September 12, 2006

Bits Bucket And Craigslist Finds For September 12, 2006

Post off-topic ideas, links and Craigslist finds here.




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190 Comments »

Comment by arlingtonva
2006-09-12 04:09:00

CIA World Fact Book - Rank Order - Current Account Balance

https://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/rankorder/2187rank.html

No need to buy gold here…move along

Comment by ajh
2006-09-12 04:27:05

Every time I see a chart like that, I stop feeling good about the government’s (relative) fiscal conservatism here in Australia.

 
Comment by Lex
2006-09-12 04:29:45

Yup.

http://skidelskyr.com/index.php?id=2,43,0,0,1,0

Not sure I agree ‘tho about buying gold.

Comment by arlingtonva
2006-09-12 04:36:31

If I was responsible for managing finances in Japan, China, Germany, Saudi Arabi and Russia, I would come to the conclusion that the dollar will continue to erode and I need to store my wealth in something-like gold (among other things). If I were them I would be buying gold in 2007 and 2008.

Comment by Huck Finn
2006-09-12 04:49:09

That is a responsibility you won’t need to worry about. You’re far too logical , and hardly short-sighted enough to be a Central Banker.

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Comment by auger-inn
2006-09-12 05:10:03

And hence the conundrum over why China is overproducing (storing) Steel, Iron, Copper, etc, etc,. as well as penning long term deals on mines/oil wells around the world is solved.

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Comment by nhz
2006-09-12 05:12:43

fortunately for the US, in countries like the Netherlands total dimwits that only listen to their masters on Wall Street are handling the Treasury and Gold stock. The Dutch are well on their way getting rid of all their gold; took them a few centuries to aquire it all, now they get rid of it in a little over ten years. Amazing what central banksters can do :)

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Comment by rent2home
2006-09-12 07:29:41

IMHO thus the fate of gold is being sealed. As the government does not have gold, as long as the rule of law can be enforced, gold will NOT BE ALLOWED to become a currancy or means of barter in any form.

Few decades ago, Al Greenspan wrote the same thing, that if possibility would arise, the possession of gold by the then GOVT. will be made illegal.

So I think only when society breaks down into Chaos, the Gold will rule again.

Am I making sense…

 
Comment by MazNJ
2006-09-12 07:36:01

Wow, the ten largest Current Account credits combined are smaller than the US Current Account deficit….

 
Comment by nhz
2006-09-12 07:49:17

rent2home:
I think central banks and politicians will definitely try to outlaw gold, but ultimately they cannot succeed. Some governments (especially the upcoming economies in Asia) are not that stupid, and I think in Europe a total dictatorship would be necessary to enforce their will. But maybe that’s where we are heading to, for our own benefit of course, and for the benefit of a ’stable’ economy.

 
Comment by rent2home
2006-09-12 08:15:37

Yes, sometimes Dictatorship can be more suitable! ( too dangerous to think and go that path though…)

Regarding Gold and Asia and housing market, I know in Vietnam , people buy Houses in terms of Gold and need be paid in eqv. terms! ( no idea why)

And a decade ago, India was getting almost bankrupt, and the unconfirmed news was that the present prime minister , then the finance minister of India, went to IMF and other rich country with 4 Billion dollar worth of physical Gold on board his plane to Pledge them and get Loan.

I guess as the money was in terms of Physical Gold at the central bank, that was not easy to spend away before and thus came useful at crisis time.

.

 
 
Comment by rei.joe
2006-09-12 12:01:53

Why? I know historically gold has been a symbol of wealth and used as a currency. But, of what real use is gold? In high tech industries it has some uses, as an electronics coating, a film barrier, or in some chemical process. But on a day to day basis, if I had 100 bars of gold stashed in my basement, how would that help me out? It’s too soft to forge swords, hoes, or tractor parts out of. You can’t eat it. There’s not enough of it to be readily used as a building material, and it wouldn’t serve any special purpose as a building material anyhow. It doesn’t have any healing qualities (that I know of).

Does it really just boil down to humans thinking “ooooh, me likey shiny rocks”? You could probably argue rarity causes people to want what they don’t have. But emeralds are rarer than diamonds, yet cost less.

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Comment by John Doe
2006-09-12 12:12:16

It truly is a “barbarous relic”.

Yet, people still want hair gel and plastic surgery…

 
 
 
Comment by Sean W
2006-09-12 11:04:30

The Chinese are our slaves. I have a house full of Chinese products (Maybe $50,000 or more). I haven’t done anything for them. Their government forces them to work for us. It is sad.

Comment by rent2home
2006-09-12 18:30:37

I am afraid our children and grand children will work for the CHINESE!!

The goods and services our children produce will be “purchased” by the chinese, with the $50,000 we are paying the chinese today for their goods.

(They only way to avoid would be if dollar value is inflated away and $1000 then only gets the chinese a bread toaster…no,we dont even make those….ok what can we sell…don’t know, say something that cost $50 today. Unlike for other reasons it seems…the experts here can discuss this! )

And please do not make the mistake of “under estimate the enemy”. Chinese are actually smart people.

They are working hard like a slave for a reason, and with proceeds they are building their country, buying real assets around the world, and buying American Technology by overt and covert means..

Soon what will America sell that China can not at a much cheaper rate?

Just wanted to express my thoughts as I gathered lurking around here…..

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Comment by GetStucco
2006-09-12 06:59:28

Coincidently, four countries with among the biggest housing bubbles include:

147
Australia $ -42,090,000,000 2005 est.
148
United Kingdom $ -57,610,000,000 2005 est.
149
Spain $ -83,140,000,000 2005 est.
150
United States $ -829,100,000,000 2005 est.

Comment by nhz
2006-09-12 07:50:56

how do they measure this … is it the total value of the housing stock (above the historical trendline)? Or total value of outstanding mortgage debt? or …?

Comment by Getstucco
2006-09-12 09:33:48

Either average home purchase price to average rent of comparable property or average home purchase price to average income will do.

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Comment by arlingtonva
2006-09-12 04:16:31

In case you are wondering: quadrillion comes after trillion

Comment by arlingtonva
2006-09-12 04:22:02

I thought it was in thousands…it’s still high ;) and very unbalanced.

Comment by ajh
2006-09-12 04:33:32

Surely we must be reaching the point where the interest (and the interest on the interest) starts to become significant for the US.

Check out the staggering (given we only have 20 million people) number for Australia; most of the time until the last couple of years Australia’s trade has more or less been in balance.

The Current Account deficit is basically due to a few bad years during the 1970’s, with the deficits compounded for 30 years at high-ish interest rates.

(Interestingly, Australia consistently runs large trade surpluses with Japan, South Korea and China, but large trade deficits with the US.)

Comment by arlingtonva
2006-09-12 04:47:06

In Fiscal Year 2005, the U. S. Government spent $352 Billion of your money on interest payments* to the holders of the National Debt. Compare that to NASA at $15 Billion, Education at $61 Billion, and Department of Transportation at $56 Billion.

http://www.federalbudget.com/

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Comment by Huck Finn
2006-09-12 04:56:05

Top of that link : The National Debt is $8.5 Trillion!!!
I always get a kick out of the accountanting practices of our own government. The reality is far far worse. In 2004 , the Social Security and Medicare trustees themselves estimated that the unfunded benefit liabilities of these programs have a CURRENT value of $74 Trillion .

 
Comment by flatffplan
2006-09-12 04:56:43

and doe educated 0 children
agencies w Soviet sounding names”
Bush 1st

 
Comment by ajh
2006-09-12 05:11:05

arlingtonva,

Yes, but at present there isn’t a significant difference between the US trade deficit (the consensus estimate for the July figure coming out today is $65.5B, which annualises to $786B) and the Current Account deficit ($829B on your link above).

In fact, the US CAD has only very recently overtaken the Trade deficit, because the non-trade balance was positive due to the assets built up since WW2. However, the non-trade balance is now negative as well.

Assuming 5% interest, the non-trade differential will be about $40B higher next year, so even if the trade deficit improves by $40B the CAD will be unaltered. This will mean another $40B deterioration in the non-trade balance the following year and so on.

In Australia’s case, we are now at 6% of GDP just paying the interest . . .

 
Comment by feepness
2006-09-12 09:07:58

and doe educated 0 children
agencies w Soviet sounding names”
Bush 1st

Crap, they must have screwed up my education too because I can’t understand this at all.

 
 
Comment by josemanolo7
2006-09-12 13:24:21

japan has about 110% ratio of debt over gdp. how much does it cost for them to service that? from what i remember they expect this ratio to increase to about 115% before it starts going down. usa ratio is bout 70% debt over gdp.

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Comment by jmunnie
Comment by Chrisusc
2006-09-12 06:51:07

Interesting article. Very timely theories. Thanks for the link.

 
Comment by waiting_in_la
2006-09-12 10:03:43

Wow, nice read.

 
 
Comment by David
2006-09-12 04:25:29

David Lereah is being stomped on:

AND THE AWARD GOES TO…
http://tinyurl.com/k33jq

Crtiticism in the tribune: http://tinyurl.com/jsqty

David
Bubble Meter Blog

Comment by Ozarkian from Saratoga, CA
2006-09-12 04:34:05

links don’t work

Comment by ajh
2006-09-12 04:40:46

The second one works for me. It goes to a thread on http://www.davidlareahwatch.blogspot.com if you’re interested.

 
Comment by Ozarkian from Saratoga, CA
2006-09-12 04:49:32

Now both links are working I think tinurl was having a problem.

 
 
Comment by david cee
2006-09-12 04:40:01

excerpt from a Chicago Tribune Article:

Lereah and his fellow housing industry economists don’t come out unscathed. Critics say they generated unfounded optimism that the housing market would soar perpetually.

“In October 2005 Lereah was busy calling the bubble believers `Chicken Littles,’” goes one post in a blog dedicated to criticizing the economist, davidlereahwatch.blogspot.com. “Many of the predictions espoused by the `Chicken Littles’ are fast becoming closer to reality. … David Lereah has lost credibility because of his irresponsible cheerleading.”

Comment by david cee
2006-09-12 04:46:02

“David Lereah has lost credibility” NO!
Economist David Lereah PHD Virginia has an ethics problem.
He should be held to a higher standard as a degreed economist,
instead of being a shill for NAR. Can’t tell the difference between him and the next late night infomercial guru promising to make me a millionaire buying his real estate course.

 
 
 
Comment by Ozarkian from Saratoga, CA
2006-09-12 04:32:39

I posted this question late last night in yesterday’s bit bucket. Would appreciate some more info. Thanks to Mozo Maz for his comment.
—————————-
Help, I am having a “discussion” with my brother on why banks foreclose on houses. He says the reason is to get title on the house and then do all kinds of things with it (he won’t expand on what these things might be). I say it is to sell it asap and that banks are not in the rental business or the house investment business (if yes, then why didn’t they just buy the house themselves to begin with). Anyway, I can’t find any statistics on what happens to foreclosed property can someone help?

I did find a truly AMAZING article in the NYTimes titled:
“THE NATION; U.S. Is Getting Stuck With a Glut of Repossessed Houses”
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=940DE3DA1539F935A35750C0A96E948260
The amazing part is the article was written in 1988! I think they can just spruce it up a bit and publish it again in 2007

Thanks for your advice, comments, links, pointers, etc.
—————————
Comment by Mozo Maz
2006-09-11 17:08:56
Banks are not chartered to manage real estate. And federal bank examiners get very insistent, that a bank under scrutiny must get rid of “non performing assets” like foreclosed homes, within about six months.

Comment by arlingtonva
2006-09-12 04:58:26

”We don’t have any responsibility for the overall market,” said Thomas W. Maher of the Veteran’s Administration ( In 1998).

”We don’t have any responsibility for the overall market,” said FILL IN THE BLANK of the Veteran’s Administration ( In 2008).

Comment by arlingtonva
2006-09-12 04:59:27

in 88′ not 98′

 
 
Comment by scdave
2006-09-12 07:19:37

They also cannot retain any excess proceeds recovered from the sale of the property…Those proceeds must be returned to the Mortgagor….

 
 
Comment by jmf
2006-09-12 04:33:42

bubble world tour continues

next stop : singapore

http://immobilienblasen.blogspot.com/2006/09/singapore-bubble-world-tour.html

 
Comment by salinasron
2006-09-12 04:34:06

Well, well, now it starts, salary roll backs! Detroit news yesterday:
“Union president Janna Garrison said the district presented economic proposals that did not place priority on the needs of the classroom. She said some of the district’s proposals included a 5 1/2 percent wage reduction, and copays for health care benefits of up to 20 percent.”
“The district says it needs $105 million in concessions from its unions, including $88 million from the teachers, to balance its budget.”

And Florida news: “Experts Downplay Fla. Earthquake Fears”

Nothing like holding an ‘illiquid asset’ when fear creaps in the market place!

Comment by Max
2006-09-12 07:23:33

I’m starting to feel genuenly sorry for Detroit. What on Earth has that place done to deserve that kind of wrath? I mean, granted their cars are often not classy, but Mercedez-Benz also drop like crazy due to crappy quality.

Something needs to be done about Detroit.

 
Comment by auger-inn
2006-09-12 07:49:43

Was that “needs of the classroom” or “needs of the teacher” that is being disputed in this proposal?

Comment by CA renter
2006-09-12 08:05:37

auger,

Exactly how do you propose students should learn? Shall we throw them in a room together with a lot of books and hope for the best???

If children do not have parents who are willing and able to teach their children, then the teachers are the only ones left to do it. Exactly what do you think they should be paid? Do they deserve more or less than basketball players and actors?

Comment by fiat lux
2006-09-12 08:12:40

Teachers and firefighters and policemen should all be happy to do their jobs for salaries that we ourselves would not consider accepting! It’s the American Way!

/sarcasm off.

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Comment by adopt-a-landlord
2006-09-12 09:04:13

We’ve lost touch with the concept of public service and serving our country. We don’t do these things to become financially well off. We do them to serve the greater good of society. This idea may be totally foreign and probably a little shocking to the “ME FIRST” generation, but this is one of the virtues that has made our country great.

So if you want to serve your society and your country, stop whining and serve. If you’re more dollar-reward focused and think you’re worth more, go into business for yourself and find out if it’s true.

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Comment by CA renter
2006-09-12 22:59:12

We don’t do these things to become financially well off.
———————–
You’re right, most civil servants do not intend to be well-off, but they do need to make a living. Or should we only allow nuns and priests who’ve taken a vow of poverty to do these jobs?

 
 
Comment by ChrisO
2006-09-12 09:15:52

Teacher salaries aren’t the biggest problem in our school systems, in my opinion. The $80k per year unionized janitors and the “assistant to the assistant associate vice superintendant” are the biggest problem in most of our school districts. So much of our money vanishes long before it ever gets to the classroom.

Also, no teacher can ever replace parents as the inculcators of values and discipline. If the kids are snotty little unmanageable brats coming into the classroom, there’s little that even the best teacher could do–and of course teachers that really try to ‘do something’ in that case get fired and/or sued.

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Comment by SF Mechanist
2006-09-12 09:39:19

“If the kids are snotty little unmanageable brats coming into the classroom, there’s little that even the best teacher could do–and of course teachers that really try to ‘do something’ in that case get fired and/or sued.”

Then they grow up to work for the financial industry, and the worst most undisciplined brats become Realtors®.

 
 
Comment by tj & the bear
2006-09-12 09:20:14

Wages, like anything else, are subject to supply and demand. Any occupation where the number of available, qualified workers exceeds the number of available positions is by definition overpaid… and that’s certainly the case with teachers. The only reason so many teachers are already overpaid is that they are unionized public servants.

You can discuss teacher’s relative value to society any day vs. athletes, celebrities, etc. but that doesn’t determine wages, the market does. You may not like it, but that’s just the way it is.

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Comment by bubbagump
2006-09-12 10:11:54

Yup. Supply and demand.
That’s what we should aim for schools.
(1)We should turn our public schools into the WALMART of education. The teaching will eventually become crappy. But it’s cheap
(2)After that, we should cut public funding for schools, since the teaching is crappy. Then it becomes crappier. So what!
(3) All the well-off then pull the kids from public schools, and put them into private schools. (This is a public secret - private schools charge much more, have crappier teaching, and all sorts of extra fundraising )
(4) The public school becomes the last resort, for the unwashed masses.

I have seen it before, private schools for the rich, absolutely crappy non-functioning public schools for the poor. Pick any third world country - Uganda, Sudan, or feudal country - Mexico, India, and you see the same.

And I suggest before you produce a knee-jerk per pupil spending number, see how much of it is spending on teachers and schools, and how much is for spend on any _given_ poor performing school. That’s the dirty secret of public schooling - all schools dont get the same funding. The per-pupil spending number has no meaning.

And yes, I’m no teacher or any side to it - I’m in business. “So if you want to serve your society and your country, stop whining and serve.” is really meaningless. Business people dont serve? Maybe that explains a lot about this country at this time. Is there a class of people who must live for public service, sacrificing their self, and another class who dont? This is really starting to make sense to me - it explains a lot about what I see now.

 
Comment by tj & the bear
2006-09-12 10:25:30

I don’t disagree with you. If you want better teachers, raise the qualifications, pay bonuses tied to results (taking into account the challenges therein), and eliminate tenure.

In California, the CTA has managed to legislate in all sorts of mandatory certifications that artificially restrict the supply of “qualified” teachers, while simultaneously fighting any chance of accountability and the rewarding true teaching skills.

ChrisO is correct, too; the LAUSD is a top-heavy joke, with a huge number of six-figure jobs that have absolutely no connection to the classroom.

Of course,it doesn’t help that the parents out there making the biggest noises are those claiming the standardized exit exam — which any decent sixth-grader could pass — is too hard for their spoiled brats.

 
Comment by arroyogrande
2006-09-12 10:53:14

“The teaching will eventually become crappy. But it’s cheap”

In other words, the only thing that will change is that it will be cheap…it’s already crappy in California.

 
Comment by Max
2006-09-12 11:59:21

tj & the bear,

what does tenure have to do with anything? Do you know what tenure is, and what it ISN’T? Tenure is beneficial because it preserves from grade inflation (pandering to students’ short-term interest) and preserves ideological and scientific diversity.

 
Comment by Bostonian
2006-09-12 12:53:44

I don’t think so. Tenure exits at Harvard and 90% of students gets A’s in every course. Ditto every Ivy League university. I can also assure you that there is very little ideological or scientific diversity in these hallowed halls, so if that is what you think tenure is for, its not working.
Honestly, its a lot harder to play basketball like Michael Jordan than it is to teach algebra. the algebra is also a lot less entertaining so it no surprise that the one plays better than the other.

 
 
Comment by auger-inn
2006-09-12 18:39:22

Hehehe, looks like I started a real threadjacking here!
To answer your question though, I’m quite agnostic on the whole idea of teacher’s salaries. My mom was a teacher and my sister is a teacher so it isn’t like I have an issue with them at all.
However, don’t piss on my boots and tell me it’s raining outside. This quote about not caring about the classroom (read kids) because the administration is trying to balance the budget is just an attempt to drag parental emotions into the negotiations.
This topic is actually relevant to this blog for the following reason, state agency’s have to balance their budget. The recession/depression we as a country are going to experience will be very painful. What you are witnessing here is probably going to be happening everywhere in the country within the next year or so. Detroit has been very hard hit and the travel/auto industry in that state has been decimated. Ask the guy at GM how he felt about taking a pay cut? Did he imply that his work would suffer and the cars would be less safe because of the pay cut (no jokes please)? That is what the quote in question says to me.
The fact remains that states will have to get pay cuts as well as cutting services. Pensions are a whole other issue but needless to say, it doesn’t look good! Hell, the whole country is basically bankrupt.
Like the guy who is trying to sell his house at last year’s selling price only to find out that he has to adjust his expectations, folks in this country are going to find out that the gov’t job they hold is still subject to budget constraints and revenue will be falling FAST starting next year. We are all in the same boat (more or less) so it won’t be fun for anyone. I stand by my original comment that the quote is talking about the needs of teachers not those of the classroom. If the country goes into a depression there will be some damn fine teachers teaching class for whatever it pays and they’ll be happy to have the job. IMO

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Comment by CA renter
2006-09-12 23:12:08

Hopefully, there will also be some damn fine basketball players throwing balls around for whatever it pays and they’ll be happy to have their jobs as well. ;)

 
Comment by CA renter
2006-09-12 23:42:05

BTW, I do believe we will see pay cuts across the board in govt jobs, as well as cutting out positions, etc. I’ve already seen it.

That being said, I think there is a lot of ignorance WRT teaching, firefighting, policing, etc.

I have a challenge for those who thinks civil service jobs are too easy and too well-paid. I will pay $1,000 to anyone (up to five people) who will do the following:

Go out and get the teaching job. You must work in an “underperforming” school (so you will understand the REAL reason these schools perform poorly). After ONE YEAR, you come back and let us know how easy the job was and explain to us how we can improve upon it — **after** you have experience and actually know what you’re talking about.

 
Comment by auger-inn
2006-09-13 06:17:23

I agree with you that teachers work hard, didn’t mean to imply otherwise. One of the main problems as I see it (and I’m not close to the action by any means) is that parents aren’t raising their kids to be respectful of adults and teaching them manners and appropriate behavior. Just my opinion.

 
 
 
 
 
Comment by david cee
2006-09-12 04:35:30

40% drop in home prices over next 3 years WOW!!!

U.S. equity prices declined by 40% in the three years after the dot.com bubble imploded. The decline in property values on average could be as large, and because of the regional character of the bubble, much larger in what had been the hot property markets.

The decline in household wealth that will follow from lower home prices is likely to be comparable to the decline in 2000, 2001, and 2002 that followed from the lower stock prices. Moreover the sharp slowdown in the rate of economic growth is not good news for corporate profits.

The New York area will be sharply affected both by the decline in home prices and in stock prices. Homes in the metropolitan area will remain more costly than in most other parts of the country, but they will become much more affordable than they now.

Mr. Aliber is professor at the University of Chicago’s Graduate School of Business and president and chief investment officer of Dorchester Capital Management.

Comment by nhz
2006-09-12 05:19:14

hmm … the Dutch stock market declined by nearly 70% after the dot.com bust. Since then, homeprices have INcreased by 60-90% (depending on area in the country). This increase in home values easily outweighed the loss from the stock market bust (because more people own homes and they have far bigger amounts of money investen in RE). I sense another bubble in the making …

Comment by GetStucco
2006-09-12 05:58:57

“I sense another bubble in the making…”

In what, pray tell?

Comment by nhz
2006-09-12 07:52:22

no idea, but I’m sure the FEDs are working on it …
maybe another bond bubble?

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Comment by Desert Dweller
2006-09-12 10:52:57

Maybe tulip bulbs will make a comeback :)

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Comment by the_economist
2006-09-12 04:43:33

Article on a cute couple that cant sell their condo.

http://tinyurl.com/rbu8r

Comment by Huck Finn
2006-09-12 07:25:04

“We basically had 24 hours to sell our place”
“lowered the price from 334900″(from 327900 , a whopping 2%)(didn’t try very hard)
“and waited for the offers to come rolling in! ” depite the fact that there’s an 8 month supply of comparably priced homes? And they’r complaining after only 30 days on the market.

Comment by nhz
2006-09-12 07:54:54

yeah, it’s really the psychology.

In my country I now often hear people complaining that their house has been on the market for more than a year without any serious offers. Guess what, maybe the asking price was a little bit to high (with salesprices here being 600-1000% over the 1990 price level, and asking prices even higher).

 
 
Comment by fiat lux
2006-09-12 08:13:22

URL isn’t working currently.

 
Comment by Big V
2006-09-12 13:28:16

It seems like every time I try a Tiny URL, it doesn’t work.

Comment by marksparky
2006-09-12 13:57:28

irrational buyer panic (buy this minute before I’m priced out of the market) now becomes irrational seller panic (omigod, no multiple offers!! we’re sunk!!)

 
 
 
Comment by flatffplan
2006-09-12 05:00:49

rent vs price change in your hood
in 22151 rents up 15% while prices doubled= mean reversion comming

Comment by arlingtonva
2006-09-12 05:15:15

Where do you think people managing the trillions of dollars in defense and debt live?

 
 
Comment by diogenes
2006-09-12 05:03:17

Did anyone catch the NPR story on government windfalls this morning?

It seems the State governments have a “surplus” from the growing economy since 2001. Naturally, most of them are finding ways to spend this money, with the exception of a few, Arizona being one that was mentioned.

A good portion of the money is supposedly earmarked for EDUCATION and overly-paid teachers. The report did not say where the majority of the extra income was derived but seemed to indicate is was a growing economy.

I suspect if an accouting was done, the majority of folks here know where that money came from.

One last thing, the City of Phoenix is REFUNDING some of the property taxes. They say it is the people’s money and they have no right to keep the surpluses. I guess the mayor and city council there know the imbalance in prices and fair market value have been stretched to the limit.
I just wish the rest of the country would get a clue.

Comment by CarrieAnn
2006-09-12 07:31:56

NYers are presently waiting for refunds on their school tax bills. These are not property taxes but a separate bill. Instead of giving it it to us as a credit on our state taxes, the state has decided it needs to spend $3mil to mail it to us (before November!) And of course, these refunds will be counted as taxable income so now we’re getting taxed on our paid taxes….guess they need to do that to pay for the processing and handling fees incurred when buying our November vote.

 
Comment by Big V
2006-09-12 13:38:07

I was really annoyed by NPR this morning. They kept assuming that increased tax revenues were due to increased incomes, but we all know that states derive most of their revenue from property and sales taxes. That means that states can receive “windfalls” from increased prices.

Surely the folks at NPR are aware that real estate price inreases have outpaced wage increases. The logical conclusion to draw from these observations is that the economy is getting WORSE, since people are paying more (for real estate, et al.), but not making more.

I guess NPR is entitle to their opinion, even though it’s wrong.

 
 
Comment by Bill
2006-09-12 05:03:25

I did some research on Stephen Kim, the very bullish analyst on the home building sector from Citibank. Kim (a young, probably Korean-American) received several awards for predicting that the HB stocks would go up in 2003-2004. Clearly that was a good pick and anyone who followed his advice then made a lot of money. He seems to be trying to repeat his performance of 2003-2004. If the housing market starts to recover in the first half of 2007, he will be a winner again. However, as a reader of this blog who is trying to project forward, a recovery any time next year seems very unlikely. Just like analysts who were right during the dotcom runup, it is very difficult to change shift gears and go in the other direction.

Comment by bozwood
2006-09-12 05:22:44

Stephen Kim has been bullish the whole way up and down. He likes them when they are “expensive” and when they are “cheap.”

Comment by GetStucco
2006-09-12 06:05:53

Bullish stopped-clock forecasters were generally always right during the Greenspan era, when asset price appreciation was elevated to a national security issue.

 
 
Comment by sfv_hopeful
2006-09-12 12:24:17

“Kim (a young, probably Korean-American) ”

And this is relevant how?

 
Comment by josemanolo7
2006-09-12 14:51:15

not much different from a random bet, 50% chance.

 
 
Comment by VR
2006-09-12 05:31:17

I am a big believer in the housing bubble and was even born and raised at ground zero (SF Bay area). I have watched the housing prices reach insane levels and firmly believe that these prices will plunge back to ’99 levels over the next couple of years. However, I have to question whether this bubble is a nation-wide phenomenon. For example, there are places in the South where it is still cheaper to buy than rent (30 yr. fixed). Because of this, I argue that no housing bubble exists in these areas.

I looked at a few homes near Montgomery, AL area (online) and was shocked at the mediocre appreciation experienced by the homes in this area. In fact, the appreciation experienced by these homes over the past ten years has been pegged to the CPI. I can take the 1995 price of a given home, multiply it by the CPI correction factor from 1995 and the resulting sum is usually in the ballpark of the asking price.

I bring this point up for two reasons, first I have the opportunity to temporarily relocate to this area (education opportunity) and am trying to decide whether I should buy or not. Secondly, I believe the overriding theme of many bubble advocates is that this is a nation-wide phenomenon. However, certain areas in the country still seem able to pass the “bubble test”. Specifically, it is still cheaper to buy than rent coupled with meager appreciation over the past decade (right in line with inflation). Granted, some may not find this a very desirable area, but when one considers a married couple working at Wal-Mart can still afford a 2000 sq. ft home with a conventional loan in a nice neighborhood, I have to wonder if the bubble is irregular in shape and sparred a few areas from this insanity.

Comment by nhz
2006-09-12 05:40:22

the credit bubble is global, the housing bubble is to some extent local/regional. e.g. housing bubbles are mostly confined to the anglo-saxon part of the world, and within countries they usually start around the financial centres where there is better access to ‘easy money’ for speculation. If the bubble continues for a long time it may spread to outer regions or even other countries (which often get even bigger price increases by % than the original bubble centres). Apparently some parts of the US are not (yet) at that stage, but in the EU the bubble gains have already spread to the most remote regions of some countries.

 
Comment by Bill
2006-09-12 05:49:11

I’d like to take on the midwest, since it’s clear that the coasts plus AZ and Nevada are the center of the bubble. Indiana, Ohio and Michigan saw very little appreciation in prices over the past few years. Indi has the highest rate of foreclosure in the country, probably because prices were down 2% last year. State coffers are doing well this year, but the further downturn in the auto industry is starting to hit. So, I would agrue that the midwest is in a “housing bubble” even though prices never went up much. The inventory, especially in urban areas is very high and prices are coming down, putting people under water. Our “ownership society could lead to riots in Detroit. From reading this blog, it seems that no state or region has been spared. Probably the Northwest and upper west are only some months behind.

Comment by Ozarkian from Saratoga, CA
2006-09-12 08:13:34

The problem here in the Ozarks is that many of the new homes are mini-McMansions — rather than inexpensive small but quality built homes for the locals. A local realtor told me a few days ago that only houses below $120K are selling right now. The house she was showing me was priced at $239K on 5 acres of land carved out of a farmer’s field. The equity locusts seem to have stopped moving here and so no one is buying them. That’s my guess…I’ve been here 10 months (from CA) and about half or more of my new friends are recently from the wesst or east coast. They all bought their houses within a few weeks or even days of coming here. My nephew even bought his house sight unseen! I’m the only one I know who decided to rent and check out the lay of the land. There are 8 mini-McMansions down the street from me…2 are occupied, 1 occupied but for sale by owner, 4 finished and for sale, and 1 just the foundation (work seemed to have stopped on that one). These houses are all priced at $170K and above in a town where the typical house is a 3bd 1bath 1 car carport 50-80 yr old “vintage” house sells for $60K-$95K. And these mini-McMansions are right next door from these other houses. It’s a strange juxtaposition of styles. The mini-McMansions all sport that fake stone, fake brick, vinyl siding, fake stucco and a little bit of wood (on each house, it’s unbelievable).

Comment by Moman
2006-09-12 11:08:40

What city are you in? It’s a darn shame the builders are polluting the countryside with those ugly houses for which there is no demand.

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Comment by Ozarkian from Saratoga, CA
2006-09-12 17:25:31

I’m in small town off I-44 between Joplin and Springfield in SW MO (Ozarks). I moved here 10 months ago from Saratoga, CA. I was born and raised in LA area, college in N. Calif, and spent most of my adult life in SF Bay Area except for 8 yrs in Boston and a few years abroad.

Actually I think the correct term for someone who lives in the Ozarks is “Osarker” not “Ozarkian” but I didn’t know that till recently.

 
 
Comment by Big V
2006-09-12 13:56:36

Ozarks or Saratoga?

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Comment by Big V
2006-09-12 13:58:12

Oh, never mind.

 
 
 
Comment by Misery Index
2006-09-12 09:25:42

Bill,

I have to agree with you…the midwest will probably get slaughtered as well. I live about 60 miles from Chicago and I cannot believe the development that has occured in the last 5 years. Case in point, I live in a town of 6000 people. In 2004 and 2005 we had slated for development 7000+ homes!!!
Many of the local residents where completely opposed to the idea, but idiot city council reps pushed it through (can’t stop growth, yada yada). We lucked out though, due to greed by our city reps, annexation disputes, and courrption by the develeoper..the delays have put a nail in the whole project.

p.s. the local farmers made out pretty good, fetching between $35-$75k per acre of farmland ($1-2k 5-10 years ago)

 
 
Comment by GetStucco
2006-09-12 06:07:15

“However, I have to question whether this bubble is a nation-wide phenomenon.”

You need to get out more and to read more, then.

 
Comment by txchick57
2006-09-12 06:46:40

You can argue all you want but the areas you mention have all had their own bubble. You can find ridiculously over priced junk in places like Sioux Falls, South Dakota and in West Virginia. Just because prices do not shock you, a resident of the most expensive place in the U.S. does not mean they are affordable for the local economies of these places. The bubble is everywhere.

Comment by VR
2006-09-12 07:37:34

Agreed, but the main point is that a couple making $7.00 – $8.00 dollars an hour (Wal-Mart) could afford to purchase the median priced home in that area with a 30 yr. fixed, they may have to stretch, but it could be done. There is no lack of retail jobs in that area, as they have a Wal-Mart or Target on nearly every corner.

If a given area:
- Is cheaper to buy than rent
- Allows Joe and Mary Six pack working low wage retail jobs to qualify for a 30 yr. fixed on a median priced home
- Has seen no significant appreciation in the past 10 years

Then where is the bubble? I ask because the real-estate bubble in many parts of the country is so blatantly obvious, but in parts of the South, I cannot not see it. Perhaps many on this board are correct and I am blind . . . or perhaps given the two extremes of an issue, the truth lies somewhere in the middle.

Comment by Moman
2006-09-12 07:51:29

You are failing to realize that many areas of the country should have falling prices (i.e. Michigan/Ohio/Indiana) but they have modest (1-3%) appreciation instead. Appreciation when there should be depreciation is symptomatic of a bubble. Alabama is in the similar zone - loss of mfg jobs should temper housing prices. The automakers moving along I-20 have tempered much of the inevitable decline.

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Comment by House Inspector Clouseau
2006-09-12 10:13:33

First posting was lost.

Rehash:

1) I don’t think that EVERY single locale has to be affected for this to be a “national” bubble. This is partly semantics. For example, I would say that English is our “national” language. however, it doesn’t say so in our constitution. there are many pockets of area where English is decidedly NOT the primary language spoken (eg: Chinatown, Spanish Harlem, Puerto Rico, Creole in the Bayou). Yet, I’d still say English is our national language.

In the same way, it is the EXCEPTION rather than the rule in my opinion to find an area in our US that isn’t way overvalued currently. You must search long and hard to do it. Doubtless, there are areas which are non-bubble, but overall our nation is bubblicious.

2) I would also argue that even if the area itself isn’t in a bubble per se, it doesn’t mean it hasn’t been affected by the bubble. And thus it doesn’t mean it won’t lose value as the rest of the bubble areas are affected. Think about it, one of the reasons you’re willing to buy in Alabama is because it’s so “cheap”. If SF cost 1/2 as much, would you be so willing? thus, Mobile/Montgomery are affected by the bubble even though they might not be a bubble themselves.

3) are you sure you’re looking in an ok area. Sure, rents might be higher than PITI where you’re looking, but you may be looking at slums (hard to tell if you aren’t living there). When I moved to Mpls, I thought everywhere looked the same, now I know better.
I’ve heard reports of significant appreciation in some parts of Mobile/Montgomery…

clouseau

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Comment by nhz
2006-09-12 07:57:01

I think that is similar to what we see in Europe: prices vary strongly between countries, regions or sometimes even cities. But almost everywhere they are far too high for the locals and so by definition in a bubble.

 
Comment by Misery Index
2006-09-12 09:41:43

txchick,
see my post above.

I should add, the price of all these homes slated for development and the homes that have been build have prices that started at 1.75 to 2.5 times what the median for the area was in the late ’90’s.

I see the rampant development EVERYWHERE here.

Another good example of free money. Late 2005 a newly planted immigrant from india had borrowed money for the development of a strip mall. The construction was progressing very slow 4-5 months only three walls and the iron suport beams in place. Come March 2006 very high winds knocks the walls down, “owner” suddenly nowhere to be found. The city is forced to redeem the $20k bond for cleanup (didn’t cover cost). Today the lot is half cleaned up and completely weed covered.

This in a town of 6000 people!

 
 
Comment by Chrisusc
2006-09-12 07:02:34

I might just rent, since you say you are only going there for a degree, then may be coming back to SF. If prices drop and then you decide to stay, then buy. But otherwise just pay the extra for the rent and be assured that you can leave whenever you want since you dont have to sell a home.

After spending some time there then you will know more about the area and where you want to live, should you decide to buy. You probably need to get talk with people and get a feel for the area first…

Just my take.
:)

Comment by P'cola Popper
2006-09-12 10:28:49

As a rule of thumb always rent until you know the lay of the land and I would not sign a long rental agreement unless I had some comfort in my knowledge of the area. Don’t want to get locked into a place and then find that you like to spend all your time on the other side of town!

 
 
Comment by CarrieAnn
2006-09-12 07:41:32

My apologies for not remembering who’s said this but past posts have offered this consideration:

If not for the credit bubble (& its loosened lending stds), appreciation in areas that appear to be non-bubble might have actually gone negative.

 
Comment by fiat lux
2006-09-12 08:07:45

Housing bubble issues aside, if you’re brand-new to an area and only plan to remain there for a limited time, that’s a really good reason to rent unless renting is significantly more expensive than buying.

 
Comment by SF Mechanist
2006-09-12 09:51:20

“However, I have to question whether this bubble is a nation-wide phenomenon. For example, there are places in the South where it is still cheaper to buy than rent (30 yr. fixed).”

To me the definition of a bubble is disconnection from fundamentals from speculative run-ups, so if that is true, then as you say it looks like there is no bubble there.

 
 
Comment by Brandon
2006-09-12 05:38:37

“A 31-story hotel/condominium project tentatively named Boise Place will go up in the vacant lot at 8th and Main streets where the ill-fated Boise Tower never got off the ground, a developer said Monday.”

“Floors eight through 31 will house hotel rooms and condominiums. Most of the condos will range from 805 square feet to 2,200 square feet and will be priced from $400,000 to $1.25 million.
The top two floors will house five penthouses in the 3,700-square-foot range and will be priced at up to $4 million each.”

http://www.idahostatesman.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060912/NEWS01/609120364

Comment by CA Guy
2006-09-12 10:50:02

Brandon:
Please tell me this developer is joking! Now I am sure Boise is a lovely place, but when you look at the demographics, locale, etc., this type of project is absurd! Obviously that guy has watched Field of Dreams one too many times. You know, if you build it, they will come. IMO, the sad thing is that so much capital has been wasted on housing units that will prove to be very undesirable in the long run (malinvestment?). Then again, in the long run we are all dead. The more I read about this bubble, the more depressed I get about the nation’s economic future (short to medium term at least).

 
 
Comment by Larry Littlefield
2006-09-12 05:45:53

Times discontinues real estate blog
September 11, 6:50 pm
In perhaps another sign of the housing market slowdown, the New York Times announced on Monday that it had discontinued its real estate blog. The number of posts on the blog declined precipitously throughout the summer. more [NYO]

Comment by housegeek
2006-09-12 09:39:42

Thanks Larry — I’ve followed this limping offering for awhile, and the blog never had any decent # of posts (best one had 6 at the most if I recall) - it mostly wasn’t a blog at all but a retread of their often cheerleader-y pieces from the RE section.

Of course they couldn’t tolerate expression any freer than that, so now they’re moving along to even more rose-colored pastures — sections on “great homes” and tools to get people to buy more houses.

 
Comment by Graspeer
2006-09-12 09:43:01

I wonder if this has more to do with more negative comments on the blog now that bubble mania is wearing off then in the number of posts. I doubt if the NYT Real Estate advertisers would want to pay for negative comments, though maybe the “fix your credit” companies might.

Comment by housegeek
2006-09-12 11:02:06

Negative meaning realistic. It’s not negative to describe the market as it is, any more that it’s negative to give someone a flu shot. Yeah, it stings a little, but it’s good preventive medicine. The Times, which serves its RE advertisers, would rather have its readers inebriated and vulnerable than provide them an ounce of prevention.

 
 
 
Comment by Sunsetbeachguy
2006-09-12 05:48:15

This is probably more for the weekend topic suggestion, However, it is on my mind now.

How would the bloggers here like to restore accountability into the culture/system?

I say, bring back public shame.

Criminal Trials for David Lereah and his ilk.

Civil Trials for most mortgage brokers, etc.

Obviously, blogs like this where the media can lurk and get a pulse on the zeitgeist.

What are other ways to at least ding bubble participants?

Comment by Bill in Carolina
2006-09-12 06:17:42

And what would you charge Lereah with? It’s not a crime to lie unless you lie under oath. It would, however, be interesting to see a law firm solicit “victims” for a class action lawsuit against Lereah and the NAR.

Comment by eastcoaster
2006-09-12 06:37:24

That would repulse me. Much as I find his/their behavior shameful, I now and will always maintain that people need to be ultimately accountable for their own actions and decisions. I’m definitely anti-lawsuits in this whole mess.

Comment by rj
2006-09-12 10:24:50

If that’s your viewpoint, then the rich would never be guilty of anything cause their money will always insulate them from hardship.

That said, the only way certain public figures in this bubble that helped create it will ever get what some believe they deserve is “an action of the masses” outside the justice system.

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Comment by david cee
2006-09-12 09:16:29

Leareah has Professional Standards of Conduct as Economist with a PHD from Virginia. I am sure his boss, the Realtors, has an ethics clause and has an ethics committee. I seriously doubt when they hired him as an economist that they told him to be a PR man. He has brought the whole profession of economics down to another shill occupation. I guess lying has replaced ethics at the graduate schools.

Comment by Getstucco
2006-09-12 09:30:41

Don’t blame his professional affiliation for his unethical conduct. There are bad doctors and bad scientists in other fields besides economics.

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Comment by rent2home
2006-09-12 18:09:38

If he was the “spokesperson” of NAR, what he said as a cheerleader would have been fine.

Now as a “chief economist”, what he did was just plain cheerleading.( now being exposed to all and he is trying cover up… )

When he was speaking… the bloggers on this blog made fun of him. ( he earned it )

Certainly he brought disrpute to the term, “Economist”, let alone “chief economist”.

Most probably his actual job brief was cheerleading, and the title “Chief economist” was provided to lend weight to his talk and make common people believe him.

Well, now that he has done his actual job WELL for this phase, I expect that he will “RETIRE” within say a year.

NAR will soon understand that they will be better served by a new “Chief Economist” to spin slightly different soudning tales; and as people want to believe; they will believe and give a chance to the “NEW” guy who is sooo “different” .

(He will do his job with the same objective ofcourse: get business for realtors ™.)

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Comment by ocjohn
2006-09-12 09:40:28

In addition, he could claim a role as a “reporter” and is probably exempt from regulation as an invenstment adviser. I don’t know if he could get away with it, faulty real estate investment advice, in a court of law with a bunch of angry underwater homeowners.

Have you noticed classified ads in the newspaper from unethical mortgage brokers and insurance salesmen pushing homeowners to leverage 100% of your home in “fixed” equity annuities? These people are lying and committed financial fraud. Nothing beats the investment and tax savings of a retirment plan and they say it is stupid to put your money there. There aren’t enough prosecutors and people complaining to put these guys out of this scam. Scott Burns from the Dallas News wrote a few articles exposing these scumbags.

My cowoker went to lunch with her old mortage broker who pushed this scam on her. She was smart enought to see it for what it was. She won’t by talking to this broker anymore.

 
Comment by Jim Lippard
2006-09-12 14:41:47

“It’s not a crime to lie unless you lie under oath.”

Not true. There are other cases where lying is criminal–fraud, theft by deception, etc.

 
 
Comment by SF Mechanist
2006-09-12 09:59:05

I don’t want to waste more money on expensive trials, lawsuits, and prison sentences. Why did they ever get rid of tar-and-feathering and the pillory anyway?

Comment by SunsetBeachGuy
2006-09-12 10:56:24

I agree, public shaming with some tar and feathers worked pretty well in the past for scamsters.

 
 
 
Comment by GetStucco
2006-09-12 06:01:23

Sorry if already posted / discussed. The chart which accompanies this article suggests that this time truly is different…
———————————————————————————————
House prices in America
Gimme shelter
Aug 24th 2006 | CHICAGO
From The Economist print edition
Now that the party is over, how bad will the hangover be?

AMERICA’S housing market has banged its head on the ceiling; now investors and homeowners alike are wondering how soon—and how hard—it will hit the floor. On August 23rd the latest figures showed that in July prices of previously owned homes rose at their slowest pace in more than 11 years. In the past 12 months they are still (just) up in nominal terms (see chart), but down in real terms. The number of units sold fell by 11.2% from a year earlier, and the stock of unsold homes reached its highest level since 1993. Markets were waiting for figures on prices of new homes, due out the following day. But the softness was enough to stoke the worries that have been mounting about how badly the end of America’s housing boom will hurt the rest of the economy.

Falling demand is already pounding the construction industry. Housing starts, seasonally adjusted, fell by 2.5% in July and were 13.3% lower than a year earlier. Building permits for privately owned houses were down by 20.8%, year on year. And although the number of homeowners applying to refinance their mortgages has risen over the past five weeks, the demand for loans to buy new homes has fallen by nearly a quarter in the past year. It is little wonder, then, that an index of housebuilders’ confidence has plunged by 56% since June 2005 to a 15-year low.

The slump has been especially harsh at the high end, because rich buyers were at the forefront of the housing boom over the past few years. Toll Brothers, the biggest builder of luxury homes, said this week that in the latest quarter its orders for new units were almost half those of the previous year. The slowdown is also a worry for home-improvement chains such as Home Depot and Lowe’s, as well as for other businesses that have benefited from the housing boom.

http://economist.com/finance/displaystory.cfm?story_id=7843304

 
Comment by GetStucco
2006-09-12 06:17:38

Here is an entry for the topic “HOUSE PRICES” on economist.com. It generally does a good job of describing the relationship between house price inflation and home purchase demand, but seems to have missed the fact that ARMs have become a defining feature of the later stages of the US housing bubble. The statement that home ownership provides an inflation hedge in the US because of our use of fixed-rate financing does not apply to those with broken ARMs.
————————————————————————————————–
House prices

When they go through the roof it is usually a warning sign that an economy is overheating. House prices often rise after INTEREST RATE reductions, which lower mortgage payments and thus give buyers the ability to fund a larger amount of borrowing and so offer a higher price for their new home. Strangely, people often regard house-price INFLATION as good news, even though it creates as many losers as gainers. They argue that rising house prices help to boost consumer confidence, and are part of the WEALTH EFFECT: as house prices rise, people feel wealthier and so spend more. However, against this must be set a negative wealth effect. An increase in house prices makes many people worse off, such as first-time buyers and anyone planning to trade up to a better property.

As long as people think that their house is a vehicle for SPECULATION, rather than merely accommodation, it seems inevitable that prices will be volatile, prone to a boom-bust cycle. As house prices rise, profits are made, tempting more speculative buyers into the market; eventually, they start to pay too much, interest rates rise, DEMAND falls and prices plunge. People have also invested in housing as a HEDGE against INFLATION: house prices generally rise when other prices rise, whereas the real value of mortgage DEBT is eroded by inflation. However, when mortgage interest rates are variable (as they generally are in the UK) rather than fixed (as in the United States), they may rise painfully during times of high inflation as a result of MACROECONOMIC POLICY efforts to slow the pace of economic GROWTH.

One of the reasons why the United States has long-term fixed mortgage rates is the financing provided by government-sponsored agencies such as the Federal National Mortgage Association and the Federal Home Loan Mortgage Corporation, nicknamed, respectively, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. Economists increasingly debate their role, especially as they have grown into some of the world’s largest lenders. Supporters claim that, as well as reducing macroeconomic volatility, they make housing more affordable, particularly for poorer people, and that other governments should play a similar role in the mortgage market. Critics say they have become a huge potential risk in the global financial system by creating a moral hazard through the controversial but widespread belief that if they were to get into difficulties the government would bail them out and, thus, their financial counterparties.

http://economist.com/research/Economics/alphabetic.cfm?letter=H#houseprices

Comment by txchick57
2006-09-12 06:49:26

Typical British journalism. They love it when bad things happen in America. Meanwhile, they can barely keep their own populace and economy under control.

Comment by Left LA Behind
2006-09-12 07:12:13

I am a big reader of the Economist. I believe it is jointly published by both a NY and London team of journalists.

Comment by oikonomikos
2006-09-12 10:31:44

while different in style from BW, Fortune and Forbes, The Economist is read by the bankers on both sides of the Atlantic and probably in Asia, too. I agree it’s rather academic in tone, and can turn some people off as ’snooty’.

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Comment by Housing Wizard
2006-09-12 08:02:36

So true txchick

 
Comment by lalaland
2006-09-12 09:09:07

Like the Brits can cast any stones. Londoners are the most over-leveraged people on earth.

Comment by rj
2006-09-12 10:31:35

So says the Angelino. :D

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Comment by SF Mechanist
2006-09-12 10:01:36

It’s called “projection.”

Comment by Tulkinghorn
2006-09-12 15:56:40

You misundertand the POV of the Economist editors and readers. They are highly educated and relatively sophsticated, so there is a fair bit of ‘cluck-cluck’ to the tone of their writing.

However. they are often right, and are not afraid to make politically incorrect calls when the fundamentals support the calls.

This article is a good example. Fannie Mae has created/allowed to develop a terrible moral hazard. The whole system of securitized mortgage debt is far off the rails, yet remains a sacred cow. If anyone has the data, I would love to see a chart of how quickly the level at which mortgages became considered ‘jumbo’m and contrast that to the cpi.

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Comment by Big V
2006-09-12 16:10:13

txchick, you’re right on.

 
 
Comment by nhz
2006-09-12 08:03:34

as mentioned before, I really doubt the argument regarding the importance of fixed rate vs. ARMs for the increase in homeprices. The Netherlands has mostly fixed rate (10-30 year) mortgages and together with the UK one of the most extreme housing bubbles.
I think crazy lending (e.g. 10x income, no-doc loans, 120% mortages etc.) and ‘government put options’ for the housing market are a more important factor for when prices get out of control.

Of course ARMs do matter in the sense that they can stimulate speculation, which could speed up things on the way up and on the way down.

Comment by Getstucco
2006-09-12 09:27:40

Then you don’t understand the connection between ARM financing (at a time of extremely low short-term interest rates) and the home purchase budget in US-market bubble zones. There is no way that San Diego prices could have climbed to 10X median income alongside of record low affordability without the effect of I/O ARM financing to decouple home purchase budgets from permanent household incomes.

 
Comment by arroyogrande
2006-09-12 11:41:40

“The Netherlands has mostly fixed rate (10-30 year) mortgages and together with the UK one of the most extreme housing bubbles.”

nhz, how have the Dutch been able to make monthly payments on these ever increasing home prices? If the cost of a home goes up 5x, but the types of loans remain the same (fixed rate, 30 year, etc.), how can people afford the 5x monthly payments when they first buy a house?

In the US, affordability wasn’t really an issue (until now), as the banks kept allowing you easier and easier loan terms - cheap ARMs, interest only, negative amortization…but without these easier and easier loan terms, the US RE market would have hit the affordability wall much sooner.

How are the Dutch able to do it?

 
 
 
Comment by John Fontain
2006-09-12 06:18:08

Funny cartoon that was published in the “Toxic Mortgage” issue of Business Week. It shows a house sinking and a realtor tells the prospective buyers “There’s been some ’settling’ around the foundation.”

http://data.dmregister.com/duffy/details.php?id=2006-08-25

(sorry if this has already made the rounds)

Comment by scdave
2006-09-12 07:33:18

Funny….

 
 
Comment by GetStucco
2006-09-12 06:23:33

An article in the latest Economist print edition shows that UK, OZ, and US are not out of the woods yet with respect to the house price / rent ratio, unless this time is different and prices have attained a permanently high plateau relative to rents. The accompanying graphs shows that US prices are currently 50% overvalued relative to the long-term average price / rent ratio, and UK and OZ are even worse.
———————————————————————————————-
The global housing market
Checking the thermostat

Sep 7th 2006
From The Economist print edition
Property prices are cooling fast in America, but heating up elsewhere

HOUSES are not just places to live in; they are increasingly important to whole economies, which is why The Economist started publishing global house-price indicators in 2002. This has allowed us to track the biggest global property-price boom in history. The latest gloomy news from America may suggest that the world is on the brink of its biggest ever house-price bust. However, our latest quarterly update suggests that, outside America, prices are perking up.

America’s housing market has certainly caught a chill. According to the Office of Federal Housing Enterprise Oversight (OFHEO), the average price of a house rose by only 1.2% in the second quarter, the smallest gain since 1999. The past year has seen the sharpest slowdown in the rate of growth since the series started in 1975. Even so, average prices are still up by 10.1% on a year ago. This is much stronger than the series published by the National Association of Realtors (NAR), which showed a rise of only 0.9% in the year to July.

The OFHEO index is thought to be more reliable because it tracks price changes in successive sales of the same houses, and so unlike the NAR series is not distorted by a shift in the mix of sales to cheaper homes. The snag is that the data take time to appear. Prices for this quarter, which will not be published until December, may well be much weaker. A record level of unsold homes is also likely to weigh prices down. The housing futures contract traded on the Chicago Mercantile Exchange is predicting a fall of 5% next year.

http://economist.com/finance/displaystory.cfm?story_id=7891311

Comment by nhz
2006-09-12 09:09:08

always good reading these articles but really, why do they use these stupid NVM numbers for the Netherlands? (at least they now say which numbers they are using …).

Even the numbers from the ‘Kadaster’, a far more representative and official source, show price appreciation between 1997 and 2006 at nearly double the NVM number. And that’s without any correction for the huge shift in type of properties sold that occured during the boom. When using an index like the US OFHEO, the Netherlands would be at the top of the list (except when looking at the last two years when pricegains were relatively small at around 5% yoy).

 
 
Comment by Chilipepr
2006-09-12 06:38:56

Some realtors and economists now argue that the decline in home prices will be modest and is nearly complete.

They are very likely to be mistaken.This decline is just beginning and will become more severe because of a recession that will be triggered by the falling home prices. This in turn will lead to a surge in unemployment and many of the newly-unemployed will no longer be able to afford their homes.

http://www.nysun.com/article/39480

Comment by GetStucco
2006-09-12 06:48:48

“This decline is just beginning and will become more severe because of a recession that will be triggered by the falling home prices.”

Govt economists are all over this by now and have strategies in place to buoy the economy up the moment signs of a downturn emerge.

Comment by tj & the bear
2006-09-12 10:14:45

Yes, and I’m absolutely certain those will just exacerbate the downturn.

 
Comment by Hoz
2006-09-12 10:23:32

GS, All the economists in the world “are all over this”, but there is no plan, there are no strategies in place - there is no fungible currency that can bail out the US. If the US prints more dollars then Hyper Inflation.

 
 
 
Comment by GetStucco
2006-09-12 06:46:30

Have homebuilder share prices reached a permanently low plateau?

Despite a steady drumbeat of bad news, PHM’s and other major builders’ share prices have stayed almost completely flat since the early-April through early-June swoon. Can anyone offer a non-conspiracy-theory explanation for how this could happen against a steady drip of worse-than-anticipated announcements?

(My leading non-conspiracy-theory explanation: Hedge funds make loads of dough by writing puts and calls just outside the trading range in which they peg the share prices. If this theory is correct, then it is bad news for TxChick…)

http://tinyurl.com/hhkb6

Comment by txchick57
2006-09-12 06:58:47

I have no position in that group. Could care less. If anything, I’d be long or selling puts.

Comment by GetStucco
2006-09-12 07:01:57

Cool. But regardless, how do you like my theory (hedges peg the price to a trading range, then fool bulls and bears into buying puts and calls with strike prices outside of the range)?

Comment by txchick57
2006-09-12 07:09:59

They’re doing that in the indices too and have been for three plus years. That’s why the breakout in volatility this spring inflicted so much pain. That one was a warmup. I can’t wait for the next one. I am long many cheap index puts (vol).

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Comment by GetStucco
2006-09-12 07:14:04

Like other forms of rigidity, price rigidity (even if artificially induced by hedge funds) has an unpleasant side effect of increasing the level of fragility.

 
 
 
 
Comment by Lex
2006-09-12 07:07:30

Can hedge funds really peg stock prices for a whole group in such a manner? Not disagreeing, just curious.

Comment by GetStucco
2006-09-12 07:10:33

Not sure. I am just trying to think of reasons for why the builder share prices stay flat against a backdrop of steadily eroding fundamentals which do not elicit the knee-jerk “tinfoil hat” accusations.

Comment by nhz
2006-09-12 08:07:19

maybe the market is expecting a good bounce because of (future) interest rates drops?

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Comment by txchick57
2006-09-12 08:15:45

I think they’re jamming people who shorted Sept. options since Sept. is usually so weak. We’ll see what happens after that.

 
 
 
 
 
Comment by peter m
2006-09-12 06:50:08

http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/news/la-me-911ports11sep11,1,6459564.story

“Danger Abides at L.A.’s Ports
Despite millions spent on security, experts see the vast complex as a vulnerable target.
By Dan Weikel, Times Staff Writer
September 11, 2006 ……

“In the five years since the attacks of Sept. 11, the vast ports of Long Beach and Los Angeles have been included on most lists of likely terrorist targets….. ”

“California’s attorney general ranks them third and sixth respectively on a roster of 624 possible targets in the state…….”

“A key vulnerability, Flynn and others say, remains the ubiquitous cargo container, the mainstay of international commerce and a potential Trojan horse in the age of terrorism.”

“There are concerns that too few containers are inspected, both in the U.S. and at foreign ports where they are loaded.

Federal studies show that radiation detectors used to scan containers on the docks have limited effectiveness and that evacuation and recovery plans for both ports are not fully developed……..”

“If terrorists were to explode a 10-kiloton nuclear bomb in the Port of Long Beach, Rand Corp. researchers recently calculated, it could kill 60,000 people instantly, expose 150,000 more to hazardous levels of radiation and result in more than $1 trillion in economic losses, at least 10 times the financial loss in the attacks on the Pentagon and World Trade Center five years ago……”

“Of the roughly 480 ships that arrive each month in the Los Angeles and Long Beach harbors, 50 to 60 are boarded and searched by Coast Guard maritime security teams before docking…….. ”

“After ships arrive in port, about 6% of the containers they carry are selected to be scanned on the docks with X-ray machines and hand-held radiation detectors, officials say. Then about 6% of those are selected to be unloaded for inspection at customs facilities…….
All trucks leaving the harbor areas are again scanned by radiation detectors…..”

MY Comments:

This is a long thorough article on the screening process for incoming cargo ships and containers and what steps The authorities are taking to guard against terrorist attacts on the Long Beach/LA ports. I only pasted a few snippets: the article is very long and thorough and needs to be read thoroughly to get a balanced assessment of Port Security procedures and their effectiveness.
I have always maintained that these ports are a prime target of a possible terrorist attact due to the incalculable economic damage/disruption they could deal to the US economy.
As much anti-terrorist funding as possible should be provided to bolster our ports.

Comment by GetStucco
2006-09-12 07:02:35

This news is off topic and five years old, to boot…

 
 
Comment by Left LA Behind
2006-09-12 06:58:48

Uh oh…

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/5337770.stm

IMF warns of global growth danger

The International Monetary Fund (IMF) has warned that a global slowdown is looking more likely because of high oil prices and a cooler US housing market.

“There are risks to the global economic outlook that have tilted to the downside,” the IMF said in a report.

It also said that the US dollar may fall unless policies on savings levels and investment imbalances were changed.

The report was released ahead of the IMF and World Bank’s annual meetings in Singapore later this month.

The official IMF event does not starts until 19 September, but leaders from the Group of Seven (G7) richest nations and finance ministers are already in Singapore discussing policies.

Comment by GetStucco
2006-09-12 07:08:49

Sorry to repeat a post for the gazillionth time, but anyone who is interested in the IMF’s perspective should at least look at the tables in this report, if not actually read it (CAUTION: .PDF FILE):

“WORLD ECONOMIC OUTLOOK, April 2003 — Chapter 2: When Bubbles Burst”

http://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/weo/2003/01/pdf/chapter2.pdf#search=%22when%20bubbles%20burst%22

Comment by jag
2006-09-12 12:32:54

Anyone seriously interested in what this real estate bubble can mean should read that World Economic Report. Basically it says RE busts are much worse, historically, than equity busts because of the ripple effect on the economy. It is not good news for employment, GDP or for stocks.

 
Comment by Jon
2006-09-12 19:08:26

Anyone who doesn’t have time/interest in reading the whole thing should at least skip to page 74 and read the synopsis… It sums it up well in a single page.

Jon

 
 
Comment by nhz
2006-09-12 09:14:17

I think the IMF has been warning long enough now for politicians to totally ignore what they are saying (at least as long as the message is inconvenient to them).

Comment by Getstucco
2006-09-12 09:23:27

The unique thing about the IMF report is that it carries considerably more statistical weight than any other study I have seen, as it covers housing and stock market experience over a long period of years and across a broad cross section of developed country economies. It’s take home message is quite straightforward: Housing busts generally last longer and have more severe macroeconomic consequences than do stock market crashes.

 
 
 
Comment by lauravella
2006-09-12 07:08:42

It hasnt been posted here yet, but there is an article on Yahoo finance by bankrate.com stating anyone can put a freeze on their credit rating for ID theft for all states, in addition Nevada and California and other select states a person can freeze their credit for any reason. Humm, could this be to stop banks from giving them a bad mark for not making mortgage or other timely credit payments?

or is this saying…O.K. to mess-up your finances - lets change the rules to protect people that make bad financial decisions…

Comment by GetStucco
2006-09-12 07:16:20

“lets change the rules to protect people that make bad financial decisions…”

Standard govt operating procedure…

 
Comment by Lex
2006-09-12 08:55:17

Credit freeze legislation has nothing to do with credit reporting, and it does not automatically revoke previous authorizations. It is opposed by lenders & credit card agencies on the following grounds:

“In the meantime, a consumer could miss out on a low mortgage rate or one-time credit card offer, says Nessa Feddis, senior federal counsel for the American Bankers Association. “It sounds good, but people don’t realize how often they request their credit reports be pulled for a good deal,” she says.”

I don’t think I have to translate.

from http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/archives/individual/2005_06/006545.php

 
Comment by Chip
2006-09-12 11:42:36

“…could this be to stop banks from giving them a bad mark for not making mortgage or other timely credit payments?”

I suspect it is more benign than that. I received my letter today from the Veterans Administration, saying that the missing laptop was found and they are certain it was not compromised. The “freeze,” on a broad scale, could be a monumental bureacratic nightmare because people constantly would be wanting to un-freeze for this or that reason. Heaven forbid, I think they’d almost have to have a new Division of Credit Freezes to handle the workload and complaints. Politicians want nothing to do with such a hot potato, IMO.

 
 
Comment by lauravella
2006-09-12 07:14:13

Here is the article on credit freezing: A bill pending in the House of Representatives would limit who can put a security freeze on credit reports. If passed, this federal bill, the Financial Data Protection Act of 2006, would limit credit freezes to identity theft victims. Once you’ve been hit by ID theft you may request a credit freeze, not before.

A credit freeze gives consumers control over their personal financial information by allowing them to block access to their credit reports — a move that essentially prevents unauthorized credit checks. If lenders can’t check your credit report, they can’t grant credit to imposters.

Currently, 20 states have passed legislation allowing any consumer to place a credit freeze on his or her credit reports — whether a victim of identity theft or not.

The idea of allowing anyone, anytime, to place a freeze on his or her credit sparks controversy between consumer advocates and financial industry proponents. Some see credit freezes as too extreme, while others see them as “the biggest tool in the toolbox.”

The logic behind this bill, says Ed Mierzwinski, U.S. Public Interest Research Group, or PIRG, consumer program director, is “like saying you can’t get a seat belt until you’ve been in an accident.”

J. Craig Shearman, vice president of government affairs for the National Retail Federation, doesn’t think a security freeze is necessary for most consumers.

“Our concern is that the credit freeze issue has become overkill, because most consumers are never going to be the victims of ID theft. If millions of consumers place a credit freeze on their files, it can cause difficulties when trying to purchase homes, cars or even opening simple lines of credit at a department store,” he says.

If not a credit freeze, then what?
Opponents of security freezes say that placing a fraud alert on your account is just as effective for notifying the three credit reporting agencies that your information has been tampered with or stolen. A fraud alert, which is free, allows U.S. citizens to place a 90-day watch on their credit files, requiring banks and other credit lenders to take extra steps to verify their identities before issuing credit.

While a credit freeze offers good protection, it means a consumer may not be able to access his or her own credit during that time period, says Steven Katz, spokesman for TransUnion’s Truecredit.com. Fraud alerts allow you to go about your credit activities without paying or waiting to lift a freeze. An alert, unless removed or renewed by the consumer, falls off after 90 days. A credit freeze stays put until the consumer pays to remove it.

Consumer advocates warn that fraud alerts don’t live up to their labels. Calling fraud alerts a “fig leaf of protection,” Mierzwinski says that they merely place a flag on credit reports. They don’t stop credit from being issued.

The need to protect customers should not be underestimated, especially since most consumers don’t have the option of giving their consent about where their personal information is being sent.

“Credit bureaus and data brokers buy and sell your name, address, Social Security number and credit file to anyone who will pay for it,” says Evan Hendricks, editor of Privacy Times.

Chris Hoofnagle, the west coast director of the Electronic Privacy Information Center, says consumer reporting agencies’ interests are not in tune with consumers’ interests. “The credit bureaus are creatures that serve the creditors and don’t want any slowdown of instant credit.”

I cant think of a good reason to freeze credit ratings…anyone?

 
Comment by bearishgirl
2006-09-12 07:17:10

Morning bloggers, I found this on Realty Times…..lol…..now let’s play fair in the sandbox….lol!

http://realtytimes.com/rtmcrcond/California~Torrance~kaygrundhaus

Comment by scdave
2006-09-12 07:41:15

Damm;…Suzanne’s name is really Kay….Funny….

 
Comment by John Fontain
2006-09-12 09:22:06

“listen to your realtor and everyone will be happy”

this coming from a realtor who says she doesn’t see prices falling. sickening!

 
Comment by tlm
2006-09-12 09:29:17

I don’t see prices really going down, it just seems that way because owners are still trying to get top dollar for their houses, and I don’t blame them.

Umm.. can anyone translate for me? So let me get this straight, sellers are still trying to sell at high prices, and this makes it appear as if prices are falling? Anyone? Anyone??

Comment by Desert Dweller
2006-09-12 11:08:58

“listen to your realtor and everyone will be happy”

The all time funniest line ever.

Comment by P'cola Popper
2006-09-12 11:28:46

“Give me the money and nobody gets hurt”

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Comment by Chip
2006-09-12 11:45:12

LOL.

 
 
 
 
 
Comment by GetStucco
2006-09-12 07:25:36

Barbara Corcoran is on abc’s Good Morning America’s Show Me the Money morning business show right now, offering some very clever tips on how to market a home in the current slowdown.

1) Drop a dead celebrity into your living room. She suggests displaying a photo of Marilyn Monroe on the wall to get the conversation going.

2) Rent billboard space to advertise that your home is for sale.

3) Hold a joint open house with a bunch of your neighbors who are also selling their homes.

4) Rent a latte cart and park it in front of your home.

5) Offer free pizza and beer for a year as part of the sales contract.

Not mentioned: LOWER YOUR ASKING PRICE!!!

 
Comment by GetStucco
2006-09-12 07:39:05

Does the fact that Robert Toll is elucidating the reasons the housing market overheated explain today’s skyrocketing homebuilder share prices (5%+ jump)? His musing about a downturn limited to two years duration is a strawman, as previous downturns in housing have lasted a minimum of four years.
————————————————————————————————-
Greed, speculation helped overheat housing market: Toll CEO
By John Spence
Last Update: 11:27 AM ET Sep 12, 2006

BOSTON (MarketWatch) — Toll Brothers Inc. (TOL: 27.95, +1.33, +5.0% ) Chief Executive Robert Toll said the U.S. housing market got ahead of itself due to greed on the part of buyers and sellers, and that it now likely faces the highest level of speculative inventory ever. Toll said the current downturn is unique in his experience because it wasn’t driven by a “macro-event” although interest rates have risen steadily. “Every day there’s an article about how lousy housing is now and how dumb you have to be to buy a house now,” the CEO said Tuesday at the Credit Suisse Homebuilders Symposium. “I don’t know what it will take to turn this market — it could take two years, or it could take someone getting quoted in the New York Times saying the market has hit bottom.”

http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/story.aspx?guid=%7BDFF933DD-D746-4A56-AFB5-A53A916DF126%7D

 
 
Comment by Getstucco
2006-09-12 08:57:33

Is Cecere’s shocking revelation that housing supply and demand are out of balance providing yet another reason for the homebuilder share prices to rally? Or is it the investigation of Karatz’s option grants that is sparking investor optimism?
——————————————————————————–
KB Home CFO says housing facing supply/demand imbalance
By John Spence
Last Update: 8:22 AM ET Sep 12, 2006

BOSTON (MarketWatch) –KB Home (KBH : Last: 43.15 +2.04 +4.96%
12:33pm 09/12/2006 Delayed quote data) Chief Financial Officer Dom Cecere said the U.S. housing market is facing an imbalance between supply and demand, and that pricing pressure will continue just like in any other industry until it evens out. He said Tuesday the market needs to work its way through “the speculative inventory being dumped on the market” before home prices stabilize. KB Home is scaling back its land position to “reflect the realities of the market,” Cecere said at the Credit Suisse Homebuilding Symposium. Cecere said he could not comment on the company’s ongoing and previously disclosed internal review of stock-option grants given to Chief Executive Bruce Karatz.

End of Story

Comment by jmf
2006-09-12 09:26:29

look at the shortsqueeze at wci.

20% plus in 4 days. optionsmania.

i will add to my shorts on friday or monday.

Shares Short (as of 10-Aug-06)3: 16.20M
Short Ratio (as of 10-Aug-06)3: 10.9
Short % of Float (as of 10-Aug-06)3: 44.80%

Comment by Getstucco
2006-09-12 09:28:36

Short-term shorts are getting their teeth kicked in…

 
 
 
Comment by Getstucco
2006-09-12 09:08:30

A Tale of Two Bubbles, by Dr. Irwin Kellner

(Not discussed:

1) Falling home prices and falling energy prices could turn out to be parallel symptoms of deflation in response to a slowing world economy, which the Fed will fight by any means necessary. Whether or not they will succeed in this epic struggle without breaking the financial system in the process is the trillion dollar question.

2) Home ownership is far more widespread in society than ownership stakes in energy producers. Thus the negative wealth effect of falling home prices is far more pervasive than that of falling energy prices.)
———————————————————————————–
http://tinyurl.com/fbk5k

IRWIN KELLNER
Will fall in oil price trump real-estate softness?
Commentary: Confidence disproportionately swayed by housing slump
By Dr. Irwin Kellner, MarketWatch
Last Update: 2:28 AM ET Sep 12, 2006

HEMPSTEAD, N.Y. (MarketWatch) — Falling prices of energy and housing are exerting opposing — but unequal — pulls on confidence and the economy.

Both are responding to the law of supply and demand. Prices of oil and natural gas have come down from their recent highs because demand is not keeping pace with output, thus causing inventories to rise. Home prices are down for the same reason: demand is falling, while the number of homes being put up for sale is rising.

You would think that falling prices of these two important items in the consumer’s market basket would be greeted with universal cheers. You would be wrong.

There are far more fans of falling energy prices than there are those who are rooting for falling home prices. Indeed, except for those relatively few families who happen to be in the market to buy a house, falling home prices are increasingly being looked upon as a threat to the economy, rather than a boon.

When home prices rise, we take that to mean that we are wealthier. Some of us even tap this increase in home equity in order to put this wealth to work. Conversely, on those rare occasions when home prices fall, which they are doing now, it has a deleterious effect on wealth, spending and thus on confidence.

 
Comment by Lex
2006-09-12 09:09:58

BTW, witness list posted for the Senate hearing. Disappointed, to say the least.

http://banking.senate.gov/index.cfm?Fuseaction=Hearings.Detail&HearingID=236

Comment by Getstucco
2006-09-12 09:20:14

They have to listen to the guys whose constituent lobbies send in the campaign contributions…

 
 
Comment by manhattanite
2006-09-12 09:17:59

lex, did you get my posting explaining that jm had said “bingo #11″ in a later comment (#23) on that thread?

Comment by Lex
2006-09-12 09:19:45

Yes I did. Thank you. Was a bit surprised by his comment, ‘tho.

Comment by manhattanite
2006-09-12 09:24:36

chip pointed out admirably that the vertical sq ftg available in manhattan is so, so much than anyone realized. it might as well be texas.

Comment by manhattanite
2006-09-12 09:26:10

“so so much MORE than anyone realized.”

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Comment by Hoz
2006-09-12 10:37:40

ECB: Consistently Hawkish
Tuesday, 12 September 2006 11:58:31 GMT
- ECB: Consistently Hawkish

Written by Terri Belkas, Junior Currency Analyst
Central bankers continue to make comments regarding “vigilance”, but ECB President Trichet seems concerned with more than just Europe and the euro…
Jean-Claude Trichet, ECB President

“Global economic growth remains quite dynamic but uncertainties are also growing. We have the sentiment that the global economy grows at a robust pace. But while growth is quite dynamic uncertainties are also growing.” – September 11, 2006

Said that “central banks cannot afford to be complacent about inflation pressure” and emphasized the need to anchor inflation expectations.” – September 11, 2006

“On the exchange rates question, I trust…that excessive volatility and disorderly movements in exchange rates are undesirable for economic growth.” – September 8, 2006

Axel Weber, ECB Governing Council Member

“We have not decided that by the end of the year, the withdrawal of the (current) accommodative policy should be stopped. If the ECB’s main scenario on economic growth and inflation is fulfilled, then there should be a progressive withdrawal of the stimulative monetary policy. If our baseline scenario is confirmed, then there is a need to take action… There would be a need to withdraw our accommodative monetary policy. This does not mean we are going to have a restrictive policy.” – September 6, 2006

Jurgen Stark, ECB Chief Economist

“The next economic projections of the eurosystem staff will be important on discussions about the continuation of rate increases…At some moment, we will have to communicate what will happen after the end of the year.” – September 11, 2006

Said that there is a risk that inflation expectations may “harden at a higher level” should financial markets “wrongly assume” that the bank will tolerate an inflation rate of more than 2% permanently. – September 11, 2006

Yves Mersch, ECB Governing Council Member

“The ECB will exercise the strongest vigilance not only in the near future, but one should expect that the ECB won’t stop its determination to control prices at the end of the year. Monetary policy will remain very accommodative due to the very abundant liquidity in the market. We will do whatever is necessary to deliver on our mandate of price stability.” – September 7, 2006

The Head of the Eurogroup sounds apprehensive about the ECB’s candid nature…

Jean-Claude Juncker, Head of the Eurogroup

“I have asked ministers not to be too outspoken on monetary policy. I am a great defender of the independence of the central bank. I will continue to press for regular informal talks with Trichet to strengthen cooperation between the euro’s political and monetary arms. I wanted to take the heat out of the debate. Both of us have said there is an excellent relationship and that co-operation will be intensified.” – September 11, 2006

US Fed: Careful Navigation

Central bankers have made incredibly similar sounding statements, with the exception of Poole…

William Poole, St. Louis Federal Reserve Bank President

Noted that the Fed should have a policy “that is as tight as it needs to be,” though he also expects inflation to taper lower over time and sees some noise in the inflation data. He also warned that if inflation does not ebb, he would rather act sooner than later. – September 11, 2006

“We might have some weakness in certain sections of the country, but I think we’re just not going to have a housing crash that’s nationwide.” – September 6, 2006

Turning dovish?

Sandra Pianalto, Cleveland Federal Reserve Bank President

In reference to the August 8th FOMC meeting, “Although the elevated inflation numbers concerned me, and indeed they still do, the overall pace of economic activity - especially housing activity - had begun to moderate, and the full effect of the FOMC’s previous rate increases had not yet been felt. I viewed the pause as appropriate to give me the chance to accumulate more information before judging whether additional policy firming would be needed.” – September 8, 2006

Once a dove, always a dove…

Janet Yellen, San Francisco Federal Reserve Bank President

Commenting on the FOMC decision to hold rates, “I think this was the prudent course of action that properly balances the dual mandate given to the Fed by Congress—to foster price stability and maximum sustainable employment… I would argue that a gradual approach is likely to be better because there is a need to incorporate lags between policy actions and effects on the economy.” – September 7, 2006

Cathy Minehan, Boston Federal Reserve Bank President

“On the risks to growth, one obvious concern is the housing market…The Bank’s baseline forecast assumes a continued moderate downturn in residential construction…An even larger downside could result if nominal home prices actually decline, rather than flatten out as projected, affecting household wealth and overall spending more than anticipated.” – September 11, 2006

BoJ: Standing at a Crossroads

Officials defend their monetary and fiscal policy…

Toshihiko Fukui, BOJ Governor

“The change in the base year and other changes made a bigger impact than the market had thought. But I believe the data still confirms that prices have been on a moderate uptrend since the start of this year, and suggests that the year-on-year rate of change in consumer prices is projected to continue to follow a positive trend, as the output gap continues to be positive.” – September 8, 2006

“We always discuss currencies at the G7 meetings from various aspects as part of overall talks on future economic policy management. But this time, it is not clear what kind of opinions will be expressed in what way. But I think there is little possibility (for the G7 group) to discuss in depth on currencies in particular. I heard that there were some comments from Europeans on this issue, but I don’t expect in-depth discussions on the JPY in particular.” – September 8, 2006

Shinzo Abe, Japanese Chief Cabinet Secretary

“While we (the government and the ruling parties) are promoting reforms, I hope the BOJ will support the economy through monetary policy.” – September 6, 2006

Sadakazu Tanigaki, Japanese Finance Minister

“Our outstanding public debt stands at around 150% of gross domestic product and we have noted the need to prevent it from snowballing. We have no time to spare when it comes to fiscal reforms.” – September 5, 2006

Kaoru Yosano, Japanese Economic and Fiscal Policy Minister

“We’ve learned a lot from Mrs. Thatcher and from America, but we can’t follow exactly their path to reform…There’s a limit to our reforms. The market fails sometimes.” – September 8, 2006

PBoC: A Public Affair

Matters of the yuan have come to be a crucial issue in China, especially amidst international pressures…

Zhou Xiaochuan, PBoC Governor

“I think in the second quarter of this year growth was a little too high…My opinion is that liquidity is still abundant in China’s economy, so we are going to squeeze it…I think we are gradually expanding flexibility of exchange rates. That is our policy.” – September 11, 2006

Wen Jiabao, Chinese Premier

“We will firmly deepen the yuan exchange rate formation mechanism reform and let market supply and demand set the exchange rate level and gradually allow more exchange rate flexibility. Therefore, there won’t be any ‘unexpected’ adjustment to the yuan exchange rate.” – September 6, 2006

Wu Yi, Chinese Vice Premier

“China will continue to open up to attract more foreign investment.” – September 8, 2006

“Some problems still exist in China’s economy but these problems have a limited impact on the overall economy.” – September 7, 2006

Fan Gang, PBoC MPC member

“We still need to maintain investment growth at a certain level. (Annual) investment growth of around 20% is desirable.” – September 7, 2006

Bo Xilai, Chinese Commerce Minister

“At present, we need the developed (country) members to take the lead in making substantial concessions in order to create conditions for the quick resumption of the (WTO Doha Round) negotiations.” – September 5, 2006

The world is worried about dollar induced inflation except us.

Comment by nhz
2006-09-12 11:53:32

“ECB: Consistently Hawkish”

sorry, what a joke. All just empty talk to provide cover for when things run out of hand in the near future. Right from the start of the ECB, real inflation and money supply growth in the EU has been at least as high (M3 growth 8-12% yoy) as in the US. During the last years, even the heavily doctered inflation numbers have consistently been above the official ECB ceiling. Current ECB rates are far below the FED funds rate; the ECB is far more behind the curve than their fellow inflationists from the FED.
I don’t think there is any chance of ‘tight’, responsible monetary policy as long as these clowns control Europe’s finances.

 
 
Comment by P'cola Popper
 
Comment by Chip
2006-09-12 12:00:53

Darkly funny:

At http://www.realcentralva.com , the question du jour is “Should buyers forego inspection in a hot market?” This is dated 9/12/06.

Hot? You mean like dot-com hot?

 
Comment by jag
2006-09-12 12:48:09

Who in their right mind would forego an inspection, much less RECOMMEND it?

Who would even imagine bringing up such a question?

 
Comment by luvs_footie
2006-09-12 16:50:30

And this from Australia……..

http://www.invbiznews.com/wordpress/?p=451

Has this world gone completely mad?

 
Comment by chuen
2006-09-12 21:35:31

My coworker just listed his condo in Canyon Country (Santa Clarita, CA) for $269,000 (2 bd, about 850 sq. ft.) - He’s the second lowest priced condo among 50 for sale in the same 800-unit complex (1 out of every 16). Many of his neighbors have it priced around $300K and have had it sit on the market for months. And many have reduced their unrealistic prices only to have it still sit. It’ll be interesting to see how this one plays out.

 
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