New Homes For-Sale ‘In The Thousands’: Orlando
The Orlando Sentinel reports from Florida. “Exactly one year after hitting an all-time high, Orlando’s existing-home sales had their slowest August in four years last month as the area’s housing market continued losing steam at a slow but steady pace. The number of homes resold in the core Orlando market dropped nearly 34 percent compared with August 2005.”
“The market’s inventory of available properties continued to grow, surpassing 20,000 for the first time, totaling 21,077 properties, the equivalent of a 10-month supply of homes. The last time the inventory-to-sales ratio was that high was back in February 1997.”
“Sellers, increasingly thwarted by the high number of competing homes, are beginning to fret as the weeks tick by without a sale. Maria Rivera, who has been trying to sell her two-bedroom, two-bath Port Orange home for nearly a year, said Thursday that she is about to list her property with a Realtor once again, her third listing since last October.”
“‘My original price was $240,000, but now the price has been lowered to $219,000,’ she said. Rivera said she fears that rising property-insurance rates and taxes are key reasons buyers are reluctant to make offers these days.”
“A total of 2,077 homes changed hands in August through the Mid-Florida Regional MLS, compared with 3,134 a year earlier. It was the lowest total for August since 2002.”
“Newly built homes are now being added to the Realtors’ MLS in significant numbers, and that’s a new wrinkle, said Anthony Crocco, Central Florida division director for Metrostudy.”
“‘This is really something we haven’t seen before,’ Crocco said. The number of new homes being offered through Realtors is now ‘in the thousands,’ he said, as increasingly desperate investors or speculators decide to compete directly with the previously owned homes that typically comprise the Realtors’ listings.”
“The backlog of unsold homes is actually worse in coastal counties such as Brevard, Crocco said, as contracts are canceled and potential buyers walk away from their deposits.”
“Area Realtors say they are holding more weekend open houses and hustling harder than ever, particularly for sellers such as Rivera, who need to relocate and are not just testing the market with unreasonably high asking prices.”
‘Faced with the loss of more than 8,300 students this year, Broward school district officials intend to find out who disappeared and why. Among the questions they will consider: Are the district’s students fleeing because of high housing costs? School districts all over the state are pondering the same issue. Till said declining enrollment was the buzz at a conference of Florida superintendents earlier this week. ”The numbers surprise me and the fact that’s it’s happening across the state,’ he said.’
‘ All Floridians who pay homeowner insurance premiums will have a one-time charge added to help cover Citizens Property Insurance Corp.’s $1.7 billion deficit in 2005, officials with the state-backed home insurer decided Thursday. ‘This is really horrendous,’ said Laura Feldman, a State Farm Florida customer in Pembroke Pines whose premium will increase from roughly $1,500 to more than $5,000 a year.’
‘This is really horrendous,’ said Laura Feldman, a State Farm Florida customer in Pembroke Pines whose premium will increase from roughly $1,500 to more than $5,000 a year.’
WOW, that is enormous. When is this new Tax Bill due, 1//2 Dec..1/2 April??
This is something to watch in realtime. Gonna have to look into the laws on Florida property. Buying Tax Liens might be an interesting thought a year from now, depending on the laws of course.
Tax bills come out in November and are due by May ( I think ) here in Polk County.
Tax deed sales will be creeping up on alot of these less desirable crackerboxes down here in another 3-4 years. There are alot of “fixer-uppers” that the flippers are stuck with down here and they are desperately trying to unload them without putting and money into them.
Everybody is bailing out in a hurry….I mean EVERYBODY.
When the snow birds arrive from the north this fall and winter, they will begin to digest the enormous increase in their tax bills and insurance bills this year. Taxes up by 25 to 40%, because they do not qualify for the homestead exception. Insurance bills up as high as 300% more.
My prediction is; Florida will see an explosion if inventory hit the market in the spring, the likes of which has not been seen since the 1920’s.
We managed to secure a $3,500 policy for our home, which was up from the previous $1,900 policy we had in effect with a small insurer that went under due to the hurricanes and got taken over by Citizens, the state company. If my wife and I were not able to get the $3,500 policy, the next best quote was more than a $1,000 higher. And keep in mind: This is for a house built up to the latest codes (new construction completed in 2004) and NOT in the zone that also requires windstorm coverage. Older houses that are closer to the ocean, built with frame construction, gabled roofs, etc. can cost thousands more to insure. It’s a total nightmare.
This is all IMO: many of the pilgrims who move to Florida think that a frame house is OK or even desirable. More power to ‘em, but most old Floridians wouldn’t touch a house that is not concrete block. The one exception is some of the very old “cracker” housing that seems indestructible — they are easy to spot because they are built up on blocks/crawlspaces.
Easiest way to spot a frame house from the outside or driving by: look for the “stucco cut” at the bottom, an indent inward toward the house, right as the house meets the ground. Not a guarantee, though — some frame houses do not have stucco cuts and reputedly they are much more susceptible to termite damage.
At that point, you might as well self-insure: set up an investment account specifically for housing repairs/replacements. It might not be enough, but it sure beats $5,000/month for insurance that you probably won’t be able to collect when the next hurricane hits.
Self insurance is a great idea … except for the fact that if you have a mortgage, you HAVE to have homeowners insurance. That’s my situation and the situation of most FL homeowners.
once again, the govt agents and school officals are down right stupid and in so much denial. families are moving out of florida , period. the remaining insurance policies coming out this year will make people pull their hair. lets sit and look at the Jan. 2007 numbers and see the inventory exploded. then, see sellers start dropping prices. they will have to or they will go bankrupt, spending all of their money on insurance and taxes!
And people wonder why Florida has an education problem. School superintendents can’t figure it out. Now they will probably spend taxpayer money on a study to figure out what they could find out very easily by going into the neighborhoods and talking to people on the street. OK, here goes: 1) Families can’t afford to live in Florida, with the low wages and high cost of living. DUH! 2) The schools majorly suck. Who wants to send their kids into a situation where the kids have to worry more about being jumped than about grades?
yes but they do produce a number of high quality division 1 athletes. nj has great schools but few athletes of d1 caliber
i have an uncle in key largo who saw his windstorm policy go from $2200 to $14,000 to $21,000 in four years. citizens considers anything in monroe county toxic.
Boulderbo, Please let me know the dollar value of your uncle’s home. I am guessing this is a very high priced property to have $21,000 per in windstorm policy(?). What does the windstorm policy cover? Is it something in addition to regular home owner’s insurance? Thanks
bought 5 years ago for $400k, was worth $1.2 last year, now probably moving below $900k. windstorm does not cover flood, although they’re one story up above an apartment below.
Wow. I don’t know how anyone can afford that.
He has to have meant 2,100. 21k is not possible. My place has the same value and I pay the highest rates (state pool) and the figure would be no more than $2,100.
sorry va, boulderbo is right. the keys insurance rates are just out of this world. but the reality is that, if your house is worth 1.2 million and it is destroyed, who is going to hold the bag. remember, the keys nearly have a hurricane threat every other year. i dont like what the insurance companies are doing, but the rise in housing values (assumed) must be paid out. hurricane katrina really changed the game. if you have large communities wiped out by a cat 5, do you think the insurance company is going have pay low and payout high? everyone wants to act rich, but not pay for being rich. if your house value goes up 4X, your insurance should go up 4X. the problem is the flipfloppers and bag holders who demand to make thousands for nothing. now that the tables is turn, i see tears. here other way of looking at it. i own a home at 370,000 + 30,000 insurance. my insurance is going up from 1,000 a year to 4,000 a year. that 3,000 difference over 30 years is 90,000. 30,000 vs 90,000. the 60,000 difference is the amount a buyer needs to look at to stay in the same mortgage range. as a buyer, do i pay 60,000 more to buy in the same house that the seller is selling. 310,000 + 90,000 insurance. that is an 16% shave. no incentives is worth a price shave and buyers have figure it out and still cant afford housing in most of florida
I am in Naples. Is there really that big a difference in rates? I find 21K for a Wind policy, frankly, unbelieveable.
You need 3 policies in Florida. Regular Homeowners, Flood, and Wind. It adds up. At 21K for wind, that seems extremely high. In a condo, you will need to replace the entire interior, including the walls, etc. The “blanket” policy that is paid through your fees, gives you an empty shell. I am in the “state pool” on a first floor beachfront place. The most insurance you can get is 250K.
But remember, there is no state income tax in FL!
“But remember, there is no state income tax in FL!”
And no roads worth a good poop!
Gonna be lots of FT*’s (fooked teachers) who bought area homes, thinking, “This will be forever”…
Now they’ll all be laid off, and caught in the tar pit of crashing values and no jobs.
HD,
Considering the average income for a teacher is south of $40,000 a year, the last problem teachers have is worrying about keeping the house they have. Most teachers cannot afford to LIVE in most of South Florida- period. Not only is there a dropoff in students, but there is also an exodus of teachers to other states where they are paid higher and the cost of living is less.
Ben,
Took a cruise through sedona and the infamous oak creek canyon yesterday. It was raining in parts of flaggstaff. I then went back 260 east through pine and then through payson back to mesa. I saw some great country but agree prices are way ahead of themselves up there. Looks like a fire had burned near sedona recently.
There was a fire in Oak Creek Canyon earlier this year. A big one, too. Started in a homeless encampment.
“‘My original price was $240,000, but now the price has been lowered to $219,000,’ she said. Rivera said she fears that rising property-insurance rates and taxes are key reasons buyers are reluctant to make offers these days.”
Or maybe your PRICE IS TOO HIGH for a dinky 2 bedroom condo! For crying out loud, why can’t these people get the message? Lower your price, and people will buy. Is that so hard to comprehend?
I have been folowing parts of gilbert az and exhisting home sellers are still waiting for the greater fool to show up and buy their special house. I’ve seen houses sit for 6 months with a wish price. Inventory is so high due to all the people still trying to cash out at last years price. I wish I could figure out who really needed to sell vs. the dreamers.New builders are adjusting prices much faster for current market conditions.
I have been closely following Gilbert as well. I completely agree with you. Only the builders are going down in price. (They seem almost desperate now.) I have a friend in Gilbert who recently put his home on the market. He wants to cash out and rent for a couple of years as he knows a housing crash is coming. But yet he puts his 3,000 sf home on the market for $560k. He bought it less than two years for $300. I guess he doesn’t want to “cash out” that badly.
I think some posters on this site mentioned months ago that the builders were going to determine the prices on the way down . Builders are now paying the used real estate agents to sell the new stuff trying to capture any available buyer out there . (They usually pay the tract saleman less to market inventory ). So this is a concession for builder to pay higher marketing costs to get the re-sale agents to switch over to their new inventory .
I would just like to say that you can go directly to a new home tract and get more concessions from the builder if you don’t use a agent . Any money a builder can save could be passed on to the buyer IMHO, ( I know realtors will hate me for saying this ). Damn it , people need to save money right now so I don’t care what you guys think . You guys(realtors ) had a gravy train for a long time and I am more concerned about people not overpaying . This is a bad situation and I don’t want the public to be screwed anymore .If you guys had any brains at all you would know that if the masses fall ,we all fall in one way or another .
Michigan Born and Phoenix Bound: Your friend is chasing the market all the way down to perhaps the $300k that he bought it for, or maybe until foreclosure if market price for his home gets to be below $300k. Why are these sellers with equity so unrealistic? If your friend was not living in a fantasy world then he could walk with more than $100k in his pocket if he prices it right TODAY.
Unbelievable!
Do they automatically foreclose if the market price is less than what is owed on the house? I didn’t see that the friend was having trouble making his payments. I thought you could “just” get stuck paying far more than the house was worth.
Never ever underestimate the “Power of Positive Thinking.”
The power of positive thinking is powerless.
Lower your price, and people will buy
Not necessarily…To use GetStucco’s line…
Why as buyer do you want to catch a falling knife. We’re talkin’ easy quarter mil value declines here.
This valuation collapse has a long way to unwind.
Some hard-core’s are even saying WW III will evolve to muddy the waters to divert the attention of millions of people from realizing how really screwed they are.
And that’s as low as it can get.
Ummmm, your WWIII talk is very off topic. WWIII won’t be started to save housing. It will be started because Muslims do not want to tolerate any non-Islam thoughts in this world. Look at their furor over the Pope today. Just silly. So, please don’t go too far off topic on this site.
If you really want to flush out the islamo-fascists, so that they are easier to spot and kill, just publish a bunch of political cartoons featuring the profit Mohamed. Sorry for my political incorrectness in advance.
Did blogger go down or has the REIC hijacked my site?
http://bakersfieldbubble.blogspot.com
No, your site was not jacked by the REIC. I can see it — clear as a bell.
Really? I keep getting an error message. Error 500
I’m using Mozilla Firefox on WinXP and it’s coming through just fine.
Oops. I stand corrected. What was coming through just fine was a cached version of your site. I just did a hard refresh (Control-F5) and it’s not showing up right now.
Our dog rescue site is down too on blogger.
I should of know you were a dog lover Txchic. I rescued a dog about 2 years ago and its been the greatest dog . The dog had a injury from a car accident ,but I didn’t care .
Dogs that have been rescued usually have been to hell and back and they love you for giving them a home .
down for me.
Crispy,
Uh oh… I can get to my blogspot blog…
I hope connectivity to yours is restored soon.
Neil
tin-foil hat off.
Thanks!
Anytime you have to ask that question, the answer is number 1.
LOL. I remember, before you switched, how we would get locked out and posts deleted. Very unreliable.
Works for me, with firefox.
“Sellers, increasingly thwarted by the high number of competing homes, are beginning to fret as the weeks tick by without a sale. Maria Rivera, who has been trying to sell her two-bedroom, two-bath Port Orange home for nearly a year, said Thursday that she is about to list her property with a Realtor once again, her third listing since last October.”
“‘My original price was $240,000, but now the price has been lowered to $219,000,’ she said. Rivera said she fears that rising property-insurance rates and taxes are key reasons buyers are reluctant to make offers these days.”
———————————————————————————
Yet another greedy asshat hopes to strike it rich on their little castle.
Get a clue lady…….YOUR LITTLE BUNGALOW IS WORTH MAYBE $ 80,000 AT THE MOST.
These people are gonna choke on their own greed and sense of self-entitlement.
Here, I found the greedy asshat’s tax records. Looks like she paid $ 105,500 in 2003:
http://www.brevardpropertyappraiser.com/asp/Show_parcel.asp?acct=2506721&gen=T&tax=T&bld=T&oth=T&sal=T&lnd=T&leg=T&GoWhere=real_search.asp&SearchBy=
Greedy b!tch
Where does she think she is, Phoenix!!
RIVERA MIGUEL A & MARIA M
Owner Address 2 3722 HUGH ST
Les I think you had the wrong county as Port Orange is in Volusia. She and her husband paid $75k for this house in 1999.
Owner Address 3 PORT ORANGE FL
Owner Zip Code 321194214
Location Address 3722 HUGH ST PORT ORANGE
You are correct….my bad.
Still, what an example of pure greed. She basically feels like she’s entitled to almost 3X what she paid in 1999.
A very greedy b!tch.
Get a clue lady…….YOUR LITTLE BUNGALOW IS WORTH MAYBE $ 80,000 AT THE MOST
Yep…
“‘This is really something we haven’t seen before,’ Crocco said. The number of new homes being offered through Realtors is now ‘in the thousands,’ he said, as increasingly desperate investors or speculators decide to compete directly with the previously owned homes that typically comprise the Realtors’ listings.”
This is playing out just as many of us have predicted here — a flood of new homes for sale is adding to the already-severe flood of existing homes in the MLS. I guess we should expect a big share price rally on the homebuilder stocks today in response to yet another amazing revelation about eroding fundamentals, as homebuilder stock prices always go up, at least in the short run.
and it’s no different in manhattan either.
The stock market is just another Las Vegas gambling casino, the house settings the odds, and teasing you with the chance to win big. And they have Krammer and CNBC for their pitchman.
The action of the homebuilders over the last 30 days proves this is a playground for the insiders to skim the public. The sleeze of these banker type has reached a new all-time low.
Keep in mind “stock analysts” A) often work for companies that have conflict-of-interest relationships with the homebuilders, and B) the “analysts” are often 24-year olds who “analyze” the data given them by the companies themselves. These kids have no ability to see beyond the spreadsheet provided by management. They make no connection between the sea of “for sale” signs they see on the way to work and the company-provided data.
The stocks will not crater until the companies themselves concede publicly that they are toast. It will take a while. Be patient.
Can’t buy that - Toll and Horton have both come pretty close to admitting they’re toast. HB stocks on average already lost 50% from valuations that never got that high to begin with before the recent rally. The money on the short side got made earlier this year - nobody’s going to get rich trying to push these things lower - the only easy way to make money now is to have cash and to eventually need a house.
I agree–before pronouncing the HB’s and the option-ARM banks (FED, DSL, etc) dead, you need to spend some time looking at their balance sheets. The HB’s could actually do very, very well if they simply slowed down building and sold off their existing inventory (they’re trading at close to book value or at a discount now). It’s going to take a very, very long time for the option-ARM lenders to blow up, since their customers will continue making neg-AM payments for the next 3-4 yrs until their LTV caps out. Until then the lenders will be fine. The only really good short I’ve found is MTG, which is essentially the least secured part of each house out there and could blow up fast.
“Area Realtors say they are holding more weekend open houses and hustling harder than ever”
Key word: “hustling”. Yes, the remaining FB’s are being “hustled” harder than ever. Lies, deceit, maniopulation….anything goes with these bastards.
“maniopulation?”….bitchin’ word
Comment by nnvmtgbrkr
2006-09-15 08:26:35
“maniopulation?”….bitchin’ word
It is a fine word. I always liked when Boxing Promoter Don King would say “Trickaration”. Usually when his fighter lost a fight he would blame it on the “Trickaration” being used by the other fighter….LOL …. Ah lotta’ trickaration goin’ on here!
So what exactly extra are they doing? They put home on local MLS, place ad in newspaper, stick open house signs all over the place and then sit in house and wait for annoying people like me and my family to show up?
Builders have always done that around here. They put houses on the market that in finished but unsold, houses that are currently under construction but unsold, houses that are planned bunt no ground has been broken yet, and vacant lots with no specific plans for a house on them.
Around here, Open houses are not used much to sell. We have them occasionally to get the word out that the house is for sell, but very little housing is sold as a direct result of open houses.
When I say they put houses on the market, I mean they put them on the local MLS. I see them all the time mixed in with existing resale houses. (except of course, most newbuilds are larger and cost more.)
Builders on tracts don’t usually use the MLS to market homes because of the higher marketing costs .If the builders are doing that now it’s because they are trying to capture the used real estate market . Go directly to the tract because if the builder can avoid paying a MLS realtor a 6 to 8% commission than the builder will have more room to give concessions to you the buyer if you are interested in a new home .
They often show elevation drawings of houses they intend (or would like) to build on a lot. I believe this is to generate interest and have people come in, tour the model homes, and talk about having a house built that is customized for their needs. I doubt re agents bring them buyers, but people shop the online mls like purusing the garage sale section of the classifieds. This is just a way to attract future buyers.
As to me, I live in an 1873 farmhouse on 3.5 acres just outside of the city. I would not go near a tract house.
I’m just saying if the agent brings the buyer to a new home tract,(that also has a MLS listing ) the agent puts thats buyers name on a list and nails the builder for a commission . A buyer can go directly to a tract ,saving the builder extra costs .
All the homes, that already been built, have already been customized for everybody’s needs. The choices are endless. No need to build anymore homes customize for your needs.
It’s like fishing with the wrong kind of bait. You catch nothing.
Comment by nnvmtgbrkr
Key word: “hustling”. Yes, the remaining FB’s are being “hustled” harder than ever. Lies, deceit, maniopulation….anything goes with these bastards.
I guess I don’t get! One would think it would be the “FL” as in Lender? The only thing I can say is they have nothing to lose. In all of the threads it is always the same the “FB” the “FB”. Never the “FL” What the heck is going on? Some of these people should just burn the money at this point in the game!
Lets do the math:
(Inventory x 2)+ ( Sales -40%) + ( Taxes x 2) +( Insurance x 2) + ( Reset Mortgage payment x 2) / ( Potential buyers x.50 )= HUGE LOSSES
=upside down = drown
…couldn’t you just hear the coastal buyers all praying for the promised cat4 storm? Please let mother nature let me collect the insurance before my ARM comes due…..
I think you are not far off. I have some friends down in south florida, ARM and I/0 and he made a comment to me that it would be fine if a Hurricane took the house away. Unfortunately for the builders, and home owners in south florida the main part of hurricane season is coming to an end in the next few weeks and they will have to wait until June to start hoping again. (If they can make it that long.)
Damn. We bought in Cape Coral in March ‘03, planning to build and move there. Then the taxes kept going up, along with the costs of construction; then suddenly the property’s value skyrocketed. We decided it was best to sell the property and stay in Georgia, where we already know we can afford to live, and use some of the money to pay off the credit cards and just sock the rest away. Everyone in my family (living in Cape Coral) said we were nuts, and that we’d lose money.
We put it on the market in August of last year, got the buyer in September. The appraisal came back low — so the buyer jacked up the down payment (he got the down payment from a HELOC!), thinking it wasn’t a big deal because the value would keep skyrocketing. He’s building a house on that property now. No idea how he’s paying for it. (Took him months to get the mortgage to buy the property, and the terms weren’t very good.)
Anyway. Between the contract and the closing, the market just seemed to screech to a halt.
I looked on the county property appraiser’s website a few nights ago; if I read it correctly, a very similar property nearby just sold last month for half what that guy paid for ours.
Damn, we dodged a bullet.
Sorry — I’m not adding much to the discussion here. Just a long-winded way of saying “Holy —-.”
You did really well, Karen, my hat’s off to you. Well done on standing your ground and doing the right thing, despite the well intentioned opinions of family members. Cape Coral is in big time trouble right now.
Funny you should mention Cape Coral. A couple of years ago, I had a business prospect from that town.
He was a real estate agent, and, at first, he seemed quite eager to purchase my services. But he came harder and harder to get ahold of. After the hurricanes of late ‘04, he ‘fessed up and said that he wasn’t going to be able to do business with me after all.
I couldn’t help thinking that his own business wasn’t turning out to be as good as he thought. And I have no idea if he’s even in real estate now. If he was smart, he got out while the getting was good.
I know a “newbie” re/max agent from No.VA. who bought about 10 places (lots) in Cape Coral around 2003. Hope he still has them. He also bought over 20 new construction condo’s in No.VA. over the past few years.
Been in the “business” all of 4 years. He never heard of the 90’s and besides it is different this time. Tried to hard-sell me on a few deals. Gave up and stopped calling about 9 months ago.
I wish I could check by name and see how many properties he has for sale. Our county does not have that capability. Last I heard from him, he was trying to unload some D.C. condo’s on me. Claimed they were cancellations and I could slide in at pre-construction pricing. Yeh, if these babies were a “deal” why wasn’t he jumping on them. Just trying to protect his commission.
My wife and I dumped a house in Avondale, AZ back in August, 2005. A California couple paid cash for it because they were “tired of renting hotel rooms whenever they visted their daughter.” I guess their daughter lived in our rat trap subdivision. Their plan was to actually make money by visiting their daughter because….home values always go up.
The market in Phoenix started tanking a month later.
I too share your Holy _ _ _ _!
Just a long-winded way of saying “Holy —-.”
No-just a long winded way of saying, “Whew, that’s one FB!!!!!
Moron should have thrown in his cards on the low appraisal.
Good for you-bad for him.
I know someone trying to unload a lot in Cape Coral. Realtor told him recently he’s competing with almost 300 other lots in his area! Thank goodness it’s only a lot.
Much of Cape Coral is just a grid of narrow paved and unpaved streets, with weeds and other local flora as far as the eye can see. Every now and then you’ll find a run-down house or a single-wide on a lot. This goes on for several square miles.
We always thought this person was pretty astute, and could never figure out why he had bought a lot there. He showed us the area and suggested we ought to buy at least one lot ourselves. This was in 2002. In retrospect, I think he was drinking the Kool Aid.
That is what Cape Coral has been since it’s inception.
To understand the town, you need to pull up the old public plats and you will see that they go back to Florida’s early boom days.
The were literally thousands of lots platted on sold to suckers coming for Florida Real Estate boom. Many were 25 ft wide lots, like row houses for New Yorkers, or trailer shacks for crackers. In order to have a normal sized lot you needed to buy two or 3.
When I was selling RE back in the early 80’s I occasionally ran into someone that owned 3 or 4 and was looking to unload them. They are in the same situation now as then.
The lots were worth about 2k, if i recall correctly, based on the lastest sale data. Adding normal inflation, they are probably worth about the same today.
My grandparents purchased a lot like that in Ft. Myers back in the 70’s. I think they paid $500 for it and planned to eventually retire there. Both died before they could do it and the lot got passed to my mom in the 80’s. There wasnt a thing she could do with it since they never developed the area with any utilities. In 2004 some “developer” called her and offered her $5000 for lot. Supposedly they were fianally developing that area. She sold it and put the money toward her own mortgage.
She probably got taken but good. That lot was probably worth 150K.
Not anymore.
OT, the housing bubble even makes it to Pop Matters, a pop culture blog/review site (does this make us trendy?):
MARGINAL UTILITY: Sympathy for the Middleman
“The ever-widening current-accounts deficit mimics the dismal savings rate only on a national scale, charting the massive amount America must borrow from other countries to sustain its current levels of consumption.
“That may seem a cause for concern, especially as the housing bubble is showing signs of having popped — housing starts are down, the supply of unsold houses is growing, and the measures of the sentiment among builders are plummeting. One theory about how Americans have managed to save less than nothing in the past few years was that the deficit was made up for by rising home values — people saw the rapidly appreciating value of their homes as their retirement savings. Many homeowners decided to take advantage of historically low interest rates to borrow against that newfound home equity, which allowed them to keep consuming despite stagnant income levels and rising energy costs. But now the doom-saying about housing seems to be taking its toll on consumer confidence, which reached an unexpected low in August. (”Consumer Confidence Tumbles”, Wall Street Journal Online, 29 August 2006) Most telling is people’s low expectations for the future: consumer attitudes are even more sour when asked to consider what they anticipate down the road. Combine that fear of the future with stabilizing (if not falling) house prices and higher interest rates it would seem that the shopping spree would have to be coming to an end, and perhaps austerity measures like those Northwest Airlines’ management so insensitively suggested will have to become more widely adopted.”
Orlando ranked #100 (1best-100worst) as the “nastiest” (mean/rude)
city in country by Men’s Health Magazine.
When I was down in the FL PanHandle doing disaster inspection work after Ivan, even the locals told me to stay the hell away from Orlando.
Manchester NH rated #1.
There are some great posters on this blog from Orlando, and I exclude them from my statement that the Orlando area is a disaster in terms of the population. I moved there briefly (Sanford, because it looked so charming on the outside) after selling here in the Tampa area and then came screaming back here. I was completely stunned by the local attitude, the rudeness and the outright criminality in everyday affairs. I am not surprised by the rating in that magazine. Must be the influence of the Mouse, all that phony hospitality.
Hey now, no dissing the mouse!
Palmetto — it is indeed because of the mouse. Prior to 1970, Orlando was a wonderful place to live, assuming you didn’t need big-city style entertainment and amenities. There were wondeful-smelling orange trees all the way out Highway 50 well past Clermont. Do-gooders had not yet determined that the awesome smell of bread baking is fatal, so we would drive by the Merita plant just to whiff the air. Martin-Marietta (now Lockheed) was by far the biggest employer in town. Steak ‘n Shake was just like Richie Cunningham’s hangout in “Happy Days.”
The theme parks ruined that, forever. Among the new tourists, who previously had thought of Florida almost solely in terms of the beaches, were people who decided they wanted to live here and transplanted their businesses. Politicians always think that is a good thing. I don’t. At least I had the privilege of living in Orlando in what were, IMO, its very best days and at what turned out to be a great time to be young in America.
Chip, I love your posts and I hope you didn’t take offense at my comments regarding the Orlando area. I really like your analysis of what happened. For some reason, Orlando seemed to have the influx of the worst of the out of state and this whole nasty attitude took hold. You are right, it was great at one time. That’s what I remembered when I moved there briefly.
Palmetto — no, I take no offense at all at your posts. O-Town was a great place, to me, and that changed. But I suppose it’s like a husband or a wife. They generally don’t get any better looking as the years roll by; when you’re together every day, you don’t notice the change nearly as much as a stranger would.
Any major cities downfall due to growth can be attributed to the major employer of that city. Have you ever been to Detroit? One time was a beautiful city(from what I hear), but the big three caused thousands of southern blacks to move for the jobs. The whites fled the city, there weren’t enough jobs for everyone, and Detroit is left with a few nice pockets, and the rest a decaying city with drugs, prostitution, crime….
Let’s also put some blame on the bubble here too. Most of this growth is due to the construction. While there are some, most workers at Disney are not hispanic. That is changing though. Most of these hispanics came for the construction work. Afterall, Orlando seemed like the investors dream come true.
Here’s an example. The English like to vacation at the mouse. Not sure why they don’t go to Euro disney, but everytime we’ve gone to Disney there are many english/european families. 10 years ago Tom the english guy sees how cheap housing is in orlando. “Bugger” he says “for what I pay for hotels, I can buy a house, rent it out to my friends and family when they go to Disney and make money on the deal”. Tom the english guy buys a four bedroom home with a small pool for $150k. He tells all his friends and family and they start renting from him. They come a few times and say the same thing. So now they are all buying cheap houses in Orlando. Next thing you know every other house is being sold to european investors. Europeans are heavily marketed buy vacation homes all over florida, but most decide Disney is where to be. Of course now these $150k houses are $400k. And every investor from California to Kentucky joined the mania. Someone needed to build these homes.
Hey just check out VRBO.com. Vacaton rentals buy owner for the orlando area rentals. More than half have United Kingdom phone numbers and the rates in pounds as well as dollars.
Here’s my concern, what happens when the construction comes to a complete halt? I think many are still building to finish contracts. Do they leave, or does Orlando become like Detroit? Disney in Detroit is definately not an appealing vacation to me!!!! Unemployed and uneducated is a breeding ground for crime. More crime means less visitors to the Mouse……. Remember the attacks on people in rental cars and out of state tags years ago. People were afraid to come to Florida.
Don’t just blame the mouse, blame the developers, the builders, the city and county officials who allowed this uncontrollable, unsustainable growth.
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. The biggest problem with this bubble bust is that most of these investors bought small starter homes. We have tens of thousands little homes built like crap all over Florida. These will either become low income or be bull dozed! Lovely neighborhoods in traditionally low crime/safe areas will now have drug and crime problems as these homes are inhabited by unemployed and uneducated workers. Stay Tuned!
PS The rude people have come to Tamap as well over the last five years. What a change! I’ve never seen so many angry drivers in my life! Rude, angry people everywhere! We used to be such a friendly town! It’s only going to get worse as that sucking sound finishes with a loud POP!
Over the last 7 years I’ve rented and worked all over Orlando and while I’m not as well traveled as many other posters on this board, I definately vouch that this has to be one of the rudest places in the country. The sad thing is everytime I’ve rented I thought I liked the area until it was time to renew the lease, then I couldn’t wait to get away from there. I don’t know the reasons, but it just gets worse every year. I think there could be a couple more charts we are looking to move up the ranks in. Traffic, murders, condo conversions… what else am I missing?
Used to live in Kissimmee area. Almost bought the house we were renting but decided to head back north. Anyone have any on the ground reports about the Kissimmee/St. Cloud area?
Although the area gets a bad rep, I still miss it from time to time. The wife and I, fresh out of college, took a one way Uhaul there, with barely a hundred bucks between us after paying the first month’s rent. Trial by fire and all that good stuff…
Kissimmee — it pretty much is just more of what it was. The Spanish-speaking community has grown so large that they are trying to gerrymander their own voting districts. I say Spanish-speaking because there seems to be some sort of major attitude rift between Puerto Ricans and everyone else who speaks Spanish, those being referred to, I believe, as Hispanics.
Why shouldn’t they. I worked for the Blacks. My Congressional district in Tampa runs down a narrow strip on the East side of Hillsborough County, and then actually crosses Tampa Bay to pick up the lower part of Pinellas County, which is predominately black.
No need to try the re-districting in your case, though, they will be the majority population in just a few more years.
Hey, almost everyone else has already done so, so don’t knock the spanish-speakers
Just recieved an email from Morrison Homes in Tampa, FL (almost got stationed there in 2003 and decided to stay on the mailing list to watch it all crumble). They have a development Arista that has 7 spec homes ready now. They are offering a 7%sales commission to realtors and $30,000 of the price of each house. The ad reads “Lucky you! Our Lucky seven sale at Arista has been extended through this weekend! Seven inventory homes with HUGE discounts!” They are also advertising the “move in for $1″ program. The houses range from $388K to $596K after the HUGE discount. When we started looking in 2003 the homes were $200K-275K.
I think there are buyers out there, but the prices continue to remain high, out of reach of middle-class Americans wanting to retire or move over in Florida. When developers are not building affordable housing, that adds to the problem. In Daytona Beach, for example, which is one hour away from Orlando, all we see being built now are condos on the ocean or river fronts. A typical 2-BR, 2-Bathroom unit fetches on the average at least close to $400,000 or more. Who are these developers trying to attract in an area where the economy is dependent on tourism with low wages? I predict, within a year, the situation will be worse than it is today. There will be a number of foreclosures, and perhaps even bankruptcies. Worse, there are fears the bubble may be as worse as that infamous bust in 1926.
Yep. We need the bust to bring down house and land prices. Part of the problem with the bubble is that land values skyrocketed, so builders felt the only way to make money was to either build “luxury” condos or McMansions. I’m single with no kids. I just want a 3/2 with a decent sized lot, say around 10k sq. ft. (I realize in OC that what we consider a decent sized lot is much smaller than in other parts of the country). But it seems that nobody builds these anymore. If you want small, you have to get a condo or townhome. If you want a house, they only build big houses on small lots.
They are trying to attract whoever will pay the highest dollar for the product. The macro-economics is not their concern.
The FED let the credit bubble build. Can’t really blame the builders.
Ahh Flagstaff………..I’m a case in point about high priced places losing teachers. I left my teaching position in Flagstaff and then left Flagstaff. Flag schools are suffering a loss of enrollment because nearly no one with school age children can afford the way over priced crap.(poverty with a view). My father raised 9 kids in Flagstaff and owned a home and my mother didn’t work. My parents today couldn’t afford their own home they have lived in for 45 years. My old neighborhood is eerily vacant of children….now all you see is subarus with ski racks………..don’t see snow anymore either. These silly fools pay over 1500 dollars for ski passes…..yikes!
FL got into thinking that we are some kind of NY, NY or somekind of up-scale place… Goverment is dreaming, peolple are dreaming… there is some good stuff here, stuff to like thats for sure, but no up-scale anything… city Goverments got all loaded with cash from the insane property tax increases, and they are just wasting like there’s no tomorrow. Insurers are a bunch of liars.. most properly-built houses only lose a few shingles/roof tiles, that a couple of thousands, I think most people dont even claim… im not saying there’s people that have bigger issues, Im saying its not so massive at all… sure there was Andrews.. but those houses were crap built with spit and greed. Fresh FL buyers are in for a triple whammy… 3x the insurance 3x property taxes and 3x housing cost… old buyers say from 1999-2000 only are in for 3x insurance if they have a morgage, taxes dont change much for them provided it is their primary residence. That triple whammy by my calculations makes owning a house at about 3k a month (based on a 320khouse).. add utilities, car, car insurance, food, house maintenance… its just crazy… and apartments arent much cheaper… a 2br goes for about 190k… a 1br for 160k.. but then maintenance usually goes for 200 a month (thats a low number really) not even special location or anything… KRAZY.