“Sellers Can’t Be Choosy” In Florida
The Herald Tribune reports from Florida. “In the fourth quarter, there was about $2 billion worth, or more than 3,600, unsold condos in the Sarasota Multiple Listing Service alone. In October, only 83 were sold, most of them for less than $350,000.”
“That monthly absorption rate amounts to 2.28 percent of available condo inventory or, to put it another way (assuming no more would-be condo sellers materialize and no new condo projects are built), it will take about 31/2 years to empty the condo inventory cupboard.”
“The local glut notwithstanding, Mark Miller, president of Sarasota’s Westwater Construction Inc., backed by a $47 million line of credit from Wachovia Bank plus his own money, has unveiled a 189-unit gated golf condo community.”
“The company is making a big bet because it offers ‘resort-style residences and amenities, a brand new challenging 18-hole golf course and all at prices that are affordable for this market,’ said Jimmy Stewart, Westwater’s director of business development. The condos range from 1,770 to 2,240 square feet, with prices starting in the $400,000s.”
The Orlando Sentinel. “For the past couple of years, the region’s economy has hummed along at a solid growth rate of 3 percent to 4 percent. But that’s no longer sustainable in the face of a slowing housing market and rising costs facing consumers.”
“‘You’ve got to keep one eye on the housing market to see how that’s going to shake out,’ said Sean Snaith, an economist at the University of Central Florida.”
“The housing sector’s biggest challenge now is working through the massive inventory of homes on the market. In November, there were 21,122 homes awaiting buyers, according to the Orlando Regional Realtor Association. In comparison, one year earlier there were 9,685 homes on the market and in 2004 there were only 3,681.”
The Palm Beach Post. “Months after Ocean Land Investments started chatting up Ocean Resorts residents about a deal to purchase their 400-lot park, the Boca Raton-based company has backed off. Ocean Resorts stretches from the Atlantic to the Intracoastal, offering idyllic views for the condos the developer has in mind.”
“Logan Pierson, acquisitions VP, conceded that Ocean Resorts’ less-urban setting, combined with slowdown in the condo market, have tempered the firm’s enthusiasm. Meanwhile, the buzz that the developer’s interest initially sparked at Ocean Resorts has quieted.”
“‘The last word we heard from them was that they needed to do more due diligence and that the market was down,’ said Glenn Ludwig, president of the co-op that controls the community.”
The Sun Sentinel. “Buyers have been wielding more power since South Florida’s five-year housing boom last year yielded to a significant slowdown. Those getting the best deals are hiring experienced agents, pushing for incentives, wearing poker faces, finding motivated sellers and, when all else fails, walking away.”
“Buyers are in control as investors have pulled out of South Florida real estate, creating less of a demand for properties. With fewer buyers, homes stay on the market longer. The supply of homes for sale has swelled in Broward and Palm Beach counties, creating havoc for people who need to sell quickly.”
“Jenn Vest made what she thought was a fair offer on a house in Broward County, but the seller rejected it and wasn’t much in the mood to haggle. The same thing happened on another property.”
“Vest later found a two-bedroom house in an eclectic neighborhood near downtown Fort Lauderdale. Originally listed at about $550,000, it was reduced to $349,000. She closed on the deal Dec. 29 for $316,000.”
“MLS listings also include histories of the properties, and they can show buyers just how motivated or desperate sellers are. Real estate agent Pamela Orr noticed that the home Vest bought had been on the market for more than a year. The length of time was the first clue that the seller might be getting antsy.”
“After probing further, Orr found that prices in the neighborhood were falling, in part because developers were buying homes on the cheap and tearing them down to build luxury townhouses. Armed with that background information, Vest offered the seller $316,000, about 10 percent less than the latest list price.”
“‘We told the seller, `This is our best offer,’ Orr said.”
“In today’s climate, buyers who intend to live in the homes typically can pay 10 percent to 15 percent below market value, said David Dweck, an agent in Palm Beach and Broward counties. Investors paying cash, closing quickly and taking the property ‘as is’ might be able to swing deals with desperate sellers for 65 percent to 70 percent below market value. ‘That’s reality,’ he said.”
“Some agents say buyers shouldn’t worry about making lower offers, reasoning that sellers can’t afford to be insulted in a market glutted with properties.”
“(Realtor) Douglas Rill in West Palm Beach just had a client list a Lantana condominium for $400,000. A prospective buyer first offered $330,000 and then $365,000, but the seller refused. After later agreeing to accept the deal, Rill’s client lost out when the buyer had bought another unit in the same complex for less money. ‘Sellers can’t be choosy,’ Rill said.”
‘After years of record-setting home sales and housing construction, the real estate market has cooled off - and no one knows that better than Mark Perez.’
‘The president of Buck’s Wholesale Plumbing Supply in Tampa used to count on making 15 to 20 deliveries a day - shiny faucets, toilets, sinks, showerheads and the like - to homes being built in the Tampa Bay area. Today, his company delivers to just two or three houses a day.’
‘The forecast for 2007 is a strange juxtaposition. Employers here are desperate to attract workers. Good news for Joe Job Seeker, right? Yes, except those same companies can’t afford to raise wages.’
‘You can expect some of those job hoppers to jump right out of state. Increases in property insurance premiums, real estate taxes and housing prices are making Florida a lot less affordable than we’re used to.’
‘You used to move from New York to Florida because housing was half the cost,’ said Hardin of SCI Cos. ‘But if that’s no longer the case, what’s the point? People would rather stay in Georgia and pay 6 percent income tax.’
Yet another good reason not to buy — flexibility after job loss.
Also easier to vote with your feet if you rent. The elections in Florida are far from over. I predict more of an exodus for this state over 2007. There were rumblings on the local Friday night PBS political forum about a Florida state INCOME TAX! Wow, you know it is getting bad when the powers that be start considering a state income tax!
Pametto
Also easier to vote with your feet if you rent. The elections in Florida are far from over.
I like that!
And unlike Al Gore, landlords can’t get a recount.
There’s a lot more hanging in FL than chad.
except Al Gore didnt get a recount…the supreme court stopped it.
Actually he got several re-counts, including one authorized by the Democratic Florida Supreme Court in violation of the Florida state constitution, and Florida law, which puts a time-limit on recounts. The problem was that Gore only wanted specific (Democratic) counties recounted, not the entire state, which would have violated the equal protection clause of the U.S. Constitution. Hence, the ruling you oppose.
The whole recount thing was nonsense. People going into the polls knew that if they don’t properly punch out their choices, their ballots would be invalidated. There were signs posted everywhere telling them this.
Also keep in mind that every Florida newspaper, in collaboration, recounted all the votes, and Gore lost. Period. They didn’t even bother with the absentee votes from Europe and Middle Asia, because they were heavily in favor of Bush.
I’ll grant you, Bush is an idiot and the worst president in history, but he won fair and square (at least as defined by politicians). If the Democrats were serious about winning, they’d pick someone worth voting for.
“I’ll grant you, Bush is an idiot and the worst president in history, but he won fair and square (at least as defined by politicians). If the Democrats were serious about winning, they’d pick someone worth voting for. ”
Here, here… Same thing will happen if Hillary is the candidate in 08
“Investors paying cash, closing quickly and taking the property ‘as is’ might be able to swing deals with desperate sellers for 65 percent to 70 percent below market value. ‘That’s reality,’ he said.”
65 to 70 percent below market value? Am I reading that correctly? Of course, I suppose “market value” is a relative term.
One of the most abused words in the marketing of this bubble has been “luxury.” I have a semi-retired relative who bought a condo in a “luxury golf course community” in Sarasota before the bubble really took off. It is average in every sense of the word, and there are thousands of units just like it.
I understand that the word “average” doesn’t move product, but if everyone thinks they are living in a luxury condo, then no one is.
“Lugzhurry”. BWAHAHAHAHA! A term used to rope in the “rubes”, as it were. Just finished reading an article on media manipulation of the masses, a la Bernays. This use of the word “luxury” was exposed in a book called “Class”. You’ll find that many of these “lugzhurry” condos in Florida have enough mold in them to gag a maggot.
That’s gotta be Paul Fussell’s book, from about 1980. I mentioned it here a while back… 25+ years old and still the authoritative book on class in the U.S.
passthebubbly, THANKS! Yours was the post I was trying to recall. Fabulous book. I lent it to someone and never got it back. You are right, it is THE definitive work on class in the US. What is so great about it is that all you need is a little intelligence to understand the book. It is a great read, not some pompous,extensively footnoted tome by a boring sociologist. It is both informative and enjoyable.
I’ve been secretly deducting 17 i.q. points from evely prole wearing a baseball cap, backwards on their head, for years now…
Thank you, Paul Fussell
A great read~
I’ve been secretly deducting 17 i.q. points from every prole wearing a baseball cap, backwards on their head, for years now…
Thank you, Paul Fussell
A great read~
(edited version)
My favorite is the way you can tell someone’s class right off the bat the instant you meet him. “How do you do” (upper) versus “nice to meet you” (middle).
passthebubbly, how about this one: “Have a nice day”.
passthebubbly, there are so many gems in that book, like how the builders name developments and roads with pseudo-British titles like “Coventry Gardens”, “Waverly Place”, etc., all to give the high proles the illusion of upper class, as associated with all things English. How to sell a housing development: townHOMES vs. townhouses.
Do they have anything in the book about calling postage stamp sized lots with big houses on them “estates”? Ha!
A friend from the UK always chides me how everything in America is “WORLD FAMOUS”…
Isn’t “How do you do?” a phrase taught in My Fair Lady?
snake charmer,
My favorite abuse of the language has been “upscale”. Last spring I called some builder out of Craigslist for some abortion he was contemplating on the Oregon coast just for a goof. It was hysterical, the guy had the vocabulary of drunk 8th. grader and he just kept saying that “everything” would be “upscale”! When I finally asked him to quantify “upscale” his response was VERY upscale!
Can only second that…luxury here in US is the term for ‘decent’.
No, it’s the term for “excuse to overcharge you”.
How can McCabe suddenly do a flip-flop and say, “This is your time,” when all along he’s been saying the desperate sellers will get more desperate before it’s all over? I think McCabe got quoted out of context here, so don’t think he’s turned bull all of a sudden.
I’ve been guessing all along that McCabe and his group will get into the market way too early.
My suspicion is that he has no group, and if he does that group is very non-committal. They could invest in Florida condos or porkbellies–whatever yields the greater return.
“(Realtor) Douglas Rill in West Palm Beach just had a client list a Lantana condominium for $400,000. A prospective buyer first offered $330,000 and then $365,000, but the seller refused. After later agreeing to accept the deal, Rill’s client lost out when the buyer had bought another unit in the same complex for less money. ‘Sellers can’t be choosy,’ Rill said.”
This seller is clearly an uninformed greedy pig. He will be turned into bacon and ham in the months to come. I would love to see a follow up on this moron in a couple months.
What is the point of even listing your house if you’re not willing to come down 10%.
“…it will take about 3 1/2 years to empty the condo inventory cupboard.”
That is only IF no more condos go into construction and IF no more currently-owned condos go on the market. Fat chance of that.
Someone explained this continual building phenomenon in yesterday’s California thread. It boggles the mind. Not too far of a stretch to imagine that, in a few years down the road, should the “depression” scenarios play out, all these condos could become warehouses for down and outers.
Yup, either rent to them for pennies on the dollar or they’ll squat for nothing. Lotsa dark towers in FL.
And here in Orlando, almost six times the inventory of not quite three years ago. And the Spring sellers haven’t come out yet, nor the IRS tax cheaters who are waiting to claim their vacant spec house as a principal residence.
I read reports in financial analyses lately that predict a 3-5% reduction in selling prices and chuckle at that. Too bad the average home seller doesn’t understand the basics of supply and demand that benefitted them during the Christmas retail season.
“3-5% reduction in selling prices”
BWAHAHAHAHA! Well, I guess we are not up to the point of the real race to the exits. It will be interesting to see exactly WHEN that happens. I’m thinking midway through the spring. Any thoughts?
I think we have another year before it gets crazy. Some of these people have only had their homes up for sale for a year and probably think it’s a fluke that it hasn’t sold already. Let them go through two Spring “selling” seasons without a sale and they’ll finally get it.
Chip,
Thanks for starting my Monday out right! The absence of cap gains gets only “grudging” recognition here as a bubble factor. My wife and I went out to the Oregon coast on Sunday to see the storms. Development there has been a real circus (with a cast of thousands) and absolutely ZERO consistency in vision or implementation. A real Wild West “cowboy” effort. BUT b/c of it’s relative proximity to Portland there “IS” plausability to commuting from there hence the pricing stucture that assures full exploitation of the cap gains exemption. What’s really repulsive is all the “coat tailing” b/c if some nerd from Portland can charge 1.2 mil for a 2,000 sq. ft. cedar shake sided sh@tbox then certainly a local can charge 299k for 1,200 sq. ft. shack? They’ve got a real mess out there.
People commute from the coast to Portland? Every day? For real!?
I thought Portland’s big selling point was its compactness, strict zoning, urban growth boundaries and all that stuff that makes it easy to have a very short commute. Having an hour-plus “commute” out to Seaside kinda goes against all this, doesn’t it?
passthebubbly,
Well….. agreed. It would be an insane commute (but we know people who do it!) This kind of goes hand in hand with “the rolling bubble”. Much of the development out there in Seaside, Cannon Beach, Lincoln City and even Bandon have been facilitated by (what else)….. MEW! In fact it’s hard *not* to know several people that have/are/planning to build on the coast.
Now, claiming you’re commuting from Bandon would be a stretch to say the least but just about everything else would meet the IRS “acid test”. Besides, does ANYONE know of anybody that’s gotten busted for claiming their specuvestor/vacation/2nd home as a “primary” residence? Seriously, anybody? Pffft, it’s the ‘honor” system for crissakes. There is NO enforcement and you’d have to be trying to get busted!
I’ve rented from a couple of people’s “primary residence”. The IRS and local governments have bigger fish to fry. It’s the equivalent of jaywalking on the real-estate fraud spectrum.
I think the people across the street from me got busted for that. I noticed that the Pima County Assessor changed the residency type from 100% owner-occupied to half-rental. This reflected the fact that the owner’s daughter lives there and rents out roooms.
passthebubbly,
LOL! Yeah, maybe. When it comes to all of the BS that goes on in this arena maybe it isn’t that big a deal. But it is. Think of it in these terms, withdrawing 100, 250, 500k out of your IRA at age 42? OR, making “excess contributions” ALL w/ ZERO penalty! Such a deal!
I’ve had friends where the LL asked would it be “alright” if they kept the power bill in their name? Uh, NO! That would *not* be alright. There is SO much incentive to lie and very little if any in terms of consequences. I guess they figure even if they DO get popped they’ll just pony up and pay the tax? Yeah, like anyone is laying awake nights worrying about that.
Chip- the real number is 41,000 listings, the usual bs from the board. I posted on the site too.(Sentinel) Blew the writer away with data. Got a response of “interesting observations, thanks for sharing.” What a load.
Please everyone go to the site and post a comment to these clowns.
Dimedropped — wow — 41,000 versus 21,000? That’s a huge difference. Same market area? Geez — that would be an increase of more than tenfold.
The local board reports sales marketwide and listings by 2 counties, Orange and Seminole. Clearly they manipulate the data to suit their minions.
STOP THE PRESS: WE TURN AWAY FROM YOUR REGULARLY SCHEDULED PROGRAM TO BRING YOU THIS IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENTl
EGGO WAFFLES HAS JUST COME OUT WITH A NEW FLAVOR. IT IS CALLED “FLIP-FLOP’. LOOK FOR IT IN YOUR GROCER’S FREEZER. Now back to your regularly scheduled news about flip flops in Florida.
Here is an article which certainly belongs in Ripley’s Believe it or Not… From front center of the recently-reformatted p. A1 of today’s WSJ (I could not resist sneaking in a couple of comments in parens
):
———————————————————————————————
Buyer’s Remorse
Speculators Helped Fuel Florida’s Housing Boom
Slump in Chic Naples Shows Market Perils; Ms. Dresner’s Auction
By Michael Corkery and James R. Hagerty
——————————————————–
Naples, Fla. — In 2005, this once-sleepy retirement haven on Florida’s west coast was arguably the hottest housing market in the country.
Builders held lotteries to determine who could purchase homes in new gated communities. In the older neighborhoods, buyers were snapping up modest ranch houses and cottages soon after they were listed for sale. The median home price more than doubled between 2000 and 2005, to about $482,400.
The frenzied run-up prompted economists at banking concern National City Corp. and the economic consulting firm Global Insight Inc. to label Naples “the most overvalued” housing market in the U.S. in the second quarter of 2005, a dubious honor it retains. Today, prices are dropping, the number of unsold homes on the market has swelled to more than twice the national average and investors are scrambling to unload their properties.
Such a crescendo of activity might have prompted some to pull back. But plenty of investors, who purchased homes to rent or flip, continued to buy and sell through the height of the boom. One of them was Marjorie Dresner. The Canadian native believed that Naples, with its laid-back, balmy atmosphere, would long be an attractive market. A prolific invester, she purchased dozens of houses in recent years, many of them with a partner (What a dumb bunny! http://www.pilkey.com/bookview.php?id=22 ). One of them cost her $1.7 million.
The early run-up in real-estate prices in Naples was based on strong economic fundamentals. Low interest rates, the creation of new mortgage products and a strong economy (Strong fundamentals? Sounds like a bubble economy fueled by a spiked punch bowl and loose lending.) triggered a wave of home buying by making ownership affordable for the masses. And Naples was especially desirable, with its chic restaurants, impeccably landscaped streets, stretches of pristine beaches and influx of baby boomers.
But it’s increasingly evident that investors and speculators here and elsewhere played a greater role than previously thought (though long heralded on this blog) in pumping up the real-estate bubble — especially near the end of the run.
In late October, Ms. Dresner tried auctioning off 28 of her properties, but some bids were as much as 40% lower than what she paid (It is kinda hard to find the exit door when the theater is on fire and full of smoke!). One three-bedroom ranch house she purchased in July 2005 in the middle-class Lake Park neighborhood fetched a high bid of $400,000; Ms. Dresner and a partner paid $690,000 for the house, according to county records. Ms. Dresner won’t talk much about her investment experience, but prefers to focus on the positive. “I did very well in the beginning,” she says. “I look at the overall picture. You don’t just look at one year.”
(Undsoweiter…)
Housing bust on Page A1, gotta love that.
As I recall from reading about it at the time, Ms. Dresner cash-out re-fi’d most or almost all of the properties she put up for auction, immediately before the auction. That totally screwed the auctioneer, who couldn’t possibly sell the properties for the mortgage amount. Didn’t know she is Canadian — wonder how that plays out in the debt-collection arena.
40% off seems like the magic number doesn’t it?
At least with the really insane markets like Naples (maybe most of Florida).
Maybe in San Diego, too, once the reality sinks in of what it means to have 50%+ of recent (Dec 06) sales involving vacant homes. By contrast, back in June 2004, when the bubble was really heating up, only 23% of SD homes were sold vacant.
“I look at the overall picture. You don’t just look at one year.”
wow, that’s pretty impressive when they can fluff off a $300K haircut (which probably adds up to millions for all 28 properties).
Because she’s Canadian, she has the possiblity of cutting and running. There is no financial connection between Canada and the US. However this doesn’t stop lawyers from coming after her (if they get criminal charges on her she’ll be extradited in a heart beat). And it also doesn’t stop her from being hauled off to jail at the boarder or even at a connection flight (perhaps she’s even on the “Road to Guatanamo” for financially terrorizing US bank auditors)
Here’s the original article (or at least one of them) about the Dresner / Naples auction fiasco:
http://tinyurl.com/ykjrvz
On the ground here in Central Florida:
1) A young man who used to work for me here at the State Government left to work as an assistant manager at a local truss plant in 2004. Work was booming and his bonuses were huge in 2004 and 2005. No bonus this Xmas however….he was laid off last Friday 1/5/07 and is looking for work. Called me this A.M. to see if he could get his old job back….
2) Licensed General Contractor buddy of mine who does flipper / true owner renovations came over last weekend and said jobs were “falling off a cliff” and his prospects past March were very, very dim….said he has no new work in the pipeline and had several renovations cancelled in the last two months.
3) Bandit signs are now at EVERY INTERSECTION here in Polk County. I mean EVERYWHERE. Everything is for Sale or Rent take your pick. In 25 years I have seen NOTHING like this here in Polk County.
You can smell the desperation in the air…
“You can smell the desperation in the air… ”
That is SO true. I was trying to come up with a term to describe an emotional vibe that seems to permeate the atmosphere around here and that is perfect. People are carrying on somehow, but there seems to be an underlying current of defeat.
Reminds of Houston 1986.
of coarse smug gov workers will get raises
You need to get help.
A Tale of Two Titles
Mr. Iacono’s sharp eye caught this one. Reminds me of the controversial difference in the covers of a national news magazine a few months ago, between the U.S. and overseas versions.
WELL in nyc this mornig there is a mystery gas smell in the air.
it is on the news nobody knows what it is, it stinks in my office
any other nyer’s smell gas or know about what it is?
MG, I was just reading about that on a breaking news page. Supposedly it is pretty widespread and is even across the river in Jersey. ConEd has no comment at this time. Don’t light any matches.
Wall Street must’ve cut one. (Juvenile, I know, but I just couldn’t resist)
They were talking about that on cnbc. I dunno, maybe it’s just Liz Claman’s hairspray.
No, more likely Trumps’ hairspray..
It’s the smell of a build up of real estate fart gas as housing bubble bursts in NY.
I hope the Realtwhore’s fart doesn’t catch fire…
maybe a developer trying to blow up a failed condo project
We smell it here. My wife’s building got evacuated. I heard Bleecker Street is real bad as well.
NYC, I’ve been trying to get information on the net, to see if there are any updates as to the sources of this. So far, nothing. Really weird there’s no hard information.
maybe the rivers rolled over? I know lakes do that from time to time bringing the water at the bottom to the top accompanied by a god awful smell.
Never heard of that. Interesting. God help NY if the Hudson and East Rivers roll over.
Or making more Flip Flop Eggo waffles.
“That monthly absorption rate amounts to 2.28 percent of available condo inventory or, to put it another way (assuming no more would-be condo sellers materialize and no new condo projects are built), it will take about 31/2 years to empty the condo inventory cupboard.”
=> Do I get to live in one of them for free until it sells?
Marc, go to yesterday’s California thread. A nice discussion on the finer points of squatting.
Looks like you can add another subprime lender to the list
http://www.securedfunding.com
“Dear Valued Customers,
Based upon market conditions and limited product availability, we are ceasing wholesale operations. We have stopped accepting new applications, and will have until the 12th of January to fund out the pipeline. We appreciate your patience as we undergo this transition.
Thank you for your support”
How long until this house of cards blows up? Eery week another lender gets cut off or shuts down.
“Months after Ocean Land Investments started chatting up Ocean Resorts residents about a deal to purchase their 400-lot park, the Boca Raton-based company has backed off. Ocean Resorts stretches from the Atlantic to the Intracoastal, offering idyllic views for the condos the developer has in mind.”
I saw this as a story on a news-serial here in Tampa just last week. I was visiting my family and everyone was amazed at the prices they were getting. The sellers were counting the money they would have for a new life as retirees, while lamenting they could not find another place, or even afford on the new condos scheduled to START at $3 million.
I think it was a 60 minutes story. It may actually have been a national, rather than local script.
The sad part is that the “NEWS” gave the impression of ever-rising Florida Property prices. This story is a retraction. It should get the same coverage as the original so not to leave a FALSE IMPRESSION.
Yep, saw that story as reported here in the Tampa area. Oddly, because of the location of the park, I have a feeling that some developer will still try to buy it, but for less. You are right, the story DID give a false impression for sure.
“Buyers are in control as investors have pulled out of South Florida real estate, creating less of a demand for properties.”
“Investors have pulled out”…. i don’t think so, they are in a swamp pit being chipped at by hungry alligators. Who do you think the majority of sellers are? the long term residents (pre- 2002) may have enough equity to sale at a 30% or more discount, its the GF oops i mean INVESTORS who bought in the last 2 years are the ones that are stuck.
This is marked difference in the MSM reporting since October of 06′, like some of the fellows predicted Florida may be grnd. zero, where does it go from here?
“where does it go from here?”
Waves of foreclosures….each year for the next 3 years or so.
First the weak hands fold. Then the later ARM resets. Then the people able to make payments say “why bother” and punt as well.
Only long time residents (pre-2001 or so) may stick it out and a few others who put a lot down. Most anyone with 70% LTV or higher will bail over the next 4 years.
Of course, it depends on what actually happens to the people that walk away and the stories that begin to circulate. If the IRS/banks are aggressive pursuing people, this will play out over a longer period of time as the people who can make payments will hang on even if underwater. If the IRS/banks don’t aggressively pursue people, almost everyone underwater will walk which will drive prices even lower.
How about late-lifers that see their retirement funds (read “equity”) evaporating? I can see lots more bailing, too.
Seems like this is the place to put this one. 30% is the norm here in Palm Beach County for price cuts on properties selling. Those that are over priced just sit and sit and sit. I just hope our recent purchase was low enough. $290K (list and appraisal anyway) home sat ont he market for 12 months. We bought at $221K last month which is closer to a 25% off discount. We’re not crazy with 100% financing either. We put $45,000 of our hard earned money down to purchase. Payment is $1585 including taxes and insurance. That compares with rents on homes like ours in the $1500 - $1750 range. Who’s got some opinions on how we’ll fare?
It really doesn’t matter if the price waffles back and forth in your situation so long as you don’t plan to move anytime soon and have to sell. What does get lost in this is sometimes there are people who simply want to buy something to live in like in the olden days. On paper, you seem to be in pretty well relatively speaking.
It really doesn’t matter if the price waffles back and forth in your situation so long as you don’t plan to move anytime soon and have to sell. What does get lost in this is sometimes there are people who simply want to buy something to live in like in the olden days. On paper, you seem to be in pretty well relatively speaking. Bet the seller was thrilled to see you come along!
That seller was thrilled. Their settlement check was a whopping $4,098 after holding the house from ‘03 to ‘06. They weren’t speculators until they decided to close on a house in St. Lucie County before selling their home.
If you plan to stay for a while, can make the payments and have some back-up, you’ll do fine. I think you might have done better in a year or two or three, but for you it’s just paper ups and downs. You’ll only get hosed if you are forced to sell.
You may be $10K-$40K underwater for a while (3-5 years - 2008-2013) at worst, I’d think. May not be that bad - you may not go negative to your loan balance at all. Depends on what happens to your neighborhood and how much overbuidling continues and what the builders build.
I predict that 3000 sf McMansions will be for sale at $275,000 in 18 months in Orlando. Guess who the seller will be? FNMA! Under the auspices of the Resolution Trust Corporation incarnate. Financing will be through HUD and they will pay your closing costs and give you money to move in. (Oh by the way, they are doing it now.)
The Sun Sentinel. “Buyers have been wielding more power since South Florida’s five-year housing boom last year yielded to a significant slowdown. Those getting the best deals are hiring experienced agents, pushing for incentives, wearing poker faces, finding motivated sellers and, when all else fails, walking away.”
First, a hat tip to the Sun Sentinel for attempting to pimp “experienced realtors” as the answer for getting a bargain in the current slowdown. I suppose they are hoping to preserve some advertising dollars while reporting as much of the truth as they dare.
Secondly, I hardly need to hire some fluffer to help me get excited about sticking a lowball offer to some underwater “investor”. The same fluffer who undoubtedly was out pushing unsuspecting house hunters into unaffordable housing with the mantra “real estate only goes up and we will refi you later so don’t worry about payments” just months ago. Screw the idea of hiring some realtor to skim money off the transaction.
We are a LONG way from bottom and I would like this pricing freeze to last a bit longer so that the eventual long pricing fall snaps the neck instead of having the noose tighten gradually while slowly suffocating these investors. I think it’ll be a bit more humane that way.
“Months after Ocean Land Investments started chatting up Ocean Resorts residents about a deal to purchase their 400-lot park, the Boca Raton-based company has backed off. Ocean Resorts stretches from the Atlantic to the Intracoastal, offering idyllic views for the condos the developer has in mind.”
This was actually on Nightline Wednesday night at 11:00 Eastern on ABC. I knew it was BS as they were reporting it. They interviewed a few of the people because the trailer owners had to vote to approve the sale. One older couple actually split their vote; the guy voted to sell and take the money and the wife voted against the sale.
I believe they had until Sunday evening, December 7th to vote. It’s interesting they buyers backed out. Because of this fact I assume the owners voted to sell. If they had voted not to sell, no mention would have ever been made of the “changed market”. IMHO
“(Realtor) Douglas Rill in West Palm Beach just had a client list a Lantana condominium for $400,000. A prospective buyer first offered $330,000 and then $365,000, but the seller refused. After later agreeing to accept the deal, Rill’s client lost out when the buyer had bought another unit in the same complex for less money. ‘Sellers can’t be choosy,’ Rill said.”
HHHHAAAAA The kicker is that the buyer created a lower comp within the complex…. At least he can refi so long as they don’t need a value higher then $300,000.