The Heyday Of The Real Estate Boom Is Over
The Bend Bulletin reports from Oregon. “Home sales in Bend are down, but…more renters are in the market, and there are more houses to choose from, said Regan Scott, principal broker of Deschutes Property Management in Bend. That means falling rents for single-family homes and move-in incentives in some cases, Scott said. ‘This is unique in our market because this hasn’t happened in the past,’ Scott said. ‘We’re dealing with a new clientele, that (leasing) was not their goal. We have a new clientele that is doing this out of necessity to react to the market.’”
“Developers also are hiring Scott to find renters, for new homes that aren’t selling, he said. Scott said the influx of rental homes is primarily due to a soft housing market that is forcing investors who purchased homes for a quick profit to rent them in order not to lose them. Scott said many of the homeowners who hired his company never intended to rent their properties.”
“Stephanie Kramer, owner of Austin Property Management in Bend, has roughly 350 housing units, mostly single-family homes, under management, including a number of single-family homes that were added within the last six months, she said. Kramer expects to have 450 units under management by summer, partly fueled by homes that aren’t selling.”
“She also sees many new arrivals to the area who are choosing to rent instead of buy, betting housing prices will fall. There are also more potential home buyers who can’t line up loans, she said.”
“Valerie Hunter, a broker who specializes in foreclosures, said owners who lease a home usually have some equity in it. Otherwise, they are forced to sell, but in the current market, it takes a ‘fire sale’ to unload a property, Hunter said.”
“As a result, owners with properties in jeopardy usually list their homes for sale and for rent simultaneously, ‘just trying to get anybody to come to the table,’ Hunter said.”
“The Bend market had 1,262 single-family homes for sale in February, according to this month’s report from the Bratton Appraisal Group in Bend. The report listed 45 single-family home sales in February, the lowest since January 2005.”
“Traci Platiro, operations manager for Windermere Property Management in Bend, said her company can offer — with the homeowner’s approval — half-off discounts on the first month’s rent or, in some cases, a first month’s rent of $99.”
“‘People are taking a lot harder look in today’s market, in order to not have a vacancy, to see what they can do — so reasonable rates and move-in incentives always help,’ Platiro said.”
The Willamette Week from Oregon. “There are seemingly three kinds of Portland renters: those who’ve had a recent rent increase, those who soon will, and those competing for the dwindling supply of decent rentals at a decent price.”
“And industry insiders are predicting even larger rent increases ahead. So why these big changes? The mortgage crisis has made it harder to qualify for a loan. That means those who may have become owners a year ago are now forced to rent.”
“Norris & Stevens managing director Brian Bjornson says rents were kept ‘artificially’ low for the last few years because it was easy to buy and many renters opted to own instead of rent.”
“‘Now, many of those same buyers would like to rent out their condos,’ Bjornson says. ‘These condos in the Pearl and the South Waterfront aren’t selling, and the owners have $2,000 mortgages. They want to get as much of that mortgage covered as possible, so they try to keep rents high.’”
“According to Norris & Stevens—one of Oregon’s largest locally owned real estate and property management companies—newer two-bedroom, two-bath apartments in the metro area rented for an average of $865 at the end of 2007.”
The Yakima Herald Republic from Washington. “Hundreds of new lots have been created, and as many as 650 more are at one stage or another in the application process as developers move to meet what they say remains a strong demand in a popular area for residential housing.”
“The rapid pace of development and the resulting inventory does give developers pause. The growth is exceeding what has been the traditional market absorption rate of 200 to 300 homes per year.”
“‘For all of our thinking, we aren’t going to guess right every time. If we don’t guess right and something causes people to tighten up, that really drives down the housing process in Yakima,’ said Jon Kinloch, Apple Tree resorts director of marketing.”
“Pat Strosahl, CEO for United Builders of Yakima, called the current demand insatiable. So who are the buyers for these new developments? Strosahl said a quarter of the homes United Builders is selling in its various developments — including Zillah Lakes near Zillah and in the Yakima area — are from outside the area.”
“‘We think Yakima has a lot of advantages that Bend, Ore., has. There is a pretty significant range of recreational activities in close proximity. We are within three hours of the major metropolitan areas,’ he said. ‘We have this wine-country thing and house prices are reasonable compared to other markets.’”
“The proposed as-yet unnamed development by United Builders and its partner, is focusing on baby boomers approaching retirement. Apple Tree is seeing a larger percentage of buyers, 50 percent, from outside the area.”
“‘They are made up of professionals moving to Yakima for a particular job or moving to Yakima to retire or for some other reason,’ Kinloch said.”
“With retirees from the Seattle area and elsewhere having cash from selling their homes, the demand is expected to continue.”
The Olympian from Washington. “Thurston County foreclosure notices have increased more than 50 percent in the first quarter of 2008 compared with the same period last year. South Sound real estate agent Phil Sharp has tried to capitalize on this increase by offering tours of foreclosed property to potential investors.”
“On Saturday, about 15 people loaded into two white vans and toured 12 homes in Lacey and Olympia that were listed for sale by banks, or by owners hoping to sell their houses before they are sold at auction.”
“Thurston County hasn’t been immune from the ‘mortgage mess’ because of past lax lending standards and a slower housing market brought about by higher inventory levels, Sharp said.”
“A few years ago, there were only about 400 homes on the market to choose from, he said. Since, inventory levels have surged past 2,000 homes. The number fell to 1,977 homes in February, according to Northwest MLS data.”
“Because some owners might be home during the tour, he asked the group to be respectful with comments. ‘People are already feeling down; they don’t need to be kicked,’ Sharp said.”
“Tim Salo of Olympia said he wants to diversify his investment portfolio by buying real estate. He started shopping for foreclosed properties about six months ago, but then prices averaged about $250,000. Since, he has noticed prices for distressed property fall 10 percent to 15 percent.”
“‘Now, it pencils out,’ he said about the investment.”
“Still, Salo acknowledged that it was sad to see people losing their homes. On the second stop of the tour, 15 people filed into an Olympia house and came face to face with Timothy June, the owner. While everyone looked through the house, June stayed busy by cleaning up his daughter’s room.”
“Asked how he felt about the tour, June said he was glad to have people looking around. ‘I want the house sold,’ he said.”
The Sequim Gazette from Washington. “From about 2003-2005, Sequim real estate took off. The heyday of the local real estate boom is over. What’s left is a market stable enough to coast into the next jump in sales.”
“‘The outlook for Sequim-area real estate is positive when you consider factors relating to long-term supply and demand…and the fact that baby boomers are going to continue to retire here for years to come,’ agent Michael McAleer said. ‘For now we still have a constant flow of buyers that is still higher than 2001 and 2002 and a large housing stock for them to choose from.’”
“‘While houses are still being sold at a price higher than five years ago, we are not on an island,’ McAleer said. ‘We are not going to see the number of buyers from out of the area like we did during our big sale years.’”
“McAleer said an inflated housing stock and reduction in buyers emphasizes a buyers’ market in Sequim. ‘We define a buyers’ market based on number of houses on the market and how many houses sell per month,’ he said. ‘If there are six months’ worth of houses for sale, it’s a balanced market. Right now Sequim has 11 months of housing available, compared to 17 months nationally.’”
“The county’s median household income is $46,213, according to the state. With $10,000 down and an 8.23-percent loan, the median household would be able to purchase a $150,000 home, according to HSH Associates Financial Publishers.”
“There were about a dozen houses on the market at or below $150,000 in the last week of March. With median housing costs at $339,950, most county residents are unable to afford most of the housing stock.”
The Bellingham Herald from Washington.”The undeveloped 20-lot Roseberry Ridge subdivision is now the property of Skagit State Bank, after a slowing local real estate market left its would-be developer without better options.”
“Property records indicate that the bank filed a February foreclosure notice on the seven-acre property. The notice says that close to $2 million in unpaid debt was secured by the property. Whatcom County Assessor’s Office records indicate that Roseberry Ridge LLC paid $700,000 for the property in 2006.”
“Given present conditions in the real estate market, Roseberry Ridge developer Ken Tiderington said he didn’t think he could sell the lots fast enough to pay off his loan or even keep current on interest payments.”
“‘We would have had to keep paying interest until the market turned,’ Tiderington said.”
“Tiderington is also developer of the 173-lot Pacific Highlands subdivision in Ferndale. He said the first 90 lots sold in about two weeks when they went on the market in 2004. He has now sold all but 26, but at this point the market has ‘just disappeared.’”
“‘There’s an overbuilt, abundant inventory of unbuilt lots in Ferndale,’ Tiderington said.”
“‘You cannot get a spec loan at any bank in Bellingham,’ Tiderington said. ‘The market’s dried up, the lenders have dried up.’”
“‘People who have money are still buying lots and building houses,’ Tiderington said. ‘That end of the market always stays the same. When the market is this bad, (custom home buyers) get the best deal.’”
“That’s because subcontractors will cut their prices when work is scarce. ‘Subcontractors right now are hurting big time,’ Tiderington said.”
The Vancouver Sun from Canada. “Metro Vancouver condominium prices are forecast to climb over five per cent this year and average 3.5 per cent a year for the next four years, according to the Conference Board of Canada and Genworth Financial Canada.”
“‘Prices are rising, so if you can get into the market, clearly in the Vancouver market, which is one of the best in the country, then you are going to get some return in terms of building your equity.’ said Jim Murphy, president of the Canadian Association of Accredited Mortgage Professionals, which promotes affordable home ownership.”
“‘Of the leading indicators for a price correction that we look at, so far, none of them have come to pass,’ said senior analyst Robyn Adamache. ‘So there is still quite a ways to go.’”
The Calgary Herald from Canada. “Calgary’s resale housing market has taken a dramatic turn and the latest MLS sales data from the month of March suggest it has become a buyer’s market with listings continuing to soar and sales plunging compared with a year ago.”
“‘We have moved into a market that is currently providing a great variety of choice for the buyer,’ said Ed Jensen, president of the Calgary Real Estate Board.”
“Total MLS listings inventory at the end of March was 12,597, a whopping 167 per cent increase from 4,723 registered in March 2007. The month-end inventory for single-family homes in Calgary metro was 5,957, up 155 per cent from a year ago, while for condos it was up a staggering 283 per cent from a year ago to 2,781 listings from 726.”
“‘With that surplus in inventory, what we’re seeing here is roughly one in five of the homes are selling,’ said Jensen.”
“‘The days of the sellers in the last couple of crazy market years just naming their price and throwing their house on without presenting their house correctly, those days are done. And I think we have to come to reality,’ he said.”
“‘One overhanging question is that supply level and how that will impact prices,’ said Lai Sing Louie, senior market analyst in Calgary for Canada Mortgage and Housing Corp. ‘I don’t believe we’ve reached the highest level of supply yet.’”
“‘We don’t expect any dramatic decrease in prices but we think that prices are going to go up and likely the annual average is going to be less than five per cent. Things are stabilizing right now but still the biggest risk is that with all that supply out there, it’s going to give people even more time for selection,’ he said. ‘It’s going to cause people maybe to compete more with each other. That sense of urgency to buy has diminished dramatically from a year ago.’”
“The average sale price of a single-family home in Calgary metro has increased for each month this year from the $444,769 it was in December — $455, 297 in January, $471,696 in February. It had peaked at $505,920 last July.”
“‘We’ve gone through some crazy years where our inventory was almost non-existent,’ said Jensen. ‘I think the sellers need to pay attention that this is a buyer’s marketplace.’”
‘So what is in store for B.C.? The Vancouver Sun posed that and other questions to four local economy watchers. Here’s what they had to say’
‘Murray Leith (ML), vice-president of investment research at Odlum Brown Ltd.: Canada will not be immune to weakness in the U.S. and global economies. As global growth slows, we expect commodity prices to come off their boil. That will undermine a key driver of the Canadian economy.’
‘ML: Homes in B.C. are simply not affordable. It is the same fundamental problem that existed in the U.S. before the bursting of their bubble — home prices are too high relative to incomes. Either incomes will catch up to home prices over time or home prices will correct to be more appropriately aligned with incomes. We think we are close to a peak in B.C. home prices.’
Three cheers for Murray!
If median house price exceeds median household income in the area by more than 3x its a market due for correction. Anything more than 3x is unhealthy.
FHA set the PITI limit to 1/3 gross household monthly income for a good reason.
I thought the numbers were 28% PITI and 36% total debt load.
“I thought the numbers were 28% PITI and 36% total debt load.”
Likely true for single income household with kids.
The world (much of it) overbuilt, and lowered lending standards?
You are a light.
Leigh
Purchase applications down 11.8%, last week.
Is the supply of naive knife catchers drying up?
I have a theory that the knife catchers, who believe the hype about it being a good time to buy, are an impatient bunch. Many of them have been racing to catch their falling knives, the last few months. As spring turns to summer the number of suckers with fall greatly, as most of them will have bought. Sellers who thought they could price high, during the spring season, will start to panic. Those that can’t hang on will get taken down in the next wave of foreclosures. We could see more foreclosures in the second half of 2008, than the first half.
“Those that can’t hang on will get taken down in the next wave of foreclosures. We could see more foreclosures in the second half of 2008, than the first half.”
I wonder if the banks/mtge companies are “stalling” on some foreclosures, giving the FBs one last, “last ditch effort” to unload properties during the “spring selling season”.
I generally agree with you on the impatience thing.
I do think though that there are some markets where banks are beginning to unload properties at what are some good prices. People aren’t catching knives by the blade in every market…just most markets…
Nothing against you vmaxer - If I hear “Catch a falling knife”, one more time, I swear to Baby Jeebus - Sigh.
Can we just retire this phrase?
For the love of gawd, that is a REAL visual!
Oooooouch - no blades!
Best,
Leigh
P.S. Yes, I know a falling blade (even a dull one) will cut thy hands. (Or wherever it may fall - shudder).
Gotta picture the fingers hitting the floor.
Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhh 0k. I’m such a girl.
Shudder,
Leigh
I guess people are just getting sick of talking about California. Oh well. Happy Wednesday, Ben.
AH HA BigV!
I thought I time-warped into another blog! *gasp*
But Oly is a princess, with a tiara, and deserves just time - whom else could get wee ones to run so enthusiastically! (Huge Oly fan)!!
Ben is providing information on the contagion, thank you Ben.
Happy hump day to All!
Leigh
But California is the center of the universe. It’s different here. Everyone wants to live here.
/sarcasm
AH HA BigV!
(second post, my apologies if this double post).
I thought I was on the wrong blog *gasp*
Happy to see Oly nation getting some attention - I’m a huge fan!
Happy Hump Day to All!
Leigh
‘Happy Hump Day to All!’
Wha…?
Happy Windsday!
Hump Day: the middle of the work week
Oh…..that’s what it is…..and all this time I thought it was an invitation to throw restraint to the wind. My apologies to those who fell victim to my misunderstanding.
LOL ex.
Aaaah haaah!
Gotsha!
Olypiagal ropping with moss, sneaking up on frogs, on a fine Wednesday eve!
And a tiara to boot!
Leigh: Oly where is my princess wand?
Oly: Leigh, it’s over there - back off Leigh - it’s mine…
Leigh: a frog kisser you are!
Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee - chasing wee ones ~
Leigh
Did you ever envy someone else’s buzz?
Hey kill joy-it’s hump day!
JT to the - buzz that!
Leigh
Party on Leigh
Ex,
That’s a happy hump day to you darlin!
Best,
Leigh
I play nice.
Realtors here in PDX reckon inventory is falling and sales are picking up.
Goes against everything I’m seeing on the RMLS pull stats sites and what I’m seeing with my eyes.
Though they seem to be down 30% YOY.
Sales prices are up YOY according to the realtors also.
Case Schiller seems to point to a different reality.
Income is stagnant or dropping. House/income ratio will never get much lower then it is now, welcome to Global Depression 2.0. Bread/soup lines, here we come. Maybe we can burn all our I-Pod/I-Phones for heat.
“The county’s median household income is $46,213, according to the state. With $10,000 down and an 8.23-percent loan, the median household would be able to purchase a $150,000 home, according to HSH Associates Financial Publishers.”
An 8.23% loan? If that’s the best rate the buyer can get, then what are the changes that they’ll have $10,000 to put down?
I did a little math and an income of $46213 comes out to $2772/mo. assuming 28% tax and no other deductions. A mortgage of $140k at 8.23% for 30yrs. is a payment of $1050 for just the PI. That’s almost 38% already. Yikes!
$46K gross does not pay 28% tax. Married with a kid or two and $46K gross pencils out to about a 5-10% tax rate. Add in the mortgage deduction and that $46K gross turns into $46K net.
Is it me, or am I seeing fewer and fewer “it’s a great time to buy” quotes from the real estate salespeople in the articles Ben posts?
It seemed a few months ago, that quote was in every article….now the favorite quote seems to be, “buyers have a lot to choose from”……what’s the next most frequent quote going to be……”I don’t know where all the buyers went”……??
Pent up demand
Grrr…I use to get furious when I read that one, now it’s just tooooo darn funny.
How about, “We’re not giving them away!” (da house).
Good night Irene!
Leigh
Yeah, I demand asking prices that tie to value . . . and I’m very pent up in that demand.
“It’s a buyers’ market” is pretty common, too. Along with the “buyers have a lot to choose from” that you mention, I think we’ll see more of the “buyers are taking their time because of the increased inventory.”
My favorite:
“Buyers are being stubborn.”
ROTFLMAO
Nothing to do with affordability…
Got Popcorn?
Neil
On the fence, we are! HAR -
I refuse to type disparaging language, grrr…
Love the popcorn!
Leigh
Better on the fence then on the Joshua Tree.
This is tooooo good to be true!
They both would hurt my - er- hurt.
Leigh
Now there’s a visual.
“‘The outlook for Sequim-area real estate is positive when you consider factors relating to long-term supply and demand…and the fact that baby boomers are going to continue to retire here for years to come,’ agent Michael McAleer said
Also, don’t forget that the Swiss will soon begin making cheese there.
“Now, many of those same buyers would like to rent out their condos,” Bjornson says. “These condos in the Pearl and the South Waterfront aren’t selling, and the owners have $2,000 mortgages. They want to get as much of that mortgage covered as possible, so they try to keep rents high.”
Another schizophrenic article. First, they suggest rents are going up because people aren’t buying. Then, lots of condo owners are trying to rent their financial boat anchors. Add to that the continued building of condos in the core that are vacant. They seem to think that just because a condo owner needs to cover a $2000 mortgage, that someone will have to pay that amount.
boat = break out another thousand
I like boating, but the bills are a killer.
don’t you think this was just another lame willyweek article? trying to freak out the 20-something SE pdx crowd…
“They want to get as much of that mortgage covered as possible, so they try to keep rents high.”
I’m sure that the owners would like to rent out the condos for $10,000/mth. They don’t get to determine the rental value…
Seriously - condos?
I’m in WI, a condo in the middle of - er - BFE!
The WORST word ever - condominium (twindos whatever).
Fracking $200K for condo + fees.
We’ve lost our minds! (Not aimed at posters here - just venting).
Leigh
Yeesh, can someone sit some of these idjits down and explain to them the concept of DEMAND curves?! And SUPPLY curves?! And how ya gotta look at where the two intersect if you want to have a chance of, well, actually SELLING anything?
“I’ve got to rent out my present condo for $30K/month to fund the payments on the 5 Porsches, ok?”
rents are dropping…there are more homes to rent and more competition…there is no reason to pay high rent in Oregon.
Just use Craigslist as your barometer —- Vancouver, WA rentals have soared in the past 12 months….there are 1363 - 3 or more bedroom homes for rent on craigslist right now… 1363!
It is easy to find a great deal. My wife and I walk our neighbor hood and we see houses not selling, we have also seen houses go off the market for two months and the relist — because they are not selling…you can tell all the realtors and house flippers that no one is listening to them…it is harder to get a loan, which makes it harder to buy, which makes it harder to sell…and there are a ton of rentals with prices dropping — not to mention the fact that you can drive a great rent deal if the owner is desperate enough…so yes, we will live in your new home for a low monthly cost and have zero risk. Thanks!
The Willamette Week from Oregon. “There are seemingly three kinds of Portland renters: those who’ve had a recent rent increase, those who soon will, and those competing for the dwindling supply of decent rentals at a decent price.”
“…it takes a ‘fire sale’ to unload a property, Hunter said.”
Thats because your wishing price is insane!
Somehow, I can’t helping thinking of Crazy Eddie.
“I can’t helping thinking of Crazy Eddie.”
Rule of buying #37: if it has balloons attached to it, lowball the frick out of it.
Useful rule. Unrelated balloon rule: if the entrance to a party (get-together, wedding reception, etc.) is marked by balloons, there is plenty of alcohol and peeing outdoors is OK.
Does that mean that peeing outdoors is not OK if there aren’t balloons? Uh oh, I think I may have committed a faux pas.
is that accepted knowledge?
Weekend thread topic!
Yes, really–this could be one of those cultural mores that it behooves me to pay attention to.
It’s actually even better than that, oly. It also means that (brave) uninvited people can come on in as long as they smile and drink a lot.
Now - social norms.
Plumbing people! (This is why I avert eyes when reading this blog).
Put your…er…pull up you pant/skirt!
Toooooooooo funny
Leigh
“…there are more houses to choose from, said Regan Scott, principal broker of Deschutes Property Management in Bend. That means falling rents…”
C’mon Ben, are you settin’ me up here?
Defalling rents need deschutes to prevent dehard landings.
Deschutes means some falls in French
destiny!
“there are more houses to choose from, said Regan Scott, principal broker of Deschutes Property Management in Bend. That means falling rents”
Defalling rents need Deshutes to stop dehard landing. Nyuk-yuk.
Sorry for the double post. I thought the first was de-stroyed. I’ll shut defugup now.
Oh, you! Go pee on a balloon, you double-poster!
I was just teasing there, Muggy. I liked the ‘Defalling rents need Deshutes’ part, and liked seeing it twice, even. And in an amazing example of Jungian synchronicity, I am presently drinking, that’s right…Deschutes ‘Fat Tire’ ale!
It’s a sign. (hic)
“‘Fat Tire’ ale!”
De-flation!
Fat Tire is from New Belgium brewing outta CO. Just sayin.
*Plugggggh*. (spitting it right out)
Okay, then, back to the Island Market.
“Deschutes ‘Fat Tire’ ale!”
$20,000 in Deschutes ale, receiving $2,400 in recycling, a great buzz and saving $200,000 on the purchase of a house.
Priceless.
And from the New York Times, this enchanting article has more crappola in it than any I recall.
“EVE LEVINE, a 34-year-old real estate broker, recalls fondly the five years when she was, as she calls it, “low-cost bicoastal.” Her primary residence was in Brooklyn …”
http://tinyurl.com/2xvuma
Yep, gotta support the local suds!
But I do like me some Fat Tire.
“The Bend market had 1,262 single-family homes for sale in February, according to this month’s report from the Bratton Appraisal Group in Bend. The report listed 45 single-family home sales in February, the lowest since January 2005.”
Not enough for sale at that rate - that’s only about 28 mos worth.
The number of areas with more than two years of inventory now officially scares me.
Oh well…
Stupid flippers never learn…
Got Popcorn?
Neil
Somebody set me straight on this. Today, let’s say I decide to live large and buy a home for $800,000. I am pretty sure I can afford the payments. Not positive, but pretty sure. So I go out and buy that home in California, move in, and hope for the best. The one thing I do not do is refinance. Then, say 3 years from now I decide the place has lost value, and I really don’t want to make the payments anymore. So I hand the keys into the bank and say “see ya later”.
Exactly what is my downside? California is a non-recourse state, so there really isn’t a whole lot the lender can do. Sure my credit will be dinged, but let’s face it - they give credit to anyone and at some point the credit will be flowing again.
So why should I wait a year or 2 for prices to drop when my risk is almost nothing right now anyway? Also, throw in the fact that uncle sam won’t make me pay the forgiveness tax, AND they might even assist me in keeping the place!
Honestly, aren’t I being the REAL sucker by not gaming the system like everyone else? I am going to get the tax bill anyway. Why not live large?
Yeah, I know. Do the right thing. Blah blah blah. But I see very little reason to do the right thing when everyone around me is gaming the system and I AM GOING TO GET THE BILL ANYWAY.
So…convince me I am not an idiot to wait for prices to fall. My risk is almost zero now.
Ironically, I was thinking the same thing, just this afternoon.
Just try not to put any money in to it.
The only downside that I see is your FICO score, which could prevent you from getting insurance or a job.
“Honestly, aren’t I being the REAL sucker by not gaming the system like everyone else?”
Let’s call this the “bubble-sitter’s conundrum.” I’ve had the same thought… Maybe we should start an investment bank, set up accounts offshore and just go ape$hit.
I like your way of thinking! lol
“…So I go out and buy that home in California, move in, and hope for the best. …”
A little late for an April Fools joke.
What is the best? or What is the best case scenario for making a purchase in a falling market? What is the risk?
Under the new rules from Fannie and Freddie, if you go into foreclosure you cannot get a mortgage for seven years and your FICO must be over 680. Possibly in a few years there may be somebody doing subprime, but I doubt it. I think you should evaluate the Risk/reward ratios using any of the multitude of formulae available. I believe you have failed to measure your risk.
I bet you can’t get a 100% loan so you would have to put down at least 80K.
You answered your own question.
Clean heart.
Sigh. Clean is not cheap. Thank you.
Leigh
Your risk is losing your down payment, which you almost certainly have to have now regardless of your credit score. Walk away and you lose at least $80,000 (10%).
Check the rents for an equivalent house. I pay 1/3rd of the cost of a mortgage+tax+ins at the house I’m at now. Do you want to pay 200-400% of the cost to live in a similar place?
I’ve had friends who have rented 6-car garage houses. So there are high end houses available to rent for a fraction of the cost of buying.
You will also lose the down payment.
“‘We think Yakima has a lot of advantages that Bend, Ore., has. There is a pretty significant range of recreational activities in close proximity. We are within three hours of the major metropolitan areas,’ he said. ‘We have this wine-country thing and house prices are reasonable compared to other markets.’”
Does Bend have a couple thousand illegal aliens? Wait, I mean ‘undocumented workers’; does Bend have those? I ask because I’m curious. I was in Yakima recently, and it became clear to me that I gotta brush up on my Spanish before the next trip.
This should help (The One Semester of Spanish Love Song):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ngRq82c8Baw
OT:
On the aviation blogs, all their talk is about airlines shutting down or about to shut down:
1. Aloha (shut down)
2. Alitalia (Air France/KLM, their White Knight, walked away)
3. then its a debate on who is next…
Virgin Atlantic is burining cash…
So is Skybus…
I’m not hearing good news out of Sun Country…
The list goes on and on…
Lightsaber
airlines…oh, there’s a great business model..
..unless you buy the plane with a no-money down IO, with a teaser rate, you can’t make a dime…
What are you talking about? Airlines are a great business to be in.
Let’s see: The start up costs are enormous, ongoing overhead costs are fixed and expensive, your margin is highly dependent on fuel costs, *and* volume is completely dependent on the robustness of the economy. Oh, I did I mention the fierce competition where you spend most of your time competing on price? And your only hope of earning customer loyalty (generally) involves giving away your high overhead product for free?
I can’t wait to start my own airline business someday. It’s been a dream of mine to take millions of dollars worth of shareholder money and turn it into jet exhaust.
The loss of Virgin Atlantic would be very sad.
Most national airlines run at a loss….anywhere else there’d be mergers up the wazoo but somehow the idea that (say) Switzerland and France really only need one airline frost the shorts of any red-blooded nationalist. Great to see large hunks of aerodynamic metal whizzing around with your country’s flag on it.
Hence, national airlines. Hence, economic inefficiency. Hence, run at a loss….
I’m just waiting until we bring back zeppelins. Hot damn!
Not sure if anyone reads these the day after, but ATA gone as of today, stranding passengers at Chicago Midway.
I thought you guys might like to see an email I got today:
‘Ben……….hate to clue you in ………but yur so called bust has been turnin around for 45 days now.better start another thread……….Kc’
Excellent, then I guess the govt can stop discussing the bailout plans.
No fair!
After I read my last post, I thought it was safe to take a sip of water! Was it Jes Jain who posted here information on how the down slide has accelerated during the last few weeks?
The poster must be from Alexandria, VA (near DC). They seem to be the most clueless…
Hey, there is a weekend topic: Where in the world are the most clueless FB’s?”
Got Popcorn?
Neil
A redundant question. They’re FB’s. They are all clueless (at least they were when they bought - now they think something might be wrong).
Didn’t you know FB also stands for ‘Forgot Brain’
HoooRAAAAAY! An idiot to please us! Jeeze, about time. We’ve been turning on each other lately, out of sheer boredom and lack of idjits and/or trolls. Quick, quick, Ben, ’start another thread’. Use the person’s contact info, huh huh, and how about you call the thread ‘Sweet Precious Troll’.
you got that right.
45 days and why are the restaurants half full, movie houses half full if that, and no one is on car lots, and nothing is going on in the Planning Dept anywhere for the ‘future’?
Enquiring minds want to know…’where is everybody’
What was the turning point 45 days ago?? Valentines Day??
‘Ben……….hate to clue you in ………but yur so called bust has been turnin around for 45 days now.better start another thread……….Kc’
Oh, thank god. The bust is over. It’s finally Time2Buy.
“What was the turning point 45 days ago?? Valentines Day??”
You mean this isn’t the annual post-MLK Day rally? Maybe that extra day in February does make a difference after all. Why do messages like the one posted by Ben appear to be written by semi-literates? If the market had turned as claimed, wouldn’t Realtors be too busy to send a message like that to Ben?
That has got to be that WA kid in Detroit - written between shovelfuls of diamonds.
Ben……….hate to clue you in ………but yur so called bust has been turnin around for 45 days now.better start another thread……….Kc’
Kc’
As in fried chicken?
HAR!
Ben to Kc:
Start another thread? Where you bin boy?
Kc: yor so called bust and all, well, itz bin 45 dayz.
Ben: Whiskey Tango Foxtrot - There is NO bailout!
Kc: start another thread. I need good news man.
FunYuns,
Leigh
Screw the Willamette Week. They are so bought and paid for by RE it is rediculous. A Portland trash weekly free newspaper full of hooker adds
They had a “special RE issue” at the top of the bubble talking about how great RE is in Portland and how rents were going to go up.
They were wrong…lots of lofts sitting empty and plenty still being built.
“‘Prices are rising, so if you can get into the market, clearly in the Vancouver market, which is one of the best in the country, then you are going to get some return in terms of building your equity.’ said Jim Murphy, president of the Canadian Association of Accredited Mortgage Professionals, which promotes affordable home ownership.”
He would say that wouldn’t he…
Prices are rising… so that’s a justification for buying… just as long as you can find a greater fool in the Vancouver Real Estate Market.
Build up equity by being a mortgage slave?… No thanks… I’ll take a pass on the 40 year amortization mortgages these “professionals” are now peddling….
Bend…OVER
Says it all
arrr….me thinks the western USA is going to stink a lot worse than the eastern USA. The realtor types could always sell each other themselves or something. Do the western states actually have any industry? Most of the USA is nothing but Walmart/Whole Foods/Olive Garden (okay maybe in Manhattan/LA it’s some fruity tooty place instead). Is this a good setup for real estate? I think RE prices will fall back to early 90’s values or much less, without adjustments for inflation (hey if you’re going to push doomsday stuff, be flamboyant).
Oh, and since everyone is all ruffled over the Fed and Bear Stearns, let me assure you that something that is unsustainable, is not sustainable by any means. All fraudulent ventures come apart eventually irregardless of how much PR pomp they may have. Yes, this applies to politics too. Bushie poo may have a 90% approval rating but he’ll be out of office soon, and the next one in line won’t be so lucky bwa ha ha ha ha….
So canucks are slowly finding out that they cannot walk on water. It is funny how most of them still think that they won’t be affected by events in the US. It is very likely that people in vancouver are much more delusional than those in the Bay Area.
When RE implodes in Canada, the people there will certainly try to find some reason for the event that does not implicate them. Such behavior stems from the very high levels of cognitive dissonance in the canuck mind- if there is such a thing. It will be fun to watch though..
Couldn’t agree with you more… despite your perjorative beliefs about Canadians…
We have the winter Olympics, a two-week sporting event, coming in two years.
Surely, everyone will want to live here so they can luge at will.
Sen. Robert Bennett, R-Utah, said people shouldn’t view the situation as Wall Street versus Main Street.
“My experience is that Wall Street and Main Street are inextricably linked,” he said.
Yes, Main Street and Wall Street conspiring to screw the few minding their own business on Responsibility Road.
“And industry insiders are predicting even larger rent increases ahead. So why these big changes? The mortgage crisis has made it harder to qualify for a loan. That means those who may have become owners a year ago are now forced to rent.”
“Norris & Stevens managing director Brian Bjornson says rents were kept ‘artificially’ low for the last few years because it was easy to buy and many renters opted to own instead of rent.”
WOW. Rent. Lower (artificially). Buy. Why. Jeesh.
Have we lost our collective minds?
Sigh,
Leigh
I haven’t been up to Washington in over 30 years.
During my time in the Army, I used to drive supplies and troops from Ft. Lewis to Yakima. From what I remember, Yakima was mostly desert. Has that changed?
Yeah Yakima is desert. Makes me wonder how this far up north it’s possible, but yeah there it is.
Yakima: The Palm Srpings of the Northwest…
Apparently the city slogan. Only connection is the lack of rainfall.
While flipping channels this evening, i heard this..
From a PBS News Hour interview.. Sen. Dodd:
“…All of these factors, the accumulating factors — the fact that between 7,000 and 8,000 people a day are filing for foreclosure on their homes..”
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/business/jan-june08/mortgage_04-02.html
There’s no time to waste. Climb aboard that foreclosure bus and snap one up before they’re all gone.
Personally I prefer chainsaw-catchers. More apt in this current Great Depression 2.0.
Keep hands away from chainsaws - please.
My tony brain can’t imagine the…aaaaaaaaaaaaah.
“”We have this wine-country thing and house prices are reasonable compared to other markets.”"
This will end well.
Leigh
There are no shortage of idiots willing to part with their $5000 savings.
BTW, why are you asking for money on your site? I didn’t think it would cost that much to run one.
Is your nickname, “kc”?
“Property records indicate that the bank filed a February foreclosure notice on the seven-acre property. The notice says that close to $2 million in unpaid debt was secured by the property. Whatcom County Assessor’s Office records indicate that Roseberry Ridge LLC paid $700,000 for the property in 2006.”
Ok, the developer paid $700k for raw land. Say he spent $500k to create buildable lots (utilities, grading, roads, etc.). Assume also that the lots can be sold in a package for 1/2 of cost, or $600k. That works out to a 70% loss to the bank (though a lot of this loss is accrued but uncollected interest). Expect more of the same.
BTW, loans to buy land and develop lots are traditionally very high risk. That’s why a prudent banker should demand a very loan LTV for such loans. The bankers at Skagit weren’t prudent and the bank will now take the hits (I’m sure there was more than one of this kind of loan).
rents are dropping in the Portland area — bigtime, just check out all the for rents on craigslist…so you realtors can also forget the “rents are going up” bs…
look for yourself…there is so much selection, it is ridiculous — plus, many nervous mortgage holders are being forces to rent and watch their price go down when no one rents from them for the first two months….
I can deliver leased instruments to Organisations or individuals with their
preferred text verbiage as been approved by their bankers. We also proffer sales
option to interested buyers. Our terms and procedures are so flexible and
workable by RWA clients. Our lease rate is (5.5+0.5)%+x%. X% IS Lessee broker’s
Commission and he determines his commission. Also we have facilities to discount
BG and Put you into PPP Trading.
Contact me through this email:(financialinstruments01@gmail.com) or through
skype: (muhsin.abid.ali) in other to furnish you with other information.