April 23, 2008

It’s A Buffet For Buyers

The Capital Journal reports from Kansas. “Topeka, like much of the rest of the country, is a buyer’s market when it comes to real estate. Home sales fell 26 percent here in the first three months of 2008 compared to sales during the same quarter a year ago. Average sales price in the first quarter 2008 was $115,240, which was down 7 percent from $124,023 a year ago. Janet Carter, president of the Topeka Area Association of Realtors, said subprime lenders have left Topeka, so consumers with less than A credit are having a tough time finding financing.”

“‘We have really lost that group of buyers,’ Carter said. ‘They have nowhere to go.’”

“Toni Shenk, an associated broker, said several foreclosed properties are coming onto the market. ‘It’s a buffet for buyers,’ she said. ‘It’s a good time to buy.’”

The Des Moines Register from Iowa. “Whatever the reason, neighborhoods like Four Mile are taking it on the chin. These days, the more common signs in Four Mile are the ones advertising homes for sale. Plenty are foreclosed homes. At least 75 homeowners have had foreclosure petitions filed against them between January 2005 and February 2008, according to the Register’s analysis of court data.”

“‘It’s definitely impacting the suburbs and the new-build areas as well, but the greatest percentage of foreclosure filings are happening in the lower- to middle-income neighborhoods,’ said Danny Wagener, a community organizer for Des Moines Citizens for Community Improvement. ‘It’s a lot of families who are on the cusp of homeownership who have been misled or put into situations that will inevitably fail.’”

“The median assessed value of the foreclosed homes was $96,000. That’s nearly $50,000 less than the 2006 median value of households in Polk County, about $142,000.”

“‘They’re not getting the money they want out of these houses these days, the market’s so bad,’ said Kevin Lancial, who works for Des Moines’ public works department and has lived in Four Mile for nearly 20 years. ‘And some people just get in over their heads.’”

“Lori Hall and her husband moved into a two-story, four-bedroom house in October 2004. The next year, in order to borrow on their equity and renovate a bathroom, they refinanced with an adjustable-rate mortgage. Lori said the process was confusing for these two first-time homeowners, but they thought they were getting a deal.”

“Two years after refinancing, their house payments increased from $953 a month to $1,350. The Halls couldn’t afford it and quickly fell behind in payments. And after a short period of unemployment, they declared bankruptcy. Now, they’re looking for a rental house, as their home is in the midst of foreclosure.”

“‘When you talk about Four Mile out here, there’s a lot of homes for sale right now,’ Lori Hall said. ‘If we’d stuck with the original loan, we absolutely wouldn’t have these problems today.’”

“Bob Mahaffey, a Des Moines city councilman for the east side, said some homeowners in the area assumed increasing home values would offset the price of their loans. ‘But with the downturn of the real estate market, that never happened,’ he said.”

The Indianapolis Business Journal. “Despite the national housing market’s slump, more than three-quarters of U.S. homebuyers remain confident their purchase was at least as good an investment as stocks…according to a new survey released today by the Metropolitan Indianapolis Board of Realtors.”

“‘Real estate is a long-term investment. Don’t buy and expect to make a fortune in six months,’ said Realtor John Creamer, a former MIBOR president. ‘But if you’re looking for long-term wealth accumulation, real estate in central Indiana is still a great place to invest, either in a home or a rental property.’”

“‘[Local] sales have been up and down. But buyers are still showing up at open houses and asking questions,’ said Creamer. ‘We never went through the ceiling, because we never had investors buying just to get appreciation. Our investors were a little more savvy.’”

“When considered purely as an investment vehicle, said Ball State Bureau of Business Research Director Michael Hicks, homes don’t necessarily compare favorably against stocks. But individuals can’t live inside a stock, or enjoy the intangible benefits of a well-appointed kitchen, cedar deck or recreation room. Taking all factors into consideration, he said, a house is a good long-term investment.”

“‘I’m not sure they are if you’re [just] speculating on it, but they are if you’re living in it,’ Hicks said. ‘Or at least I hope so, because I’m writing a fairly big mortgage payment every month.’”

From Today’s TMJ4 in Wisconsin. “Foreclosures are a growing problem in Milwaukee. This year alone over 1,600 people had their homes foreclosed on. ‘It’s a hard, hard battle. I have been fighting it for a while,’ Monique Ray said.”

“Ray is in a desperate fight to save her home. ‘I think owning your home is one of the most important things you can do, or you can have,’ Ray said.”

“Her annual interest rate is 11 percent. Her mortgage jumped from $700 to more than $1,600 a month. ‘I am a diabetic and I have been sick with stress worrying about bills and how I am going to pay my mortgage,’ Ray said.”

“The experts say the situation is going from bad to worse. Just ask steel worker Dennis Timlin. He makes good money but he spends every dime he makes on his bad mortgage and 12 percent interest rate. He is looking for any help he can get. ‘I am in trouble,’ Timlin said.”

The Detroit Free Press from Michigan. “At the end of 2007, there were 40,298 houses on the market in Wayne, Oakland, Macomb, Livingston and Washtenaw counties. That represents a 17.4-month supply at the current sales pace. The supply of attached new housing, such as condominiums, ranges from 14 to 24 months in the three counties.”

“The Forte Group organized in 2006 to capitalize on the huge oversupply of homes on the market. The company works with local builders to move inventory by purchasing the buyer’s existing home for 90% of the appraised value.”

“They accept just one out of eight applications because the owner isn’t ready to accept a price lower than anticipated, or he or she owes too much on the house. ‘We are trying to give fair value of what the market will pay,’ said Joshua Britton, Forte’s partner. ‘There are a lot of people in this market who are stuck. But there are a lot who aren’t.’”

“But the money isn’t in selling the houses, and they sell many at a loss to control inventory. Builders pay their fees ranging from 12.5% to 15% on the purchase price of the new home. ‘We usually sell the house at a loss,’ Britton said. ‘You can either sell a house for a gain or you can sell a house fast, but you can’t do both.’”

“Marketplace Homes LLC, which started in 2002, began operations with a rent-to-own program and that changed when the real estate bubble burst.”

“Marketplace’s buyout program includes a guaranteed three-year lease so the customer can purchase a new home, knowing that the old home will generate income to pay the mortgage and expenses until it sells. The company last year purchased or leased more than 40 homes and generated more than $10 million in new construction sales for builders.”

“‘Now the market has shifted, and people can’t get rid of their homes. They are competing against banks that are dropping the prices,’ said Skip Chelton, the company’s VP. ‘It is a terrible time to sell in Michigan. Conversely, it is a terrific time to buy.’”

The Star Tribune from Minnesota. “Until recently, local governments in Wright County have been large beneficiaries of the explosive housing growth. Wright County, which welcomed the growth, and in some areas did little to control it, is now paying the price.”

“Housing values are declining at a time when many local governments are in the midst of building new schools and roads and expanding waste-water treatment plants. And vacant homes and half-built subdivisions do little to attract employers or shops that might help turn things around.”

“‘It should have been obvious there was a problem, when developers kept building and building and building, in spite of the fact that many of their houses weren’t being sold,’ said Fred Naaktgeboren, mayor of Buffalo. ‘A lot of people wanted to believe everything was all right.’”

The Spokesman Recorder. “Minnesota Governor Tim Pawlenty has reportedly threatened to veto the Minnesota Subprime Foreclosure Deferment Act recently passed by both houses of the state legislature. In an effort to change the governor’s mind, a group of protesters set up a ‘Subprime City’ last Saturday, made up of tents and cardboard boxes outside the Governor’s Mansion in St. Paul.”

“In an April 1 press conference, Pawlenty said he is concerned about the potential effect on credit for the entire Minnesota mortgage market if the bill becomes law.”

“ACORN officials calculate that every 15 minutes a home in Minnesota is being foreclosed. ‘There are houses being foreclosed all over the state of Minnesota,’ Senior Organizer Vera Ashley pointed out. ‘Everybody didn’t take a loan out just to go buy a new car. They wanted a home, and now they’ve lost it. [They] were conned, maneuvered or tricked into adjustable rate mortgages.’”

“Sharon, who lives on St. Paul’s East Side (she asked that her last name be withheld), was among the protesters. She and her husband are currently facing foreclosure on their three-bedroom home that they purchased in 2006.”

“‘We haven’t lost our jobs,’ explained Sharon. ‘We did not get in over our heads. It was very affordable for us. When I signed the loan, I was under the impression that it would be a fixed rate. I was not aware that at a certain point the loan interest rate would skyrocket.’”

“‘The payment went from $1,675 to $2,300 a month,’ said Sharon. ‘The property tax increased while the value of the home decreased, which made it almost impossible for us to afford.’”

The Weseca County News from Minnesota. “Ten years ago, Realtor Charlie Leach got a call asking if he wanted to handle a foreclosure listing. He took it. Today, Leach handles foreclosure homes almost exclusively and works 80 hours a week to keep up with listings within about an hour’s radius of Waseca.”

“‘It’s almost overwhelming,’ he said.” “In 2007, Leach sold 135 houses; all but two of them were foreclosures. So far in 2008, he has listed 45 homes, compared to 25 at this time a year ago.”

“Occasionally, Leach has to actually remove people from their homes, which is ‘not so pleasant.’ He says he always tells them he doesn’t blame them for the foreclosure because ‘half my friends are four paychecks away’ from the same situation.”

“‘Usually they stay mad at the bank, but they don’t stay mad at me,’ he said.”

“His current foreclosure listings range from $20,000 from $585,000 and, while a certain percentage are the result of medical crisis, a divorce or a lost job, Leach said in most cases the homeowners were simply overextended.”

“The effect of the foreclosures on the local market is not that big, he said, but it is a vicious cycle. ‘The more properties I get, it drags down the value of existing homes,’ he said.”

“He expects the ‘foreclosure high tide’ to last another two years, perhaps three years if the federal government gets involved, because it would ‘just delay things another year.’”

“For each foreclosure, the result for the bank is anywhere from a slight profit to a $100,000 loss, with an average loss of $45,000 loss per house.”

“Most of the time, for the person buying the property, ‘it’s a pretty good deal,’ Leach said. He just wishes first time homeowners would have to take a class on mortgages and finances in general before signing those loan papers.”




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101 Comments »

Comment by Ben Jones
2008-04-23 11:42:52

‘Marketplace Homes LLC, which started in 2002, began operations with a rent-to-own program and that changed when the real estate bubble burst. Marketplace’s buyout program includes a guaranteed three-year lease so the customer can purchase a new home, knowing that the old home will generate income to pay the mortgage and expenses until it sells. The company last year purchased or leased more than 40 homes and generated more than $10 million in new construction sales for builders.’

Another good example of artificially high prices producing more overbuilding, even in a market wipe-out like Michigan. Notice the 2002 reference. IMO, these states had a housing mania too, it just fell apart sooner.

Comment by Arizona Slim
2008-04-23 11:56:00

From the original post:

“‘Real estate is a long-term investment. Don’t buy and expect to make a fortune in six months,’ said Realtor John Creamer, a former MIBOR president. ‘But if you’re looking for long-term wealth accumulation, real estate in central Indiana is still a great place to invest, either in a home or a rental property.’”

It’s been my understanding that, when it comes to ROI, housing tends to trail other asset classes.

Comment by joeyinCalif
2008-04-23 12:18:09

i dunno about that.. when a small down payment is leveraged to the moon 100% return is not unusual. Of course this assumes there is a realistic plan that includes a timely resale, which is unlikely in today’s falling market which won’t easily allow the generic fixer-upper model of 20-30 years ago.

Comment by MacAttack
2008-04-23 15:14:25

Yes, leverage can result in big gains…and as we’ve seen, in absolute wipeouts of principal, and beyond. It’s exactly the same as buying stocks on margin - folks in 1929 didn’t think THOSE prices would ever go down either.

Absent the leverage, though, I often wondered what the real gain was when taxes, maintenance, cleaning, utilities, and similar were deducted from the nominal gain. Friends used to tell me I should buy the biggest place I could - essentially leveraging myself as much as possible. I did not, never believing the return was all that great, and not being a fan of debt in general. I’m very glad of that now, as you might imagine.

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Comment by joeyinCalif
2008-04-23 15:42:35

I’d take a wild guess.. If all available information were calculated and averaged out, aside from appreciation, holding RE as an investment is a zero sum game.

However, there is plenty of money to be made by the manipulation of particular properties combined with advantageous situations. But, imo, those opportunities require the competitive attitude, the resources, skills and devotion of a professional, along with perhaps some measure of luck. There is money to be had in RE, but no easy money.

 
Comment by Michael Emmel
2008-04-23 18:07:39

As long as the payments are close to renting and you fairly secure generally people say you have to stay in a house five years to really recover your money. And the interest rate is reasonable etc then it can easily pencil out to buy vs rent.

Other investments of the same amount generally don’t make enough to cover your rent. This is why landlords want to be cash flow positive on rentals btw they don’t make much money on just covering part of the mortgage payment. Also of course because of the leverage you want house prices to be very stable which means everyone needs quite a bit of skin in the game.

I can’t see how it can work out if the house price is much more than rent since the maintenance costs of a house are quite high.

 
 
 
Comment by yogurt
2008-04-23 12:19:37

That’s because it’s less risky than stocks. I mean risk in the proper investment sense, uncertainty of future income. The discounted value of future income determines the value (as opposed to price) of any asset. The future income of housing (rent) is very predictable, so the price of the asset gets bid up so that the total return isn’t much higher than for fixed income.

That of course is assuming that the house price/rent is at historical norms. Buy when the price is inflated, and you or a greater fool are going to lose money. That not a risk - that’s a certainty.

 
 
Comment by NYCityBoy
2008-04-23 13:22:51

Repeat after me: “The bubble in Minnesota started in 1998.”

Comment by DinOR
2008-04-23 13:57:43

God love you sir! In Oregon probably even sooner. By identifying the bubble as a strictly Post-9/11 event, NAR is hoping to stem the damage control to 2002.. give or take. Just check out the Case-Schiller charts in most major metros and you’ll see the ramp up start in the late 90’s.

Comment by Groundhogday
2008-04-23 15:46:17

Yep, in Bozeman the university had to bump up starting salary offers beginning in 1998 due to rapidly increasing home prices. At the time, a young professional would really sweat the purchase of an $180k home. Starting salaries have gone up about 10-15% over the past 10 years, while home prices have almost tripled.

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Comment by Blano
2008-04-23 15:49:00

I’ve been having trouble understanding how these companies can make money when they’re basically paying full price to buy someone out. To me, 90% of “appraised” is still full price around here.

 
 
Comment by WT Economist
2008-04-23 11:53:32

“Despite the national housing market’s slump, more than three-quarters of U.S. homebuyers remain confident their purchase was at least as good an investment as stocks.”

They may be right, but that isn’t necessarily good news!

Comment by Climber
2008-04-23 12:28:13

What a loaded statement - which stocks?. I sold Nextel shares to buy a Honda Civic. Two years later the Civic had held it’s value far better than the Nextel shares. Neither would have been a “good investment”.

Lately my gold and energy stocks have far outperformed my house. It remains to be seen if the trend continues.

Comment by NYCityBoy
2008-04-23 13:19:31

“more than three-quarters of U.S. homebuyers remain confident their purchase was at least as good an investment as stocks.”

I remain as confident as ever that 3/4 of all Americans are f-cking morons.

Comment by roguevalleygirl
2008-04-23 19:36:13

I was putting it at 1/2, but thats still a lot of morons.

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Comment by cvca
2008-04-23 12:00:24

“Most of the time, for the person buying the property, ‘it’s a pretty good deal,’ Leach said. He just wishes first time homeowners would have to take a class on mortgages and finances in general before signing those loan papers.”

Not going to happen. Majority of FB are trying to Forrest Gump their way to riches.

 
Comment by az_owner
2008-04-23 12:06:11

Toni Shenk, an associated broker, said several foreclosed properties are coming onto the market. ‘It’s a buffet for buyers,’ she said. ‘It’s a good time to buy.’

————————–

Trying to buy today is like following the Klumps in the buffet line - only scraps and remnants of sauce left in the steam pans.

Wait until they put out a fresh tray of bread pudding and salsbury steak, then load up the plate, Cousin Eddy style.

My personal taste is for land - raw, sweet, juicy land. I’m looking for 10% of peak prices as an entry point into some lots in the Phoenix metro.

Comment by Olympiagal
2008-04-23 12:57:05

Yeah, when I read that line I thought about NYCityboy and his entertaining thoughts regarding a ‘Bullsh*t Buffet’.

Raw, sweet, juicy land–you make it sound so appetizing.

Comment by MacAttack
2008-04-23 15:15:20

They aren’t making any more… oops, wait, they just rezoned a whole bunch… I guess they ARE making more :)

 
 
Comment by mikey
2008-04-23 13:15:52

From Today’s TMJ4 in Wisconsin. “Foreclosures are a growing problem in Milwaukee. This year alone over 1,600 people had their homes foreclosed on. ‘It’s a hard, hard battle. I have been fighting it for a while,’ Monique Ray said.”

Oh My Toto!…Ray must live in Milwaukee, Land of Oz, as ALL the little Munchkin RE agents in the different land of Milwaukee are singing “It’s a Great Time to Buy”

Ooops!..Almost all of them. Olga hasn’t been the same since that house FELL ON HER SISTER LAST WEEK :)

 
Comment by ex-WA
2008-04-23 14:07:51

My personal taste is for land - raw, sweet, juicy land. I’m looking for 10% of peak prices as an entry point into some lots in the Phoenix metro.

Only 10%? Here in Tucson, where we’re renting, asking prices for land are still ridiculous, I’d say 100% overpriced. But I’ve seen many large bulldozed tracts that were planned to be developments where nothing has happened in many months, no foundations, nothing, just dirt farms for breeding valley fever. Some have signs for the factory builders like Lennar. The thing is, since almost all development here is “master planned communities” done by these big builders, they won’t sell off individual lots. Well, they can rot, it’s just too bad they’ve f’d up the environment so badly.

Comment by 85701 is overrated
2008-04-23 14:49:29

He said “10% of” not “10% off”.

Comment by Arizona Slim
2008-04-23 15:14:06

Okay, fellow Tucsonans, what do you think about the latest loft-crashing news? IIRC, an acquaintance bought one of these units. It was such a problem child that he was trying to get the developer to buy it back.

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Comment by az_owner
2008-04-23 15:36:58

That’s right - 10 cents on the dollar. And I’m looking at infill lots where a few modest houses or a duplex will do well in a world of $5 gas. I’m not talking about being a developer myself, just a land speculator.

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Comment by DinOR
2008-04-23 14:51:27

Test

 
 
 
Comment by aimeejd
2008-04-23 12:09:49

“Occasionally, Leach has to actually remove people from their homes”

Realtors are empowered to remove people from their homes? Since when?

Comment by mikey
2008-04-23 13:59:46

The Spokesman Recorder. “Minnesota Governor Tim Pawlenty has reportedly threatened to veto the Minnesota Subprime Foreclosure Deferment Act recently passed by both houses of the state legislature. In an effort to change the governor’s mind, a group of protesters set up a ‘Subprime City’ last Saturday, made up of tents and cardboard boxes outside the Governor’s Mansion in St. Paul

Good thing I ain’t the Governor. I’d have called up Iraq and ordered an air strike of hungrey squirrels from the Minnesota Air National Guard on those damned Acorn squatters :)

 
 
Comment by Mo Money
2008-04-23 12:12:49

“Toni Shenk, an associated broker, said several foreclosed properties are coming onto the market. ‘It’s a buffet for buyers,’ she said. ‘It’s a good time to buy.’”

Toni, here’s a brain teaser for you that will make your head explode. When is it NOT a good time to buy ?

 
Comment by robmypro
2008-04-23 12:22:40

Just got back from Costco. We went at around 10:00 am. I wasn’t expecting a big crowd. I was wrong. The parking lot was packed. There was a crowd around the rice section. People had 3-4 bags of it. Word was definitely out about shortages. Also, just about every other cart had several cases of water, and a big package of toilet paper. It could be that I was just more aware of it today, but I don’t know.

This was in Fountain Valley, California.

Comment by Arizona Slim
2008-04-23 12:31:27

Reminds me of Johnny Carson’s toilet paper shortage joke. He cracked that one in December 1973, and it set off a genuine panic. Complete with hoarding! For those too young to remember, here’s a history lesson.

Comment by robmypro
2008-04-23 12:38:58

That was amazing. I never heard that one. Thanks.

 
 
Comment by Mo Money
2008-04-23 12:37:10

Costco always seems to be mobbed on the weekends as people buy way more then they need at any one time. The 1st things to go in any panic are bread, milk, Toilet paper and water.

Comment by robmypro
2008-04-23 12:51:11

Hey, Mo. I know the weekends are busy, but I wasn’t expecting it to be so busy today, at 10am. I didn’t really notice a lot of bread or milk, but toilet paper and water were HUGE hits today.

Our strategy was a little different. Sure we got the tp and water, but I did some research a while back to see which canned foods had the longest shelf life. What I came up with was:

Spam
Tuna
Sardines
Corned Beef
Bush’s Beans

All these items have a shelf life of multiple years. We also loaded up on rice, cooking oil, etc. I remember when we first did this about 6 months ago. People looked at our cart and sort of wondered “what the heck?”. This time we got no looks at all, although our cart was not as full.

Maybe I am totally wrong about a food shortage. But with inflation rising rapidly, stocking up still helps protect against price rises down the road. And should the shit really hit the fan, I know my family is going to get through it.

Comment by are they crazy
2008-04-23 13:17:46

Good time of year for food shortage - best time to garden. Cheap and easy to plant your own veggies. We use a Pur filter on kitchen faucet, so we don’t buy water.

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Comment by SteveH
2008-04-24 09:10:48

Am I missing something here? Why buy water? Aren’t there taps at home that can be used to fill plastic jugs? Bottled water is almost as expensive as gasoline.

 
 
Comment by joeyinCalif
2008-04-23 12:41:01

i shop at costco .. all they HAVE is big packages of toilet paper..

It’ll be time to worry when the Tonight Show monologue includes a bit about a rice shortage.

Got consumer staples?

Comment by robmypro
2008-04-23 12:54:16

“i shop at costco .. all they HAVE is big packages of toilet paper..”

I hear ya joey. But my point was that every other cart had one or two big packages of TP in it. I didn’t see a sale sign over by it either. People were just loading up. Honestly, 40% of the carts I saw had TP in them. That was very unusual. But maybe this is typical? I never really noticed.

Comment by DinOR
2008-04-23 13:20:11

Costco is truly as much an affliction as unregulated, unplanned and compulsive trips to Home Despot during the Cargo Cult of the housing boom years. I can see people getting in, getting what they need and GTFO but all too often I see people making a day of it? You know stopping by the snack-bar and chowing down on foot-long hot dogs and/or cardboard pizza to give them the strength to cruise the aisles some more? ( Used to meet eldest daughter there for lunch. She LOVED the place! ) No thanks.

( Any word of a liquor shortage? ) Oh we’ll be fine then thanks. :)

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Comment by aqius
2008-04-23 14:33:12

( Any word of a liquor shortage? ) Oh we’ll be fine then thanks.

AHAHahahaaa - I swear, between DinOR, Olygal, Leighsong, Palmetto, Exeter, Aladinsane, and many other characters on this board, my blood pressure has dropped faster than a foreclosed house.

(’course I aint a character myself. my comments are ALWAYS perfectly rational, thoughtful, typographically and grammatically corect!)

 
 
Comment by joeyinCalif
2008-04-23 13:43:00

i don’t buy TP there because i don’t like pushing a cart. Even with a regular shopping cart i tend to buy stuff i don’t need.. frozen junkfood etc.. go in for eggs and butter and end up burning $200.

First few times, I was kinda amazed at how much stuff people buy.. wtf.. do they own a restaurant or something? But i think most are just frugal families stocking up.
Since it’s basically wholesale price/quantities, Costco purchases are not a valid retail commodity market indicator, imho.

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Comment by robmypro
2008-04-23 13:57:43

How about this one?

Sam’s Club, the membership warehouse division of Wal-Mart Stores Inc., is limiting how much rice customers can buy because of what it calls “recent supply and demand trends.”

Sam’s Club’s restriction is effective immediately at all locations where quantity restrictions are allowed by law. It does not apply to other staples such as flour or oil.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080423/ap_on_bi_ge/wal_mart_rice

 
Comment by DinOR
2008-04-23 14:03:27

Well that and the 300 lb. gals getting 5 gal. jars of mayo? Yeah, you need to be buyin’ in bulk sister. You know that was HD’s retail model as well. You’d go in for a roll of masking tape and a 1″ paint brush and $300 later you’re heading for the check-out!

I’m proud to say I haven’t set foot in a Home Depot since 2002 and Costco since 2004. Ahhh, clean and sober! :)

No more tile adhesives and saw horses in MY.. life!

 
Comment by joeyinCalif
2008-04-23 14:34:35

watch the CNBC video to the left.. seems this is just a coastal N Calif. (wacko) phenomenon.. a nutty panic run on rice.
If “Americans eat an average of 10lbs of rice per year, while Asians eat 150 pounds per person”, i eat less than my share and you can have some of mine..

A few stores don’t want to empty out their warehouses and be forced to re-up at panic prices.. and i don’t blame them.

 
Comment by mikey
2008-04-23 14:36:28

aah yes…. a couple of 40lb bags of rice, a little Jack Daniels, a few smokes and the trusty rusty 45 cal semi auto with plenty of ammo.

With that, 800 rolls of TP, and the healthy house mouse clan in the cellar for meat…we SHALL survive America :)

 
Comment by hip in zilker
2008-04-23 14:43:52

shoot. and we just got rid of the rats in the attic.

 
Comment by are they crazy
2008-04-23 15:30:34

I just don’t want to schlep around and store all that stuff. We used to do the checkstand giveaway at target - going through the store impulse buying and then when we got to the checkstand would separate need from want and give back all the stuff we had decided not to buy. Got the thrill of putting the stuff in the cart and then the bonus thrill of not having spent as much money afterall.

 
 
Comment by Mo Money
2008-04-23 14:48:52

If you have several girls in your household TP goes pretty fast, I’m convinced they eat it the way we’ve gone through it at times.

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Comment by sfv_hopeful
2008-04-23 15:31:35

I hear you. I’ve learned to ignore that sound. You know, THAT sound - the sound of toilet paper being rolled in it’s holder over and over and over, then ‘rip’, repeat. The girls in the family go through that stuff like there’s no tomorrow. My apologies to the many trees that sacrificed their lives in order to make that possible.

 
Comment by mikey
2008-04-23 15:42:06

Sheesh…What do you THINK the 45 Cal. semi auto is FOR…the house mouse clan ?

:)

 
Comment by LA Wallflower
2008-04-23 16:14:09

There are only two kinds of people in this world: “Folders” and “Crumplers.” Crumplers use TP at roughly 8-10x the rate of Folders.

I’ve noticed that a lot of women are Crumplers, including my girlfriend, but many men are as well.

Train your children, people. We can eliminate Crumpling in our lifetime!

 
Comment by anon in DC
2008-04-23 17:43:26

My brother told me when he went to Kidergarten the nuns taught the kids to FOLD. That was in the early 1960s. Guess the depression and war were still fresh memories.

 
 
Comment by MacAttack
2008-04-23 15:19:04

There’s a coupon for it currently.

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Comment by oxide
2008-04-23 14:21:56

Got consumer staples?

Actually yes. I parked some of this year’s Roth in Fidelity’s Consumer Staples Fund in February. Even a stopped clock is right twice a day.

Comment by aqius
2008-04-23 14:44:30

since you & others have mentioned Fidelity a few times, I just want to mention my HORRIBLE EFFIN exeperience with those anal paperwork shufflers, just trying to redeem & have a check issued from a deceased relatives estate account.

Among the many other brokerages I had to contact to redeem like accounts, such as Morgan Stanley & a few others, Fidelity was, without a doubt, the MOST-PAIN-IN-THE-ASS to work with.

After the first few contacts I informed the ‘ol ball n chain of my prediction was that this particularf brokerage house would drag their feet, nitpick & use any excuse to NOT pay out / liquidate an account. These assholes put up so many bullshit obstacles that I will NEVER do any business with them again.

perhaps yer experience has differed but that is my war story.

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Comment by DinOR
2008-04-23 14:55:16

I dunno guys. I can’t get too excited about this. I was stationed in the Philippines for years and we did without a LOT of things on a regular basis. Not the least of which electricity and water. Hell, it seemed like EVERY payday was a mad dash to get to the PX before they ran out of everything! ( Always had plenty of beer though.. )

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Comment by MacAttack
2008-04-23 15:17:04

I heard about it on the radio on the way to work, and I thought, DOPES!

 
Comment by Anthony
2008-04-23 16:38:33

No rice at Costco in Eureka, CA…sold out.

 
 
Comment by DinOR
2008-04-23 12:23:27

“If we’d stuck with the original loan, we absolutely wouldn’t have these problems today”

And…. if my Aunt had balls she would have been my Uncle! No sorry, the problem was that she saw all this equity and couldn’t keep her hands off it. You know what, I’m sick and tired of this urban myth of spending 15-25k on bathroom “remodels”. Absolutely sick of it.

One of our old houses had sheet rock that was rotting out from the shower leaking behind it. Real mess, lots of mold. ( This is what happens when the previous homeowner puts a tub/shower against an outside wall! ) Complete remodel. Now true I did… do the whole thing on a shoe string budget but I doubt we spent a grand.

I don’t expect everyone to be as frugal as the avg. poster here but unless there was a fire you should be able to get away cheaper than getting a cash out re-fi?

 
Comment by LA Wallflower
2008-04-23 12:36:40

“Janet Carter, president of the Topeka Area Association of Realtors, said subprime lenders have left Topeka, so consumers with less than A credit are having a tough time finding financing.”

“‘We have really lost that group of buyers,’ Carter said. ‘They have nowhere to go.’””

It still blows my mind when I hear people saying somethign this.

Janet, darling. You shouldn’t have had that group of buyers to begin with.

People with “less than A credit” have “less than A credit” because they are not the kinds of people to whom you lend a six-figure dollar amount and then expect to actually be paid back with interest. Most of them have proven this by their previous financial actions.

When is “beating the stupid out of people” going to become fashionable again?

Comment by LA Wallflower
2008-04-23 12:50:33

…says the guy who can’t spell “something” and leaves out “like.”

*bonks self on head*

 
Comment by joeyinCalif
2008-04-23 12:54:47

Discipline the stupid out of your kids or the cold, cruel world will do it with hard knocks..

Comment by In Colorado
2008-04-23 13:18:42

Its like I tell my kids: The world is not as forgiving as we (dad & mom) are.

 
 
Comment by shelby
2008-04-23 16:41:47

My Mom just sold her 60 year old house in topeka in 3 weeks - but it was only 65K
Had a lot of lookers - no bubble there-
no one wants to live in that gang-infested hell-hole
Yes, that’s Topeka kanasas!!

 
 
Comment by NoSingleOne
2008-04-23 12:37:10

It’s different here!

AOL/Forbes Magazine Top 5 “Sellers” Markets

1. San Jose
2. San Francisco
3. Salt Lake City
4. Austin
5. Kansas City

Comment by scdave
2008-04-23 12:50:20

Nice Post….

 
Comment by HARM
2008-04-23 14:50:02

AOL/Forbes Magazine Top 5 “Sellers” Markets

The forgot the “Delusional” between “5″ and “Sellers”.

 
Comment by hip in zilker
2008-04-23 14:54:12

I’m so glad we’re different here in Austin. This place should be absolutely flying off the shelf:
http://austin.craigslist.org/rfs/652155825.html
Wish we could have back the 100 year old tree that was knocked down to build this ***

Comment by mjc
2008-04-23 18:11:30

“feels like living in a single family home. Pride of ownership shows. It looks new, fresh and clean.”

Why “feels like” and “looks”?

I’m suspicious.

Comment by hip in zilker
2008-04-23 18:41:46

“feels like living in a single family home”
It’s a duplex (in my book), shares a wall with a unit perpendicular. They’ve changed the marketing from “townhome” to “condo.”

“looks new, fresh and clean.”
It’s been lived in less than a year. But there are a lot of never-occupied detached McMansions in this neighborhood being marketed by their developers. And more coming onto the market … few being sold.

As the ad says, it’s a great neighborhood. But this place looks like it was dropped onto it by aliens.

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Comment by drew
2008-04-23 12:51:11

“Toni Shenk, an associated broker, said several foreclosed properties are coming onto the market. ‘It’s a buffet for buyers,’ she said. ‘It’s a good time to buy.’”

Any realtard would say anything to convince the public that its a buyers market. With affordability still an issue, its not a “buyers” market, its a “Waiters” market. Those who wait shall be rewarded in the end.

Comment by DinOR
2008-04-23 13:38:05

Drew,

I tend to think it’s NAR brainwashing it’s own members to use those “marching order” statements any time they interface with the media. By now most realtors in most markets have seen:

1. Friends they looked up to “wash out” as realtards
2. Numerous foreclosures in their own neighborhood ( perhaps even their own clients )
3. Deals fall through as financing utterly dries up
4. New home builder auctions, etc. etc.

It’s part of NAR’s campaign to “combat all the negative MSM coverage”. That way all realtards are uniformly stupid.

 
 
Comment by Renterfornow
2008-04-23 13:02:58

Topeka Area Association of Realtors, said subprime lenders have left Topeka, so consumers with less than A credit are having a tough time finding financing.”

“‘We have really lost that group of buyers,’ Carter said. ‘They have nowhere to go.’”

Oh lets feel sorry for these deadbeats who bid up house prices into the stratospshere and are walking away. Screw these freeloaders.

 
Comment by Mr. Drysdale
2008-04-23 13:04:02

“‘We have really lost that group of buyers,’ Carter said. ‘They have nowhere to go.’”

Umm, I believe they can go back to renting or boomerang back to their parents’ basements.

What Carter really meant is, “We have really lost that group of commissions . . . and we have no where to go”

 
Comment by need 2 leave ca
2008-04-23 13:07:57

I am going to the casino buffet tonight (my work). Is that the same as a housing buffet?

 
Comment by need 2 leave ca
2008-04-23 13:20:27

Senior Organizer Vera Ashley pointed out. ‘Everybody didn’t take a loan out just to go buy a new car. They wanted a home, and now they’ve lost it. [They] were conned, maneuvered or tricked into adjustable rate mortgages.’”

No Vera, with very few exceptions, they were all greedy folks who wanted an instant road to riches because housing ALWAYS went up. You can’t tell me that 99%+ of the folks now in foreclosure knew in their gut they couldn’t afford the mortgage if they had to pay it in full on whatever they were earning at the time. For example, one family I saw in San Jose CA (granted much higher price than MN) where husband/wife made $13/hr and bought a $850K house. In the gut, they had to know they couldn’t pay that when push comes to shove. I would say that for all 50 states and many foreign countries now blowing up.

Comment by spike66
2008-04-23 14:37:43

Amen. They were not conned, manuevered or tricked into anything.
They wanted easy money, and a soft life, and they knew the meaning of the word “adjustable”. And yes, they did take out a loan to buy a new car, because they don’t have a nickel of their own to pay for anything.We call them deadbeats…greedy little mofos, too.

 
Comment by Blano
2008-04-23 15:56:48

These ACORN clowns are rapidly becoming my least popular protest group. Do you have to take a stupid pill to be part of this silliness???

 
 
Comment by Professor Bear
2008-04-23 13:20:57

Was Kansas a bubble market? This news makes me feel like Rip Van Winkle, waking up from a long nap.

Comment by DinOR
2008-04-23 13:51:12

Professor,

Funny you’d say that? I call all the late-to-the-party, nosebleed sellers “Rip Van Flipper” LOL!

 
Comment by Anthony
2008-04-23 16:44:07

I wouldn’t think of Kansas as in a bubble. My folks live in Topeka and things are still very affordable by any measure. State government provides consistent, good jobs, as well as some manufacturing jobs. You can buy a very nice house in a good neighborhood for about $150K-200K and median salaries are competitive. Also, food and energy cost less. After living in California for 6 years, I’d go back there in a heartbeat if I could secure employment in my limited field.

 
 
Comment by need 2 leave ca
2008-04-23 13:36:36

It’s a hard, hard battle. I have been fighting it for a while,’ Monique Ray said.”

“Ray is in a desperate fight to save her home. ‘I think owning your home is one of the most important things you can do, or you can have,’ Ray said.”

Monique, let the albatross go. Rent a small apartment at a fraction of the cost. Then you can sleep at night, and reduce your stress. Ask the military person who called his home an albatross from yesterday’s thread.

Comment by spike66
2008-04-23 14:41:27

Yo Monique, the battle is over, you lost, the house is going, going, gone. But thank you for playing the real estate game. Now scram.

 
Comment by HARM
2008-04-23 14:46:37

‘I think owning your home is one of the most important things you can do, or you can have,’ Ray said.”

*I* think having good health, peace of mind and free time to spend with family and friends is FAR more more important than working yourself into an early grave in a futile attempt to “save” a f**king house you clearly cannot afford.

 
 
Comment by stan
2008-04-23 13:38:24

How exactly is a “bubble market” defined? Is it based on home prices VS. income levels in the area? I’m guessing home prices have historically been a bit out of reach for the average person, so what is the formula or the way it is calculated?

Thanks!

 
Comment by need 2 leave ca
2008-04-23 13:39:18

When I signed the loan, I was under the impression that it would be a fixed rate. I was not aware that at a certain point the loan interest rate would skyrocket.’”

“‘The payment went from $1,675 to $2,300 a month,’ said Sharon

Sharon, did it dawn on you to READ the document BEFORE you signed it. And if you are truly illiterate (although doesn’t seem), pay an attorney $100-200 to read it and explain the important details, like what the payments are over the life of the loan. But you were in too big of a hurry, and the scum sucking MB glossed over that fact because they wanted that big fat commission.

Comment by oxide
2008-04-23 14:37:39

Going from $1675 to $2300 sounds like a lot more than just an interest adjustment. I’d wager there’s an Option ARM in there somewhere.

And you don’t even have to “read” too carefully. Just ask them to run you up an amort chart, and please put the payment for month #25, #37, and #61 in bold print, thank you. That will stop any loan officer in his tracks. [you should have seen the salesperson's face at Toyota when I told them I had "Tier 1" credit. She knew they couldn't play any low-FICO games with me!]

Comment by Climber
2008-04-23 15:22:45

But they get downright peevish with you when you just bring out a check book. We had to get a manager to “approve” our paying by check. We asked if they’d rather have a suitcase full of cash and they shut up.

 
 
 
Comment by need 2 leave ca
2008-04-23 13:41:27

Not going to happen. Majority of FB are trying to Forrest Gump their way to riches.

this is a great statement. succint, understandable, and TOO TRUE.

 
Comment by need 2 leave ca
2008-04-23 13:47:42

This post deserve a mention for Casey the A$$HOLE. He was the poster child for buying more house than he could ‘eat’. Is his sorry A$$ in jail/prison yet? The foreclosure jester?

 
Comment by smiling_in_SD
2008-04-23 14:17:47

“‘We haven’t lost our jobs,’ explained Sharon. ‘We did not get in over our heads. It was very affordable for us. When I signed the loan, I was under the impression that it would be a fixed rate. I was not aware that at a certain point the loan interest rate would skyrocket.

peoples stupidity still amazes me. It prolly shouldn’t anymore but it still does.

Comment by spike66
2008-04-23 14:44:30

“peoples stupidity still amazes me. It prolly shouldn’t anymore but it still does.”

And they get to vote too.

Comment by are they crazy
2008-04-23 15:40:40

And they get to breed.

 
 
Comment by Mo Money
2008-04-23 15:03:36

Why would you have an “Impression” ? the damn loan docs state what the terms are you mouth breathing nitwit.

 
Comment by Darrell_in_PHX
2008-04-23 15:46:33

BS! You have to sign the very simple “truth in lending”. If it is an ARM, you also have to sign the ARM rider. There is NO WAY they didn’t know what they were signing.

 
 
Comment by darkmatter
2008-04-23 15:12:08

“‘The payment went from $1,675 to $2,300 a month,’ said Sharon. ‘The property tax increased while the value of the home decreased, which made it almost impossible for us to afford.’”

i just checked my bottle of jack daniels. but no the proof did not go up.

what are these people drinking?

just what does the “value of the home changing” have anything to do with being able to afford it after you have already bought it?

Comment by Darrell_in_PHX
2008-04-23 15:45:00

Refi man, REFI!

They got the house with a low teaser rate with plans to just refi every couple years to keep the rate low. They were toast when prices stopped going up, interest rates started going up, or high LTV loans went away. Since we have all three, they are really toast!

 
 
Comment by mikey
2008-04-23 16:07:20

Jack Daniel’s (Old Time No7) 86% proof here …I beat DinOR to the PX and it WASN’T to HARD….RICE

 
Comment by mikey
2008-04-23 16:10:43

maybe says 96%proof …makeit make that “HOARD” :)

 
Comment by Mormon_Tea
2008-04-23 16:10:43

“‘We haven’t lost our jobs,’ explained Sharon. ‘We did not get in over our heads. It was very affordable for us. When I signed the loan, I was under the impression that it would be a fixed rate. I was not aware that at a certain point the loan interest rate would skyrocket.’”

Uh huh - here’s another bunch of doozies from the current pages of American Stupid:

1. I was told Social Security would always “be there”.
2. I was told if you worked hard you would get “ahead”.
3. I didn’t think it would get this bad.
4. I thought the Government would do something about this.
5. No one saw this thing coming.
6. I can’t afford to sell at a loss.
7. They need to roll back the price of gasoline.
8. They need to bring back the good jobs.
9. The next President needs to give us affordable Health Care.
10. In the long run, real estate and the stock market always go up.

Now, folks, enjoy this fine Spring 2008 day and relax in the knowledge and comfort of these eternal truths - and that somehere out there, in the verdant Forest, plucky Thumper is all twitterpated with his sweetie.

Comment by spike66
2008-04-23 21:38:38

Nice job Mormon Tea on the the ongoing list…add to it, “I did all the right things, I went to school, got a job, and was frugal…so where’s my house, middle-class life…”

And the answer is…spent. It’s all been spent. Gulf Wars 1 and 2. Bosnia, Somalia, Grenada, Vietnam, Korea. The War on Drugs. The War on Terror. The War on Poverty. Entitlements. Medicare. Medicaid. College for Everybody. Big Pharma. Stadiums and Convention Centers …everywhere.

 
 
Comment by mikey
2008-04-23 16:33:01

11. We have meet the enemy and she is Suzanne.

 
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