They’re Not Going After A Dream Anymore In Florida
WTVJ reports from Florida. “Broward resident Marina Davis has to love her home. She’s trapped in it. Like thousands, Davis has seen her real estate investment turn upside-down. In September 2005, Davis paid $550,000. Two months ago, the home was worth $480,000. Now, it is down to $380,000. Even worse, Davis falls farther behind every month. Because she got a risky ‘negative equity’ loan, her monthly payment of $2,850 isn’t even enough to cover the monthly interest of $4,550. She now owes the bank $590,000.”
“‘There’s nothing I can do,’ she said. ‘I am losing $1,700 a month. I am just going backward. I looked into refinancing, which is impossible.’”
“‘That’s not a good situation. You are basically stuck,’ Realtor Kevin Veilleux said. Loans like this, called negative adjustable mortgage loans, were common before the hard times hit South Florida real estate.”
“‘The only way people could actually afford to live in and buy property was to do the negative adjustable mortgage,’ Veilleux said. ‘They really need to unload and get rid of those properties before we get into hurricane season.’”
The New York Times. “Barbara Sanz has never missed a mortgage payment, but the plunge in real estate is punishing condominium owners like her anyway. Four years ago, she bought her first condo in a glassy new Miami tower when the building was filling up. Now nearly one in six residents in the 43-story building is battling foreclosure and their contributions to the building association are shrinking.”
“Each of the remaining owners has had to chip in an extra $1,000 assessment and $50 more a month for cable and Internet. That is on top of Ms. Sanz’s $450 monthly maintenance fee.”
“Even though she pays more, her building has broken washers and dryers and unusable exercise equipment, and her hallway is spotted with mold. ‘It’s not fair,’ said Ms. Sanz. ‘The first two years, I enjoyed all of the benefits of living in a condo. I’m disappointed now. I hate the way the building looks.’”
From CBS 12.com. “Rampant construction has West Palm Beach going vertical. But if you look closely at all the high rise condos downtown, you may notice some are virtual ghost towns. Realtor Anthony Pizzarelli says, ‘If you see a year-old building with half the lights on, half the lights off, chances are half the building is controlled by the developer that built it.’”
“The other reason for the big void: foreclosures. The agent, who’s been dubbed ‘Mr. Downtown West Palm Beach’ says on average prices for condos are down 25 percent or more. On the high end, a Penthouse at posh ‘Esplanade Grande’ (has) got marble everything and amazing views. It was going for $2.6 million. Now the asking price is only $2 million dollars.”
“At ‘The Slade,’ a 2 bedroom place, complete with a 200 square foot balcony providing a sweeping view of the intracoastal and Palm Beach, is going for $599,000. That’s down from $770,000.”
“Perhaps the best deal of all if also up for grabs in ‘The Slade.’ If you are in the market for a 1-bedroom, with full gym access, you can get one originally purchased at $380,000, now in bank foreclosure, going for nearly half at $188,000.”
“Barbara and Paul Westhorpe snatched up one of these great deals when they bought their condo at Flagler Landing, just north of downtown West Palm Beach. Their 2 bedroom, plus den, comes with a massive balcony overlooking a marina and its own elevator entrance. It’s listed at $600,000. The Westhorpes got it for only $460,000.”
“The bottom line: Mr. Downtown says if you want a downtown address, prices could go down even more. ‘I think we have up to a 24 months buyer’s window,’ Pizzarelli says, ‘I like to refer to this as the first inning of the true buyer’s market.’”
The Sun Sentinel. “The housing crunch rages on, as more South Floridians behind on their mortgage payments are losing their homes in foreclosure sales after failing to work out deals with lenders.”
“Scheduled sales in Broward County hit 2,568 last month, more than a fivefold increase over the 426 in April 2007, according to Realestat. In Palm Beach County, there were 785 scheduled sales in April, a 370 percent increase over the 167 from a year ago.”
“‘Our expectation is that we’ll see more repossessions by the banks over the next few months,’ West Palm Beach housing analyst Brad Hunter said Wednesday. ‘It’s not a pretty sight.’”
The Naples News. “Collier Clerk of Courts Dwight Brock said his office recorded 641 foreclosure filings in April. In Lee County, there were 3,425 filings in April, up 357 percent from a year ago and 3 percent from last month.”
“Look at the documents recorded with his office, ‘which are largely comprised of mortgages,’ he said. In February, there were 10,256. In March, 12,035.”
“‘That’s a considerable jump. A 2,000-document jump,’ Brock said. ‘We may be seeing an upturn in the real estate market but it is too soon to come to any definitive conclusion. But maybe we have reached the bottom of the real estate debacle. If i didn’t see any more foreclosures, it wouldn’t be too soon.’”
“David Cole, director of business development for Amerivest Realty in Naples, thinks the numbers are higher in Southwest Florida because the real estate market ‘was so hot,’ with many people hoping to cash in on the ‘flipping’ craze by buying properties and selling them quickly at a higher price for a quick profit.”
“‘We had investors and probably a lot of them were not savvy investors,’ he said.”
“We’ve all read about foreclosures but may not have had the chance to see it up close and personal. Steve is a great guy, a smart guy, hard worker, a local business man, a great boss, father, honest, kind and now, a victim of foreclosure. Bankruptcy is not too far around the corner, either.”
“‘I never thought I would be one of those people,’ he said.”
“I visited Steve at his home and he just looked around, at the new hardwood floor he had put in just a few months ago, the new halogen lights in the ceiling and the custom marble floors. I sold him the house about three years ago.”
“According to Steve, the ‘help line’ that his mortgage company has isn’t really a help line. It is no more than a debt collection tip-off line. When he called it, they just started harassing him, not helping him. More effort was made to harass him into the next mortgage payment and track him down to serve him with the foreclosure notice.”
“Sadly, the end is near. The American dream of home ownership has turned into a nightmare. The bank will soon own a home with no toilets, fans, light fixtures, wash basins or even light switches.”
“So Steve will pack up and move out and probably take a few things that aren’t screwed down so tightly. Steve, thanks for the memories … and the chandelier.”
The Herald Tribune. “The Maggi sisters, Kathleen and Linda, are still living daily with the ramifications of their foreclosure by the former Coast Bank of Florida. Kathleen, 65, and Linda, 60, lost their North Port house last year after the interest rate on their mortgage adjusted to more than they could afford. They now rent in Port Charlotte and say their lives have gotten worse.”
“Four years ago, the sisters had a nice home and a good credit rating. Today, they are living in a cramped rental with their dogs, hounded by collection agencies for late credit card payments and health care bills.”
“‘We’re getting sued left and right,’ Kathleen Maggi said. ‘We have no idea how they are finding us, but we had a sheriff at the door just the other day.’”
“The sisters’ North Port home — built by bankrupt builder Construction Compliance Inc. and financed by Bradenton-based Coast (since bought by First Bank of St. Louis) — was repossessed about this time last year.”
“Linda Maggi does not dispute that the sisters owe money, but lenders are not interested in the small payments they can muster. ‘I pray every night that I don’t wake up in the morning,’ Linda Maggi said. ‘It’s really depressing when you wake up in the morning and have to start it all over again.’”
“Agent Sandra Israelson had bank-owned listings that included a two-bedroom one-bath home on Baldwin Avenue in Sarasota listed for $114,000 and a luxury Siesta Key penthouse in The Pointe that was going for $437,000.”
“In both cases, the bank asked that the homes be priced at a point that allowed them to sell within 30 days. Apparently, Israelson struck the right prices. She received four full-price offers for the Siesta Key penthouse within one week, and the pending sale is set to close next month.”
The Orlando Sentinel. “Orlando’s resale-home market showed a few more signs of improvement last month, though even the local Realtors group described the pace of change as glacial. Another decline in the median sales price, while bad news for home sellers, meant properties were more affordable in April.”
“The current inventory translates into a 22.2-month supply at the current pace of sales. That’s the eighth-biggest backlog on record.”
“Akhtar Hussain, owner of the Village Coffee Pot on Donnelly Street in Mount Dora, thinks it’s going to take ‘five to seven years’ before the Central Florida real-estate market gets back to normal. ‘They were building homes like crazy. So there’s a surplus,’ the owner of the Mount Dora business noted. Now the slowing economy is adding to the region’s housing woes.”
“Bill Loh, an aviation-industry consultant living in Oviedo, said he figures most people locally would probably do better to rent for another year, until prices show they are stable and not still headed south.”
“‘It’s like when the stock market is going down — no one wants to catch a falling knife,’ he said.”
“The Village of Imagine has fallen victim to the local and nationwide housing slump. The project’s developer is reconsidering plans to build the mixed-use complex of shops, restaurants and residential units across from the Orange County Convention Center.”
“But all that has materialized is a 315-room condominium-hotel — the recently opened Westin Imagine Orlando — surrounded by a few retention ponds and barren ground where the rest of the development would have gone.”
“The decision to put the Village of Imagine on hold has disappointed those who bought condo-hotel units in the Westin for prices ranging from $270,000 and $650,000 each. Those who have refused to close on their units because the village wasn’t built have been told by the developer that the elimination of the village from the project did not constitute a ‘material and adverse’ change under terms of the condo-hotel sales contracts.”
“Realtor Robert Anarumo said he has seven clients with contracts for units in the Westin Imagine. While most of his buyers are closing on their purchases, they’re disappointed that the village, with its restaurants, shops and waterways, hasn’t been built.”
“‘The village is what they latched onto,’ Anarumo said. ‘It was the No. 1 differentiating factor.’”
The News Journal. “A total of 687 foreclosure-related court notices were issued to Volusia County homeowners last month, up from 548 in March and 2 1/2 times the 270 notices recorded a year ago, according to RealtyTrac.”
“In Flagler County, 230 notices were sent out last month, up slightly from 226 in March. A year ago, 78 households were put on notice.”
“Altogether, about 3,450 area households have come under a foreclosure cloud this year, estimated Larry Glinzman, spokesman for the Community Legal Services of Mid-Florida, a Daytona Beach nonprofit agency that provides free counseling.”
“‘Domestic violence is still our biggest caseload, unfortunately, but foreclosure is running a close second,’ he said.”
From WOKV.com. “The Jacksonville Area Legal Aid has started holding monthly clinics to help people avoid foreclosure and predatory lenders.”
“‘People think the crisis is over, that we’ve already bottomed out, but that’s not true,’ said Lois Ragsdale, an attorney in JALA’s Predatory Lending Unit. ‘The number of foreclosures coming down the pike is astronomical.’”
The Times Union. “The decline in existing home sales and prices in Jacksonville continued for the first quarter compared with the same time last year, the Florida Association of Realtors reported Tuesday.”
“Single-family home sales by realtors dropped 36 percent to 2,119, while condominiums decreased by 40 percent to 267 sold. Median sales prices weren’t up either, with single-family homes selling for 6 percent less at $185,300 and condominiums down 8 percent to $146,800.”
“Local analyst Ray Rodriguez said it’s largely tied to the economic slowdown.”
“‘Consumers are going to lower priced items now,’ said Rodriguez, owner of the Real Estate Strategy Center of North Florida Inc. ‘They’re not going after a dream anymore. They’re going after what they can afford.’”
‘In September 2005, Davis paid $550,000. Two months ago, the home was worth $480,000. Now, it is down to $380,000… She now owes the bank $590,000.’
Oh dear! 100k in two months ought to be enough to discourage any knife catchers out there.
in the zero sum economy some people make money and most people lose money. that’s the way it is folks. get used to it.
However, economies are NOT zero sum, one of the oldest fallacies in economic thinking.
New wants and needs are continuously created.
Yea, the PTB’s want and need your money. But we do not have a free economy. And where has our economy gone since the 70’s. deeper and deeper in debt. someone makes money and someone somewhere loses money. and this economy will only be bailed out by ww3. we are no longer viewed as humans but just as mere carbon tracks. who’s gonna miss one less carbon track?
–
“100k in two months ought to be enough to discourage any knife catchers out there.”
People are slow to catch up!
Jas
‘In September 2005, Davis paid $550,000. Two months ago, the home was worth $480,000. Now, it is down to $380,000… She now owes the bank $590,000.’
100K haircut in two months! Incredible! The Post Office is going to have to hire extra staff just to process all the jingle mail as this scene continues to play out across the nation.
Oh dear! 100k in two months ought to be enough to discourage any knife catchers out there.
There are plenty of knife catchers out there as 45% of 2007 sales are now in the foreclosure process. Now is a good or great time to buy if you want to end up in a bad financial situation!
On the high end, a Penthouse at posh ‘Esplanade Grande’ (has) got marble everything and amazing views. It was going for $2.6 million. Now the asking price is only $2 million dollars.”
“At ‘The Slade,’ a 2 bedroom place, complete with a 200 square foot balcony providing a sweeping view of the intracoastal and Palm Beach, is going for $599,000. That’s down from $770,000.”
But over the historical trend these homes are up 200% nd expect that 770K home to bottom under 300K.
‘In September 2005, Davis paid $550,000.
And, once again, I point out the problem with all these stories. She didn’t pay anything, other than closing costs, perhaps. I doubt she has any money in the house.
She has been paying LESS THAN INTEREST for 3 years.
She is living in a half-million dollar house at the price of apartment rent. She has done so for 3 years.
She got to live beyond her means for quite some time and has LOST NOTHING.
Why is this a SOB-story about all she is “losing”??
Pack your bags, honey, and head back to where you belong. You’re ruining the neighborhood.
In a recourse state she’s on the hook for any difference between the financed amount and the final sales price. She may not have PAID anything, but she PROMISED a whole lot. Just like SS and medicare, she’s got a huge current liability and no where near the revenue to make it up.
Can this recourse stuff follow an FB if they leave the country? Say for Canada?
Right ,so many of the buyers that were willing to over pay for a home were people who didn’t pay very much to get in ,and continued to pay low teaser rates while racking up negative amortization .
I continue to say that the whole game plan for so many buyers was to either refinance ,take out some money and get a new teaser rate ,or sell and get the appreciation and end up winning by not shelling out to much . This is how the people were sold on going on toxic bad loans and buying property they couldn’t afford . Come on people ,borrowers don’t buy 50 to 500% more than they can afford unless there is some game plan . You got to get into how property was sold during the frenzy .
The real fools where the banks/lenders . The lenders thought they were going to take their piece of the action with this never ending churning of property and refinancing and real estate going up would
foot the bill . I bet the lenders were really counting on all those pre-payment penalties they would earn with people flipping properties ,not to mention the hefty fees for making loan after loan while people refinanced or sold repeatedly .
Look at how in the height of the mania that people started not even bothering with financing and they just bought and double-escrowed the property . Now that is really a testimony to how short term the intent was for a long term loan .No wonder borrowers weren’t worried about putting subject to clauses on obtaining financing and qualifying with their new construction contracts they planned on flipping prior to close of escrow .
On this blog we keep talking about how dumb the borrowers where ,but if you look at it in the context of what their objectives where ,than it explains that they were really gamblers going for a investment scheme.
Why doesn’t just one journalist ask one of these FB’s about how they even qualified for a loan they can’t afford now ,and how did they planned to pay for a loan on a house they couldn’t afford and could never afford . And its not acceptable for any FB to just say they just wanted the American Dream . They were willing to go along with fraud in lending for this American Dream .How many FB’s had no intent on holding the property for more than two years anyway ,so how can it be that this was their dream house anyway .
No ,the government and self-serving parties want us to believe that these poor borrowers and their lender counterparts in this real estate bubble investment scheme need to be rescued by our tax funds .
And its not acceptable for any FB to just say they just wanted the American Dream
I just get angry when they’re quoted in the paper saying they’ve “lost their home.” With no money down and a teaser rate on a neg-am mortagage, you haven’t lost anything.
In practical terms, a lot of these houses in Florida are worth zero. I’m in Florida on business this week—when I see a development where 50% of the homes are for sale by FBs and the homes are all identical, nothing’s going to sell at any price! There are too many homes here; some will have to be boarded up or bulldozed.
“People think the crisis is over, that we’ve already bottomed out, but that’s not true,” said Lois Ragsdale, an attorney in JALA’s Predatory Lending Unit. “
Wherever would they get that idea?
That’s a good point. The media is all over the speculation problem now, but it is still going on, and the results are very predictable. All those people trying to urge buyers into this market are risking having to watch them go into foreclosure just ahead. Better watch out MSM!
‘Barbara and Paul Westhorpe snatched up one of these great deals when they bought their condo at Flagler Landing, just north of downtown West Palm Beach. Their 2 bedroom, plus den, comes with a massive balcony overlooking a marina and its own elevator entrance. It’s listed at $600,000. The Westhorpes got it for only $460,000.’
‘The bottom line: Mr. Downtown says if you want a downtown address, prices could go down even more. ‘I think we have up to a 24 months buyer’s window,’ Pizzarelli says, ‘I like to refer to this as the first inning of the true buyer’s market.’
Un freaking believable! Maybe they’ll give Mr. Downtown the chandelier on the way out.
Then we may as well wait for the 9th, yes?
RE: only $460,000.’
only…(snicker)
That’s a good point. The media is all over the speculation problem now, but it is still going on, and the results are very predictable.
I see that in the Tampa Bay area. Realtors are bragging about multiple offers and that we have hit the bottom. We are only about half way through the decline in the Tampa Bay area, but the realtors will fight you back by quoting stats from MLS or the GTAR. What they don’t show in the numbers are the failed contracts due to lack of financing or the impact of foreclosues. The herds of sheeple are falling for the “Now is a Great time to buy” and then ending up being upside down.
we hit bottom apr/may
06-07 now 08
Sooner or later they will get it right!
Do Not Resuscitate Real Estate
Actually they got it for $492,500 per the county land records.
http://oris.co.palm-beach.fl.us/or_web1/details.asp?doc_id=16522859&file_num=20070327728
Just proves how much the common psychology is that prices always go up. Okay, they might go down some but since they always go up and it’s already gone down some, we’re magically going to go back up. Damn the fundamentals!!
it’s like a bunch of blind mice navigating a staircase..
“Ouch! Hey guys, I think i found the bottom.”
“ooof! Nope.. I found it.”
“Ayeee! Wrong. I’m on the bottom.”
“Ow! nope.. Here’s the bottom.”
LOL!
“It’s not fair,’ said Ms. Sanz. ‘The first two years, I enjoyed all of the benefits of living in a condo. I’m disappointed now. I hate the way the building looks.’”
You enjoyed all the benefits…now welcome to the disadvantages. Not much better than renting, is it?
“Fair has got nothin’ to do with it……”
‘Not much better than renting, is it?’
It’s not ANY better. In fact, it’s much worse, because she can’t easily leave and go to a less moldy building.
“In fact, it’s much worse…”
When you rent at an apartment building you don’t have an association randomly changing rules as they see fit either. Condo ownership is fine for the older population who likes that kind of thing. For anyone under 55, I can’t see why you’d go that route.
People here talk about condo associations as if they are all the same. Like there’s some association bylaws book on sale at Home Depot and all the developers just buy it and adopt it for their new condo building.
There are good ones and bad ones, but just like a WHOLE LOT of other important details, most buyers ignored everything except whether there was granite and stainless steel. Probably because they never intended to live in the place more than a couple years.
Brian in Chicago,
Excellent point. The primary reason I b!tch is b/c I was in the Navy. That stand for: N-ever A-gain V-olunteer Y-ourself. I swore I’d never “join” anything again. So I went into it reluctantly to say the least. Since then, our El Presidente’ has spent about 20k out of his own pocket to do endless landscaping projects and countless improvements. He pursued the builder (sadly until he passed away) and is now going after his widow. (She was involved in the dev. too)
He makes excellent suggestions and can account for every penny. We almost always get rave reviews from all our visitors. I fear if I keep complaining at some point he is just going to say, Hey this isn’t worth it. So he motivates you to be loyal and cooperative. At $200 a month ( and looking forward to being snowbirds real, real soon ) it’s a pretty good value. Considering that covers water, sewer, garbage, ext. maint and insurance. Still… I complain.
I love my condo…oceanfront, european appliances, marble, granite and even the bold look of kohler. Of course, its a rental.
not taken for granite,
Great observation on Kohler btw. Of all the things that bugged me about the boom, clueless Stanley Johnson (not our own beloved) incessant Lending Tree commercials, the “rolling bubble” I think the Kohler marketing campaign has got to be right up there with “Suzzane researched this”!
It’s a F@CKING FAUCET O.K!?
It dispenses r-u-n-n-i-n-g water… It’s no big deal alright. Sheesh.
“bold look of Kohler”
LOL. Sometime, somewhere a marketing rep sat there and thought, “yeah, I thought of that.”
Perfect example of creating selling points that convince the masses they need something…..
DinOR…….LMAO . That faucet should add at least 100k to the price of the house and get you a invitation to the Presidents Ball. Cracks me up how some of these sales people on these TV shows are saying that a seller has to change the faucets in order to get a sale .
the bold look of kohler
If any HBB’ers visit downtown Chicago and find themselves with some time on their hands and nothing better to do, I recommend checking out the Merchandise Mart. Many many decades ago, when much of America bought their goods through catalogs, Marshall Fields built the massive Merchandise Mart so manufacturers could rent space and set up a showroom - and all the retailers and catalog sellers could then easily browse through the best of what America had to offer and choose what to sell. It was a pretty good idea, and it still serves a version of that function today.
A bunch of high-end home fixtures companies, including Kohler, have showroom space there. These places are shrines to the granite + stainless cult. Don’t get me wrong, some of the stuff is fantastic, but all of it is fantasticly overpriced. And it’s all “open” to the public, if you stay on the first two floors and don’t try to use the elevators.
There’s a train station attached to the 2nd floor and every time I walk through to get outside I look at the showrooms and think about how much money was wasted during the boom.
‘Not
muchANY better than renting, is it?’Thank you, Olympiagal…I stand corrected.
A building where condos went for 700k that had communal washer-dryers? Unreal.
No kidding.
And probably rules against installing your own washer/dryer unit in the condo.
A friend in LA had to rip up all the flowers she planted because the ass-ociation deemed that they weren’t the correct color scheme.
During the “pre-construction” phase, the laundry room probably was marketed as a socializing venue for all the beautiful people about to buy in the building.
Oh, you’re talking about the Fashion Remediation Lounge?
“‘The only way people could actually afford to live in and buy property was to do the negative adjustable mortgage,’ Veilleux said. ‘They really need to unload and get rid of those properties before we get into hurricane season.’
A Public Service REALITY News Flash…The hurricance season is here and shes called “CRASH” and this storm is going to last for years.
One of the MAJOR results from this storm’s damage is that MILLIONS of FBs are going to WISH that they were happy, safe, DEBT FREE little RENTERS
Don’t worry- FEMA and the Feds will rush in to help rebuild.
A Public Service REALITY News Flash…The hurricance season is here and shes called “CRASH” and this storm is going to last for years.
The crash storm has already hit, we are now in the eye of the storm waiting for the backend of the storm to hit and it will be rather nasty!
For those who don’t know much about hurricanes, the backend of a hurricane is much worse than the front end.
Is that because the storm coming out of the eye (beginning of the back end) is stronger than the beginning of the front end?
Similarly I would expect that the end of the front end stops more abruptly than the end of the backend.
He again, reiterates, “I never thought I would be one of those people.” This time the “those” he’s referring to is not only the people who lose their home but the “those” who start stripping out the house.
This comes after the author’s claim that “Steve” is a great guy and a hard worker. I guess it does take some elbow grease to strip plumbing fixtures from a bathroom.
“Steve”: YOU RAWK!!!!!
The ‘author’ also sold this FB the house! Sure he’s a nice hardworking guy, who probably goes to church and practices catch and release fishing, but who cares? He’s a thief! If he’s so great, give him part of the commission you UHS.
Ben, what does UHS stand for?
Enlighten us; I’m always trying to add new insults to my vocabulary.
Figured it out.
Used House Seller.
Nice one.
If I may -
Used House Salesperson
As this fiasco unwinds, their very own words reveal the sleazy and amoral underpinnings of their so-called “profession”. And they don’t even get that what they are presenting as a sympathy piece is actually grounds for criminal prosecution.
I don’t know whether to laugh or cry.
Used House Salesman, or Realtwhore if you like.
Huh. I assumed it was, “Ugly Hunk of $hit” but I guess it could be ‘used house salesman’ too.
Why didn’t the author tell us WHY Steve is being foreclosed upon? Job loss, bad loan, sickness…WHAT? It’s so annoying to only get half the story.
“Why didn’t the author tell us WHY Steve is being foreclosed upon?”
HELOC money ran out?
I’ll see your “HELOC money ran out” and raise you a “Credit cards all maxed.”
“In both cases, the bank asked that the homes be priced at a point that allowed them to sell within 30 days. Apparently, Israelson struck the right prices. She received four full-price offers for the Siesta Key penthouse within one week, and the pending sale is set to close next month.”
I wonder which bank? I think they deserve a trophy!
“They’re Not Going After A Dream Anymore In Florida”
Previously:
‘where dreams take flight,’ he said. ‘Well, pretty much they’ve flown away.
Imagine a Potemkin Village?
It’s easy if you try…
“The Village of Imagine has fallen victim to the local and nationwide housing slump. The project’s developer is reconsidering plans to build the mixed-use complex of shops, restaurants and residential units across from the Orange County Convention Center.”
“But all that has materialized is a 315-room condominium-hotel — the recently opened Westin Imagine Orlando — surrounded by a few retention ponds and barren ground where the rest of the development would have gone.”
The whole city of Orlando is a Potemkin village! The only natural resource in that part of the state is DisneyWorld. I doubt there are even anymore Orange groves to speak of?
Are you saying that because DisneyWorld is built entirely of plastic, which is made from the natural resource, oil?
So far it has been a pretty good cash cow for the WDC.
These builder developement homes give a whole new meaning to the term Florida sinkholes
Foreclosure = Short People
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NvgLkuEtkA
“According to Steve, the ‘help line’ that his mortgage company has isn’t really a help line. It is no more than a debt collection tip-off line.”
Oh that’s rich, the schadenfruede meter is pegged once again. Sounds like Steve ought to call Hank up and complain.
Steve should call Governor Crist’s office. Maybe he’ll start going after the banks and leave the insurance companies alone.
Crist almighty, how much more damage can he do?
“Crist almighty, how much more damage can he do?”
Maybe he’ll have the “People’s” mortgage company to go along with the “People’s” insurance company. The lack of any real reform is proof that politics won’t solve any of our housing related problems in this state.
I liked Crist until he called the special session to give the auto insurers their desired no-fault fraud coverage back (State Farm was strongly against it….)
Car insurance for two cars full coverage no loans was $1050 for 6 months. Dropped to $750, and now back up to $1050. He took $600 from my pocket per year to reward those toothless twits and illegals who don’t want to carry car insurance and have no incentive to do so.
I’m paying $350 for two cars, full coverage.
“Hi, this is Steve - I’m not going to pay my mortgage is that ok?
What, it’s not ok! What kind of a help line is this? Hey, whose that guy at my door with the brass knuckles?”
I hve some attack cats I can loan him (for a nice tidy fee)…
“a victim of foreclosure…I visited Steve at his home…the new hardwood floor he had put in just a few months ago, the new halogen lights in the ceiling and the custom marble floors”
Soooo…why can’t he afford his mortgage? Why is he being foreclosed on? He just put in ‘custom marble floors’, so why is he not able to make his mortgage payments? How is he a ‘victim’?
I really want to know.
Hey take it easy on Steve, would you expect him to buy non-custom marble? Maybe there would be large areas where there’s bare concrete, and other spots where there’s two slabs on top of each other?
Seriously though, wouldn’t all marble floors have to be “custom”?
“At ‘The Slade,’ a 2 bedroom place, complete with a 200 square foot balcony providing a sweeping view of the intracoastal and Palm Beach, is going for $599,000. That’s down from $770,000.”
What’s a ‘Slade’? Is that like a ‘glade’ combined with ’slate’? These stoopid developers, why can’t they stick with the less-confusing, tried and true formula: call it ‘Buttercup Meadow Farms’ or else ‘Persimmon Lake Ranch’.
Maybe it’s a tie-in with Cadillac’s “Escalade” (a.k.a. ’slade) the ultimate low brow status vehicle of the early twenty first century?
Or perhaps more appropriate - their 1984 U.S. hit “Run Runaway”. (I won’t even bother commenting - too easy)
Youch! Good pull, packman!
I have developed a revulsion for places ending in “e”: Pointe, Shoppe at , and places with no relationship to the name (”Deer Creek” that has neither deer nor creek, “Orange Blossom” where the last standing orange tree was cut down to make room for golf course long ago).
When it comes time to buy I will avoid these pretentious places.
Agree! My fav paces all have no houses at all, names like Whipsaw Flat, the Poison Strip, Alkali Gully, the Stinking Desert, and there’s even Cad’s Crotch (how it got that name I have no idea).
Oh I remember those colorful place names in Moab
My favorite: “Pucker Point”. If you’ve been there, you’d know. I took the bypass on that one
I once stopped at an interstate rest area next to Crazy Woman Gulch, but she wasn’t there.
I hiked Molly’s Nipple a couple of times, out by Birds Eye. (Utarr county)
So did I, out behind the garage in Ohio, when I was 11.
Hey, Oly, there used to be Molly’s nipple out on the Swell. They changed the name to the Wickiup to be PC. Seems Molly got around, maybe she hung with Brigham.
And yeah, I’ve been to Pucker Point. Aptly named. My fav is Thelma and Louise Pint, I mean Point (darn N key)…
The late great radio humorist Jean Shepherd coined “Shepherd’s Law” which states that every development is named after what used to be there before the surveyors showed up.
Rule of thumb - multiply the number of water-related words in the name of the development by 10 miles for their distance from navigable water. Marina Bay = 20 miles. Lighthouse Lake Lagoons = 30 miles.
I particularly loathe the “The Somethings at Some Other Name” monniker — as in “The Bearings at Crossland Estates” or “The Pines at Siesta Key”
Another annoyance is an equestrian themed name (Fairfax Hunt or Foxchase) for plain old former farmland.
Slade would be the villian on Teen Titans?
Out here in Cali, just put “Vista” and “del” along with any third Spanish word and you have a housing development name.
I’m still waiting for Burrito del Vista.
In the Steve Martin Movie LA Story
there was a hotel named Pollo del Mar
chicken of the sea
Slade:
Glam rock band during the 70’s. Just this side of New York Dolls kinda wired. All glam went to hell when Kiss became popular. I then went disco because they had better drugs back then.
Roidy
ACH,
Noddy Holder?
Git Down and Git with It!
Yes! Yes! No eyebrows, Bowie Hair, platforms (purple of course). It was fun until Kiss messed it all up.
Roidy
The tales of condo pain in Florida are just beginning. I posted in the Cali thread a couple of nights ago about a FB in the condo complex where I live who apparently is renting out their condo to four laborers from south of the border. The manager was telling me about a couple of the units here that are in foreclosure, where the condo fees aren’t being paid, yet the owners are renting the units out without the consent of the board, which is one of the rules in the covenants. What they’re doing is making a little “free” money ahead of foreclosure, by collecting what rent they can for as long as they can. I guess when you’re desperate, all rules go out the window.
This was all predicted long ago. It’s not the first time this has happened, just a larger scale.
CONDOS are the WORST “investment” when things go bad. Everyone wants out, and those that get out leave their mess behind for everyone else to clean up…..fees, repairs, legal bills, maintenance, etc.
For your particular story, I will guarantee that the illegal boarders will leave the unit in a mess, costing the lender much more than just loss of loan………..
50 cents on the dollar. That’s the return.
Shhhhh, but in the complex where I live, I’m renting without consent of the board. I shredded the HOA documents because I am not providing them with SS#, DOB, etc. Why the hell do they care as long as I pay my rent and keep the place clean, of which I do both.
I did make a mistake of talking to a guy at the pool, turns out he’s the president of the HOA. I suddenly had a phone call when he started asking which unit I lived in, etc.
“‘The only way people could actually afford to live in and buy property was to do the negative adjustable mortgage,’ Veilleux said.”
Survey says - XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
Most people could not “afford” such houses any more than I can afford the Empire State Building. They basically were allowed to move in based on the promise that they’d pay for the house after they won the lottery.
And how is the world did people ever think a Neg Am loan was actually buying a house ?
Evidently, in the accounting world it is true. I’ve seen posts here on this blog explain that mortgage companies were able to book the increase in the loan amounts from neg am loans as revenue.
“‘People think the crisis is over, that we’ve already bottomed out, but that’s not true,’ said Lois Ragsdale, an attorney in JALA’s Predatory Lending Unit. ‘The number of foreclosures coming down the pike is astronomical.’”
Yes, we ain’t seen nuttin’ yet here in FLA. I have a feeling that tsunami coming down the pike will be when we finally see real capitulation in the housing market here. There is NOTHING anyone can do about what’s coming, Ben’s post already illustrates how lenders are handling these alleged “workouts”.
” Ben’s post already illustrates how lenders are handling these alleged ‘workouts’. ”
I’ve posted it before and I’ll post it again. I don’t understand the lenders that won’t work something, anything other than foreclosure out. If it’s a short sale, great…if it’s a buyer who can pay with an adjustment, great. In the end, lenders who don’t cooperate will have trouble seeking a judgement against borrowers who tried to work out a reasonable solution. In a court of equity in a contract situation, both parties must have acted in good faith to resolve the situation. The one who didn’t will lose by default in many cases.
No, Andy. You are thinking that someone is actually in control. No one is in control. It is just automatic pilot going on here. They are doing this because there are no other directions to do anything different. This bank will need to repossess about half the houses that are under duress before they change the MO. The houses they get back will be unsaleable without $50k worth of work only to sit on the market. The bank will then wake up and not one f’ing minute before.
Roidy
ACH,
I’ve made that observation as well on our Portland blog. Let’s face facts, there isn’t going to be a lot we’ll be able to do about that but in the mean time the only thing we can “do” is refuse to buy the financials until they formulate an adult response to this issue. Any rally they enjoy without a plan is fluff and hot air.
It’s because the lenders don’t own the loans. They were securitized packaged into multimillion dollar bonds and sliced up into pieces called tranches which have different risks and rate of returns. That pits senior tranche owners (”safer” “lower risk” lower return) against jr ones - the first ones to get shafted. The loans lenders are stuck with now are because they were in mid securitization when the lights went on and everybody saw the giant hole they were about to be sucked into or the lender/securitizer was forced to take back the immediately non performing loan from the portfolio pursuant to the securitization agreement.
If the lender was actually lending their own depositors money none of this would ever have happened.
If you remember the S & L fiasco in the 80’s there’s always one (at least one) good lie or fraud that enables this transfer of risk - which what all this crisis is about, a transfer of undisclosed risk!
Although it’s fun to ridicule the FB’s, knife catchers and other idiots who thought they could buy a 500K house on a 50K salary, America has always been filled with folks like that - gamblers who would play russian roulette with 5 of 6 chambers loaded if the jackpot was big enough. It’s the lenders who gave em the gun!
I recently had an appraisal and the lender stated “no short sales” and nothing over 6 months since date of purchase. (Comparables)
I wrote back. You may choose one or the other but not both. There are no true sales in the last year and the most recent arms length transaction in this neighborhood occurred 17 months ago. How do you want your eggs?
“How do you want your eggs? ”
Scrambled please. I can tell you that of the last 10 new purchases that I’ve had come across my desk, only 1 has been a property that wasn’t distressed in one way or another (foreclosure, short sale, etc). I’m watching prices go mid-1990’s right before my eyes. How can any lender expect that those wouldn’t be used to determine market value?
RE: I wrote back. You may choose one or the other but not both. There are no true sales in the last year and the most recent arms length transaction in this neighborhood occurred 17 months ago.
I think the people overseeing the mortgage underwriting process have to be about the most ignorant on earth.
Like these morons can’t integrate available data and come to a logical conclusion.
Remarkably, we are not at the capitulation stage in this state. I think that’s because people who bought pre-bubble saved nothing and have been counting on house sale proceeds for years (perhaps the anticipated gain already has been spent), and because people who bought during the bubble are stuck in a dazed and confused funk realizing that they are not, and never were, in control of events.
In the unamazing coincidences department, I wrote here earlier that my wife and I had come very close to renting a house; the deal fell through because, according to the realtor responsible for procuring a tenant, the owner wouldn’t give us an option for a second year at the same rent. I thought at the time that it was because the owner had an ARM resetting in 2009.
Well, what do you know, the realtor now is calling me up and pushing a house he owns, for a two-year rental term, at the exact same rent we were seeking for the previous property. He can show it to me “and my lovely wife” tomorrow. Who brings us these people?
Offer him a lower price. Might just work.
Put the difference into a “moving fund” though.
Well, what do you know, the realtor now is calling me up and pushing a house he owns, for a two-year rental term, at the exact same rent we were seeking for the previous property. He can show it to me “and my lovely wife” tomorrow. Who brings us these people?’
Well, I asked Sweet Baby Jeebus about it and He says He had nothing to do with it, He didn’t create ‘em, that it was either Satan or else that Charles Darwin jerk who is also more or less responsible for those incredibly creepy little Surinam toad creatures. We both agreed that those were a big mistake on somebody’s part, as are realtors.
In a related thought, ‘Surinam toads vs. Realtors’, man, I would pay lots of money to see that battle! Think of all the screams!
And so how is “your dear wife”? LOL, did the Realtor actually say that?
Roidy
Well, what do you know, the realtor now is calling me up and pushing a house he owns, for a two-year rental term, at the exact same rent we were seeking for the previous property.
Ice the realtor by not returning their call, then after a few weeks, do what TXchick suggested or low ball further. In the meantime, look at other rentals and let the realtor know you are looking as a result of their failure to work with you in the beginning.
Stupid mistake on the over confident realtor!
What is being reported is that more foreclosures are found with on only concrete in main pipes but flood damages and copper wires completely removed and some structural lumber left ajar. These are homes built within 2005 to 2007.
How do you leave lumber ajar?
How do you leave lumber ajar? Mention it in your will.
In September 2005, Davis paid $550,000. Two months ago, the home was worth $480,000. Now, it is down to $380,000. Even worse, Davis falls farther behind every month. Because she got a risky ‘negative equity’ loan, her monthly payment of $2,850 isn’t even enough to cover the monthly interest of $4,550. She now owes the bank $590,000.”
“‘There’s nothing I can do,’ she said. ‘I am losing $1,700 a month. I am just going backward. I looked into refinancing, which is impossible.’”
Anyone else find Ms. Davis’s perspective really odd? She focuses on the 1700 a month in negam, which seems more like money she is gaining (paying less interest than she owes). But she ignores the true loss of $6,000 per month in depreciation on her poor investment.
“’Consumers are going to lower priced items now,’ said Rodriguez, owner of the Real Estate Strategy Center of North Florida Inc. ‘They’re not going after a dream anymore. They’re going after what they can afford.’”
If the typical household now buys only what it can afford then we in the USA are in for a nasty economic downturn (job losses in services, retailing, and distribution channels). East Asia will be hurt also (consumer goods exports) but not as badly, which may explain the drop in stock prices in Japan, Korea, China, etc.
…a nasty economic downturn
Although it will hurt everyone, it’s serves the dumb part of America right for allowing their good RE agent friends and NAR to decide “How much house you CAN afford” in the first place:)
The “Dream” is nothing but marketing- my dream is to get out of debt, live within my means, save money, live comfortably, etc. Why does the dream need to be a bloated 3000 sq ft house? I’d be happy with an 1800-2000 sq foot house with some nice touches.
For me, 1300-1600 sq ft plus a tool shed and carport/garage is enough. Also, a wooded or small lot (less grounds maintenance) would be nice. I’ll get one, all cash, in either 2010 or 2012.
Same here. I’m paying off everything I can as quickly as I can. I do NOT want a large house and expensive vehicles or anything that requires a loan. I hope to save for a couple years and buy a house cash.
Someone stop me before I get in my car and run over the first RealtorTM that I see! Look at this list of “items” in the “Steve” column, especially the last one! Even though this Steve guy is losing his shirt, the idiot is already trying to sell him another house!
If you are a homeowner and you’re not sleeping well because foreclosure is looming, know this:
• Not everyone who loses their home has a sub-prime loan.
• You don’t have to be a deadbeat to lose your home.
• Losing your home doesn’t make you a deadbeat.
• Most families are only a few paychecks away from the danger of foreclosure.
• Your real estate agent still cares and will help you buy another home down the road.
It’s amazing how many people get confused with that last one. I know several people whose ‘friends’ are their realtors. The realtors do everything to stay close to these people - loaning out the use of a condo in a vacation spot, going out for a beer (or martini) and of course bringing up the occasional “Hey, I found a really great place you might want to have a look at. You can sell your home now and move up. It’s a great time to buy.”
The realtors stay close and friendly because they see a future sale. Or maybe it’s because they want to have sex…, but either way you’re f***ed.
I guess those people haven’t learned the difference between friends and sociopaths.
I have a cousin who thinks she is a big time RE agent and her twin sister told my Mom that she refers to me me as the Great Satan because of my sometimes outspoken views of the current real estate market. (I love it)
I am tempted to send her a message via the family grapevine that I am not Satan, that Ben is the real little devil and I’m merely one of his minor loyal disciples
laughing boy,
THAT’S exactly what’s so wrong… w/ NAR! They don’t even know what an “arm’s length relationship” IS!! Securities reps have a limit on the $ amount of “gifts” they can give clients. I think it’s 150 bucks per year? Well if comparable dwellings were renting for $150 a night and you let your “friends” stay for the weekend in your condo, you just broke the law.
I know a lot of people think enforcement there is flimsy at best but most reps know that push came to shove and something wound up in arbitration and this came up..? They’d have the option of either dropping a lesser charge and pursuing this or simply adding it to the existing complaint. Either way, nothing good can come of it.
With NAR it’s expected.
I met a realtor(TM) at a bar. She was cute, and after spewing NAR talking points for two hours, she invited me over. She immediately lit up a bowl and started getting frisky. I left but should have stayed and got some ‘bedtime revenge’ for all of you guys.
They’re not called realtwhores for nuthin’. Back in the late 70’s/early 80’s in Denver I was broker manager for a larger C21 office as well as an intructor at a pre-licensing school. Discovered real quick that the gals had a great predisposition for infidelity and “erotic adventurism” The annual C21 convention in Las Vegas was always an Olympic event. Today at 63, I have a great many fond memories. I guess things haven’t changed much over the last 30 years. Like I always say however, ” Every one you pass up is one you’ll be behind for the rest of your life.”
Oh no. Don’t do it. Please. Stop. You’ll just regre… sorry, couldn’t type it out fully without smiling.
On a somewhat related tangent, does anyone remember the movie Superman II with Christopher Reeve? There was a scene where the villains were about to toss a bus full of people and Superman kind of has this smile while shouting, “No! Don’t do it!”
In three years on this blog, I think that NYT article is the most damning I’ve ever read on condos. Whether you love or hate the NYT, you have the most influential paper in the world pretty much saying you’d have to be nuts to buy a condo in a new building right now. You are completely at the mercy of speculators, dreamers, liers, cheaters, banks with huge losses, and bankrupt developers to pay their condo fees. Most have no incentive to do so. You can’t go get running water and electricity, or even cable and internet access, on you own. The local lawn maintenance guys and their extended families are moving into rentals all around you. You are screwed.
Absolutely. At least it isn’t a co-op with much higher fees and a a common mortgage. In reality, condos are little worse off that private developers of single family homes which have water, sewer, road maintenance, security guard to cover.
At this point, no matter how low prices go, you can’t buy one condo unit. You have to be able to buy the entire building, so as not to be victimized by the condo dues deadbeats. Or at least buy more than half, control the board, kick the deadbeats out (especially the developer), and turn it into a rental.
I live in an older neighborhood in Florida with an association, and no collection or budget issues that I know of. Even if we did, water, sewer, electricity, garbage, lawn and home maintenance, etc. are all paid by each homeowner for their homes only. We have some common areas, but no clubhouse or community pool. If 1/2 my neighbors stopped paying their dues, mine might go up $20/month. Contrast that with condo people, who might have to pay $500 more a month to cover their deadbeat neighbors, or go without A/C and showers to prove their point. It would drive me nuts.
Co-ops might be a lesser risk because the current owners through the board approve the purchaser unlike a condo whee anyone can buy and sell the unit.
I knew this thing would be ugly and drawn out but jeeesshhh….this is Medussa.
JALA Bait
“‘People think the crisis is over, that we’ve already bottomed out, but that’s not true,’ said Lois Ragsdale, an attorney in JALA’s Predatory Lending Unit. ‘The number of foreclosures coming down the pike is astronomical.’”
Their 2 bedroom, plus den, comes with a massive balcony overlooking a marina and its own elevator entrance. It’s listed at $600,000. The Westhorpes got it for ONLY $460,000.”
“You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.” Inigo Montoya, Princess Bride
My Predictions for the FL market: do people remember prices in the late 90s? Beach front condos could be had in South Florida for under a $100k. Billboards along I-4 advertised starter homes from the $80k s. In Orlando, you could buy a condo for well under $50k or in Cocoa Beach a 3/2 house a block off the ocean for less than $100k. I think we may head that direction. If you think about it, there was a healthy demand for homes in FL at that time, people were moving in for jobs, yet the market stayed reasonably priced. With a huge overhang of inventory, tightened lending, and more stringent insurance requirements, prices may need to return to pre-2000 prices to become affordable again.
I remember looking at a Condo in Ft. Lauderdale on the inter-coastal in 1993 2bd. 2ba. for $69,000.00
do people remember prices in the late 90s?
Yes, I do.
And I agree with you.
It’s amazing just how few people do remember those prices.
I do remember those prices.
Most people have managed to forget.
“‘The only way people could actually afford to live in and buy property was to do the negative adjustable mortgage,’ Veilleux said. ‘They really need to unload and get rid of those properties before we get into hurricane season.’
I don’t know… seems like a massive hurricane could be a godsend. Wouldn’t insurance pay up if your house was destroyed, damaged? If so, I can see people “prepping their houses” for the coming storm - instead of nailing plywood over the windows, they’re inside pulling out nails, studs and supports, loosening that roof a little, maybe leave all the windows open… hmmm… hurricane season could get real interesting.
Speaking of that- how will the insurance work in a declining market? Is it like car insurance where replacement value will be paid? Say a home with a $400k mortgage balance is wiped out, but the market value is only $220k, how much will be paid out?
Depends on the policy. Mine uses the Case Shiller index to determine value, but it’s stated on the policy renewal every year. I don’t know if it changes during the year.
I know someone if FL who has a 2% deductible on her homeowner’s insurance. That’s 2% of the value of her home. She told me it was the only policy she could get when she moved there. I wonder where the “value” comes from?
That 2% is spelled out as a basis for estimates given by the state of Florida in its Website that compares insurance premiums by company and by county. I don’t think it says that 2% is non-negotiable, but in the current state of play I wouldn’t be surprised. Lowering the deductible most likely would be prohibitively expensive - timely evaluation of hurricane damage to a house is way different from damage assessment of a wrecked car. I’d take the 2% and run. The premiums, however, vary greatly among companies, as in more than 100% from lowest to most expensive for supposedly the exact same coverage. Much of that presumably reflects the odds of your getting paid.
got a questionaire trying to nail me for any improvements….
Insurance pays only the cost to rebuild and the mortgagee gets first claim on the proceeds (lender decides whether you payoff the loan or rebuild). If, however, you own your house free and clear, and the market value of the structure is less than replacement cost, then it may make sense to keep the proceeds and have the lot scraped. You’ll be left with cash and a buildable lot. Sell the lot for whatever you can get then start over someplace else, in a rental of course. Such strategy also makes sense if you expect the FMV of your property to decline further.
soon everyone here will have a mort w no home
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080515/ap_on_go_co/congress_housing
blast them
“Village of Imagine” is 2008’s winner in the you-can’t-make-this-stuff-up department, and might just retire the trophy.
All over America 2001-2005, delusional buyers were snapping up real estate in their own personal “villages of imagine” but I had no idea any of them were actually named as such.
Wonder what it costs to rent a U-Haul for the move from the Village of Imagine to the Town of Thinking….
Imagine-nation
‘Wonder what it costs to rent a U-Haul for the move from the Village of Imagine to the Town of Thinking….’
Hahahaha! Funny!
And a plus would be that the Town of Thinking would be such a nice small town, too. You’d know all your neighbors! All 50 of them, that is.
And all 50 would be HBB-ers.
I’m holding out for an SFR in the Borough of Productive Cogitation.
El Pueblito que Imaginas:
http://playabocana.com.mx/index1.html
Looks nice.
Paul - I was in Huatulco in October. Very nice, sleepy place just waking up to development. Apparently the Mexican govt intends for it to be the next Cabo - they have a decent pier for such a small burg. If I were thirty years younger, I wouldn’t hesitate to buy some land there, assuming it could be just outside the land trust zone but close to “town.” In its own way, it reminds me of Kissimmee a few years before Disney came to town.
“Linda Maggi does not dispute that the sisters owe money, but lenders are not interested in the small payments they can muster. ‘I pray every night that I don’t wake up in the morning,’ Linda Maggi said. ‘It’s really depressing when you wake up in the morning and have to start it all over again.’”
If you look back to the 1926 housing boom to bust in Florida, you will find many cases of people who commited suicide. One sad story is about Hemmingways father, a doctor who lost a large amount of money in the bust and commited suicide.
I doubt money was the cause. Suicide runs in that family. Both Hemingway and his granddaughter killed themselves.
Actually it was due to financial issues as he (Hemmingways father) lost loads of money in the 1926 housing boom to bust per the history on Hemmingway) You can find the article on his death on the internet. No prior history of suicide prior to Hemmingways father in the family.
By the way Skip, most suicides do not run in the family. Most are done in despiration due to financial reasons or someone facing lengthy jail time or a divorce. I investigated many in a former career.
“Ernest Hemingway was born inn Oak Park, Illinois. His mother Grace Hall, whom he never forgave for dressing him as a little girl in his youth, had an operatic career before marrying Dr. Clarence Edmonds Hemingway; he taught his son to love out-door life. Hemingway’s father took his own life in 1928 after losing his healt to diabetes and his money in the Florida real-estate bubble.”
There might well be a gene linked to suicidal tendencies. Ernest Hemingway was long known for quipping that all (male) Hemingways before him had either shot themselves or had it done for them. He made no secret of the great likelihood that eventually he would do himself in. I think it’s generally agreed that despite his notorious mood swings, the greatest motivator was that he believed he had written the best that he could possibly write and therefore felt “spent.” At least he wrung out of life everything there was to get, while he was around. He’s my favorite author, in large part because his fiction was always based on his experiences - when he described a battle, for example, he had been in the middle of one very similar.
None of his three sons did themselves in, to my knowledge.
Despite the housing carnage all around, some never notice it, or never consider that it might present some larger problem, especially government workers. The first they hear that things are a little different is when they find out in their teachers’ meeting that wages are frozen and there will be some cuts in hiring this year. I deduced this remarkable piece of intelligence last night from a conversation with an elementary school teacher.
here gov wages and employment has grown at a multiple of pop/inflation
dept of womens affairs - not shttin you
Just finished a few days’ stay in the area south of Jacksonville and north of St. Augustine. I saw a now-familiar pattern, similar to what we have in the Orlando area, if not more pronounced. In every neighborhood or section that was built during the 2003-2005 peak of bubble construction, there are for sale signs everywhere.
The downside risk of buying one of these foreclosures might also becomes familiar - what if too many properties go under and are abandoned or sold at foreclosure prices?
So how DID you like the golf tournament?
Paul - LOL - didn’t play, actually. Went to visit some old friends there. It looks like a great area for golfers, though. What surprised me most, given that I’m a cracker Floridian, is I didn’t know that part of St. John County is included in the definition of Jacksonville, at least for mail purposes.
Here is a classic, this house is in Ibis Golf and Country Club off Northlake BLVD
9012 Sand Pine Lane
West Palm Beach, FL 33412
3 Bedrooms
2 Full Baths
0 Half Baths
2.0 Garage
1774 sqft living
MLS# R2890557
Listed Price $225,000
Purchased 12/06 $370,000
““The sisters’ North Port home — built by bankrupt builder Construction Compliance Inc. and financed by Bradenton-based Coast (since bought by First Bank of St. Louis) — was repossessed about this time last year.””
Bankrupt people kicked out of a home built by a bankrupt builder and financed by a bankrupt lender……I’m speechless!
Saw this whilst skimming the local Craigslist…
http://housingbath.com/
Interesting site - thanks.
Steve is a great guy, you know, because great guys default with custom marble floors.
EAT IT STEVE.