HBB On The Road, Thread Two
AS the road tour has been extended through tomorrow, and the first OTR thread is kind of full, I’ll keep posting observations in this posts comments.
The Housing Bubble
Examining the home price boom and its effect on owners, lenders, regulators, realtors and the economy as a whole.
About Me
Name:Ben Jones
Location:Northern Arizona, United States
To donate by mail, or to otherwise contact this blogger, please send emails to: thehousingbubble@gmail.com
PayPal is a secure online payment method which accepts ALL major credit cards.
Links
-
August 2025 M T W T F S S « Sep 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31
Photo Submission: hbbphotos@gmail.com
View the HBB Photo Gallery *updated 4/13/2008
Lots of good people at the SF meetup last night, with many stories familiar from the first two; peer pressure to buy, etc. There did seem to be a frustration level that was a little higher here. Perhaps due to less of a price decline so far. But more stemmed from owner arrogance these folk were facing.
This gets to the SoCal perception of attitudes here versus what I saw. I was told this was a much more laid back populace. But it looks hyper busy and a little more stressed out than what I saw in San Diego and even Pasadena. The activity takes place at pace despite occurring simultaneous with cops busting homeless guys, sirens all the time.The service workers seem much less trusting and guarded. I also hear more yelling and such than my previous stops.
The housing itself is pretty cool. Older Victorian row-type places that go from funky to funkier. I suppose one can buy into what ever level of that one can afford or choose. One thing to note; there is a lot more of this DT SF housing than I ever imagined. I rode around some last night and it goes for miles in every direction.
Getting around on foot isn’t very easy either. The roads are wide and not very many crosswalk buttons are available. In other words, it’s pedestrian beware.
Good morning, Ben!
Just a short note from me and then back to work I go. I wanted to, again, tell you what a pleasure it was to meet you in person. You are really a sweet, cool and super-friendly guy. A little on the shy side, but I got my hug. LOL! (Ben’s better looking in person than the interview articles you may have seen.
)
So sorry I missed the others, though, since I arrived so late.
But perhaps when (if) Big V gets in the groove to pull us all together again (maybe later in the year?), I will be able to meet those who I missed the next time around.
I’ve never visited Arizona, but if I make to Flagstaff, I’ll be sure to let you know. Wishing you a safe trip back home.
BayQT~
I think that I echo BayQT’s sentiment that the Cali tour feels like a warmup. We need more get-togethers. I have a feeling that once the photo galleries are up, many posters will be bummed they missed out, and next time there will be a much greater turnout.
I am up for a late Febuary early March 09 trip to Arizona…Maybe with the slipping economy the room rates will not be to bad although air travel is now much more costly…
Slim hereby invites you and anyone else to a Tucson meetup. I know all sorts of good eating and drinking places in the central part of our fair city. All you have to do is bring yourselves and supply your usual online wit.
Guadalajara Cafe and The Kon Tiki are my favs in Tucson.
I collected a list of emails from people last night and am looking to coordinate get togethers every so often for us Bay Area bloggers. Anyone who would like to be included on the list can send an email to bayareabubble@gmail.com. I had a great time last night and look forward to seeing everyone again! It was great to finally meet Ben!! He is a WONDERFUL person and much better looking in person than on TV and in articles!
EastBay,
What time did you and your husband get home?
It was great meeting you.
How would you feel if told that you are better looking than your pictures? Puleeze…what a crappy comment, imho.
how would I feel about being told I look better than my pics? I’m ok with it. better than OK, in fact, because I’d rather be told I’m better looking than worse looking in person.
I’d be okay with it, too. In photos my mouth is usually open. Although, come to think of it, in real life my mouth is also usually open. Dangit, now I’m conflicted.
People who get vicariously offended are funny.
Well. you have to see my pics! I can count the decent photos in my life on one hand. I guess it has something to do with my scot/irish parents, and also the fact that I spent the winter at 7000 feet shoveling snow and blogging. Anyhoo, how often do I get a compliment from some Bay Area women? Woohoo!
Whooooooooooooooooooooooooohooooooooooooooo!!
No photographs!
I look hoooooorrible…
Maybe it has something to do with “capturing the soul” thingy.
Cute you are - al natural.
Best,
Leigh
P.S. The ladies and gentlemen say what a humble and handsome one you are!
Hey, ladies often say I look ugly in photos and just as ungly in real life. There is no reason for Ben not to be thankful of any nice comments.
I have to agree with Ben’s perceptions - SoCal is much more laid back than SF. Perhaps this is due to the financial center, Tech Mania, and the NY style influence? La has a much more beach-vibe.
Just my opinions, anyone else care to offer theirs?
I would agree…many people around here have their britches in a wad most of te time….One of the downside’s about living here…
yes–I’ve lived in SF (in the city) and in the LA area (Aliso Viejo, near Laguna Beach). SF is proud of its “real city” status and that attitude makes itself known in many ways.
Most definitely. SF is a densly packed metropololis, whereas SD is more of a financially secure beach town, while LA is somewhere in between. SF grates on one’s nerves after a while; I guess that’s why we saw so many kids at the bar last night (whom I mostly scared).
LOL! Like the guy across the table from you, V. That was funny.
BayQT~
You’ve got to fill us in on that…
Did you scare HBBer’s kids or some young punks hanging out in the bar? What sort of nefarious things were you up to last night?
Also…
We (in SD) were talking about a Las Vegas get-together for ALL the HBBers — including our international friends. Maybe October?
We need to find out what the interest level would be, and what people would be willing to spend, maybe making this a “family” vacation/multi-day thing to justify the expense.
Thinking party suite(s) that we could use for excellent debate 24/7, and people could come and go as they please.
Oh, I just got a little loose with the tongue is all and I said something really crude to this guy who brought his girlfriend there while she was away for a moment. I shouldn’t have done it. I felt guilty. Oh well, the two of them took a powder after about 5 minutes to make it look like they weren’t leaving just because of me.
Were they HBBers?
No, they were just random kids.
Absolutely true.
I lived there for 20 years. The Bay Areans are totally stressed out. I think it’s their total perfection that does it.
Just ask anyone how much better they are that anyone else.
I only lasted 1 year in NoCal and scampered back to SoCal. For me it seemed much too uptight in NoCal. Folks were downright rude in some instances. One time I took my wife and 6 month old to TX. Flew out of SFO and the difference between the two was remarkable. Folks in TX were a zillion times nicer and helpful. Folks in SF knocked me over trying to get on the parking shuttle as I struggled with the bags to get off. I also noticed that in Santa Cruz it was the first time in my life anywhere in the US where grocery shelves were empty of essentials like milk and bread. I knew NoCal was left leaning, but I felt like I was in Vladivostok seeing that.
It was definitely an interesting night. The most entertaining thing was that I found out Moleman lives a few blocks from me. Our back yards face onto the same water easement. We spent some time abusing the neighborhood jerks.
Ben was certainly a nice guy. It was a pleasure to meet him. And it was great getting to put faces to posts.
I loved those Victorian flats in SF. They were warm and inviting with wood floors and true, big bay windows where you could just hang out and watch the street scene. Those places must be hell to maintain though.
They’re building these faux SF style apartments in Missoula (!) with the false-front look and fakey bay windows that are actually shared corners of the kitchen. So the sink is in the corner…weird. Plus they tack on little balcony-decks which you don’t have in the SF housing except maybe by the back stairs.
“The housing itself is pretty cool. Older Victorian row-type places that go from funky to funkier.”
It’s, …. uh, ‘different’ there.
Howdy Ben, great to finally meet you and many other regulars in person. Too bad it wasn’t a weekend, or I bet turnout would’ve been 3X as high. Look forward to your next visit.
I can vouch for bubble-sitter frustration –especially in the “Fortress” areas: SF proper, Marin, Atherton, Palo Alto, etc. The drop is far more dramatic and rapid in the exurbs/suburbs and central valley, as to be expected. The peninsula never had the extreme overbuild as happened in places like Sacramento, Stockton, Modesto, Fresno, Antioch, Pittsburgh, Vallejo, etc. Partly a combination of being fully built-out, mixed with extreme local NIMBYism. Nonetheless, up to 70% of Bay Aryans bought with option-ARMs from 2004-2006, so no way will these areas remain immune forever.
How long does it take for an option ARM to reset? 2-5 years, right?
Too bad it wasn’t a weekend ??
I emailed Ben and told him thats why I could not show up…Next time…
Ben, for what it’s worth after living in So Cal for seven years (and owing there) we returned to the Bay Area/San Mateo Coast. We really missed the tolerance factor here in the Bay Area as well as the innovation and initiative. In So Cal (save for a few places in LA proper) all they do is ride the next wave in on some copy cat company and pay crappy wages to boot. So yeah while I think it’s more laid back in So Cal it’s just not very exciting. Damn even AZ has more going on than OC and south (and the wages are better which is why my son moved there from O’side). I felt sometimes like it was big giant retirement community.
Glad to be back though and I could give a rat’s ass about the ‘pressure’ to buy. We heard that crap about buying when we returned in Nov. 2005 and well damn it…. I WAS RIGHT about waiting and NOW I’m getting the respect from the naysayers (even though they’re pissed about it HAHAHA). I STILL won’t pay 500K for a crappy 3bd/2ba house built in 1963 with single pane windows, no insulation and in need of major renovations….and there are tons of them over here. I’ll keep paying my 1165/mo (all inclusive) for the little flat 2 blocks from the ocean and be patient. No hurry here. Too bad you couldn’t find the time for a drive along the central coast of CA. You REALLY missed out my friend.
What IIIIIII want to know is when Ben is coming up to the fabulous PNW.
Me too
greetings from PDX.
Well I wasn’t asked (before)!
Lots of signs for you to peruse whilst touring Oswego Lake.
Silicon Valley is very fast-paced. When I moved to Oregon in 1994 in search of affordable housing, I was surprised by the lack of urgency in the businesses I worked in - still am, to some extent, though I’ve been here nearly 15 years.
SF has great public transit, but if you’re a ped, count to three after the light changes, or get smooshed. I believe red-light cameras got their start in The City That Knows How.
I thought you were from this area. Seattle?
Or is that just what you tell everyone?
I have to agree with Ben’s perceptions - SoCal is much more laid back than SF. Perhaps this is due to the financial center, Tech Mania, and the NY style influence? La has a much more beach-vibe.
Just my opinions, anyone else care to offer theirs?
What the hell? Both times I was trying to respond to Ben’s original post and I got duplicate postings (I thought word press checks for existing strings???), and both are seperate threads.
Hmmmm, maybe I need more coffee.
I’m from Sacramento and have spent most of my time in either NorCal or SoCal. For the last 13 years, I have been in San Diego and mostly OC. I think San Diego is the most laid back place in SoCal. I generally prefer NorCal to SoCal.
The coastal cities are very different from inland cities. By their nature, inland cities are more laid back or what some people refer to as boring. Sacramento is much more laid back than the Bay Area.
Growing up, it seemed that the Bay Area was more relaxed than the coastal cities down south. But since the dot.com boom, I think that it has reversed. The quality of life is better down here than up north because it is more relaxed. I hear the waits for anything is bad in the Bay Area because so many people have been priced out of the housing market because of the bubble. They can’t find any good help. The infrastructure seems better down here because there is some more room to build as well. Yeah, there is more sprawl down here but it seems more crowded in the Bay Area.
that’s my impression too. I lived in SD and LA area and spent a fair amount of time in SF and Sacramento. San Diego is by far the most casual and laid back. I would rate SD as the no. 1 place to live in California.
I would agree.
what, O’gal hasn’t shown up to bash SD yet?
Look below.
Hahaha!
I can’t WAIT for a mass exodus from SD, though! Hopefully enough people will be financially ruined and will have to get out. I’ve always said this about San Diego: “It will chew you up and spit you out finance-wise”. (If you’re not smart with your money :))
To hot for me…I am a wimp
No, No, don’t say it!!! It’s, um, Laguna Beach, yeah, that’s it! That’s #1, not San Diego, repeat, not San Diego.
I’ve traveled all over California and live in Norcal. I concur that the SF Bay Area is pretty tight. I think part of this is due to the business atmosphere, which some compare to the original boom that happened 150 years ago: the gold rush. The job market is still fairly robust, wages are also higher, and the goal of many people is to make it big, and do it fast.
The higher wages are what adds to this frustration.Sure- the data shows that the avg income is maybe 55-60k. But the undeniable truth is that there are MANY people that make a lot of money. When I arrived here from TN, I was amazed at just how many people were driving BMWs , Mercedes, and so on. Not just BMW’s, but the nicest, fully loaded, most custom-built models. That and there are loads and loads of Porsches, Mazaratis, and the occasional Bentley. Back home, you were lucky if you saw a new Beetle or an older BMW. So there are significant amounts of people making big bucks on top of all the tech workers making their 100k salaries. 100k is A LOT of dough, yet when people here look at how much it costs to buy even a smaller home, the facts are discouraging. It makes no logical sense that such a large income wouldn’t suffice, or afford anything halfway decent. Yet that is the reality for most remotely desireable areas here. So people are frustrated because they are seemingly successful, yet they cannot obtain what their incomes ’should’ afford them. People like the effort=reward equation, and in the BA, that game doesn’t work as well.
Add to the fact that even if you were to buy, many of the basic community aspects here are broken, such as the schools, roads, and other publicly funded items.
In short, I actually like places like Sacramento - those ” boring” places better than the BA. I feel that in LA, at least people are somewhat resigned to the fact that getting rich in the movies is highly unlikely. But perhaps they can be a makeup artist. In the BA, everyone assumes that they will eventually strike it rich in some sort of venture, and this creates a charged, competitive atmosphere.
“When I arrived here from TN, I was amazed at just how many people were driving BMWs , Mercedes, and so on. Not just BMW’s, but the nicest, fully loaded, most custom-built models. That and there are loads and loads of Porsches, Mazaratis, and the occasional Bentley. ”
With the exception of the few Bentleys and Maseratis, methinks that a lot of these people may have you fooled. Let’s not forget that many people work those credit cards like there’s no tomorrow, and those that qualify can also get a car loan. And then ( at least in the last 6 or 7 years) there’s the almighty HELOC.
I’ll have to admit, back in the day, I drove a 1971 BMW 2002 model…bought it from a private owner in 1976 for like $3000 cash or something like that (my memory is fading on the exact cost). Nothing fancy at all.
Since I’ve realized that it’s really easy for people to “fake the funk”, i.e., pretend they are wealthy but are not, people with such toys don’t impress me anymore.
I doubt that a lot of the folks you mention hold the pink slip to those vehicles.
Not trying to appear all-knowing, my friend. Just opening up the aperture a little wider.
BayQT~
I think it depends on where you are and in what circles you run.
From what I’ve seen on the tech side, you 1) are either plugging along, struggling to figure out how to buy what you want, or 2) you’ve made a big hit, put a million in the bank, and now have the down payment for the nice place and can plug along happily tinkering as an engineer in whatever startup wants to hire you next.
And then there are the serial entrepreneurs and VCs who have $ to spare.
Finding service workers is the ball buster though. That makes running hotels, etc. very difficult.
With respect to nice cars, there is another aspect that skews perception. That is the nice cars are concentrated in the hands of a few. I know of many people with the high end cars, and they have well more than one. The same person could own a Ferrari, Bentley, Aston Martin, etc. So, if you frequent the same neighborhood, and one day you see a Bentley, the next an Aston Martin, and the following day a Ferrari. Your gut feel is that it’s three rich guys. It’s really just one REALLY rich guy.
Yeah, that whole luxury car thing is BS. All the really rich people I know (at work, of course) just drive regular cars. It’s the technicians that drive around in sports cars and commute from BFE.
It’s the technicians that drive around in sports cars and commute from BFE.
Cars are a HOBBY and have little to do with income. I live next door to Carmel-by-the-Sea and most of the cars in that town are just average. There are plenty of pick-up trucks and 20 year old grampa cars in the mix.
On the other hand, Reggie Jackson keeps an entire warehouse of collector cars in Seaside. Every August the billionaires fly in to watch races at Laguna Seca, trade million dollar cars, and dress up at Pebble Beach. Every September the locals bring their project cars out for another show (mostly $10K to $50K cars).
Someone into cars might spend $5K, $25K, $50K, or $1,000,000 to be entertained…the amount of wealth only determines which cars one can afford.
RE: When I arrived here from TN, I was amazed at just how many people were driving BMWs , Mercedes, and so on. Not just BMW’s, but the nicest, fully loaded, most custom-built models. That and there are loads and loads of Porsches, Mazaratis, and the occasional Bentley. Back home, you were lucky if you saw a new Beetle or an older BMW.
The big spurge in leasing creates a misleading impression people are doin’ better than they really are.
You should poll these high rollers and see if they own the wheels via cash money, or a monthy payment that covers the title after 72 or fewer months.
SF is far more East Coast and per capita better educated than LA. (People in San Francisco actually support their opera. In LA, it’s just done for show.) However, like Manhattan, SF lacks the sense of humor, the wacky creativity, and the outdoor/sunshine groovy-body beachy thing that is LA. San Fran has nicer clothing, but LA has far better plastic surgery and more way cool cars. Also, what sort of celebrities live in San Francisco? Nancy Pelosi? Jerry Brown? Really. Boooooorrrrriiiiiinnnnnnggggg.
SF is more socially entrenched and old line (read: snobishe) than Low Sangless–which has such a high resident turn-over from folks trying to make it in “Hollywood,” that try as it may, it simply cannot take itself all that seriously. I’m fourth generation Angeleno, which makes me something of an inbred freak. Yet in fourth generation SF that isn’t even hoi polloi.
Don’t underestimate the influence of the film industry in LA either. People tend to smile alot more here because you never know who might see you on the street, in a restaurant, and who cast you in their flick at any given moment. In San Francisco, the chances are you’re not going to get hired off the street to work in a brokerage house.
And while San Francisco is downright wanton, decadent, even, Los Angeles just enjoys its little cheap meaningless affairs…and tends to pass them around. Not nearly so portentious–in any way. It’s a matter of approach and taste.
Lots more options in LA>
The Run To The Far Side is not wacky creativity? The Love Parade is not wacky creativity? The monthly critical mass rides are not wacky creativity? The Sisters of Perpetual Indulgence is not wacky creativity?
The main stereotype that particularly northern californians get wrong is that those in SoCal, like LA or wherever, are more marterialistic. Having lived in both places for years, that is soooooo the opposite of what is actually true.
I’ve never heard that those in the Bay Area are more laid back but, in a similar vein, that’s not true either. San Diego can be a bit stuck up, but not like the bay area. LA is the place to party.
remember, Ben, if you drop your keys, kick them to Oakland!
not that there’s anything WRONG with that…
“kick them to Oakland . .. “. oyyyye !
also very glad to see no one made the comment ” Ben, you can’t say that San Diego/Pasadena/San Francsco doesn’t love you “.
with our nice humble Ben replying ” thats obvious ” . . . .
SoCal is laid back. Sacramento is boring.
I think people’s perceptions of SF go back about 30 years, when it was much more laid back. We had corporate headquarters, but they were a small part of the city. Lots of people–myself among them–got by on part-time work and spent time on politics and art. Now as the corporate centers relocate to SoCal and the East Coast, it’s much more business-oriented. Rents used to be high–now they’re outrageous. A lot people have moved out–either to Portland or Seattle–or to Austin. (Yes, there are a lot of SF “ex-pats” in Texas.)
(Yes, there are a lot of SF “ex-pats” in Texas.)
And we wish they would all go back sometimes…..
Sorry to have missed you in L.A, Ben - maybe next time!
I find SF to be a lot more like European cities, like London or Paris.
SF has a decent public transport system - something sorely missing in L.A, plus it has a diversity that you don’t get in L.A, where - yes- there are people of all backgrounds, but they mostly live in homogeneous neighbourhoods.
And SF is older - at least by west coast standards, which gives it a more old-world feel. Its rare to see buildings over 50 years old in L.A, whereas there’s quite a lot of housing stock and commercial buildings in San Francisco that have reached the century mark. It definately gives off a different vibe not ‘recycling’ buildings every 40 years or so.
Being a port town also takes me back to living near the Thames. Compare and contrast the pathetic L.A ‘river’, which trickles down a concrete culvert for most of its journey, no ferries or small boats in sight. And the beaches in L.A definately don’t give off that ‘working maritime’ feel you get in both SF and London (even though London’s not actually on the coast, there’s a lot of river traffic, and the Thames is a huge character in the cast of London).
Having lived in London almost all my life, I felt really at home in SF.
L.A still perplexes me in many ways, even though I’ve lived here almost a decade.
Whereas, a few hours in SF, I feel almost like I’m back in London. I’d move to SF in a heartbeat, if only we could find jobs there.
Its my favourite US city, so far. Although, I have to admit I really like Flagstaff too
apre’s poster
Logging in from Ripon. Houses for sale everywhere and developers advertising for more. Also just passed Manteca. There is a huge Florshime (?) project that looks half finished. The wind is blowing and everything has this hellish dusty-red haze. And what’s that smell?
Oh BTW, right before I left downtown SF, I got some trail mix and water from a store across the street. The kid at the counter had a huge pit-bull that jumped on the counter and snapped at the guy in the line ahead of me. The owner of the motel I stayed in could hardly have been less polite.
Getting out of town was pretty easy. Traffic was light and people know how to drive. But once I got off the main highways, it looks more like AZ, TX, etc. Walls of death and too much construction.
Next stop blogging stop: Bakersfield.
There is a huge Florshime (?) project
You headed up HWY #99 Ben ??
That foul smell in Manteca is what gives the place it’s name (Lard-town). Get out, get out while you can!!!
This must mean you are headed down through Fresnooooooo. Can’t wait to hear more of your Central Valley observations. Fresno County = 500,000 service sector McJobs. Everyone’s masquerading like they should be living the credit-binge high life. That place is screwed!!!
Have fun looking at all those useless housing developments along the way. I know that I did, the one time I accidentally drove through Bakersfield up to SF.
Going down the 99 is going to feel like being in a totally different state. At least it’s not too hot today.
Did you take the 80 and then hit the 99? if so, that will give you a good idea of how much housing pressure from the bay has pushed out into the inland areas. Then you have places like Yuba where folks bought because they couldn’t afford Sacramento. It’s complete lunacy.
Sorry I couldn’t make it. It was hell trying to get a flight out of the midwest and then I caught someone’s cold on the plane - ugh.
I would think the entire Hwy #99 corridor (got to be 600 miles) can be the poster child for the housing bubble…Its got to stack up with Florida I would think…
“I would think the entire Hwy #99 corridor (got to be 600 miles) can be the poster child for the housing bubble…Its got to stack up with Florida I would think…”
especially visalia and bakersfried, the two cities i know best. Only been thru fresno a few times but yes it is also a bubble pop area.
Welcome to St. Louis–what part of town will you be living in?
Next stop blogging stop: Bakersfield.
You’re gonna love BField.
If you drive through central downtown you will see some of the most marvelous mid-50’s ranches; just beautiful places in well-kept neighborhoods. But everywhere on the perimeter are acres of stucco boxes all waiting for buyers. Especially if you get a chance to take 178 east out of town.
A lot of the inner burg to the north is comprised of decomposing 30’s and 40’s bungalows and shacks and for much of that you’ll swear you’re in Tijuana.
Cheers!
Oildale.
‘Nuff said…
Also take 58/178 west down to Allen Road and see all the high end houses that are in foreclosure, stopped building, etc.
Ben— If you get a chance to stop at a Trader Joe’s, they have lots of snacky stuff for vegetarians, including just about every kind of nut.
This *is*, after all, the land of fruit and nuts. Have you been stopping at farm stands? I highly recommend you do…
The aggressive pit bull at the counter is classic out of control happy to be in your face San Francisco. It is probably a rescued dog, depending of course on interpretation of the term.
I can think of more than a few people who deserve to be rescued from out-of-control pit bulls and their owners.
Next stop blogging stop: Bakersfield.
(Sorry if this duplicates)
You’re gonna love BField. Around the center of town there are beautfiful 50’s era ranch homes in immaculate neighborhoods. The fringes however, area filled with vacant stucco boxes, desperately seeking buyers. Especially out east on the 178.
To the north of downtown are neighborhoods full of rapidly decomposing 30’s and 40’s bungalows and shacks. You’ll think you’re in Tijuana.
At one time, BField sported true mansions and wealth from the oil fields. Those days are long gone.
Cheers!
If you’re in Oildale (N. Bakersfield) it doesn’t look like T.J. at all! No Hispanics allowed. Salt of the earth people, Merl Haggard, Buck Owens types. Give you the shirts of their backs.
Ben,
O.K., I tried to post to warn you… but there must be some kind of Jas Jain intercept…do not have your car “fresh air” vents open… Sorry, you might not make it Bakersfried….stop!
Ben , So you are shooting down the 99. Good deal. You will have the road all to yourself all way thru as all CA will be watching the lakers and tuesday is the slow day for traffic all over CA.
If You get near Visalia and wish to visit that housing overbulit meltdown zone you have to take rte 198 ,the sequoia hwy, east about 5 miles or so off 99 to get to heart of visalia. Not much scenic areas and pleasant stopovers off 198 as u go thru Visalia main city & dwtn. May just as well pass over Visalia and keep shooting straight to Bakersfried as Visalia inner city offers little in way of scenic tourist spots. Only the farm county to the east of visalia proper all way to sierra foothils near entrance to Sequoia NP is worth traveling thru . Real nice farm acrege out there .
Better just to keep shooting down 99 and do quick stopover at tulare , which has severe housing overbuilding but folks pretty laid back and friendly. Then on to bakerfried, about as dull and untouristy as visalia but with some good trucker ranch steak restaurants. 99 is chock full of trucker reststops & pullovers . Folks in this part of CV seem really laid back and life moves more slowly than in LA.
Too bad Ben didn’t swing on over the Sierra’s to Reno to see some real carnage.
Are you coming to the Splat? When? Where?
The smell is cows. And people were paying $660K to live there. Yeah, I know, it was a bubble.
Ben,
I would highly recommend stopping in Visalia if going down to Bakersfield on the 99. A great example of a smallish town (although now over 110,000 population) where the local government went bananas when big builders came in with all the money circa 2001-2002. You already know how the story ended: lots of unbuilt houses, beautiful farmland destroyed for future neighborhoods, and many disgusting McMansions owned by absentee landlords from LA.
BTW, the reddish haze is a combination of locally-generated pollution from primarily diesel exhaust and the soil blowing in the wind. Be careful about breathing it: there is a fungus in the soil that causes “Valley Fever,” which is endemic to the southern San Joaquin Valley (mainly Fresno south to Bakersfield). I’ve known many a people who have been hospitalized from breathing the air with this fungus in it.
My dad got that. And by the way, it’s like herpes. You NEVER get rid of it, Valley Fever can recur years later. It’s pretty nasty stuff.
This is true. Close the vents in the car, and use the air-conditioning. Not to scare you but my brother-in-law died of Valley Fever. The hospital couldn’t figure out what was wrong. So everytime I make that trip, I close the vents. No big deal, just being safe.
The smell, by the way, is all the dairies. Enjoy!
Come to the central valley and smell the dairy air!
I’ll bet Ben thought people were exaggerating when talking about all the cow-towns (and the smells) in California.
It’s not all “Hollywood” here, that’s for sure!
Come to Colorado Springs and smell the pure mountain air!
And import your milk from the places that produce it. Like eggs to omlets, it’s real hard getting milk from rocky mountain highs.
Hate to disillusion you, but Colorado has its own dairies.
Well, I’m sure it does. But the constant sideways comments about farm country smells do seem to grate a bit. I live in the Central Valley, and yes it smells and yes it’s hot and damn straight it’s people live a lower class of life. But for all the swells in the Bay Area and south of the Tehacipi’s that find sport with the hick comments, I wish a dairy lagoon in their backyard. Rant very off.
LOL!!!
Every time I log on now I get treated to the unsettling image of John McCrazy. Ben, I hold you morally responsible for any sleep loss and feelings of disequibrium I may experience.
Not that Obama is any more comforting, let me add.
???
I think where you were seeing a pic of McCain I am being treated to an add for Rich Dad’s “Learn to be Rich” seminar in San Diego.
Personally I would prefer the pic of McCain to a snake oil salesman’s desperate pitch to relieve fools of their money.
Would love to see about a hundred of us show up, hide in the audience, and point out all the flaws in the “system” they are no doubt selling. But who has three days to save idiots from themselves?
(Sorry if this duplicates)
You’re gonna love BField. Around the center of town there are beautiful 50’s era ranch homes in immaculate neighborhoods. The fringes however, area filled with vacant stucco boxes, desperately seeking buyers. Especially out east on the 178.
To the north of downtown are neighborhoods full of rapidly decomposing 30’s and 40’s bungalows and shacks. You’ll think you’re in Tijuana.
At one time, BField sported true mansions and wealth from the oil fields. Those days are long gone.
Cheers!
I’m glad Ben came out last night. Not only was it fun to meet him (yes, he’s nice), but it was also fun to recognize the slightly aghast demeanor that all people walk around with on their first visit to San Francisco. It’s not the real world up there, you know. The houses are a real horror to live in, even though they look so cutesy from the street. Consequently, all people in the city are sleep-deprived and overly moist. That’s what makes them so mean and makes them want to bite you vicariously through their pit bull.
Well, Ben, I think that you should move to SD after you’ve won the peace prize for your blog. SD is about the best place to live that I’ve ever seen.
A field trip to SF requires a couple days minimum, accompanied by a local.
When he said he was camping near Market in the Castro i thought “now there’s a wasted trip.. and the car will probably get broken into.. by someone I know”.
It was a proud, strong middle class family town and successfully resisted incursions by all sorts of human weirdness, and always recovered.. until the early 70’s when hoards of hippies / Vietnam protest-era leftists got a political foothold and overwhelmed the place.
The old houses and neighborhoods are still there but the family appeal has been extinguished in all but a few isolated spots.
Your narrative is backwards. The middle class fled and values and community collapsed in their absence. When nonconformists started moving in, hippies in the Haight and gays in what had been Eureka Valley and various other migrations, it was not uncommon for houses to be handed over for a token fee in order to escape the tax burden. The middle class abandoned those areas, and the various types of crazy dreamers that came next rebuilt them into one can see now: the magnificent yield of a major eruption of chaos, dreams, and escapism.
I agree the middle class fled… it was a choice between fleeing and “tolerating” the way things had become.
Hundreds of thousands of vagabonds decended on the City during the war protest years. When the hippinicks (that’s what my old-country grandmother called them.. she confused them with the beatniks) first moved in and set up shop it was all about free love, drugs and music. The open atmosphere attracted liberals of all flavors, including society’s outcasts like gays the world over.. SF became a place where you could let it all hang out.. and they did.
But it soon turned to politics.. the old City had to be killed before it could be reborn.
Harvey Milk, the first openly gay person to hold any important public office anywhere in the entire world (according to Time mag) ran in ‘73, ‘75, won in ‘77 with the help his coalition including the labor unions and Jim Jones (!) and was murdered, along with Mayor Moscone.
Supervisor Feinstein took over, being next inline for mayor. There were protest riots and looting during the Dan White trial and afterwards.. police cars were set ablaze.. she did nothing… didnt arrest a single person. Liberalism had won.
Ya know.. that reminds me.. a few years later i was in a local bar one night.. a cop-bar actually.. and one of the seargents pulled out a piece of paper and handed it around to his troops.. it was an outline of how they were to handle people from now on. Among other things, it talked about AIDS and wearing rubber gloves. I hadn’t heard anything about AIDS and didnt know what the fuss was about..
Anyway, sure.. the middle class families fled. The family’s house was bought in 1940’s-50’s for maybe $20 or $30K and due to the influx of new wealth, people were offering 10, 20 and now 30 times that amount. Why not take the offer and leave? Why not pick a better spot to raise the kids?
‘SD is about the best place to live that I’ve ever seen.’
Oh, how very wrong you are. Olympia is the best place! In the world! Perhaps the Universe!
Ben, come live in Olympia. You can eat a zillion oysters and blackberries and live in the forest. In a house in the forest I mean, not like a bear or a caveman. Although you could do that, too, if you wanted. Olympians are not terribly judgmental.
Hey, Oly, you mean you’ve given up on Utarr??
Eat, drink, and be merry, for tomorrow you may…be in Utah.
Sorry about the delays in managing the blog, etc. My wireless provider on 99 was down in Bakersfield and as it turns out, just about everyone else, including Starbucks. So after wasting an hour, I decided to cut my loses and head straight to Barstow. If the Yuma Proving Ground is where they test weapons, Barstow is where they test flagpoles.
So the drive down 99 was of housing bubble interest. If anyone wants to know why so many are underwater, it’s because the bigs (DR Horton, KB Homes) are selling new houses in the low $200ks. I saw it everywhere; Madera, Modesto, Fresno, Bakersfield, etc. The most ridiculous was in a place called Chowchilla; a massive project of McMansions behind dirt berms and walls. Ryland Homes, I think.
So, OTR to SD, LA, SF and Barstow! But after a frustrating hour of searching; I do have a silver lining. See, Route 66 was the old hwy here and thats where all the motels are. But the hwy department went around that and there are no signs. However - once I found a cool place called the California Inn, with DSL no less, and a huge room w/everything, and a pool, and a couple of Sierra Pale Ales. I see the upside. Outside my patio there are the two biggest Saguaro cacti I ever saw. But they get watered so they grew into the second story roof, like columns. And the wind is so high, their big center sections sway in the middle like belly dancers! And it’s on Route 66, which is a stones throw from my little place back home, so I feel connected.
I’ve learned a lot on this impromptu OTR blog thing about connections, hardware dos and don’ts, etc. Expecting sleep is a mistake, I found out. But, I am ready to cruise into Arizona tomorrow. So please check back and we’ll wrap up this little trip like we started it!
Ben i guess you stayed at Cal Inn in barstow. One thing Barstow has is motels and hotels, tons of them. I think Half the structures there are either motels or quick eating joints.
Yes, old rte 66 which has some historical old west landmarks and ghost town shacks immediately east of barstow around daggett. Not pleasant to roam around there in june as temps are 100%. And galloping thru the Mohave desert best done on an off-terrain motorcycle, atv, or jeep cherokee in winter.
The majors are really sucking air in the valley, Ben. These massive planned communities are loaded with unsold homes, bare lots, foreclosures and hurting homerenters. The Chowchilla project is truly the worst example of the bubble: in the literal middle of nowhere (one of Chowchilla’s claims to fame is that it sits at the geographic center of CA), overpriced and isolated.
There are dozens of these ‘developments’ in the CV, and prices are truly imploding - saw a bunch of 2K+ sf places for sale at 170K+/-. That’s a serious challenge to anyone underwater.
“So the drive down 99 was of housing bubble interest. If anyone wants to know why so many are underwater, it’s because the bigs (DR Horton, KB Homes) are selling new houses in the low $200ks. I saw it everywhere; Madera, Modesto, Fresno, Bakersfield, etc. The most ridiculous was in a place called Chowchilla; a massive project of McMansions behind dirt berms and walls. Ryland Homes, I think.”
_______________________________________________
And you only touched the surface…
Imagine the gawdawful disaster that’s just beyond your view?
I saw it everywhere; Madera, Modesto, Fresno, Bakersfield, etc. The most ridiculous was in a place called Chowchilla; a massive project of McMansions behind dirt berms and walls. Ryland Homes, I think
I only reason I think they would have chosen such an isolated place like Chowchilla is that Highway 152 is next to town. Insane people have been commuting to San Jose from the western side of the Central Valley on 152 for several decades (e.g., Los Banos, Patterson–see a map). It would have made some kind of twisted sense to speculators during the bubble–those in Chowchilla would only have an extra hour on their commute to San Jose. The drive is roughly 2-3 hours with no traffic, but 152 is dangerous and frequently bogs down.
I was driving south on the 99, coming back from Burning Man a few years back, when I encountered a large roadside sign the city fathers had spent around $50k on, which said “Chowchilla, A Unique Way Of Life”.
Just a few hundred feet down the freeway was a much smaller sign that said “Central California Women’s Facility”. (it wouldn’t be pc to call a prison, a prison?)
Drive-by Irony…
Ben,
I’m glad you are having what seems to be a good time. It’s too bad you couldn’t have stopped in Bakersfield - I would have loved to see a pic of you in front of David Crisp’s former mansion.
-SB
Ben, glad you had a glance around where I lived for so many years. Now come east to Albuquerque. I will get you the best Indian (India) that exists here. I know all of the Indian restaurant owners in town, as well as hotel owners. We’ll have a great time. I will need help with booze. I don’t drink personally. But know some of the haunts.
Does Albuquerque still have that great BBQ place? Rudy’s or Ruby’s or something like that? They made the best BBQ chicken, I swear. It was the best way to eat Weber’s white bread, too.
It’s nice in the desert in the morning. The Saguaro are blooming and the wind died down. I think there is a 50 degree temperature swing forecast for today in Barstow. Coming into town, I passed miles of junkyards and abandoned houses. One thing about the low land prices though; all the parling lots have ample pull out space and the turn-ins are twice as wide as everywhere else.
This is where I 40 begins, so once I get on the road it should be a quick drive to the AZ border.
One place I forgot to mention from yesterday was Tahachapi. It’s in the mountains east of Bakersfield. Not hard on the eyes; lots of windmills, a few McMansions. I’m not sure what people do for a living up there. Then the road drops into what I guess is death valley.
I got panhandled in the parking lot this AM. Man, this stuff is everywhere. I am sure that it will be one of the first things I see in Flagstaff this afternoon.
Hey ben;
That was fun being your envoy last weekend. Between photos of the groups and helping with logistics I think I have a new career now.
Did you like the Photobucket link? I got some great shots of the southern cal people. Does anybody want to see the photos today?
Are you going to post the link? I want to see what I missed…
SM, I wanted to see to meet you, especially since you knew about the sunspot on the coast. Here are the photos from the southern california OTR.
http://s292.photobucket.com/albums/mm1/anngogh/?albumview=slideshow
Questions and comments appreciated.
Fundraising idea for the blog: HBB calendar featuring Lostcontrol posing in various skimpy attire on the beach
I’d buy it.
Governator: Hey….you forgot me
http://photobucket.com/images/Schwarzenegger/
Hey tx, I must have lost control because the guy ain’t lostcontrol but his name is tim.
Someone tell me who is holding the jugs?
The person who is tim is also waiting in LA.
Hey - that’s me!
No longer anonymous, I suppose.
My name is Tim, and I have been posting under this handle since ‘04 - if I posted back then, that’s when I found the (original) blog, before it moved here.
Yeah, now my sister just called to say she thinks I need to buy a house in sd. I won’t buy until ben’s blog tells me to buy. When is that?
Maybe 2012…maybe later.
BTW, the guy with the jugs is Tristan, IIRC. Hope I’ve got that right.
Oh. Hahsahahah. Hi, Tim. Where have you been all my life? LOL
Coming into town, I passed miles of junkyards and abandoned houses.
Hey Ben,
I’m assuming you drove the 58 from BField through Kramer Jct to Barstow.
That last leg, after it narrows down to two lanes, is probably some of the most desolate, barren and abandoned property in the US. When people think California, they usually think Hollywood, Beverly Hills and Laguna Beach. If people could see that windblown wasteland along the 58 and realize that there are thousands of miles more of the same throughout southern and central CA, they’d be thinking Dust Bowl instead of Land of Milk and Honey.
Glad to hear you’re going to be safe in the land of the giant cactus again soon, thanks for the updates, it’s been fun following along on your trip.
“Then the road drops into what I guess is death valley.”
The town of Mojave I think death valley is farther north east. drive up Owens valley sometime and see the most spectacular veiws of Mountains the serria Nevada eastern side drops right down to the valley floor which is a desert now that LA stole the water many years ago.
“The town of Mojave I think death valley is farther north east. drive up Owens valley sometime and see the most spectacular veiws of Mountains the serria Nevada eastern side drops right down to the valley floor which is a desert now that LA stole the water many years ago.”
I forgot to mention to ben about the tiny settlement of mohave which is actually not along the 58 but along the hwy 14 detour 15 miles south of 58. Not missing nothing in mohave as it is a gritty railroad/ truck junction and a very ugly desert burg to boot. Mohave was alway my pit stop from LA to owens valley and the eastern sierra more out of necessity as it was the last sizable burb before you hit lone pine about 2 hrs away. Usualy got the quick burger meal at carls jr and gas fillup and left mohave as quicj as possible.
Yes, the rte 14/395 drive into and thru the eastern sierra/owens valley/bishop/lone pine region is indeed spectacular: just to see that 10,000 ft sierra mountain wall rising straight from the vallry floor is a sight.
Death valley is the same direction but you take rte 190 from olancha or lone pine and it is about another 1 to 1.5 hrs drive from the 395/190 junction at Olancha. Also the Trona rd rte 178 from ridgecrest. Wrong time of year to do death valley- best to do in winter as is entire mohave region.
One place I forgot to mention from yesterday was Tahachapi. It’s in the mountains east of Bakersfield. Not hard on the eyes; lots of windmills, a few McMansions. I’m not sure what people do for a living up there. Then the road drops into what I guess is death valley.
Actually that’s just the Mojave desert. The highway goes near a large jet airplane graveyard/storage lot near the town of Mojave itself. Death Valley proper is to the northeast and has a LOT more to interesting stuff to see than Highway 58 on the Mojave-Barstow route. (Bakersfield to Barstow is on my driving route to Las Vegas…I know it well…)
Tehachapi has cattle ranchers and probably a bit of money from Bakersfield (e.g., retirees, oil). It doesn’t get nearly as hot or stinky up there as in the Central Valley.
Tehachapi has a big prison. Several hundred staff commute into town to keep prisoners there. The next biggest thing is health care and the hospital with about 1% the number of employees. The prison workers make good money and have defeated the Governator’s attempts to roll back wages and benefits. With Three Strikes in effect even large rural prisons like that are not enough. More money goes to prisons than schools, which raises big issues regarding social impacts and what might happen if the prison population growth stopped increasing.
That’s where Jas lives (not the prison, but Tahachapi, at least so I think).
some prisons are self-guarded…
Yes, I think you’re right about Jas living there. Don’t think he has to commute anywhere though.
I think the road just drops down into the upper reaches of the Mojave…
Back in Kingman, AZ. The area east of Barstow was pretty uneventful, but some interesting volcanic stuff, anyway. More highway patrol than I’ve seen the entire trip.
I should mention the amount of contact I’ve had with truckers this trip. I have used a wireless network set up at a chain. So-so satifsfaction with it, but I can get food gas, check the blog, etc, all in one stop. I have really had to make good time to pull this off. Truckers are an interesting bunch, and I wouldn’t want their job. Once in California a couple days ago, I accidentally walked into the ‘drivers’ lounge.’ These guys have everything; private showers, phone booths, a theater. They have been very helpful with directions, hints, and such. Maybe I should call this trip the ‘truckstop tour.’ Anyway, hats off to these hard working guys and gals of the road.
I just was asked by a lady here, where’s home? I said Flagstaff. She said, ‘nice place to visit, but I wouldn’t want to live there. If I wanted to go back to snow country, I’d move back to Montana.’
Well, back to snow country!
Ben,
Just a quick note about your trip thru Ca. I don’t know if u had occasion to pull over at the numerous CA rest stops, which are designated pullover parking rest stops for travelors & truckers. They are sited about every 100-150 miles along most of the major CA interstate fwy/ hwy routes such as 99, 5, 15, 10, 40 ect. Well maintained by and run by the state and with parks shady trees, lawns, restrooms and tourist kiosks.
Imagine the traffic at these sites along with summer travel will be down somewhat with the high gas prices. Plus with the CA budget problems i don’t know how well maintained they willl be in future but they are one of the few justifiable and beneficial CA gov’t expenditures.
Glad you made it back home safely, Ben! There’s no place like home — even when you’re a renter.
Hope you enjoyed your trip. It was awesome of you to arrange all the get-togethers, and I think everyone has a new-found appreciation and respect for one another as real people.
Thank you!!!
So this was quite the experience! An accounting is in order:
Cities visited: 3
Cuts/bruises: 1 each, cut from gas cap on rental car. bruise, origin unknown.
Tickets: none!
Beers drank, uncounted. Beers paid for; very few (thanks people)
Tequila shots; 1. (Barstow)
Most puzzling comment; my escort ran a yellow in Pasadena, leaving me behind in limbo. (Me; ‘You made me run that red light.’ Ann; “But you had to.’)
Best comeback, dropping me off in SF; (me: thanks for driving all the way from Dublin. SFbayqt: ‘Well you drove all the way from Arizona.’)
Brushes with death; 3. 2 CD changing related, 1, 18 wheeler related.
Giant tumbleweeds obliterated; 1, north of Bakersfield.
Music highlights: listening to Repo Man soundtrack coming into SD the first time. “Tiny Montgomery” on the Golden Gate Bridge (Dylan and The Band; Basement Tapes.) The Stones country song in Bakersfield and Ummagumma going into the Kingsman area the first time.
Best 4 hour HB discussion; me, PB and the SD die hards at Pizza Port.
Best dental graduate badgering; Big V at Toronado in SF.
Worst directions; locals to Haight Street in SF.
Most common question; ‘Are you Ben’?
Second most common question and answer: Q: “So what are you doing in California?’ A: ‘I came to see you guys.”
All said, I couldn’t be happier with the visit and all the fun I had. My thanks to all of you for a trip I will never forget.
There’s nothing quite like hitting a mature tumbleweed square on at 75mph..twigs get stuck in places you didn’t know you had.
Thanks for keeping the blog running through all that. Regular “refershers” could detect when you were on the road or asleep, but otherwise it was practically seamless.
Thanks I did my best; biggest tech mistake; not getting cell wireless card.
Ben, next time, swing on up here. It’s only a few hundred miles out of your way!
I will. I got about 5 hours sleep per night on this one.
Even if you didn’t go see Ben, you can send me your photos to put on the photobucket.com.
I think it would be great to see what people in Ny,tx,ut,fla,Wa and mass look like. I really wanna see what Hoz looks like!
Send your personal photos to ben with your posting name and I will launch them for all to see. Be sure to put photobucket in the subject line.
cheers!
Ouro
sorry, no can do on the picture request as last time I sent a pic, Reynolds Aluminum Co. fired off a C&D because their name was visible on the tinfoil hat I was wearing.
I suspect they just wanted some royalty chedder . . .
WHAT, I made it onto a list??? And not just any list, but an internet list, and written by an internet celebrity so brilliant that he puts even Britney Spears to shame? I am humbled.
LOL!! Ditto from me, too, V. What I said was true, Ben…how could I really complain about driving 45 minutes while you had been driving for days?!
It was really great finally meet you. And since I have a daughter living in New York, I’ll keep my eyes peeled for when you decide to do an East Coast meetup.
BayQT~
Best 4 hour HB discussion; me, PB and the SD die hards at Pizza Port.
Best name discovered for a band: PB and the SD die hards
Ben,
Any plans to come over to Japan!? There having one hell of a real estate bubble here too! Japanese banks are falling over themselves to offer voodoo loans, and have lost a ton of money on the debacle unfolding in the US!
I’d even save all the brochures for new real estate that I get in my mail box here.
I know a really good ‘ShoujinRyori’ place! ShoujinRyori is ‘Buddhist monks food’ but is very beautifully presented and tastes great. 100% Vegan.
Well I know you won’t make it, since I think I’m the only one in Tokyo reading your blog!
Sorry I missed you in LA!
Chris
I’m a Sunnyvale Renter - ex Tokyo Renter, does that count?
Rents in Tokyo haven’t seemed to have gone up much over the past 15 years, have they?
I got a nice 3rd (top) floor corner 30m2 1K w/ internal W/D space for 11-man back in ‘95-2000. Right between Hirou-eki and Azabu-juban. Rent didn’t go up at all those 5 years, but I did have to pay a month for renewal every two years.
Rent started here at $1320 in 2003 and it’s already $1750! (I went month-to-month since the mgmt company wants a TWO MONTH cancellation fee)
Hi Troy,
I think it does!
Yea Tokyo rents have not changed much, even when I lived her
back in 1997-2000. Still new stuff and anything large is seriously
overpriced. Cheaper to buy in many cases for the very large
and expensive places. But for middle priced thing, it still makes
more sense to rent. At least according to the NY Times
rent vs buy calculator.
The place I’m renting is in Shinagawa Seaside, developed after you
left I believe, and my place is 69square meters and about 24man a
month and it’s brand new. Now key money, just 2 months rent deposit,
one month agent fee and first months rent! But my company picked
up the deposit.
But my wife (Japanese) hates it here and wants to go back to the US/California.
So just saving money for a real house.
Maybe you can make it to Vegas if we have our “global” get-together?
Big V - the BBQ place is Rudy’s. It is excellent BBQ. There was also a location of it in El Paso I passed last week when down there on a work assignment. For Bay area people, I miss JD’s in Castro Valley. Most unique restaurant I have ever been to. Check there out. Small hole in the wall, excellent food. On Castro Valley Bl.
Since I’m only 15 minutes down the freeway from Castro Valley, I’ll put JD’s on my list of places to check out.
Thanks, need 2.
BayQT~
Excellent, will try.
txchick57,
Sorry, but I suspect my picture on a calendar would result in a crisis of major proportions! I may have been of some marginal benefit 40 years ago (this would be a real push), but hardly today.
My double may look like me from the back of his head, since I still have my hair.
lol,lol,lol…
–
David Rosenberg:
“A sign of just how undervalued the dollar is — And if you want to see first-hand how the dollar has probably hit rock bottom given how egregiously undervalued it is, have a look at page B1 of the WSJ – Europeans are coming to the USA in droves to buy their luxury cars that are produced where they live but have been shipped to dealer lots in America where
they are not moving. The super-cheap dollar and the rebates are saving European buyers as much as 30% from what they would pay for the identical vehicle at home. See “Europeans Go to U.S. Dealers to Buy Cars From Home”.”
I think that the dollar has bottomed against the European currencies.
Jas
–
Sorry, it was meant for Bits…
Jas
The Euros buying up their own goods from us, for less than they pay at home is a one-time phenomenon, until the next shipments from Europe, which will be priced in Dollars at what the rest of the world pays…