July 2, 2008

Bits Bucket For July 2, 2008

Please post off-topic ideas, links and Craigslist finds here.




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Comment by wmbz
2008-07-02 04:31:46

HURRICANE WATCH
Insurers Criticized
For New Rate Models…

Last year, Leanne Lord of Marion, Mass., decided to put her house up for sale after her insurance premiums more than doubled to about $2,892 a year since 2005. Many of her Cape Cod neighbors, who hadn’t seen a hurricane in the area since 1991, followed suit. Today, there’s a glut of houses on the local market.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB121487523491418103.html?mod=googlenews_wsj

Comment by not a gator
2008-07-02 04:52:17

Gotta pay for all those new roofs (shoddy construction, high risk area, with risk premium not properly priced in) in coastal Florida somehow…

Oh and btw, Cape Cod DOES get wicked hurricanes every so often. If you’re on the eroding coast, your house WILL be washed away. Otherwise, the biggest risk is that a pine tree comes down on your house. I saw the damage in suburban Boston after Gloria. Of course, hiring an arborist every decade or so can help with this!

 
Comment by not a gator
2008-07-02 04:54:20

THE REAL ESTATE CYCLE OF CAPE COD

Move in because it’s cheap.
Move in because it’s a good investment.
Move in because it’s conspicuous consumption.

Move out because it’s too expensive.
Move out because you’re losing money on your investment.
Move out because it’s a dump.

Move in because it’s cheap. Etc.

 
Comment by watcher
2008-07-02 05:09:24

This article is geographically inaccurate. Marion is not on Cape Cod.

Comment by tresho
2008-07-02 09:10:55

Marion is not on Cape Cod. That is probably just the homeowner’s primary residence.

 
 
 
Comment by wmbz
2008-07-02 04:35:39

The New Coal Car…
The technology dates to the 1920s, but today’s prices make liquid coal for cars a live option. The result is an investment boom.

“Powering cars with coal might seem like a recipe for ecological disaster. But if fuel experts are right, a liquefied form of the notoriously dirty mineral will be providing much of the world with its transport fuel within the next two decades. The coal miner’s equivalent of turning straw into gold, liquid coal enables cars, trains and even jets designed to burn oil to run on coal instead. And, says its cheering squad, it does so in a way that’s green, economical and widely available”.

http://www.newsweek.com/id/44188

Comment by johnfromia
2008-07-02 06:58:16

Very interesting. I noticed this article at Portfolio.com about the promise of next generation bio-fuels like oil from algae. It seems to hold much more promise than corn-based ethanol. Let’s hope the gov’t doesn’t screw things up by picking the wrong winners.

Natural Selection
by David Ewing Duncan
Fuels of the Future
http://www.portfolio.com/views/columns/natural-selection/2008/07/02/Alternative-Energy-Fuels?rss=true

Comment by Brian in Chicago
2008-07-02 09:50:58

Diesel from Algae:

http://jalopnik.com/394479/sears-tower-or-bust-my-algae+powered-car-adventure

Sears Tower Or Bust: My Algae-Powered Car Adventure

David Levine, a second-year teacher placed in Chicago through the Teach For America program, faced a common problem: how to get students to take the same interest in their studies as in Grand Theft Auto IV. His school, the Al Raby School for Community and Environment, serves populations from the predominately African American neighborhoods on Chicago’s West Side, a place where the median income is more than 40% lower than the city as a whole. How could he motivate his students to invest their time and interest in the scientific process?

The goal was to create enough biodiesel from algae, grown and processed in the classroom, to power a vehicle from the school to Chicago’s Sears Tower and back, an approximately 20-mile round trip. Because algae sucks carbon out of the atmosphere, it is relatively carbon neutral to produce and, unlike corn or soybeans, isn’t a food crop. But how do you turn single-celled plants into viable fuel within the confines of a classroom?

Comment by ET-Chicago
2008-07-02 10:13:15

Pretty cool.

I know that project would’ve engaged me.

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Comment by desertdweller
2008-07-02 10:09:12

Saw a guy on morning tv today in Ohio who has Mustang that he has enhanced the engine and it gets more than 100 mph.
Looks good, drives fast. His grandfather developed the technology in the 40s when the war made rationing gas a problem. So, frankly, he is waiting for patents and it Can be done. It is up to the auto mftrs to do it right. It has been here all along but apparently oil has a strangle hold on the politicos wallets. And WS wallets. Who wants a car that can get from 100 - 500 mph????
I do.

Comment by BanteringBear
2008-07-02 10:23:45

You mean mpg, right?

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Comment by tresho
2008-07-02 10:42:20

Just another urban legend. I have been reading such stuff since 1973, nothing has ever come of it. OTOH, the Big 3 currently make & sell vehicles that get 50 mpg, but don’t sell any in the USA.

 
 
Comment by desertdweller
2008-07-02 18:08:31

Yes, Bantering, I meant Mpg.. I knew you would know what I meant!

And it was on Cnn headline snooze.

So, it really never has been bogus. And yes they do sell them out of our country. Why? well, maybe they know they can pull one over on us. constantly.

 
 
 
 
Comment by AdamCO
2008-07-02 07:57:20

The coal industry has been promising clean burning, emission-free coal technologies since the 70s. It’s all talk, fluff, and pandering for govt. handouts.

Comment by Pondering the Mess
2008-07-02 09:07:51

I remember the “Special Report” National Geographic magazine on energy, with discussions about “clean coal,” alternate power, and how we were going to need to do something in the future vs. relying on oil (and gas) and hoping that they never run out.

That magazine came out in the 1980’s, if I recall. Here we are, 20 years later, and we’ve accomplished virtually nothing as a species on this front, save for consuming resources even faster with a “consumer economy,” huge SUV’s, huge McMansions, etc.

I weep for our future!

Comment by tresho
2008-07-02 09:12:16

Here we are, 20 years later, and we’ve accomplished virtually nothing What’s a few decades among friends?

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Comment by BanteringBear
2008-07-02 10:26:22

When are people going to wake up and realize that internal combustion is the problem? I don’t care what the fuel source is, we need to stop burning!

 
 
Comment by peter a
Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 04:56:04

good for her. I would have done the same thing.

 
Comment by not a gator
2008-07-02 04:58:42

This isn’t a problem if you give your money away before you die. She wanted to enjoy full use of her wealth to the end, thus, ironically, she loses control.

Had she set up one of those special “charitable” trusts for richie riches and accepted an allowance while directing the use of the capital (either starting a new charity or forging links with existing ones), they wouldn’t be discussing now whether the trustees have the legal right to reinterpret the “mission statement” on her will.

 
Comment by wmbz
2008-07-02 05:06:56

Glad to see the “Queen of Mean” did that, pissed off some loser family members waiting on the big payday, I’m sure.

 
Comment by jfp
2008-07-02 07:41:23

That’s just … awesome. I think it’s hilarious how people feel so entitled to their parents money. Easier than earning it, I guess.

Comment by wolfgirl
2008-07-02 08:45:26

Even worse was one of my aunts after her brother committed suicide after losing badly in the 1987 stock market crash. She had been expecting his estate to pay for her retirement. And she was a good bit older than her brother.
BYW, my uncle’s broker called my mother to say how sorry he was about my uncle. I suspect than my uncle didn’t take advice on the market.

 
Comment by ahansen
2008-07-02 09:06:43

Leona didn’t “earn” it either. She married it.

I’m with you, Tex. (Keep in mind that human caretakers will likely be employed and presumably paid for their services to said dogs.)

Comment by EmperorNorton_II
2008-07-02 09:18:53

This economy is going to the dogs…

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Comment by wolfgirl
2008-07-02 11:39:21

Dogs are nicer than most people I know.

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Comment by deogee
2008-07-02 19:42:10

I “howly” agree with you. woof.

 
 
 
 
Comment by BanteringBear
2008-07-02 10:31:35

That is one ugly face.

 
 
Comment by weez
2008-07-02 04:40:26

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/business/orl-azzouz0208jul02,0,4572.story

Developer in Orlando having problems due to condo slump.

Comment by palmetto
2008-07-02 05:34:44

Wachovia decided to reneg(e)otiate.

 
Comment by Tim
2008-07-02 05:59:14

“They’re playing incredible hardball with us,” Azzouz said. “The easiest thing for me to do is to put the keys [to the condos] in a box, give it to the bank and walk away, and we’re done. But I don’t want to do that to the community.”

His statement is truthful but incomplete. He doesn’t want to give up and have his credit ruined, but wants to do the community is continue to screw as many ppl as he can by dumping overpriced properties on an already flooded market.

 
Comment by hip in zilker
2008-07-02 09:38:13

Is there any evidence for Gerrity’s statement?

The market statewide soon will get a boost with billion-dollar buyout funds looking to scoop up discounted property, said Michael Gerrity, founder of Orlando-based MultiChannel Ventures LLC, a boutique private-equity firm that owns the Real Estate Channel online-marketing network.

“They’re going to be buying in big blocks, in cash. It’s going to chew up a nice chunk of condos, particularly at the high end — luxury condos” in Florida, Gerrity said. “The faster we get through this [excess] inventory, the better.”

Comment by GrittyToasterWaffleGuy
2008-07-02 11:30:24

Moment of silence, please.

Ambac Trading Halted

 
 
 
Comment by mgnyc99
2008-07-02 04:40:43

good morning

sign of the times -starbucks to close 600 stores and rein in growth

http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/080702/starbucks_closings.html

Comment by combotechie
2008-07-02 04:47:14

A very good sign of the times. It’s back to basics once again.

Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2008-07-02 05:51:29

70 percent of those slated for closure had opened after the start of 2006.

Enough said!

 
 
Comment by polly
2008-07-02 04:57:26

A local chain called “Let’s Dish” where people go in to put together meals to freeze is closing its two stores in my county. I got the e-mail because I took an offer to get a small order for free a few months ago. It seemed expensive (if you had to pay)and the whole process was vaguely humiliating, but I went fairly late on a weekday evening and it wasn’t deserted. The e-mail said they aren’t going out of buisness completely.

Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 05:39:39

there was a chain of those around here called The Dinner Station, all or most are bankrupt. What a stupid idea.

Comment by ibbots
2008-07-02 05:46:03

you got that right, I was scratching my head for hours after I read about that business.

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Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2008-07-02 05:52:43

Can’t you just prep it yourself, and freeze it if that’s what you wanted?

Am I missing something in their (fairly moronic) business model?

 
Comment by A.B. Dada
2008-07-02 06:09:41

While it does seem to be a moronic business model on its face, I think it does have some viability. Maybe not right now, but I do like some of the ideas. I haven’t thought about it, ever, until right now, but off the top of my head:

1. Someone else manages the equipment (cleaning, maintaining, sharpening, decalcifying, replacing, etc).

2. Someone else manages the energy costs.

3. You don’t have to worry about wasting unused food and can probably get an exceptional pick of fresh foods to use.

4. You can learn new recipes and new ways to add healthy options to your family’s diet.

5. There’s a social aspect: I know many women (single and married) who are terribly bored and don’t have much contact with others for whatever reason.

6. You don’t have to invest in high end equipment at home: a simple kitchen with a nice dining room is all you need.

Personally, I’d probably take advantage of it myself, had I heard about it before. Bad marketing, I guess.

 
Comment by polly
2008-07-02 07:49:06

They billed themselves as a replacement for cooking and/or grocery shopping. That is patently untrue as you still have to cook and they do not provide a substitue for all grocery shopping. What they are is a good substitute for choosing a few main dishes a month and having a well stocked pantry.

You still have to shop for breakfast, lunch, side dishes, drinks, and snacks. Once I have to go shopping, I don’t feel it is a huge burden to purchase needed pantry items (like spices) and main dish ingredients. You still have to cook the stuff once you bring it home.

It basically is a substitute for a chunk of the thinking/planning process for dinner entrees. And it gives you the illusion that you chose or invented the recipe and are, therefore, a “good” cook. If people really valued this illusion, it could be successful. I don’t think people care that much.

 
Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2008-07-02 07:59:06

I think it was basically just an outlet for bored soccer moms drunk flush from the HELOC spigot.

They even provided “wine” while the mommies cooked.

As goes the HELOC, so go these business models.

 
Comment by polly
2008-07-02 08:14:53

That is very perceptive. The sales stuff seems aimed at women with busy jobs, but it never really says that. It just talks about being too busy to cook or shop.

Like I said above, I found the process to be vaguely humiliating, especially the do rag they made you wear so your hair doesn’t fall into the ingredient containers. Being drunk might help with that part, but is a negative when you have to drive home.

 
Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2008-07-02 09:31:20

I cook a lot. A LOT.

So I understand most of the costs, and I am under no illusion that it costs more to eat in (with my labor.) But you eat far far better with real produce.

As for the labor, I don’t consider it work but a hobby. But I can see how it would be a chore for others not so inclined.

So I don’t understand this model. Either I cook, and I do all the work, or I pay you to do all the work.

This half-and-half is just silly. Why would I drive somewhere, do all the work, drive it back, and still have to cook it later?

I’ll stand by my HELOC analysis.

 
Comment by EmperorNorton_II
2008-07-02 09:38:06

But, can you cook the books like Wall Street?

 
Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2008-07-02 10:11:51

If you bring me some books, I’ll give it my best shot. ;-)

 
Comment by EmperorNorton_II
2008-07-02 10:35:33

Flash-paper Flambé is always a favorite dish.

 
 
Comment by Gadfly
2008-07-02 09:32:03

How about a drive-through fondue chain?

Think of it: a boiling pot of hot cheese on the center console with everyone trying to stab sharp forks of bread into the cheese while driving down the interstate. It’s a sure winner!

And don’t forget Kramer’s idea for a make-it-yourself pizza chain.

George: You can’t have people shoving their arms into a 600 degree oven.
Kramer: It’s all supervised!

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Comment by BanteringBear
2008-07-02 10:53:37

Sounds great, as long as they include the burner with the cheese pot. Nothing like an open flame on a plastic armrest. Come to think of it, maybe they could offer BBQ to go. No, not just the meat, but the actual BBQ as well. They could just hand over the smoking Weber.

Seriously, how lazy are people anyway?

 
 
 
 
Comment by wmbz
2008-07-02 05:04:24

7,257 - 600 = 6,657 So it shouldn’t be a problem for someone to get their daily half calf double latte frappe whip cream w/reverse Cinnamon swirl. Sounds like 12,000 should start looking for a job.

 
Comment by A.B. Dada
2008-07-02 05:05:03

I use my real name here, so I can’t go into great detail, but the news of this is completely short-sighted. Let’s just say that in 3 years, Starbucks will likely have reopened the same number of stores, just in different locations.

If you can get yourself a list of the locations that were failing, you’d not be surprised that they’re closing them. Starbucks still has many locations that are doing gangbusters, even with the housing market crash.

Like my gun, some people will only let you take their coffee away from their cold, dead hands.

Comment by NotInMontana
2008-07-02 05:12:34

But you can make your own, yes?

 
Comment by combotechie
2008-07-02 05:15:45

IMO, Starbucks is symbolic of flush times, when the dollar was easy to get thus spending four dollars for a latte was no big deal.

Those times are being whisked away as tight money conditions are arriving on the scene.

Four dollars for a latte, after tax considerations, is about a half hour’s pay at minimum wage; A wee bit pricy.

Comment by A.B. Dada
2008-07-02 05:24:00

I agree that it seems frivolous, but it’s also a legally acceptable drug that many people rely on.

Have you seen how many fatties carb it up at lunch time? All those lovely starches and sugars kick your pancreas into overdrive, give you a nice big insulin rush, which leaves you deprived of blood sugar, hence the afternoon doldrums. That’s why Starbucks jumps after lunch: people need a kick start.

I’ve helped dozens of people in the past 12 months redo their budgets significantly. The only thing NOT ONE person would give up? Starbucks in the early morning or late afternoon. Not one. Out of nearly 60 people.

Crazy, but I believe that legal drugs will always be a needed item, even if people have to cut back elsewhere.

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Comment by palmetto
2008-07-02 05:32:28

Sounds like people need you to help them re-do their diets.

 
Comment by A.B. Dada
2008-07-02 05:36:32

Ha, surely you jest, but I have helped quite a few kick that afternoon crash. Healthy fats, fiber and proteins for lunch make a world of difference in one’s ability to climb the corporate or self-employment ladder. I fully attribute my successes to being 2-3 hours more productive per day than my collegues. “It’s the diet, stupid!”

Funny aside: I had this employee who loves to eat at an all-you-can-eat pizza & pasta buffet for lunch. He’d sleep (after the sugar crash) at our customer’s basement office from 2-3 every day. They asked us to can him. I warned him more than once, but he never listened. Wonder where he is today.

 
Comment by peter a
2008-07-02 05:36:46

“All those lovely starches and sugars kick your pancreas into overdrive”

That is why I got out of telecommunications and got into nursing. 26million people with diabetes 56million with prediabetes I am going to be working for a long time, making decent money, and enjoying taking care of people.

 
Comment by A.B. Dada
2008-07-02 05:41:52

Smart, Peter A. My “step”-mom did the same.

Easy enough to watch for who will probably end up with a diabetic condition (non-hereditary): a can of coke has 41 grams of sugar per serving. Drink 3 of those a day for 20 years and you’re there.

Lucky for us healthy living people, we get to subsidize their slow road to death. No offense intended to those currently living WITH diabetes, because you were conned by your government’s food pyramid for many years. But now that we know that sugars and starches are slow killers, people who are younger should make drastic adjustments to their dietary habits. I do believe that many forms of diabetes that are acquired instead of inherited are reversible (studies do show this), but you can’t teach an old dog new tricks. And stick the taxpayer with the bill, while you’re at it.

That’s a reason I’ll fight “free” health care: it just subsidizes all these cola drinking, pasta eating, potato mashing insulin-poor people who continue to cry “It’s a thyroid problem!” Only if the brand of junk food you eat is labeled Thyroid-brand, maybe.

 
Comment by JP
2008-07-02 05:52:36

Healthy fats, fiber and proteins for lunch make a world of difference in one’s ability to climb the corporate or self-employment ladder.

I eat healthier than most people, ran up the ladder, and am now an entrepreneur. If you want to talk about taking away my caffeine, then you better have that gun of yours in hand for defense.

Uh-oh, look at that above paragraph. Looks like I need to cut back again.

 
Comment by aladinsane
2008-07-02 06:07:03

Why do people pay $5 for a beer at a bar, when you can drink alone for a buck?

Starbucks model was based upon this.

 
Comment by oxide
2008-07-02 06:33:44

JP, chill — with an iced mocha, of course. :-)

AB Dada, which legally acceptable drug were you referring to: caffeine or sugar? I believe that sugar is as much of a factor as the caffeine. Those fatties who carbed up during lunch are solving the low-sugar doldrums with - what else - more sugar. The stuff is basically ice cream.

And don’t underestimate the appeal of the Sbux culture: smooth jazz and low lighting and relaxing atmosphere etc. OR, the advantage of the little 10-minute vacation from work you take just to go acquire your 400 calories of bliss.

You get a little hit just from the picture of the little green woman on the Sbux cup.

 
Comment by michael
2008-07-02 06:37:17

i used to consume mass amounts of coffee. i never got the whole starbucks thing. my attitude about coffee is just like Sheriff Ed Tom Bell’s dad in “no country for old men”.

Sheriff Ed Tom Bell - “how fresh is this coffee?”

Father - “i make a fresh pot about once a week whether i need to or not.”

 
Comment by Skip
2008-07-02 07:53:52

I think Friends going off of the air is having an impact on SBUX - teens are no longer being informed that its cool to go hang out at a coffee shop. In fact, how cool can it be to hang out at the same place your parents go?

My mother beat type 2 diabetes by changing her diet and losing weight. Although, according to her doctor, one you are diagnosed with diabetes, the diagnosis is permanent, so the stats on the number of cases may be skewed as more people discover non-drug treatment.

 
Comment by Arizona Slim
2008-07-02 08:00:46

I’m with Dada. I’m also self-employed, and the long work hours come with the territory. I attribute my abundant energy to proper diet and plenty of exercise.

Yes, I do like to have a little caffeine kick in the morning, but it comes from the green tea that I brew myself. I buy the green tea in bulk at the local food co-op, which puts the cost of each serving down into the pennies-per, rather than several dollars-per.

 
Comment by ET-Chicago
2008-07-02 08:29:49

Why do people pay $5 for a beer at a bar, when you can drink alone for a buck?

Starbucks model was based upon this.

A grouchy old man bar beats the hell outta Starbuck’s every time.

 
Comment by speedingpullet
2008-07-02 08:55:25

Wow, peter a - put those diabetes/pre-diabetes numbers together and that’s about 1 in 11 of the entire US population!

If it was an infectious disease, people would be right in calling it a plague. We’re a really sick country.

If any good were to come out of higher energy prices, it might be the staving off of full-blown diabetes to some of these people.
I don’t mean it in a callous way at all, but maybe a better diet and some exercise will help them.

 
Comment by charliegator in Gainesville, Florida
2008-07-02 09:04:31

It’s not a bar! It’s group therapy!

 
Comment by tresho
2008-07-02 09:32:30

There’s evidence that Type 2 diabetes is mostly inherited not acquired. Young, vigorous, healthy & thin 20-somethings were studied somewhere in Europe, in 2 groups depending on whether their parents & GPs had Type 2 DM or not. Blood tests & positron-emission studies of cellular metabolism showed the Type 2 descendants already had a substantial deficit in glucose metabolism in their mitochondria as opposed to the control group. The groups are being followed over the years to see what happens. I don’t have a link, those really interested can find it using Google or PubMed.
I suspect ultimately the trigger for Type 2 DM will be either a environmental contaminant or some kind of chronic infection, in people carrying that genetic “defect.” I put the “” around defect because the genetic pattern also protects against starvation, a far bigger risk of death for traditional human populations than overeating/obesity. The closest thing to a “cure” for Type 2 DM is surgical alteration of the GI tract causing what amounts to chronic starvation. Severe exercise regimens may also do that, for those who are willing to spend their remainder of their lives either exercising or resting up after exercising — IMHO this is not much of a life.
Research $ on this subject are rather scarce since it’s unlikely a patentable drug for the condition will ever be found. Corporations are unlikely to invest much, and the US government is asleep at the switch.
Those not susceptible to Type 2 DM are expected to pooh-pooh my ideas & continue to throw human waste at those with the ailment & its prodrome.

 
Comment by speedingpullet
2008-07-02 09:58:09

Fascinating, tresho!

So you’re saying that, in many cases, type 2 is ‘hereditary’ rather than environmental?

I don’t know much about the subject, but I did an internship in medical stats back in the early 90’s, working on a long-term study of health and growth of UK schoolkids.

Even back then, the trend for diabetes was getting higher, but no one really had a handle on why, so thanks for the update on the research.

So, does the study you referenced infer that the rise in diabetes is due to the increase in ‘descendants’ of Type II parents, or are there other, non-genetic factors to take into account?

I know that the skyrocketing Autism diagnosis numbers are due, in part, to better diagnostics and refitting the symptoms associated with it, so I wonder if the rise in diabetes diagnoses might also be due to something similar..?

PS: I’d never throw poo at anyone ;-)

 
Comment by tresho
2008-07-02 11:16:24

the study you referenced infer that the rise in diabetes is due to the increase in ‘descendants’ of Type II parents, or are there other, non-genetic factors to take into account?
The point of the study I cited was to detect any inherited metabolic abnormalities in the descendants of Type II DM that might help explain the condition. They did find something very suggestive at the mitochondrial level. Until recently it had been impossible to follow glucose metabolism at the cellular level in different organs of a human being. It remains to be seen how the detected variations play out over a lifetime.
The study made no reference to whether or not the number of descendants of Type II ancestors is increasing among the general population.
It is certain that the onset of Type II DM is extremely gradual, probably taking decades, as opposed to Type I DM, which is typically abrupt & relates to massive & sudden destruction of pancreatic beta cells. The slow onset of Type II suggests a multiplicity of causes.
So, if Type II DM starts with genes, why has it only recently become such a severe problem? Genes don’t change that much from one decade to the next unless a genetic subgroup has annihilated. Your genetic makeup is not that different from that of your great-grandparents, unless you have had genes implanted somehow from a source outside of your ancestry.
There are many factors that change the effect of genes, toxins and chronic infections are two that are particularly hard to trace, that’s why I mentioned them. Epigenetics is another very weird process: an short-lasting event at some point in your life can alter the way your genetic makeup expresses itself, sometimes the effect is not reversible. This PBS special goes into this at greater depth for those interested.
Type II DM is way more complex than commonly appreciated, even by physicians. Telling people to eat less and exercise more is often just another way to dodge the issue and blame the patient when medicine has no better way to manage the problem.

 
Comment by tresho
2008-07-02 11:25:12

skyrocketing Autism diagnosis numbers One possible cause or contributing factor is assortative mating. Populations with a genetic proclivity for having autistic children are more likely to select within themselves for mating & also to have children, than in centuries past, due to economic & cultural factors. Diagnosing any disease based solely on observed behavior is a tricky process & much prone to errors and controversies.

 
Comment by Gadfly
2008-07-02 11:34:07

The Standard American Diet (S.A.D.) may work (barely) for caucasian euro-americans, but it has wreaked havoc upon the Native American population where Type II Diabetes sufferers are epidemic. Better diagnoses are not causal as to the recent high numbers–merely a correlation.

Autism, too, was relatively rare until the last 25-30 years. How many adults over, say, age 40 have been “better diagnosed” with autism?

No matter how you slice it–the numbers are way up for Type II diabetes, autism, auto-immune disorders, cancer and several others diseases.

So it’s the old chicken-egg conundrum. Heredity vs. environment. Those who are genetically susceptible (determined by testing) to Type II would do well to eschew the high carb/sugar diets. Same for those who might be “susceptible” to autism via mercury toxicity. [BTW, whoever the genius was who thought of putting thimerisol into vaccines ought to be shot]. Maybe we should breed humans whose genetic make-up most closely resembles that of the cockroach?

 
Comment by Gadfly
2008-07-02 11:59:08

Genetic predisposition is the scientific community’s version of “running home to momma”. It’s a dianostic panacea that blames the victim and appeases the masses while ignoring the elephant in the living room.

Unbiased science should take ALL factors into consideration when studying the causes of disease. I would submit that the alphabet soup health agencies are acting in a very unscientific manner when, for example, they dismiss out-of-hand any link between mercury/thimerosol and autism.

Same goes for studying fluoride. Nutrasweet. Type II Diabetes and the food industry. Follow the money–always.

Regulators, health agencies and professional trade groups are all about protecting their corporate masters as the conflicts of interest run roughshod over scientific objectivity.

 
Comment by tresho
2008-07-02 21:29:27

Genetic predisposition is the scientific community’s version of “running home to momma” Go argue with a PET scanner.

 
 
Comment by shakes
2008-07-02 06:39:55

My wife loves Starbuck’s and I have to admit I like it too, but $3.50 for a latte when I can make one for $.50 is what chapped my ass. I bought an espresso machine and I call my latte’s SaveABuck’s cause I save 3 bucks on each drink. I have more then paid off my equipment costs and I have save countless gallons of gasoline by staying home and making them!!

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Comment by BanteringBear
2008-07-02 11:09:00

I did the same several months ago. It’s already paid for itself.

 
Comment by potential buyer
2008-07-02 16:31:26

Was autism rare 30 years agi or just misdiagnosed?

 
 
 
Comment by Professor Bear
2008-07-02 07:11:27

“Let’s just say that in 3 years, Starbucks will likely have reopened the same number of stores, just in different locations.”

Keep drinking the caffeinated koolaide, pal.

Comment by BanteringBear
2008-07-02 11:11:50

“Glory days, well they’ll pass you by glory days…”

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Comment by Gadfly
2008-07-02 12:11:12

And I’ll bet you a triple shot mocha latte half-caf skim milk with hazelnut that in three years SBucks will operate about half the stores they have now.

Got Folgers?

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Comment by watcher
2008-07-02 05:11:08

Starbucks = Famous Amos cookies = fad.

Comment by NoSingleOne
2008-07-02 07:50:28

Caffeine is an addiction for many people. Famous Amos cookies were more of a luxury. People often view coffee as a necessity to start their day.

Comment by cactus
2008-07-02 08:47:13

McDonalds is serving all kinds of coffee cheaper than Starbucks

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Comment by jrochest
2008-07-02 14:15:30

Yes, but have you TASTED MickeyD’s coffee?

I’d rather drink battery acid.

 
 
Comment by NotInMontana
2008-07-02 09:01:12

I still don’t get it. You don’t have to go to Starbucks for caffeine. People made their own coffee at home for many years. We had percolators and coffee funnels then drip machines and stuff like that. I used to buy Starbucks grounds at Walmart, then I found some other cheaper brands. There are even coffee makers in the workplace, I hear tell. And pop - all sorts of way to get high.

I suppose it’s the latte angle…not worth it IMO.

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Comment by tresho
2008-07-02 09:40:04

On my road trips I travel with a Bialetti Moka Express and the minimal Coleman propane burner for emergency coffee making. Traveling through west Texas one 2005 morning I couldn’t find a decent cup of coffee anywhere. I parked at an emergency turnoff, set up my system on the ground & brewed some decent stuff at the roadside. It was ambrosia. I would have preferred Starbucks, but there warn’t none.

 
Comment by ET-Chicago
2008-07-02 10:10:58

On my road trips I travel with a Bialetti Moka Express and the minimal Coleman propane burner for emergency coffee making.

I’m torn between admiration and the urge to make fun of you …

 
Comment by tresho
2008-07-02 11:30:13

I’m torn between admiration and the urge to make fun of you … I should have mentioned I never stay in paid lodging unless someone else pays for it, otherwise I live out of my truck camper the way to visit friends & relatives scattered all over the US. If you ever see a black F150 with a red, white & blue homebrew shell on it, that’s me.

 
 
Comment by Professor Bear
2008-07-02 09:33:45

I am admit to being mildly addicted to caffeine. (I have quit for a couple of weeks at a time over the past few years to make sure that I am not seriously addicted.)

Anyway, Trader Joe’s line of dark roasts has worked just fine to help me maintain my habit, for at most 1/3 the cost of Pete’s or Starbucks at 100% of the taste. I guess I am one of those odd folks who feels the need to hang out with other caffeine addicts in order to enjoy my fix.

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Comment by BanteringBear
2008-07-02 11:16:11

Do they sell decaf?

 
Comment by Olympiagal
2008-07-02 11:35:27

‘Do they sell decaf?’

Yes, they do. I like Trader Joe’s coffee. I love Trader Joe’s in general. The nearest one to you, bear, is probably in Portland OR.

 
Comment by BanteringBear
2008-07-02 12:11:00

Thanks, Oly. Closest one is Federal Way. They should have one in Olympia. What are they thinking?

 
 
 
 
Comment by Ann
2008-07-02 05:54:41

Let’s see…lower the price of overpriced coffee(which during the housing boom made serious $$$ for starbucks) or fire employees (who get paid little to make overpriced coffee)..mmmmm…fire the employees!

God Bless America..

Comment by Tim
2008-07-02 06:02:50

To be fair, no company should keep employees on if doing so would hurt the company long run. It is not fair to shareholders.

Comment by tresho
2008-07-02 09:44:07

not fair to shareholders This better describes the publicly-held corporations that are chiefly interested in rewarding CEOs and their cronies, shareholders be damned.

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Comment by A.B. Dada
2008-07-02 06:05:16

The problem with what you’re slyly saying is that all businesses have to deal with input costs (supplies, labor, rent, utilities, etc).

Some items have input costs that are not easily modified, especially if your branding is based on a particular item’s level of quality. There is rarely better coffee than Starbucks, who buy items that are quickly moving up in price thanks to your Fed’s dollar destruction policy. Labor, though, is an input cost that is generally easy to deal with. Firing someone costs nothing, hiring someone costs training, generally.

For Starbucks to change their coffee quality level would kill their business. In my area, there is an excellent coffee shop that actually roasts their own beans fresh every morning, and they make a great cup of coffee. But Starbucks is consistent, each and every time. I think their market share is there for a reason: consistent service, consistent product, consistent end result. The labor is the LEAST important aspect of their business and brand.

I still stick to my original proposal: I highly doubt Starbucks will be harmed in the downturn significantly. Yes, they’ll close some stores, but I think they’ll open a good number, too. I consider myself a coffeephile and a tea expert, and I can still not mimic the quality of coffee that comes out of Starbucks. It doesn’t matter what beans I use, what machines I use, what water quality I use or anything. The coffee that I buy at Starbucks is well worth the $1.55 or so that I spend. When I splurge (a few times a week), the $3.50 I spend is still worth it, to me. It seems worth it to the many people in line ahead of me at the 3 or 4 Starbucks I frequent.

Remember, people tend to try to cut BIG items out of their budget first. Few realize how costly it is to spend $4 a day on coffee because the individual purchases are minimal. How many people go over their monthly spending to see where they’re losing money? I do, but most of my friends and peers do not.

Comment by wolfgirl
2008-07-02 06:34:20

I have to disagree with the consistent statement concerning Starbucks coffee. When my youngest daughter started at Barnes and Noble, they put her in the Starbucks side for a couple of weeks. She was hired for the service desk, but someone was onvacation. She had no idea how to make the drinks and left a crucial ingredient out. No one ever complained that their drink didn’t taste right. She’s still at Barnes and Noble and will not buy coffee from Starbucks.

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Comment by Dani W
2008-07-02 10:43:35

what, you push a button - the machines are automated. There’s no crucial ingredients other than the coffee itself.

 
Comment by wolfgirl
2008-07-02 11:45:57

She left out something. Maybe it was a latte or other fancy drink. But she realized it when someone showed her how to make it right. She won’t go to Starbucks now.

 
 
Comment by Tim
2008-07-02 06:57:28

There have been many studies that show that consumers in blind taste tests prefer McDonalds are QuickTrip coffee. You pay for the label and to be around others that want to pay for the label.

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Comment by 9down
2008-07-02 08:22:48

Mcdonald’s is using the same type of beans and i usually go there if I need to “drive-thru” (3 kids in car seats). My only problem is the cream choice (I prefer whole milk). You still have those crappy cream packets. You can ask for cream to be put in, but i’m not sure what I’m getting. As for price, it’s about the same as starbucks. All in all, I happy to have a choice when I can’t get out of the car.

 
Comment by Ol'Bubba
2008-07-02 08:58:11

That’s the one thing about McDonald’s coffee that pisses me off. If you’re going to charge a premium price for coffee, then you should be able to provide it anyway the customer wants. If you have to pay over a buck for a cup of coffee, they should offer half and half, whole milk, 2% milk and skim milk.

I HATE Starbucks for ruining the way coffee is sold in America. Before Starbucks you could get a cup for under a buck with free refills.

I prefer brewing my own coffee in the morning. It probably cost me about 50 cents a pot, including ground coffee, milk, and sweet and low.

 
Comment by desertdweller
2008-07-02 10:24:31

I saw just that thing in the chicago airport Mc D’s one day. The customer paid for coffee and asked for real cream/half-half and McDs asked for more money. The customer quietly had words with them. Eventually got their half/half for free. I couldn’t believe McDs would charge extra for cream/halfhalf. Sheesh.

 
Comment by incredulous
2008-07-02 10:45:59

In europe McDs charges for ketchup packets.

 
 
Comment by Lip
2008-07-02 06:58:53

ABD,

I have to agree with you in that they won’t be harmed that much in the future. I can get a decent cup of java for $2, with plenty of caffeine and with a good strong flavor or for $1.50 I get something with less quality. Therefore for me the slight extra cost is worth the quality and I think this is true for many others.

Lip

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Comment by peaceful
2008-07-02 08:27:33

I guess its a personal thing. . . I think Starbucks coffee is often too bitter and I only like a few of their flavors . . .

I think 7-eleven and Jack in the Box have superior coffee, and I drink a lot of coffee . . . and have had to drink a lot of Starbucks because places I’ve worked and their cafes have supplied that . . .

I like the atmosphere of the place “Starbucks” and like to go “there”, but not for their unique coffee.

 
Comment by SF Mechanist
2008-07-02 08:47:07

Starbucks coffee is meh to me, it’s okay but done better elsewhere… the pastries have a weird taste that I won’t touch.

I support Starbucks in so far as it distracts the yuppies from the places I do like. Once they discover the nicer places my favorite spots go to hell in a handbasket in no time.

 
 
Comment by Skip
2008-07-02 08:00:16

I seem to recall reading that SBUX paid more for health insurance per year for their employees than coffee.

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Comment by tresho
2008-07-02 09:50:12

I wonder how much of the cost of the least-expensive Starbucks cup goes for employee health-care benefits? As opposed to, say, McDonald’s coffee…

 
Comment by Skip
2008-07-02 10:39:15

http://www.forbes.com/2005/09/15/starbucks-healthcare-benefits-cx_cn_0915autofacescan01.html

The company’s chairman told U.S. legislators yesterday that it will spend more on employee health insurance this year than on raw materials to brew its coffee. Starbucks (nasdaq: SBUX - news - people ) provides health care coverage to employees who work at least 20 hours a week, which will add up to about $200 million this year for health care for its 80,000 U.S. employees. But Schultz that Starbucks’ benefits policy is a key factor in the company’s low employee turnover and high productivity.

 
 
Comment by Incredulous
2008-07-02 08:33:48

I make WAY better coffee than anything available at Starbucks–using Cuban coffee and a cloth straining funnel. Everyone who has ever tasted it has flipped out and asked for my secret. There is no secret. The darkly roasted Cuban cofee, which is moist, not dry, in a perfectly measured amount (not the amount used to make traditional Cuban coffee) is all it takes. No brewing, steeping, or bubbling. No expensive equipment. Dump the coffeee in the funnel, pour the water in, and viola! Perfect coffee every time. In about one minute, for less than ten cents a cup.

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Comment by Rintoul
2008-07-02 08:50:52

Do you grind the beans? How fine?

 
Comment by Incredulous
2008-07-02 09:43:16

No, I buy Cuban coffee already ground. It’s very abundant here in Tampa, and there are lots of great brands. They’re all dark and moist, and most are a large-to medium grind . Cafe Bustelo (in the bag or can) is one of my favorites. Because it’s very darkly roased and very moist, you can easily measure a HEAPING teaspoon’s worth (this doesn’t work with drier coffees), which is all it takes for one normal-size cup (not mug). It’s much stronger and far more aromatic that most coffees, so less is more.

You need a soft cloth funnel (not a paper drip bag). Dump in the coffee and pour the water over it. It runs through very fast unless you’re making a lot; when it stops dripping, use tongs to squeeze the end of the bag. That’s it. You can make it stronger by using more coffee. If you make it weaker, it ceases to be interesting and starts tasting like American coffee. If you want traditional Cuban coffee, use a level tablespoon for each cup, and use smaller cups.

 
Comment by tresho
2008-07-02 09:48:26

You need a soft cloth funnel Interesting recipe, I’d like to try it. What kind of cloth? Would multiple layers of cheesecloth work to make the funnel? Could a French press coffee maker do the same thing?

 
Comment by Incredulous
2008-07-02 10:43:44

I don’t know. The cloth funnels, made from cotton, are sold everywhere here. I suppose you could try a paper drip funnel. It needs to be a true funnel, very narrow at the bottom. There’s no need to press; just let the water run through. I think 8 ounces per cup, unless you’re making Cuban coffee, in which case it would something like 4-6 ounces per cup. A heaping teaspoon of coffee is a little less than a tablespoon.

Cafe Bustelo is readily available, but there are other, better brands. I haven’t made coffee in a while, except for instant (ugh), and I can’t remember all the brand names. One that pops into mind is La Norma, but I cannot find it on the internet, so perhaps it no longer exists. There was one made here in Tampa in Ybor City, but I can’t remember the name (yellow package). A popular brand is Pilon, but if I recall, it’s too finely ground to work with my simple method.

For Cuban coffee, you would use a whole tablespoon (or even heaping tablespoon) per cup, and dump the coffee into the pot of hot water, and stir and let steep for a while, before pouring it through the funnel. The final product could be labeled coffee concentrate.

 
Comment by Incredulous
2008-07-02 11:05:44

Note that the other person calling himself/herself Incredulous is using a small “i.” I don’t know why some newbies have to use other posters’ handles. I’ve been posting here for what, three years, more?

 
Comment by navygator
2008-07-02 12:09:38

For all you MD, PA, NJ, DE & VA people… nothing beats a cup of WAWA coffee… especially since its about $1.25 for a 20oz! They also sell the bags for you to brew at home. While living in FL and WA, hubby and I had relatives ship us boxes of WAWA. Their hoagies are the best too. I think the reason my hubby asked for orders back to this area was so he could have WAWA everyday!

 
Comment by phillygal
2008-07-02 13:34:03

YES

chocolate caramel flavor

if you ever drive north up 95, stop by the Wawa mothership, it’s on Baltimore Pike (rte 1) just south of Media, PA.

http://www.wawa.com/WawaWeb/Timeline.aspx

 
 
 
Comment by combotechie
2008-07-02 06:07:07

Part of the mystique of “The Starbucks “Experience” was the price of its coffee. Lower the price and you put a dent into its mystique.

The trick is to lower the price without announcing a price cut, i.e. two-for-one days, dollar specials, coupons, etc. … that sort of thing.

Comment by Tim
2008-07-02 06:16:51

I often wonder how many high priced foods and restaurants would no longer be desired if they were cheaply priced. Ppl often prefer the exclusive nature of product, often derived from price alone, more than the product itself. When I go to my brother’s house for dinner he goes on and on about how he got the steaks through lobels and how expensive they were. They dont taste any better than what’s on sale at the local supermarket once you find a good store.

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Comment by combotechie
2008-07-02 06:32:32

A bit off topic, but related …

A little while back Tiffanys was selling vast numbers of silver bracelets to teen aged girls. It seems the fad for these bracelets swept through the teen-age ranks and every one of these girls just had to have one.

Good for Tiffanys right? Wrong. Tiffanys did not want their name associated with buying habits of mere teen age girls. The exclusitivity of their name was to be protected at all costs. So, after trying, to no avail, to raise the price well beyond these girl’s budgets, Tiffinys stopped selling the bracelets altogether.

Tiffanys could have cashed in big time but didn’t. Unlike Moodys or Standard and Poors, they chose to protect their name rather than bust it out for short term gains.

This act put Tiffanys stock on my buy list, assuming the price ever gets to be reasonable.

FWIW.

 
Comment by JP
2008-07-02 06:37:54

This act put Tiffanys stock on my buy list, assuming the price ever gets to be reasonable.

Maybe they’ve overpriced it in order to avoid being associated with buying habits of HBBers.

 
Comment by aladinsane
2008-07-02 06:46:32

Tiffany in the days of old, made remarkable works of art…

They now crank out junk for the masses, and nobody seems to have caught on.

 
Comment by combotechie
2008-07-02 06:51:01

Tiffanys didn’t overprice the stock, Mr. Market did.

I’m waiting for Mr. Market to get into one of his periodic moods when he thinks everthing in the world is going to sh*t and investing in the stock market is for losers.

 
Comment by aladinsane
2008-07-02 06:52:55

“The main purpose of the stock market is to make fools of as many men as possible.”

Bernard Baruch

 
Comment by combotechie
2008-07-02 06:59:39

Is the same Bernard Baruch that made a fortune in the stock market?

 
Comment by aladinsane
2008-07-02 07:02:40

“Every man has a right to be wrong in his opinions. But no man has a right to be wrong about his facts.”

Bernard Baruch

 
Comment by oxide
2008-07-02 07:35:24

Daayum, that’s good. I’d put it up on my workspace, but I’d just add to my Enemy Pile.

 
Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 07:35:59

Junk for the masses. Like this?

http://www.tiffany.com/Engagement/Item.aspx?sku=19475247

if that’s junk, I’d love to have it.

you really are a blowhard sometimes

 
Comment by aladinsane
2008-07-02 07:54:25

You are obsessed with mere baubles and frequently tell us of yet another piece of modern crud that you bought on the cheap…

Why not expand your horizons and acquire some quality Tiffany gear from way back when, instead?

Here’s a primer:

http://www.metmuseum.org/explore/Tiffany/menu.html

 
Comment by OCDan
2008-07-02 08:48:29

Here we go again.

On and on about this kind of “stuff.” please, everyone just remember that this pretty colorful stone is just that…a stone. Crickey, I paid 10K for a rock. Yeah, and I paid 45K for a ‘vette.

While, I’ll one up all…I paid 200K for a gem mint 10 rated and slabbed ‘52 Topps Mantle.

Geez. It is this kind of thinking that led to the Housing and Credit bubbles.

Stop buying this kind of stuff at overvalued prices.

While you’re at it TX, can you get me the Picasso over there for $100 mil?

 
Comment by ET-Chicago
2008-07-02 08:54:52

On and on about this kind of “stuff.”

If you can actually afford it and it makes you happy … shrug.

Everyone has their “thing.”

 
Comment by lavi d
2008-07-02 09:04:54

This act put Tiffanys stock on my buy list, assuming the price ever gets to be reasonable.

Just don’t eat breakfast there…

 
Comment by combotechie
2008-07-02 09:13:59

“On and on about this kind of ‘Stuff’.”

Personality I agree, it’s just stuff. But as an investor this stuff can be quite profitable.

Back to Tiffanys: Any guy can buy jewelry for their girlfriend at a pawn shop, and lots of jewelry once sold by Tiffanys will eventually find their way into pawnshops.

But pawnshops don’t offer the “Tiffany Experience” and the bragging rights that come with this experience. It’s not enough for a guy to buy his love jewelry, if he loves her that’s what he’ll do.

But if he REALLY loves her he’ll take her to Tiffanys and the couple will experience the joy of being royaly pampered while making their selections.

Afterwards the reward of all-important bragging rights extend the “Tiffany Experience” to the girlfriend as she gets to relive the experience to herself and verbally repeat the experience over and over again to her envious friends.

 
Comment by EmperorNorton_II
2008-07-02 09:43:07

The heighth of American Art is generally thought to have been reached in the 1920’s, and passed away sometime during the Great Depression.

HELOCury goods such as Tiffany aren’t long for this world, when people actually have to pay for them, instead of getting a loan to do so.

 
Comment by combotechie
2008-07-02 09:57:08

Tell your friends, tell everyone you know that Tiffanys is doomed.

 
Comment by EmperorNorton_II
2008-07-02 10:03:25

Fools always rush in, when reason dictates otherwise.

 
Comment by ahansen
2008-07-02 10:03:58

LOL, Combo.

 
Comment by Olympiagal
2008-07-02 10:34:12

Well, combo, I’m a girl, and I wouldn’t waste time being friends with any other girl that would:
1. Get envious over a stone on my finger given my by an a*s-kissy boyfriend.
2. Tolerate me blabbering on and on about getting that stone in a fancy store with my a*s-kissy boyfriend. I mean, how dull can you get? I’ve got way more exciting things to discuss. Frogs, kayaks, things like that. Maybe my shoes, for instance. Yeah! Shoes! Now THERE’S a subject worth blabbering on about!

 
Comment by packman
2008-07-02 10:44:48

Attitudes aside - I’m with aladin on this - sorry tx. While Tiffany does have some *really* nice jewelry, it’s way overpriced IMO, and they’ve lost all of the gorgeous and unique colorful items they once had that made them special. The man was a god in the decorating world, and now that his talent is gone the store has turned into basically an overpriced version of “Things Remembered”, and selling almost nothing but colorless silver and crystal. At least that’s my impression (admittedly not that deep).

FWIW TIF is one of my big shorts. I think they’ll get slammed hard eventually by this downturn, in particular as the financial layoffs continue to mount.

 
Comment by packman
2008-07-02 11:22:21

As a side note - one of TIF’s sources of revenue is employment anniversary gifts - I have a Tiffany pen from years ago in fact. As the layoffs mount, this revenue will be decreasing. Not sure how significant it is though.

 
Comment by combotechie
2008-07-02 11:27:15

Oly -

Well, you are a treat, frogs, kayaks and all, and I wouldn’t think you’d be overly dazzled by Tiffanys.

But there are those women who are. Call them plastic, superficial, me-orientated, high-maintenence, whatever - these women are out there. And so are their deep poketed men friends.

It’s not you and it’s not me that cares a whit about Tiffany’s stuff; I only care about it’s performance as a going concern. If priced right it’s a buy. If priced right most anything is a buy.

 
Comment by azman
2008-07-02 12:02:50

What about a market for Tiffany’s boxes?
Buy the box for $5 on Ebay and the item at the pawnshop

Like she’s gonna notice…

 
Comment by johnk
2008-07-02 13:01:47

I would recommend against that. I did some consulting at Tiffanys many years back and they had an employee store. I bought a $5 date book that came in one of those fancy blue boxes. I then took the box and put a ring you can get out of a gumball machine and wrapped it up all nice for my then girlfriend. Her eyes lit up when she saw the box and then saw the ring. Then after about a second she was not smiling anymore. I just could not resist doing it. Suffice to say the relationship did not last, but it was something I could not pass up.

 
Comment by combotechie
2008-07-02 13:40:53

“Her eyes lit up when she saw the box …”

Proof positive of the magic of the name Tiffany.

How much is such a name worth? What price should one put on it?

 
Comment by EmperorNorton_II
2008-07-02 13:42:15

Apparently $5.00 is the going rate.

 
Comment by combotechie
2008-07-02 15:06:14

Then put the name on five-hundred million boxes that cost a nickel each and you’ve made yourself a fortune.

 
Comment by EmperorNorton_II
2008-07-02 15:09:51

Is that the best you got, Willy Loman?

 
Comment by combotechie
2008-07-02 16:37:38

Since you asked…

The best of what I’ve got includes cash and the patience to wait and buy quality when offered at a discount.

Tiffanys offers the quality, time and circumstances may offer the discount.

 
 
Comment by incredulous
2008-07-02 10:51:39

About a year ago 20/20 found a bunch of Vodka snobs (evidently there are a bunch of designer Vodkas retailing for $50-$100 a bottle) and did a blind taste comparison and threw in some cheapo $5 generic vodkas. There was absolutely no correlation between price and which vodkas were chosen. You should have seen the reaction of those who picked the cheapo no-name bottles, one even rationalized that he still preferred the $100 bottle for “its design”.

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Comment by peter a
2008-07-02 16:41:38

I did electrical work for a bottler of spirits here in Mira Loma .
They would use the same vat of vodka for the $5, $10, $20 bottles same vodka different labels.

 
 
 
 
Comment by joeyinCalif
2008-07-02 06:07:14

On the rare occasion i voluntarily walk into a starbucks it’s because there’s no McDonalds or somewhere else to get a quick cup of coffee at a fair price.
Thing is that i feel very uncomfortable in starbucks.. it’s like walking into a strange bar.. as if everyone knows everyone and knows what’s going on.. everyone except me.

People don’t go to Starbuck’s for the coffee any more than people go to bars for the liquor.. they go there to hang out with other people.

Comment by packman
2008-07-02 06:44:03

It’s very highly location dependent. I seek out Starbucks often on road trips, including beside interstates, because it’s a known entity where I can get good coffee (McDonalds coffee - blech). Most of the time there’s a line of people doing the same thing - just getting their coffee and getting out.

In downtown/touristy areas though you’re right - there are tons of people just hanging out.

I shorted SBUX for a while and made a little, but got out since I think they’ll end up doing OK in the long run. It’s a good place for out-of-work people to hang out, so they may even do well during a depression :)

Comment by joeyinCalif
2008-07-02 06:57:58

Tried the new McDonalds coffee yet? They put a lot of money and effort into offering what they call “Premium Roast” coffee. To my admittedly unsophisticated pallet, it tasted just like Sbux and is worth a try, imo.

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Comment by lavi d
2008-07-02 09:11:14

To my admittedly unsophisticated pallet…

What the heck are you doing pouring coffee on your bed?

;)

 
Comment by Olympiagal
2008-07-02 10:36:13

‘What the heck are you doing pouring coffee on your bed?’

Hahahahaha! Thank you. That was funny.

 
Comment by packman
2008-07-02 10:49:42

How new are you talking? McD’s tried the premium roast thing I think about 10 years go I think, and it wasn’t bad actually, but last I saw I thought they had discontinued it. Maybe it was just the locations I went to at the time though. I don’t go to McD’s unless I’m really desperate - the food is horrendous compared with other similarly-priced fast food.

 
Comment by joeyinCalif
2008-07-02 11:29:31

new as in less than a year.

March 2007
We compared the rivals with Starbucks, all in basic black–no flavors, milk, or sugar–and you know what? McDonald’s beat the rest. Our trained tasters, who visited two locations from each company, spill the beans below (prices are an average of what we paid for the closest thing to a medium cup)…

http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/food/beverages/coffee-tea/coffee-taste-test-3-07/overview/0307_coffee_ov_1.htm

 
Comment by packman
2008-07-02 12:55:10

Interesting - I’ll have to give it a shot. I’m certain they did it before though too - this isn’t their first foray into premium coffee.

I do however place absolutely zero credibility into “taste tests”. Tastes are very subjective, and tastes are acquired for many things like coffee and alcohol. Usually taste tests are performed by the “general public”, the majority of which drink things like Bud Light, and white zinfandel - things I could maybe drink years ago but now can no longer stand.

Guess that all sounded pretentious. Oh well.

 
 
Comment by Ouro Verde
2008-07-02 07:23:14

Yeah, when I did travel alot, I had to have a starbucks in walking distance, otherwise I’d never wake up with hotel coffee.

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Comment by Anonymous Coward
2008-07-02 10:12:40

Ok, I live in Seattle and somebody’s got to say it: “Charbucks” serves absolutely HORRIBLE coffee. It doesn’t matter what beans they use, it all has that bitter burnt flavor. It’s their roasting process, as the flavor permeates all their beans/blends. The only way their coffee is drinkable is if you add enough things (milk, sugar, flavorings) so that you don’t taste the coffee itself.
Locally, Tully’s is my favorite. And when I travel, there’s usually a Gloria Jeans within a block or two of the hotel. Although I did happily find a Tully’s in Tokyo a few years back…

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Comment by sfv_hopeful
2008-07-02 14:47:50

Ah, Tully’s. I agree with you 100%. Tully’s was my coffee of choice for the very reasons you mention, until I discovered how to buy green AAA or AAAA rated “Cumbre Supremo” beans, then roast and brew them in small batches. Mmmmmm….

 
Comment by oc-ed
2008-07-03 00:23:52

I have to back you up on that one. SBux always tasted burnt to me too and a friend of mine who owns a coffee house supports that. He is second generation coffee people and he says they burn it.

 
 
 
Comment by GrittyToasterWaffleGuy
2008-07-02 06:59:04

My Mom gets a Chai Latte every morning at Starbucks (she lives near Seattle and works downtown, and I think there’s a constitutional requirement up there to visit a Starbucks at least once a day. From time to time, people give me Starbucks gift cards (for birthdays, Christmas, etc.) I usually just hand them over to her as long as I have at least one with $20 on it. That $20 generally lasts me most of a year. And it’s not like I don’t drink coffee. I’ve just never gotten the whole Starbucks concept.

 
Comment by Ouro Verde
2008-07-02 07:21:27

Joey, that is exactly the way I feel. Like everyone is cool and hey, i’m not. It makes me squirmy. But I did see a bunch of movie stars in the malibu starbucks. That was cool.
Trader joes double dark coffee brews up great.

Comment by hoz
2008-07-02 08:05:04

SPQR

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Comment by EmperorNorton_II
2008-07-02 08:56:26

S.P.Q.A.

 
 
Comment by Dani W
2008-07-02 10:49:15

Of course, the really cool people frequent the local indie coffee house. ;)

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Comment by tresho
2008-07-02 12:00:55

In my town the really cool people frequent the beer locker at the local grocery store.

 
 
 
 
Comment by qaxbami
2008-07-02 06:22:37

Will organic/natural brands be taking a hit because, like Starbucks, you have to pay a premium for them?

Comment by Ed G
2008-07-02 07:27:22

Heck yeah. Whole Foods WFMI is on my short-list.

Comment by oxide
2008-07-02 08:09:40

Whole Paycheck has gone bi-polar boutique. They tried to attract the Dean&DeLuca crowd with their high-end wine and cheese, while simultaneously keeping their original tree-hugging clientele with an ever-shrinking selection of natural products. In the process they alienated both demographics.

Tree-huggers are now going to farmers markets and filling in the gaps with a few natural products from normal grocery stores (who wisely stocked up on the popular green products).

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Comment by speedingpullet
2008-07-02 08:47:07

Whole Paycheck is just too expensive for me - even with the introduction of the ‘365′ range.
Plus, my local one has 2 out of 8 aisles full of tat like vitamin suppliments, essential oils and clothes made out of organic twine and shoes made out of cornish pasties…

I’d rather spend my money at Trader Joes - I can still get organic and free range, and at a price that’s comparable with a ‘regular’ supermarket.

Although, the deli counter at Whole Foods is to die for.. ;-)

 
Comment by Arizona Slim
2008-07-02 13:25:55

Shoes made out of Cornish pasties? Now, that is footwear that this HBB-er of Cornish descent can get excited about!

 
 
Comment by packman
2008-07-02 11:33:08

Ed - good call. I’ve never seen such a steady incline, then steady decline, as WFMI. I owned some for a while, unfortunately just after it had started its decline. One of the dumbest investments I ever made (second only to Webvan). Gritted my teeth as I sold for a significant loss, but now glad I did since it’s down 60% more still. I should have shorted it dangit.

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Comment by ET-Chicago
2008-07-02 08:40:48

Will organic/natural brands be taking a hit because, like Starbucks, you have to pay a premium for them?

It depends on pricing and value, just like everything else. Organic isn’t necessarily more expensive than “conventional,” it just depends on your sources and methods.

It’s pretty easy to beat Whole Foods’ prices and quality on most organic items around here — between the excellent local fruit market, the farmer’s markets, and local meat purveyors, I can get what we want at prices that’re competitive with conventionally grown foodstuffs at the local supermarket.

 
 
Comment by Arizona Slim
2008-07-02 07:51:47

Here’s another sign of the times:

Upset homeowner shoots real estate agent

Comment by cactus
2008-07-02 08:56:45

Tague told WOOD-TV in Grand Rapids that Johnson believed that VanderStelt took advantage of him in a real estate deal. Johnson bought a house through him in 2005, then recently decided to sell it and went to a different real estate agent. The second agent told Johnson that, because of the slumping housing market, the home was not worth what he had paid for it.

 
Comment by lavi d
2008-07-02 11:35:24

Here’s another sign of the times:

And another:

Foreclosure crisis hurting renters, too

 
 
 
Comment by IllinoisBob
2008-07-02 04:41:08

The chart of delinquent loans has an exponential curve!

Small Banks’ Reckoning Day Is Coming
Billions in Troubled Construction Loans
Promise to Pose Test for Regional Lenders

Wall Street is bracing for regional and small banks to fess up to large losses from their mounting volume of soured construction loans made primarily to home builders.

According to the Federal Deposit Insurance Corp., $45.4 billion of the $631.8 billion in construction loans outstanding at the end of the first quarter were delinquent. When banks announce second-quarter results in coming weeks, they are expected to report sharp increases in loans that builders can’t repay. Banks are also facing intensifying pressure from federal and state regulators to deal with the problem loans on their books.

 
Comment by IllinoisBob
Comment by edgewaterjohn
2008-07-02 05:17:52

The CRE train wreck ought to be something to watch in and of itself. Looks like BOA is choking on the LaSalle too.

 
 
Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 04:52:15
Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2008-07-02 07:53:24

Many moons ago, a friend of mine wanted to go on a full-on bender through a three-day weekend.

He didn’t even make it to Saturday evening.

This is harder than people think it is. ;-)

Comment by bluprint
2008-07-02 10:37:41

no sh!t.

you gotta pace yourself.

I’m not sure I’ve ever even made it 24 hours. My best is probably ~18 hours (bachelor party). Starting with golf in the morning and ending with leaving the strip club. That was a good day/night, but I paid for it the next two days. Well, I paid for some of in the club…those places are expensive.

 
Comment by Olympiagal
2008-07-02 10:38:49

Maybe he just needs more practice. :)

Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2008-07-02 11:03:05

He was plenty experienced. I don’t think he realized that the rules for a three-day bender are totally different from a typical bender.

To those of us who went home, slept it off, and went back the following (Sat) evening, it was quite funny. Particularly, since he turned green looking at the “fresh” alcohol we brought in. :-D

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Comment by ET-Chicago
2008-07-02 08:47:07

Is that next Sunday’s magazine? It wasn’t in this Sunday’s.

I’ll look for it.

Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 09:21:18

link to the article is in the blog now

staggering lifestyle that man has. 24K square foot house in Palm Beach that he lives in with a cat

I don’t begrudge him a dime of it. I’ve been listening to him since the early 1990s and never get tired of it.

Comment by EmperorNorton_II
2008-07-02 09:45:02

Joseph Goebbels had a sweet pad, as well.

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Comment by tresho
2008-07-02 10:05:57

Godwin’s Law strikes again.

 
Comment by Cowtown
2008-07-02 10:09:14

I hereby declare Godwin’s Law to be invoked.

 
Comment by Cowtown
2008-07-02 10:10:36

Bah, you beat me to it.

 
Comment by phillygal
2008-07-02 13:10:07

The Bits Bucket was Godwinned much earlier than Emp Norton’s post:

Comment by hondje
2008-07-02 07:27:16
Hmm, well, I still say McCain’s spiritual advisor’s idea that Hitler was sent by God is still a pretty kooky idea…

Sorry, EN_II, you weren’t FIRST!
:-(

 
 
Comment by ET-Chicago
2008-07-02 09:51:53

It’s a pretty lengthy article to read onscreen (for me, at least), but the little lady loves to get the Sunday Times … us bein’ Tree Sodomizing Elitists and all that.

So I’ll have something to look forward to — the article, not the hanky panky with the local tree population.

(Pretty nice cover photo, huh?)

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Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 11:15:48

total compensation pkg north of 400M apparently

higher than couric, brian williams and diane sawyer combined.

I think that is very funny

gives you an idea of how potent flyover country really is

 
Comment by EmperorNorton_II
2008-07-02 11:24:54

I’ve driven through flyover country, and it’s quite common to only find one station on your a.m. radio dial in many places, with right-wing propaganda blaring, and one host always makes special mention that there is no need to think, as he’ll do it for you.

 
Comment by Arwen_U
2008-07-02 16:18:34

From the article:

“Recently, Pew reported that, on a series of “news knowledge questions,” Limbaugh’s “Dittoheads” — the defiantly self-mocking term for his faithful, supposedly brainwashed, audience — scored higher than NPR listeners . . .readers of newsmagazines, political magazines and business magazines, listeners of Rush Limbaugh and NPR and viewers of the Daily Show and C-SPAN are also much more likely than the average person to have a college degree.”

 
 
Comment by lavi d
2008-07-02 11:54:17

I don’t begrudge him a dime of it. I’ve been listening to him since the early 1990s and never get tired of it.

“I mean, let’s face it, we didn’t have slavery in this country for over 100 years because it was a bad thing. Quite the opposite: slavery built the South. I’m not saying we should bring it back; I’m just saying it had its merits. For one thing, the streets were safer after dark”

“We’re not sexists, we’re chauvinists — we’re male chauvinist pigs, and we’re happy to be because we think that’s what men were destined to be. We think that’s what women want.”

“”He is exaggerating the effects of the disease. He’s moving all around and shaking and it’s purely an act. … This is really shameless of Michael J. Fox. Either he didn’t take his medication or he’s acting.”

-Rush Limbaugh

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Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 12:31:25

MCP’s, I wouldn’t put it that way, but we want real men.

 
Comment by BanteringBear
2008-07-02 12:42:44

“When you strip it all away, Jerry Garcia destroyed his life on drugs. And yet he’s being honored, like some godlike figure. Our priorities are out of whack, folks. He’s just another dead drug addict.” (Rush Limbaugh on Jerry Garcia, 8/11/95)

“You know I have always tried to be honest with you and open about my life…I need to tell you today that part of what you have heard and read is correct. I am addicted to prescription pain medication.” (Rush Limbaugh, Friday, October 10, 2003)

The wrong guy died. Rush Limbaugh is a no talent scumbag.

 
Comment by Lost In Utah
2008-07-02 12:54:51

Rush Rush to the cliff and give him the boot.

 
Comment by Olympiagal
2008-07-02 15:45:34

Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 12:31:25
MCP’s, I wouldn’t put it that way, but we want real men.’

What’s a ‘real’ man, tx? Tell us, especially me, as I’m all in a fever of curiosity.

 
 
 
 
Comment by lavi d
2008-07-02 11:39:53

I know this will send catspit on a three day bender

Entertainment has always paid more than news.

Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 12:30:09

you have American Idol and NBA Basketball, I have Rush Limbaugh

Comment by lavi d
2008-07-02 12:45:53

you have American Idol and NBA Basketball, I have Rush Limbaugh

They’re all the same. Their job is to keep you interested long enough to get you through the next commercial.

PS:I have the NFL and don’t own a television.

;)

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Comment by Arizona Slim
2008-07-02 13:29:19

Another HBB-er who doesn’t own a teevee? Dang, I thought I was the only one.

 
Comment by lavi d
2008-07-02 15:11:46

Another HBB-er who doesn’t own a teevee?

I have had several periods of tv-less-ness in my life.

Coincidentally, one was back in the ’80’s when I worked for Jones cable as a technician in, you guessed it… Tucson.

 
Comment by iftheshoefits
2008-07-02 15:37:21

Here’s another tee-vee less HBB’er for you. The internet is all the tee-vee I need.

It’s fun reading about other folks reacting to the talking heads, when never seeing them yourself. It’s like being at the ball park, at the concessions stands, trying to figure out what’s happening on the field from all the noise.

 
Comment by easthawaii
2008-07-02 18:19:29

No TV for 10 years.

 
 
 
 
 
Comment by watcher
2008-07-02 04:52:23

HOUSTON — World demand for oil should continue to climb, despite the doubling of oil prices and weakening economic growth, according to a report released Tuesday by the International Energy Agency.

That should mean tightening supplies, decreasing the odds that drivers will get much relief at the gasoline pump.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/02/business/02oil.html?ref=business

Comment by aladinsane
2008-07-02 06:15:27

America’s freaked out about $5 gas, imagine what they’ll do when supplies surprise everybody and it’s 1973 or 1979 all over again?

Comment by SDGreg
2008-07-02 07:35:42

“America’s freaked out about $5 gas, imagine what they’ll do when supplies surprise everybody and it’s 1973 or 1979 all over again?”

As much impact as the rising prices have had, it should be interesting to see the response to supply disruptions and even higher prices.

Though I wasn’t driving at the time, I do remember the gas lines of the 70’s. As a result, each new car I’ve gotten has always gotten better mileage than the car it replaced. For too many Americans this obviously hasn’t been true. We’re all going to be paying the price soon. What a waste of 30 years.

Comment by aladinsane
2008-07-02 07:39:07

I was a freshly minted driver in 1979, and waited in lines as long as 1/4 of a mile, to get my go-juice fix.

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Comment by calex
2008-07-02 18:07:57

I remember my friends parents would change license plates around because they had 1 even and 1 odd. I don’t know if it was everywhere, but in cali they had odd and even days to go to the gas station based on your license plate.

 
 
 
 
Comment by joeyinCalif
2008-07-02 06:51:45

imo, here’s the thing from an investment point of view..

yes, demand will rise and yes (maybe) actual supply can’t keep up forever… but the situation is NOT critical. It’s NOT urgent. It’s going to take many years before even the worst of predictions about a shortage actually materialize.

We see oil prices skyrocketing .. $140 bbl.. maybe go up 160 or 180 based on fear, speculation and a few economic factors..

It’s already a great opportunity for profit taking.
A few of the largest speculators can bail out whenever they feel like it. Oil falls to perhaps $100 or less in a matter of hours. Small investors get reamed, just as happened when gold hit $1,010/oz.

The same fear-factors drive the price up again.. then they dump it again. I can see several such cycles happening in the coming years.

Comment by slorenter
2008-07-02 07:51:29

Ummm check the price of gold buddy, its back up to 940 now. oil is now at what 17 cents a cup now? instead of 15 cents. Gold,Oil, commodities are all still insanely cheap. They did not even keep up to the bogus CPI inflation numbers the past 20 years, they have a LONG way to climb. Also through in globalization into the mix and you have the perfect storm.
The devaluation of the dollar is by design my friends, welcome to the real world…

Gold at 5k ounce
Oil at $500 barrel

Now we can START talking bubble.

Comment by joeyinCalif
2008-07-02 10:18:05

With no increase in incomes, $150 bbl oil is the tipping point. That’s where more than 12% of income is spent on all things energy related.

That’s when people in general cannot afford to spend more on essentials like gasoline and food (transport), so they begin to cut back.
… and that’s where supply / demand imbalances become meaningful, even in this crazy, speculative market.. and that’s the beginning of the end of the bubblicious commodities-road to instant wealth.

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Comment by oxide
2008-07-02 07:53:34

Thank you Joey. I’m lucky to have an income and live in an area such that gas prices have little more than a psychological effect. Shortages, on the other hand…*shudder*

I got into a discussion about doing semi-homesteading in prep for peak oil. Friend said that shortages are at least 10 years away. I said, well good, because it will probably take 10 years to set up the semi-homestead.

Comment by watcher
2008-07-02 08:30:47

Gas will be rationed in less than 3 years. Prepare faster.

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Comment by OCDan
2008-07-02 09:05:45

Keep in mind that while “Rome burns” the military will get theirs. While we have to ration or go on even/odd days to fill up, the military will get theirs.

As for those who want to drill, like TX. Go ahead. Pay off some congreecritters and start at it. If there is so much oil in the ground in this country there is money to be made. And if there is that much oil, there is “REALLY REALLY BIG MONEY” to be made.

HOWEVER, me thinks that there may not be as much oil as people think. Unfortunately, we have this Pollyanna view in this country, just like a lot of FBs, that the oil will never run out or get to a point that it is more expensive and requires more energy to get than is produced.

Right, and this Christmas I’ll be dressing as Santa Claus and flying around the world in my reindeer-powered sleigh dropping off barrels of oil to all of you godd kiddies. The bad ones get coal for the furnace.

 
Comment by measton
2008-07-02 10:07:55

All you have to look at is the incentives to lie about reserves.

OPEC countries lie so they can produce more. Their production limit was based on reserves. They lied because a bird in the hand is worth 2 in the bush.

The oil majors stock price is related to reserves. If Shell XOM ect told investors that their reserves were depleted you can bet the stock price would fall.

These incentives have resulted in overstated reserves. That being said, a total collapse of the market will drag down oil fast.

 
Comment by tresho
2008-07-02 10:16:09

I’ll be dressing as Santa Claus and flying around the world in my reindeer-powered sleigh dropping off barrels of oil What a horrific mental image, Santa napalming the good kiddies. At least if you don’t get beaned by the coal, you might get some benefit from an airdrop.

 
 
Comment by tresho
2008-07-02 10:18:14

I’m lucky to have an income and live in an area such that gas prices have little more than a psychological effect. I thought you lived in the USA.

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Comment by Sleeper
2008-07-02 11:25:04

My prediction is more like 10 months away. I have been trying to set up a ‘homestead’ myself at my place in Baltimore and the process is daunting to say the least. The house is as efficient as I can reasonably make it and my energy budget is below 5kwh but the ‘victory garden’ is a lot harder in practice than it is on paper and photovoltaic panels on the roof are just a pipe dream right now.

The brown stuff is gonna hit the fan HARD and even though I have known about it for years I’m nowhere near ready for it.

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Comment by A.B. Dada
2008-07-02 05:14:23

Just wanted to give out my opinion on Prosper after using it for a year. Thanks to a lot of comments from mainly this site, I weeded through Prosper listings to find ones that others might not consider low risk, but I do.

In the end, my YOY return was close to 11% with no defaults (very lucky). Most of my loans were only $50 to $100. It was a lot of fun, and I know I helped some people out. My biggest gain, though, was not depositing money into a bank that used the money multiplier effect to create additional liquidity/inflation. Prosper takes my money and loans it direct. This works better than buying CDs or money market accounts.

What were my requirements?

1. Not a homeowner (they list this).
2. Not AA or A credit (> 720 FICO). B or C is fine.
3. Low DTI (Debt-to-Income) ratio, generally under 18%.
4. Not needing money for a real estate investment.
5. Not needing money for a coffee house or a restaurant.
6. Not needing money for a student loan or credit card debt.

My regular loans I bid on were generally for a cheap car, buying equipment for a business (not restaurant-related or RE related), etc.

The fact that I can use advice given here is a boon to those who hang out regularly. While I don’t advocate Prosper for everyone (many people have lost a ton of money), it was and continues to be a great tool to help others and make a little moolah on the side at a reasonable return.

By the way, if you’re interested in Prosper, drop me an email, I get a nice referral commission :)

Comment by Captain Credit Crunch
2008-07-02 06:32:23

Thanks. I’ve had a Prosper account for a year or more and never funded a loan or transfered money in. I just knew there was going to be trouble, but your experience gives me some hope that it’s still possible to direct lend. In this environment of crappy interest rates for saving, this sort of thing is very appealing except that I think I’ll need my principal in a couple years to buy a house.

Comment by A.B. Dada
2008-07-02 06:45:39

CCC: Prosper is a gamble, for sure. I have two friends who lost thousands last year because they invested in bad loans. I would have stayed so far away from their loans it isn’t funny (”I need money to expand my rental property!” or “Help me refinance my credit cards (DTI was 60%, requested interest rate was 28%? Yeah right).

There is one guy on Prosper now looking to invest in green technology. Great credit rating, good stated income, and overall good profile. I’m investing in it myself. Risky, but I think the return will be nice (14% requested, so probably sell for 11%). Lots of opportunities if you check in regularly.

What’s the most you can lose if you go simple? $50? Not a big deal. I showed a friend how to stick in $5000 and make close to 18%, but he takes HUGE risks. So far he’s made out like crazy, but I’m not as risky as he is.

Comment by Ouro Verde
2008-07-02 07:38:53

That gives me shivers just reading about the risks.

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Comment by girlbear
2008-07-02 21:32:33

I’ve checked out Prosper but the one I like better is Virgin Money. It would be where you bring in the borrower and so you would know them and already decided on the risk. Could be a family member or friend but it is done thru the site so all the payments are made thru the contract..

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Comment by yogurt
2008-07-02 06:45:27

My biggest gain, though, was not depositing money into a bank that used the money multiplier effect to create additional liquidity/inflation.

That’s an illusion. The money you loaned was in a bank all along. Unless you loaned cash, in which case it’s temporarily out until it gets to the borrower, who then puts it back in the bank or buys something from someone who does.

Comment by A.B. Dada
2008-07-02 06:48:46

Actually, Prosper only recently became chartered as a bank (in Utah). Until then, it was chartered based on local State regulations regarding co-op financing. I spoke with some of the founders years ago, and it appears that they did not have the ability to use the money multiplier effect to make more money.

Sure, the money I loan out gets deposited in a fractional reserve bank, but that’s not my problem. I’d much rather have a site where I can loan out my gold, but that’s not around and most people would be fearful to borrow in gold denominations as the price has risen significantly over time.

 
 
 
Comment by Maria
2008-07-02 05:27:07

The divorce rates are going up this is from my hair stylist , few of her clients are in process of divorcing. The common factors among the divorces are they have been married for two to three years, bought houses and are in debt.

The salon is high-end salon, so I expect customers to be earning good money. Mind you this is Louisville, not so bubble area.

Asked her about their business; she told me that they have not been affected yet but other small salons have been affected. I think they will soon be affected, as people delay the haircuts by few weeks, less coloring less use of spas etc..

Comment by A.B. Dada
2008-07-02 05:33:25

One thing I’ve wondered about regarding these upper end salons is how their net profit is acquired.

I assume that most salon owners make their primary income renting chairs, right? Or do they own all the chairs and pay a salary/wages to the employees? I know of a few barbershops and salons locally that have weathers almost all downturns because they’ve always focused on low-mid income people, and rent most of their chairs to others, which gives them a more fixed income. Then they make a little cream on the value added items such as the expensive shampoos, conditioners, and accessories.

In my experience, opening a business during a recession in a lower income area tends to be more profitable than opening a business during a boom in an upper income area. YMMV, of course.

Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 05:44:52

yes, I’m sure you’ve noticed how there are 150 businesses and services created for every “wealthy” person as well as 10-15 spec houses and condos built for each of them and virtually no services or products aimed at the lower end.

Seems pretty short sighted to me. I know the profit margins are much bigger at the high end but I would think the sales would be tougher to these overprivileged navel gazers.

Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2008-07-02 06:04:02

If you’re doing it with OPM, you might as well aim for the stars.

Only people who are risking their own capital would actually work out the true margins.

Hope sells.

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Comment by tab
2008-07-02 06:49:51

Actually, there are plenty of services aimed at the lower end consumer, but they tend to be services which aim to bleed them of money that they don’t have. There are plenty of rental places (Aaron’s, Rent-A-Rim, etc), pay day loan places, and cash title loan places. There are also plenty of crappy fast food places. There are rarely any places that cater to low income people that actually provide them with value for the money they do have. I hesitate to point this out, slightly, but Wal-Mart is the exception.

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Comment by A.B. Dada
2008-07-02 07:16:00

I personally love Wal*Mart, and I’m not a low income person. They go to battle on my behalf against manufacturers and distributors, and this is only good for me, the consumer.

I don’t do a LOT of shopping there, but last year we went there a lot more because the quality was surprisingly better than competitors. For example: the produce at Wal*Mart was better than the much more expensive Dominicks. Why? Wal*Mart turned over their produce faster, so it was freshed. Their ability to buy in higher quantity also gave them a better price.

Lately, the local one started carrying sugar-free goods, organic goods, etc. I saw a cotton blanket for $30 that Bloomies sells for $200, exactly the same material and quality.

So I will never discredit Wal*Mart. The few people I know who work there have been there for years and have climbed up the ladder nicely. Their secret? Don’t act like a $8/hour employee and you won’t be one for long. Smart.

 
Comment by AdamCO
2008-07-02 08:08:25

My biggest beef with wal-mart is using our tax dollars to fund their employees’ health care. it is a serious abuse of our govt. system and amounts to taxpayers subsidizing wal-mart, allowing for lower prices.

 
Comment by tresho
2008-07-02 10:22:54

My biggest beef with wal-mart is using our tax dollars to fund their employees’ health care. it is a serious abuse of our govt. system Turn your assumption on its head. Forcing employers to fund their employees’ health care is a serious abuse of health care financing & damages the employers’ profitability. US automakers save a lot per vehicle by having factories in Canada where the automakers don’t have to pay for health care as they do in the USA.

 
Comment by AdamCO
2008-07-02 13:54:38

In my view, health care is a human rights issue that must be funded, whether by the private sector (e.g. the automakers) or by the public sector (e.g. the wal-mart model). other countries have shown the efficiency gains by having some public involvement in health care, so i lean that way. Taking the cost out of what companies pay their employees seems like it would be help the competitiveness of our major cooperations and reduce outsourcing.

 
 
 
Comment by Maria
2008-07-02 05:48:29

A.B. Dada ;

The salon that I go to ; the employees/stylist are on payroll and you don’t tip the stylist.

M

Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 06:01:35

I saw my “stylist” yesterday. He’d had his 3rd botox injection for the month and was sporting a lovely spiked do of his own. I can overlook all this because he is very good.

But he charges $100 for half an hour’s work. So I don’t tip, I already feel ripped off just paying that.

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Comment by WantsOut
2008-07-02 10:04:00

When we moved last year, my wife introduced me to her stylist. Male, so I was already somewhat squeamish. I watched her pay $80 for the 2 of us. After questioning her about the cost for me, $35, I promptly drove her to the hair salon supply outlet and bought a nice pair of scissors $20. She’s been cutting it ever since.

 
Comment by BanteringBear
2008-07-02 12:47:03

Sounds cheap as compared to the $300 my sister pays in Hollywood.

 
Comment by Matt_in_TX
2008-07-02 19:09:44

Wa ha ha. Used to work in Downtown Dallas near the Crescent hotel across the street from a little hair salon. All his customers had to walk past his overly fancy sports car to enter his shop. (Well, OK, they probably didn’t see him turbo in every day ;)

 
 
Comment by michael
2008-07-02 06:45:13

my wife goes to a very expensive hair salon.

she also works her ass off and is a successful professional who drives a 13 year old honda.

damn i love her.

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Comment by incredulous
2008-07-02 10:59:26

What always cracked me up about starbucks were the fools who would actually order the italian sizes (venti, grande, whatever). How absurd. Other than myself, I don’t think I ever heard someone order medium, small, …

Eventually I think starbucks and granite countertops will merely be vestiges of a bygone era, I can’t wait.

 
Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2008-07-02 11:05:39

SBUX may have made oodles off the HELOC money but I think they will evolve and survive.

 
 
Comment by caveat_emptor
2008-07-02 06:52:25

I saw my stylist yesterday too chick- I even paid a 20% tip! However, for the ~25min of work, the bill was $10, not $100. Yes, there was a pole with red and blue stripes spinning out front of my “salon”. I’ve always marvelled at how much the opposite sex was willing to spend on a hair-cut ;-).

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Comment by Ouro Verde
2008-07-02 07:43:10

I cut my own tresses. I turn my head upside down and snip. Of course I look homeless, but I have a lot of hair.
Will venture into the salon soon.

 
Comment by SD Renter-George
2008-07-02 07:47:50

I get free haircuts. It only cost me $20,000 to send my daughter to Paul Mitchell the School. I should get them free for the rest of my life but we’ll see.

 
Comment by speedingpullet
2008-07-02 09:18:32

LOL, OV - I’m sure it looks much more like an expensive ‘layer’ style than homelessness. Some people pay good money to have their hair cut at varying lengths.. ;-)

Now that my barnet is halfway down my back, I can do what I used to do in my previous long-haired incarnation - sit on one of the straight-backed dining room chairs and get the husband to use the ladder-back as a guide for hacking away. Its cheap, and often he manages to get it almost straight…

 
Comment by bluprint
2008-07-02 09:40:37

Heh…my wife made the mistake a few weeks ago of asking me to trim her bangs. I did. She won’t be asking for that again any time soon. lol

“Didn’t you realize those strands were SUPPOSED to be long?”

 
Comment by Olympiagal
2008-07-02 10:55:35

Ouro, just keep practicing. You’ll get the hang of it. I have a lot of hair, too, and I cut it myself. I get compliments on my pretty tresses all the time.
Here’s my tips:
Whatcher do, is, drink some beer, so as to loosen up your cutting hand–tension is the enemy of a pretty haircut–and then just sort of snip away delicately, here and there, layery like. Eventually you should start to sing, absentmindedly at first, but then get into it and start bellowing out the lyrics with gusto–this is a potentially significant moment, when you are filled with enthusiasm, so just be sure you don’t start whacking out big chunks–anyway, look at the back, look more or less okay? Jeeze! What a great song! I love beer! Now, throw down the scissors and prance out the door and away into the forest, because you’re all done and looking great!

 
Comment by lavi d
2008-07-02 12:01:59

just sort of snip away delicately, here and there, layery like. Eventually you should start to sing…

Ah. There’s a reason you live in the woods!

“Layery-like” Snort!

:)

 
Comment by Gadfly
2008-07-02 12:49:25

“Some people pay good money to have their hair cut at varying lengths.. ”

Hayyll, back where I come from we call that a mullet!

 
Comment by lavi d
2008-07-02 12:58:53

Hayyll, back where I come from we call that a mullet!

Business in front, party in the back!

(I just love that saying…)

 
 
 
Comment by awaiting wipeout
2008-07-02 05:49:31

That’s why I tend to favor managing and leasing strip malls and power centers, vs. lifestyle and outlet centers. Even grocery store anchored neighborhood centers are feeling pain right now. Alternative shopping venues like discount and dollar stores are taking market share. The middle class is hurting, along with lower income.

Comment by Arizona Slim
2008-07-02 13:38:13

Dollar stores, yard sales, swap meets, and other low-cost shopping venues should be doing well these days. I’ll bet Mr. Craig (that guy with the list) is doing all right too.

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Comment by jrochest
2008-07-02 14:40:23

Mr. Craig is going to do very well: Ebay, too.

The only problem is that the expanding bedbug problem will make it hard to sell used furniture & appliances.

 
 
 
 
Comment by peter a
2008-07-02 05:51:10

Got my hair cut at my local fantastic sams yesterday in Yucaipa. Ask her how business was, she said they getting busier and busier people can not afford to drive to there fancy hair salons in Orange County.
We had a lot of Orange County rejects move to my once used to be hick town(prebubble). I’m always telling people I buy you $400,000 Yucaipa house when its back down to $120,000. I just wish they would raze these crap box houses and put back the orange groves.

Comment by Olympiagal
2008-07-02 10:58:05

‘I just wish they would raze these crap box houses and put back the orange groves.’

Amen. Oh, jeeze, yes.

Comment by desertdweller
2008-07-02 11:29:36

We/CA had much less fires in the days when homes weren’t built where orchards were, or coyotes/bobcats roamed.
Much less fires.
Now it is all about saving the houses for these firepersons.

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Comment by Ed G
2008-07-02 05:52:18

Guess that whole ‘for richer, for poorer’ is a thing of the past. Now its ‘for as long as our home makes us rich’.

 
Comment by Ann
2008-07-02 05:56:17

Funny I have been hearing the opposite from a attorney friend of mine.who said divorces were down in the area since people couldn’t finance their way out of it, much less sell the house!

Comment by Maria
2008-07-02 06:18:23

Ann;

That is what I told my stylist that that it will cost money to divorce.

One of my colleague canceled her divorce beacause she and her husband could not afford the cost associated with divorce.

M

 
Comment by Ed G
2008-07-02 07:29:39

Well, they must not have had kids. If the woman has kids she can finance her way out of it through child support payments, alimony, etc.

The husband on the other hand will be essentially a serf to his former family, while his ex-wife keeps the house and gets half her student loans paid for.

Comment by desertdweller
2008-07-02 11:30:57

Know of an exactly opposite story, as ex h makes 150k in first 3 months of yr, and is garnishing his wifes 23k yr salary.

Something is just not right.

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Comment by desertdweller
2008-07-02 11:34:56

Know of opposite story. Ex h made 150k in first 3 mos this yr.
Garnishing ex wifes 23k yr salary.

He makes so much he can pay off attny and judge to make bad calls. He doesn’t care. Narcissist. 19 yr old son is due to be just like father. Smart but graduated with 2 Ds/2 Fs last semester, part of reason, dad kept taking son to cubs games when son should have been studying for finals.

It isn’t always the Ex h that gets it in the shorts. Know of quite a few women who have been taken to cleaners. X h is off making tons of $ .
So, please you and Aqius keep slamming women. Or not.

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Comment by Esoteric
2008-07-02 18:44:00

Just because 1% of all divorces ends in the way you describe doesn’t mean that women don’t make out like bandits in divorce settlements.

Men are continually short-shrifted in divorce court on an automatic basis.

 
 
 
 
Comment by CarrieAnn
2008-07-02 06:03:01

It seems in the last 2 years there’s been a jump in divorces reported in my former town too. One couple soon after moving to town (purchasing their 3rd home there) filed for divorce and put the house on the market only months later. That was 2 years ago. The home just sold.

A home the next street over is for sale due to divorce. That’s the reason supposedly that the price is too high.

The home at the top of my street had sold to divorce. Rumor was he had smacked them around for years. She just finally called uncle.

That was a very small town (8-10k people depending on source) yet I have heard of 5 others and there was the one near miss w/my good friend. I don’t know if its all about money though. Most of these stories include someone else on the side. Another of my friends split was just over. They had stuck it out trying to make it work and that ship had sailed.

When my home was up for sale there were quite a few newly single men looking for a place to live. They were usually 40 - 60 years of age, and I don’t think an apt was an option for someone of their income and socio-economic stature…..at least in their minds.

 
Comment by Pondering the Mess
2008-07-02 09:30:28

The usual reason for divorce (and it seems that half of all new marriages these days) is to “cash out” at the other person’s expense, thus winning the house and alimony payments for life.

It is not surprising that divorce goes up as financial hardships make it clear that the “fairytale” lifestyle isn’t going to happen, but I wonder if divorce rates may decline long-term once people are dirt poor and there is no longer any financial reason to “cash out” and win the house (that nobody can afford), or alimony payments (which are useless if there are no jobs, etc.)

 
Comment by hip in zilker
2008-07-02 12:32:07

Lawyer friend in Rockport TX said that all of a sudden she has a bunch of people coming in for divorces. Not individuals who would be timing their divorce by a tax rebate check.

 
 
Comment by Rachel
2008-07-02 05:27:35

Good news - Manhattan real estate finally going down.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=a05lmF8fkldM

 
Comment by A.B. Dada
2008-07-02 05:43:29

I don’t believe in peak oil, but I do tend to believe in peak gallium and iridium. Great markets to possibly invest in:

http://www.asimovs.com/_issue_0806/ref.shtml

Comment by aladinsane
2008-07-02 06:24:12

I believe in Peak Golem.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golem

Comment by A.B. Dada
2008-07-02 07:17:26

aladinsane: Please paypal me $3.55 for the coffee you just made me spit up. I’ll waive the 3% overhead fee, too.

…tap tap tap… still waiting.

 
 
Comment by Mormon_Tea
2008-07-02 06:59:35

Interesting.

I’ll stick with silver.
Americans are basically uneducated, uninformed, and confused with respect to silver. I recommend to those who have a lot of $$$ tied up in financial instruments, stocks, bonds, CD’s etc; to accumulate some silver as quickly as possible. Of course, there are many financial geniuses in America, who “know” anything connected with precious metals must be a “bubble” to be avoided. No problemo.
I’ll stick with silver.

Comment by SD Renter-George
2008-07-02 07:51:13

In regards to gold and silver, you might want to subscribe to a free newsletter at http://www.gata.org They will tell you everyhitng you need to know about gold & silver. Excellent place.

 
Comment by slorenter
2008-07-02 08:03:15

I 2nd that, continue to accumulate as much wealth ( silver) as possible. The real value of a eagle should be 200 to 300 dollars, a average days wages. When the sheeple wake up it will be.

 
Comment by packman
2008-07-02 11:46:04

Question for silver bugs -

Seems to me that silver would be fairly easy to counterfeit relative to gold, since it doesn’t have the unique appearance or weight qualities. To the untrained eye it’s not very different than nickel or zinc.

That being the case - why is it so valuable? Is its value solely based on its rarity (relative to nickel and zinc etc)?

I own a fair amount of silver actually - I’ve thought about getting more but am hesitant to because of the counterfeit factor.

Comment by watcher
2008-07-02 12:45:40

You can test silver before you buy it. There are testers on the market; I just weigh and measure to be sure it is silver if in doubt. There is less incentive to counterfeit silver because of the lower price, relative to gold.

Silver is used in industrial applications, so much of the mined silver is gone and not recoverable, unlike gold.

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Comment by EmperorNorton_II
2008-07-02 13:03:53

The only problem i’ve encountered has been 100 troy ounce extruded .999 Silver bars that have been hollowed out and lead replaced within, perhaps 20 ounces worth.

 
 
 
 
 
Comment by JP
2008-07-02 05:45:10

txchick, Regarding the link about google (only saw it late yesterday): The article was too full of polemic to get an accurate description of what’s really going on. And google’s potential broadband biz is actually one of the most interesting things happening under the radar in the comm biz. Lightreading is a much better source for that biz landscape.

Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 06:03:18

yeah, I like Lightreading. There hasn’t been much reason to read it the past two years but it is probably time to take it up again.

 
 
Comment by aladinsane
2008-07-02 05:51:21

Imagine the double whammy of being a foreign investor in U.S. stocks right now?

Not only are you getting creamed thanks to the market, but as everything is denominated in Dollars Americano, the wreck is a total.

Comment by combotechie
2008-07-02 05:56:05

Hence the stock market will crumble and will put the P/E below ten and it’ll be buying time again.

See? It’s all good.

Comment by aladinsane
2008-07-02 05:58:40

“Money is the barometer of a society’s virtue.”

Ayn Rand

Comment by NoSingleOne
2008-07-02 07:54:16

Ayn Rand also distrusted libertarians and thought Alan Greenspan was a genius.

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Comment by aladinsane
2008-07-02 08:02:47

Greenspan = Judas Beast

 
Comment by watcher
2008-07-02 08:28:27

Greenspan believe in Rand, then sold out her ideals.

 
 
Comment by ET-Chicago
2008-07-02 10:29:01

“Money is the barometer of a society’s virtue.”

Yeah, that’s sounds like the kind of thing Ayn Rand would say.

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Comment by watcher
2008-07-02 06:15:42

Stick a fork in ‘king dollar’.

http://quotes.ino.com/chart/?s=NYBOT_DX&v=dmax

 
Comment by watcher
2008-07-02 07:27:40

King dollar not looking good today…oh my.

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2008-07-02 07:28:17

This is a historic buying opportunity for foreign investors with strong hands.

Comment by slorenter
2008-07-02 08:11:10

Um they are still waiting on the sidelines, when the dollar index is down to .42ish they will pounce! Owned! all your belongs belong to us now.
I could see a situation where banks are bought and all the loans are voided and land confiscation happens.

 
 
 
Comment by watcher
2008-07-02 06:08:24

inflationary war on seniors:

Long before workers at the San Diego Food Bank began distributing cardboard food cartons from the back of a truck on a recent day, elderly men and women, many needing walkers and metal canes, formed a line in a church parking lot.

The free food amounts to a lifeline for these seniors, who have seen inflation wring much of the value out of their fixed incomes.

http://www.usatoday.com/money/perfi/retirement/2008-07-01-retiree-fixed-income_N.htm

Comment by aladinsane
2008-07-02 06:18:38

What happens when the food banks are overdrawn, and there is no plan B?

Comment by wolfgirl
2008-07-02 06:51:11

A lot of people will be in a world of hurt. I wonder how Salvation Army donations are going.

Comment by Ouro Verde
2008-07-02 07:49:32

Where did I read that 160 thousand customers have stopped paying utilities in san gabriel? That is really bothering me.
How can frank/dodd save homeowners when people can’t even turn on the fridge?

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Comment by watcher
2008-07-02 07:32:12

You can tell a lot about a society by how it treats old people. We let ours starve.

Comment by wolfgirl
2008-07-02 08:55:09

I help an individual directly but not through any oranization.

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Comment by EmperorNorton_II
2008-07-02 09:16:11

We let our people starve, but have no problem in giving away 500,000 tons of wheat* to an axis of evil charter member.

* free delivery included @ no extra charge.

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Comment by tresho
2008-07-02 10:31:43

but have no problem in giving away 500,000 tons of wheat* to an axis of evil charter member. That’s just a bribe so the NKors won’t make more trouble. This is like making treaties with Indians rather than just rubbing them all out.

 
Comment by EmperorNorton_II
2008-07-02 10:48:35

Why not just give the North Koreans blankets infected with smallpox, instead?

 
Comment by Olympiagal
2008-07-02 11:04:56

‘You can tell a lot about a society by how it treats old people. We let ours starve.’

You must know different old people than the ones I know. The ones I know scamper around playing golf and traveling and planning their vineyard at their vacation home, in betwixt getting their (younger-taxpayer subsidized) prescription Viagra and Rogaine.

 
Comment by desertdweller
2008-07-02 11:43:54

Oly gal, I see the both sides of seniors.
Those with more money than sense, playing, frolicking, getting much needed medical attn asap, enjoying high end restaurants/stores.
And I see all the men and women who are as poor as church mice. They go to food banks, share $3.= 3 taco day with 2 others just to eat. Share rides everywhere, all go en masse to libraries, have nothing to do but play cards daily=lack of cash/ss doesn’t cover increases.
No new clothes. I see these folks at the day old counter in the back of the store, hoping to get some squishy type vegetable etc.
I see them both and the ones that are wealthy give to other countries, not their own.

 
Comment by tresho
2008-07-02 11:55:57

Why not just give the North Koreans blankets infected with smallpox, instead? The British tried that on my ancestors, but there were too many survivors. The USA mostly used the treaty method, which worked out to my satisfaction. My family got tens of thousands of $ last year when a lawsuit over treaty violations dating back to 1837 was finally settled. Other tribes’ mileage has varied, of course.

 
Comment by EmperorNorton_II
2008-07-02 13:08:28

The USA mostly relied upon Indians having no immunity against common diseases.

Around 90% of the indians died of measles 140 years ago, where I live.

 
 
 
 
 
Comment by qaxbami
2008-07-02 06:15:09

Deepening Cycle of Job Loss Seen Lasting Into ’09

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/02/business/02jobs.htm

The slide in the labor market has become both symptom and cause of a weak economy, pulling many families into a downward spiral. Back when housing prices were still rising, Americans borrowed exuberantly against the value of their homes to finance renovations, vacations and shopping sprees. But that artery of finance has constricted considerably along with access to credit cards, forcing a reversion to the traditional limits of household finance. Millions of American families must now confine their spending to what they can bring home from work.

With job losses growing and working hours shrinking, many paychecks are eroding, prompting millions of families to cut their spending. Soaring prices for food and gasoline are overwhelming modest wage gains for most workers, leaving households with even less money to spend. All of which deprives struggling businesses of sales, prompting them to shed more workers, sending the cycle down another turn. Starbucks announced on Tuesday that it would close stores and eliminate up to 12,000 jobs, about 7 percent of its work force.

Few expect the rebate-laced sales to expand the job market, because businesses understand that the one-time surge of money will wear off later this summer.

Many experts expect the economy to then be pulled back into the weeds by the same forces that have led the downturn — declining home prices, tighter credit and leaner paychecks.

Comment by In Colorado
2008-07-02 07:50:26

My employer’s Printing and Imaging division, the long time super star at our company, is now stagnant. This is in spite of record sales overseas. All I can deduce is that Americans (and possibly Europeans too) aren’t buying as many printers or ink cartridges as they used. I wonder why?

Of course, instead of treating this division as the crown jewel it once was, corporate has neglected it, minimizing investment over the years. There is now no meaningful difference between our products and those of our competitors, and the logo alone no longer cuts it.

Comment by A.B. Dada
2008-07-02 08:11:41

I’m in the print/imaging business, and I definitely agree that consumer demand for ink is down significantly.

I just wrote an article about this after researching it over a few years (and calling it a “bubble” in 2006, hah). I’ll have to find if it’s online anywhere, doubtful, though.

The reality on ink is that the foreign “compatible” ink is much cheaper. I’ve helped MANY consumers move from disposable ink cartridges to CIS (Continuous Ink Systems). For a small Epson printer, a decent CIS is about $100, and the ink is dirt cheap. Works much better, too. I recall pricing disposables at thousands of dollars per gallon, and CIS at under $200 per gallon.

Also I am seeing more consumers print-to-PDF than churn out paper. It seems that as people work to reduce clutter in their offices, more and more people are relying on digital paper than the real deal.

Thankfully for me, my market needs paper, and it needs it each and every week. I found a huge growth market (5 years of market analysis starting in 2001 before I opened shop in 2006), and I believe the market will grow 700% in the next 3-4 years with almost no competition to deal with yet, or maybe ever. Tough market to get into, but once you’re in, you’re in for life if you service you customers properly.

I’m not sure if you’re in the large-scale ink/imaging market or the consumer market, but on the business side, my tech consulting business is also helping our clients reduce the need for toners, inks and various paper. If you do have to print, I’m a big fan of spending MORE money on paper so it doesn’t leave particles in the printer that cause clogging, jams and reduce performance. The ink can be third party, although I have to tell you that the few inks I’ve imported have not passed the “healthy, safe and environmentally friendly” test. Most of them have no MSDS sheets, and are probably lethal in high dosage. No thanks.

Can I ask what market you’re in primarily?

Comment by In Colorado
2008-07-02 10:08:42

I haven’t worked in IPG for some time, but when I did we made consumer products only. There has been a half hearted, minimal investment attempt to tap into the commercial market, leveraging outside technology. End result: another lineup of me-too, mediocre products, much like our disastrous attempt to sell digital cameras that finally has ended.

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Comment by sleepless_near_seattle
2008-07-02 09:33:55

Read recently that Vancouver is selling their plant (and leasing part back) and that Corvallis continues to shrink. Man, I used to be SO busy visiting Corvallis.

Comment by In Colorado
2008-07-02 10:04:40

They still manufacture printers in Vancouver?

Not surprised that Corvallis continues to shrink. IPG has plants overseas now.

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Comment by sleepless_near_seattle
2008-07-02 11:25:33

Don’t think any mfg has been in “Vantucky” since about 2000. In fact, I’m not sure what they’ve been up to. R&D, fixtures, test apparatae are all I hear about.

What’s the word on Boise?

 
Comment by sleepless_near_seattle
2008-07-02 11:29:32

Another note of value only to myself. I really liked the culture of that company. Great engineers to work with and I could relate with most of them. I hope the folks I called on are happily vested and doing well…

 
Comment by In Colorado
2008-07-02 12:39:25

Pensions are gone. For those grandfathered (20+ years seniority IIRC) the plan is still in place. All others get a 401(k), and it was just announced that new hires will get a smaller match than current employees.

Haven’t heard much from the Boise site. At this point I’m pretty sure that only laser printer R&D is done there.

 
 
 
 
Comment by jfp
2008-07-02 11:27:20

Millions of American families must now confine their spending to what they can bring home from work.

This was always true, in the long run. Some people just like to spend their futures today.

Comment by NotInMontana
2008-07-02 12:53:59

Truth be known, I think that “futures” gambit is why student loan debt gets so high. You think you’re going to be making all that big money later…

 
 
 
Comment by Lip
2008-07-02 06:18:51

Drill Here. Drill Now. Pay Less.

“American Solutions, the 527 started by Newt Gingrich, posted a petition that called for increased drilling as a way of lowering gas prices. “We… the undersigned citizens of the United States, petition the U.S. Congress to act immediately to lower gasoline prices by authorizing the exploration of proven energy reserves to reduce our dependence on foreign energy sources from unstable countries,” it declared.”

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0608/11436.html

Tired of high energy prices? If yes, the petition takes about one minute to complete.

Comment by aladinsane
2008-07-02 06:51:34

Why should we smoke our own supply, when foreigners are still willing to take promise sorry notes, for theirs?

Comment by Lip
2008-07-02 07:04:40

The problem is that they “aren’t willing” considering our recent proclivity to inflate the $. I hear that Europe’s fuel costs have only risen about 50% of ours solely because of the weak dollar.

Here’s the deal, we have plenty of reserves, lets go and get them while we simulataneously prepare other technologies. We should’ve been doing this for 30 yrs but since we haven’t, now is the best time to start.

Comment by aladinsane
2008-07-02 07:12:17

The fact is, there are boucoup oil wells all across the country that weren’t profitable on the basis of $30 a barrel prices, but @ $140 a barrel, extremely so.

Why not exploit those first?

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Comment by jim
2008-07-02 08:53:42

Why should they? They have doubled the price being paid for the same amount being produced.

 
 
Comment by Mole Man
2008-07-02 07:25:21

“plenty of reserves”

We used to hear talk like that about the surplus. Having no math skills and no shame is no way to go through life, kid.

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Comment by combotechie
2008-07-02 10:56:17

We should set up a Department of Energy and give it Cabinent level status and a mandate to make our country energy self-sufficient.

Oh, wait … we already did that.

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Comment by NotInMontana
2008-07-02 14:59:28

Yes but do we have an ENERGY CZAR?? I think not! ;-)

 
 
 
 
Comment by Mole Man
2008-07-02 07:23:12

Saving gas by driving less or more efficiently would yield greater results and doesn’t even require you waste a minute of your time.

Comment by A.B. Dada
2008-07-02 07:33:41

So true. One of my vehicles is a Land Rover Discovery (as I’ve spoken of before). I’ve gone from 13 mpg to almost 16 mpg just by turning off the engine at red lights. If I see I’m missing a green light, I’ll turn off the engine before I brake (coasting while off). It’s an amazingly easy thing to do.

Not going through the drive through a few days a week also saves me significantly.

I also have found that keeping my tachometer steady rather than my speedometer steady offers a big return.

Lastly, I keep my tires inflated properly, which also adds a little extra. Getting low rolling resistance tires is a benefit, too.

The peak I’ve received in that truck was 17 mpg on out-of-state gas. Not sure what the blend was. My friend, identical model, gets 11 mpg with his driving technique.

Comment by watcher
2008-07-02 07:39:36

So it costs you about 25 cents a mile to drive, just for fuel. I predict you won’t be driving that car in two years, unless you put a mast and sail on it and coast around town on windy days.

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Comment by In Colorado
2008-07-02 07:57:54

If A.B. were an FB I would agree. But this is not the case.

 
Comment by A.B. Dada
2008-07-02 08:01:08

So it costs you about 25 cents a mile to drive, just for fuel. I predict you won’t be driving that car in two years, unless you put a mast and sail on it and coast around town on windy days.

And I earn close to $70 per mile driving it. Consider this:

When I pull my trailer full of close-out polypropylene banner material for my print shops (located in Chicago, Los Angeles and Florence, KY), I generally have approximately $8,000 to $14,000 worth of paper in it. The paper I buy generally retails in the range of 3X what I pay for it. The “profit” on my savings in this case is $16,000 to $28,000 saved.

Why do I take my expensive time out and not send an employee? Because I can haggle on the closeouts, significantly. Most of my employees can not.

If my time is worth $120 per hour, and I can drive 30 miles per hour on an average trip picking up close-out material, in a given day I drive approximately 240 miles. Let’s say the bottom end of the profit is $16,000 saved, divided by 240 miles. I “lose” $960 in time, so let’s say $15,040 saved. I spend $100 on gas (lower MPG because of pulling the trailer), so that’s $14,940 saved. That’s $14,940 / 240 = $62.25 per mile that I earn owning that big oil burning beast.

Does $0.25 per mile bother me? No. Are you earning $60 per mile in your fuel efficient vehicle? Probably not.

Anyone who thinks that driving a big truck is always a waste has no clue to the realities of profiting in a declining market. If I had the drive and the responsibility, I would do it full time, actually. With the number of print shops that are failing due to high energy costs and high labor costs, I have my pick of purchasing goods from literally hundreds of shops and dozens of wholesalers who have to liquidate. I made my shop resistant to economic conditions by putting the actual shops in depressed areas where labor is cheap (but I pay more than others in those areas), where property costs are even cheaper (renting a 10,000 foot “warehouse” near Florence, KY for only $600 per month!), and where local FedEx and UPS depots are VERY close so shipping costs are low.

So, no, I won’t be driving something else. I know the Land Rover Discovery engines, transmissions and overall design like the back of my hand, and handle maintenance almost entirely by myself. Also, I get a huge amount of entertainment value when I want to plummet the truck down the side of a rocky cliff or through 5′ of water (the truck is snorkled for that) and have a blast over my friends who spent $60,000 on their H2s that don’t pull like mine or dive underwater like mine.

Drive your Prius. I could probably fit about $500 of paper in one and tow basically nothing. No thanks.

 
Comment by A.B. Dada
2008-07-02 08:02:36

In Colorado: I am an FB, actually. I bought a mobile home as an “investment” (actually, a cheap place to live after we liquidated our previous overpriced home, hah) and can’t sell it for the life of me. I’m out about $12,000 on that “investment” and am happily awaiting my bailout check!

;)

 
Comment by watcher
2008-07-02 08:33:06

It’s not only the cost that will force you from your land schooner. The coming gas rationing will make you change vehicles.

 
Comment by A.B. Dada
2008-07-02 09:41:17

There won’t be gas rationing, ever. You can bet on it.

A very good friend of mine since high school is a geophysicist, and he firmly believes that there is more oil in the ground than anyone wants to admit to.

In my businesses, I am always shrieking to my customers about the limited supply of what I sell: namely me. When I sold retail goods, we always kept our inventories low enough to sell for the premium we did. When I sold wholesale, we did the same. The business market is just as much about feigning limited supply as it is about feigning low profit margins.

The oil industry is doing exactly that.

 
Comment by USAF Ret.
2008-07-02 10:32:50

Oil in the ground is a much different concept than oil we can extract.

 
Comment by tresho
2008-07-02 10:39:19

There won’t be gas rationing, ever. You can bet on it. I ain’t taking that bet. There will be spot shortages at the very least. All the oil in the ground or on the moons of Saturn is worthless until I can pump it into my tank. OTOH I will be the first to rejoice and take a 7000-mile road trip when gas gets back to $1.50/gal.

 
 
Comment by Skip
2008-07-02 08:21:10

I’ll turn off the engine before I brake (coasting while off). It’s an amazingly easy thing to do.

For those with power brakes and power steering this is not a very safe thing to do.

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Comment by cactus
2008-07-02 09:14:24

“I’ll turn off the engine before I brake ”

Don’t crash into me when you lose your power brakes and can’t step down hard enough on the brake pedal to stop.

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Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 07:30:52

you know it’s a winner by the screechy objections put out by Reid, Pelosi, etc. They say it would take 7 years to get any of it out of the ground. If Bill Clinton had not vetoed the drilling in 1996, however, we’d have that oil right now and probably not $4 gas.

Comment by AdamCO
2008-07-02 08:18:04

And there is the line of the talking heads. Of course, it involves Clinton.

Anyhow, the problem is the dishonesty of the whole thing.

Americans feel the pinch and are looking for a short-term solution, and our right-wing friends use the opportunity to push through their own (okay, the oil lobbyist’s) agenda and put on the show that what they propose will solve the current crisis, though the true purpose is nothing of the sort.

The same dishonest logic got us into the iraq war. Americans felt insecure and the white house exploited this insecurity to push their own, unrelated agenda, while feigning that it would solve the actual problem at hand.

It’s dishonest and disgusting. Whether your a libertarian or a communist (idealists on different ends of the spectrum), I don’t care, just be honest about your positions.

 
Comment by Skip
2008-07-02 08:27:23

Well, to be fair, Reid, Pelosi, and Clinton have never worked in the oil industry.

Pres Bush and VP Cheney have over 40 years of oil industry experience between the two of them, not to mention plenty of contacts in Saudi and Kuwait.

Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 09:17:17

then they should keep their yaps shut

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Comment by sleepless_near_seattle
2008-07-02 09:41:28

Yes, never mind the HUGE conflict of interest. For shame…for shame.

 
 
Comment by Gadfly
2008-07-02 13:16:58

“Let us rid ourselves of the fiction that low oil prices are somehow good for the United States.”

(Then-representative Dick Cheney in 1986, after introducing a bill to impose a tax on imported oil.)

D’oohhhh!!

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Comment by edhopper
2008-07-02 09:11:16

Jimmy Carter put policies in place to end our reliance on ALL foreign oil in 25 years. Ronald Reagan stopped every program Carter instituted and opened vast new areas for drilling.
But go on an blame Clinton.

Comment by sleepless_near_seattle
2008-07-02 09:38:50

Thank you for pointing this out!

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Comment by lavi d
2008-07-02 12:16:51

Ronald Reagan stopped every program Carter instituted and opened vast new areas for drilling.

But go on an blame Clinton.

Ouch. That had to hurt.

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Comment by NoSingleOne
2008-07-02 13:47:03

Game, set, and match.

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Comment by watcher
2008-07-02 07:34:27

I agree, we should do what the Republicans think is best. Their energy policy of the last eight years has been stellar; we can expect more of the same.

Comment by Blano
2008-07-02 08:32:54

Sure, along with “coal makes us sick; oil makes us sick.”

You can also expect more of the same from enviro-nuts (represented by Reid, Pelosi & Co.) who care more about snail darters, sea lions and their “view” than they do about people.

Comment by EmperorNorton_II
2008-07-02 09:50:04

Would you more appreciate the Great Lakes if they caught fire on occasion, like what used to happen in the 1960’s before we realized we were poisoning our surroundings?

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Comment by tresho
2008-07-02 12:15:18

Would you more appreciate the Great Lakes if they caught fire on occasion It was a tributary of the Great Lakes, the Cuyahoga River, that caught fire on occasion. That problem was basically cured by closing most of the factories that contributed to the problem. Now the unemployed can spend their free time fishing the less polluted waters of the Crooked River. Their only care is to not eat too many of the fish they catch.

 
 
Comment by ET-Chicago
2008-07-02 09:57:06

You can also expect more of the same from enviro-nuts (represented by Reid, Pelosi & Co.)

Reid & Pelosi are no enviro-nuts, for better or worse.

I can think of lots of funny names you might want to call them, but that particular term of endearment doesn’t really fit.

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Comment by phillygal
2008-07-02 13:23:43

This thread was already Godwinned (twice) today, so I can do this

Will you still love me in the morning?
:-D

 
 
 
Comment by measton
2008-07-02 10:17:45

GOP energy plan

If your running out of candles, burn the candles you have at both ends.

 
Comment by Olympiagal
2008-07-02 11:08:03

Comment by watcher
2008-07-02 07:34:27
I agree, we should do what the Republicans think is best. Their energy policy of the last eight years has been stellar; we can expect more of the same.’

Oh, I agree wholeheartedly, watcher. And not only their energy policy. They’ve managed everything else just beautifully as well.

Comment by speedingpullet
2008-07-02 14:57:55

I’ve got nothing against drilling for oil here in the good old USA - there’s still a surprising number of small wells here in L.A (wierldy enough, there’s a gusssied-up well standing on the grounds of Beverly Hills High School - of ‘90210′ fame).

But - for every dollar they spend on finding new fields, another dollar goes towards R&D for solar, solar thermal, wind and decent, non-famine causing bio-fuels.

I’m sick of hearing how ‘unviable’ these are - especially out here in the sunny, windy Southwest - when any fool knows they’re spending a fraction of the amount they do on ‘conventional’ sources.

And for Pete’s sake, repeal the stupid ban on growing Hemp, already.

Its one of the most useful plants humanity’s ever been given.

The ‘drugs are bad, m’kay?’ posse has made its point, and now we need this lovely weed more than we ever have.

Besides, as it contains a fraction of the THC in regular mary-jane, I defy anyone to get stoned on it without puking their guts up first… ;-)

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Comment by Waiting for the Fall
2008-07-02 06:25:40

Overdue Home-Equity Credit Lines Rise Most Since 1987, ABA Says

By Hugh Son

‘July 2 (Bloomberg) — Consumers fell behind on loans secured by their homes at the fastest pace in two decades in the first quarter, signaling deeper distress in the U.S. economy, the American Bankers Association reported.

Home-equity lines of credit at least 30 days past due rose 14 basis points to 1.1 percent of accounts for the quarter, the Washington-based group said today in a statement. Delinquent credit-card accounts increased 13 basis points to 4.51 percent, the highest level since 2006. ‘

Subprime may be contained, but it sounds like the only way to close an opened can of worms is to put it in a bigger can.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aEGQR1.P0t4A&refer=home

 
Comment by Paul in Jax
2008-07-02 06:26:35

Chick - Is it too erly to start putting in bids for a rally?

Comment by Paul in Jax
2008-07-02 06:28:33

er, erly=early, sorry

 
Comment by joeyinCalif
2008-07-02 07:01:54

lots of good news today .. news nobody should really give a rat’s ass about since it has absolutely no effect on anyone who doesn’t own a piece, but good enough for a strong rally, imo.
I’m gonna guess DOW up 165 pts. by the close.

Comment by GrittyToasterWaffleGuy
2008-07-02 07:48:45

Wait. So now we rally on crappy news AND on good news? Awesome.

I’m still holding some July index puts. Still reasonably confident they’ll turn a decent profit by early next week. I just don’t see any conviction in this rally. Yesterday’s recovery from the trough after GM announced that things were extremely crappy, just not ludicrously crappy was beyond bizarro and yet it doesn’t even rank in the top-10 of bizarro market behavioral events in the last 6 months.

but I think Tx is right — we’re looking at another rally stretching most of the summer if not all the way into the fall. It makes no sense at all, so of course it’s nearly guaranteed.

The only cure for this market seems to be trading like Opposite George — just do whatever makes the least amount of sense and you’ll do fine.

“My name is George. I’m unemployed and I live with my parents.”

Comment by EmperorNorton_II
2008-07-02 12:09:52

Don’t bring the President into this…

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Comment by joeyinCalif
2008-07-02 13:07:06

I’m gonna guess DOW up 165 pts. by the close.

did i say up? I meant down.

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Comment by Gadfly
2008-07-02 13:22:35

You were spot on–if you put a minus sign next to that number. !0k, here we come . . . .

Comment by joeyinCalif
2008-07-02 14:59:33

ya know.. just getting the “165″ part right made me feel like i should be in Vegas.

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Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 07:29:15

I’m wondering if we get another leg down in a few days to make one of those “w” bottoms.

Comment by watcher
2008-07-02 07:42:48

I have expected every year since 2000 to be the W bottom, but he keeps surprising me.

Comment by hoz
2008-07-02 09:23:52

lol

Sorry Ms. Tx, IMHO a large ‘L’ - somewhere around 7600 DJIA, 620 S&P500 - a lot of 5% (maybe even 10%) rallies as we drift.

Trading rule number 7: Show no fear, fate aids the bold.

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Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 11:11:52

yes but not before another sucker rally to a lower high

you deal in years, I deal in days to a few months

 
Comment by hoz
2008-07-02 12:24:27

I have been known to day trade, but only when there is sufficient liquidity! The only liquid market at this time is currencies. It is just that whenever you make a day trade 3 things can happen, 1) make money, 2) lose money or 3) scratch and break even. 2 of those 3 are bad.

The number one question that I ask myself before I buy anything, “How do I get out?”

I can buy a lot of stocks right now, but I can’t get out of them if wrong.

 
Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 12:28:43

you can’t? are buying a million shares at a time? I never have any trouble getting out, even in a fast market

 
Comment by cactus
2008-07-02 12:32:41

Sorry Ms. Tx, IMHO a large ‘L’ - somewhere around 7600 DJIA, 620 S&P500 - a lot of 5% (maybe even 10%) rallies as we drift.

wow hoz you’re more negative than I am … Texas whats the support for the S&P ?

 
Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 12:37:20

we hit it yesterday

meh

still have calls, bored

 
Comment by hoz
2008-07-02 13:57:01

If the market allows it, size is not a factor - that is a huge IF.

The market is not currently allowing large unhedged trades, exceptions are stocks like GM -an unknown that I got lucky upon and completely misread. The blocks going across are spreads.

 
 
 
 
 
Comment by hd74man
2008-07-02 07:08:49

Much more of this once O’Bama boy is elected.

It’ll be probably his first act in office…change the national anthem due to it’s racist origins.

http://www.9news.com/news/article.aspx?storyid=94919&catid=339

Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 07:24:24

he’s not going to be elected so not to worry . . .

Comment by Muir
2008-07-02 11:28:17

Wager?
-
How much?
How?
When?

Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 12:26:25

you too? find exeter. he’s holding the money

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Comment by hondje
2008-07-02 07:27:16

Hmm, well, I still say McCain’s spiritual advisor’s idea that Hitler was sent by God is still a pretty kooky idea…but I guess you neo-CON true believers will continue to drinkin’ whatever Koolaide flavor Karl Rove says is best…

Comment by phillygal
2008-07-02 07:51:11

I still say McCain’s spiritual advisor’s

What’s your definition of “spiritual advisor”?

 
Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 08:26:08

Karl’s a winner. Winners have more cred. The end.

Comment by NoSingleOne
2008-07-02 09:36:35

No question, the man could put lipstick on any pig and turn it into Mae West. “Turd Blossom” was the greatest shyster in American history, with skin made of Teflon.

However, the magic has now run its course. Ask how many Americans today have severe buyer’s remorse…

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Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 09:57:39

don’t count him out yet.

 
Comment by Gadfly
2008-07-02 13:29:37

Good for a laugh:
“McCain’s YouTube Problem Just Became a Nightmare”

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEtZlR3zp4c

 
 
 
 
Comment by A.B. Dada
2008-07-02 07:27:30

Hmm, I think I prefer the lyrics to that version than the official one (official as of 1931, IIRC).

I’ve never been one to declare allegience to a non-important-entity, and still use the phrase “these United States” instead of “the United States.” I’m an Illinoisan, and will continue to pledge my alledgiance to God and no one else. I also fly the Illinois flag as the only flag on my properties, since it is Illinois that is my country.

If people want to sing ridiculous songs of false patriotism, so be it. Not my thing, and for sure I find it apostatic to sing about freedom when living in an unfree world.

Comment by lavi d
2008-07-02 12:26:00

Hmm, I think I prefer the lyrics to that version than the official one …

I pledge allegiance to the flag
of the United States of America
and to the corporations for which it stands

One nation under greed, insolvent,
with kickbacks and payoffs for some.

 
 
Comment by edhopper
2008-07-02 09:14:55

Do you have any idea how racist your post is?

 
Comment by NoSingleOne
2008-07-02 09:31:36

The last time any anthems were changed, it was the Republicans trying to stick the word “under God” into what had been a previously secular and personal declaration.

Comment by EmperorNorton_II
2008-07-02 09:57:35

The repos also were responsible for adding “In God We Trust” to our currency in the 1950’s.

We thought we had to be uber-religious, in order to thwart the commie menace…

Comment by hoz
2008-07-02 11:05:13

Nah it was the Southern menace in 1864. lol

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Comment by EmperorNorton_II
2008-07-02 11:13:16

Coins in 1864 (2 Cent Piece), Banknotes in 1957.

 
 
Comment by Blano
2008-07-02 12:34:17

The horror!!!

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Comment by Professor Bear
2008-07-02 07:20:09

Checking out the Option-ARM reset schedule, I see average resets of $5 bn or so per month stretching from now (June 2008) through August 2012. That would be 50 months at $5 bn a month, or $250 bn in Option-ARM resets over the upcoming four years (gulp)?

Pick-A-Pay Goes Away…
Posted by: Dean Foust on June 30

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2008-07-02 07:23:24

How does the stock market persistently look past bad news? And why?

July 2, 2008 10:20 A.M.ET
BULLETIN
ADP data highlight soft jobs

In a precursor to pivotal Labor Department data, private-sector payrolls are projected to have shed 79,000 positions in June.

Comment by In Colorado
2008-07-02 08:07:01

Perhaps bad news means that the rich will control and even higher percentage of the world’s wealth, and hence, its power.

It is my belief that this is what its really all about: power. If global GDP were to shrink, but if their power were to increase, they would be just fine with that.

 
Comment by GrittyToasterWaffleGuy
2008-07-02 08:50:31

I’m not sure it’s a matter of looking past the bad news as much as the market not completely sleeping off the PPT Viagra it took yesterday. Things seem to be softening as lunchtime approaches…

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2008-07-02 09:40:52

The initial version of this story did not say “biggest job loss in nearly 6 years (2008-6 = 2002)

ECONOMIC REPORT
ADP shows biggest job loss in nearly 6 years
Private-sector jobs decline by 79,000 in June
By Rex Nutting, MarketWatch
Last update: 8:41 a.m. EDT July 2, 2008

WASHINGTON (MarketWatch) - Private-sector firms in the U.S. lost 79,000 jobs in June, the biggest loss since November 2002, according to the ADP employment index, released Wednesday.

 
 
Comment by Professor Bear
2008-07-02 07:25:46

Economic woes put more jobs on the line
Work force is feeling brunt of ’slow-motion recession’
By Peter S. Goodman
NEW YORK TIMES NEWS SERVICE

July 2, 2008

 
Comment by hoz
2008-07-02 08:08:41

W have learned that rogue trades that make money are cllaed Sir

What is the inverse of a bubble?

Metaphors in free fall: the anti-bubble named

By John Kay

“…No better metaphor for the processes that can give rise to bubbles and anti-bubbles has ever been formulated. But under Keynes’ rules the runaway winner would have been elbbub – bubble reversed – and that did not quite do it for me. So I decided to seek fundamental value rather than be carried away by market momentum.

If a new coinage was to be the answer, my choice would have been David Osman’s suggestion of trubble, which has an attractive sound and a subtle allusion to Shakespeare’s witches’ brew. But I was looking for the features that make bubble such a powerful metaphor. Bubble involves the repeated “b”. It invokes size without substance. Bubbles attract people of all ages who have not quite grown up. Charles Monneron pointed out another critical requirement – the word must be short enough to be part of the vocabulary of Jim Cramer of CNBC…z”

 
Comment by A.B. Dada
2008-07-02 08:27:40

I hate the term bubble now. Instead, I prefer to use the Austro-phrase “malinvestment market.”

We Austrian economists know that central banks always inflate the money supply. New money creates investment desires, which causes people to malinvest, which causes these “bubbles.” But the term bubble sounds like a market phenomenon when it is almost always a currency phenomenon.

Hence I now use the term “malinvestment market” rather than bubble. Connects it with the proper economic thought for explaining it.

Comment by Professor Bear
2008-07-02 09:20:33

A kick in the nuts from a Fed governor might help sober up the liquidity-drunk Wall Street bull herd a bit.

July 2, 2008 12:19 P.M.ET
BULLETIN
FED’S MISHKIN SEES PERSISTENT U.S. ECONOMIC WEAKNESS

Data show slim job pickings
In a precursor to pivotal Labor Department data, private-sector payrolls are projected to have shed 79,000 in June — biggest loss in six years.

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2008-07-02 09:29:56

“…sounds like a market phenomenon … almost always a currency phenomenon”

Sounds like econoganda.

 
Comment by bluprint
2008-07-02 11:27:32

I think the term “bubble” appropriately reflects the expansion of the economy to a point outside the production possibilities frontier, in the context of the Austrian theory. It also does well to illustrate the difference between this “fake” expansion and real economic growth.

In short, I interpret the term “bubble” to be an explanation of current market/economy condition or health rather than a description of the money supply and also as opposed to a description of what got us there.

A “malinvestment” better reflects an individual action, which is appropriate in using aggregate individual action to help explain a situation, but doesn’t serve to illustrate the larger economic condition/result quite as well.

IMO.

Comment by Professor Bear
2008-07-02 14:18:42

‘A “malinvestment” better reflects an individual action, which is appropriate in using aggregate individual action to help explain a situation, but doesn’t serve to illustrate the larger economic condition/result quite as well.’

Malinvestment at the macro level reflects too much investment in one sector at the expense of other better use of financial and real capital. Exhibit A: the highly-subsidized and protected U.S. homebuilding industry. The consequence of malinvestment is expenditure of valuable resources (labor, materials, energy, etc) on production of unneeded and unused capital stock, as epitomized by the 18.6 m vacant homes dotting the U.S. landscape.

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Comment by bluprint
2008-07-02 17:21:17

Malinvestment at the macro level reflects too much investment in one sector

Right, but it’s a collection of individual acts. “Malinvestment” in the context of the macro economy represents the specific activity, albeit activity by lots of individual actors. The “bubble” term, in contrast, describes the condition of the single whole thing or whole market.

This is all just my opinion of course, it’s subtle but it’s how I fee about the words. Especially the term bubble really fits with regard to the “fake” economic expansion that inevitably leads to collapse (remember we are talking in the context of the Austrian theory of the business cycle).

 
 
 
 
 
Comment by takingbets
2008-07-02 08:09:15

Fugitive hedge-fund swindler in federal custody
Wednesday July 2, 10:55 am ET

Rebekah Carmichael, a spokeswoman for U.S. Attorney Michael Garcia, said Wednesday that Israel is in federal custody. She would not immediately provide other details.

Israel disappeared last month on the day he was supposed to report to federal prison. Authorities found his car on a bridge over the Hudson River with the words “suicide is painless” scrawled in the dust on the hood.

He was sentenced to 20 years in prison for bilking investors out of $450 million in hedge funds.

http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/080702/fugitive_executive.html

 
Comment by hoz
2008-07-02 08:32:07

Mr. Paulson’s speaking in London (Domine Dirige Nos) is a perfect example of ‘Bank speak’.

He said “we must get rid of the perception that a large bank cannot fail’

What he means; “A large bank and lots of small banks are in too much trouble for us to bail out.”

Comment by GrittyToasterWaffleGuy
2008-07-02 08:47:30

What he means; “A large bank and lots of small banks are in too much trouble for us to bail out.”

Or even more succinctly and slightly more colorfully, “we’re fooked.”

 
Comment by watcher
2008-07-02 08:48:50

Paulson: new rules and law needed to deal with total meltdown……(Here come the nationalizations, exchange and currency controls).

 
Comment by EmperorNorton_II
2008-07-02 09:04:01

Have Henry Paulson and Lurch ever been seen @ the same time?

Comment by sleepless_near_seattle
2008-07-02 11:11:20

I’ve always asked the same question of Michael and Latoya Jackson…

 
 
Comment by cactus
2008-07-02 09:18:34

haha thats right

 
Comment by In Colorado
2008-07-02 10:30:19

I heard that Citi is offering some CC holders a 10% rebate if they pay off up to $5000 in CC balances.

 
 
Comment by watcher
2008-07-02 09:33:51

The Munich-based company that has supplied Zimbabwe with the special blank sheets to print its increasingly worthless dollar caved in to pressure on Tuesday from the German government for it to stop doing business with the African ruler.

A loaf of bread costs 30 billion Zimbabwean dollars.

http://www.moneyweb.co.za/mw/view/mw/en/page94?oid=213278&sn=Detail

 
Comment by hoz
2008-07-02 09:38:03

Martin Wolf: the lessons from today’s financial crisis

By Martin Wolf

“…Just as striking are the many huge uncertainties. Will the recent surge in commodity prices prove to be a short-term bubble or long-lasting? Will US households cut back sharply on consumption, which ran at 70 per cent of gross domestic product between 2003 and 2007? Can the deleveraging of the US and other high-income countries occur smoothly, without high inflation? How much more bad debt is still to emerge? Will emerging economies suffer such big inflationary surges that they will be forced to abandon intervention in currency markets? If so, will long-term interest rates jump in the US? Are emerging economies more vulnerable to the slowdown in US imports than many now believe? When will financial markets recover? Are equity markets adequately assessing the risks ahead?…”

FT

When all these questions are satisfactorily answered it will be safe to buy US and European equities.

Comment by Professor Bear
2008-07-02 09:39:17

Once it is clearly safe to buy US and European equities, the safety will already be priced in.

 
Comment by lostangels
2008-07-02 10:13:12

Hey Hoz, what is your read on the regional Cali banks? Who will be the first to go down? Downey, First Fed, PFF, Vineyard? Rumor is Indymac will be in receivorship tomorrow.

Comment by hoz
2008-07-02 10:35:30

LOL

I do not invest based on which is going to go out of business first. There are so many banks in trouble, there is so much dark matter; it is a flip of the coin which is first. I just keep mental bets, which will get to targets first. e.g Bank of America $16 before Citigroup $10. I believe both will get there. I am still shorting US banks.

Frankly, if I were the Federal Reserve and had access to the banks holdings; I would be doing everything in my power to keep these banks from closing. The Federal Reserve is, in M. Alexandre Dumas words, “Wait and Hope”.

There is nothing the Federal Reserve can do at this time without some legal changes by Congress.

 
 
 
Comment by packman
2008-07-02 09:44:36

Can someone smarter than me say what this means exactly?:

http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/NFORBRES?rid=19

It appears to me that we have quite an unprecedented spike - by a factor of more than 10 - in borrowed reserves of the lending institutions, over the last 3 months or so. Is this perhaps showing the effect of the BS bailout, borrowing from the Fed’s discount window?

Odd thing is though, Wikipedia mentions that $46B was loaned after 9/11, but that doesn’t show up on the graph - in fact what does show up is a spike in *free* reserves at that time, not borrowed reserves, and the spike is about $15B.

Comment by Professor Bear
2008-07-02 11:02:58

I do not fully grasp the implications of this data, but given that it starts in 1959 and never went below -3 before March 2008, I see those last three data points as highly inauspicious. At a glance, it appears that depository institutions are running out of moneys.

Title: Net Free or Borrowed Reserves of Depository Institutions
Series ID: NFORBRES
Source: Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System
Release: H.3 Aggregate Reserves of Depository Institutions and the Monetary Base
Seasonal Adjustment: Not Seasonally Adjusted
Frequency: Monthly
Units: Billions of Dollars
Date Range: 1959-01-01 to 2008-05-01
Last Updated: 2008-06-27 12:28 PM CDT
Notes: The series is calculated by the Federal Reserve Bank of St.Louis.

Prior to 2003-01-01, the data are calculated as excess reserves minus
total borrowings plus extended borrowings. From 2003-01-01 till
2007-11-01, the observations reflect excess reserves minus total
borrowings plus secondary borrowings. From 2007-12-01, the definition changes to excess reserves minus discount window borrowings plus secondary borrowings. Please, check the latest definition of the discount window borrowings at
http://research.stlouisfed.org/fred2/series/DISCBORR.

2007-01-01 1.335
2007-02-01 1.424
2007-03-01 1.569
2007-04-01 1.508
2007-05-01 1.350
2007-06-01 1.564
2007-07-01 1.375
2007-08-01 3.872
2007-09-01 0.159
2007-10-01 1.194
2007-11-01 1.330
2007-12-01 -2.065
2008-01-01 0.490
2008-02-01 1.552
2008-03-01 -16.050
2008-04-01 -33.482
2008-05-01 -26.253

Comment by Professor Bear
2008-07-02 11:26:30

The discount window borrowings from 3-08 through 5-08 (seen through clicking on the link) are highly (negatively) correlated with the three last data points in the “Net Free or Borrowed Reserves of Depository Institutions” series.

 
 
 
Comment by Professor Bear
2008-07-02 09:54:25

Upbeat banks help lift Wall Street

US stocks climbed for a second session as confident statements from European banks bolstered their US peers and new data showed that factory orders climbed modestly in May - 16:02

Happy talk, keep talkin’ happy talk,
Talk about things you’d like to do.
You got to have a dream,
If you don’t have a dream,
How you gonna have a dream come true?

Comment by cactus
2008-07-02 12:27:51

huh? US stocks are down again. I really think only the very brave or day traders will buy stocks at this point of the Recession. I plan to buy with both hands at about SP 1000 after Bernake is forced to raise interest rates. maybe next year? Oh and Obama raises taxes on oil companies that should do it.

I did buy some PAAS though but its a contrainian bet on the economy and dollar.

 
 
Comment by takingbets
2008-07-02 10:11:03

headlines from yesterday and today.

GM Jumps 15%, Pushes Market Higher

Merrill says GM bankruptcy possible

why would GM make the stock market rally yesterday if they need to file for bankruptcy?

Comment by Blano
2008-07-02 12:30:51

They’re giving it all (or most) back today.

 
 
Comment by hoz
2008-07-02 10:16:43

Another hospital bites the dust.

Hospital Partners of America Inc. has elected to cease operations at River Oaks Medical Center in Houston, owned and leased by Medical Properties Trust Inc. The 524-bed hospital is on two separate campuses in the southwest part of Houston. Medical Properties Trust purchased the real estate from Hospital Partners of America for $40 million and leased it back in August 2007.

Also a few pharmacies and medical supports systems shut down this week. Oops

Comment by EmperorNorton_II
2008-07-02 10:32:59

Bed-riddence

 
 
Comment by watcher
2008-07-02 11:02:31

Bush: ‘we’re strong dollar people’

WASHINGTON, July 2 (Reuters) - U.S. President George W. Bush reiterated on Wednesday that his administration believed in a strong dollar, and said the currency would reflect the relative strength of the economy.

“We’re strong dollar people in this administration, and have always been for a strong dollar, and believe that the relative strengths of our economy will reflect that,” Bush told reporters.

LOL. and then the buck sank like a stone…just go away George.

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2008-07-02 11:05:32

The doctrine of “too-big-to-fail” is suddenly in severe question.

Brokerage-firm failure has to be an option: Paulson
By Greg Robb, MarketWatch
Last update: 1:09 p.m. EDT July 2, 2008

WASHINGTON (MarketWatch) - Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson will stress in a speech later Wednesday that federal regulators must craft a system to allow brokerage firms to fail without threatening the overall financial system.

“For market discipline to constrain risk effectively, financial institutions must be allowed to fail,” Paulson said in excerpts of a speech he will deliver in London.

“It is clear that some institutions, if they fail, can have a systemic impact, so we must give regulators the authorities to limit that impact and facilitate an orderly failure,” Paulson said.

Comment by packman
2008-07-02 12:02:25

Ooh - that doesn’t bode well.

 
Comment by bluprint
2008-07-02 12:12:23

so we must give regulators the authorities to limit that impact and facilitate an orderly failure,”

That can’t possibly go wrong…

 
 
Comment by hoz
2008-07-02 11:09:47

Dan Gamel Liquidating California RV Dealerships

FRESNO, Calif.–(BUSINESS WIRE)–It was just over six months ago when Fresno businessman Dan Gamel returned to the helm of the corporation that carries his name and the company’s six RV sales and service centers that he had sold off in 2005. Today Gamel announced that he will begin liquidating the inventory of all recreational vehicles in his remaining RV dealerships and he will close the doors for good once the inventory is sold off.

Gamel’s current locations are in Bakersfield, Modesto, Rocklin, Anderson, and two locations in Fresno: his original RV sales center on Central Avenue and the flagship Camp America store that he opened in a former Super K-Mart on Shaw Avenue in 2004. …”

RV, Furniture, Auto - poor Fresno. Soon no Starbucks

Comment by EmperorNorton_II
2008-07-02 11:19:48

Fresno still has a Trader Joe’s, but that’s about it.

 
 
2008-07-02 11:16:06

TXChick, late yesterday I posted a reply to your redstate link (google, “socialized” broadband, net neutrality) in yesterday’s Bit Bucket. Reproducing it here. (adding “and DESTINATION” )
———

This article attempts to link the issue of “net neutrality” with the Vast Left Wing Conspiracy. I’ll leave aside the latter part and just stick with the basic issue of net neutrality. To quote the RedState article:

“Through a host of third party organizations, Google is at the center of a spider web of entangled left wing interests hiding behind feel good notions like “net neutrality” that have evolved from keeping internet service providers from charging you extra for using iTunes instead of Rhapsody, into socialized broadband.

The ISPs want to charge customers based on the CONTENT and DESTINATION of their surfing and downloads, instead of the QUANTITY downloaded.

As a good analogy, imagine the highway toll booths charging you a toll based on the brand of the car you drive, so you pay more if you’re in a Honda Civic than if you’re driving a Toyota Corolla.

Another analogy is the toll authorities charging different toll rates for the same stretch of the highway based on WHERE you’re going. As in, you pay $20 if you’re going to LA from SF, and $10 if you’re going to San Diego from SF.

Anyone can see where the corporations are going: If you download youtube videos, you’ll pay a LOT more than if you were downloading content from NBC, Fox, CBS, ABC, AT&T. They want the public to read and watch what THEY choose for the public, instead of the public choosing on its own and paying based on how much bandwidth it consumes.

Ask yourself, why should you have to pay more to your ISP, FOR BANDWIDTH, if you’re watching the same videoclip from youtube, than you’d pay them for downloading the clip from Yahoo.

Internet bandwidth is already metered and tiered (look up “traffic shaping”). The attempts to eliminate net neutrality are a power grab, an attempt to keep the elites’ control over what the public gets to see.

I’m not sure if the RedState goopers are being wilfully ignorant about it or they truly can’t comprehend the arguments for net neutrality. No wonder it makes a lot more sense to them to simply wrap it up neatly with Soros, Lessig, Google, Obama and the Soviet Union.

Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 12:24:54

satan satan satan red menace communist tree hugging homosexual terrorists ;)

2008-07-02 13:14:15

hey! Satan’s color of choice in the 21st century is orange. click my name to find out (and thanks to whoever mentioned that link here a few months ago - it’s already cost me a few hundred $ so far and will likely cost several k $ more by November).

BTW, I’ve found RedState to be an excellent source of entertainment on the nights of the recent special House elections, and November is shaping up as the party of a lifetime. :-)

 
Comment by NoSingleOne
2008-07-02 13:29:50

Lol…this is why I can never get myself to beam the righteous anger at you :)

 
 
Comment by lavi d
2008-07-02 12:40:33

The ISPs want to charge customers based on the CONTENT and DESTINATION of their surfing and downloads, instead of the QUANTITY downloaded.

Also, net neutrality wouldn’t be an issue if there were actual competition in the brodband marketplace.

When you’ve only got one or two providers to choose from (a duopoly) there’s very little incentive for either to improve service and reduce costs.

The FCC should have never have done away with the line sharing rules which forced the telcos and cable companies to allow competitors to use their lines at wholesale prices. This is more fair than it seems at first glance, when you realize that the telcos and cable companies are granted rights-of-way, tax breaks and easements in order to provide service. And also, that it would be ridiculous to have several companies’ lines sharing the same holes and poles.

Techdirt has done a fine job illustrating the FCC’s failings with regard to ensuring competition in the broadband marketplace.

 
 
Comment by hoz
2008-07-02 11:16:50

US Bank
Retail Banking Facility
918 17th St.
Denver, CO Office,
103,840 square feet MSDW 2002-HQ lender -Capmark Finance

The loan was transferred to special servicing in September 2006 for payment default but is now paid current through April. The property is 100% vacant effective as of February 2007. The borrower has requested time to complete a refinancing. ”

I have a warped since of humor, I find this funny. “I love buying stocks in companies that don’t pay their bills”, he said brokely.

 
2008-07-02 11:21:05

OT- political

Questioning of the sacred cow leads to the cult going ape$hit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qRwsk56lN44

 
Comment by watcher
2008-07-02 11:47:58

Where is Jas? We need a deflationary pep talk.

Each week, Ira Cooper opens a letter from another supplier with the same message as the last: We’re raising our prices, effective immediately. We can’t tell you how long the new prices will last. “We used to get quotes good for six months,” said Cooper, president of QED Inc., a lighting company based in Lexington, Ky. “Now you’re lucky if you can get a quote good for 15 days.” Manufacturers of everything from wallpaper to cereal are feeling the same hit.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/chi-wed-economy-manufacturing-jul02,0,617836.story

Comment by EmperorNorton_II
2008-07-02 12:30:03

Deflationistas still like to inflate their cause @ this late hour, oddly enough.

 
2008-07-02 13:16:51

As repeated often here….

inflation in what folks need
deflation in what folks want

Passed by an auto dealership lately?

iPod touch 8GB MSRP = $299
Street price of shrink wrapped brand new: $230

 
 
Comment by cactus
2008-07-02 12:18:25

http://biz.yahoo.com/rb/080702/usa_paulson_economy.html

LONDON (Reuters) - U.S. Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson said on Wednesday that high oil prices, further home price declines and capital markets turmoil will prolong the American economy’s slowdown, while Europe and the UK were also showing signs of slower growth.

 
Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 12:22:48

skf diverging from the indices

Comment by hoz
2008-07-02 12:29:46

An aberration? I just do not see any significant divergence.

Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 12:34:43

just noticing. don’t care really

 
 
 
Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 12:53:27

Back to the 2002 model. 10.750 is a 50% retracement of the move from the ‘02 lows to the .07 highs if I calculate correctly. Probably a good buy point and not that far away.

Comment by hoz
2008-07-02 12:59:21

lol

I just bought S&P500s - SPUs 1266.75\

Same reasoning - overdone based on potential news.

Comment by hoz
2008-07-02 13:16:03

1262.75

 
Comment by matt
2008-07-02 16:19:20

Good luck, we aren’t even close to washing out on some indicators. Too many people looking for a bounce that isn’t going to come.

 
 
 
Comment by cactus
2008-07-02 12:55:41

July 2 (Bloomberg) — The euro may be nearing an “explosive breakout,” reaching record levels against the U.S. dollar, according to a Citigroup Global Markets Inc. research note.

The trading pattern, including a so-called double-bottom that tested lows, resembles the one before Feb. 26 that preceded the surge to $1.6019 per euro, analysts Tom Fitpatrick in New York and Shyam Devani in London wrote in the note today.

“ We cannot help but feel that things might be about to get very bad again,” the analysts said, referring to the possible combination of falling bond yields and rising oil prices.

kinda inflationary but Gold is down. maybe no one cares about Gold anymore?

Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 12:58:35

a so called double bottom that tested lows

like the one on the S&P?

Comment by matt
2008-07-02 13:00:56

What company will replace GM on the dow index?

 
Comment by cactus
2008-07-02 13:11:13

double bottom pattern ? maybe I don’t really follow charts.
I guess -30% off the peak of the stock market is not out of reason. then I start to buy. maybe we get there this year?

Now I am mostly cash waiting for a buy like -30% . In the mean time I just buy commodity stuff now like dba and maybe some gold, silver stocks as Inflation is getting the headlines.

and next week its back to work so I will kinda lose focus on this stuff.

 
 
Comment by watcher
2008-07-02 14:01:49

Gold is down? Where?

 
 
Comment by packman
2008-07-02 12:57:54

Market nosedive commencing - down 1.5% in the last two hours of trading.

Dow closing in official bear territory.

Cause?

Comment by hoz
2008-07-02 13:01:49

Mr. Paulson and President Bush both said “The US favors a strong dollar policy” When either has spoken the dollar is down 2%, is the double statement cumulative?

Comment by EmperorNorton_II
2008-07-02 13:26:44

It’s…

Doubleplusgood

 
Comment by calex
2008-07-02 16:18:19

A naked blonde walks into a bar with a poodle under one arm
and a 2 foot salami under the other
she lays the poodle on the table
the bartender says “I suppose you won’t be needing a drink”
the naked lady says
“WE SUPPORT A STRONG DOLLAR”

 
 
 
Comment by cactus
2008-07-02 13:01:14

July 2 (Bloomberg) — U.S. stocks fell, sending the Dow Jones Industrial Average down 20 percent from its October peak, as industrial shares dropped on record oil and steelmakers and coal producers tumbled on concern the economic slump will worsen.

ooops bear market that was easy to predict but now the question; when is this over and where is the bottom ? Is it still linked to home prices or has it mutated to Inflation and the price of oil thanks to the FED and its very low interest rates trashing the dollar.

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2008-07-02 13:21:02

Weren’t GM’s “better-than-expected” results the reason the market rallied yesterday?

BULLETIN
MAJOR INDEXES CLOSE NEAR SESSION LOWS; GM FALLS 15%, PACING DOW INDUSTRIALS’ SLIDE
THE RATINGS GAME
GM plunges after Merrill Lynch cuts rating
By Shawn Langlois, MarketWatch
Last update: 3:20 p.m. EDT July 2, 2008

SAN FRANCISCO (MarketWatch) — General Motors Corp. shares plunged more than 14% on Wednesday, pushing through levels not seen since the early 1950s after Merrill Lynch warned clients it might be time to bail out on the troubled automaker.
GM’s (3:59pm 07/02/2008 GM 9.99, -1.76, -15.0%) stock dropped $1.62 to $10.13 after Merrill analyst John Murphy slashed his rating on the Dow component to underperform from buy with a price target of $7 a share. He also downgraded several key parts suppliers.

“We believe that the pressure on the industry is extreme enough that it is putting the entire automotive value chain at risk, including even once obvious stalwarts,” he said. “Large factors are becoming increasingly obvious including declining volumes, deteriorating mix and rising raw materials that are conspiring to compress profits.”

 
Comment by lavi d
2008-07-02 16:36:54

500 posts! Come on, we can do it!

Just 41 more!

Yes we can!

 
Comment by Chip
2008-07-02 17:21:58

Scary - a year or two ago, I tried to buy a jumbo CD at Home Town Bank of Villa Rica (GA) because the rates were excellent and I have family in the area. The only reason I didn’t is because they didn’t allow sales of CDs to out of state residents (don’t remember if that is a bank thing or a state thing). Construction loans are 413% of risk-based capital and 56% of the loans are non-performing. Whoa.

http://online.wsj.com/public/resources/documents/info-Loan080701-sort.html

Comment by CrackerJim
2008-07-02 17:49:10

To me, there does not appear to be any safe place for cash assets today. I am spreading my cash across multiple banks (using the CDAR program) and taking my chances with FDIC.

Comment by aladinsane
2008-07-02 18:38:39

We have a really smart crowd here, but why are so many of you throwing caution to the wind, and relying upon the FDIC to come through for you, when the banks start failing en masse?

Comment by CrackerJim
2008-07-02 18:55:00

The alternatives discussed seem to involve flying around the world with a bag of gold coins or investing in some foreign currency. Give me some practical solutions other than burying dollars or gold in the back yard. If the FDIC cannot deliver on covered deposits (using the full faith and credit of the US of A), then we are in a world of sh** and most of the alternates fall through too as this will mean a US default and all bets are off.

(Comments wont nest below this level)
Comment by aladinsane
2008-07-02 19:12:37

I can think of no other alternatives for you, unfortunately…

Having your wealth in some other country’s paper money is like selling coal to Newcastle, a no go.

It pretty much leaves Gold as the only plan B.

 
 
 
 
 
 
Comment by reuven avram
2008-07-02 18:36:11

They’re at it again:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB121504491777524933.html?mod=hps_us_whats_news

(I hope you can read that WSJ link–it may be “premium”)

Congress, led by Nancy P. wants to throw out MORE stimulus checks, devaluing my hard-earned-and-saved $$$ even further.

I think it’s time for me to resend the letter I’ve sent to my congresswoman several times already: While I’m opposed to a “stimulus”, the only fair thing to do is to reward people who have been responsible. Eliminating the taxes on dividend incomes would be a great way to accomplish that.

Comment by ahansen
2008-07-02 22:27:44

Eliminating the taxes on dividend incomes would be a great way to accomplish that.

Ah yes. All those responsible trustfundians….

 
 
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