The Housing Bubble

Just another urban legend. I have been reading such stuff since 1973, nothing has ever come of it. OTOH, the Big 3 currently make & sell vehicles that get 50 mpg, but don’t sell any in the USA.

Ford Unleashes 54-mpg Diesel and Two Bio-Ethanol Models for Europe

Yes, Bantering, I meant Mpg.. I knew you would know what I meant!

And it was on Cnn headline snooze.

So, it really never has been bogus. And yes they do sell them out of our country. Why? well, maybe they know they can pull one over on us. constantly.

I “howly” agree with you. woof.

Can’t you just prep it yourself, and freeze it if that’s what you wanted?

Am I missing something in their (fairly moronic) business model?

While it does seem to be a moronic business model on its face, I think it does have some viability. Maybe not right now, but I do like some of the ideas. I haven’t thought about it, ever, until right now, but off the top of my head:

1. Someone else manages the equipment (cleaning, maintaining, sharpening, decalcifying, replacing, etc).

2. Someone else manages the energy costs.

3. You don’t have to worry about wasting unused food and can probably get an exceptional pick of fresh foods to use.

4. You can learn new recipes and new ways to add healthy options to your family’s diet.

5. There’s a social aspect: I know many women (single and married) who are terribly bored and don’t have much contact with others for whatever reason.

6. You don’t have to invest in high end equipment at home: a simple kitchen with a nice dining room is all you need.

Personally, I’d probably take advantage of it myself, had I heard about it before. Bad marketing, I guess.

They billed themselves as a replacement for cooking and/or grocery shopping. That is patently untrue as you still have to cook and they do not provide a substitue for all grocery shopping. What they are is a good substitute for choosing a few main dishes a month and having a well stocked pantry.

You still have to shop for breakfast, lunch, side dishes, drinks, and snacks. Once I have to go shopping, I don’t feel it is a huge burden to purchase needed pantry items (like spices) and main dish ingredients. You still have to cook the stuff once you bring it home.

It basically is a substitute for a chunk of the thinking/planning process for dinner entrees. And it gives you the illusion that you chose or invented the recipe and are, therefore, a “good” cook. If people really valued this illusion, it could be successful. I don’t think people care that much.

I think it was basically just an outlet for bored soccer moms drunk flush from the HELOC spigot.

They even provided “wine” while the mommies cooked.

As goes the HELOC, so go these business models.

That is very perceptive. The sales stuff seems aimed at women with busy jobs, but it never really says that. It just talks about being too busy to cook or shop.

Like I said above, I found the process to be vaguely humiliating, especially the do rag they made you wear so your hair doesn’t fall into the ingredient containers. Being drunk might help with that part, but is a negative when you have to drive home.

I cook a lot. A LOT.

So I understand most of the costs, and I am under no illusion that it costs more to eat in (with my labor.) But you eat far far better with real produce.

As for the labor, I don’t consider it work but a hobby. But I can see how it would be a chore for others not so inclined.

So I don’t understand this model. Either I cook, and I do all the work, or I pay you to do all the work.

This half-and-half is just silly. Why would I drive somewhere, do all the work, drive it back, and still have to cook it later?

I’ll stand by my HELOC analysis.

But, can you cook the books like Wall Street?

If you bring me some books, I’ll give it my best shot.

Flash-paper Flambé is always a favorite dish.

Sounds great, as long as they include the burner with the cheese pot. Nothing like an open flame on a plastic armrest. Come to think of it, maybe they could offer BBQ to go. No, not just the meat, but the actual BBQ as well. They could just hand over the smoking Weber.

Seriously, how lazy are people anyway?

Sounds like people need you to help them re-do their diets.

Ha, surely you jest, but I have helped quite a few kick that afternoon crash. Healthy fats, fiber and proteins for lunch make a world of difference in one’s ability to climb the corporate or self-employment ladder. I fully attribute my successes to being 2-3 hours more productive per day than my collegues. “It’s the diet, stupid!”

Funny aside: I had this employee who loves to eat at an all-you-can-eat pizza & pasta buffet for lunch. He’d sleep (after the sugar crash) at our customer’s basement office from 2-3 every day. They asked us to can him. I warned him more than once, but he never listened. Wonder where he is today.

“All those lovely starches and sugars kick your pancreas into overdrive”

That is why I got out of telecommunications and got into nursing. 26million people with diabetes 56million with prediabetes I am going to be working for a long time, making decent money, and enjoying taking care of people.

Smart, Peter A. My “step”-mom did the same.

Easy enough to watch for who will probably end up with a diabetic condition (non-hereditary): a can of coke has 41 grams of sugar per serving. Drink 3 of those a day for 20 years and you’re there.

Lucky for us healthy living people, we get to subsidize their slow road to death. No offense intended to those currently living WITH diabetes, because you were conned by your government’s food pyramid for many years. But now that we know that sugars and starches are slow killers, people who are younger should make drastic adjustments to their dietary habits. I do believe that many forms of diabetes that are acquired instead of inherited are reversible (studies do show this), but you can’t teach an old dog new tricks. And stick the taxpayer with the bill, while you’re at it.

That’s a reason I’ll fight “free” health care: it just subsidizes all these cola drinking, pasta eating, potato mashing insulin-poor people who continue to cry “It’s a thyroid problem!” Only if the brand of junk food you eat is labeled Thyroid-brand, maybe.

Healthy fats, fiber and proteins for lunch make a world of difference in one’s ability to climb the corporate or self-employment ladder.

I eat healthier than most people, ran up the ladder, and am now an entrepreneur. If you want to talk about taking away my caffeine, then you better have that gun of yours in hand for defense.

Uh-oh, look at that above paragraph. Looks like I need to cut back again.

Why do people pay $5 for a beer at a bar, when you can drink alone for a buck?

Starbucks model was based upon this.

JP, chill — with an iced mocha, of course.

AB Dada, which legally acceptable drug were you referring to: caffeine or sugar? I believe that sugar is as much of a factor as the caffeine. Those fatties who carbed up during lunch are solving the low-sugar doldrums with - what else - more sugar. The stuff is basically ice cream.

And don’t underestimate the appeal of the Sbux culture: smooth jazz and low lighting and relaxing atmosphere etc. OR, the advantage of the little 10-minute vacation from work you take just to go acquire your 400 calories of bliss.

You get a little hit just from the picture of the little green woman on the Sbux cup.

i used to consume mass amounts of coffee. i never got the whole starbucks thing. my attitude about coffee is just like Sheriff Ed Tom Bell’s dad in “no country for old men”.

Sheriff Ed Tom Bell - “how fresh is this coffee?”

Father - “i make a fresh pot about once a week whether i need to or not.”

I think Friends going off of the air is having an impact on SBUX - teens are no longer being informed that its cool to go hang out at a coffee shop. In fact, how cool can it be to hang out at the same place your parents go?

My mother beat type 2 diabetes by changing her diet and losing weight. Although, according to her doctor, one you are diagnosed with diabetes, the diagnosis is permanent, so the stats on the number of cases may be skewed as more people discover non-drug treatment.

I’m with Dada. I’m also self-employed, and the long work hours come with the territory. I attribute my abundant energy to proper diet and plenty of exercise.

Yes, I do like to have a little caffeine kick in the morning, but it comes from the green tea that I brew myself. I buy the green tea in bulk at the local food co-op, which puts the cost of each serving down into the pennies-per, rather than several dollars-per.

Why do people pay $5 for a beer at a bar, when you can drink alone for a buck?

Starbucks model was based upon this.

A grouchy old man bar beats the hell outta Starbuck’s every time.

Wow, peter a - put those diabetes/pre-diabetes numbers together and that’s about 1 in 11 of the entire US population!

If it was an infectious disease, people would be right in calling it a plague. We’re a really sick country.

If any good were to come out of higher energy prices, it might be the staving off of full-blown diabetes to some of these people.
I don’t mean it in a callous way at all, but maybe a better diet and some exercise will help them.

It’s not a bar! It’s group therapy!

There’s evidence that Type 2 diabetes is mostly inherited not acquired. Young, vigorous, healthy & thin 20-somethings were studied somewhere in Europe, in 2 groups depending on whether their parents & GPs had Type 2 DM or not. Blood tests & positron-emission studies of cellular metabolism showed the Type 2 descendants already had a substantial deficit in glucose metabolism in their mitochondria as opposed to the control group. The groups are being followed over the years to see what happens. I don’t have a link, those really interested can find it using Google or PubMed.
I suspect ultimately the trigger for Type 2 DM will be either a environmental contaminant or some kind of chronic infection, in people carrying that genetic “defect.” I put the “” around defect because the genetic pattern also protects against starvation, a far bigger risk of death for traditional human populations than overeating/obesity. The closest thing to a “cure” for Type 2 DM is surgical alteration of the GI tract causing what amounts to chronic starvation. Severe exercise regimens may also do that, for those who are willing to spend their remainder of their lives either exercising or resting up after exercising — IMHO this is not much of a life.
Research $ on this subject are rather scarce since it’s unlikely a patentable drug for the condition will ever be found. Corporations are unlikely to invest much, and the US government is asleep at the switch.
Those not susceptible to Type 2 DM are expected to pooh-pooh my ideas & continue to throw human waste at those with the ailment & its prodrome.

Fascinating, tresho!

So you’re saying that, in many cases, type 2 is ‘hereditary’ rather than environmental?

I don’t know much about the subject, but I did an internship in medical stats back in the early 90’s, working on a long-term study of health and growth of UK schoolkids.

Even back then, the trend for diabetes was getting higher, but no one really had a handle on why, so thanks for the update on the research.

So, does the study you referenced infer that the rise in diabetes is due to the increase in ‘descendants’ of Type II parents, or are there other, non-genetic factors to take into account?

I know that the skyrocketing Autism diagnosis numbers are due, in part, to better diagnostics and refitting the symptoms associated with it, so I wonder if the rise in diabetes diagnoses might also be due to something similar..?

PS: I’d never throw poo at anyone

the study you referenced infer that the rise in diabetes is due to the increase in ‘descendants’ of Type II parents, or are there other, non-genetic factors to take into account?
The point of the study I cited was to detect any inherited metabolic abnormalities in the descendants of Type II DM that might help explain the condition. They did find something very suggestive at the mitochondrial level. Until recently it had been impossible to follow glucose metabolism at the cellular level in different organs of a human being. It remains to be seen how the detected variations play out over a lifetime.
The study made no reference to whether or not the number of descendants of Type II ancestors is increasing among the general population.
It is certain that the onset of Type II DM is extremely gradual, probably taking decades, as opposed to Type I DM, which is typically abrupt & relates to massive & sudden destruction of pancreatic beta cells. The slow onset of Type II suggests a multiplicity of causes.
So, if Type II DM starts with genes, why has it only recently become such a severe problem? Genes don’t change that much from one decade to the next unless a genetic subgroup has annihilated. Your genetic makeup is not that different from that of your great-grandparents, unless you have had genes implanted somehow from a source outside of your ancestry.
There are many factors that change the effect of genes, toxins and chronic infections are two that are particularly hard to trace, that’s why I mentioned them. Epigenetics is another very weird process: an short-lasting event at some point in your life can alter the way your genetic makeup expresses itself, sometimes the effect is not reversible. This PBS special goes into this at greater depth for those interested.
Type II DM is way more complex than commonly appreciated, even by physicians. Telling people to eat less and exercise more is often just another way to dodge the issue and blame the patient when medicine has no better way to manage the problem.

skyrocketing Autism diagnosis numbers One possible cause or contributing factor is assortative mating. Populations with a genetic proclivity for having autistic children are more likely to select within themselves for mating & also to have children, than in centuries past, due to economic & cultural factors. Diagnosing any disease based solely on observed behavior is a tricky process & much prone to errors and controversies.

The Standard American Diet (S.A.D.) may work (barely) for caucasian euro-americans, but it has wreaked havoc upon the Native American population where Type II Diabetes sufferers are epidemic. Better diagnoses are not causal as to the recent high numbers–merely a correlation.

Autism, too, was relatively rare until the last 25-30 years. How many adults over, say, age 40 have been “better diagnosed” with autism?

No matter how you slice it–the numbers are way up for Type II diabetes, autism, auto-immune disorders, cancer and several others diseases.

So it’s the old chicken-egg conundrum. Heredity vs. environment. Those who are genetically susceptible (determined by testing) to Type II would do well to eschew the high carb/sugar diets. Same for those who might be “susceptible” to autism via mercury toxicity. [BTW, whoever the genius was who thought of putting thimerisol into vaccines ought to be shot]. Maybe we should breed humans whose genetic make-up most closely resembles that of the cockroach?

Genetic predisposition is the scientific community’s version of “running home to momma”. It’s a dianostic panacea that blames the victim and appeases the masses while ignoring the elephant in the living room.

Unbiased science should take ALL factors into consideration when studying the causes of disease. I would submit that the alphabet soup health agencies are acting in a very unscientific manner when, for example, they dismiss out-of-hand any link between mercury/thimerosol and autism.

Same goes for studying fluoride. Nutrasweet. Type II Diabetes and the food industry. Follow the money–always.

Regulators, health agencies and professional trade groups are all about protecting their corporate masters as the conflicts of interest run roughshod over scientific objectivity.

Genetic predisposition is the scientific community’s version of “running home to momma” Go argue with a PET scanner.

I did the same several months ago. It’s already paid for itself.

Was autism rare 30 years agi or just misdiagnosed?

Yes, but have you TASTED MickeyD’s coffee?

I’d rather drink battery acid.

On my road trips I travel with a Bialetti Moka Express and the minimal Coleman propane burner for emergency coffee making. Traveling through west Texas one 2005 morning I couldn’t find a decent cup of coffee anywhere. I parked at an emergency turnoff, set up my system on the ground & brewed some decent stuff at the roadside. It was ambrosia. I would have preferred Starbucks, but there warn’t none.

On my road trips I travel with a Bialetti Moka Express and the minimal Coleman propane burner for emergency coffee making.

I’m torn between admiration and the urge to make fun of you …

I’m torn between admiration and the urge to make fun of you … I should have mentioned I never stay in paid lodging unless someone else pays for it, otherwise I live out of my truck camper the way to visit friends & relatives scattered all over the US. If you ever see a black F150 with a red, white & blue homebrew shell on it, that’s me.

Do they sell decaf?

‘Do they sell decaf?’

Yes, they do. I like Trader Joe’s coffee. I love Trader Joe’s in general. The nearest one to you, bear, is probably in Portland OR.

Thanks, Oly. Closest one is Federal Way. They should have one in Olympia. What are they thinking?

what, you push a button - the machines are automated. There’s no crucial ingredients other than the coffee itself.

She left out something. Maybe it was a latte or other fancy drink. But she realized it when someone showed her how to make it right. She won’t go to Starbucks now.

http://archive.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2007/1/29/102949.shtml

Mcdonald’s is using the same type of beans and i usually go there if I need to “drive-thru” (3 kids in car seats). My only problem is the cream choice (I prefer whole milk). You still have those crappy cream packets. You can ask for cream to be put in, but i’m not sure what I’m getting. As for price, it’s about the same as starbucks. All in all, I happy to have a choice when I can’t get out of the car.

That’s the one thing about McDonald’s coffee that pisses me off. If you’re going to charge a premium price for coffee, then you should be able to provide it anyway the customer wants. If you have to pay over a buck for a cup of coffee, they should offer half and half, whole milk, 2% milk and skim milk.

I HATE Starbucks for ruining the way coffee is sold in America. Before Starbucks you could get a cup for under a buck with free refills.

I prefer brewing my own coffee in the morning. It probably cost me about 50 cents a pot, including ground coffee, milk, and sweet and low.

I saw just that thing in the chicago airport Mc D’s one day. The customer paid for coffee and asked for real cream/half-half and McDs asked for more money. The customer quietly had words with them. Eventually got their half/half for free. I couldn’t believe McDs would charge extra for cream/halfhalf. Sheesh.

In europe McDs charges for ketchup packets.

I guess its a personal thing. . . I think Starbucks coffee is often too bitter and I only like a few of their flavors . . .

I think 7-eleven and Jack in the Box have superior coffee, and I drink a lot of coffee . . . and have had to drink a lot of Starbucks because places I’ve worked and their cafes have supplied that . . .

I like the atmosphere of the place “Starbucks” and like to go “there”, but not for their unique coffee.

Starbucks coffee is meh to me, it’s okay but done better elsewhere… the pastries have a weird taste that I won’t touch.

I support Starbucks in so far as it distracts the yuppies from the places I do like. Once they discover the nicer places my favorite spots go to hell in a handbasket in no time.

I wonder how much of the cost of the least-expensive Starbucks cup goes for employee health-care benefits? As opposed to, say, McDonald’s coffee…

http://www.forbes.com/2005/09/15/starbucks-healthcare-benefits-cx_cn_0915autofacescan01.html

The company’s chairman told U.S. legislators yesterday that it will spend more on employee health insurance this year than on raw materials to brew its coffee. Starbucks (nasdaq: SBUX - news - people ) provides health care coverage to employees who work at least 20 hours a week, which will add up to about $200 million this year for health care for its 80,000 U.S. employees. But Schultz that Starbucks’ benefits policy is a key factor in the company’s low employee turnover and high productivity.

Do you grind the beans? How fine?

No, I buy Cuban coffee already ground. It’s very abundant here in Tampa, and there are lots of great brands. They’re all dark and moist, and most are a large-to medium grind . Cafe Bustelo (in the bag or can) is one of my favorites. Because it’s very darkly roased and very moist, you can easily measure a HEAPING teaspoon’s worth (this doesn’t work with drier coffees), which is all it takes for one normal-size cup (not mug). It’s much stronger and far more aromatic that most coffees, so less is more.

You need a soft cloth funnel (not a paper drip bag). Dump in the coffee and pour the water over it. It runs through very fast unless you’re making a lot; when it stops dripping, use tongs to squeeze the end of the bag. That’s it. You can make it stronger by using more coffee. If you make it weaker, it ceases to be interesting and starts tasting like American coffee. If you want traditional Cuban coffee, use a level tablespoon for each cup, and use smaller cups.

You need a soft cloth funnel Interesting recipe, I’d like to try it. What kind of cloth? Would multiple layers of cheesecloth work to make the funnel? Could a French press coffee maker do the same thing?

I don’t know. The cloth funnels, made from cotton, are sold everywhere here. I suppose you could try a paper drip funnel. It needs to be a true funnel, very narrow at the bottom. There’s no need to press; just let the water run through. I think 8 ounces per cup, unless you’re making Cuban coffee, in which case it would something like 4-6 ounces per cup. A heaping teaspoon of coffee is a little less than a tablespoon.

Cafe Bustelo is readily available, but there are other, better brands. I haven’t made coffee in a while, except for instant (ugh), and I can’t remember all the brand names. One that pops into mind is La Norma, but I cannot find it on the internet, so perhaps it no longer exists. There was one made here in Tampa in Ybor City, but I can’t remember the name (yellow package). A popular brand is Pilon, but if I recall, it’s too finely ground to work with my simple method.

For Cuban coffee, you would use a whole tablespoon (or even heaping tablespoon) per cup, and dump the coffee into the pot of hot water, and stir and let steep for a while, before pouring it through the funnel. The final product could be labeled coffee concentrate.

Note that the other person calling himself/herself Incredulous is using a small “i.” I don’t know why some newbies have to use other posters’ handles. I’ve been posting here for what, three years, more?

For all you MD, PA, NJ, DE & VA people… nothing beats a cup of WAWA coffee… especially since its about $1.25 for a 20oz! They also sell the bags for you to brew at home. While living in FL and WA, hubby and I had relatives ship us boxes of WAWA. Their hoagies are the best too. I think the reason my hubby asked for orders back to this area was so he could have WAWA everyday!

YES

chocolate caramel flavor

if you ever drive north up 95, stop by the Wawa mothership, it’s on Baltimore Pike (rte 1) just south of Media, PA.

http://www.wawa.com/WawaWeb/Timeline.aspx

A bit off topic, but related …

A little while back Tiffanys was selling vast numbers of silver bracelets to teen aged girls. It seems the fad for these bracelets swept through the teen-age ranks and every one of these girls just had to have one.

Good for Tiffanys right? Wrong. Tiffanys did not want their name associated with buying habits of mere teen age girls. The exclusitivity of their name was to be protected at all costs. So, after trying, to no avail, to raise the price well beyond these girl’s budgets, Tiffinys stopped selling the bracelets altogether.

Tiffanys could have cashed in big time but didn’t. Unlike Moodys or Standard and Poors, they chose to protect their name rather than bust it out for short term gains.

This act put Tiffanys stock on my buy list, assuming the price ever gets to be reasonable.

FWIW.

This act put Tiffanys stock on my buy list, assuming the price ever gets to be reasonable.

Maybe they’ve overpriced it in order to avoid being associated with buying habits of HBBers.

Tiffany in the days of old, made remarkable works of art…

They now crank out junk for the masses, and nobody seems to have caught on.

Tiffanys didn’t overprice the stock, Mr. Market did.

I’m waiting for Mr. Market to get into one of his periodic moods when he thinks everthing in the world is going to sh*t and investing in the stock market is for losers.

“The main purpose of the stock market is to make fools of as many men as possible.”

Bernard Baruch

Is the same Bernard Baruch that made a fortune in the stock market?

“Every man has a right to be wrong in his opinions. But no man has a right to be wrong about his facts.”

Bernard Baruch

Daayum, that’s good. I’d put it up on my workspace, but I’d just add to my Enemy Pile.

Junk for the masses. Like this?

http://www.tiffany.com/Engagement/Item.aspx?sku=19475247

if that’s junk, I’d love to have it.

you really are a blowhard sometimes

You are obsessed with mere baubles and frequently tell us of yet another piece of modern crud that you bought on the cheap…

Why not expand your horizons and acquire some quality Tiffany gear from way back when, instead?

Here’s a primer:

http://www.metmuseum.org/explore/Tiffany/menu.html

Here we go again.

On and on about this kind of “stuff.” please, everyone just remember that this pretty colorful stone is just that…a stone. Crickey, I paid 10K for a rock. Yeah, and I paid 45K for a ‘vette.

While, I’ll one up all…I paid 200K for a gem mint 10 rated and slabbed ‘52 Topps Mantle.

Geez. It is this kind of thinking that led to the Housing and Credit bubbles.

Stop buying this kind of stuff at overvalued prices.

While you’re at it TX, can you get me the Picasso over there for $100 mil?

On and on about this kind of “stuff.”

If you can actually afford it and it makes you happy … shrug.

Everyone has their “thing.”

This act put Tiffanys stock on my buy list, assuming the price ever gets to be reasonable.

Just don’t eat breakfast there…

“On and on about this kind of ‘Stuff’.”

Personality I agree, it’s just stuff. But as an investor this stuff can be quite profitable.

Back to Tiffanys: Any guy can buy jewelry for their girlfriend at a pawn shop, and lots of jewelry once sold by Tiffanys will eventually find their way into pawnshops.

But pawnshops don’t offer the “Tiffany Experience” and the bragging rights that come with this experience. It’s not enough for a guy to buy his love jewelry, if he loves her that’s what he’ll do.

But if he REALLY loves her he’ll take her to Tiffanys and the couple will experience the joy of being royaly pampered while making their selections.

Afterwards the reward of all-important bragging rights extend the “Tiffany Experience” to the girlfriend as she gets to relive the experience to herself and verbally repeat the experience over and over again to her envious friends.

The heighth of American Art is generally thought to have been reached in the 1920’s, and passed away sometime during the Great Depression.

HELOCury goods such as Tiffany aren’t long for this world, when people actually have to pay for them, instead of getting a loan to do so.

Tell your friends, tell everyone you know that Tiffanys is doomed.

Fools always rush in, when reason dictates otherwise.

LOL, Combo.

Well, combo, I’m a girl, and I wouldn’t waste time being friends with any other girl that would:
1. Get envious over a stone on my finger given my by an a*s-kissy boyfriend.
2. Tolerate me blabbering on and on about getting that stone in a fancy store with my a*s-kissy boyfriend. I mean, how dull can you get? I’ve got way more exciting things to discuss. Frogs, kayaks, things like that. Maybe my shoes, for instance. Yeah! Shoes! Now THERE’S a subject worth blabbering on about!

Attitudes aside - I’m with aladin on this - sorry tx. While Tiffany does have some *really* nice jewelry, it’s way overpriced IMO, and they’ve lost all of the gorgeous and unique colorful items they once had that made them special. The man was a god in the decorating world, and now that his talent is gone the store has turned into basically an overpriced version of “Things Remembered”, and selling almost nothing but colorless silver and crystal. At least that’s my impression (admittedly not that deep).

FWIW TIF is one of my big shorts. I think they’ll get slammed hard eventually by this downturn, in particular as the financial layoffs continue to mount.

As a side note - one of TIF’s sources of revenue is employment anniversary gifts - I have a Tiffany pen from years ago in fact. As the layoffs mount, this revenue will be decreasing. Not sure how significant it is though.

Oly -

Well, you are a treat, frogs, kayaks and all, and I wouldn’t think you’d be overly dazzled by Tiffanys.

But there are those women who are. Call them plastic, superficial, me-orientated, high-maintenence, whatever - these women are out there. And so are their deep poketed men friends.

It’s not you and it’s not me that cares a whit about Tiffany’s stuff; I only care about it’s performance as a going concern. If priced right it’s a buy. If priced right most anything is a buy.

What about a market for Tiffany’s boxes?
Buy the box for $5 on Ebay and the item at the pawnshop

Like she’s gonna notice…

I would recommend against that. I did some consulting at Tiffanys many years back and they had an employee store. I bought a $5 date book that came in one of those fancy blue boxes. I then took the box and put a ring you can get out of a gumball machine and wrapped it up all nice for my then girlfriend. Her eyes lit up when she saw the box and then saw the ring. Then after about a second she was not smiling anymore. I just could not resist doing it. Suffice to say the relationship did not last, but it was something I could not pass up.

“Her eyes lit up when she saw the box …”

Proof positive of the magic of the name Tiffany.

How much is such a name worth? What price should one put on it?

Apparently $5.00 is the going rate.

Then put the name on five-hundred million boxes that cost a nickel each and you’ve made yourself a fortune.

Is that the best you got, Willy Loman?

Since you asked…

The best of what I’ve got includes cash and the patience to wait and buy quality when offered at a discount.

Tiffanys offers the quality, time and circumstances may offer the discount.

I did electrical work for a bottler of spirits here in Mira Loma .
They would use the same vat of vodka for the $5, $10, $20 bottles same vodka different labels.

To my admittedly unsophisticated pallet…

What the heck are you doing pouring coffee on your bed?

‘What the heck are you doing pouring coffee on your bed?’

Hahahahaha! Thank you. That was funny.

How new are you talking? McD’s tried the premium roast thing I think about 10 years go I think, and it wasn’t bad actually, but last I saw I thought they had discontinued it. Maybe it was just the locations I went to at the time though. I don’t go to McD’s unless I’m really desperate - the food is horrendous compared with other similarly-priced fast food.

new as in less than a year.

March 2007
We compared the rivals with Starbucks, all in basic black–no flavors, milk, or sugar–and you know what? McDonald’s beat the rest. Our trained tasters, who visited two locations from each company, spill the beans below (prices are an average of what we paid for the closest thing to a medium cup)…

http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/food/beverages/coffee-tea/coffee-taste-test-3-07/overview/0307_coffee_ov_1.htm

Interesting - I’ll have to give it a shot. I’m certain they did it before though too - this isn’t their first foray into premium coffee.

I do however place absolutely zero credibility into “taste tests”. Tastes are very subjective, and tastes are acquired for many things like coffee and alcohol. Usually taste tests are performed by the “general public”, the majority of which drink things like Bud Light, and white zinfandel - things I could maybe drink years ago but now can no longer stand.

Guess that all sounded pretentious. Oh well.

Ah, Tully’s. I agree with you 100%. Tully’s was my coffee of choice for the very reasons you mention, until I discovered how to buy green AAA or AAAA rated “Cumbre Supremo” beans, then roast and brew them in small batches. Mmmmmm….

I have to back you up on that one. SBux always tasted burnt to me too and a friend of mine who owns a coffee house supports that. He is second generation coffee people and he says they burn it.

S.P.Q.A.

In my town the really cool people frequent the beer locker at the local grocery store.

Whole Paycheck is just too expensive for me - even with the introduction of the ‘365′ range.
Plus, my local one has 2 out of 8 aisles full of tat like vitamin suppliments, essential oils and clothes made out of organic twine and shoes made out of cornish pasties…

I’d rather spend my money at Trader Joes - I can still get organic and free range, and at a price that’s comparable with a ‘regular’ supermarket.

Although, the deli counter at Whole Foods is to die for..

Shoes made out of Cornish pasties? Now, that is footwear that this HBB-er of Cornish descent can get excited about!

Godwin’s Law strikes again.

I hereby declare Godwin’s Law to be invoked.

Bah, you beat me to it.

The Bits Bucket was Godwinned much earlier than Emp Norton’s post:

Comment by hondje
2008-07-02 07:27:16
Hmm, well, I still say McCain’s spiritual advisor’s idea that Hitler was sent by God is still a pretty kooky idea…

Sorry, EN_II, you weren’t FIRST!

total compensation pkg north of 400M apparently

higher than couric, brian williams and diane sawyer combined.

I think that is very funny

gives you an idea of how potent flyover country really is

I’ve driven through flyover country, and it’s quite common to only find one station on your a.m. radio dial in many places, with right-wing propaganda blaring, and one host always makes special mention that there is no need to think, as he’ll do it for you.

From the article:

“Recently, Pew reported that, on a series of “news knowledge questions,” Limbaugh’s “Dittoheads” — the defiantly self-mocking term for his faithful, supposedly brainwashed, audience — scored higher than NPR listeners . . .readers of newsmagazines, political magazines and business magazines, listeners of Rush Limbaugh and NPR and viewers of the Daily Show and C-SPAN are also much more likely than the average person to have a college degree.”

MCP’s, I wouldn’t put it that way, but we want real men.

“When you strip it all away, Jerry Garcia destroyed his life on drugs. And yet he’s being honored, like some godlike figure. Our priorities are out of whack, folks. He’s just another dead drug addict.” (Rush Limbaugh on Jerry Garcia, 8/11/95)

“You know I have always tried to be honest with you and open about my life…I need to tell you today that part of what you have heard and read is correct. I am addicted to prescription pain medication.” (Rush Limbaugh, Friday, October 10, 2003)

The wrong guy died. Rush Limbaugh is a no talent scumbag.

Rush Rush to the cliff and give him the boot.

Comment by txchick57
2008-07-02 12:31:25
MCP’s, I wouldn’t put it that way, but we want real men.’

What’s a ‘real’ man, tx? Tell us, especially me, as I’m all in a fever of curiosity.

Another HBB-er who doesn’t own a teevee? Dang, I thought I was the only one.

Another HBB-er who doesn’t own a teevee?

I have had several periods of tv-less-ness in my life.

Coincidentally, one was back in the ’80’s when I worked for Jones cable as a technician in, you guessed it… Tucson.

Here’s another tee-vee less HBB’er for you. The internet is all the tee-vee I need.

It’s fun reading about other folks reacting to the talking heads, when never seeing them yourself. It’s like being at the ball park, at the concessions stands, trying to figure out what’s happening on the field from all the noise.

No TV for 10 years.

I remember my friends parents would change license plates around because they had 1 even and 1 odd. I don’t know if it was everywhere, but in cali they had odd and even days to go to the gas station based on your license plate.

Keep in mind that while “Rome burns” the military will get theirs. While we have to ration or go on even/odd days to fill up, the military will get theirs.

As for those who want to drill, like TX. Go ahead. Pay off some congreecritters and start at it. If there is so much oil in the ground in this country there is money to be made. And if there is that much oil, there is “REALLY REALLY BIG MONEY” to be made.

HOWEVER, me thinks that there may not be as much oil as people think. Unfortunately, we have this Pollyanna view in this country, just like a lot of FBs, that the oil will never run out or get to a point that it is more expensive and requires more energy to get than is produced.

Right, and this Christmas I’ll be dressing as Santa Claus and flying around the world in my reindeer-powered sleigh dropping off barrels of oil to all of you godd kiddies. The bad ones get coal for the furnace.

All you have to look at is the incentives to lie about reserves.

OPEC countries lie so they can produce more. Their production limit was based on reserves. They lied because a bird in the hand is worth 2 in the bush.

The oil majors stock price is related to reserves. If Shell XOM ect told investors that their reserves were depleted you can bet the stock price would fall.

These incentives have resulted in overstated reserves. That being said, a total collapse of the market will drag down oil fast.

I’ll be dressing as Santa Claus and flying around the world in my reindeer-powered sleigh dropping off barrels of oil What a horrific mental image, Santa napalming the good kiddies. At least if you don’t get beaned by the coal, you might get some benefit from an airdrop.

I personally love Wal*Mart, and I’m not a low income person. They go to battle on my behalf against manufacturers and distributors, and this is only good for me, the consumer.

I don’t do a LOT of shopping there, but last year we went there a lot more because the quality was surprisingly better than competitors. For example: the produce at Wal*Mart was better than the much more expensive Dominicks. Why? Wal*Mart turned over their produce faster, so it was freshed. Their ability to buy in higher quantity also gave them a better price.

Lately, the local one started carrying sugar-free goods, organic goods, etc. I saw a cotton blanket for $30 that Bloomies sells for $200, exactly the same material and quality.

So I will never discredit Wal*Mart. The few people I know who work there have been there for years and have climbed up the ladder nicely. Their secret? Don’t act like a $8/hour employee and you won’t be one for long. Smart.

My biggest beef with wal-mart is using our tax dollars to fund their employees’ health care. it is a serious abuse of our govt. system and amounts to taxpayers subsidizing wal-mart, allowing for lower prices.

My biggest beef with wal-mart is using our tax dollars to fund their employees’ health care. it is a serious abuse of our govt. system Turn your assumption on its head. Forcing employers to fund their employees’ health care is a serious abuse of health care financing & damages the employers’ profitability. US automakers save a lot per vehicle by having factories in Canada where the automakers don’t have to pay for health care as they do in the USA.

In my view, health care is a human rights issue that must be funded, whether by the private sector (e.g. the automakers) or by the public sector (e.g. the wal-mart model). other countries have shown the efficiency gains by having some public involvement in health care, so i lean that way. Taking the cost out of what companies pay their employees seems like it would be help the competitiveness of our major cooperations and reduce outsourcing.

When we moved last year, my wife introduced me to her stylist. Male, so I was already somewhat squeamish. I watched her pay $80 for the 2 of us. After questioning her about the cost for me, $35, I promptly drove her to the hair salon supply outlet and bought a nice pair of scissors $20. She’s been cutting it ever since.

Sounds cheap as compared to the $300 my sister pays in Hollywood.

Wa ha ha. Used to work in Downtown Dallas near the Crescent hotel across the street from a little hair salon. All his customers had to walk past his overly fancy sports car to enter his shop. (Well, OK, they probably didn’t see him turbo in every day

What always cracked me up about starbucks were the fools who would actually order the italian sizes (venti, grande, whatever). How absurd. Other than myself, I don’t think I ever heard someone order medium, small, …

Eventually I think starbucks and granite countertops will merely be vestiges of a bygone era, I can’t wait.

SBUX may have made oodles off the HELOC money but I think they will evolve and survive.

I cut my own tresses. I turn my head upside down and snip. Of course I look homeless, but I have a lot of hair.
Will venture into the salon soon.

I get free haircuts. It only cost me $20,000 to send my daughter to Paul Mitchell the School. I should get them free for the rest of my life but we’ll see.

LOL, OV - I’m sure it looks much more like an expensive ‘layer’ style than homelessness. Some people pay good money to have their hair cut at varying lengths..

Now that my barnet is halfway down my back, I can do what I used to do in my previous long-haired incarnation - sit on one of the straight-backed dining room chairs and get the husband to use the ladder-back as a guide for hacking away. Its cheap, and often he manages to get it almost straight…

Heh…my wife made the mistake a few weeks ago of asking me to trim her bangs. I did. She won’t be asking for that again any time soon. lol

“Didn’t you realize those strands were SUPPOSED to be long?”

Ouro, just keep practicing. You’ll get the hang of it. I have a lot of hair, too, and I cut it myself. I get compliments on my pretty tresses all the time.
Here’s my tips:
Whatcher do, is, drink some beer, so as to loosen up your cutting hand–tension is the enemy of a pretty haircut–and then just sort of snip away delicately, here and there, layery like. Eventually you should start to sing, absentmindedly at first, but then get into it and start bellowing out the lyrics with gusto–this is a potentially significant moment, when you are filled with enthusiasm, so just be sure you don’t start whacking out big chunks–anyway, look at the back, look more or less okay? Jeeze! What a great song! I love beer! Now, throw down the scissors and prance out the door and away into the forest, because you’re all done and looking great!

just sort of snip away delicately, here and there, layery like. Eventually you should start to sing…

Ah. There’s a reason you live in the woods!

“Layery-like” Snort!

“Some people pay good money to have their hair cut at varying lengths.. ”

Hayyll, back where I come from we call that a mullet!

Hayyll, back where I come from we call that a mullet!

Business in front, party in the back!

(I just love that saying…)

Mr. Craig is going to do very well: Ebay, too.

The only problem is that the expanding bedbug problem will make it hard to sell used furniture & appliances.

Just because 1% of all divorces ends in the way you describe doesn’t mean that women don’t make out like bandits in divorce settlements.

Men are continually short-shrifted in divorce court on an automatic basis.

The only problem i’ve encountered has been 100 troy ounce extruded .999 Silver bars that have been hollowed out and lead replaced within, perhaps 20 ounces worth.

Greenspan = Judas Beast

Greenspan believe in Rand, then sold out her ideals.

but have no problem in giving away 500,000 tons of wheat* to an axis of evil charter member. That’s just a bribe so the NKors won’t make more trouble. This is like making treaties with Indians rather than just rubbing them all out.

Why not just give the North Koreans blankets infected with smallpox, instead?

‘You can tell a lot about a society by how it treats old people. We let ours starve.’

You must know different old people than the ones I know. The ones I know scamper around playing golf and traveling and planning their vineyard at their vacation home, in betwixt getting their (younger-taxpayer subsidized) prescription Viagra and Rogaine.

Oly gal, I see the both sides of seniors.
Those with more money than sense, playing, frolicking, getting much needed medical attn asap, enjoying high end restaurants/stores.
And I see all the men and women who are as poor as church mice. They go to food banks, share $3.= 3 taco day with 2 others just to eat. Share rides everywhere, all go en masse to libraries, have nothing to do but play cards daily=lack of cash/ss doesn’t cover increases.
No new clothes. I see these folks at the day old counter in the back of the store, hoping to get some squishy type vegetable etc.
I see them both and the ones that are wealthy give to other countries, not their own.

Why not just give the North Koreans blankets infected with smallpox, instead? The British tried that on my ancestors, but there were too many survivors. The USA mostly used the treaty method, which worked out to my satisfaction. My family got tens of thousands of $ last year when a lawsuit over treaty violations dating back to 1837 was finally settled. Other tribes’ mileage has varied, of course.

The USA mostly relied upon Indians having no immunity against common diseases.

Around 90% of the indians died of measles 140 years ago, where I live.

Don’t think any mfg has been in “Vantucky” since about 2000. In fact, I’m not sure what they’ve been up to. R&D, fixtures, test apparatae are all I hear about.

What’s the word on Boise?

Another note of value only to myself. I really liked the culture of that company. Great engineers to work with and I could relate with most of them. I hope the folks I called on are happily vested and doing well…

Pensions are gone. For those grandfathered (20+ years seniority IIRC) the plan is still in place. All others get a 401(k), and it was just announced that new hires will get a smaller match than current employees.

Haven’t heard much from the Boise site. At this point I’m pretty sure that only laser printer R&D is done there.

Why should they? They have doubled the price being paid for the same amount being produced.

Yes but do we have an ENERGY CZAR?? I think not!

If A.B. were an FB I would agree. But this is not the case.

So it costs you about 25 cents a mile to drive, just for fuel. I predict you won’t be driving that car in two years, unless you put a mast and sail on it and coast around town on windy days.

And I earn close to $70 per mile driving it. Consider this:

When I pull my trailer full of close-out polypropylene banner material for my print shops (located in Chicago, Los Angeles and Florence, KY), I generally have approximately $8,000 to $14,000 worth of paper in it. The paper I buy generally retails in the range of 3X what I pay for it. The “profit” on my savings in this case is $16,000 to $28,000 saved.

Why do I take my expensive time out and not send an employee? Because I can haggle on the closeouts, significantly. Most of my employees can not.

If my time is worth $120 per hour, and I can drive 30 miles per hour on an average trip picking up close-out material, in a given day I drive approximately 240 miles. Let’s say the bottom end of the profit is $16,000 saved, divided by 240 miles. I “lose” $960 in time, so let’s say $15,040 saved. I spend $100 on gas (lower MPG because of pulling the trailer), so that’s $14,940 saved. That’s $14,940 / 240 = $62.25 per mile that I earn owning that big oil burning beast.

Does $0.25 per mile bother me? No. Are you earning $60 per mile in your fuel efficient vehicle? Probably not.

Anyone who thinks that driving a big truck is always a waste has no clue to the realities of profiting in a declining market. If I had the drive and the responsibility, I would do it full time, actually. With the number of print shops that are failing due to high energy costs and high labor costs, I have my pick of purchasing goods from literally hundreds of shops and dozens of wholesalers who have to liquidate. I made my shop resistant to economic conditions by putting the actual shops in depressed areas where labor is cheap (but I pay more than others in those areas), where property costs are even cheaper (renting a 10,000 foot “warehouse” near Florence, KY for only $600 per month!), and where local FedEx and UPS depots are VERY close so shipping costs are low.

So, no, I won’t be driving something else. I know the Land Rover Discovery engines, transmissions and overall design like the back of my hand, and handle maintenance almost entirely by myself. Also, I get a huge amount of entertainment value when I want to plummet the truck down the side of a rocky cliff or through 5′ of water (the truck is snorkled for that) and have a blast over my friends who spent $60,000 on their H2s that don’t pull like mine or dive underwater like mine.

Drive your Prius. I could probably fit about $500 of paper in one and tow basically nothing. No thanks.

In Colorado: I am an FB, actually. I bought a mobile home as an “investment” (actually, a cheap place to live after we liquidated our previous overpriced home, hah) and can’t sell it for the life of me. I’m out about $12,000 on that “investment” and am happily awaiting my bailout check!

It’s not only the cost that will force you from your land schooner. The coming gas rationing will make you change vehicles.

There won’t be gas rationing, ever. You can bet on it.

A very good friend of mine since high school is a geophysicist, and he firmly believes that there is more oil in the ground than anyone wants to admit to.

In my businesses, I am always shrieking to my customers about the limited supply of what I sell: namely me. When I sold retail goods, we always kept our inventories low enough to sell for the premium we did. When I sold wholesale, we did the same. The business market is just as much about feigning limited supply as it is about feigning low profit margins.

The oil industry is doing exactly that.

Oil in the ground is a much different concept than oil we can extract.

There won’t be gas rationing, ever. You can bet on it. I ain’t taking that bet. There will be spot shortages at the very least. All the oil in the ground or on the moons of Saturn is worthless until I can pump it into my tank. OTOH I will be the first to rejoice and take a 7000-mile road trip when gas gets back to $1.50/gal.

Yes, never mind the HUGE conflict of interest. For shame…for shame.

Would you more appreciate the Great Lakes if they caught fire on occasion It was a tributary of the Great Lakes, the Cuyahoga River, that caught fire on occasion. That problem was basically cured by closing most of the factories that contributed to the problem. Now the unemployed can spend their free time fishing the less polluted waters of the Crooked River. Their only care is to not eat too many of the fish they catch.

This thread was already Godwinned (twice) today, so I can do this

Will you still love me in the morning?

yes but not before another sucker rally to a lower high

you deal in years, I deal in days to a few months

I have been known to day trade, but only when there is sufficient liquidity! The only liquid market at this time is currencies. It is just that whenever you make a day trade 3 things can happen, 1) make money, 2) lose money or 3) scratch and break even. 2 of those 3 are bad.

The number one question that I ask myself before I buy anything, “How do I get out?”

I can buy a lot of stocks right now, but I can’t get out of them if wrong.

you can’t? are buying a million shares at a time? I never have any trouble getting out, even in a fast market

Sorry Ms. Tx, IMHO a large ‘L’ - somewhere around 7600 DJIA, 620 S&P500 - a lot of 5% (maybe even 10%) rallies as we drift.

wow hoz you’re more negative than I am … Texas whats the support for the S&P ?

we hit it yesterday

meh

still have calls, bored

If the market allows it, size is not a factor - that is a huge IF.

The market is not currently allowing large unhedged trades, exceptions are stocks like GM -an unknown that I got lucky upon and completely misread. The blocks going across are spreads.

don’t count him out yet.

Good for a laugh:
“McCain’s YouTube Problem Just Became a Nightmare”

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEtZlR3zp4c

Coins in 1864 (2 Cent Piece), Banknotes in 1957.

Malinvestment at the macro level reflects too much investment in one sector

Right, but it’s a collection of individual acts. “Malinvestment” in the context of the macro economy represents the specific activity, albeit activity by lots of individual actors. The “bubble” term, in contrast, describes the condition of the single whole thing or whole market.

This is all just my opinion of course, it’s subtle but it’s how I fee about the words. Especially the term bubble really fits with regard to the “fake” economic expansion that inevitably leads to collapse (remember we are talking in the context of the Austrian theory of the business cycle).

I can think of no other alternatives for you, unfortunately…

Having your wealth in some other country’s paper money is like selling coal to Newcastle, a no go.

It pretty much leaves Gold as the only plan B.