September 15, 2008

The Days Of Selling For An Unreasonable Price Are Gone

The Rocky Mountain News reports from Colorado. “Caroline Hoyt, whose company next Saturday is opening the Casitas at Stapleton, said that today’s market is the worst since the downturn of the mid-1980s. This week, she discussed a variety of topics with Rocky Mountain News Real Estate Editor John Rebchook.”

“Q: What’s your take on the market? A: It’s horrible. We’re building about 150 homes now, while in the past we’ve built as many as 350. We had one home that we sold five times (before it closed.) And these were good contracts. We don’t accept contingencies. They all fell apart over credit issues.”

“If you want to buy a $1.5 million home in today’s market, there is no loan program for you, unless you’re practically paying cash.”

The Greeley Tribune from Colorado. “Sharon Herdman calls it a nutty real estate market. Then there are homes that have been sitting on the market for two years without an offer. Then there are the other homes out there that are getting low-balled.”

“‘We’re seeing people offer from $100,000 to $150,000 less (than the asking price),’ said Herdman, a Realtor with Sears Real Estate. So for Herdman, hearing word that the average home sales price in Greeley is dropping is no surprise.”

“‘We’re seeing a lot of price reductions,’ she said. ‘What we’re also seeing is that if you reduce the price to make it more marketable, people are still hitting them $50,000 to $75,000′ below their asking prices.”

“The lower home prices mean some great deals for buyers (try $139,000 for a home that sold recently in the upscale Kelly Farms neighborhood), said John DeWitt, president of the Greeley Area Realtor Association, but not so great for sellers, who reaped the benefits of strong markets for years.”

“‘When I got into the business nine years ago, all the stories were about the sellers and how they were getting contracts in one day,’ DeWitt said. ‘Now it’s a full-on buyer’s market and sorry, sellers. Stay put. … The days of selling a house … for an unreasonable price are gone.’”

KNXV TV from Arizona. “The prices are low, the inventory is high and the poor housing market is having a serious impact in the Phoenix community of Maryvale. ‘Everyday I search the listings and this neighborhood and I see five, six, seven new listings on a daily basis,’ said real estate agent Stanley Fosha.”

“For sale signs and empty homes pepper the small community where home sale prices rarely top $100,000. ‘It’s an evacuation and I think residents are leaving this area at a high rate due to the poor economy and bad bank loans,’ said Fosha. ‘I found that there were 955 homes for sale right now and that’s in a community that has less than 4,000 homes all together.’”

“Fosha says records show another 980 homes face foreclosure in Maryvale. ‘If the foreclosures go through, there’s basically going to be half a community that will be potentially bank owned by the end of the year,’ said Fosha.”

“According to Fosha, there are 600 Maryvale homes priced less than $100,000 and 40 homes listed at $50,000 or less.”

The Arizona Daily Star. “Of the 7,505 resale-home transactions recorded in Maricopa County in August, 44 percent were bought out of foreclosures, according to the realty studies department at Arizona State University. That’s a 2 percent increase from July and more than double the 20 percent of sales recorded in August 2007.”

“There’s no end in sight for the housing slump, said Jay Butler, director of realty studies at ASU’s Polytechnic Campus in east Mesa. ‘Most potential buyers still confront a weak economy, slumping levels of confidence and tighter underwriting guidelines,’ Butler said.”

“The median price of a home bought out of foreclosure in August was $161,875, compared with a non-foreclosure price of $193,550. A year ago, the median prices were $220,010 and $258,000, respectively.”

“The median price for homes sold in Tucson dropped sharply last month, according to a report from the Tucson Association of Realtors MLS.”

“The monthly sales report showed that the median price in August was $185,000, the lowest since January 2005. Previously this year, the median, or middle price of homes sold, has been holding steady at about $200,000.
The fall to $185,000 is 7.5 percent below where it was in July and about 16 percent below where it was in August 2007, the report said.”

“‘The market is showing signs of a rebound but it will not be a quick turnaround, and no one should be looking for a return to 2005 anytime soon,’ said Rick Hodges, CEO of the association.”

The Sierra Vista Herald from Arizona. “Community members with foreclosure concerns will have a chance to have some questions answered Thursday, when the Better Business Bureau of Southern Arizona hosts a seminar on the issue. Ann Gates, Cochise County manager for the Better Business Bureau, said the current state of foreclosures in Cochise County calls for such an event.”

“‘Foreclosures, according to the title companies, are increasing down here,’ she said. ‘There hasn’t been anything like this in quite a while down here.’”

The Reno Gazette Journal from Nevada. “Bank repossessions and notices of default saw significant increases in Washoe County in August while foreclosure filings reached record highs nationwide, a new housing report found.”

“Overall, foreclosure filings were reported on 1,105 properties in the county, up 46 percent from July and 127 percent from August 2007. Notices of default jumped up 46 percent to 596 while bank repossessions increased by 24 percent to 304. Auctions increased 97 percent to 205.”

“Nevada posted the highest foreclosure rate in the nation for the 20th straight month, followed by California and Arizona. According to the report, 11,706 Nevada properties received a foreclosure filing notice in August, up 16 percent from July and 89 percent from the same period last year. Clark County accounted for 10,099 of the properties, topping the state with a foreclosure activity rate of one in 75 households.”

In Business Las Vegas from Nevada. “The run of seven consecutive months during which home sales increased ended in August. There were 47 fewer sales in August than in July, marking the first month this year there has been a decrease from the previous month.”

“Prices continued their downward slide, which analysts said has prompted the surge in buying in recent months. The median price of the 2,545 homes sold in August was $210,000…30 percent below a year ago, according to the Realtors group.”

“President Patty Kelley attributed the continued decline in prices to the unprecedented number of bank-owned properties on the market and that two out of every three homes sold every month are owned by lenders. Kelley wouldn’t predict how far prices would fall and when it would stop. She said that will only end when the market sells off homes in or near foreclosure.”

“‘I don’t see how they can go much lower,’ Kelley said.”

“Dennis Smith, president of Home Builders Research, thinks $200,000 may be a barrier because he says he can’t believe that of all the homes built in the past five to 10 years, more than 50 percent are worth less than $200,000.”

“But for now, Smith said it looks as if prices will continue to fall and said it is likely to continue until spring. ‘Nobody can tell us how many foreclosures are coming in the system,’ Smith said. ‘Until we know what those are, we can’t run the calculations.’”

The Review Journal from Nevada. ” Creditors have forced the 63-unit Onyx condominium project into involuntary Chapter 11 bankruptcy. San Diego-based Crestone Co. was developing the 2-acre site, formerly the Tropicana Inn. The telephone number listed on the company’s Web site is no longer in service.”

“The $28 million mid-rise project was announced in 2005 as an affordable alternative to the high rises that were being built near the Strip. Units at Onyx ranged from 740 square feet to 2,300 square feet and were priced from the $400,000s to more than $900,000.”

“They came standard with granite counters, stone flooring, General Electric appliances and 10-foot ceilings.”

“‘I feel sorry for those guys,’ Las Vegas-based architect Howard Perlman said. ‘They owe me money, but they got hurt. Everybody’s getting hurt, but it’s just the timing in the market. Can you sell a condo for those prices? Their strategy was right on when they started.’”

“More than half of the 23,400 homes for sale in Las Vegas are sitting vacant. The system for disposing of bank-owned homes is ‘clogged up,’ Thomas Taylor of Desert Classic Properties said. Banks and mortgage companies have concentrated listings into the hands of a limited number of qualified brokers in Las Vegas.”

“‘Agents are holding from 100 to 600 listings each — way, way too many to handle properly,’ Taylor said.”

“Some agents aren’t prepared to handle the large quantity of listings they received from the banks, REO specialist Tim Kelly said. He’s looked at properties that don’t even have a ‘For Sale’ sign in the yard. Sometimes the staff representing the listing agent isn’t as ‘professional’ as he’d like. ‘They’re probably overworked and underpaid,’ Kelly said.”

“REO specialist Troy Kearns saw the foreclosure wave coming when his personal speculative investments turned sour and decided to ride it out rather than battle it. He has about 150 REO listings and pending listings, including a four-bedroom, 1,530-square-foot home at 7234 Bridgeview Ave. The pool is polluted, the home is trashed, the garage is a disaster and the place smells like cat urine.”

“He’s going to suggest a list price to the bank of $155,000 to $175,000.”

“‘We won’t put anything into it. We’ll sell it as is,’ Kearns said. ‘It’ll look a lot better once we clean this place up. It needs paint, but it’s not structurally damaged. It’s got tile, it’s got a pool. If there’s pipes ripped out, that’s a problem.’”

“One homeowner facing foreclosure in Anthem dismantled his air conditioner and threw it into the swimming pool. About 20 percent of people in foreclosure will tear things up because they’re upset and feel they’ve been ’screwed over,’ but the other 80 percent know it’s coming and accept it, Kearns said.”

“Robin Camacho of American Realty Investments said she makes very little money working with some clients buying foreclosures. She recently had offers accepted on a $60,000 home and a $920,000 home and spent about an equal amount of time on each transaction.”

“‘It’s all the same to me,’ Camacho said. ‘My only goal is helping my client find the right home. I can’t tell you what my clients are paying for these, but suffice to say, there are some great deals on Las Vegas homes right now.’”

“Of the 19,684 single-family homes for sale on the MLS, 5,624 are bank-owned and 7,183 are short sales, listed for less than the mortgage owed. That means that nearly two-thirds of the inventory needs lender approval, Kearns said.”




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57 Comments »

Comment by Ben Jones
2008-09-15 13:07:48

Sorry about the partial early post error. It was a busy day at the courthouse steps.

‘When I got into the business nine years ago, all the stories were about the sellers and how they were getting contracts in one day,’ DeWitt said.’

And it’s fair to guess that the bubble in Greeley got started a year or more before this time, so maybe 10 years or more? What irks me about the media and the government is that they will say it was a bubble, but then proceed like it isn’t. If this was a housing bubble, the first question should be; when did it start? That will give everyone an idea of how long and far prices will likely fall.

In Colorado’s case, prices were falling when I started this blog in late 2004. IMO, we are looking at years of declines, even from here.

Comment by NoSingleOne
2008-09-15 14:24:27

I originally thought the financial cratering was mainly housing when I found this blog. I am now realizing things are so much bigger than this. I have always looked forward to the “bust” part of the cycle, but things are getting a little scary. Unchartered territory, I guess…

Comment by BKlawyer
2008-09-15 22:47:05

Ben- I’ve been around awhile. You’re blog single handedly (Props to Lost in Utah) saved me from becoming a bubble victim. I looked at North Colo. Steamboat Springs property and almost bought into the “It’s different in tourist real estate areas” DESPITE my years of chicken little predictions. It’s hard to be a contrarian when you have the resources to jump in. Not so hard when you are standing on the sidelines throwing rocks at the parade because you CAN”T jump in. . .. Thanks to Ben and his sound and sage crew. . .

 
 
Comment by exeter
2008-09-15 14:50:27

I recall back in 1997-98 that CO real estate was bloated even back then when I was considering a job and relocation there. The inflated housing prices then were the only reason I didn’t go.

 
Comment by Olympiagal
2008-09-15 15:14:46

‘It was a busy day at the courthouse steps.’

Ooooh! Tell us how it went! And tell us if it was hard to keep the smug off your face. I bet it was, huh huh!
And then tell us when you are making a PNW road trip. It’s going to start to rain like blazes here, and soon, you know. Rain is good for people of Scottish descent. It refreshes the hide and makes the haggis sit easier. Plus, there’s mushrooms. Plus, there’s REaltards to make fun of, because you know why? Because it’s NOT different out here, that’s why. Hahahahahaha!

Comment by Ben Jones
2008-09-15 15:30:26

I’ll probably post the details at the forum in the N AZ thread, but it was interesting. One thing you should know OG; the weather in Flagstaff this time of year is nothing short of heavenly during the day, if a bit chilly at night.

Actually, two of my good friends just moved to Portland, so I need to get up that way sooner than later. I like Washington a lot. I almost moved up to North Bend years ago, but the out of state tuition thing stopped me.

Comment by Olympiagal
2008-09-15 17:39:16

Well, make it sooner, I urge. Only bring your rain-jacket, your hoodie, and also your galluses, if it’s sooner.
As for this ‘out-of-state-tuition thingie.’ Jeeze, I just don’t know about you, Mr. B. Honest McRighteous. (sorrowful shake of my head) You shoulda lied. That’s what I did, when I wanted to take a woodworking class right after I got here. And then I almost lost my favorite thumb, now that I think about it, so that should have been a lesson to me about not lying.
Maybe you were young and didn’t know better? That’s probably what happened.
Anyhow, it’s time to move on, Mr. Man, and admit that the PNW is the place for pale Scots bloggers.
Besides, we have Swede Days here! We have Julefest up in Poulsbo! We have oysters, yes, and kayaks, and mussels, and micro-brews, and smug bicyclers in packs, and ponds and lakes and more berries than you can ever, ever imagine, and also arcane festivals attended by pale hairy locals! Fabulous!

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Comment by joelkton
2008-09-15 19:42:09

North Bend?! You godda be kiddin. Rain, wind, cold: a climate resembling the Outer Hebrides without the culture. Good lord, man, count yourself lucky. Just try to buy seafood at a restaurant. You’ll get Gordon’s fried fish sticks passed off as gourmet fare, and, btw, Mo’s chowder really blows. Ugh. don’t get me started on the Oregon coast.

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Comment by patient renter
2008-09-15 15:26:31

Anything to report from the courthouse?

 
 
Comment by North GA Dave
2008-09-15 13:11:42

“If you want to buy a $1.5 million home in today’s market, there is no loan program for you, unless you’re practically paying cash.”

As it should be.

Comment by Bronco
2008-09-15 13:52:32

We will know we turned the corner when a million dollar house is really a million dollar house.

Comment by Neil
2008-09-15 19:51:48

When did people *need* financing for homes selling at 20X+ median wage? At that point, financing should be a convienience or one of several financial options.

It amazes me how long its take to return to normalacy.

Now the scary ride is here… any updates on the real estate roller coaster?

Got Popcorn?
Neil

 
 
Comment by climber
2008-09-15 15:51:04

It’s not like Stapleton is in the best part of town either. It’s the former airport and the areas that grew up around the airport were not high end.

Everything fun to do in the Denver area is a drive from Stapleton, and if you want to hike or ski in the mountains you have to fight your way all across town. No thanks.

When I moved to Denver in ‘94 prices were reasonable. The nicer parts of Denver were comparable to the nicer parts of Detroit (yes, there are - or were - nice parts of metro Detroit). So, if there’s a floor to watch for I’d say 94 prices plus a bit for inflation. That should give a median house price of around $150k. I think the current median is around $220k.

 
 
Comment by arizonadude
2008-09-15 13:19:59

It is getting ugly out there.Aig looks like it is toast too.I cannot believe how such a large company good screw up this bad.I thought homebuyers were nuts but now we have 100 year old companies dropping like flies.

Homebuilders are still drinking kool aid.I looked at some townhomes yesterday. I asked the sales rep how they were selling anything due to the competition of foreclosures.Basically all I got is was different there and they come with a warranty.So I am going to pay 50k more for a warranty? You can pick up a 1 year warranty for a lot of things in the house for 350 bucks.The foreclosures I looked at were a couple years old.Spend 5 grand and you have a nice house.

Comment by buckwheat
2008-09-15 13:51:05

I think the builders have finally faced reality out here. The townhomes we looked at last year in Lake Elsinore were 300 and change for a 3 bed 2 bath. Checked on them last weekend for fun and the same model is down to 199 with all kinds of “incentives”. Now if they could only build jobs out there…

Comment by exeter
2008-09-15 16:03:00

“Now if they could only build jobs out there…”

BULLSEYE. There are many places I’d like to live but few of them have the jobs that pay enough to support basic living costs. There are alot of nice houses just about everywhere you go but their aren’t alot of good paying jobs in those same locations. And because of this, those who have the 2005 housing mindset are going to be very very disapppointed.

Comment by MacAttack
2008-09-15 17:33:15

Here in Portland, OR, I saw something new from the builders: “Any reasonable NON-CONTINGENT offer accepted on completed homes.”

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Comment by Neil
2008-09-15 19:49:51

My… that’s a cry for help. ;)

Non-contingent means “you’re not going to sell!”

Oh boy… this is happening fast if Portland is seeing it like that.

Got Popcorn?
Neil

 
Comment by rms
2008-09-15 20:35:35

“Oh boy… this is happening fast if Portland is seeing it like that.”

Winter is just around the corner; everything slows for 5-months!

 
 
Comment by NoSingleOne
2008-09-15 18:18:45

Hold on to your homes, if not…
Hold on to your jobs, if not…
Hold on to your families, if not…
Hold on to your sanity

Otherwise, ya ain’t got nuthin’

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Comment by aNYCdj
2008-09-15 16:52:05

Time for ole Warren to step in…..AIG insurance….and aircraft leasing

Warren owns NetJets…and Geico….so?

 
 
Comment by Curt
2008-09-15 13:32:39

“Flip & Grow Rich”

Ben, I love it!

Comment by Jimmy Jazz
2008-09-15 14:34:03

That ad is like selling saunas in hell.

 
 
Comment by sfbubblebuyer
2008-09-15 13:51:40

I love the flipper ads showing up here! Take ‘em for every penny, Ben! I’m even clicking a few for laugh value.

Comment by Bronco
2008-09-15 13:54:47

check out that slimey punk, armando

Comment by Arizona Slim
2008-09-15 14:10:13

Would you buy a used house from this man?

 
Comment by sfbubblebuyer
2008-09-15 14:13:19

His site is similarly amazing! All that is there is another picture of his greasy mug and a way to enter your contact info so that they can sell you to marketing lists.

 
 
Comment by Arizona Slim
2008-09-15 14:05:14

You meanies. Don’t you realize that, if you keep clicking, you’re going to raise their pay-per-click customer acquisition costs?

Comment by sfbubblebuyer
2008-09-15 14:12:03

Why yes… yes I do! Hee hee!

Comment by Bad Chile
2008-09-15 14:16:44

I love how the spokeschick’s monitor is blank…

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Comment by Bronco
2008-09-15 14:26:09

wait…,let me check it again

 
 
Comment by patient renter
2008-09-15 15:52:15

LOL. I can’t believe that guy has a book. Wow.

Comment by novawatcher
2008-09-15 20:12:33

I clicked on the link to as a way to send Ben some money.

Man, is that site cheesy. I really like the fake pop-up window designed to look like a Windows instant message. That really looks stupid when you’re using a Mac, and it screams “we’re trolling for dumb people”.

 
Comment by desertdweller
2008-09-15 22:51:37

Saw him in his first shows…okay guy, but as he progressed, he got to be a bigger arse every single show, even being a schnook to his wife and brother.
Well, he certainly kept getting what he wanted but was continually a worse person per show to his subcontractors.

He was the only one allowed to make a decent living.
OH well. loved it when his ad appeared and we should keep looking at it.

 
 
 
Comment by Silverback1011
2008-09-15 13:53:13

I see a lot of neato decorating and reconstruction in these flipper houses on HGTV and now this stupid flipper show on A&E, but how many of those things get resold ? I saw a hideous 2-family in what was obviously an “ethnic” neighborhood in L.A. someplace a couple of nights ago, and these 2 ass—le brothers ( ? ) friends ( ? ) were asking $ 778,000 or so for it. They paid over $ 500,000K for it and put in an extra bedroom and new kitchen on each side. Wow. I think I’ll make an offer.

 
Comment by Brett
2008-09-15 14:27:24

It is very dissapointing and sad to see how some people always try to blame someone for the loss of their home due to foreclosures. Why do they have to trash and destroy the property they were living in? It really shows the level of ignorance of some people.

Unless you do not speak English, you should have read the documents you were signing when you closed for your house.

I may sound a little harsh, but I do not feel sorry for people who were signing a loan for hundreds of thousands of dollars and did not take the time to read the terms. It’s a freakin’ 30-year commitment; taking a few hours or days to investigate the terms.

Comment by wiscman
2008-09-16 03:23:53

Ever close on a house, Brett? If you read every piece of paper put in front of you it would take a week. They’re all written in legalese, so unless you’re a lawyer or real estate professional you have no idea what you’re reading anyway. To protect yourself you need someone with you who understands the process - a lawyer or a knowledgeable real estate agent, for example. Without someone on your side it’s not hard to see how people can get ripped off by unscrupulous lenders/RE agents.

Comment by incredoulous
2008-09-16 09:14:27

I get tired of this stack of papers argument. There really are only 2 important documents, the HUD statement showing all the fees and such, and the note outlined the terms (interest rate, period, adjustments, etc.) It seems any reasonably sane person with even half of a functioning brain would at least look of these 2 documents very carefully, but I guess not when people’s primary concern is to “snag a house”, “get in a house”, etc.

 
 
 
Comment by LA Wallflower
2008-09-15 14:37:41

So, how many of these half-neighborhood’s worth of foreclosed homes are on Lehman’s balance sheet as of today, I wonder?

For that matter, how many on BoA’s via Countrywide? Did Merrill have any REOs?

Methinks we’ll find out how many, as they’re likely to be price-cut even more aggressively…

Comment by az_lender
2008-09-15 16:47:31

Merrill’s problem was a lot of CDO, CDS garbage. Their problem right now is that they sold their $30B of such garbage to Lone Star hedge fund for $7B, but Lone Star paid only 1/4 of that in cash, the rest is on Merrill’s list of receivables. Good luck Merrill, maybe collectable maybe not.

About a month ago I bought $200K of ML’s corporate debt. Am I dumb or what? Meanwhile, as I’ve been reporting recently, I was having arguments with some poor soul who wanted to buy a $98K property (mobile plus lot) and I was balking at lending $80K, saying I would lend only $72K. Our deal isn’t concluded. Instead of nickel and diming this borrower, I should’ve been more careful about lending $200K to Merrill Lynch!!! …however, I got very lucky when B of A decided to buy Merrill. The bondholders will (presumably) be paid.

Comment by dude
2008-09-15 19:28:23

By my informal survey around these parts (93552), both MER and LEH have a sizable portfolio of REO. Citi and Deutsche are probably the hands down winners, though.

 
 
 
Comment by DinOR
2008-09-15 14:43:33

Almost hard to believe that Sierra Vista, AZ would be experincing ‘that’ many foreclosures? My mom, brother and older sister live there and the area seems economically stable. Mostly military ( and retired ) military. It always seemed to me that a lot of people are there for health reasons and won’t be leaving any time soon?

Man, is there ANY place this thing didn’t hit?

Comment by aNYCdj
2008-09-15 16:56:53

Its DIFFERENT here in the Big apple, we thumb our noses at you.

So we lost lehman, most of those losers probably lived in Jersey anyway.

And Merriil all those Darien commuters..HAH….

 
Comment by SanFranciscoBayAreaGal
2008-09-15 18:31:07

DinOr,

If you go over to the Forum, you will see Ben has posted numerous articles from around the world concerning this god awful ugly bubble. No place in the world is immune.

 
 
Comment by safe_as_apartments
2008-09-15 14:44:47

I’m seeing steadily increasing inventory and declining prices in MA (market I follow closely). Many sellers finally getting it, seeing declines close to 15% off list. Huge glut of inventory from $750,000 to $1,000,000.

The insolvency of the U.S. banking system is becoming obvious to the smart sellers.

Congratulations, renters.

Comment by Pen
2008-09-15 18:20:48

“Huge glut of inventory from $750,000 to $1,000,000.”

What area of MA are you following?

I know the North Shore is loaded with these priced liced and up and down and all around. Per Buffet, price is what you pay, value is what you get..I still don’t see value out there. Those prices sure are “sticky”, aren’t they.

I’ve looked at couple of $650 - $850 homes, just for kicks.

What I’m starting to see now is BIG tax bills on relatively small homes. I am also starting to see many 5 figure tax bills, which is pretty scary, given that the median income is only in the mid-five figures.

 
 
Comment by DinOR
2008-09-15 14:56:34

“nearly two-thirds of the inventory needs lender approval”

At what point does Las Vegas become a total loss? How much longer can the 1/3rd that *doesn’t require bank approval hold out before getting dragged down by the majority?

I would think with as little as 10 or 15% in peril there would be no pricing power whatsoever for legitimate sellers. Now just to say that because you aren’t ‘currently’ in some stage of default implies that you’re totally legit but..?

Comment by ravi
2008-09-15 20:50:22

I just bought a house for about $120000 in Vegas to rent out.

Comment by calex
2008-09-16 05:23:33

There are so many of you that bought houses in Vegas to rent out that you should have your own club.

 
 
Comment by 45north
2008-09-15 21:03:33

At what point does Las Vegas become a total loss?
Mr. Mortgage:
Lenders, receivers, trustees, and sometimes, the developers themselves, are arranging asset sales that transfer title directly from the defaulting borrowers to the real estate equivalent of jobbers.

The time is now.

 
 
Comment by Jim
2008-09-15 16:41:43

I, too, am getting scared by the broader prospect of a stock market collapse. I’m young and have never owned a house - been reading this blog since summer 2005 when I graduated from college in LA and nearly bought a $400,000 condo in Inglewood…. anyway, I’ve been waiting for these recent price declines like a kid waits for Christmas. I live in Portland now and am happy to see prices finally on their way down.

However, now that my 401(k) is getting destroyed, I wonder if I should be careful what I wish for…

I hate mortgage brokers, I hate realtors, I hate greedy sellers, and I especially hate flippers. They have not only priced millions of people out of the housing market, but they have brought financial ruin to millions more and put our economy on the verge of a depression. Now that I - someone who doesn’t even OWN a house - am losing money because of them, I know that we’re in trouble.

How much worse can this get?

Comment by chilildoggg
2008-09-15 22:33:36

rydex and profunds and others have inverse mutual funds that go up when the market goes down. there are also inverse ETF like DOG.

 
 
Comment by Ted
2008-09-15 16:53:26

Oh that new advertiser is classic! I typed in Casey Serin’s name and my e-mail address, and when I tried to click off before ordering it sent me to a “operator standing by” with a scripted message for each response. You should try it for yourselves…it’s a lot more fun than watching the entire banking system melt down.

 
Comment by Neil
2008-09-15 19:46:03

The ad when I clicked on is for the book “Flip and grow rich!”

ROTFLMAO.

Try getting the loan today.

Got Popcorn?
Neil

Comment by JackRussell
2008-09-16 05:29:24

You mean you can’t go out and get one of those payday homeloans any more :-)?

 
 
Comment by Adam
2008-09-15 20:14:54

Great Depression part 2. We still have over 100 bank failures to go. Every weekend, some new corporate carcass gets deposited on Paulson’s doorstep. He may actually have to earn part of his salary in the government sector…

Avoid stocks and corporate bonds. Cash (and soon gold) are king. When everything around you is deflating rapidly, you don’t need to earn interest or take on investment risk, as you are gaining in purchasing power by the minute. At least another year to go in this stock bear market and the last year of the bear is the worst part…

In the real estate bear market…? 2011-2012 for nominal price floor seems reasonable, but inflation-adjusted is another story. If Helicopter Ben’s deflation fighting dream is recognized, we may lurch from deflation into a hyperinflationary spiral.

Absolutely got my popcorn!

 
Comment by SDGreg
2008-09-16 04:30:36

“The $28 million mid-rise project was announced in 2005 as an affordable alternative to the high rises that were being built near the Strip. Units at Onyx ranged from 740 square feet to 2,300 square feet and were priced from the $400,000s to more than $900,000.”

“‘I feel sorry for those guys,’ Las Vegas-based architect Howard Perlman said. ‘They owe me money, but they got hurt. Everybody’s getting hurt, but it’s just the timing in the market. Can you sell a condo for those prices? Their strategy was right on when they started.’”

Their strategy was right on when they started? Incomes were high enough to support those prices when they started, but incomes of fallen substantially since then? Not quite. It was never a viable project except in the context of an unsustainable bubble.

 
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