January 14, 2009

Bits Bucket For January 14, 2009

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443 Comments »

Comment by Xenos
2009-01-14 04:17:59

Can I throw out a question to the Californians here: how do you track sales histories and comparables now that the registries are off-line? Even Zillow does not show anything any more. Or do I need to get myself to the county in question and look it up in person at the courthouse?

Comment by DennisN
2009-01-14 04:38:53

The registries are off-line? Did they get pulled because of the budget impasse?

Try http://www.propertyshark.com - you can pull records for up to 6 properties each day with a free account. It doesn’t cover the whole country but does cover coastal states including California. The only fault with PS is that it tends to be several weeks late in posting data.

Comment by Professor Bear
2009-01-14 08:01:18

“The only fault with PS is that it tends to be several weeks late in posting data.”

You expect free data up to the minute?

Comment by DennisN
2009-01-14 09:50:44

I wouldn’t expect it, but was actually just giving a word of caution to Xenos. By the way, Property Shark actually is a pay-for service, intended for the use of Realtors&trade . They just give a few hits a day away free for ordinary people.

What’s not to like about charging Realtors for a service and giving it away free for everybody else? :)

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Comment by Professor Bear
2009-01-14 20:06:48

I don’t like it, because what interests me is the basic description (available) and the sales price history (not available w/o fee).

 
 
 
Comment by not a gator
2009-01-14 17:33:56

and only covers certain metros at that. easy to use site, though.

 
Comment by Milkcrate
2009-01-14 17:39:07

Good tip. Thanks.

 
 
Comment by scdave
2009-01-14 09:16:50

Every county will likely have a different processing time line but ultimately the data is of public record…Santa Clara County California usually takes a couple of months or more to process the recordings…

 
 
Comment by wmbz
2009-01-14 04:41:58

Wow, something else no could have seen coming LOL. I’m telling ya this coming year is going to be more fun than a SNL comedy skit.

Banks in Need of Even More Bailout Money!

Article Tools Sponsored By
By EDMUND L. ANDREWS and ERIC DASH
Published: January 13, 2009

WASHINGTON — Even before word came on Tuesday that Citigroup might split into pieces to shore up its finances, an unpleasant message was moving through Congress and President-elect Barack Obama’s transition team: the banks need more taxpayer money.

In all likelihood, a lot more money.

Mr. Obama seems to know it; a week before his swearing-in, he is lobbying Congress to release the other half of the financial industry bailout fund. Democratic leaders in Congress seem to know it, too; they are urging their rank and file to act quickly to release the rescue money. And Ben S. Bernanke, the chairman of the Federal Reserve, certainly knows it.

On Tuesday, Mr. Bernanke publicly made the case that one of the most unpopular and most scorned programs in Washington — the $700 billion bailout program — needs to pour hundreds of billions more into the very banks and financial institutions that already received federal money and caused much of the credit crisis in the first place.

The most glaring example that the banking system needs even more help is Citigroup. Though it already has received $45 billion from the Treasury, it is in such dire straits that it is breaking itself into parts.

Like many banks, Citi is finding that its finances keep deteriorating as the economy continues to weaken.

Even some of the bailout program’s harshest critics acknowledge that things most likely would be even worse without it, and that the bailout had accomplished its most important goal, which was to prevent a complete collapse of the financial system.

Since last September, no major banks have failed and the credit markets have thawed somewhat.

But analysts said the problems are still acute, if less apparent on the surface. Banks have received $200 billion in fresh capital from the Treasury since last fall and have borrowed hundreds of billions of dollars more from the Fed. But in the meantime, the economy fell into a severe downturn last fall that is likely to continue until at least this summer.

Comment by edgewaterjohn
2009-01-14 06:28:30

HP has said twice now that the banks are out of the woods - yet what’s with all this “urgent” talk from the incoming adminstration? Did they not get Hank’s memos?

Despite all the nice nice talk about the cooperative transition between the adminstrations, there’s still the possibility that those leaving will leave a flaming bag of sh*t on the doorstep.

Comment by skroodle
2009-01-14 07:19:46

You think?

The Bush administration hasn’t tied up a bow on anything?

I wonder if they will tell even tell Obama where the money from TARP #1 went?

This financial crisis still has a few years to run.

I can see Obama putting the finishing touches on TARP#8 in 2015.

Comment by Jim A.
2009-01-14 07:33:45

I’m reminded of Nixon’s wage and price controls in the 70s. Phase I, Phase II, Phase III….

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Comment by edgewaterjohn
2009-01-14 07:54:41

Or possibly Jeb signing TARP #8?

Don’t discount the power of the short attention span coupled with a feckless electorate.

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Comment by The Housing Wizard
2009-01-14 08:14:26

The banks are still borrowing billions of dollars from the Feds . Now what does that tell you ? Short term loan injections end up becoming bail-outs . When the Feds started the liquidity injection short term loan program for the Banking and Investment Firms Industry ,than bail-outs became a given . From day one bad assets and declining assets were used for security for those loans to Lenders . Reminds me very much of
refinances given to FB’s to keep them afloat one more year .

 
Comment by nhz
2009-01-14 09:48:11

life is still good for the banksters (as long as they keep their job); maybe the bonuses are slightly smaller this year, but salaries and other compensation will probably go up. Let the good times roll for another year, why would the FED make life hard for their best friends?

 
Comment by not a gator
2009-01-14 17:35:49

+1 nhz

 
 
 
Comment by ET-Chicago
2009-01-14 07:45:28

Despite all the nice nice talk about the cooperative transition between the adminstrations, there’s still the possibility that those leaving will leave a flaming bag of sh*t on the doorstep.

The doorstep is covered in flaming bags, I’m afraid. The financial bag o’ sh!t is simply the closest.

Comment by measton
2009-01-14 08:32:06

I don’t see them being nice enough to put the crap in a bag, I suspect they will find crap flung in every corner of the white house and the drapes and furniture will be on fire.

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Comment by SFC
2009-01-14 09:29:50

Maybe they’ll be like the Clintons, and just take everything with them. They stripped the place as if they’d been foreclosed on.

 
Comment by Stan UpHigh
2009-01-14 10:36:01

SFC - lie.

Clinton left a fat surplus ($559 billion), who cares if he took the chair Monica sat in. Good memories! ——————>

 
Comment by LehighValleyGuy
2009-01-14 11:51:29

“Clinton left a fat surplus ($559 billion)”

Yeah, if you went by Enron/Worldcom accounting.

 
Comment by SFC
2009-01-14 12:07:51

Stan, I’m confused. I said that the Clintons took the furniture, you said that’s a lie. Then you started talking about a surplus?, then said Bill took a chair. Aren’t chairs furniture?

 
Comment by Stan UpHigh
2009-01-14 13:13:07

SFC - I agree, you are confused and your sense of humor is broken.

 
Comment by mdindestin
2009-01-14 19:43:51

Clinton deserves some credit even though most of the surplus was associated with the tech bubble. The treasury was full from capital gains tax revenue.

I remember the talking heads inflating the bubble: Earnings don’t matter, things are different now….yadda, yadda, yadda.

 
 
 
 
Comment by Blano
2009-01-14 07:14:54

C currently down 16% in premarket.

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-01-14 08:03:14

My favorite banking cartoon shows Dr Bernanke’s experiment, wherein he pours money into the (piggy) bank’s mouth, with the confidence that “something good will eventually come out the other end.”

 
Comment by Pondering the Mess
2009-01-14 10:23:33

Well, of course they need more taxpayer money!

How else can they pay out the big salaries and bonuses for all of their “hard work” in crashing the ship of the economy onto the rocks? They’ve run out of voluntary loot to steal, so now they have to steal at the point of a gun!

Don’t worry - hyperinflation will make us all “rich!”

 
Comment by potential buyer
2009-01-14 10:52:56

So they frittered away the money we loaned them initially, then expect another handout?

Do they repay their loan with the money we have loaned them, I wonder?

 
Comment by GS fixer
2009-01-14 14:17:56

Second TARP go-around = “Black Swan”

Just like the 2009 Alt-A resets.

GS fixer = Nostradamus

Comment by Professor Bear
2009-01-14 14:57:24

What of the soon-to-be-announced third, fourth and fifth TARP iterations?

 
 
 
Comment by wmbz
2009-01-14 04:44:00

Economic crisis may put pressure on democracy…

By Robin Kwong in Taipei

Published: January 14 2009 08:56 | Last updated: January 14 2009 08:56

Democratic institutions worldwide could come under increasing pressure this year as a result of the global economic downturn, warns Freedom House, an international rights organisation.

Christopher Walker, director of studies, said the impact of the financial crisis would present severe challenges “to all sorts of topographies of states”; the full effects on civil and political freedoms around the world remained to be seen.

Governments are likely to face increased social tension as a result of rising unemployment; this may be particularly acute in southeast Asian countries such as Malaysia, Indonesia and the Philippines, where millions of migrant workers are expected to return from overseas without work.

The warning comes as Freedom House found liberties declining around the world for the third consecutive year in 2008, after five years of expansion at the beginning of this decade. Some 34 countries saw falls in freedom last year, according to the group’s annual Freedom of the World survey, released yesterday for the first time in Asia.

North Korea remains the least free country in the world; Finland is the freest. Sub-Saharan Africa saw the worst setback in freedoms, with nearly a quarter of its countries seeing falls.

Mr Walker said the decline was largely because “governments least welcoming to democratic freedoms marshalled their resources” after the ‘colour revolutions’ in post-communist states such as Ukraine and Georgia between 2000 and 2005.

Authoritarian states, led by Russia and China, were employing more sophisticated methods against opposition – including judicial investigations, media censorship and internet control – to curb freedoms. “The tools that are used to suppress freedom are more nuanced and more institutionalised.”

Copyright The Financial Times Limited 2009

Comment by packman
2009-01-14 07:02:36

The problem with a “Free Market Economy” is - we haven’t got one, contrary to popular belief.

In related news, the updated index of economic freedoms just came out. Will post a link that’ll probably show up sometime tomorrow :).

U.S. is now 6th. Just behind (ahem) New Zealand now.

Comment by packman
Comment by GS fixer
2009-01-14 14:24:30

I’m convinced that the WSJ is published in a parallel universe, where all Wall Street is dedicated, honest, and trustworthy, and whose stewardship of the economy has everyone living in economic Valhalla, except where all those regulators/lawyers/union-members/freeloaders/parasites mucking things up.

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Comment by ET-Chicago
2009-01-14 14:39:21

If you think the WSJ universe is wacky, you should check out the parallel universe the Heritage Foundation occupies. Un-real.

 
 
 
Comment by nhz
2009-01-14 07:28:14

let me guess who is first: Zimbabwe or Somalia maybe?

Comment by packman
2009-01-14 08:08:31

Ha ha - no Zimbabwe is second to last (last is NK) - the biggest mover down since last year actually. Somalia isn’t even on the list - maybe it’s not even considered a country or something.

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Comment by nhz
2009-01-14 09:52:56

I was not quite joking, I seriously doubt this kind of ’statistics’.

Some time ago there was a nice TV documentary about mobile phone services in Somalia. They have about the lowest rates on the planet thanks to free competition in the marketplace, and service level is pretty good.

How is that possible in a third (fourth?) world country? Because they hardly have a government that messes with the market … I think Zimbabwe may also have a free economy of some kind, because their official economy is 99% nonfunctional. Problem is that the real life economy does not register with statistics from the burocrats or the banksters.

 
Comment by not a gator
2009-01-14 17:45:27

“thanks to free competition in the marketplace”

I’m sure it has nothing to do with lower startup costs with a mature technology and a population which cannot use credit (Muslim banking rules) and doesn’t have much cash driving the price the market will bear down.

I read recently that part of Somalia is actually a functioning state again, but it’s a kind of collective/coalition thing that came together because everyone was sick of the chaos. Until a “strong leader” emerges, there’s no-one for global capitalism to bribe (so they can get an exclusive franchise and turn the screws).

“I think Zimbabwe may also have a free economy of some kind”

Um, well, not really. Of course there is a black market, but since Zimbabwe is not producing much in the way of goods (they used to be a major agricultural exporter), ergo there is little in the way of an economy and millions are starving. Many work across the border and under the table, the “Mexicans of South Africa”.

Now, if some of these new, failed farmers get a hot idea to start growing coca or opium poppies, Zimbabwe might start having an (underground) economy again!

 
 
 
 
Comment by Hwy50ina49Dodge
2009-01-14 07:30:51

“…Governments are likely to face increased social tension as a result of rising unemployment; this may be particularly acute in southeast Asian countries such as Malaysia, Indonesia and the Philippines, where millions of migrant workers are expected to return from overseas without work.” ;-)

Geez, will everyone just relax…Cheney-Shrub / Condi / Rummy gave the world a “Democratic” global fix-it-all solutions template: It’s known as the Iraq-Afghanistan Sha-Zam reconfiguration Doctrine. :-)

 
Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2009-01-14 10:06:14

This article highlights one of my biggest fears related to the bubble fallout–that disillusioned masses will make it easier for fascism to take root again.

 
 
Comment by Blano
2009-01-14 05:44:09

Median sales price in Detroit metro area falls 46 percent YOY in 2008.

Median sales price in Detroit in 2008: $ 7,500.

Demolition permits outpace building permits. For every 4 houses built, 5 torn down.

http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20090114/BIZ01/901140383

Comment by wmbz
2009-01-14 05:57:01

“Demolition permits outpace building permits. For every 4 houses built, 5 torn down”.

Good, that’s exactly what needs to happen! Demolition of houses will be spreading around the country.

Comment by packman
2009-01-14 07:12:48

“Good, that’s exactly what needs to happen!”

I disagree - it’s the broken window fallacy. Each house that’s destroyed means thousands of hours of work that is wasted. The only case where I would agree is where it would take more work to rehab a home than to destroy and rebuild (it happens, but it’s rare).

Falling prices is a good thing, remember. The more unsold inventory, the farther prices fall.

Comment by Jim A.
2009-01-14 08:51:43

Really in Detroit the choice is between abandoned and empty or bulldozed. The jobs left and the people followed. The houses remained. There’s no real reason to rehab houses that there is no demand for.

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Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2009-01-14 09:04:17

Really?

The reason there is no demand in Detroit is nobody in their right mind would pay the property taxes to live there.

Drop the property taxes, and watch how many people try and rehab those houses to live.

Again, broken window in action here.

 
Comment by hoz
2009-01-14 09:14:33

I suspect that you are correct. The best thing for Detroit would be to declare BK to get out of its pension obligations and then to revamp its tax structure lowering by 70%. It is almost a ghost town.

 
Comment by scdave
2009-01-14 09:36:19

Drop the property taxes, and watch how many people try and rehab those houses to live ??

And aren’t the property taxes based on the transfer value ?? If you sell them cheap then the taxes should be low. Unfortunately you probably don’t have the same protection that prop.#13 provides in California so as soon as you buy on the cheap you likely will get into a pissing match with the county assessor that will want to set a higher value…

 
Comment by scdave
2009-01-14 09:42:27

best thing for Detroit would be to declare BK to get out of its pension obligations ??

How about the best thing for the COUNTRY !

You want to VOMIT !! Check out the article in the San Jose Mercury News yesterday regarding the Fire & Police officers Salary, Pension and Benefit plan…I would post the link but I do not know how…Its really sickening…

 
Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2009-01-14 10:01:02

Even something like a 10-year property tax moratorium might do the trick although your plan is definitely the more long-term sustainable one.

Either way, what they want to do is more of the same without understanding why they are so effed in the first place.

Same with Maine, IIRC.

 
 
Comment by lavi d
2009-01-14 09:39:19

I disagree - it’s the broken window fallacy.

I’d say go ahead and knock ‘em down, if…

If they are in the Sonoran desert (Tucson-Phoenix) and they put the desert back the way they found it (saguaros, mesquites, palo verdes, washes, etc)

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Comment by cashedin05
2009-01-14 20:40:55

So I guess nobody moved any earth where you live. I suppose you reside in a natural cave like structure and do not disturb a single organism.

 
 
Comment by MrBubble
2009-01-14 12:41:06

And all that demolition will be recorded in GDP. What a joke.

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Comment by peter a
2009-01-14 08:38:05

I am for demoing as long as they put back the orange groves.
A orange grove in bloom is the best smelling thing.

 
 
 
Comment by Tim
2009-01-14 05:56:33

“In the city of Detroit, the median price for a home was halved in 2008, to just $7,500 from $15,000 in 2007.”

I thought that was a typo, but that is what it says.

Comment by exeter
2009-01-14 05:59:57

But it’s different in Detroit. It won’t happen anywhere else. /sarcasmoff

Comment by edward
2009-01-14 21:06:55

It is different in Detroit. But in a very bad way.

 
 
Comment by Blano
2009-01-14 06:00:44

You read it right. Not missing any zeros.

 
Comment by combotechie
2009-01-14 06:02:20

Jobs, it’s all about jobs and money flow. When the money flow stops you end up with a ghost town and one-dollar homes that go begging.

Comment by darrell_in_phx
2009-01-14 06:06:19

wages!

Comment by qaxbami
2009-01-14 06:57:59

How can jobs and wages improve when consumers, who account for 75% of the economy, are seeing their prime asset devalued, are shut off from credit, are afraid for their own jobs, and are afraid to buy?

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Comment by packman
2009-01-14 07:21:38

It’s all about CONFIDENCE!

(smirk)

 
Comment by milkcrate
2009-01-14 11:05:59

An economist I respect once told me that the measurement of consumer confidence is one of the best indicators of economic signals for the stock market, retail, etc. You gotta feel good to open your wallet or purse for non-essentials.
But, yeah, it would be delusional to think that confidence alone would save a city where the wheels have fallen off and the axles are broken.

 
Comment by packman
2009-01-14 12:25:16

Confidence and economics is kind of like Advil and health. Yeah it makes you feel good for a while if you take it, or you may retain a headache if you don’t, but it doesn’t do a d*** thing one way or another in terms of your actual health.

There is indeed an (obvious) correlation of confidence and the stock market - but that’s short-term only.

 
 
 
 
Comment by SDGreg
2009-01-14 06:57:27

“In the city of Detroit, the median price for a home was halved in 2008, to just $7,500 from $15,000 in 2007.”

I haven’t spent that little in rent for a year in more than 15 years. I could buy two houses in Detroit for what I spend on rent in a year now. Of course, I’d be in Detroit then…

Comment by Tim
2009-01-14 07:20:01

I’m sure someone will correct me if I am wrong, but I think the debt service on 7.5k works out to less than $70 a month including tax escrow and that’s 100% financed.

Comment by Hwy50ina49Dodge
2009-01-14 07:34:14

I would think that it’s kinda tough to shovel your sidewalk in a flack jacket. ;-)

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Comment by scdave
2009-01-14 09:51:58

:)

 
 
Comment by nhz
2009-01-14 07:52:21

I read a story in a local Dutch paper how a US bank spent $10.000 to sell a Detroit home for $1, and even that proved to be difficult.

I guess there must be some hidden cost to owning a Detroit home like state taxes, high risk of demolition (not really an issue at $1 …), maybe all kinds of rules about mandatory home improvement and such?

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Comment by Skip
2009-01-14 09:24:31

If someone moves in and sets up a meth lab you are responsible for the cleanup which can run into a lot of money.

 
Comment by Blano
2009-01-14 09:40:37

“I guess there must be some hidden cost to owning a Detroit home like state taxes, high risk of demolition (not really an issue at $1 …), maybe all kinds of rules about mandatory home improvement and such?”

These are some true war zone areas of town. Areas that may never recover, in a city that continues to go downhill.

In these areas, the “hidden cost” could well be your life.

 
Comment by Carlos Cisco
2009-01-14 19:29:13

Just Googlearth Cleveland and fly over the east side of the city. You will see vast tracts of near homeless blocks of residential areas that 40 years ago were vital, working neighborhoods. No more. The population left with the manufacturing. They cleaned up the burning cuyahoga river ( wasnt the river that caught fire but rather a wooden trestle bridge used to ferry hot pig iron) at the expens of shutting down 90+ percent of the manufacturing that supported the neighborhoods. Its just a matter of time until de-industrialized cities all over this country share the same fate. We’re used to it here in Ohio. We can smell the fear in places like California, New York, Nevada. Many states made sport of The Rust Belt. Now I believe a vast swath of overbuilding that supported states with little else might soon be dubbed The Black Mold Belt. Millions of homes will never be lived in either by owners or renters. This new economy will never support 500K single family dwellings.

 
 
Comment by Boston Bruce
2009-01-14 10:38:06

My wife and I went to Detroit for our vacation last year. (No, I’m not kidding.) It’s really quite a place. I spent my elementary school years in Dearborn and Rosedale Park. Both old neighborhoods looked pretty good. The Motown Museum is a hoot. We also did the Henry Ford Museum, Greenfield Village, and a waterfront concert next to the Renaissance Center. If you’re used to the ethnic neighborhoods of Boston, Philly and NYC, Detroit’s Greektown is comically disappointing. It’s all of one block long. The African American History Museum is superb.

Most of Detroit itself, however, looks a bit like 1945 Germany after an Allied bombardment — flattened blocks with maybe one house standing — mile after mile. The only thing missing is the smoke. The place is a wasteland. Grosse Pointe is all mansions, but one block over the city line and it’s back to the Third World. Kind of a surreal place.

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Comment by tgun
2009-01-14 11:45:33

Went to grade school there myself… St. Sebastian in Dearborn and St. Norberts in Inkster. My family lived there until my father, who worked for Ford Motor Company as a manager, saw the writing on the wall in ‘73′ and transitioned to a new career at 3M in St. Paul MN.

Quite a transition moving from Inkster MI to Elk River MN (my parents bought a place with 4 acres)…

Have visited Detroit occasionally as my grandparents still lived there (all deceased now), the 80s were also particularly bad for Detroit. However, in the 90s I thought the city and burbs looked remarkably better.

Yes, loved to go to Greenfield Village, Henry Ford Museum, Boblo Island, Point Pelee (Canada) beach…

 
Comment by Not Mssing It
2009-01-14 12:23:26

Googlemap and set it to street view. It is unbelievable. Has to be where they filmed the movie Chuckie.

 
Comment by GS fixer
2009-01-14 14:28:01

………the exotic entertainment clubs in Windsor, Ontario…..or so I’ve heard…….

 
 
 
Comment by Jim A.
2009-01-14 08:54:18

So you can buy a house with the money from your car title loan. Now THAT’S a switch.

Comment by Carl Morris
2009-01-14 09:55:05

…and cars always go up. I could see this leading to us working off a whole new paradigm.

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Comment by milkcrate
2009-01-14 11:08:42

Maybe just visit the plasma center for the funds. :)

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Comment by bananarepublic
2009-01-14 09:52:53

Those places are worth less than zero. Impossible to maintain, rent. All you can do is pay taxes with them, and respond to police calls when the place is set on fire.

Worth less than nothing.

 
Comment by Don't Know Nothin About Buyin No House
2009-01-14 10:17:46

For us older bloggers, Detroit will never be a total loss.

Top 10 Motown tracks

I Heard It Through The Grapevine: Marvin Gaye.
Written by Norman Whitfield and Barrett Strong, this song was first given to Smokey Robinson and The Miracles to record, but it was the 1968 version by former Motown session drummer Marvin Gaye that really shone.

You Keep Me Hangin’ On: The Supremes. Unlike many of the label’s quickly recorded hits, this bittersweet tale of love gone wrong took around nine takes to perfect and marked the beginning of Diana Ross’s prominence.

Uptight (Everything’s Alright): Stevie Wonder.
Until this song’s release in May 1966, “Little Stevie Wonder” was known as nothing more than a Ray Charles imitator and in danger of being dropped by the label. However, Uptight went straight to number two in the American charts and Wonder’s transformation began.

Nowhere To Run: Martha and the Vandellas.
Featuring the gritty vocal and hard-edged brass sound that set the band apart from their peers, this is about as thrilling as Motown’s output gets.

This Old Heart Of Mine (Is Weak For You): The Isley Brothers. The Isleys’ 1966 take on the classic love song was their only hit for Motown during their brief time with the label, yet remains popular today thanks to its association with the Northern Soul scene of the late ’70s.

What’s Going On: Marvin Gaye. Marvin Gaye fell into a deep depression and contemplated giving up music after the death of his singing partner, Tammi Terrell, in 1970. He didn’t and What’s Going On, which became the label’s fastest-selling single, ushered in a new phase
for soul music.

Reach Out I’ll Be There: The Four Tops. With a pulsating bassline, glorious backing harmonies and part-sung, part-screamed vocal from Levi Stubbs, it’s one of Motown’s most dramatic songs.

Tears Of A Clown: Smokey Robinson and The Miracles. Although it was first released in 1967, this song, written by Smokey, Stevie Wonder and Hank Cosby, made the charts in 1970 and hit number one on both sides of the Atlantic.

Ain’t Too Proud To Beg: The Temptations. When The Temptations 1965 single Get Ready flopped, it was time for a rethink. Thanks to its James Brown-esque horn section and blues-inspired vocal from David Ruffin, the song was exactly what they needed.

He Was Really Sayin’ Somethin’: The Velvelettes. This classic wasn’t a hit when it was released in late 1964, but the song about the lies men tell when trying to woo women, has stood the test of time.

Comment by potential buyer
2009-01-14 11:30:54

Nah, ‘Just my Imagination’ and “My Girl”.
‘Sexual Healing’ and just about anything sung by M. Gaye!

 
 
Comment by Pondering the Mess
2009-01-14 10:34:06

Could be the complete lack of jobs and the crumbling infrastructure, unraveling society, etc. Good thing that can’t happen anyway else! *rolls eyes*

 
 
Comment by hunkydory
2009-01-14 06:03:13

The average UAW wage is 27 dollars an hour, or around 55k a year. Bit of a disconnect, no?

Comment by combotechie
2009-01-14 06:04:45

Don’t forget to add in the legacy costs.

 
Comment by exeter
2009-01-14 06:16:47

And the average non-UAW plant worker is $26. Example: Toyotas plant in Tennessee.

Comment by ET-Chicago
2009-01-14 07:48:57

That’s the cost or the wage in a non-UAW plant?

Don’t non-UAW plants have much lower base wages on average?

Comment by Al
2009-01-14 09:06:21

It’s not the wages, it’s everything else.

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Comment by ET-Chicago
2009-01-14 09:44:47

I don’t disagree with you, Al, I was just looking for a little clarification.

 
Comment by Jon
2009-01-14 11:01:11

“It’s not the wages, it’s everything else.”

It’s really 2 major, major problems:

1. Debt. Big 3 borrowed tons for capital equipment necessary to produce 16 million cars a year. They have to make 16 million to repay the debt. They can only sell 11 million. Ouch!

2. They never adequately funded the pension obligations they agreed to. Now they have to pay a million retirees pension & health benefits on ever smaller market share. Ouch redux!

Toyota can pay competitive wages & without the debt & benefit obligations will continue to feast on the Big 3’s market share.

 
Comment by Al
2009-01-14 13:08:25

I suppose I should add that the non-unionized plants have been offering fairly competitive wages to keep the unions out. They save by not offering as many benefits.

 
Comment by Kirisdad
2009-01-14 13:32:49

I think the disconnect Hunky is refering to is; If wages are over 50 thou/yr why are homes $10,000? the answer is; UAW workers live in the ritzier suburbs. Which begs the question; why do the big three need to pay those kind of salaries, if housing is so cheap? the answer is: to keep the present union leadership in office. Union leaders are just like politicians, which is why neither system works and both become corrupt.

 
Comment by Jon
2009-01-14 15:08:19

I’d rather see a world where working class folks make $55K and houses are 10K than working class folks make $20K and houses are $200K.

 
Comment by ecofeco
2009-01-14 15:30:23

Wrong on wages. Line workers at the foreign car plants in this country avg $12 hr. At best. (starting is approx. $9hr.)

You are not going to buy a house on $12hr. Or much else beyond survival.

 
Comment by not a gator
2009-01-14 17:52:50

You could buy a $30K house. In those parts of the South you could typically find a $40K or less house without too much trouble until the recent runup.

It’s all about wages:cost of living, and housing is a huge chunk of that.

 
 
 
 
Comment by edgewaterjohn
2009-01-14 06:20:54

$27/hr. is still more than large swaths of this country makes, so that figure is unlikely to generate much sympathy amongst the working poor. It’s dog eat dog, and the pols are subtly introducing class warfare langauge into the mix.

Comment by darrell_in_phx
2009-01-14 06:34:39

I’m ready for some age-group warefare.

Comment by qaxbami
2009-01-14 07:01:17

Right - and mix in some good old-fashioned class warfare while we’re at it. Power to the common man!

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Comment by SanFranciscoBayAreaGal
2009-01-14 13:00:58

Yup, keep everyone at each other throats so we don’t look at what is really going on.

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Comment by ecofeco
2009-01-14 15:33:30

We have a winner.

 
 
 
Comment by jeff saturday
2009-01-14 07:45:32

Just an observation, most people I know that would tend to vote Democrat drive Honda,Toytota ect… and most people I know that would vote Republican drive or drove Ford or Chevy trucks or an suv. I am seeing a major shift including myself looking to buy Honda, Toyota ect… from one side but not the other. Ford dealer on North Lake in Palm Beach Gardens Fl. new cars, trucks crossovers lined up forever with no, and I mean no traffic. The Chevy dealer across the street gone. The Toyota dealer that I have been to twice always has traffic and customers sitting at desks buying cars. I don`t know if it`s the news of the job bank or the rescue money, but I know three people who would never buy anything but Ford or Chevy buy Japanese. Our first looks like it`s going to be an 09 Toyota Camry SE with a 6 cyl engine, nice car. Anyway my little snapshot of the world doesn`t look good for the Big 3, the UAW or house prices in Detroit.

Comment by VaBeyatch in Virginia Beach
2009-01-14 08:35:37

It would be mean, but I would have rather seen the bailout go to form 3 new US automakers. Get some new blood going. Get good engineering talent, good design talent. Spawn new companies, get some psychologists to help them get cult status (see Apple & Nike).

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Comment by Kirisdad
2009-01-14 13:37:55

That’s how to sell today, make it the cool/hip thing to have. Buick is the cult brand in china, right now.

 
Comment by not a gator
2009-01-14 17:55:39

GM has plenty of good engineering talent. Unfortunately, they have, like, seven layers of middle management dedicated to crushing every innovation that comes out of R&D…

GM is too big to take risks (except credit risks–HA HA!). Get too bumbly and the nimbler guy will eat your lunch.

 
 
Comment by SFC
2009-01-14 09:37:57

The Camry is a nice car. To say that Toyota sales are much better than the big 3 right now is incorrect. I know for a fact that Toyota sales in the Southeast are way, way down. They have 1000’s of cars they cannot get out of ports and warehouses, as the dealer’s lots are full. You ought to be able to get a really good deal.

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Comment by SFC
2009-01-14 09:40:10

I know because there was an article on this in the New York Times a few weeks ago.

 
Comment by scdave
2009-01-14 10:01:25

You ought to be able to get a really good deal ??

Define “really good”…I just offered to purchase a new 2008 Jeep..I offered 20% off list, all cash…They turned me down..Hell, as soon as I drive the dam car off the lot it will fall in value by 40%…

 
Comment by jeff saturday
2009-01-14 11:31:04

I wasn`t trying to say the Toyota dealer was booming, but they did have customers, and each time there were people sitting at salesman’s desks buying vehicles. The Ford dealer with a much bigger lot and much more inventory looks completely dead. As far as a good deal, $500.00 over invoice.

 
Comment by SFC
2009-01-14 12:24:19

Well, I was talking about Toyotas not Jeeps. I think that some of the rebates require you to finance with Chrysler, so paying cash actually hurts you. You can always take it, then pay it off right away.
There are two dealers on Ebay, one in Georgia and one in South Carolina, that appear to be discounting the heck out of new Jeeps. For example a new loaded Commander at $13,000 off sticker.

 
Comment by Namehasbeenchangedtoprotectdainnocent
2009-01-14 13:24:14

And what is that brand new Chrysler/Jeep going to be worth when the plug is finally pulled on this zombie company? Let’s see; no warranty and no dealer support. That’s always good for resale value.

 
Comment by not a gator
2009-01-14 17:57:21

Yeah, but that’s because Consumer Reports reported last month that the Jeep Commander got one of the worst customer satisfaction ratings of all Jeeps and all cars!

And the gas mileage is a joke!

 
Comment by jrm1493
2009-01-14 20:18:20

In my experience new car warranties are just about worthless anyway, the cars just aren’t likely to break during the warranty period. I’m waiting to strike when GM or Chrysler declares bankruptcy - get a new truck for 1/2 price.

The last 2 new cars I’ve purchased have required a single repair during the first 100,000 miles, of a $38 part (Ford). The other had zero failures in the first 100,000 miles (GM). Both needed a set of tires in there but that’s not a warranty item - neither even needed brake pads (more driving style I guess). The GM was recalled once but they took care of it in a day and gave us a rental. I did have a friend with a 2007 (non-big 3) vehicle that had major transmission issues so I guess it happens (they ended up selling it because they were tired of driving a loaner half the time).

 
 
 
 
Comment by skroodle
2009-01-14 07:14:23

Thats only for worker that were on payroll 2 years ago. The new wage is $12/hour. Yes, the UAW sold out the new/younger employees. I think the average age is 50 at GM plants.

At $12/hr, I think the houses in Detroit are priced about right.

Comment by Hwy50ina49Dodge
2009-01-14 07:38:04

“…At $12/hr” …Quality must job #1… not to mention morale…cue to robot welder wearing “happy face” hard-hat. :-)

Comment by nycjoe
2009-01-14 08:25:24

$12 an hour is the new union wage? That is scary, not that some working folks are actually making $27 an hour instead of living in a shantytown, which is where all such rabble belong, according to Darwin. So, um, what would be the hourly rate for management? A multiple of how many times?

Imagine all the people
making 55K
It’s easy if you try …

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Comment by MrBubble
2009-01-14 12:48:10

Just to clarify and not a flame: Darwin had nothing to do with social “darwinism”.

MrBubble

 
Comment by nycjoe
2009-01-15 01:55:56

S’alright. Wasn’t strictly referring to the improvised social version of the doctrine. Just making a comment on the rise and fall of the species, in a general way. With maybe some sarcasm engaged.

 
 
Comment by MIke in Carlsbad
2009-01-14 11:20:58

There was a photo of a guy who bought a Mustang in the 90’s and it had an emblem on the side that read “Quality if Job #1″, the emblem was put on upside down.

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Comment by Tim
2009-01-14 06:03:59

“Analysts are fearful that banks’ credit problems, which up until now had been largely concentrated in mortgages, are spreading to other portfolios, like credit cards and auto loans, setting up 2009 to be another year of multibillion dollar losses.”

One more to file under who could have seen this coming. You mean to tell me that debt defaults are not contained? And that debt, is debt, is debt?

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Stock-futures-point-lower-apf-14056612.html

Comment by edgewaterjohn
2009-01-14 07:18:52

Prior to the bust most everyone thought that the mortgage would be last obligation the FBs would walk away from.

Now that that myth has been debunked - how can they even pause to think that the FBs won’t walk on everything else?

They’ll use cash, and resort to all manner of programs to rehabilitate their credit. After all, they want to buy new stuff, and the PTB wants them to buy new stuff, and the Chinese want them to buy new stuff.

Comment by nhz
2009-01-14 07:54:03

just wonder how bad credit could ever be a real problem with the new Obama administration? I’m sure they will fix that, somehow, in order to keep the ‘economy’ going.

Comment by bink
2009-01-14 09:41:13

No-fee govt. issued credit cards for all!

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Comment by Sammy Schadenfreude
2009-01-14 06:27:48

Hedge-Funders Are Bullish on Gold, Guns, Inflatable Lifeboats

http://nymag.com/news/features/all-new/53372/

Not exactly bullish for real estate.

Comment by packman
2009-01-14 07:29:18

I call major BS on the “The system really was about six hours from failing.”. Sorry - maybe his little corner of the banking system was, which would be fine with me. The power companies weren’t going to turn off power in 6 hours, and New Jersey wasn’t suddenly going to flood in 6 hours.

Comment by packman
2009-01-14 07:30:22

Meant to add - it’s all scare tactics to extract money from the clueless. And as of today they’re doing it again.

Comment by qaxbami
2009-01-14 09:26:56

How much money do the clueless have? You can’t get blood out of a stone.

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Comment by packman
2009-01-14 09:50:08

It doesn’t matter how much money people have because most of it isn’t extracted. It is created out of thin air by the FedRes.

 
 
Comment by CA renter
2009-01-15 03:41:11

Exactly right, packman.

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Comment by ET-Chicago
2009-01-14 07:51:12

Well, if I can’t trust a hedge fund to prognosticate, who can I trust?

(Ugh.)

 
 
Comment by mrktMaven
2009-01-14 06:35:14

Nortel files bankruptcy. From globeandmail:

Former technology titan Nortel Networks Corp. is expected to file for bankruptcy protection as early as today, sources say, a move that will likely see what was once Canada’s great corporate success story broken up and sold to foreign rivals.

Comment by packman
2009-01-14 07:26:33

Yeah I mentioned that yesterday actually. This is a company that had 100k+ employees 8 years ago during the tech boom.

Keep in mind this important fact - Nortel built, and still provides support for, about 40% of all the telephone switches in use in the U.S.A.

This may be a big as-yet-untold story with respect to infrastructure. The U.S. may be asked indirectly to bail out a Canadian company for this reason. Pure conjecture on my part though.

Comment by Rancher
2009-01-14 08:31:36

Nortel is out dated, their equipment is slow.

 
Comment by VaBeyatch in Virginia Beach
2009-01-14 08:40:29

Are there really that mane DMS switches out there? I thought most of the Bells were rocking Lucent ESS systems. Then you have those other oddballs. Did Nortel get any of the Cellular world? I thought the MTSOs ran Ericsson and such. With FIOS and VIOP, I thought the Bell switches were getting a forklift upgrade? Note - I’m not a telco employee, just a hacker geek that used to be interested in phones. If I had a house with a large garage, I’d probably try to score a ESS-5A for fun (Used to run a Merlin Legend in the house friends and myself rented).

Comment by packman
2009-01-14 09:15:48

Most of the “core” of the Bells were using 5ESS, but many providers switched over time and started putting in DMS. I worked for Nortel for a period in the late 80’s when the move to digital was going gangbusters, and at the time probably 50% were DMS.

Funny you should mention FiOS - I worked on that equipment as well, up until recently. FiOS is only the access portion - the core phone switch is still DMS/5ESS/GTD5/EWSD. They’re attempting to change away from the old “big iron” digital switches to softswitches, and FiOS enables that, but only about 0.001% are actually using softswitches as yet - it’s still in it’s infancy deployment-wise until all the problems (mostly operational) are worked out. In the meantime the providers pay *hefty* maintenance fees to Nortel/Lucent/etc. for the installed switches.

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Comment by VaBeyatch in Virginia Beach
2009-01-14 11:38:35

Ah interesting! I thought with FiOS they were finally starting to upgrade the ESS switches. VOIP… bringing all the unreliability of the internets to a telephone near you! Fiber to the premises and wireless to the people is how I see the future.

 
 
 
Comment by peter a
2009-01-14 08:50:05

Cisco is making a big dent in the PBX world with voice over IP. Alcatel is the European big PBX provider doing the same thing. VOIP is the way phone systems are going .

Comment by SFC
2009-01-14 09:43:34

Don’t forget Avaya, they have a big chunk of this as well.

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Comment by Jon
2009-01-14 11:09:03

Or you could just run Asterisk on Linux and pocket the money…

 
Comment by VaBeyatch in Virginia Beach
2009-01-14 11:42:01

We run Asterisk on Linux. It’s okay, but it has it’s shortcomings. Avaya is Lucent was AT&T. I’m not sure who handles the huge stuff (ESS) (Is it still Lucent or is that stuff branded Avaya now?). I would imagine VOIP is putting a huge dent in the business phone system market. So many players, so many cheap players. 16 Polycom POE VOIP sets cost us less than a single 8 port line card would for the older hardware PBX units. I still have love for the hardware though. Big beautiful purpose built systems that ran 20 years without problems, versus modern PCs with motherboards failing because the capacitors were a product of trojaned corporate espionage.

 
 
 
Comment by DennisN
2009-01-14 13:02:30

It looks like the 2012 Olympics committee is really worried about losing one of their biggest corporate sponsors in Nortel.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/London-2012-monitoring-Nortel-apf-14061200.html

“Officials are hopeful that Nortel can continue supporting the London Olympics in its existing capacity either by restructuring under Chapter 11 protection or by finding a buyer.”

Yeah right…..

 
 
Comment by Al
2009-01-14 09:12:48

I think I’ll take my share certificate, frame it and hang it in my office. A good conversation starter, no?

Comment by Kim
2009-01-14 11:50:24

I’ve seen more than one steakhouse out west with old mining stock certificates hanging on the walls. So on bright side… someone will open up a retro-tech cafe someday and you can sell it to them to hang on the walls. HBBers can dine there and ask for “Al’s table”, which will be saved exclusively for HBB use.

(kidding!)

 
 
 
Comment by mrktMaven
2009-01-14 06:37:58

Bloomberg: Retail sales fall 2.7, ex autos 3.1

Retail sales were projected to fall 1.2 percent after an originally reported 1.8 percent drop the prior month, according to the median estimate of 78 economists in a Bloomberg News survey. Forecasts ranged from declines of 3.5 percent to 0.3 percent.

Sales fell 0.1 percent for all of 2008 compared with the prior year, the first decrease on record. November’s decline was revised to 2.1 percent from a previously estimated fall of 1.8 percent.

Comment by darrell_in_phx
2009-01-14 06:40:53

Those were nominal. Subtract deflation and the numbers aren’t as bad. Bad??? Yes, but not THAT bad.

Comment by mrktMaven
2009-01-14 07:32:10

CR is reporting YOY was awful: nominal was down 10.2 pct and real 11.3 pct. It takes a while for the media to catch on to YOY stuff.

 
 
Comment by nhz
2009-01-14 07:30:17

and as usual on such ‘good’ news, the dollar surges and the euro and gold plunge. The total disconnect of finance and real economy continues …

 
Comment by ann gogh
2009-01-14 08:06:19

How ’bout those california re defaults reported today?
Of course I don’t have a link because I saw it on Cnbc.

Comment by Professor Bear
2009-01-14 21:09:26

BusinessWeek
Over one Million People Lost their Home in 2008
Posted by: Chris Palmeri on January 14

Foreclosures.com came out with its latest numbers today, a 63 percent rise in foreclosures for 2008, with a total of about 1 million throughout the year. The foreclosure process was begun on 2 million during 2008. Of those, 1.6 million were in the southern and western states as you can see by the chart above.

Alexis McGee, president of Foreclosures.com, believes the worst is behind the housing market. She’s says housing affordability is better than it’s been since 1994, when a mortgage on a median-price home equaled 18 percent of the median income.

BS ALERT!!!!

Dropping interest rates on mortgages have improved this even more. Plummenting housing construction and a growing US population ultimately mean an increased demand for housing. Unemployment, while rising sharply, is still below where it stood in the 1990-1991 recession and well below the highs of the early 1980s.

“Don’t expect another tidal wave of foreclosures this year, either, just because more adjustable rate mortgages are due to reset,” McGee says. “Current mortgage rates are at 30 year lows and dropping. Those who qualify will be able to refinance and enjoy lower monthly payments, not higher ones. Those that can’t will end up either selling their homes pre-foreclosure or losing them to foreclosure. But I am anticipating our market can absorb this inventory.”

CLICK!

 
 
 
Comment by Tim
2009-01-14 07:14:46

I was “asked” to move from the securitization and derivatives group to tax-exempt tax group. It’s better than losing my job, but I’m getting too old for so much change. I hope I enjoy it as much.

Comment by hoz
2009-01-14 07:34:12

Change is good. It keeps me from being just another old mope. Good luck!

Comment by Tim
2009-01-14 07:44:19

Thanks Hoz. Change is always hard, but so far in my career it has always worked out for the best.

 
 
Comment by cougar91
2009-01-14 07:49:30

Man you know how many finance types would *KILL* you for that position right now? I know a ton myself, former colleagues who got chopped the last year and still jobless.

Comment by Tim
2009-01-14 07:59:47

Yes, I know. Many of my Wall Street contacts don’t even answer the phone anymore. They are either fired, depressed or spending their time looking to jump ship. I always expected all the excess created in the last 5 years to go. It is sad, and less expected, to see those I worked with before the bubble also on the chopping block. My views on the industry and debt caused me to be thought of as a pessimist the last 5 years. Turns out I was, in fact, an optimist all along.

Comment by ann gogh
2009-01-14 08:11:06

Yeah tim. Last year I had mini panic attacks frequently and my family kept telling me to stop fretting. It was weird to watch the very thing I was afraid of become non stop news.

Who is this new socialist cabinet member?
Do I have to wear blue pajamas now?
I look awful in baggy clothing.

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Comment by edgewaterjohn
2009-01-14 08:21:30

Pessimist (realist) in good times, optimist (realist) in tough times. Probabaly not much of a formula for making lotsa friends, but it’ll get ya through.

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Comment by drumminj
2009-01-14 09:18:55

That’s the nice thing about this blog. There are a lot of “realists” here, even though most would see us as pessimists. Though, in some cases it probably would be better to turn out to be a pessimist, than have the expected negative outcomes come to fruition…

 
Comment by Jim A.
2009-01-14 10:47:17

And even I feel like a sunny, happy optimist after spending some time on a blog with the Gold, Guns, and Greater Depression crowd.

 
 
 
 
Comment by polly
2009-01-14 12:29:57

So, what are you going to be doing? Tax exempt bonds? Debt financed income isues? Other stuff? You would be surprised how much financial stuff is involved with exempts.

Comment by Tim
2009-01-14 17:03:47

I will be working mainly with tax-exempt munis: drafting bond counsel opinions, tax regulatory agreements, and tax compliance certificates, deal structuring, etc. It is in conjunction with another partner resigning.

Comment by CA renter
2009-01-15 03:50:21

Sure glad somebody is willing to do that sort of work! ;)

Best of luck to you, Tim. Just being offered another position is a compliment, IMHO.

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Comment by ahansen
2009-01-14 15:38:40

Something tells me tax-exempt is going to be where all the action is in coming years….

You may have lucked in, Tim! Please keep us posted?

Comment by Tim
2009-01-14 17:06:32

Obama probably will not hurt the workload.

 
 
 
Comment by mrktMaven
2009-01-14 07:15:01

The market looked like it was going to turn yesterday. We straddled the downtrend line throughout the day and closed right on it. It closed at 871.79. As a result of today’s retail sales number, however, it looks like we’ll bounce away from that line. It’s going to be an interesting day b/c 850 to 865 is support.

Comment by vozworth
2009-01-14 07:23:14

815 downside target is going to 750.

this is the double bottom setting up to test the lows….hold on to your hats kids.

Im long fear and short courage.

Comment by mrktMaven
2009-01-14 07:57:41

Right on the cusp of another leg down, target 815. Will it hold at 850? Is this a shoulder or cliff edge?

Comment by mrktMaven
2009-01-14 08:41:08

Breach! — 841.

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Comment by mrktMaven
2009-01-14 08:46:07

838

 
Comment by mrktMaven
2009-01-14 09:09:34

Support at 840 or more mad selling later in the afternoon? London down 6 pct. Germany and France down 5 pct. Clearly, the tone is negative.

 
Comment by mrktMaven
2009-01-14 10:42:40

We’re getting support around 842. 842 is a 50 pct fib retracement from 741 to 943. Will 842 last into the close?

 
Comment by Kim
2009-01-14 11:59:54

“Will 842 last into the close?”

I say no. They will run it down further into the close (last hour).

 
 
 
 
Comment by Blue Skye
2009-01-14 11:01:56

Gold also looks to be sliding over the edge of the cliff. If it does, it will be the fourth leg down.

 
 
Comment by hoz
2009-01-14 07:29:45

China’s trade figures:

Exports were down 2.8% (exports to US down 4.1%)
Imports down 21.3%

China’s surplus $39B 1st time it did not hit a new record. 40.2B would be record and for the last 6 months of 2008 China’s surplus is only $197B, but who is counting.

China’s exports are doing fine, but the consumption side of the ledger is a nightmare for us and Europe. To sustain the exports it is probable that China will continue to buy sovereign debt from the US and Europe.

Comment by vozworth
2009-01-14 08:09:48

This is the same situation with investors in US Treasuries. “Every now and then you grab the bull by the tail and face the situation.” They all will flee to the exit at the same time. It will not be pretty.

—-

Panic is a terrible thing to waste. Looking forward to the Biege Book? I think it may be a little in the grey area. How grey?

CHARCOAL.

Comment by hoz
2009-01-14 09:09:37

I like barbecues. Charcoal fire roast the wienies

But nothing like a big bonfire. As we grab the tail and face the a’hole of this mess, we must ask ourselves is the smell worth it. Something’s rotten in Denmark (and the rest of the Benelux countries). Maybe Greece, maybe Italy to large to save. Bye, bye Baltics.

Bye Bye Baltics
Im gonna miss you so
Bye Bye Baltics
Why’d you borrow?

No more sunshine
It’s followed you away
I’ll cry Baltics
till you’re home to stay

I’ll miss the way you smile
As though it’s just for me
And each and every night
I’ll write you faithfully
(Bye Bye Baltics)

huh, Bye bye Baltics
It’s awful hard to beg
Bye bye Baltics
shoulda read the regs

We love you Europe
O Yes we do
We love you Europe
And we’ll be true

I’ll miss the way you smile
As though it’s just for me
And each and every night
I’ll write you faithfully

Bye bye Baltics
It’s awful hard to beg
Bye bye Baltics
Guess I’ll always care
Guess I’ll always care
Guess I’ll always care–
Guess I’ll always care!

Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2009-01-14 13:03:18

:-)

BTW, hoz, thanks for the explanation last week…

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Comment by Hwy50ina49Dodge
2009-01-14 07:51:43

Blingada, bangada…boom! ;-)

Tiffany cuts forecast, posts holiday-sales decline:

http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/Tiffany-cuts-forecast-posts-21/story.aspx?guid={54971975-E469-4544-AB77-81731C1499E0}

Starmucks coffee still $9.99 per bag at Stater Bros…

BWAAAAAHAHHAHAHHAHHHA!!!!!!

Comment by whino
2009-01-14 08:41:25

“Tiffany cuts forecast, posts holiday-sales decline”

Add gottschalks bankruptcy into the mix and a pattern starts to emerge. Lol!!!!!!

Comment by potential buyer
2009-01-14 12:16:41

Anyone see the article in WSJ when Tiffany’s was upset because the hoi polloi were buying their silver bracelets (retail around $195, I do believe). They only wanted to cater to the very wealthy, so they raised their prices.

See how that worked out…..snort!

Comment by combotechie
2009-01-14 17:52:33

Long term I think it was a good move on Tiffany’s part. Their name is their greatest asset and nobody outside of Tiffany can degrade it.

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Comment by Milkcrate
2009-01-14 18:01:30

Some might laugh at bad car accident with limbs in the median. I would not.

 
 
Comment by Darrell_in_PHX
2009-01-14 09:47:56

ShaneCo, that FLOODED the radio with commercials both here and in CO when I lived there, bankrupt. I guess my friend in the diamond business (their tag line) isn’t anymore.

 
 
Comment by Hwy50ina49Dodge
2009-01-14 08:03:11

Hey now… leave Donald “Pucker-lips” sTrump alone, he’s an American genius! ;-)

“These real estate tycoons imported the global financial crisis to Israel,” said Gill Beeri, managing director of Ramat Gan, Israel-based Ayalon Financial Solutions Ltd. Its Smadar fund lost 14.1 percent in the first 11 months of last year. “There’s increased concern that these companies may default.”

Billionaires Burn Israeli Savers on New York, U.K. Land Deals:

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601109&sid=aknybsZJKX2w&refer=home

 
Comment by hoz
2009-01-14 08:06:13

LONDON — Swiss bank Union Bancaire Privée kept hundreds of millions of dollars of its wealthy clients’ money in Bernard Madoff’s alleged Ponzi scheme despite warnings from its own research team, according to people familiar with the matter.

While others in the investment community had questioned Mr. Madoff’s strategy and chosen to stay away, the instance offers a sign that red flags were raised within one of the large institutions that actually invested with Mr. Madoff.

…”
WSJ

Some firms did not perform due diligence, those that did ignored the analysis. UBP screwed with its customers. Like all F’k ups, it deserves to go under.

Comment by nhz
2009-01-14 10:00:12

I read yesterday that Banco Santander - who’s clients lost about 2 billion to Madoff - only lost a couple million themselves. This sounds suspicious, maybe they did perform some diligence and took action, but not for the customers?

 
 
Comment by mrktMaven
2009-01-14 08:07:34

Next?

Jan. 14 (Bloomberg) — Greece had its sovereign credit rating lowered one step by Standard & Poor’s, which cited the country’s weakening finances.

The rating was cut to A- with a “stable” outlook, S&P said today in a statement from London. Greek stocks and bonds fell after the announcement.

Comment by nhz
2009-01-14 10:22:38

next Italy I guess, after that it gets interesting.

of course they forgot to downgrade the US first, but nobody cares about that.

Comment by not a gator
2009-01-14 18:07:43

Don’t forget Ireland and Spain.

US “don’t worry, it’s contained” :)

fratboys on wall street … cops responding to noise complaint arrive at frat house one night, discover drunk underage girls “duuuude, I mean ossifer … we’ve go’ i’ … I mean, dude, we have i’ totally Under Control.”

 
 
 
Comment by mina
2009-01-14 08:13:57

as someone here on the board pointed out a few months ago, here is a little something for Mr. Schrenker who was apprehended today

remember kids it’s down the road not across the street
http://www.cuppatea.org/rememberkids.jpg

Comment by Olympiagal
2009-01-14 10:11:43

Link didn’t work for me.

 
Comment by Seattle Renter
2009-01-14 17:07:29

I think that was me a few months back when I put the HBB-fu on a sleazy mortgage broker I ran into at the gym

Here’s a link to the image I found by googling, I hae no affiliation with the host site though(never been there before):

http://ewh.buzznet.com/user/journal/228911/

And yeah, that guy sounds like a real piece of work allright.

 
 
Comment by hoz
2009-01-14 08:17:27

Exclusive analysis, Part 1: The staggering cost of new nuclear power

A new study puts the generation costs for power from new nuclear plants at from 25 to 30 cents per kilowatt-hour — triple current U.S. electricity rates!

This staggering price is far higher than the cost of a variety of carbon-free renewable power sources available today — and ten times the cost of energy efficiency (see “Is 450 ppm possible? Part 5: Old coal’s out, can’t wait for new nukes, so what do we do NOW?“)….

http://climateprogress.org/2009/01/05/study-cost-risks-new-nuclear-power-plants/

Solar et al are a lot less expensive than 25 cents /kwh. The link is to climate progress which analyzes the paper and gives a link to the pdf.

It is the first detailed study in 30 years of the cost in the US of a new nuclear reactor.

Comment by colomountains
2009-01-14 09:17:11

I am not sure about that, have you checked this website out? It is all doom and gloom about an upcoming world catastrophe, yet we are having a lot of very cold weather.

This is a group trying to increase your taxes and bring about cap-and-trade.

I strongly believe that the so-called “green” technologies is going to be the next bubble. I was talking to a senior engineer in the power industry and he states that “green” technologies cannot cover the peak power consumption in either the summer or winter months.

To provide cheap and reliable power, you need “nuclear” (that is right, he stated this) and “coal” power plants.

Solar and Wind cannot provide the amount of power that we need and we will continue to need.

Comment by aNYCdj
2009-01-14 09:38:18

colomountains

Even though they are highly educated they really are dumb for saying this without providing a possible solution

One of the ways which could solve this problem is we have to find a way to employ millions of people at 4 AM and not at 4 PM, to spread the electric load over the day , think about it……

—————————————————————–
I was talking to a senior engineer in the power industry and he states that “green” technologies cannot cover the peak power consumption in either the summer or winter months.

Comment by colomountains
2009-01-14 11:01:06

I have and some people are already doing that. The problem comes when you have kids and a lot of people do, then what?

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Comment by aNYCdj
2009-01-14 12:53:37

Choices Choices…then the parents work different shifts. We all will have to pay dearly for the luxury of working 9-5 in the future.

———————-
The problem comes when you have kids and a lot of people do, then what?

 
Comment by CA renter
2009-01-15 04:10:52

If you work 11:00 p.m. to 7:00 a.m., you can get the kids off to school, sleep while they’re in school, and get to spend the whole afternoon/evening with them.

You can also stagger shifts with the spouse and homeschool (like we do).

It works, and I agree 100% with nycdj on this. There is no reason to have everybody working/schooling during the exact same hours. It’s rather inefficient and increases pollution as people have to sit in bumper-to-bumper traffic everywhere they go. It also strains infrastructure.

 
 
 
Comment by nhz
2009-01-14 10:13:22

if solar and wind can do that in cold Germany, they should be able to do it easily in most of the US. However, people may have to adapt some of their habits to make things work out, e.g. make some changes to homes, air-condition use etc.

Most engineers in the power industry are NOT a reliable source for this kind of information, they have their own vested interests (or otherwise the company they get their info from has).

regarding ‘cheap’ nuclear: when authorities were planning to build a nuclear reactor in my area long ago, they promised that electricity meters would be removed from homes, because power would be so cheap that they could provide it for free. It’s now some 30 years later and my area has the highest power rates in the country, despite (?) the nuclear reactor.

Comment by colomountains
2009-01-14 10:50:32

Nhz,

This particular person is different, he believes that green power is good; at the same time he understands that green power will not provide all our energy needs. You need to have balance by using all available sources.

What do you do when there is no wind or sun? You still power no matter what.

I see a lot more promise in fuel cells at an industrial scale that can power millions of households and industry.

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Comment by Blue Skye
2009-01-14 11:09:27

Energy inputs > energy outputs = Green

Hydro has prooved effective. Many small towns used to have their own hydro plants, now just a hazard to canoes.

 
Comment by Jon
2009-01-14 11:24:40

Fuel Cells are not a power source. They play more the role of a battery. Hydrogen is not a fuel source. It’s an energy transmission mechanism.

Nuclear & green is the way to go. Westinghouse has an experimental nuke plant in South Africa that cannot melt down because they use uranium pellets wrapped in ceramics.

Force conservation, go nuke, use green where it makes sense, use coal where you can pump the CO2 into underground caverns. It can be done with leadership and minimal cost. Especially if we just shoot the chuckleheads on the far right & left.

 
Comment by Blue Skye
2009-01-14 12:04:43

I prefer to shoot chuckleheads right between the eyes, thank you.

 
Comment by nhz
2009-01-14 12:07:33

colomountains:

yes, you need balance and part of that is lifestyle changes. Most older home designs, certainly outside the US, are able to balance day/night energy use. Many types of energy use fluctuate over the day out of choice, not out of basic necessity.

Of course green energy production fluctuates as well and especially wind can be tricky. This IS a big issue of course; in my country there were proposals already 30 years ago for this, like building artificial islands with windmills in the ocean that are filled up with water when there is excess energy, and using the water at other times (like a hydro dam) to provide electricity. Due to low energy prices this was never realised.

New variations of this are being studied at the moment, one proposal is to raise the water level in our ‘IJsselmeer’ (a big - partly artificial - lake inside the country) a few meters and use this to drive turbines when the tide outside the lake is low. Smaller tidal energy generators are being tested at the moment (tidal energy always works, except maybe in extremely rough weather).

Other proposals are to store energy (e.g. as compressed air) in underground reservoirs left over from natural gas production etc. For hotter areas where the sun always shines I have seen proposals for floating solar energy islands, that send power to the mainland AND produce clean water and possibly some kind of biofuel at a later stage.

Maybe add coal with CO2 storage/conversion (we have such a plant under construction here, although still small). Fuel cells: maybe, but certainly not with current technology. There are many technological options available, we just need the commitment to really start using them instead of ‘cheap’ oil etc. (courtesy of energy wars etc.).

 
 
 
Comment by potential buyer
2009-01-14 12:19:22

The wouldn’t the solution be to devise something that would work on individual homes, factories, etc. and not on huge grids?

Comment by ecofeco
2009-01-14 16:06:12

The solution already exists. For the price of fully loaded SUV, you can power a 2000sqft home with all the modern conveniences in use today and being used as one normally would. (within reason, like don’t turn everything in the house on at once)

The system is a combination of wind, solar (passive and electric) and batteries. For less than 40K. Installed.

My next house WILL be self powered.

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Comment by nycjoe
2009-01-14 19:51:12

In that case, maybe we don’t NEED it. Well, unless we need nuclear waste MORE!

 
 
Comment by packman
2009-01-14 09:18:16

That’s what excessive government regulation will get you. In the case of nuke - really, really excessive.

Comment by Olympiagal
2009-01-14 10:17:25

‘In the case of nuke - really, really excessive.’

Yeah, ’cause fiddling around with that nuclear radiation stuff should be fun and easy for anyone who feels like it. It’s not like anything BAD could happen, were nuclear power plants carelessly or whimsically run.
Oh, wait…

Comment by Darrell_in_PHX
2009-01-14 10:46:00

Water slowed rectors use totally different design from soviet grpahite slowed reactors. We have a REMARKABLE safety record.

Should a nuke plant be built on the San Andraes Fault? Probably not. But, 10 years of study to prove what we already know???

Water slowed nuclear reactors are very, very safe.

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Comment by sleepless_near_seattle
2009-01-14 10:58:10

And what about the bad stuff left over?

 
Comment by Blue Skye
2009-01-14 11:57:46

Is that the type used at Three Mile Island?

 
Comment by nhz
2009-01-14 12:11:49

technically safe yes, but there still is lots of political risk (ask the Germans what happens during fuel transports) and of course the HUGE risk of waste disposal (IMHO there will NEVER be an acceptable solution for this). I shouldn’t need to explain these risks in a country with Homeland Security.

P.S.: in Netherlands nuclear waste is safely stored in a bunker that is 6 meters below sea level, just behind the North Sea dikes in an area that is 100% certain to be flooded when the dikes break (like they did in 1952). But authorities have more to worry about in that case probably, like underwater mortgages etc.

 
Comment by MIke in Carlsbad
2009-01-14 12:16:20

Why not pebble bed reactors, or other designs that are impossible to melt down (reaction stops natually).

Sure there is waste, better to contain it in a mountain than release it in the air for everyone to breathe.

 
Comment by Muir
2009-01-14 12:24:28

“And what about the bad stuff left over?”
Oh, I don’t know, maybe burry it near fault lines.
After all, what could possibly go wrong?
Though I’ll take reactors over “clean” coal or “renewable” ethanol by a factor of 2.

 
Comment by not a gator
2009-01-14 18:13:55

No, I will definitely take clean coal over “new-clear” power.

Though many do not realize that coal is radioactive as well!

The main fault to a modern coal plant (and I don’t mean those grandfathered polluting machines in Ohio–fie!) is the coal mine. Talk about your lousy working conditions. Though I doubt Uranium mining is a prettier picture.

 
 
Comment by packman
2009-01-14 12:33:39

The comparison of the number of people who have died providing fossil-fuel based power (think hundreds of thousands), and the environmental impact vs. nuclear isn’t even close.

It all comes down to people being scare of things they don’t understand - e.g. atoms splitting.

It also comes down to huge energy lobbies. Inexpensive nuclear could cause a lot of folks at XOM etc. to lose a lot of money.

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Comment by Darrell_in_PHX
2009-01-14 12:39:24

“Is that the type used at Three Mile Island?”

Yes… And what was the result? Oh yeah, the water slowed reactor shut itself down, with absolute minimal radition leakage.

2 million people exposed to about 1/6th the radiation you’d get from a chest xray.

“And what about the bad stuff left behind?”

Reprocessing.

People need to grow up and realize EVERYTHING is a risk. A windmill could fall over, and kill 1 person, and it would still be 1 person more than has died as a result of a water slowed nuclear reactor radiation leak.

How about the coal toxins building up in leach ponds used to scrup exhaust?

How about the risk of a damn collapsing and flooding down river communities?

How about the risk of toxins used in photo-voltaic manufacturing?

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Comment by BanteringBear
2009-01-14 13:38:22

“A windmill could fall over, and kill 1 person, and it would still be 1 person more than has died as a result of a water slowed nuclear reactor radiation leak.”

I’m not sure if that’s true. A friend in high school’s father worked on 3 mile island, and he was diagnosed with cancer. Not too long after the meltdown, he started to get sick. He developed a tumor in his eye, and had to have it removed. Ultimately, his whole body was riddled with cancer and he succumbed in the late 80’s.

 
Comment by mathguy
2009-01-14 15:30:10

so you’re saying he died after living a longer than average life despite being exposed to radiation from 3-mile?

 
Comment by Blue Skye
2009-01-14 15:40:35

Darrell,

The toxins from PV (solar cell) manufacture is a huge secret. It’s a semiconductor process, but isn’t watched like one IME, because we feel all green and fuzzy about it.

And don’t you worry about the siloxane gas escaping either!

 
Comment by not a gator
2009-01-14 18:16:06

Another mathguy who failed reading comprehension!

 
Comment by BanteringBear
2009-01-15 00:21:12

“so you’re saying he died after living a longer than average life despite being exposed to radiation from 3-mile?”

Sure, if the average life expectancy of a white male is 44.

 
 
 
 
Comment by Doghouse Riley
2009-01-14 09:58:22

As I’ve said here before, there will be no new energy development in America, whether it’s solar, wind, geothermal or those eeeeeeeeeevil nukes and coal, as long as any small group of whiners with a lawyer can tie it up in court, practically indefinitely.

Bush was never able to crack this nut, Obama will still less be able to since so much of his base is the tort bar, NIMBY “activists” and the save-the-endangered-weeds envirokooks.

 
Comment by nhz
2009-01-14 10:07:31

some recent EU studies put the cost of nuclear even higher. It all depends on which costs you factor into the equation. Often special costs like large scale security (e.g. for fuel transports), long term storage and waste disposal are not included in the calculations, or only at some ridiculously low proforma charge.

in Netherlands the owners of nuclear reactors are allowed to ‘pay for’ long term storage by starting a fund that will accumulate with some risk-free strategy at 14% per year over 50 years. After those 50 years they will have sufficient money to pay for a few hundred (not hundred thousand …) years of storage - that is, if inflation does not start to bite and runs up projected storage costs.

Now just imagine what happens when they can’t realise these 14% riskfree gains. The first fly in the ointment was that our largest nuclear power plant was banking with Icesave and lost 25 million, probably most of the ’starter capital’. But nobody is worried, they are in it for the long term you know …

Comment by colomountains
2009-01-14 10:54:35

That again will bring us back to coal, where coal provided power is about 7cents/kwh; which is very good if you ask me.

I don’t know what those costs are in the rest of the country, but when I lived in the SF bay area, I was paying a tiered strucutered starting at 11/kwh as the starting point and which I thought excessive in the late 1990’s.

I was very surprise to find out that power away from the coasts is very reasonable and cheap. That is my assumption in this matter.

Comment by DennisN
2009-01-14 12:39:29

Here in ID the non-summer rate is $.055783 per KWH.

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Comment by lavi d
2009-01-14 11:26:21

in Netherlands the owners of nuclear reactors are allowed to ‘pay for’ long term storage…

In the US, the power companies have been paying for long term storage (Yucca Mountain) since 1973.

 
 
 
Comment by ann gogh
2009-01-14 08:18:38

Annie get yer gun and pocket knife!

“Hunter said unnamed Obama officials have said bases such as Pendleton could be tapped to house detainees moved out of a shuttered Guantanamo.

Camp Pendleton officials referred questions about the proposal to Defense Secretary Robert Gates, whose spokeswoman Cheryl Irwin said that if Obama does order Guantanamo closed, military bases are not ruled out as possible relocation sites”

Comment by Darrell_in_PHX
2009-01-14 09:51:35

The problem with bringing them into the U.S. is that the laws governing them change significantly. I know this was a big campaign promise, but seriously, a BAD idea.

Comment by Doghouse Riley
2009-01-14 10:00:43

Hell, I’m almost ready to let them all get out on bail. Americans apparently only learn by example these days, and one example clearly was not enough.

Comment by potential buyer
2009-01-14 12:23:01

Well we certainly created new terrorists, even if they weren’t to begin with.

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Comment by Namehasbeenchangedtoprotectdainnocent
2009-01-14 13:13:49

I’m sure they were only a bunch of innocent, peace loving goat herders just chillin’ on Tora Bora. Wrong place at the wrong time and whatnot. Bleeding hearts of the world unite.

 
Comment by not a gator
2009-01-14 18:19:03

So try them in court!

 
 
 
Comment by DennisN
2009-01-14 12:41:47

Maybe the US military should adopt a “no prisoners” rule.

I always thought it was a mistate to take Saddam Hussein alive. He was arrested with a gun in his hand - why didn’t they just shoot him?

Comment by Skip
2009-01-14 13:27:42

A lot of the prisoner’s in Gitmo were “sold” to the military by “informants” belonging to our “allies”.

The question should be - after 7 years why have we not caught the chief perpetrator?

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Comment by VaBeyatch in Virginia Beach
2009-01-14 08:24:29

Could the next bubble be luxury apartments? Here in Norfolk, VA there are tons of new apartment buildings going up. Condos sit empty and unsold. Rents are trying to go up, but at least with the company I’m with they have more openings than ever. Oh, and about 1000 new apartments coming on the market, all of which will probably be priced at the extreme of the market. Luxury, aka hardwood laminate, stainless steel and granite or something similar to it.

Comment by cobaltblue
2009-01-14 08:59:03

The next bubble sure looks to be U.S. Treasuries. Institutions are standing in line to throw billions of dollars at a proposition where you get just over a 2% annual return on a 10 year bond, and about 0% on 6 month issues. This bubble will of course eventually crash through the floor dragging the few remaining solvent institutions with it. Just remember that 30 year treasuries in the 1980 era sold down to 52 cents on the dollar. Why?
Because of inflationary expectations. Today, when the world is locked in deflationary expectations, is the worst possible time to buy these Treasuries; at the HEIGHT of the Treasury bubble. After all, everybody KNOWS they’re the safest thing around, right???

Comment by Darrell_in_PHX
2009-01-14 09:54:17

If the government defaults on the bonds, then what else is safe? If Treasuries aren’t the safest, then what is?

Comment by scdave
2009-01-14 10:14:49

Exactly Darrell….

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Comment by yogurt
2009-01-15 07:17:45

The issue is not default risk. Holders of Treasuries will always get their nominal dollars back because the Fed can create more at will. The issue is inflation risk that is not reflected in the yield. That’s what clobbered Treasuries in the late 70’s and early 80’s.

 
 
 
 
 
Comment by SFC
2009-01-14 08:41:05

My wife is going to quit her job as a teacher after this school year. Taxes are so high on the additional income, it’s just not worth it. It got me thinking - maybe moral hazard isn’t that rewarding risky behavior makes people repeat the risk again. Maybe it’s that it causes good people to give up.
Is it even remotely possible that the more the government bails out the people that caused this crisis, the more the responsible people will stop producing and buying? Maybe the 50% of people that always take their obligations seriously, the backbone of this country, now have in the back of their mind “gee, another $2 trillion I gotta pay back, why work?” Or “I gotta pay back another $2 trillion, better not buy that new car”! I know that Ben, and many on this board have said not to worry about these $trillions, that there’s no way to pay it back, but for many people financial responsibility is not so easy to turn off.

Why don’t they ever consider doing something for the people who didn’t screw up?

Comment by aNYCdj
2009-01-14 09:31:35

Its WORSE then you think……What I f you were working freelance and a Mortgage Loan officer competed for the same job? They would get hired over you because even though they committed mortgage fraud falsified applications willingly sold mortgages people cant afford to get their commission check…they had a steady job the last few years,and you didn’t

This is what i face everyday

——————————————-
Why don’t they ever consider doing something for the people who didn’t screw up?

 
Comment by drumminj
2009-01-14 09:34:05

I don’t think the issue is so much about having to actually pay back the $2 trillion, but rather the other point you make - that those who have made poor decisions or not honored their obligations are being bailed out (regardless of how it gets paid for). It certainly is discouraging.

Yes, as Ben says, there have been and certainly will be ways to profit from this. But it’s also frustrating to have made “correct” decisions, and ultimately been punished for it. Keep your cash in a MMA rather than an MMF (and thus get a lower rate of return)? Well, those with MMF’s end up getting insured by the gov’t, even though you made the right risk/reward decision. Sell out all your funds that had FNM and FRE bonds because you knew they’d drop in value? (and get a lower return because you moved to cash?) Hey, those who didn’t make the right choice get…..backstopped by the government with now _explicit_ guarantees.

From my perspective, it leads one to think “why bother trying to make the right/responsible choice, if I just end up falling behind those who didn’t” (and on top of it, have to pay more in taxes as a result to pay for those guarantees <– this being the part Ben disagrees with).

So far, being responsible and making prudent decisions hasn’t paid off. Without the reward, what’s going to encourage people to act prudently?

Comment by not a gator
2009-01-14 18:22:46

+10

Feeling the same frustration myself… though in my case I went through h@ll shorting IB’s last year…

But yeah, I went and told everyone I knew to get out of money markets (which were up to their eyeballs in cruddy MBS derivatives). Of course the gov’t just covered their behinds… I thought the “return” was due to higher “risk”, didn’t realize it was a subsidized savings account…

When do I get to join the special people?

Comment by CA renter
2009-01-15 04:25:00

Feeling your pain.

It’s tempting to just give up, buy a multi-million dollar McMansion and wait for the govt to lower my principle to “what I can afford” (after quitting work and hiding assets, of course!).

Definitely a lesson in how crime really does pay, especially if you are too big to fail.

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Comment by BP
2009-01-14 09:53:25

Your point is exactly where I find myself. With all the State income tax, Federal taxes property taxes and on and on we have decided if Congress raises the current tax rate at all we are shutting our business down for the summer and go on vacation. Much like the Australians do due to their high tax policy.

Comment by SFC
2009-01-14 10:03:53

In the past week my wife has found that many of our friends are thinking the same way. Why work so hard, only to have Washington spend all the money on things we disagree with? We’re all taking our balls and going home. If they want us to be France, we’ll work and vacation like the French.

Comment by bubblicious
2009-01-14 18:15:07

Funny, we’re doing the same in Canada. Taking reduced work weeks — in part to enjoy life, in part to work on freelancing for other companies as job insurance should our day jobs evaporate. Having saved like mad and rented debt-free when everyone else was spending during the boom, we now have the luxury of being prepared for a deep, dark recession and making more time for family while others panic. And we have the money to take (modest, of course) advantage of fire sales on vacations and other services while everyone else just tries to pay off debts. It pays to swim up stream. In dark times you need sanity and family. We’re regrouping and hunkering down — in a positive way, and will capitalize on our prudence when, well, if, we ever get a recovery. Not surprised to hear others doing the same. More to life than money and things.

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Comment by not a gator
2009-01-14 18:26:59

I wish I could get a 35 hour work week! But our union contract guarantees us 40 hours and we’ll get it, by gosh by golly!

I’m trying to come up with some sort of scheme to get a 35 hour “full time” (ie, I keep my health insurance, please [insert deity here]) without screwing the other employees who need all 40 hours of pay just so their children can eat.

(Unfortunately, I think I am the only one who wants 35 hours… even our returned retiree seems to want 50 hour weeks… so I think it would smack of favoritism.)

 
 
 
Comment by Jon
2009-01-14 11:37:13

“Your point is exactly where I find myself. With all the State income tax, Federal taxes property taxes and on and on we have decided if Congress raises the current tax rate at all we are shutting our business down for the summer and go on vacation. Much like the Australians do due to their high tax policy.”

Why not just pay someone 100% of the revenues to run it for you over the summer? Employee gets a nice summer job & you get a nice vacation. Sounds win-win to me.

 
 
Comment by edgewaterjohn
2009-01-14 09:53:32

“…the more the responsible people will stop producing and buying?”

In so far as the buying part, this is a form of resistance that everyone can partake in. Holding back those dollars now carries more impact than at any time in past few decades.

Really, look at those DEC retail numbers. If savers are miffed, there is something they can do about. Sure, savings interest rates are zilch - but why would someone rather buy a depreciating house or car instead? Besides, there’ll be plenty of cars and houses to be had in due time.

 
Comment by Doghouse Riley
2009-01-14 10:06:54

“the more the government bails out the people that caused this crisis, the more the responsible people will stop producing and buying”

I seem to recall an emigrant Russian woman writing a long book about that sort of decision back in the fifties. Of course, respectable public opinion has made fun of her ever since, because nothing like that could ever happen in the USA.

Comment by not a gator
2009-01-14 18:29:17

I make fun of her because she was as kooky as Mary Baker Eddy and Rev. Sun Myung Moon, lording over her coterie of the easily-dominated, determining all the details of their lives, including who they could marry…

Kook is as kook does.

 
 
Comment by scdave
2009-01-14 10:18:41

SFC…Took the words out of my hands on the key board…My feelings exactly…I quit…

By the way, sounds like you are in a high tax state..Where are you located ??

 
Comment by Darrell_in_PHX
2009-01-14 10:23:27

My wife was talking about looking for a second job. I pretty much talked her out of it. At 40% marginal, $1 saved is $1.60 earned, but $1 earned is only $0.60 to spend. Instead of getting a second job, we just decided to tighten the belt another notch.

Of the top 100 movies last year, we say 24 in the theaters. With popcorn and sodas, call it $50 per = $1200 spent. She’d have to make $2000 to take home that much. At $10 an hour, call it 200 hours of work to spend 48 hours in a theater.

Last year we spent over $4K on 2 cruises (5 person x4 day and 2 person x 7 day = 34 person days) . She’d have to earn $6,666 K to keep that much after taxes. At $10 an hour, 666 hours. 16 hours awake x 34 person days = 544 hours.

As I said, I think I convinced her to tighten the belt rather than get a second job.

Comment by Blue Skye
2009-01-14 12:12:55

Add the expense of the second car in most cases.

Add the tradeoff between having time to cook vs. convenience premium foods.

Add the stress, subtract the intimacy!

Comment by Darrell_in_PHX
2009-01-14 12:25:05

No, no…. She still has her $50+K first job. NO WAY can she quit that. Just talked her out of getting a $10 an hour second, part-time job.

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Comment by Blue Skye
2009-01-14 12:27:18

OK then double the last line!

 
 
 
Comment by Skip
2009-01-14 13:33:01

You should have her get a job in a movie theater, that way you can see all the movies you want and eat all the popcorn for free.

Comment by bluprint
2009-01-14 14:32:05

I knew some guys that worked in a theatre when I was in college (the first time). We would go there after it closed and watch the latest release and drink byob (dry county here, maybe in some other magical land they sell beer in the movie theatre but for me this was and still is awesome).

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Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2009-01-14 16:29:59

Dry county?!?

Talk about living unhappily ever after.

WHOA!!! I’d rather go work for the NAR®.

 
 
 
 
Comment by I Corinthians 4:2
2009-01-14 11:30:24

“It got me thinking - maybe moral hazard isn’t that rewarding risky behavior makes people repeat the risk again. Maybe it’s that it causes good people to give up.”

+5,000,000

I can’t tell you how many times while watching this whole debacle unfold, that I’ve asked myself “what’s the use?” The responsible and prudent always get the short end of the stick. Then I have to remind myself…Matthew 6:19-21; Ecclesiastes 12:13

 
 
Comment by mina
2009-01-14 08:59:40

my husband has been introducing me to “the Godfather” movies, which I have never seen before.

one line I love: “hold your friends close, hold your enemies closer.”

and so I do. frequently I check the Builder Online and Big Builder Online sites for interesting info.

today’s article of interest:
Starting Over: The economic crisis forces the home building industry to reassess the fundamentals of its business.

Comment by Olympiagal
2009-01-14 10:25:50

Nice link, mina.

(from the article.)
‘… a better way might be conceivable through a responsible and coordinated application of planning, rules, and guidelines that isn’t motivated solely by self-interest.’

What a thought!

Oh, and mina, I’m glad you finally got introduced to the Best Buncha Movies in the world. Well, maybe not the best, but I love the Godfather. I do a SUPER godfather imitation. I’m gonna’ go practice it a bit right now, since you reminded me.

 
Comment by GS fixer
2009-01-14 11:05:47

The best lines:
“Leave the gun…….take the canoli”.

and

“……pain-in-the-ass innocent bystanders…..”

Clemenza……my kind of no-nonsense guy. :)

 
Comment by Skip
2009-01-14 13:35:31

Thats actually an Arabian Proverb, not Italian. :-)

Comment by ACH
2009-01-14 16:17:31

What is? Take the gun … leave the canoli?
Roidy

 
 
 
Comment by VirginiaTechDan
2009-01-14 08:59:55

I would like to respond to this post from yesterday..

If your libertarian utopia is really a possibility, could you please direct us to a region in the world where **no** government infrastructure, healthcare, education, military, etc. exists and where the people of this region have greater measures of health, wealth, literacy, etc.?

Please back up your theories with credible examples, as it would really help to convince those of us who doubt libertarianism and Darwinian capitalism will result in a more successful society.

The fact that violent thugs have at all times ruled over the ignorant masses does not in anyway disprove my assertion of what is good and in the best interest of man kind. But there is a VERY STRONG correlation between government size and economic collapse.

Some people set about to solve “world hunger” but this requires resources and a productive society. A libertarian “utopia” simply requires that individuals stop systematically stealing from and killing each other.
This is something that could be “decided” upon and made a reality and the result would be increased prosperity.

Everyone who promotes this tax or that tax to fund this or that “public good” takes some very arrogant positions:
1) They know better than everyone else on where to invest
2) Their sence of value is better than everyone else’s
3) They may steal to accomplish their goals, but no one else may
4) They may kill to accomplish their goals, but no one else may

The closest example I have would be the decades that followed the revolutionary war. There was no wide-spread government education (yet people were far better educated), the vast majority of roads were privately funded (and were being built at a rapid pace), our heath care was among the best in the world at the time, and no standing army was necessary to defend the country (we had militia).

Clearly the non-libertarian approach has failed repeatedly throughout history and the closer societies got to the libertarian ideal the greater their economic productivity and standard of living.

Comment by packman
2009-01-14 09:21:57

A Libertarian Utopia requires a strong moral base - something we haven’t had for a very long time.

Otherwise - I think it’s still a worthy goal - worth striving for, but I don’t think we’ll ever get there.

Comment by Al
2009-01-14 10:44:43

It seems to me that a common theme in a civilizations is that an adequate majority of the population must buy into the system, whichever system it happens to be. As soon as it doesn’t work for too many people (reaches a tipping point) then revolution or collapse follows. I suspect a libertarian system would fail quickly without the carrot of government programs and the stick of police action to keep people in line. I tend to like the libertarian concept in theory, but just don’t think it could work.

Comment by packman
2009-01-14 12:35:58

Police action yes - we’re talking libertarian, not anarchy. Even libertarians believe in a sufficiently-strong police force.

Government program carrots no.

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Comment by VirginiaTechDan
2009-01-14 15:27:10

So long as there is no “monopoly” on police action and said police are funded by voluntary means. If there exists a monopoly on police action then there are no checks/balances.

 
Comment by CA renter
2009-01-15 04:40:59

But therein lies one of the problems. It is exceedingly common — in countries with few regulations and a bureaucratic checks and balances — to have a police force that is totally bought and paid for by special interests.

Believe it or not, it’s the size of govt that often keeps it from being corrupted. Competing special interests actually keep each other in check.

While I strongly favor libertarianism where civil/personal rights are concerned; economically, it’s just not possible to run an entire country without some concern for the “greater good.”

Yes, we need to revamp the entire election process, IMHO, and eliminate campaign funding. I favor publicly-sponsored voters’ guides that are assembled in such a way that only facts could be published about the candidates, and that every candidate had a fair shot.

The special interest groups that finance campaigns need to be put out of business completely, and anyone found guilty of accepting bribes should be immediately thrown in jail for a minimum of five years, and should have all their assets seized and added to the general fund.

BTW, I appreciate your response, but still believe that if it were possible to set up a successful “libertarian utopia” it would have been done already.

 
 
 
Comment by VirginiaTechDan
2009-01-14 15:46:51

It is wise to first get everyone to agree on the real “goal” before any debate occurs on how to get there. Once the goal is realized then it should be clear that we should take the fastest route possible to reach that goal.

In a compromise between good and evil, only evil has something to gain.

 
 
Comment by ET-Chicago
2009-01-14 09:36:28

A libertarian “utopia” simply requires that individuals stop systematically stealing from and killing each other. This is something that could be “decided” upon and made a reality and the result would be increased prosperity.

Wouldn’t that be an action taken for the common good, a principle you seemed to roundly reject yesterday?

You’re still not convincing me that a relatively complex, relatively egalitarian society can exist without some sense of common good, common care, common goals, common courtesy (these things are intertwined).

 
Comment by drumminj
2009-01-14 09:39:54

VTDan - I’m curious to learn of your background: education, upbringing, etc. I very much respect your views, and think they’re very articulate and reasonable. I’m curious what path in life has led you to have them.

I can very much understand if you don’t want to open yourself up to character assassination on this board, so feel free to email me directly: drumminj at yahoo.

Thanks!

Comment by scdave
2009-01-14 12:36:20

I am curious also but comfortable just reading his comments…

 
Comment by VirginiaTechDan
2009-01-14 15:48:16

I posted a longer comment, but it has not shown up… I will repost the response if it isn’t here in an hour.

 
Comment by VirginiaTechDan
2009-01-14 17:37:23

I grew up in a Republican / Christian household and a very patriotic family. I have a Computer Science degree from Virginia Tech and was an out spoken evangelical.. I use to support the Iraq war, the space program, etc…. about 2 years ago I decided to stop being mentally lazy and accepting on faith the opinions of those I trusted. I decided to research one topic after another and my opinion slowly changed from one of limited government to no government.

I have a sense of right and wrong that stems from the “don’t do unto others what you don’t want others doing unto you”. From this moral foundation there is no way any man or group of men can organize to steal, kill, imprison anyone else against their will according to some arbitrary legislation. Anyone who does these things confesses by their actions they they personally would not mind others doing it to them and so restitution can be made and individuals can defend themselves.

All laws are natural and a legislator has no purpose. I support people voluntarily coming together for common defense and voluntarily paying for these services. Today there exists anarchy at the international level and disputes are settled by force or diplomacy. The core problem is the geographical monopoly of “governments”. Defense can be provided by competing “insurance companies” which will investigate crimes, find the suspect and then deal with the suspects “insurance company” to identify guilt/innocence and pay restitution. In this way every individual is able to pick the company that will best defend their rights for the lowest cost. Any company that starts misbehaving will lose their customer base. Imagine being able to “pick your country” without having to move and having the freedom to “start a new country” if none suite your needs. Then have this country protect you from other countries / individuals.

As to my “fundamentalist christian” view, I cannot deny that there is a God, but I can no longer accept on “faith” that the Bible is infallible. Since there is a God he should be feared and obeyed and your life/death salvation/damnation are in his hands (you are saved by grace). Considering the bible claims Jesus said “all of scripture hangs on loving God and do unto others…” I have decided that everything else in the Bible becomes irrelevant so long as you live your life according to the first two pillars which I can independently derive by reason.

I have also concluded that ANYONE who claims to believe the bible is infallible MUST not attempt to GOVERN others for it is better to endure an injustice than to commit one. To govern others (without direct command from God) would violate the 2nd greatest commandment.

Finally, I do believe in a “common good” but defined as “not harming anyone” instead of some dubious “good - bad > 0″ kind of calculation which will yield a different result for every INDIVIDUAL.

Comment by technovelist
2009-01-14 21:17:14

Agreed on all counts, other than that I’m not a Christian. But I strongly support the Golden Rule for other reasons than scriptural ones.

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Comment by I Corinthians 4:2
2009-01-14 11:55:49

My friends, (sorry! I know we’re all tired of that, but couldn’t resist!)

i love this blog! I love this blog! I LOVE THIS BLOG!!! I spend every lunch hour (and steal some other time throughout the day from my employer) reading the bits bucket. I so much look forward to your in depth analysis and discussion of the issues.

Let me just make a disclaimer. I’m not preaching or anything, but we all have our beliefs that shape the way we view the world. I am a Christian (not a very good one BTW), and in my very humble opinion VT Dan, it is impossible to have any type of utopia in a Godless society. I’m not saying there should be any state sponsored religion or anything. Free choice is the foundation of God’s kingdom. (The evangelicals always seem to forget this) . You get to choose whether you believe in Him or not. You get to choose whether to live by His laws or not.

The more I observe of human nature (my own included), the more convinced I am that God indeed exists, and what the Bible says is true. Man has been trying from the dawn of time to make this thing work and has failed. Every system has failed; socialism, communism, fascism, etc., and we are now beholding the cracks in capitalism. The reason none of these systems work is that nothing that man can create can solve the problem of sinful human nature. They may all start out with lofty ideals but not one system that we humans have cooked up can control that wildcard. Greed, selfishness, every kind of evil cannot be corrected by any system, government, law, or lack thereof. Only God can transform a human heart.

Off soapbox, apologies to Ben. This is the Housing Bubble Blog. Will refrain from any more scriptural or religious references from now on.

Comment by drumminj
2009-01-14 13:14:19

Sounds like you should read ‘The God Delusion’ by Richard Dawkins. It attacks the claim that religion is the necessary foundation of morality, which it seems you might be hinting at above.

Additionally, you seem to claim that because the bible says that man is inherently flawed, and because you see failure, that the bible must be true and God must exist. Just because many people have bad motives doesn’t mean that ‘man’ is fundamentally flawed, or that there don’t exist a subset of people for which a “libertarian utopia” could work, and quite well at that.

Comment by Blano
2009-01-14 14:15:32

Sounds to me like you should read the Bible by You Know Who, rather than the silly stuff that Dawkins and his ilk try to use to refute it.

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Comment by drumminj
2009-01-14 15:11:41

sarcasm?

 
Comment by drumminj
2009-01-14 15:21:37

For the record, Dawkins isn’t attempting to debunk the bible in the book, but merely the notion that morality cannot exist without religion or that morality comes from the bible.

 
 
Comment by I Corinthians 4:2
2009-01-14 14:51:46

drumminj,

I’m always looking for a good read, so thanks for the recommendation. I’ll check to see if my local library has it. If not, I’ll hit up Barnes and Noble the next time they send me a 15% off discount card in the mail.

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Comment by Skip
2009-01-14 13:51:02

Solomon - son of David, builder of the 1st Temple in Jerusalem, had 700 wives and 300 concubines and also built temples to other deities and many other buildings in Jerusalem.

Maybe he was responsible for the first bubble in construction?

Comment by qaxbami
2009-01-14 14:09:44

Also the first wife and concubine bubbles?

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Comment by Blano
2009-01-14 14:11:44

Well said.

 
 
Comment by SaladSD
2009-01-15 00:18:11

VirgTech, your argument is specious. “The closest example I have would be the decades that followed the revolutionary war. There was no wide-spread government education (yet people were far better educated).” What people? In 1870, according to the US census, 20% of the population was illiterate. Today it’s .6%

“the vast majority of roads were privately funded (and were being built at a rapid pace)” You’ve got to be kidding. Comparing roads used for horse & carriages that travel 10mp to roadways for cars at 65mph, let alone the differences in population. If you’re building a driveway, or a 1/2 mile road to town, that’s a bit different than an interstate highway system;
“our heath care was among the best in the world at the time” Great, so we had better barbers and leeches than other countries.
whooptido. “and no standing army was necessary to defend the country (we had militia).” I guess once we adopted our Manifest Destiny doctrine we had to suit up.

So, what exactly is your point? You want to time travel back to Revolutionary War days, when life was so much easier?

 
 
Comment by SFC
2009-01-14 09:26:39

“Everyone who promotes this tax or that tax to fund this or that “public good” takes some very arrogant positions:
1) They know better than everyone else on where to invest
2) Their sence of value is better than everyone else’s…”

Last night I heard some idiot talking head on TV say “we should have raised gasoline taxes as the price went down”. No one challenged him. I wanted to yell at the TV “who is this WE? You mean YOU want other people’s money, to steal as you deem appropriate! You want the money of the delivery man, the truck driver, the guy driving to his restaurant job, etc. Perhaps in your Godlike generosity you will deem to disburse this money to those you favor. It’s not your money!!”

Comment by measton
2009-01-14 11:21:59

They know better than everyone else, and their sense of value is better than everyone else. ?????

1. Taxes are needed to pay the bills. Taxes have to come from somewhere. You think it is arrogant to look at the world and to try and figure out how tax policy can improve the security and the econonomy of the US. That’s an ignorant head in the sand position to take.

2. You wanted to yell at someone proposing a gas tax. Never mind that the cost of road construction, repair, fuel infrastructure and security, are not covered by the gas tax. Our income taxes subsidize driving. Never mind that rasing the gas tax instead of income or other taxes would lead to a drop in oil consumption and thus fewer dollars going to our good friends in Saudi Arabia, Iran, Venezuela, Russia. Just stick your head in the sand and say I hate taxes and anyone who thinks about these issues should be yelled at?????

3. You want the money of the delivery man, the truck driver, the guy driving to his restaurant job, and you want the money of anyone earning a paycheck to subsidize the inefficient use of fuel, and in the process Americas enemies.

Comment by drumminj
2009-01-14 13:21:24

measton, I think you’re looking at things from a different perspective than VT Dan. You’re right - if the gov’t is going to pay for roads and infrastructure, then the money needs to come from somewhere. The point I would argue that VT Dan is making (I could be wrong) is that the gov’t shouldn’t be doing this in the first place.

Regardless, even if we all agree that roads are good, that doesn’t mean that anyone has a right to take money from someone else to pay for them (which is essentially what taxation is). It’s not a question of whether roads are good or beneficial. It’s a question of whether any individual has the right to appropriate the life and labor of another individual. My opinion (and apparently Dan’s as well) is ‘no’.

 
Comment by SFC
2009-01-14 16:11:26

We need less taxes, 50% less government. I don’t sit around saying, or even thinking “you know what - that guy over there needs to pay more taxes”. I will disagree with those that do.

Comment by ecofeco
2009-01-14 17:16:55

‘Cause deregulation has worked so well recently, hasn’t it? It brought great wealth and ethics to our financial, housing, airline and food industries along with a strong and robust infrastructure and many benefits for the fine citizens of this country like poison free foods and safe products that don’t blow up or spontaneously combust along with an ever increasing quality of life and wages.

Oh wait…

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Comment by SFC
2009-01-14 20:02:51

You’ve convinced me, comrade. I’m going to send everything I earn to the government. I make take a second job, to further support the revolution.

 
 
 
 
 
Comment by whino
2009-01-14 09:40:05

Fed official expects start of recovery in 2nd half

In a speech Wednesday at the University of Delaware, Charles Plosser also said that the unemployment rate probably won’t drop anytime soon, but that he doesn’t expect it to rise to double digits, as it did during the recession of the early 1980s.

“I expect the housing sector will finally hit bottom in 2009 and the financial markets will gradually return to some semblance of normalcy,” said Plosser, adding that the current recession could be one of the longest in the post-World War II era.

“We must consider the possibility that our presence in these credit markets will deter private-sector participants from returning to and restoring these markets to health,” he said. “To prevent our policies from having these perverse effects, we should consider gradual increases in the cost of borrowing from these facilities to discourage their use and encourage other participants to return to the markets.”

“Clarifying the criteria under which we will intervene in markets or extend credit, including defining what constitutes the ‘unusual and exigent’ circumstances which form the legal basis for the Fed’s nontraditional lending, will be essential if we are to mitigate the moral hazard we have created,” Plosser said.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Fed-official-expects-start-of-apf-14058587.html

Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2009-01-14 11:18:49

Recovery is ALWAYS six months away even when it isn’t.

There is no chance at all of a quick recovery given the excesses of the current cycle.

Comment by scdave
2009-01-14 12:38:53

I agree…

 
Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2009-01-14 13:36:33

Spot on, FPSS.

The scale of the pain must and will match the scale of the excesses.

 
Comment by CA renter
2009-01-15 04:52:26

Agree, FPSS, but what I think he is trying to say (reading between the lines) is that they need to raise interest rates because current rates are not market rates. I know you understand this, but perhaps the motivation for his claiming “everything is going to get better” is that he sees the danger in not having a true credit market.

 
 
 
Comment by ET-Chicago
2009-01-14 09:42:01

Mixing sports and real estate on ol’ NYC:

The Yankees have hired a division of a prominent Manhattan residential real estate brokerage, Prudential Douglas Elliman, to help sell some of their prime real estate: unsold premium seats and luxury boxes at the new Yankee Stadium.

“They have some customers we may not be able to reach, and they can, so we entered into a nonexclusive agreement with them,” Randy Levine, the Yankees’ president, said Tuesday. “They have customers they have sold real estate to, or will in the future, and they can sell our seats in an innovative way.”

Levine said that hiring Prudential Douglas Elliman was not an indication of a slow sales pace on high-end seats at the $1.3 billion stadium. Seven luxury suites remained to be sold, out of 59, and about 1,000 of 4,000 premium seats were available.

Link.

Comment by sf jack
2009-01-14 10:32:56

Recently, I looked at some of the ticket prices for seats at the new Yankee Stadium.

It certainly appears management didn’t expect Wall Street to meltdown when they were priced.

Good luck with that…

Comment by Hwy50ina49Dodge
2009-01-14 11:02:02

Billionaire sport team owners using taxpayers to build their stadiums…I can hardly contain my internal grief at their poor situation, just pitiful really, I especially miss that rap music they play at NBA games. ;-)

 
Comment by scdave
2009-01-14 12:43:37

Yankees have always lead the pack in being able to sign free agents…Thats why they have produced very few through their minor league system…The T/V, Radio and assessory sales revenue give them a HUGE leg up on every other franchise….

 
Comment by DennisN
2009-01-14 12:51:43

They tore down the old Yankee stadium and then started building the new one. It would serve them right to have it go bankrupt half-way through construction and have NY end up with NO stadium for 10 or 20 years. Let the Yankees go play in, say, Charlestown SC and rename them the Southern Patriots. ;)

 
 
Comment by bananarepublic
2009-01-14 10:56:20

How much to watch a baseball game? Give me a break. If I want to see a live game I’ll watch the Cal State Fullerton Titans. Quality baseball, sound fundamentals, great seats, free parking, and all this for $8.

MLB? No thanks.

Comment by Hwy50ina49Dodge
2009-01-14 11:03:10

Hey, can you bring in your own…Neil’s All Natural Popcorn? :-)

 
Comment by scdave
2009-01-14 12:44:50

I am with you on that one Banana…GO SCU…

 
Comment by CasaTostada
2009-01-14 15:39:22

Ditto. Except I’ll go see the UCI Anteaters–the new #1 in SoCal baseball.

I will not pay for a ticket to another pro sporting event or subscribe to a pay TV channel for pro sports. Period.

 
Comment by DR Fartlestain
2009-01-15 13:47:05

Plus you have the opportunity to watch Wichita State and the best coach in college baseball, ever!

 
 
Comment by edgewaterjohn
2009-01-14 11:37:37

Can one live in a skybox?

“We have an address for the Blues Brothers….1060 W. Addison”

Comment by ET-Chicago
2009-01-14 14:29:10

Hell of an address, that one.

I like to visit, but wouldn’t wanna live there.

 
 
Comment by BanteringBear
2009-01-14 14:16:35

What a sad time in our country. What used to be a “national pastime” in which an ordinary family could enjoy watching athletic adults play a childs game, has turned into nothing more than a money grab, with the end result being prices which no average family can realistically afford.

 
 
Comment by bananarepublic
2009-01-14 09:58:53

It is really depressing watching our economic system be destroyed like this. These people that are in power are basically handing our money, and our kids money, to a bunch of criminals that were running a legalized Ponzi scheme. The economic life of this country is being sucked right out of it by a bunch of gangsters.

All these firms that ran themselves into the ground should be allowed to fail. PERIOD. Use the money to pay back those that held FDIC accounts.

I do not recognize this country anymore. I am so over this country, this government, and the gangsters and morons in it.

Comment by nhz
2009-01-14 10:15:55

unfortunately it is exactly the same all over the developed world, so nowhere to run. I agree the whole finance economy is a Ponzi scheme and those in charge will do everything they can to keep it running. Politicians, banksters etc. all have the same objectives and they will profit as long as the system does not have a total collapse :(

 
Comment by sleepless_near_seattle
2009-01-14 10:53:31

Million-Man (and Woman) March on Wall St. and Washington?

Comment by packman
 
Comment by CA renter
2009-01-15 04:56:52

Sleepless,

We should be so lucky. Unfortunately, it’s not been easy trying to get people motivated to do something. :(

Maybe we need more of these “bad times” before they wake up and smell the coffee. By then, it will be all over, and the banks will have made off with all the loot, though.

 
 
 
Comment by BanteringBear
2009-01-14 10:27:11

Stock market fall down, go boom.

Comment by scdave
2009-01-14 12:46:28

Funny…:)

Comment by Elanor
2009-01-14 13:28:21

It would be funnier if I didn’t still have money in it.

On the bright side, I don’t even have to DO anything, and soon I WON’T have any money in stocks! ;)

 
 
 
Comment by mrktMaven
2009-01-14 10:32:18

Someone emphasized the point yesterday that the money banks receive today can be lent once and only once. After making a loan, banks need to keep it on their balance sheets. Compare this to yesteryear’s originate and distribute securitization model and you’ll understand why asset prices are falling around the globe. The print and distribute machinery is broken.

 
Comment by GS fixer
2009-01-14 10:40:14

FIRST!!!! (on this blog to get walking papers in 2009…..)

Signed,
(ex-) GSfixer

Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2009-01-14 11:11:53

Sorry to hear it, GS…

Comment by ET-Chicago
2009-01-14 11:29:54

Me too.

 
 
Comment by VaBeyatch in Virginia Beach
2009-01-14 12:09:14

Forgo the maintenance on them there corporate jets… aren’t they more likely to fall outta’ the sky?

 
Comment by wmbz
2009-01-14 12:09:26

Sorry to hear that, hope your time ‘off’ is short lived!

 
Comment by Blano
2009-01-14 12:10:05

Aw man, sorry to hear that.

 
Comment by Blue Skye
2009-01-14 12:19:02

Hope your time off is best lived.

 
Comment by Kim
2009-01-14 12:27:39

Oh no! Sorry to hear that.

 
Comment by scdave
2009-01-14 12:55:36

Yeah, sorry GS…There was a short segment on CNBC this morning on the difficulties in the private aircraft business..I would assume that spills directly over to service…Good luck…

 
Comment by Ol'Bubba
2009-01-14 13:44:37

I got mine in ‘08.

 
Comment by SanFranciscoBayAreaGal
2009-01-14 13:53:29

Dang GS fixer,

Sorry to hear about that.

 
Comment by packman
2009-01-14 14:22:27

Crap - sorry to hear that.

FWIW - I was let go last year, and got something within about 3 months (before severance finished, which was nice).

Comment by drumminj
2009-01-14 14:40:02

Severance? Must be nice :)

My severance was that I got to keep my company laptop. Better than nothing, but certainly doesn’t help tide one over until new employment is found….

Sorry to hear it, GS.

Comment by GS fixer
2009-01-14 15:13:19

Got out of the meeting……company is looking at their options re:the airplane…….only one of which involve my further employment for more than a couple months, max. Was strongly encouraged to pursue “other opportunities”. No discussion of a severance package…….now you know why I never take vacations (last one I had was Aug., 2001)

Started hearing rumors before Christmas, but what I was seeing with my own eyes didn’t agree with Rumor Control, so I mostly didn’t let them bother me.

I went thru this same drill in late 2003, so I’m getting good at it. I have two daughters in High School (single dad, both live with me due to “inappropriate behavior” by ex-’s new hubby), so it will suck for them if I have to relocate (which I’ll have to, if I want to continue fixing airplanes).

If it wasn’t for the kids, I might take early retirement in San Diego, and park myself a nice refrigerator box under an overpass, thus getting in early on the “Cardboard Studio Apartment” bubble.

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Comment by not taken for granite
2009-01-14 18:27:19

Sorry you got bad news, GS. I am in the same biz and I cringe when I hear how many are for sale. What region are you in?

 
 
 
 
Comment by ahansen
2009-01-14 15:19:40

Hang in there, GS.

May you find the lemonade in this turn of events and drink deeply!

Comment by sleepless_near_seattle
2009-01-14 16:03:02

I concur. Happened to me last Spring and I found a job that I like that pays more and my boss almost always has my back. I didn’t realize what a bad situation my old job was…

Good luck, GS, and may you find some relaxation in your (hopefully short) time off.

 
 
 
Comment by ET-Chicago
2009-01-14 11:01:53

The bailout is working, says he:

Sure, you can question how the money was used — many of us have — but you can’t quarrel with the fact that a financial meltdown has been avoided as a direct result of the government’s extraordinary interventions …

… Who has benefited from all this? Every investor, every household and every business in the United States.

Rebuttals?

Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2009-01-14 11:16:32

Why waste precious time that could be better spent eatin’ and drinkin’?

Comment by ET-Chicago
2009-01-14 11:28:49

Touché, Mr. Pussycat.

 
Comment by scdave
2009-01-14 12:58:56

And 96in…oops… dyslexia…

Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2009-01-14 16:58:23

ROTFLMAO

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Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2009-01-14 17:58:26

I didn’t know if it was day or night.
I started kissing everything in sight.
But when I kissed a cop down on 34th and Vine.
He broke my little bottle of Love Potion number 9.

:-D

 
 
 
 
Comment by bluprint
2009-01-14 11:29:33

Just hang it on the wall until this thing is over. It’s way too early to call it.

Plus you can’t really argue with the “it would have been worse” logic. Frank made this same claim a few weeks ago when he was interviewed (60 mins?). At the end he said something along the same lines “…it would have been even worse if we had done nothing”.

Comment by Blue Skye
2009-01-14 12:21:14

You are really much better off because I beat the crap out of you. Trust me on this.

Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2009-01-14 17:03:33

It’s way too early to call it.

As Mao once remarked on the effect of the French Revolution on the world, “It is too soon to say.”

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Comment by SanFranciscoBayAreaGal
2009-01-14 14:05:16

How could it be worse? Instead of it happening all at once, it is now a thousand deaths. I would rather it happen quickly, instead of a slow painful death.

Comment by CA renter
2009-01-15 05:09:01

+1

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Comment by Al
2009-01-14 11:48:13

Yes, the fact that the system hasn’t melted down is proof that it will not melt down. And subprime is contained.

Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2009-01-14 13:38:51

Nothing to see here folks; it’s all contained. Move along.

:-)

 
 
 
Comment by fisher
2009-01-14 11:16:20

Anybody catch the PBS film “Ascent of Money” last night? It was awesome! Great survey of many of the issues discussed here: manias, credit bubbles, etc. Much discussion of recent events also. You can watch it online on pbs’s website under /wnet/ascentofmoney/

 
Comment by Elanor
2009-01-14 12:11:15

I caught most of it. It was entertaining to see a Brit’s take on our global woes with a focus on the U.S. I liked the on-location reporting, too. The canals of Venice; the Patagonia mountains with alpaca and llama herders and the gas pipeline going, going, going off to the horizon; the horrifying pollution of Chengdong (not sure how that’s spelled) in China; and the rusting, falling-down abandoned Detroit buildings.

Missed the ending because it was past my bedtime. The TV section had it listed to end at 11, so at 11:15 I had to call it a day.

 
Comment by mrktMaven
2009-01-14 13:02:26

Ferguson was on Bloomberg over the holidays. Seems to have a grip. I’ll watch it over the weekend. Here’s the link:

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/ascentofmoney/featured/watch-full-program-the-ascent-of-money/24/

 
 
Comment by Hwy50ina49Dodge
2009-01-14 11:22:02

This doesn’t effect Alaska’s budget does it?…Hey, Ms. “Barracuda”… get those bully oil companies to re-negotiate those field lease’s, the lower 48 American brother/sister states (That can’t just see Russia …right over there…) is getting ripped off! ;-)

“The retail numbers were dismal,” said Jim Ritterbusch, president of Ritterbusch and Association. “They drove the stock market and then we got spanked again.” ;-)

Oil prices tumble with US inventories bulging:

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Oil-prices-tumble-with-US-apf-14059874.html

Comment by austin
2009-01-14 12:30:25

Look up “effect” and “affect.” You may learn something.

Comment by CasaTostada
2009-01-14 15:48:13

Spare us the snootism.

 
 
 
Comment by BanteringBear
2009-01-14 11:22:41

The Greatest Depression is here.

Comment by clue
2009-01-14 11:50:31

I smell magic premium jas bait….

Comment by SanFranciscoBayAreaGal
2009-01-14 13:56:50

voz, I mean clue, that was just too funny. Had me laughing out loud.

Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2009-01-14 16:25:17

He’s jas testing the waters.

LOL

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Comment by Blue Skye
2009-01-14 12:25:49

A year ago, after listening to my numerous rants for too long, my wonderful gf said to me calmly “Why not just act as though it has already happened?”

 
Comment by cactus
2009-01-14 12:37:45

“The Greatest Depression is here”

yep

 
 
Comment by wmbz
2009-01-14 11:39:04

“Our economic problems are due to loose monetary policy, central economic planning, and the parasitic expenses of government. Unless we assess these problems honestly, we unfortunately have a long way to go until, like the junkie, we hit rock bottom.”

Ron Paul

Comment by mrktMaven
2009-01-14 13:11:03

Don’t forget greed. The inner party bargained away a small percentage of the US middle class to tap into ALL of India’s and China’s middle class.

 
 
Comment by palmetto
2009-01-14 12:05:17

OK, this is priceless! Why? Because this house is in that Lennar Riverbend(over) development, where it used to be you couldn’t touch a place in there for under $250,000. Seriously. They planned on having million dollar homes along the river, pool and clubhouse, gated, etc. None of which has happened. Instead, you, too, can buy a home in a stucco gulag and live the good life, wondering when your place will be broken into or tagged by a gang. BOO-YAH!

Just for example, in 2000, I purchased a little 1970s concrete block shack on some land, not far from there for only slightly less than that. Sold it at the top of the bubble for about double. Awesome. (Palmster blows on nails, buffs them on chest, gazes modestly at fingertips with downcast eyes.)

http://tampa.craigslist.org/hil/reb/981017563.html

Comment by packman
2009-01-14 14:19:44

I thought they stopped making that color green in the 1940’s.

Comment by palmetto
2009-01-14 17:09:57

LOL, packman, they re-named that avocado shade of green and now they call it “sage”. What a bunch of pretentious hooey. I do feel bad for this one family I know who lives there, they are stretched to the max and trying to make a go of it in the stucco slum. The disappointment and grief these folks are going through is really sad. They thought they would be living in a great place for the kids along the river, they had a dream that has turned into a nightmare.

Comment by packman
2009-01-14 19:47:16

I actually don’t mind the outside (I had sage-ish green in my house before, but it’s best only on the inside) - I was referring to the lime green inside.

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Comment by parrish dave
2009-01-14 16:10:54

And it’s still overpriced by 85.5k !! Honestly.

Comment by palmetto
2009-01-14 17:13:24

Yes, it is, dave. I predict that squatters will move in from the trailer park nearby, if they haven’t already.

Not to mention, notice the place was built in 2006. I’ll bet it has that Chinese drywall that Lennar and some other builders used during that year. If so, plow the place under. It is toast.

 
 
 
Comment by mrktMaven
2009-01-14 12:31:18

Thus far, Nasdaq and SPX are holding their 50 pct retraces. Dow looks shaky, however.

 
Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2009-01-14 13:07:14

Posted earlier today, but not going through due to the link presumably. Posting again without the link:

Seattle area HBB/Seattle Bubble meet-up! Eli and I finally got it on the schedule. Come and join us in North Seattle (Wallingford) if you’re in the area and can make it!

DATE & TIME: Tuesday January 20th at 6:00 PM
PLACE: Kate’s Pub (Wallingford; located near I-5 and many bus routes)
RSVP: Optional; E-mail eli at-sign eligoldberg dot com and we’ll save you a spot.

 
Comment by nhz
2009-01-14 13:51:45

Dutch bubble update:

I have been trying to rent a new home, but was not able to close the deal up to now. It’s a nice home in a good location but pretty small. I am offering the owner nearly 3% of the asking price (it is also for sale) for renting the place 1 year. Even his realtor thinks this is a fair offer considering the conditions, but he thinks he can get a better deal. W’ll see about that…

Next time I will start offering a yearly rent of 2-2.5% of the price ;) That is still way over the rental prices in the government-controlled sector though. As you can see, something must be wrong with the Dutch market if yearly rent is in this range (used to be in the 10-12% range here, twenty years ago)

Comment by Blue Skye
2009-01-14 15:28:45

Wow nhz, over 300 times monthly rental. Hope you wear a crash helmet when you sleep in the rental!

Comment by Eli
2009-01-15 00:18:46

Oh joy. One of my former classmates in Enschede just bought their home.

I am curious how the Netherlands will cope with their bubble. I hope to improve my Dutch listening skills to better follow the stories in time for all the excitement!

 
 
 
Comment by aNYCdj
2009-01-14 13:52:21

My vote for a 2009 theme song

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cA30Bh00_MA

 
Comment by mrktMaven
2009-01-14 14:09:21

SPX closed at 50 pct retrace level, 842.62. Amazing mumbo jumbo, no?

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-01-14 14:45:11

Radar Logic’s 1-day, 7-day and 28-day moving average prices per square foot all dropped below $200 for the first time at this (tail) end of the cycle as of 12-Nov-08:

Transaction Period End Date = 12-Nov-08

RPX.SD.1 RPX.SD.7 RPX.SD.28
$188.87 $193.01 $199.86

This is today’s data release, but it is reported with a 2-month lag, at least to non-paying customers like me. I expect it to keep dropping for the foreseeable future, as PPSF was in the low-$100K’s in early 2000, and even so, I know people who thought prices were overvalued at that time:

Trans Per End Date / RPX.SD.1 / RPX.SD.7 / RPX.SD.28
3-Jan-2000 $128.65 $130.14 $134.24

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-01-14 15:04:47

Sobering comments from a CEO who apparently lacks the motive to paint lipstick on the pig:

JPMorgan chief says 2009 will be bleak
By Francesco Guerrera in New York
Published: January 14 2009 18:48 | Last updated: January 14 2009 21:30

The US financial and economic crisis will worsen this year as hard-hit consumers default on credit cards and other loans, Jamie Dimon, chief executive of JPMorgan Chase, has predicted in an interview with the Financial Times.

EDITOR’S CHOICE
JPMorgan keen to exploit newfound edge - Jan-14

“The worst of the economic situation is not yet behind us. It looks as if it will continue to deteriorate for most of 2009,” said Mr Dimon. “In terms of our sector, we expect consumer loans and credit cards to continue to get worse.”

”When we look back at industry excesses in areas such as highly leveraged lending and securitisation, it is clear that some of these markets will never come back,” he said. “In the next few years, the industry will go back to basics: serving individual and corporate customers as best as we can.”

Comment by Darrell_in_PHX
2009-01-14 15:39:10

I think they are lobbying for more TARP money, with no strings attached.

Comment by clue
2009-01-14 16:51:35

BAC= Topo Gigio,

yes, strings are attached.

Comment by ann gogh
2009-01-14 18:14:08

Oh eddie!

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Comment by measton
2009-01-14 17:44:08

I think they are lobbying for more TARP money, with no strings attached.

I seem to remember the market tanking the last time they came hat in hand. It has to be passed quickly with no strings or the world will end.

I wrote my dim witted congresswoman again, reminding her that the banks did exactly what I said they would when they received their money. They gave it to the ceo, and investors via dividends, and purchased smaller banks. My guess is she votes exactly the same way.

 
 
 
Comment by mrktMaven
2009-01-14 15:13:34

Will Apple take a bite out of markets tomorrow?

Jan. 14 (Bloomberg) — Apple Inc. Chief Executive Officer Steve Jobs, who said this month that he is being treated for a nutritional ailment, will take a medical leave of absence through the end of June. The shares fell 10 percent.

Chief Operating Officer Tim Cook will take over Apple’s day-to-day operations….

Comment by vozworth
2009-01-14 18:18:04

I like Steve Jobs.

Appleites aint gonna take this well. Eighty dolla puts WAS in the money.

it was a kitchen sink news day…

 
 
Comment by mrktMaven
2009-01-14 15:15:15

U.S. may extend more aid to Bank of America in a bid to help it digest Merrill Lynch.

WSJ

Comment by packman
2009-01-14 15:26:00

Just a spoonful of sugar, nicely supplied by American Maid.

 
Comment by mrktMaven
2009-01-14 15:51:51

The discussion began in mid-December when Bank of America, already the recipient of $25 billion in federal rescue funds, told the U.S. Treasury Department it was unlikely to complete its purchase of the ailing Wall Street securities firm because of Merrill’s larger-than-expected losses in the fourth quarter, according to a person familiar with the talks.

Treasury, concerned the deal’s failure could affect the stability of U.S. financial markets, agreed to work with the Charlotte, N.C. lender on the “formulation of a plan” that includes new government capital. The terms are still being finalized, this person said, and details are expected to be announced with Bank of America’s fourth-quarter earnings, due out Jan. 20.

Any possible arrangement might protect Bank of America from losses on Merrill’s bad assets. There would be a cap on the amount of losses the bank would have to absorb with the federal government being on the hook for the remainder, according to one person familiar with the matter.

Comment by Darrell_in_PHX
2009-01-14 16:17:18

$300+ billion a quarter, from now until we get sick of it and let the depression begin, or until the full $7 trillion in coming losses are realized.

Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2009-01-14 17:35:22

You try explaining that to my good buddy, hoz who feels the “deleveraging is over”?

LOL

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Comment by hoz
2009-01-14 19:30:54

Hey I wasn’t here for you to pick on me! Not fair Faster.

The risk from derivative meltdown is gone.

There is only one investment or banking house to own, but not yet, that firm is Morgan Stanley. The rest of the banks in the US are toast including Government Sachs.

Banks are losing money the old fashioned way - bad loans.

 
Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2009-01-14 19:38:08

I disagree.

The derivatives meltdown has been transformed from a powder-keg to a slow drip-drip-drip bleed quarter-after-quarter like Japan.

If that’s your idea of a “fix”, you better not work in ER.

They are ALL losing money the ol’ fashioned way including MS. That’s a balance sheet I know all too well and I don’t share your optimism.

 
Comment by vozworth
2009-01-14 20:10:28

well I do share his optimism in Mitsubishi Morgan Stanley Soloman Smith Barney FJU. FIN.

I picked it up at Wall Street Mart, it’s on sale.

 
Comment by hoz
2009-01-14 20:21:00

Hey Vozzie

I sold my JGBs tonight boo hoo sob. A sad day for some very good friends. 10yr yield 1.22% (the correct yield with 0% inflation). I am a coward, but not that conservative.

I am a Nomura client so I will stay with them. I do like Mitsubishi bank and they really put the squeeze on Citigroup.

 
Comment by hoz
2009-01-14 20:46:24

For those that complain about low yielding bank CDs, a 1 yr CD in Mitsubishi in Japan yields 0.10% - that is the competitive rate.

Why borrow from TIBOR @ 0.72% when depositors flock to give you moneys at 0.1%?

 
 
 
 
 
Comment by sleepless_near_seattle
2009-01-14 16:26:41

U.S. loses another bid to jail Madoff

“Ellis said Manhattan federal prosecutors failed to prove Madoff is a danger to the public or a flight risk. In the end, Ellis said Madoff could stay at home so long as the “portable” valuables at his Manhattan home are inventoried, and all outgoing mail is inspected.”

I’m really beginning to wonder what dirt Madoff has on the people allowing him to stay out of jail. Unbelievable.

And why is he allowed outgoing mail? The only humans he should have access to are his lawyer and a few prison guards.

Comment by measton
2009-01-14 17:46:56

It boggles my mind that some of the people fleeced by this guy haven’t taken the law into their own hands. It’s clear there is no justice.

Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2009-01-14 18:02:28

Word has it he’s received several death threats. This is like catnip to the New York Post. They’ll all over the stories.

Also, that tarty Austrian banker-bee-yatch seems to have gone in hiding over threats by Russian oligarchs.

WHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!! This is the most fun we’ve had in a while.

I wanna see a gangsta-style slayin’, full-page spreads all over the Post with screaming boldface headlines full of exclamation marks.

Comment by Blano
2009-01-14 21:08:28

I think you’re gonna see the Austrian babe wash up along the shores of the Danube somewhere, someday.

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Comment by hoz
2009-01-14 19:19:34

It would not surprise me if Mr. Madoff never goes to jail. He will probably receive probation in exchange for throwing bankers and investment houses under the bus.

Comment by vozworth
2009-01-14 19:27:59

hmmm, the “role over on dudes that absconded with the money and they dont know where it went” defense.

Im thinking Vinney the thumbreakers Aunt whose cousin….

Comment by hoz
2009-01-14 19:35:05

My Uncle Vinnie might not take kindly to Mr. Madoff. I don’t know about thumbs. That seems a little to kind.

I have my own beliefs on the Madoff Ponzi Scheme which I literally am afraid to mention for fear it might be correct and I would be toast.

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Comment by SanFranciscoBayAreaGal
2009-01-14 20:49:02

Please share. I promise I won’t burn you. :)

 
Comment by hoz
2009-01-14 21:05:39

No. It is fodder for conspiracy theorists. There are enough nuts in the world.

I prefer to believe the official version: Mr. Madoff acted on his own and kept a Ponzi scheme going for more than a decade and nobody thought to question his profits because he was so talented and the SEC lost the complaints against him and all the depositors moneys vanished into the Land of Oz.

 
Comment by ahansen
2009-01-14 23:43:17

Don’t suppose it had anything to do with a certain middle yeastern lobby and oh, say, a propensity to over-react…?

 
 
 
 
 
Comment by Darrell_in_PHX
2009-01-14 16:29:01

More inflationary preasure?

“Gannett Co., Inc. said Wednesday that it would furlough most workers and executives for one week during the current quarter as the company grapples with a difficult economy and advertising climate.”

Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2009-01-14 18:18:38

Despondent people don’t pay back loans (or taxes, I might add.)

So there’s an exception to the “death and taxes” rule although “death” might have the final laugh on that particular one.

 
 
Comment by cactus
2009-01-14 16:46:10

Jan. 14 (Bloomberg) — Motorola Inc., the second-biggest U.S. seller of mobile phones, is cutting 4,000 more jobs as the economic slump erodes consumer spending.

About three-fourths of the cuts will come from its mobile devices unit, Schaumburg, Illinois-based Motorola said today in a statement. The reduction follows 3,000 cuts disclosed in October as the declining phone business leached profitability.

Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2009-01-14 17:39:49

That phone upgrade-every-six-month cycle is sooooooooooooooooo over.

But, like, you know, whatever. :-D

 
Comment by Darrell in PHX
2009-01-14 20:31:55

Done in by iPhone and Blackberry.

 
 
Comment by Muggy
2009-01-14 18:15:01

Banker and mortgage broker arrested for forcing woman to preform oral sex in order to obtain a loan.

tampabay.com/news/business/banking/article967516.ece

Comment by vozworth
2009-01-14 18:20:55

obviously we need more liquidity.

MORE SWAP LINES !!!!

Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2009-01-14 18:42:42

Well, they’re definitely swapping some liquidity there, wouldn’t you say?

Comment by vozworth
2009-01-14 18:44:33

GO AWAY BAITIN !!!

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Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2009-01-14 18:49:51

Awwwwwwwww, you just wanna be one of those loan granters, is all. :-D

 
Comment by vozworth
2009-01-14 19:20:31

all Im sayin is dont fall for the “teaser” rate.

cuz when you lock in a fixed rate, thats a hole different bathroom stall.

 
Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2009-01-14 19:33:40

ROTFLMAO

But I’m old enough to know the difference. ;-)

 
 
Comment by vozworth
2009-01-14 18:48:34

idiocracy know no bounds….

didja see APPL get polished off at 80?

here’s a southpark:

THEY’RE TAKIN OUR JOBS !!!!

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Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2009-01-14 19:21:33

I missed it, actually.

I went off to the movies. Oh well! Can’t have everything.

Good trade, BTW.

 
Comment by Darrell in PHX
2009-01-14 20:30:37

Dam goo backs… They’re takin’ our jawwwwwwwwwbs.

 
 
 
Comment by Muggy
2009-01-14 20:27:46

That’s no way to get ahead in life.

Comment by Professor Bear
2009-01-14 21:23:24

That lender figured out how to get some head, didn’t he?

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Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2009-01-14 18:25:53

Wonder if BoA PR had an oral statement about whether the car was a Hummer?

Comment by Muggy
2009-01-14 20:41:28

Dang, doesn’t she know it’s a bad time to buy a house?

 
 
Comment by Blano
2009-01-14 21:05:34

Further proof I picked the wrong career path.

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-01-14 21:21:05

Is this how a typical mortgage deal goes down these days?

Comment by Muggy
2009-01-14 21:42:51

“Is this how a typical mortgage deal goes down these days?”

Hey, at least she’s a verifiable person, and not dead, straw, or a homeless dude that was given some booze to sign.

The new paradigm continues…

 
 
 
Comment by hoz
2009-01-14 19:23:47

HYDERABAD, India (Reuters) - India’s fraud-hit Satyam Computer Services Ltd (Bombay:SATY.BO - News) named two audit firms on Wednesday to restate its results after being caught in the country’s biggest corporate scandal, threatening its survival.

KPMG and Deloitte will restate results prepared by Satyam’s previous auditor, the Indian unit of PricewaterhouseCoopers (PWC), which said its opinions on the outsourcing firm’s financial statements may be unreliable, given the revelations of fraud announced by Satyam’s founder and chairman Ramalinga Raju….”

“…Satyam’s previous auditor, the Indian unit of PricewaterhouseCoopers (PWC), which said its opinions on the outsourcing firm’s financial statements may be unreliable…”

That is an understatement. “may be unreliable” All Indian companies audited by PWC are now unreliable. I wish I could laugh like faster, I’ll try - BWAPAHAHABWAP.

 
Comment by hoz
2009-01-14 19:47:13

“…Despite strong evidence that capital flows and transactions by foreign buyers slowed significantly during 2008, offshore investors plan to boost investments by 73% over the next 12 months, according to the survey of the association’s 200 members, which hold a cumulative $1 trillion in real estate, more than 37% of it in the U.S. Foreign lenders, meanwhile, said they intend to step up financing of U.S. purchases by 58% this year, according to the survey….

Association members show “a growing confidence and interest” in U.S. real estate, said AFIRE Chief Executive Officer James Fetgatter, adding that their investment plans for the U.S. “resemble the flight to quality that is creating the demand for U.S. Treasuries.” The main question, of course, is whether buyers will get beyond kicking the tires and make a deal.

Overwhelmingly, AFIRE members pointed to the U.S. as the primary target for their real estate investment dollars — on average, 45% of their portfolio is invested in American property. In all, half of the top 10 global cities favored by foreign investors are in the U.S. this year. Other top cities include San Francisco, Los Angeles and Houston. Interestingly, half of the top 10 cities were in Asia last year — however, Tokyo and Shanghai ranked a distant fourth and fifth place in the most recent survey, garnering about half the votes of the top three….

# Respondents reported that finding attractive U.S. investment properties is becoming less difficult, with fewer than 20% describing it as “very difficult” — the lowest percentage holding that opinion in the last five years. In 2004, nearly 60% described it as very difficult.

# For the first time since 2002, when respondents said “finding attractive opportunities” was the greatest challenge to investing in the U.S., in 2008. Seven percent said attractive opportunities were very easy to find, with 18% describing it as “somewhat easy.”…
CoStar

 
Comment by jeff saturday
2009-01-14 19:48:48

Obama would spend bailout funds on housing crisis

By JIM KUHNHENN
Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON (AP) — President-elect Barack Obama would spend the remaining $350 billion of a financial bailout fund on expanded lending and reduced foreclosures and would not use the money to help other industries, lawmakers said Wednesday after discussions with Obama emissaries.

 
Comment by hoz
2009-01-14 19:55:06

There was 1 layoff announced in Wisconsin this week Wausau Paper will be closing down its Appleton Facility sometime this year moving to Brokaw, WI. Many states are reporting 1 0-5 mass actions.

Then there is California

Adobe Systems Inc. is laying off 75 employees at 601 Townsend St. in San Francisco on Feb. 3.
Advanced Medical Optics is laying off 61 employees at 510 Cottonwood Drive in Milpitas on Jan. 17.
Belkin International Inc. is laying off 84 employees at 501 West Walnut St. in Compton on Jan. 16.
Castaic Brick is laying off 77 employees at 32201 Castaic Brick in Castaic on Jan. 7.
Downey Ford is closing down and laying off 63 employees at 9500/9207 Lakewood Blvd. in Downey on Jan. 18.
Exelixis Inc. is laying off 76 employees at 249 East Grand Ave. in South San Francisco on Jan. 5.
Gregg Industries Inc. is laying off 81 employees at 10460 Hickson St. in El Monte on Feb. 11.
Health Research Association is laying off 79 employees at 1640 Marengo St., 7th Floor in Los Angeles on Jan. 30.
Irvine Regional Hospital and Medical Center is closing down and laying off 510 employees at 16200 Sand Canyon Ave. in Irvine on Jan. 15.
KLA-Tencor Corp. is laying off 153 employees at One Technology Drive in Milpitas and 81 employees at 160 Rio Robles in San Jose on Jan. 19.
Lam Research Corp. is laying off 149 employees at 4300-4650 Cushing Parkway in Fremont on Jan. 20.
Naked Juice Plant is closing down and laying off 52 employees at 533 West Foothills Blvd. in Glendora on Jan. 30.
National Semiconductor Corp. is laying off 151 employees at 2900 Semiconductor Drive in Santa Clara on Jan. 13.
Palm Inc. is laying off 107 employees at 950 W Maude Ave. in Sunnyvale on Jan. 19.
Pearson Ford is closing down and laying off 130 employees at 4300 El Cajon Blvd. in San Diego on Jan. 19.
Qualex Inc. is laying off 68 employees at 18250 Euclid St. in Fountain Valley on Jan. 16.
Riverside Cement Co. is laying off 84 employees at 19409 National Trail Hwy in Oro Grande on Jan. 30.
Seagate Technology LLC is closing down and laying off 43 employees at 155 & 195 S. Milpitas Blvd. & 311 Turquoise Drive in Milpitas on April 3.
Shutterfly Inc. is laying off 70 employees at 3157 Corporate Place in Hayward on Jan. 16.
Starwood Vacation Ownership Inc. is closing down and laying off 218 employees at 190 Carousel Mall in San Bernardino on Jan. 19.
Symantec is laying off 38 employees at 350 Ellis St. in Mountain View on Jan. 13.
Symantec is laying off 55 employees at 20330 Stevens Creek Blvd. in Cupertino on Jan. 19.
United Industries Corp. is closing down and laying off 50 employees at 4139 Bandini Road in Los Angeles on Jan. 15.
Vertis Communications is closing down and laying off 88 employees at 1345 Doolittle Drive in San Leandro on April 5.
Vishay Siliconix is laying off 97 employees at 2201 Laurelwood Road in Santa Clara on Feb. 6.

A few of these companies are in BK or undergoing reorganization and as a result these may not be true ‘out of work’ personnel. Some of these are verified with media reports.

 
Comment by cobaltblue
2009-01-14 21:23:39

Oh no, say it ain’t so, Joe!

Secret Agent Man star Patrick McGoohan dead at age 80.

(Maybe he couldn’t bear to live in a world without Ricardo Montalban, and his fine Corinthian leather,let alone no Chrysler Cordoba.)

McGoohan was the first made for TV James Bond type spy for the good guys . He was quite the ladies man with his 6′2″ good looks and British accent. He bore surprisingly little resemblence to his actor Dad, Mr. Magoo Han.

 
Comment by hoz
2009-01-14 21:37:17

San Diego RE from the CME

MAY09 140.00A —- UNCH 140.00

NOV12 145.00A —- UNCH 145.00

Few reasons I can fathom to buy a house in San Diego for 3 years. I would be afraid to put a bid in, I might get hit.

 
Comment by hoz
2009-01-14 21:49:48

Faster and option traders check out this options screen.

http://www.nse-india.com/marketinfo/fo/optionKeys.jsp?symbol=Nifty&instrument=-&date=-

What do you gentle folks think? less cluttered, more available info? Thoughts?

Options screen for the Indian Nifty delayed quotes.

 
Comment by hoz
2009-01-14 21:58:14

Ecuador default prompts first sovereign credit swaps auction
By Laura Mandaro
Last update: 1:48 p.m. EST Jan. 14, 2009
SAN FRANCISCO (MarketWatch) — Holders of credit protection on Ecuador debt lined up to get payouts from the sellers of credit-default swaps Wednesday, in the first auction held for sovereign-debt default since administrators Creditex and Markit started holding these auctions in 2005. The auction followed Ecuador’s decision last month to stop payments on a second set of bonds. The initial results indicated the debt was worth about 32.4 cents on the dollar, meaning that sellers of protection would have to pay about 68 cents per dollar to holders of this protection, Markit said”

I am sure I hold some Ecuador sovereigns in a fund. lol

What would the payout be on US Treasury debt defaulting? (Ecuador was in a weird position and this was an unusual case, but aren’t they all unusual.)

 
Comment by hoz
2009-01-14 22:08:02

From the Ethics exam finance

“(8) Imagine you are a Fund-of-Funds manager, and you have the good fortune to get in early on “great” manager who has demonstrated stable returns and who is so amicable and magnanimous that he doesn’t even charge management or performance fees despite his libor + 600 record. Even though you originally invested in good faith, you begin to suspect that all may not be as it seems. However, you get a 5% load on every new investment, and seemingly quite “real” management and performance fees of $182,000,000 PER YEAR. Yes, PER YEAR!!, for doing precious little. What is the best course of action for your suspicions?

(a) Never admit to suspecting anything. There is a statute of limitations and they won’t be able to take all of it from you.
(b) Act surprised. Make sure you’ve the BEST lawyer on retainer.
(c) Payout as much as possible to family and friends as payroll for work undertaken. It will be hard to get that back.
(d) Kill the Golden Goose, and insure, at least, you won’t go to the Big House.
(e) Seppuku with one of the samurai swords you’ve been collecting.”
Cassandra

The questions about how you treat your MIL’s investments is cruel - but true.

Comment by Faster Pussycat, Sell Sell
2009-01-14 23:34:28

And you are surprised because?

How old are you? Twelve?!?

 
Comment by Darrell in PHX
2009-01-15 06:02:11

I’d have to go with a. Willfull ignorance is a beautiful thing.

 
 
Comment by vozworth
2009-01-15 07:52:19

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7827708.stm

there ya go hoz, riots in Riga….. they do it a whole lot better than the Icelandic riots.

 
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