There Is No Recession In Rancho Palos Verdes
by ahansen
Last weekend I attended my 40-year high school class reunion in Palos Verdes, CA. As someone who would prefer sticking hot needles into my eyes over making cocktail chitchat, the whole thing was doubly horrifying for me. Not only had forty years disappeared like…that!, here I was voluntarily subjecting myself to the very experience I’d spent the last forty years trying to repress.
But unlike other reunions I’ve attended over the years—and as a dedicated party crasher, I’ve attended my fair share– this was a surprisingly low-key affair. The “nip and tuck” quotient was way below what one would have expected for the locale, there was a complete dearth of blingy jewelry and designers duds. Even the makeup was muted– and the footwear sensible. (More than one set of well-groomed feet sported flipflops.)
What was going on here?! These were the grownup children of privilege, many of whom were now living in one of the most affluent zip codes in the country. Two years ago, this gathering would have had a glam factor to rival anything Hollywood could conjure up. But this gang looked like your typical Saturday afternoon-at-CostCo crowd—albeit slimmer, and with better hair.
Ever the conscientious HBBer, I decided to use the opportunity to pick the brains of my former classmates for information I could pass on to the blog. And here’s what I discovered:
There is no recession in Rancho Palos Verdes. I got this straight from the sources. Early on, “GL” realized he had no particular talent as the securities salesman he’d trained to become, but simultaneously discovered his true calling as a bond trader. Over the years he parlayed this gift into a very comfortable life for himself and his clients—many of whom are his neighbors in RPV. Now that the market is, in his word, “whacked,” he’s about to retire and “just play around with it.” He paid off his mortgages several years ago and works out of his homes. “ No recession here,” he says.
Three years ago, “JP” sold the RE brokerage she’d inherited from her father, and moved her family to a lesser-known ski resort to live. She doesn’t see any recession there either, as “All the folks in my community are pretty well set, and house their own help.”
“RL” is the head of a biological research concern. “Lots of grant money coming in from DOE,” was his observation. “We’re hiring like crazy again.”
There was some dispirited grumbling however, from those directing charitable foundations. I shared early-morning Bloodies with “FF” and “ES”—both of whom lamented the curtailment of public arts programs. “The arts are always the first to go, it seems. Such a terrible assumption—people need the arts in hard times.” And, “Fortunately, we’re charged with distribution, rather than solicitation of funding.” (Read: the family money is intact.)
Classmate after classmate –at least the ones who had been fortunate enough to remain on the hill where they grew up– told me that all was well. Mortgages were few or well under control (presumably one more advantage of having inherited the family homestead.) I felt like smacking them.
Then I remembered how frugal had been many of our upbringings. Our parents had weathered the Great Depression, remember, and a goodly number were surviving the aerospace lay-offs of the late ‘60’s. Despite the outward appearance of affluence, a lot of hamburger was consumed on “The Hill” in those days, and a lot of clothing was recycled down through the siblings. Yes, we were ridiculously privileged, and no, no one starved there, but most of my friends had family gardens, and those who didn’t keep chickens, had the local peacocks to wake them up at 5 AM. I also know for a fact that my mother wasn’t the only one in PV who had a “store room” where in addition to her sewing supplies and gift wrapping materials, she kept years worth of empty glass jars, giveaway cups, and plastic cutlery–just in case. Economic survival was bred in our blood.
As I looked around the marina ballroom (which had been converted into a 1960’s beach party, complete with band, sand, beach chairs and 12’ flaming tiki heads, I first thought of Ben, (and quaffed a rum drink in his honor,) and then was hit with an epiphany. Those of us who had made it to the reunion were the ones, who unlike our peers in other wealthy communities of the day, (Beverly Hills comes to mind,) had no real preoccupation with social status or standing. (There was no stratification to speak of, so it wasn’t necessary.) Kids in our class generally didn’t vie to have the hottest cars or the coolest accessories…if anything, we proto-hippies disdained them. We were the children of a meritocracy, not an aristocracy, and perhaps that attitude, even more than our actual money, was what helped us survive these last few years of economic disaster with our finances (reasonably,) intact.
Fresh from these musings, this weekend I attended our local team penning event here in East Nowhere, CA. A once-a-year fundraiser for our little mountain school, it’s an excuse for us crusty reclusive types to get out, pick off the fleas, say hi to each other, and eat about a ton of dust kicked up by long-suffering arena cows and the horses who torment them. Also to eat BBQ and drink Bloody Marys at 10:30 in the morning while watching said cattle being tormented. (Disclaimer: I seldom drink either Bloody Marys or in the morning–or torment cattle, for that matter. Perhaps these last two weekends were not coincident.)
As I asked after my various neighbors, most of whom are just as impoverished and unconcerned-about-it as I, I realized that here too, in one of the poorest zip codes in the country, there ain’t no recession neither. It’s just our Normal.
Folks up here have lived in privation for so long –digging our own water, generating our own power, cutting our own roads, no cell reception, no grocery store or gas station for 40 miles—that the current mess hasn’t affected our lifestyles one iota. We’re used to doing without. With no investments to speak of, we haven’t had to suffer through the shock of losing them. Our trucks and cars turn to POS the instant they hit the local roads. And if you barter pretty much everything you need, not having a shopping center nearby isn’t all that much of an inconvenience.
We have our own supply networks (my wife’s cousin’s brother-in-law can get that for you,) and Twin Oaks Mall (the local dump, where unwanted-but-still-useful goods are set out next to the dumpsters, awaiting a new home.) Old furniture and ranch implements, for example, are frequently recycled multiple times before defying that one last patch job. On at least one occasion, I’ve come across one of my previous years’ discards again sitting among the items-for-the-taking on the tarmac.
Legitimate business up here is scarce as hens’ teeth, and the few enterprises that do occasionally pop up are hounded out of existence by County regulators, so our underground economy is both extensive and thriving. Checks? Credit cards? You’ve got to be kidding. Half the town doesn’t even have a bank account. And hoarding? It’s what we do in our “spare” time.
Any government money that dribbles down into this community is so dilute as to be negligible. (Which is not to say that a good percentage of us living hereabouts don’t get a government check in some form every month.) But stimulus money? Car subsidies? Loan rewrites? Even in the heyday of the housing bubble boom, no bank was reckless enough to loan any of us any money. After all, you can’t attach SSI disability payments, and who wants title on a weather-beaten 40-year-old doublewide with a non-compliant plyboard “addition?”
So it seems to me that the best way to ride out the “recession” or whatever name it’s going by these days, may be to either live like a poor country slob, or actually be a poor country slob, because as far as I can tell, they’re the only ones not being hit hard in the teeth (or the retirement account,) by the all the changes we’re going through in These Troubled Times.
Geez, where is the angst, the pathos, the deep human suffering that’s usually the focus of “first person” stories? Where is the close-up of the tear stained cheeks? C’mon give me something I can sink my green teeth into!! I paid good money for this and I want my…… stuff.
My apologies, Bloodies. With all the terrible happenings of late, sometimes I forget the human side of my stories.
You want tragedy and sacrifice? I’ll give you tragedy and sacrifice.
“JS” had to sell his chocolate factory and make do with the family vineyards. Then let go his relief driver!
Icky! You have green teeth!?
Do you mean ‘algae-laden-haven’t-brushed-for-two-months’ teeth or do you mean ‘I-love-trees-’ green teeth?
According to DataQuick, the price of PV homes is up by 7.6% year-over-year. But I still have not heard a good answer on my question of whether DataQuick is failing to filter out homes that were taken back by the bank without selling. I’m also guessing a total of 32 PV homes selling is a bit lowish by historical standards?
Any thoughts?
From DataQuick:
Community / Zip Code / SFRs sold / Median Sale Price / YOY Change / Condos sold / Median Sale Price / YOY Change / Median SFR Price per Sq Ft
Palos Verdes Pen. 90274 23 $1,502 7.6% 9 $539 -25.1% $521
failing to filter out homes that were taken back by the bank..
How would they do it? Can anyone know if John Doe LLC is the lender or just a buyer taking the plunge..
Seems like it would require a bit of hands-on work if one wants to produce complete and accurate data.
Abracadabra. Alakazam.
They would have to request the data be provided in a way to allow separating actual sales from bank repossessions. A column of 0s and 1s added to the list is all it would take…
When I look at dqnews I find RPV right around $1M and down 10% in July YOY. (I don’t know the difference between PVP and RPV, maybe that’s the problem?)
Nothing wrong with an old country folk (or as you look call them “slobs”). Both of my grandparents were farmers and had their modest house paid for, with 100 acres of good farmland which has small lakes/streams. They lived a relatively worry free life with the occasional trip to the Piggly Wiggly for grocery items. Yeah it was hard physical labor, but they werent obese and strapped in a cube either.
I bet they are both laughing in their grave at you dumb suckers in your fat mortgage McMansions no postage stamp lots.
Thank god I still got the farm -
“He who goes a-borrowin goes a-sorrowin” - Ben Franklin
Monte, I couldn’t agree with you more.
And I apologize for my mis-characterization of myself as a slob. What I meant to call myself was a “hick.”
Thank god I still got the farm ??
So you inherited the farm ??
Po folk get all the freebies in CA. I have very educated friends who love that they qualify for the free health care and such.
My apologies if this is a re-post, CCD,
As your friends may discover, there is a difference between “qualifying” and actually receiving anything–especially in CA these days. MediCal, for example, is a (pardon me,) sick joke.
What I’m seeing emerge here is a stratification. There is the official, government-run economy with its salaries and services, its pensions and benefits, its commodities and marketplaces and its price structures….
Then there is the REAL one.
My buddy just got a free vasectomy. They dont want the po folk breeding.
Your buddy has connections.
Well, not anymore.
Well, look at your buddy, wouldn’t you want him stopped before reproducing? lol
My buddy just got a free vasectomy. They dont want the po folk breeding.
What, like ‘they’ held him down and vasectomized him? Isn’t that a voluntary procedure?
(usually?)
Gee Monte, sure is a good thing your parent’s parents weren’t trying to make a go of farming during the Great Depression. Sounds like they fell into good circumstances, and you’re so awesome to have inherited the fruits of their labor. One of the greatest things about this blog are all the people who have always had so much money, and therefore have never needed debt.
Thank goodness you’re always here to let people know what jerks they actually are.
“One of the greatest things about this blog are all the people who have always had so much money, and therefore have never needed debt.”
A fair point, Big V. You’re probably a handful for your husband, BTW.
I bet they are both laughing in their grave at you dumb suckers in your fat mortgage McMansions no postage stamp lots.
Shoots, I’m not even in my grave and IIIII’m laughing at FB’s in McMansions on postage stamp lots.
Great post ahansen. It says a lot. The bad thing is, what happens at the end for so many people?
“The bad thing is, what happens at the end for so many people?”
I took the bus into town today. One of the stops is in front of one of the university’s sorority houses. All those sorority sisters got on with their cell phones and ear sets. They didn’t have a clue as to what was going on economically. I sort of feel sorry for them when the SHTF, because they won’t know how to handle being poor, after experiencing only their pseudo-affluent lifestyles.
So anyone who has a cell phone and an “ear set” ( do you mean a bluetooth?) is clueless about the economy. Not that you’re stereotyping or anything. Or are you using the old dumb sorority girl stereotype?
So anyone who has a cell phone and an “ear set” ( do you mean a bluetooth?)
There’s a country song in there somewhere, crying to get out.
I’d rather have a fridge full of beer,
than a bluetooth in my ear,
LOL lavi.
Love it, Lavi!
“Are you using the old dumb sorority girl stereotype?”
I’m going by what’s been happening lately concerning our local buses. The buses are fare free, subsidized by both the town and the university. This particular sorority has petitioned the university to end its subsity, because they don’t want to ride the bus with all those “scary people” (meaning the unemployed, the one’s barely making it, etc.)
And how does the petition prove they will be poor in the future again? Or that they don’t know anything about the economy?
And yes most people who ride buses are undesirable. Not exactly a newsflash. It’s not unreasonable for 19 year old college women to want a bus free of homeless people who ride the bus in the summer for the A/C and in the winter for the heat. And yes that does happen.
My bus observations were that many were working poor. In other words to many people were trying hard to get by job to job, a few homeless, but mostly just working poor.
“And yes most people who ride buses are undesirable.”
Gosh Eddie, and you accuse ME of stereotyping. Surely you’ve heard the saying “People who live in glass houses…”
I agree with you Doug, but just to make a general statement, I am not too good to ride a bus under any circumstances. (public transit). I remember a time I was very grateful for the bus route, and told the lady driver thank you everytime.
“scary people” meaning the unemployed, the one’s barely making it, etc.)
I rode the bus a lot in college and just being unemployed or barely making it doesn’t make you ’scary’. Getting up and moving from your seat in order to sit near the college girl and staring with rapt, burning, greedy, unblinking eyes while licking your lips and starting to slobber slightly—that is what makes you a ’scary person’ to college girls.
Let’s get our terms right, here, is all I’m sayin’.
…Ah, nostalgia…
Well, you weren’t stereotyping, you were predicting that these girls would be poor based on nothing other than the fact they had a cell phone.
I stated a fact that people who ride the bus tend to be of an undesirable state. At least undesirable as defined by the Gamma Delta Betas and myself.
I will grant you that in small college towns, the undesirability factor is less so than in large urban centers and I failed to take that into account. But I live in a big city and my immediate thought of someone who rides the bus is uber undesirable.
I stated a fact that people who ride the bus tend to be of an undesirable state.
Uber undesirable. Are you kidding?
Man you need help with your idea of Facts.
Someone is an elitist around here.. guess whoooooooo?
Only 1 guess.
Oly,
What you describe would be scary. I’m only talking appearance and accents (”redneck talk”). Other than that everybody on the bus minds his/her beeswax (the drivers are quick to send obnoxious people packing, and won’t let them ride the bus anymore).
Eddie, you’re right. I’m talking about small-town transit and not big-city transit. I realize there is a world of difference between your bus experiences and mine. Believe it or not, I live in a place where you can walk around at night by yourself and not worry about putting your life in your own hands (even when you see one of those “scary people” coming toward you.)
Oly,
What you describe would be scary.
It was scary. I was a country-girl rube from the remote hinterlands, too, and was raised to always be polite to my elders, no matter what, so it was a rush-learning experience for me, because all those unseemly eager hot-eyed homeless people were my elders.
I was given no skills whatsoever to deal with the world outside of ‘Crazy-Fundamentalist-Mormon-Land’
Sigh.
I got older pretty fast, though, and with nothing the worse for the wear.
the drivers are quick to send obnoxious people packing, and won’t let them ride the bus anymore
What a pretty thought…
I learned to run for the back of the bus, where the drivers couldn’t join the hordes of other staring slobbering persons, because he would have driven off the road and rolled the bus and gotten fired.
At 19 I rode Boston subway and bus to work with no sense that it was scary, despite my having grown up in a more affluent suburban environment further down the east coast. Maybe that was then (mid 60’s), this is now? Took my vacation in Guatemala/ElSalvador, where I was too distracted by the goats and chickens on the bus to worry about the scary people, and in a way, was too naive to be scared.
I would not want to ride the loser cruiser either.
Fine I’m elitist because I don’t want to sit next to vagrants while getting from point a to point b on a city bus. You’ve exposed me.
Eddie, when was the last time you were surrounded by youth?
Many haven’t a clue. Ask around.
And V, I dont’ think he thinks middle class young women are going to succumb and be unable to weather the storm any more than young men, but seriously, having been around many teens/young 20s.. so many are Entitled and clueless about many things.
I correct myself. I know this before last year. Maybe now since the last election more youth are awake.
They are still asleep. Just folloeing another Pied Piper of Chicago.
I’m in my early 30s so I was one of them there youths not too long ago. If anything, I find older people, 50+ to be the most clueless about things. Young people know what’s going on. They may not spend every waking hour worrying about the issues of the world, but they’re not as dumb as you think.
Boomers on the other hand….in their own little world convinced their 401k account will magically grow from $12,500 to the $1.2M they need to retire comfortably simply by clicking their red heals 3 times.
Question: Of the 19 year old or 49 year old, who is more likely to be upside down on a mortgage, about to foreclose, to have bought 3 condos in Miami and to have voted for politican after politician who on a regular basis destroyed this country by overspending and encouraging over consumption?
Eddie, to be fair, a 19 year old hasn’t really had much of a chance to do all those things yet . . . a 7-year old definitely hasn’t done any of those things, so probably a 7-year-old is superior to everyone . . . after all, of the 7-year-old and the 19 year old, who is more likely to have cheated on a test, gotten someone else pregnant, driven drunk, and taken illegal drugs?
I know and I was being somewhat facetious in the comparison. But my point still stands. For all the supposed wisdom “older” people have, they sure do act like fools a lot.
What makes you think that all the middle-class female college graduates are going to be poor?
Experience and extrapolation of current trends.
What’s the possibility of only the affluent, comfortable set showing up at your reunion?
I always thought you were female, btw. Why the heck did I think that?
“…only the affluent, comfortable set showing up…?”
That was kind of the point, buyer. And we women get fleas, too. What are ya, some kind a sexist?
Just confused because of this:
We have our own supply networks (my wife’s cousin’s brother-in-law can get that for you,).
Nope, not a sexist, racist or any other -ist. Nothing against gays either. So apologies if I trod on toes. Like I said, just confused.
Oh, buyer–I know you’re not “sexist” (whatever that means….) Sometimes my linguistic nuance doesn’t translate too well into pixel.
For the record, I have neither a wife nor brother-in-law. Just writing in hypothetical third person without benefit of italics.
And it’s pretty hard to tread upon me in print, though many have tried.
my wife’s cousin’s brother-in-law can get that for you,
Ahansen comes out of the closet on Ben’s Blog!
Film at 11. Or now, if you have the You Tube.
You beat me to it, ahansen. I was gonna say it, yep. (Well not the woman gig)!
I got fleas though!
P.S. Oly and Shorty gave em’ to me!
This may be a double post, if so, apologies.
You wrote: We have our own supply networks (my wife’s cousin’s brother-in-law can get that for you,) hence my confusion.
Not sexist, racist, nothing against gays. Just was confused and nope, I’m not owed any explanation. Sorry!
Tried to respond to you twice, but my response must have been ‘moderated’.
“We have our own supply networks (my wife’s cousin’s brother-in-law can get that for you,) ” this was what threw me though.
Apologies, nothing intended by my comment. I’m a ‘nice’ person, honest…………………:-)
“And we women get fleas, too.”
Well if you would quit dancing with bears you might avoid some of the fleas!
PS I would describe you as neither a slob nor a hick. Simply a classy lady with a steel frame under her skin.
I agree 100% RE Bear.
At this point, Bear, it’s more titanium than steel….
That was kind of the point, buyer. And we women get fleas, too. What are ya, some kind a sexist?
Or even worse, some kind of insect-ist?
*gasp of outrage *
Funny. Oly, when I was a baby (8), I saw a sign in “Watson’s Drug Store” . Big deal in Greenville, Il., Watson’s Drug Store, It said “Dance to the music of the Insects”, 8:00 p.m. tonight! Or whatever.
Well, I just saw the Beatles a couple years earlier, and was going through withdrawal.
So.
I went to the “house” where the “Insects” were playing, and was the only person who showed up. Also, I got bit by Ding Bat’s dog. (He played lead guitar). Bad gig too, I might add…
Also, I got bit by Ding Bat’s dog.
I’m sorry to say it, but this made me laugh.
“Dance to the music of the Insects”, 8:00 p.m. tonight! Or whatever.
Nohow! IIIII often Dance to the Music of the Insects! After 8 p.m. or whatever! One of my favorite groups!
Only they’re real insects, and they come with darting bats and busted-pallet bonfires and skipping through the woods and stuff.
Oh, if only I had a dog handy to bite random participants.
*makes note to self on post-it *
One of the most exclusive streets down the Peninsula in San Mateo county is called “Alameda de las Pulgas”. Rough translation: “avenue of the fleas”.
How do you know these things?
OMG!
I used to drive down that road just so I could say it to my girlfriend in my best Ricardo Montalban imitation. It ends in San Mateo by the library.
We have our own supply networks (my wife’s cousin’s brother-in-law can get that for you,)
It is a way to describe the connection to getting ‘help’.
Example “i know this for sure because I heard it from joe who is married to jill, who’s brother’s ex’s sil from 1st marriage, and who’s 4th cousin removed by whatever”.. and the list goes on, but in the case of barter, and living in the back country, it helps quite a bit to know that someone somewhere can help or have what you need to fix the widget.
I just walk up to people at the Island Market while I’m pumping gas or getting a gallon of 2% milk and I say, ‘Do you want about 20 clumps of daylilies I just rescued, because my garden is full?’ Or I say: ‘Do you want 15 pounds of onions left over from a fund-raiser, because I can only eat the 30 pounds?” Or: ‘What are you doing with that big pile of wood scraps/wheelbarrow/mound of paint-cans in exciting colors?’
That way I don’t have to spend time getting to know anyone, but I still often get to dispense and/or receive useful items.
took her literally, didn’t I?……………………………..:-)
Well I’ve had 3 HS reunions cancel this year and 2 more are iffy out of 8 i had booked….$100 a ticket aint cheap…(they will combine the classes next year but i am still out the $$ this year)
ahansen…how much were your tickets?
——————————–
What’s the possibility of only the affluent, comfortable set showing up at your reunion?
Tix were purposely kept on the low side in case that was a consideration, but when you consider travel expenses, (folks came back from all over the planet,) hotel bills, food and drink, etc. the $75 to cover hors d’ouvres and administrative expenses was not really a factor. Most of the events were free anyway, with costs subsidized by donations. The whole theme was laid-back surfer chic–with dress code to match.
We had a beach party with some of our more illustrious alums providing musical entertainment one night. A harbor-front pub-crawl hosted by our own latter-day Dashiell Hammet, a no-host cocktail reception at a local hotel for drop-ins, and a bring-your-own picnic on the old school grounds the last afternoon. Sure beat the evening gowns at the kountry klub silliness you usually see at these things.
That sounds like an awesome reunion, ahansen.
Yar! Double what CA renter said.
I think it sounds great, too, hansey. I hope you fell upon your old pals with glad cries of joy and reunion, and I also hope that everyone you didn’t like now weighs 500 pounds and/or is in jail.
There’s nothing funnier than that, and I would sure as fo*ok know. Hahahaahah!
…and I also hope that everyone you didn’t like now weighs 500 pounds and/or is in jail.
And not just in jail for any ol’ crime, mind. I mean, in jail for shoplifting a tube of hemorrhoid cream from the Dollar Store, or else a bag of Twinkies or else something else of sterling amusement-factor like that.
A funny thing that I could, and would, and will trumpet to the whole world with my bugle-like klaxon lungs.
Alas, the most scandalous thing any of us did, apparently, was vote for a…(shudder,) Democrat…!
Didn’t go last yr when gas was over $4.00 gal and event was $80.00.
Decided, like ahansen was thinking, not to go as the majority weren’t who I wanted to see, now or then. Sometimes curiosity gets the better of us. Got a mini one coming up in Oct-closer and free but thinking…maybe not so much.
We skipped all reunions. Husband didn’t care about his. We moved my senior year and I had no close friends among my classmates.
I went to my 10 year HS reunion. I was sore amazed by how much some people had changed. Some looked pretty much the same, and some looked like 50+ year-old hookers, and not in a good way, neither. ‘Course, this is in southern Utarr, where the sun is deeply unkind to whitey. Sheesh! Melanoma, let’s go to the dance…
One of the things I like so much about where I live now is that mostly people are perfectly okay with looking like how they are naturally, without prodding and padding and injections and 500$ jeans and so forth. I don’t know ANYONE who peroxides their hair to a parched looking ‘chicken-little’ yellow, or has a boob job, or has a life-time membership to two tanning salons.
Of course, I’m quite picky about my friends, but still.
There’s just not as many superficial Suzanne types running around in black Tahoes or Durangos as there were in Utarr. They exist here, but they mostly cluster in McSubdivisons over in Lacey, or they move up to Tacoma, or go somewhere else. Perhaps because when they walk around hereabouts it’s no fun for them—they get pitying looks and kindly strangers offer to give them directions to where they really want to go.
Well, my tongue’s firmly in cheek on this piece, Prof, but your figures are intriguing.
I’m guessing the peninsula is pretty well built up after all these years and there really ISN’T a lot of new land being made there. Much of the acreage is geologically unstable, tightly zoned, or just hugely expensive, and the existing houses are custom and built to last. (Read: not many tract houses.) Folks tend not to just “come and go” there, as it’s an old, exclusive, and very stable community. Flipping is possible (I’ve built a spec house or two there myself,) but it tends to be an HOA-run place with significant “entry” requirements.
But still, only 32 homes?
I would venture to say San Marino might be similar to PV and possibly Montecito, CA? Although they are not on a bluff where that land crumples away on the edges ie: doesn’t grow anymore!
SanM $1.5M up 11% July YOY.
Well, here on the Space Coast in Fla we are getting hid hard in the nose by the recession. Florida is built on subsidized everything. Our mortgages are guaranteed by the FHA and bought up by Freddie & Fannie. Our homeowners insurance is subsidized by the Great State of Florida. Our economy is built on NASA and defense spending. Without big gov, we’d just be a hellish, mosquito infested backwater, similar in many ways to Honduras.
And we hate taxes and vote solidly Republican. And, by God, the Libertarian wing. The Space Shuttle goes away next year and 16,000 engineers are about to lose their jobs. Of course, those are the only non-minimum wage jobs for 1000 miles in any direction.
And I don’t want any stinkin’ death panels killin’ my grandma, cause we need that Medicare money in the community. Hmmm… gotta leave work and see if my kid is now a red commie after watching the colored fella on TV at school.
Wow Jon, I lived down in Tampa area circa 2003-2007. It was actually nice, but…
Now, from what I have heard from my friends down there, it has all gone to the dumpster.
New Port Richey, Spring Hill, (where I bought, remodeled, and sold a couple modest properties at a little profit), Hillsborough County, Pinellas County, Hernando County, in trouble.
Thanks for the post.
ATE
Tell it like it is Jon…
At least you still have internet access from your local library, it looks like.
Of course. Internet access through the Library is the only real purpose of government.
This is so disgraceful in America…….the amount of innovation and useful products the space program has brought us, coupled with putting 16,000 of the best minds to work, to be laid off so we can use the money to modify mortgages….what kind of monsters would do such a thing?
————————————————————
The Space Shuttle goes away next year and 16,000 engineers are about to lose their jobs.
16,000 of the
bestSmart mindsyeah like not going to the moon ..and that 60M$ dune buggy
http://judicial-inc.biz/AMIA_Argentina.htm
2:07min
dam dem dar librulls…. un whars dat birf sertafikit? god dam dem no good muslum luvin turrist librulls. dey alwayz pissin all over da flag.
pardun me. i gotta go wipe muh behind wid da constatooshun.
My only thoughts on surviving a recession are to generally live well within your means. As the finance folks say, don’t get caught naked when the tide goes out.
Most folks have been stripped naked over the past decade by declining wages and the increasing cost of living. It’s even harder to live within ones means when you have none. Zero income really has its way with the budget.
Hi Grizzly
Zero reliable income was THE motivating factor in me moving out of the city and into an unpopulated backwater I could actually afford. For 10% down and what it had cost me to board my two horses in Malibu every month, I was able to buy a tight little house on a viable ranch up here in the Piutes and start planting gardens and fruit trees “for later.” Sixteen years and an amazing collection of calluses and broken parts later, I’m still broke, but pretty well fed! When there’s nothing around to buy, it’s a lot easier not to spend money you don’t have– and just make do.
You’re an amazing woman ahansen. I mean it.
Amazing person.
Strong survivor and thriver!
I think it is still too early to draw any conclusions.
I have several friends that have been out of work for almost a year now and are living off of unemployment and credit cards. The way they spend, you would never know they didn’t have jobs.
Take it from someone on unemployment — they may be unemployed for a long, long time. Its looking dire out there!
potential, I am sorry to hear that. Keep a positive outlook. I am in the same boat.
Ya Bud,
ATE
And most of the people I know are making less now then they were or have less hours. This recession has legs.
Yes Central, yes.
Thanks ATE, much appreciated!
I have had recruiters / HR call me a couple of times, they ask what I salary I’m looking for. My response is “I can tell you what my last salary was” because I’m clueless as to what they want me to say. A couple of times, they have not followed through. So I suspect I’m now going to have to take a $10-15k hit if I want interviews.
Yeah, I haven’t even started looking yet. But, the other attorney who was partner left for the same reason, then I took on his load, and the same crap continued. I have no idea what is going to happen, where I will be, or what profession I will be in.
Plus, I was a pretty good litigation attorney, according to my peers.
You and me both Hang In There, OK?
I wish you guys the very best in your job hunt.
We know a number (majority of our friends?) who have either lost their jobs or had pay/benefit reductions. This includes people in the public sector, BTW.
As was said before, people are perhaps finding new jobs, but in every case we’re aware of, they’ve taken a pay cut to get that new job.
Some, who were confident they’d find a new job quickly (well-qualified, higher-end, PhD-types) are still looking for **anything** many, many months later. It is very discouraging.
“I suspect I’m now going to have to take a $10-15k hit if I want interviews”
I would suggest grabbing whatever related job you can, now, even at a lesser salary. It will be much easier to maneuver back to where you want to be once you’re in, instead of pressing the nose to the glass outside. The longer you stay outside, the harder it will be to get in.
I was unemployed for a long time during the last recession, and my lesson learned was, be flexible and humble in order to get a foot in the door - it’s much harder to get hired than to upgrade once in. Good people are always in demand, but in order to show them how good you are, you have to get in first.
Good luck!
Thank you both CA renter and NYchk. I have learned friends are invaluable.
It is rough. Husband has a few days of work scheduled that will help out some.
The way they spend, you would never know they didn’t have jobs.
skroodle,
This is what is confusing me as well. I know a few people just like that as well. To see the way they continue spending and go out to eat every chance they get, you wonder if they really have any idea that credit card debt is something that you have to pay off. The amounts on your cards, plus interest (higher these days) , should be decremented against any real “savings” that anyone acquires.
Malls here in Northern VA are still packed weekends etc. I know people are buying less, but they are still out there bags in hand feeding at the trough.
Myself, I was priced out of the home market here, thankfully I am not stuck in an upside down situation, but I am sending in my last payment for my car (bought used low rate loan from credit union) and will again be debt free.
I am still amazed at the credit card balances they carry. I couldn’t sleep at night.
NOVA has a lot of sweet, sweet defense contract jobs. I spent a short stint in McLean this summer working on a project for a defense contractor. I was amazed at the money flowing through the place. I knew that there was money in the “make things go boom” business. But I didn’t think it was THAT much money. And recession or no recession, that’s never going away.
I have several friends that have been out of work for almost a year now and are living off of unemployment and credit cards. The way they spend, you would never know they didn’t have jobs.
Why would they curtail their spending… they get a government check every week and still have access to revolving credit. When credit is no longer available, they will just file bankruptcy and have the debt repudiated. It is morally reprehensible to me, but this is the system we live in.
As an additional anecdote to the corrupt system we find ourselves in, a good friend of my father who owns a landscaping/lawn maintenance company had more than half his crew ask to be laid off… when asked why, the reason provided was: “We’re working too hard for too little money and we can collect unemployment for a year.” At what point does the Social Safety Net become a contributor to Moral Hazard?
Great post as always ahansen. Your posts always get people thinking.
Your class reunion story caused an anecdote of my own to pop into mind. Recently we were at a dinner party. Very nice people. Everyone was in a good mood. Nice summers. Plans coming together for college students, doctor’s vacation trips for African aid, travel sports teams. Talk turned to the hosts’ home and how it was larger than they had planned to buy but their out of state home had sold in 3 days, they had a weekend to chose and they liked it. Listening to the story you’d think all had worked out well.
Except another family member had previously shared with us the horrible money fights that had been going in their home. There are details that people don’t share unless they have to, and we have all gotten quite skilled at wearing the mask. That would not be the first time I’ve been priveledged to watch friends spin an all is well cover when I knew the real story.
OTOH, I visited a family recently that I hadn’t seen since before summer. The soon to be 3rd grader was sporting an i-pod touch. I asked if he’d gotten it for his birthday. Yes, he got the i-pod and each of his siblings, the 6th grader, the 8th grader, the 10th grader and the Mom had each gotten new laptops. When I expressed at home I thought there didn’t appear to be much fear of recession, my children told me of their 4th grade friend who had just gotten his own personal laptop. I don’t know. Somehow that just doesn’t feel like cutting back to me.
“So it seems to me that the best way to ride out the “recession” or whatever name it’s going by these days, may be to either live like a poor country slob, or actually be a poor country slob…”
This is only possible for those lucky enough to have inherited land from their family, or rich enough to pay for the overpriced dirt. Most folks are not so fortunate, and will be spending the majority of their paltry pay on some overpriced, dumpy rental- or hitting up family, friends, or the local homeless shelter when they lose their job.
Land is quite cheap in the boonies. The real boonies, not the areas right around larger cities. There are just no jobs there. But if you’re willing to live a subsistence/barter lifestyle, like ahansen seems to be describing, it’s there.
We’re most certainly talking about different states. I don’t call $50,000 per acre cheap.
Thank you for another great read, AHansen.
“The arts are always the first to go, it seems. Such a terrible assumption—people need the arts in hard times.”
Art is alive and well, BTW. Folks just aren’t paying for it anymore. This Saturday I plan to take my DD to an “art show” in our town square, which is right down the street from our farmers market. It will be an enjoyable morning, and practically cost-free (assuming I can resist the delicious muffins sold at the market).
This article reminds me of the old saying…
“The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn’t exist.”
If anyone was really feeling the pinch would they have admitted to it? Or would they simply just avoid such a gathering with their peers? I have an inkling it’s the latter.
Hey vinnie. Nice handle.
“If anyone was really feeling the pinch would they have admitted to it? ”
Good point.
Doesn’t the customary thinking among the upper crust goes something like this: “Being broke is contageous. People freak out and stop talking to you if you admit the money is gone. Therefore, one must conceal reduced circumstances at all costs”?
ahansen,
Thanks for the thoughtful post, again. I could really identify with it. Hey, I’ve got that 40 year reunion this year too.
The town I went to school in, Chatham NJ, was just next to Short Hills, which I think was the then highest tax bracket burb in the US. We were the children of affluence too, but also the children of frugality. Mother patched my clothes, made some of them and most of her own. A garden and mason jars. Father knew how to grow things, fix stuff and how to live off the land and passed that on. We never wanted for anything, as I recall, but we didn’t want stuff we didn’t have either.
Many fear what they thought was normal.
BTW, the time my kids got fleas was when they were going to a very yuppie school, lol. Nit combs.
I’m going to Ann Arbor in a few weeks. This is year #30 since I graduated from college, and I don’t think I’ll be going to any formal Class of 1979 activities. Reason: Family. My father will also be in Ann Arbor, and I’ll have to tend to him.
I was your neighbor in Summit NJ. Same kind of values there, clearly lots of people had money ( we didn’t) but nobody was flaunting it. I still remember the 17 year old volvo my wealthy friend Andy had, that thing drove us kids to every football practice.
“Then I remembered how frugal had been many of our upbringings.”
Wow. What a difference a few decades makes. I grew up in Rolling Hills Estates in the 80’s. Now yes, this is the “other” side of The Hill. The white trash side if you ask anyone with a view of the Pacific but in any case, the kids I grew up with where the most venal, self important, mean spirited and in some cases downrigt evil little SOB’s you would NEVER want to meet. When my folks decided to move to Washington DC in 1984 (yeah yeah, a fraught date I know) I complained for about 30 seconds.
Washington DC has it’s OWN set of issues of course
As much as I hated that place I would love to have been a fly on the wall for my 20th annivarsary and I would LOVE to know where some of those social parasites are today.
However, One nice thing I can say about Palos Verdes is that it’s one of the most beautifull places in LA to live. Even the white trash side
PV has “sides”?
Only when you’re on the “right” side but believe me, the rivalry between Rancho PV and the rest of the “Hill” was (and probably is) legendary.
The rest of us were merely ‘rich’. Rancho PV is OBSCENELY RICH.
Oh my yes.
There are actually three “cities” on the peninsula. “Behind the gates” is Rolling Hills, (our high school,) composed of the horsey old ranchos and haciendas in the center and top of the hill, including Portuguese Bend. The minimum acreage is 2.5, some of the larger estates still have avocado orchards, etc., and the whole city is surrounded by white three-rail fencing.
Palos Verdes Estates is the more Mediterranian villa-oriented west/southwest part including Malaga Cove. It is often foggy from the ocean, and considerably more “stuffy” in both character and architecture–though gorgeously done and obscenely expensive. Woe be unto anyone who confused the two–we were cross town rivals in the classic sense.
In the late ’70’s IIRC, the rest of the unincorporated areas on the hill became the city of Rancho Palos Verdes, mostly the “newer” tract-ish homes with less acreage, and more “affordable” pricing. My favorite of these was something called “Academy Hills” built on the old county dump, er landfill, adjacent to and below the Chadwick School.
The best way to ride out a recession is to be already retired when it hits. That way, you can just use up all that extra money that your parents left you when they died, instead of leaving it to your kids.
Meritocracy.
Ahansen,
Thanks so much for that write-up.
I seem to remember reading somewhere years ago about how many of the homes in PV were empty of furniture - the point being that many people over-extended just to buy the house and took years to be able to afford furniture for it. Not sure what period it was about, but I’m certain I read the article before the late ’80’s.
As a kid, I rode Sting Ray bicycle up into PV once or twice - talk about youthful endurance - it was the closest thing to “nature” you could find within easy distance of the L.A. ‘burbs.
LOL. I’ll top that.
When we moved to PV from Santa Monica I used to ride my Schwin beach cruiser, all 3 speeds and 50 lbs of her, BACK to Santa Monica to spend a few hours with friends and then would ride back to PV. often getting home after dark to my parents great chagrin. I was a skinny little surf rat except for legs like a linebacker.
A few years later I had a paper route throughout the Kings Pine neighborhood. About 60 customers. God those hills used to kill me but it kept me in great shape.
I used to do the same thing, Sleeper. Once they got the bike paths in, it was a whole lot easier than going down the channel past LAX, but I still carry the musculature from all those miles and miles and miles back uphill from the base of PV Drive North.
“Hey Mom, I’m going to the library. Be back by dinner….”
Now there’s a nice little memory.
When I was bicycling around the country in 1981-82, I went through the LA area. Picked up the beachside bike trail in Santa Monica. And rode it, and rode it, and rode it south.
At one point, I was startled by a jet that took off right overhead. Oh, so that’s where LAX is.
That was just a few miles after I had to do that walk-the-bike around Marina Del Rey. Man, there were some pricey boats docked there.
Since I did this ride in November 1981 on a weekday, I had the trail to myself. And this trail went on for something like 30 miles.
Trail ended in Redondo Beach, and I was staying the night at the youth hostel up in Palos Verdes. Yipes, what a climb!
But you know what I saw that night? The lights of LA! Just like in the movies. I thought that was pretty cool.
IMO, that’s the best bike trail in the 48 states. I rode it a few times.
My buddy Yasser is a pilot. When we fly out to Catalina, we fly right over RPV.
It looks very magical from 5,000 feet :
http://www.flickr.com/photos/31545736@N05/sets/72157620954148415/
It a fond memory for me also … I used to roller blade from Montana Avenue down to just south of Playa almost every week for a year. Sure do miss living in Santa Monica rather than downtown LA or midtown NY
I used to ride my Schwin beach cruiser, all 3 speeds and 50 lbs of her, BACK to Santa Monica
Good lord!
I won’t even ride my 3spd beach cruiser to work here in Vegas - 8 miles.
I remeber one family like that when I was growing up in the ’60’s. No living room furniture at all. The problem was that they had more kids than they could afford not that they had bought a huge house. It actually was a modest house, just more than they could afford at the time.
“”So it seems to me that the best way to ride out the “recession” or whatever name it’s going by these days, may be to either live like a poor country slob, or actually be a poor country slob, because as far as I can tell, they’re the only ones not being hit hard in the teeth (or the retirement account,) by the all the changes we’re going through in These Troubled Times.”"
Alabama, Song of the South:
“Well somebody told us Wall Street fell
But we were so poor that we couldn’t tell
Cotton was short and the weeds were tall
But Mr. Roosevelt’s a gonna save us all…”
http://www.cowboylyrics.com/lyrics/alabama/song-of-the-south-4250.html
That’s what my mother use to tell me about the Depression. She and my father both grew up in the coal mining area of Virgina with ties to the mines. Her father ran the company store until he committed suicide. Father’s father worked on the train and died when a pice of coal hit him. I’m not sure of details on either since they were topics my parents avoided.
Real Estate - The 800,000 Pound Deflationary Gorilla by Adam Brochert
http://www.safehaven.com/article-14417.htm
aHansen - You’re truly an amazing lady.
Key paragraph from Adam’s story:
“With banks unwilling and/or unable to lend (because they are scared and/or insolvent) and with citizens broke, drowning in debt and fearing a pink slip every day, the private, non-federal, for-profit federal reserve bank corporation is not going to be able to spark price inflation in asset classes like stocks, commodities or corporate bonds. And you can forget real estate. This popped bubble ain’t coming back for at least a generation. Even once we hit bottom, we will scrape along the bottom for a few (several?) years.”
And I agree with the others. Our very own ahansen is amazing. We’re privileged to have her among us.
“Banks are now hiding foreclosures and refusing to list foreclosed homes on the market! Even worse, banks are allowing people who stop paying their mortgage to stay in their homes for 2 YEARS OR MORE without taking back the house.”
I think my BP just went up.
G damn, really really ticked that I am paying rent while folks are getting free living. Damn I would Love to save up 2 yrs of income.
desertdweller, me too. Those of us who have done the right things are being punished, while lots of folks got the “e” ticket.
Oh there are quite a few people, even those you would “expect” to have been kicked in the teeth, doing very, very well still.
Case in point, I just dropped off my daughter’s friend at her house for the first time. 5200 square foot main home, one acre lot w/200k landscape, pool/spa, basketball court, guest house, 100k Benzo and 75k limited edition Escalade in the driveway.
Mom stays at home. Dad’s job? Regional president for a “HOME BUILDER.” Definitely not hurting. The little girl just gave my daughter a $300 gift for her birthday, which was more than the gift I got her, geez…I thought these guys were taking it in the shorts. Not so much…
There is broke, and there is “broke at a higher level”. Things are not always what they seem.
I think you’re making some false assumptions that don’t necessarily reflect what’s really happening in the “real” world.
If you look across the board at all income levels, many folks are hurting. The number of millionaires has been reduced by 27 percent. And we know that figure is probably higher.
I’m familiar with a $700,000 foreclosed home in an airpark community. The foreclosed home has sat there for at least nine-months. That’s an indication something is amiss with high net worth individuals. No doubt some affluent folks are either selling their airplanes, not flying on a regular basis for leisure and business, or do not have the financial resources to buy the house. The price continues to fall and the house is still unsold.
Don’t judge a book by its cover. If you dig a bit beneath the surface, you may find a few things that don’t jive with your perceptions.
John Doe, my next door neighbor, leaves for work in the morning with his briefcase. He returns home in the afternoon. He’s done this for 20-years. Conclusion: My next door neighbor is employed. In fact, all of my neighbors are employed. I see them leave for work in the morning and return from work in the afternoon. Wrong assumption!
The Wall Street Journal wrote a recent article about the unemployed PRETENDING to be employed. Some unemployed folks may play the game for a week, a month, or a year. But spending eight hours at the mall, at Starbucks ( some coffee joints do not allow computer hookups without buying something ), or at the park gets very tiring.
No doubt some of the above is occurring in PV.
Ahansen, thank you for another great read.
What I wonder though, if the rich and the poor are pretty much where they’ve always been, where’s the middle class? They are not extinct yet, is there any fight left in them?
I don’t have fond memories of high school. Consequently, I haven’t attended a reunion. I know my class has had one reunion. Other than that, I don’t know.
From all appearances, my class seems not to be actively involved in these HAPPY DAYS’ rememberances. However, the class before mine seems to be quite actively involved with these school rememberances. In fact, they have a Web site with loads of pictures detailing the various reunions.
My class has no such Web site. No pictures. No nothing. Zip! I do wonder why. It’s not because my class was small. There were 800 plus students in my class. I think my classmates are just too busy. Many of my former classmates are very successful in academia and the corporate world.
Even if my class does have a reunion, I can’t see them sitting around blabbing about their bank accounts. Daddy’s money or whatever. My high school had its fair share of wealth, nothing at all like PV, but my high school focused a lot of attention to intellectual pursuits. The National Honor Society played a key role at my high school.
That’s why dumb ol’ me didn’t fit into my high school circles. I lived in my own little world far removed from theirs.
I don’t hear much about the educational side of high school in PV. Money seems to be the focus. Some of the rich kids in my high school went to Harvard, Yale, and UC–B. Now, they’re internationally-known scientists finding cures for cancer, etc.
Actually, its always been a mix of fun and business. Lots of people exchange business cards and phone numbers. And at least it’s people you once knew. As opposed to total strangers at a “networking” event.
————————-
I can’t see them sitting around blabbing about their bank accounts. Daddy’s money or whatever.
For some people, I’m sure high school reunions are indeed fun. That’s nice. I’m sure they are for long-time students in their specific school district.
I was a transplant as a junior so I had no roots, nor long-established friendships, in my school district. I was a new kid on the block in a high school with almost 3,000 students.
For this year, and for subsequent years, reunion attendance may be down. I would think so due to the high unemployment. I don’t think many unemployed men would want to attend a reunion. Not when men define themselves by their job title. There’s a huge stigma when you’re unemployed.
yup…that little gravy train of income has almost vanished…..sad