September 24, 2009

Bits Bucket For September 24, 2009

Post off-topic ideas, links and Craigslist finds here. Please visit the HBB Forum.




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318 Comments »

Comment by dimedropped
2009-09-24 02:01:56

Terribly trite but I just gotta do it…..First!

Comment by Stpn2me
2009-09-24 03:52:38

In honour of Sammy Schadenfreude from yesterday’s post…

SECOND! :)

I just had to do it Sammy….

Comment by SV guy
2009-09-24 04:38:51

Come on people, grow up. :)

Comment by aNYCdj
2009-09-24 04:42:12

Awww what about all that feel good you are a winner for just showing up stuff people have been taught for years?

I wannbe a First too…..but not today

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Comment by Al
2009-09-24 06:13:20

I do believe you are the first DJ from NYC to post here today.

 
 
Comment by wolfgirl
2009-09-24 05:12:22

Rerun time

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Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2009-09-24 06:24:38

You are all funny! What a great community this is eh?

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Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 05:38:09

Hey Step; Seconds aren’t to bad. but thirds and fourth are a different animal! :)

 
Comment by Sammy Schadenfreude
2009-09-24 07:06:07

I forgive you all.

Comment by Ol'Bubba
2009-09-24 08:08:10

(_!_)

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Comment by In Montana
2009-09-24 13:17:40

Mooned!

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 19:18:28

Is that a male or a female moon?

 
 
 
 
Comment by Dale
2009-09-24 08:44:53

Hey….. Why don’t you guys (girls) go see how many other blogs you can be “first” on? Oh boy, Oh boy, the fun will never end! So many blogs, so little time.

Comment by Al
2009-09-24 12:19:58

There are other blogs?

 
 
Comment by San Diego RE Bear
2009-09-24 12:20:16

205th! :D

Comment by Dale
2009-09-24 14:19:55

Ben, …could you send us all “participant” ribbons?

 
 
Comment by dimedropped
2009-09-24 13:28:49

Clearly I am spending too much time alone.

 
 
Comment by wmbz
2009-09-24 02:45:25

Fed Prepares to End Mortgage Program
Officials See Signs of Shaky Recovery
Washington Post September 24, 2009

The economy has “picked up” in recent weeks, Federal Reserve policymakers said Wednesday, as they indicated that the end is within sight for a massive program to support mortgage lending.

But even as the Fed takes another step to unwind one of its unconventional efforts to boost the economy, the central bank remained cautious in its assessment of the recovery, warning that a weak job market could be a drag for some time. The Fed not only left its target interest rate near zero, as was widely expected, but again asserted that the rate will likely remain at “exceptionally low levels” for an extended period.

The decision of the Fed’s policymaking committee gives new insight into the central bank’s exit strategy in its expansive interventions in the economy over the past year.

The strategy is proceeding on two tracks: Policymakers are addressing a fundamentally weak economy by leaving the federal funds rate, at which banks lend to each other, very low for a long time. But they are removing their less conventional programs as soon as they feel they can do so without disrupting financial markets.

“They’re telling us, ‘We’ll take out some of our facilities, but we’re not even close to raising the federal funds rate,’ ” said John Silvia, chief economist at Wells Fargo.

Comment by In Montana
2009-09-24 06:04:53

yeah how’d that work out for the japanese

Comment by nycjoe
2009-09-24 06:11:04

Turning Japanese, I really think so.

The fed announced today that it would not be raising rates until 2023, if then.

Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 06:15:00

Vapors.

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Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 06:20:23

Ive got your picture of me and you
You wrote I love you I love you too
I sit there staring and theres nothing else to do
Oh its in color your hair is brown
Your eyes are hazel and soft as clouds
I often kiss you when theres no one else around

Ive got your picture, Ive got your picture
Id like a million of them all round my cell
I asked the doctor to take your picture
So I can look at you from inside as well
Youve got me turning up and turning down
And turning in and turning round

Im turning japanese
I think Im turning japanese
I really think so
Turning japanese
I think Im turning japanese
I really think so
Im turning japanese
I think Im turning japanese
I really think so
Turning japanese
I think Im turning japanese
I really think so

Ive got your picture, Ive got your picture
Id like a million of them all round my cell
I want the doctor to take your picture
So I can look at you from inside as well
Youve got me turning up and turning down and turning in and turning round

Im turning japanese
I think Im turning japanese
I really think so
Turning japanese
I think Im turning japanese
I really think so
Im turning japanese
I think Im turning japanese
I really think so
Turning japanese
I think Im turning japanese
I really think so

No sex, no drugs, no wine, no women
No fun, no sin, no you, no wonder its dark
Everyone around me is a total stranger
Everyone avoids me like a psyched lone-ranger everyone

Thats why Im turning japanese
I think Im turning japanese
I really think so
Turning japanese
I think Im turning japanese
I really think so
Im turning japanese
I think Im turning japanese
I really think so
Turning japanese
I think Im turning japanese
I really think so

Turning japanese
I think Im turning japanese
I really think so
Turning japanese
I think Im turning japanese
I really think so
Turning japanese
I think Im turning japanese
I really think so
(think so think so think so)
Turning japanese
I think Im turning japanese
I really think so

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Comment by Rich
2009-09-24 06:59:30

How about Alphaville song Big in Japan
winter’s cityside
crystal bits of snowflakes all around my head and in the wind
I had no illusions
that I’d ever find a glimpse of summer’s heatwaves in your eyes
you did what you did to me, now it’s history I see
here’s my comeback on the road again
things will happen while they can
I will wait here for my man tonight, it’s easy when you’re big in japan

when your big in japan, tonight
big in japan, be tight, big in japan where the eastern sea’s so blue
big in japan, alright, pay, then I’ll sleep by your side
things are easy when you’re big in japan, when you’re big in japan

neon on my naked skin
passing silhouettes of strange illuminated mannequins
shall I stay here at the zoo
or should I go and change my point of view for other ugly scenes
you did what you did to me, now it’s history I see…
things will happen while they can
I will wait here for my man tonight, it’s easy when you’re big in japan

when your big in japan, tonight
big in japan, be tight, big in japan where the eastern sea’s so blue
big in japan, alright, pay, then I’ll sleep by your side
things are easy when you’re big in japan, when you’re big in japan

when your big in japan, tonight
big in japan, be tight, big in japan where the eastern sea’s so blue
big in japan, alright, pay, then I’ll sleep by your side
things are easy when you’re big in japan, when you’re big in japan

 
Comment by Skip
2009-09-24 08:02:29

Do you know what that song is really about ATE?

 
Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 09:17:04

No, tell me. Seriously.

 
Comment by GrizzlyBear
2009-09-24 12:35:56

Do you, Skip? Contrary to widespread belief, it’s not about self pleasure. What it’s really about is someone slowly going mad after the loss of their girlfriend, and it was inspired by the lead singers own relationship struggles.

 
Comment by Ol'Bubba
2009-09-24 12:46:53

If you do a google search on “vapors turning japaneses meaning” you’ll find out. I found this on a site called songfacts dot com:

One of the more misinterpreted songs of all time, word was that “Turning Japanese” refers to the Oriental facial features people get at the moment of climax during masturbation. In a VH1 True Spin special, they asked The Vapors about this song, and they explained that it is a love song about someone who lost their girlfriend and was going slowly crazy. Lead singer Dave Fenton said: “Turning Japanese is all the clichés about angst and youth and turning into something you didn’t expect to.” It was inspired by Fenton’s relationship problems.

 
Comment by Left LA
2009-09-24 13:03:21

Wanking too much in prison.

 
Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 16:54:22

Bub, fascinating.

 
 
 
 
Comment by NYCityBoy
2009-09-24 06:23:28

“But even as the Fed takes another step to unwind one of its unconventional efforts to boost the economy”

I believe they are referring to the counterfeiting operations of The Fed but they had to use the euphemism of “unconventional efforts”.

I bet this makes Stucco want to short those house builder stocks. He is itching to get them in the cross-hairs.

 
Comment by Skip
2009-09-24 08:01:27

If measured according to the methodology used when I was Assistant Secretary of the Treasury, the unemployment rate today in the US is above 20%. Moreover, there is no obvious way of reducing it. There are no factories, with work forces temporarily laid off by high interest rates, waiting for a lower interest rate policy to call their workforces back into production.

http://www.opednews.com/articles/The-Economy-Is-A-Lie-Too-by-Paul-Craig-Roberts-090921-413.html

Comment by cobaltblue
2009-09-24 09:09:23

Thanks, Skip. Paul Roberts is speaking the truth when he identifies the gross understatement of unemployment numbers currently used by the State Sponsored Media.

Many times we hear some shill parrot the line “but we are nowhere near Great Depression levels”.

There is always a fresh batch of Kool-Aid around the corner being prepared for mass consumption.

 
Comment by CA renter
2009-09-25 00:25:59

That was a fantastic op-ed piece, skip. He summarizes exactly how I perceive things.

 
 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 17:20:54

How much hair-of-the-dog drinking binge is necessary to completely forget about a hangover?

Forbes dot com
Realtors Urge Extension Of Tax Credit
Maurna Desmond, 09.24.09, 06:16 PM EDT

Trade group warns that without incentive for first-time homebuyers, market could be overwhelmed by expected rise in foreclosures.

A real estate group that helped fuel the housing bubble is now warning that if homebuyer sweeteners aren’t extended, the real estate market will continue to founder.

On Thursday, the National Association of Realtors reported that after four months of incremental improvement, August existing home sales fell 2.7% to a seasonally adjusted annual rate of 5.1 million units, from a pace of 5.24 million in July. The sluggish pace is a relative improvement from the 4.93 million clip in August of last year.

“Some of the give-back in closed sales appears to result from rising numbers of contracts entering the system, with some fallouts and a backlog contributing to a longer closing process, but the decline demonstrates we can’t take a housing rebound for granted,” said Lawrence Yun, NAR chief economist. “An extension of the tax credit is critical to preserve incentives for financially qualified buyers to enter the market.”

Among measures taken to stabilize the housing market, Congress passed a temporary $8,000 tax credit for first-time home buyers. That’s set to expire Nov. 30, which has the realtors begging for an extension.

They’re in a tricky rhetorical position. On the one hand, NAR and other trade groups are encouraging folks that it’s time to buy, saying that the housing market is improving, while at the same time lobbying Uncle Sam for help on the grounds that the market could easily backslide. “The recent trend shows broad improvement in most of the country, but with an expected rise in foreclosures over the next 12 months we need to maintain a healthy level of ready buyers to absorb the inventory,” the group said.

In addition to the tax credit, the Obama administration has done plenty to encourage home sales, including lax lending policies at the Federal Housing Administration and lower interest rates, compliments of the Federal Reserve. The central bank has also been buying up hundreds of billions in mortgage debt in a bid to encourage lending, but next year that binge is set to end. (See “Ending The $1.45 Trillion Shopping Spree.”)

 
 
Comment by wmbz
2009-09-24 02:46:42

Luxury Hotels in U.S. Risk Default as $850 Rooms Remain Empty.

Sept. 24 (Bloomberg) — Luxury hotel owners risk defaulting on their debt as the recession cuts occupancies and the credit crunch constrains refinancing.

Loans secured by more than 1,500 hotels with a total outstanding balance of $24.5 billion may be in danger of default, according to Realpoint LLC, a credit rating company that tracks commercial mortgage-backed securities. Some of the biggest loans, put on the company’s watch list because of late payments, decreasing occupancies or cash flow, were made to luxury properties where rooms can cost more than $850 a night.

“All segments are showing signs of distress but the luxury segment carries much higher loan balances and is more clearly affected,” Frank Innaurato, managing director of CMBS analytical services at Horsham, Pennsylvania-based Realpoint, said in a telephone interview.

Lodging owners are struggling after adding rooms and properties at the peak of the CMBS market from 2004 to 2007, when $83.4 billion in hotel-backed securities was issued. Occupancy among chains with the costliest rooms fell to 60 percent in the first half from 70 percent a year earlier, according to Smith Travel Research. The decline was the industry’s largest for that period.

“Luxury hotels have been aggressively financed during the peak CMBS issuance years,” David Loeb, an analyst at Robert W. Baird & Co., said in a phone interview. “That’s why luxury hotel loans crowd these watch lists.”

Comment by pressboardbox
2009-09-24 06:00:04

I think the Fed should buy all 1500 luxury hotels for the full $24.5 billion. Its only fair.

Comment by potential buyer
2009-09-24 09:31:39

Yep, and drop their rates to about $50 a night.

Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 15:07:17

Hey potential, how did the job interview go?

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Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 06:38:00

“$850 Rooms”

1. Lower the price.
2. Negotiate a lower loan payment with the lender.

Where’s the problem?

Comment by wmbz
2009-09-24 06:44:52

What? Negotiate a lower price, but these rooms are “worth” $850.00, we’re not going to ‘give’ them away!

Comment by CarrieAnn
2009-09-24 08:57:17

Understod the sarcasm here but yikes! 60% of clients are still agreeing to pay these prices? Apparently the cost is being rolled into service/product cost and passed onto clients who are still coughing up. Either that are there are more rock mega tours out there than I was aware of.

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Comment by potential buyer
2009-09-24 10:36:32

Having worked with C-level management, there’s a strong sense of entitlement. You would be amazed (no you wouldn’t) at how many think that those prices are their due.

To be fair, I’ve worked with CEOs who will only stay at lower cost hotels. Holiday Inns come to mind.

 
 
 
Comment by SFC
2009-09-24 07:33:27

It’s similar to that old business joke “we lose money on every sale, but make it up on volume”. In this case it’s “our business plan is to have one sale a week with a $700 profit, and lose $150 each of the other 6 days”.

 
 
 
Comment by wmbz
2009-09-24 02:54:17

HSBC bids farewell to dollar supremacy
The sun is setting on the US dollar as the ultra-loose monetary policy of the US Federal Reserve forces China and the vibrant economies of the emerging world to forge a new global currency order, according to a new report by HSBC.

“The dollar looks awfully like sterling after the First World War,” said David Bloom, the bank’s currency chief.

“The whole picture of risk-reward for emerging market currencies has changed. It is not so much that they have risen to our standards, it is that we have fallen to theirs. It used to be that sovereign risk was mainly an emerging market issue but the events of the last year have shown that this is no longer the case. Look at the UK – debt is racing up to 100pc of GDP,” he said

Crucially, China and rising Asia have reached the point where they can no longer keep holding down their currencies to boost exports because this is causing mayhem to their own economies, stoking asset bubbles. Asia’s “mercantilist mindset” of recent decades is about to be broken by the spectre of an inflation spiral.

The policy headache was already becoming clear in the final phase of the global credit boom but the financial crisis temporarily masked the effect. The pressures will return with a vengeance as these countries roar back to life, leaving the US and other laggards of the old world far behind.

A monetary policy of near zero rates – further juiced by quantitative easing – is completely incompatible with circumstances in most of Asia, the Middle East, Latin America, and Africa. Divorce is inevitable. The US is expected to hold rates near zero through 2010 to tackle its own crisis.

Comment by packman
2009-09-24 06:13:21

Look at the UK – debt is racing up to 100pc of GDP

Not just the UK.

Keep in mind the 2010 deficit is projected to be identical to 2009. We’ll probably hit 100% sometime in late 2010 or early 2011.

Comment by packman
2009-09-24 06:20:36

BTW that chart is a few months old actually - currently we’re at about 84% of GDP. It’s growing at a rate of about 1% of GDP per month. I’ll update it after Sept debt numbers come out in a couple of weeks.

 
 
Comment by Jim A.
2009-09-24 07:44:40

“The whole picture of risk-reward for emerging market currencies has changed. It is not so much that they have risen to our standards, it is that we have fallen to theirs.

There’s the money quote. Combined with the fact that the Chinese economy has progressed into a kleptocratic oligarchy ruled by robberbarons without the rule of law rather than a complete economic basket case unable to produce anything, and the dollar is in trouble.

 
Comment by ET-Chicago
2009-09-24 08:00:23

Debt in Japan is much higher than GDP and has been for some time. I guess that’s why the author said “rising Asia.”

Interesting, too, that GB’s debt levels have been significantly lower than ours during this century. So they really must be ramping up the Debt Machine.

Comment by packman
2009-09-24 08:57:00

Yep - sadly we are heading exactly that there - in part because our age demographics are very similar to Japan’s in the early 1990’s; i.e. we going into a period where our elder generations will put an increasing burden on our younger generations.

I would *really* not want to go where Japan is, debt-wise. Though also I believe almost all of Japan’s debt is internal, whereas the U.S. has about 30% of our debt external.

Does that data only go back to 2004? It would be interesting to pull up the same chart showing Japan going back to before they started having problems in the 1990’s.

Also however that data doesn’t seem to match the numbers put out by the U.S. treasury and the BEA. The treasury shows $10.7T of debt and the BEA shows GDP of $14.2B as of the beginning of 2009; that would put our debt at 74% of GDP, not at 65% of GDP as shown in the IMF data.

Comment by ET-Chicago
2009-09-24 09:50:11

The numbers do seem to vary by source, yes. The CIA puts out its own in the World Factbook, too (an endlessly fascinating resource), and those estimates are close but slightly different as well (though I didn’t see a 2009 est. from the CIA). The CIA’s estimates run lower than the IMF’s.

I don’t think the IMF numbers in that particular data set run back farther, and only out to 2009. Wouldn’t be surprised if they can be found elsewhere on the site, though.

Thanks for putting all the legwork in on CRA the other day, BTW; I wasn’t able to respond in a timely fashion.

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Comment by packman
2009-09-24 10:26:12

Sure.

Thanks for the IMF link. One of these days I’ll get around to adding various historical Japanese data to my ever-growing collection, maybe.

 
Comment by DD
2009-09-24 10:51:15

CIA, is this the THE CIA? or is CIA in this instance something else? Can’t imagine why THE CIA -covert ops etc- would be interested in charts/graphs for Japan etc.

Thanks for the coming info.

 
Comment by ET-Chicago
2009-09-24 11:15:39

Yes, we’re talking about the CIA. Their mission is international intelligence gathering, after all.

The CIA World Factbook is an outstanding resource for comparative data. It’s fairly well-organized, too.

I don’t claim data from the CIA is objective or unbiased, but the same can be said of any informational sources at that level (the UN, IMF, World Bank, other national government agencies, etc.).

 
Comment by Julius
2009-09-24 12:11:10

Gathering intelligence involves gathering as much information about other governments/states/nations as possible. Economic info is extremely valuable when it comes to making foreign policy decisions.

 
Comment by DD
2009-09-24 19:21:38

Cool ET. Now for sure we are all being monitored.
I am going to link up so they will know that I am a HBB er.

 
 
 
 
Comment by james
2009-09-24 08:57:32

This sounds good. The Yaun becomes unhinged from the dollar, prices rise of junk, consumption slows and we become less expensive as an exporter.

Good.

This will help resolve the solvency problems, employment problems exc exc.

Of course….
Expect China to quickly move to raise tariffs to “protect” their fledgling industries.

Set off the trade war in earnest.

 
 
Comment by wmbz
2009-09-24 02:59:02

Larry Edelson
- Weiss Group

The U.S. dollar resumed its swan dive overnight, hitting brand-new, one-year lows.

Meanwhile, gold — the world’s ultimate dollar hedge — surged nicely to within an eyelash of its all-time high.

But it should come as no surprise that global investors are beating the dollar like a red-headed stepchild.

After all — they know that U.S. Treasury Chief Timothy Geithner is going panhandling this week — begging and borrowing every penny he can to fund Washington’s precedent-shattering $1.6 trillion budget deficit.

Today, Geithner will rewrite the history books by dumping an all-time record $43 billion in new U.S. Treasuries on the market in a single day.

PLUS, tomorrow and on Friday, Geithner will return to the trough, borrowing an additional $69 billion to keep the lights on in Washington.

That’s a total of $112 billion in U.S. Treasury borrowing in just three, short days!

Geithner:
“Brother, can you spare $112 BILLION?”
This is truly alarming: If you’re like me, you can remember a time not too long ago when U.S. Treasury borrowing was less than $112 billion for an entire year. Now, we’re borrowing that much in less than one week!

I wish that was the worst of it. It isn’t: So far this year, Geithner has borrowed a mind-boggling $1.41 TRILLION to fund Washington’s debt addiction — nearly THREE TIMES MORE than the Treasury had borrowed at this time last year.

And still, this is only the beginning: The Congressional Budget Office (CBO) has warned that Obama’s budget will add nearly $10 trillion in new government debt over the next ten years.

If the CBO is correct, our national debt will soar to well over $21 trillion by 2019. That’s more than double the value of all the goods and services our economy now produces in a whole year!

Meanwhile, over at the Federal Reserve, “Helicopter Ben” Bernanke is printing unbacked paper dollars like there’s no tomorrow.

Yesterday alone, in his ongoing attempt to keep Geithner’s precedent-shattering borrowing spree from sending interest rates into the stratosphere, Bernanke had to print more than $4 billion just to BUY treasuries.

THIS is why the U.S. money supply is skyrocketing! THIS is why sophisticated investors worldwide are recoiling in horror.

Comment by Stpn2me
2009-09-24 03:56:53

Meanwhile, gold — the world’s ultimate dollar hedge — surged nicely to within an eyelash of its all-time high.

Sounds like music to my ears. As long as they are printing money and the dollar’s value keeps going down, I will continue to hold my gold and platinum….

Comment by Bill in Carolina
2009-09-24 06:11:12

Stpn,

Coldwell-Banker just came out with a survey of the price of a “typical 4BR/2.5BA move-up” house in 300 U.S. markets. Fayetteville NC is fifth cheapest.

Several news sites are carrying the article today but I can’t find any link (even on the C-B site) to the actual survey results.

If any sharp-eyed HBBers find it, please post.

BTW, La Jolla CA was highest at $2.1 Million and a little town in central Michigan was lowest at $112K.

Comment by Stpn2me
2009-09-24 07:06:38

I saw that, I think….

we are looking around Siler City, closer to home (K-ville, G’boro)…Land prices are lower and I should be able to get a decent house…

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Comment by X-GSfixr
2009-09-24 07:24:34

My solution to the problem:

Stop building helicopters.

Or, if you are resigned to the inevitability of it all, buy Boeing or Textron stock.

 
 
Comment by potential buyer
2009-09-24 09:37:43

Its always either Fortune or CNNMoney that provides these.

In your instance its:
http://money.cnn.com/2009/09/23/real_estate/home_price_comparison/index.htm?postversion=2009092307

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Comment by Lucy
2009-09-24 05:30:24

I think the gold price has been surprisingly weak. The price is up by about 10% over the last 6 months when the stock market is up by nearly 40%. I don’t believe the difference is explained by conspiracy theories, PPT or abduction by aliens either.

Comment by packman
2009-09-24 06:16:41

According to current theory - gold prices *should* be inversely proportional to the stock market. As the economy improves, the market should go up, and the dollar should go up and gold down.

This hasn’t happened though. The dollar has been down despite the market being up.

 
Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 06:18:11

Lucy: I got some gold. I agree completely. It should be about 1700 now. But, what do I know?

Comment by realestateskeptic
2009-09-24 12:22:32

Lucy: I got some gold. I agree completely. It should be about 1700 now. But, what do I know?

Let me start by saying I do own some physical gold and some GLD, about 5-10% of my investments. I’ve never really believed in the Armegedon scenario and the archives here are full of me and many others and the Aladisane going back in forth and I fell into the “my guns are better than your gold” camp.

Here’s my question. Since the dollar was the world’s currency and up is now down and black in now white, why should Gold still have the same relative “value” it had before? Is it immune? Why should it be at $1,700 in the end you can’t eat, cook or heat with it? AlI that gold can get me that I can actually can use is worthless dollars. Guns however…..

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Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2009-09-24 06:31:10

Check GLD versus VFINX for the last three years. Then tell me that gold has not diverged.

Also September a year ago stocks dropped subtantially while gold took a quick drop, then recovery. It is only in the last six months that GLD and VFINX look correlated.

 
 
Comment by LehighValleyGuy
2009-09-24 06:45:16

If the CBO is correct, our national debt will soar to well over $21 trillion by 2019. That’s more than double the value of all the goods and services our economy now produces in a whole year!

Well, according to ahansen, government regulation creates wealth and prosperity, so we just need a lot more of that and we should be good.

Comment by Sammy Schadenfreude
2009-09-24 07:16:13

Well, according to ahansen, government regulation creates wealth and prosperity, so we just need a lot more of that and we should be good.

In fairness to ahansen, I don’t think that’s an accurate characterization of what she said. Some government regulation (with effective oversight and enforcement) is necessary and appropriate, given the excesses and abuses created by predatory capitalism. I’m a Ron Paul guy with Libertarian leanings, but the conduct of such “self-policing” industry groups as the NAR makes it clear that some oversight is needed - and not the asleep-at-the-switch SEC variety.

Comment by ET-Chicago
2009-09-24 08:40:46

I’m a Ron Paul guy with Libertarian leanings, but the conduct of such “self-policing” industry groups as the NAR makes it clear that some oversight is needed - and not the asleep-at-the-switch SEC variety.

I’m glad to hear not all our Paulite/Libertarian types believe corporations can and should police themselves.

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Comment by packman
2009-09-24 10:37:58

Along those lines - seems to be that an ideal solution would be independent agencies to provide this kind of data. Ideally the ratings agencies and that kind of thing are supposed to be just that, however there are two problems I see with the current system:

- Much of the data is already assumed to come directly from the government: The BEA, the Labor Dept., the Census Bureau, the Federal Reservce, etc. etc. Well the government isn’t exactly an impartial observer. Aside from its (often discussed here) ties with the corporate world - the government’s revenues itself are often driven by this data. For instance there is a *very* strong correlation between stock market performance and federal government revenue; as made obvious by this year’s way-lower-than-expected level of tax receipts, due to last years market crash. Since much of the data already comes from the government though, there isn’t much of a demand for independent third-party data, and even if there was I’m guessing such parties would have a *heck* of a time making a living competing against the government.

- The ratings agencies themselves are quite heavily regulated, e.g. how the SEC regulates the ratings agencies with NRSRO status and such. Thus even those that are supposed to be independent aren’t. They’re in bed with the wall street corporations that they rate, by proxy through the government.

 
 
Comment by LehighValleyGuy
2009-09-24 11:49:13

“Well, according to ahansen, government regulation creates wealth and prosperity, so we just need a lot more of that and we should be good.”

In fairness to ahansen, I don’t think that’s an accurate characterization of what she said.

I don’t see any other interpretation of this excerpt from her guest post:

perhaps we should take a moment to remember that we, you and I, are our government, and that without a regulated social structure, none of us would be enjoying a life— even the most impoverished among us— that compares admirably to a life of royalty a mere few generations back.

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Comment by Al
2009-09-24 12:26:55

Government regulation doesn’t create wealth or prosperity, but it has role in distributing it and regulating how it is generated. Try to imagine a world without any government what so ever.

 
Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 13:21:51

Al: Heck, I don’t know. Intuition, I guess. I got in with 30 brilliant uncirculated 1 oz coins two years ago @ 600.

I do not have a lot of money.

Something smells, and I don’t know what it is.

Do you, Mrs. Jones. (robbing Dylan a little).

 
 
 
Comment by ahansen
2009-09-24 20:46:11

Are you really this simplistic, Lehigh, or do you just need a refresher course in reading comprehension?

 
 
Comment by measton
2009-09-24 06:51:43

If the CBO is correct, our national debt will soar to well over $21 trillion by 2019. That’s more than double the value of all the goods and services our economy now produces in a whole year!

A little dishonest comparison in that even if we do not increase our production of widgets those widgets will be valued in 2019 dollars. If those dollars are worth half as much our GDP will double. Still ugly.

 
Comment by packman
2009-09-24 07:05:11

If the CBO is correct, our national debt will soar to well over $21 trillion by 2019. That’s more than double the value of all the goods and services our economy now produces in a whole year!

A. Not it’s not - current GDP is $14.1 trillion. Double of that is $28T, which of course is not less than $21T.

B. CBO also estimates GDP to grow dramatically - not sure the exact number, but it’s close to $20T by 2019 I believe; so debt would be around 100% of GDP.

C. To the CBO - I say “good luck with that”! More likely debt will be about 150% or so of GDP.

 
 
Comment by wmbz
2009-09-24 03:07:39

U.S. credit card defaults rise to record: Moody’s
September 23, 2009

NEW YORK (Reuters) - The U.S. credit card charge-off rate rose to a record high in August, as more Americans lost their jobs, Moody’s Investors Service said on Wednesday, in another sign consumers remain under stress.

The Moody’s credit card charge-off index — which measures credit card loans that banks do not expect to be repaid — rose to 11.49 percent in August from 10.52 percent in July.

The index resumed an upward trend after declining in July for the first time in almost a year, vanishing hopes of stabilization in the industry after record high credit losses.

“We continue to call for a recovery of the credit card sector to begin once industry average charge-offs peak in mid-2010 between 12 percent and 13 percent,” Moody’s said in a report.

Credit card losses usually follow the trend of unemployment, which rose in August to 9.7 percent, the highest level in 26 years. Moody’s estimated unemployment will peak next year at 10 percent to 10.5 percent.

The Moody’s index showed credit card delinquencies — payments more than 30 days late — rose to 5.80 percent in August from 5.73 percent in July.

“Even early-stage delinquencies rose, ending a trend of four consecutive months of improvement,” Moody’s said in a report.

Comment by Xenos
2009-09-24 03:26:11

wmbz- nice companion pieces. The war between inflation and deflation continues.

 
Comment by rms
2009-09-24 06:29:45

I’m tired of these entire U.S. flattened percentages. I want to know how much credit card debt, in dollars, the typical southern Florida or southern California family defaults on these days.

Comment by aNYCdj
2009-09-24 07:15:27

My edumakated guess would be $5-10K in FloorRiddah, and $50-100K in Kalifornication

Comment by rms
2009-09-24 11:41:36

I’d like to see a thorough story about a two-income over-consumptive California family doing a strategic default of their debts. The rest of the country deserves to know what they’re really supporting out west.

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Comment by Sammy Schadenfreude
2009-09-24 07:19:04

Is there such a thing as a “typical” family these days? The default data would be more useful if they broke it out by “forbidden” categories like single vs. married, gender, ethnicity, income bracket, etc.

 
Comment by potential buyer
2009-09-24 09:46:20

You may find that answer on creditcard dot com, which does offer statistics for all credit cards.

 
 
 
Comment by Stpn2me
2009-09-24 03:47:48

Seems to me, for people like this, this lifestyle becomes a choice. This is what happens when you make bad life choices….

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/features/article2651937.ece

Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2009-09-24 06:37:54

Yikes! And they have black widows and flood dangers! Yes they made the choice.

 
Comment by wmbz
2009-09-24 06:52:50

Yep, they made their choice, and living in a dank damp tunnel is not healthy, so they most certainly deserve ‘free’ sickness care.

Comment by aNYCdj
2009-09-24 07:17:04

Or a room in an Empty LUXURY going to rot in the hot sun kondo tower with a million dollar view….right?

 
 
Comment by Sammy Schadenfreude
2009-09-24 07:22:17

Fascinating. Now we know what happened to LV Landlord of “it’s different here” fame.

 
Comment by potential buyer
2009-09-24 09:49:11

Just move them into one of the thousands of empty houses in Vegas. Problem solved.

Comment by Sammy Schadenfreude
2009-09-24 19:47:41

They’d tear out the appliances and copper pipes, sell them to buy drugs, and be right down in the tunnels again in no time at all.

Comment by CA renter
2009-09-25 01:17:59

Very true, Sammy. Sad, but true.

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Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 15:26:12

Wow, is all I can say. I lived under interstate bridges in Ft. Lauder, though, so it looks kind of cool to me. Wow.

 
Comment by james
2009-09-24 16:39:06

Morlocks are evolving in Vegas.

I’m releasing an alligator to keep the rest of us safe!

Don’t understand why people don’t go native and live up in the great northern woods in Canada or something of that nature.

Collect some welfare and put some labor into building a cabin in BFE Canada. Then you can fish/hunt exc. Show up every now and then for medical care and mo welfare checks.

Why live in the sewers of vegas?

Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 17:16:02

james: Yeah, good point.

 
 
Comment by james
2009-09-24 16:48:30

The other movie that pops to mind is Escape from New York.

I guess Escape from Las Vegas ought to be next in line in that series.

We had people living under the freeway here in LA. I’m thinking we have all those homes in Detroit/midwest… ought to send these people there. Of course a lot of this is the same ole refrain. Drugs. Drugs. Drugs. Then some arrest warrents on top of that.

SIL and I have talked about the welfare reforms (a welfare worker). The tragic part, particularly when you meet these people up close, is the total disfunction. Basically most of these people can’t function outside of jail and barely in one. Need structure. Of course they end up having kids too. This is what happens though… they fall into these odd cracks in the fabric of society.

Very difficult for conservative ole me to figure out what to do. Do you encourage them by providing aid and re-enforcing their dependancy? Look for family? Put them in jail?

Comment by CA renter
2009-09-25 01:21:53

I think we, as a society, need to accept the fact that people like this will **always** exist. From there, we need to figure out how to help those who really want help, protect others from their “activities” (children and crime victims), and afford them a very basic level of care…enough so that they do not turn on anyone who has more resources than they do.

IMHO, this is why welfare is a necessary evil. We have it to protect the rest of society from desperate people who would not hesitate to kill or harm others in order to gain access to money, food, drugs, etc.

 
 
 
Comment by wmbz
2009-09-24 03:47:55

Home credit extension could sway buying decisions: survey.

NEW YORK (Reuters) - Nearly one in five prospective first-time U.S. home buyers said a possible extension of an $8,000 tax credit would be the primary influence on their decision to purchase a home before the end of 2010, according to a survey by a real estate website.

The 18 percent who would be swayed by the move equates to 334,000 buyers who would otherwise not purchase homes from December 1, 2009 to November 30, 2010 — the likely period for an extension, according to the survey published by Zillow.com on Thursday.

Their addition to the market could make the difference between a robust annual increase in 2010 home sales and a flat or negative change, Zillow.com said.

“(An extension of) the tax credit will boost demand at the margin, and that fact will make it easier to work down our current high inventory levels of existing homes on the market,” Stan Humphries, Zillow chief economist, said in a statement.

The $8,000 first-time home buyer tax credit is part of a U.S. stimulus bill to combat the worst economic downturn to hit the United States since the 1930s.

Home buyers who do not currently own a primary residence and have not owned one for the past three years are considered for the credit.

There is speculation the U.S. government could try to pass legislation through Congress to extend the credit for another year. Alternatively, it may scrap the scheme on expectations the U.S. real estate market can recover under its own steam.

Comment by oxide
2009-09-24 05:24:03

according to a survey by a real estate website.

They may as well ask a fox the take a headcount of the chickens.

Comment by rms
2009-09-24 06:34:43

“They may as well ask a fox the take a headcount of the chickens.”

+1 Exactly!

It’s amazing that the MBA and NAR haven’t been exposed as thieves yet.

 
 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 06:39:59

“Nearly one in five…”

Shows you something about what kind of folks are buying right now. Low-end inventory (what used to be funded through subprime loans) must be pretty depleted by now…

Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2009-09-24 08:52:53

Don’t worry, they’re making more low-end inventory every day—as the shadow inventory gets thrashed over time, it moves down-market. :-)

 
Comment by VaBeyatch in Virginia Beach
2009-09-24 09:22:04

Nope, tons of crap still on the market. Selling for prices that used to buy a nice place, but it’s what people can afford with all their money. At least here in Norfolk.

 
 
Comment by eastcoaster
2009-09-24 07:24:31

Their addition to the market could make the difference between a robust annual increase in 2010 home sales and a flat or negative change, Zillow.com said.

Highly doubt it’ll be “robust.” Just more prolonging of the already prolonged and previously prolonged inevitable. Why don’t the PTB get this?

Comment by CA renter
2009-09-25 01:23:52

Amen, eastcoaster. It does get old, doesn’t it?

 
 
Comment by CarrieAnn
2009-09-24 12:40:48

No word on the number of sales that would occur if sales prices were left to drop naturally to what the market would bear w/ adjustments made for credit risk reflected in interest rates and required LTV ratios.

Hunt Real Estate in Syracue published this in the Sunday Real Estate section:

First-Time Home Buyers!
Purchase a new or existing home w/ $0 down.
Plus receive up to $8,000 in tax credit.

5.25% interest rate
$0 down payment
Closing costs assistance/seller concessions
First Time Home Buyers
Maximum Sale Price $258,690 (pretty decent 4/2.5 2500 sq footer in a nice school district can be had for this price)

For more information contact Hunt Mortgage…..

I think the world’s gone mad.

 
 
Comment by wmbz
2009-09-24 04:13:49

First tires, now paper, funny how that works. Watch for an ever increasing laundry list of complaints. Who’d a thunk it.

China faces new US trade complaint over paper as union, 3 producers file antidumping case September 24, 2009

BEIJING (AP) — A U.S. labor union and three paper companies have filed a new trade complaint over imports of Chinese paper, possibly fueling tensions between Washington and Beijing amid disputes over tires and other goods.

The complaint was announced Wednesday as U.S. President Barack Obama and his Chinese counterpart, Hu Jintao, were attending a summit of leaders of the Group of 20 major economies in Pittsburgh.

The case accuses China, along with Indonesia, of improperly subsidizing exports of some types of coated paper that it says have flooded the U.S. market, wiping out thousands of American jobs.

It comes a week after Beijing filed a World Trade Organization challenge to Washington’s decision to raise tariffs on imports of Chinese-made tires. The two governments also are involved in disputes over access to each others’ markets for poultry, steel pipes, music and movies.

The complaint was filed by three paper producers and the United Steelworkers, a union for 6,000 of their employees. The companies are NewPage Corp., of Miamisburg, Ohio; Appleton Coated LLC, of Kimberly, Wisconsin, and Sappi Fine Paper North America, of Boston.

Comment by oxide
2009-09-24 05:05:33

Didn’t NAFTA do this exact same thing with corn? IIRC, cheap subsidized corn flooded into Mexico and put enough Mexican farmers out of business that they began to walk into the US for a better life.

Removing the corn subsidy would solve several problems.

Comment by Sammy Schadenfreude
2009-09-24 07:25:54

The biofuel swindle (taxpayer-subsized ethanol from corn) has actually caused a sharp rise in corn prices in Mexico, leading to widespread hunger and, you guessed it, the immigration of desperate hungry peasants to the US. And the cultivation of cash crops like marijuana and opium poppies since the smallholder farmers can’t compete with NAFTA corn.

Isn’t globalism grand?

Comment by Al
2009-09-24 07:36:39

I’ve wondered if part of the who biofuel push was a message to the middle east: “sell us cheap fuel or we’ll burn your dinner in our gas tanks.”

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Comment by Skip
2009-09-24 08:06:53

Thats wild, so if the price of corn is too low Mexicans immigrate to the US and if the price of corn is too high Mexicans immigrate to the US.

I’m gonna go out on a limb and say if the price of corn is just right Mexicans also immigrate to the US.

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Comment by Al
2009-09-24 06:32:18

Shouldn’t China be complaining about all the paper the US is exporting?

Comment by measton
2009-09-24 06:55:05

Funny

 
Comment by Sammy Schadenfreude
2009-09-24 07:27:38

All that green helicopter currency? Oh no, you don’t understand. It says “backed by the full faith and credit of the US Government.” So you gotta have faith….

 
Comment by palmetto
2009-09-24 07:49:02

“Shouldn’t China be complaining about all the paper the US is exporting?”

rotflmao

 
Comment by ahansen
2009-09-24 20:54:20

Tee hee, Al.

 
 
Comment by ecofeco
2009-09-24 15:20:57

In the 1970s and 80s, we were being clobbered by foreign steel dumping. This contributed to the severe reduction of steel plants in this country which cost us thousands of jobs and began the decimation of the blue collar middle class.

The other main contributor was that most steel makers here refused to modernize by switching to wide spread use of mini mills with arc furnaces.

As usual, the unions were blamed.

Comment by DD
2009-09-24 19:25:49

You nailed it Ecofeco. Just like the tire dumping going on today. At least the unions are winning that round. More of that has to happen. Fight back and get our manufacturing back here.

 
 
 
Comment by Stpn2me
2009-09-24 04:14:37

Hey,

We gotta STOP this evaluation of appraisals like this. Realtor’s are losing too much money!

I notice the only ones complaining are those standing to benefit off a house’s sale…

http://money.cnn.com/2009/09/22/real_estate/industry_asks_appraisal_relief/index.htm?postversion=2009092315

Comment by Sammy Schadenfreude
2009-09-24 07:33:25

I would love to see an MSM article that actually tells the ugly truth about anything. This one, for example, should read “The lobbying arm for scumbag realtors is leaning on corruptible State goverments to turn a blind eye to the fraudulent and inflated appraisals necessary to secure loans for FBs and perpetuate artificially high prices for shoddily-constructed McMansions, securing realtor commissions at the cost of shoring up a Ponzi scheme that is collapsing under its own weight.”

Comment by ecofeco
2009-09-24 15:24:07

Exactly.

 
Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 15:39:54

Cool Sammy.

 
 
 
Comment by Muggy
2009-09-24 05:02:17

A school hall monitor I know just ‘bought’ an investment house in California.

It’s like 2005 all over again.

Comment by Bad Chile
2009-09-24 05:19:59

Muggy:

I had a white shirt on. Now it is brown from the coffee I just spewed on the monitor and down my chest.

A hall monitor? Wow.

 
Comment by awaiting wipeout
2009-09-24 05:43:12

I’m beginning to think so too, Muggy. As a one check buyer, looking for just a plain jane one-story w/ a sm pool, it is frustrating as heck. I’m not looking to turn a buck (infact, who wants taxes to rise), I just want a place to call home for the rest of my life.

 
Comment by potential buyer
2009-09-24 11:05:53

Did he pay cash for his house in say, Modesto or Fresno?

 
 
Comment by Bad Chile
2009-09-24 05:09:20

In a sign of the times…

I was at the dentist yesterday getting some work done. Came to $210 after insurance, which isn’t petty cash but is doable. I pull out the credit card (easier that way, get the cashback, etc.) and ask if they want payment now.

Instead of yes, I get the answer, that “well, we always like payment now, but we understand times are tight. We can bill you, or if you want, we can do part now on the credit card and you can come back in a month and put the remainder on the card…”

Like I said, I know times are tight and $210 isn’t small potatos, but to immediately have the dentist office offer all sorts of “anything to get our money” possibilities was shocking.

Normally I’d defer payment as long as possible just out of old fashion tightwadness, but I felt bad for the dentist office and cash flow issues.

Comment by Steve W
2009-09-24 05:44:16

That dentist office needs a new biller/cashier. The only correct answer to “Do you want payment now?” would be: “Yes.”

Comment by palmetto
2009-09-24 05:50:43

Exactly. Payment now.

Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 07:01:07

Yeah, but it does show some humanity.

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Comment by Stpn2me
2009-09-24 07:11:52

but it does show some humanity.

Humanity costs money. Where does it come from?

 
Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 07:16:03

Step, just like I told you to stay away from Ashley and Sierra, I am now telling you I am staying away from metaphysics.

When does it cool off over there Step? You said 100 last week, what happens in the “winter”?

Hope you are safe and doing well, my man.

ATE

 
Comment by ecofeco
2009-09-24 15:27:16

A society that puts a price on everything values nothing.

 
Comment by MrBubble
2009-09-24 20:46:30

++1

 
 
 
Comment by aNYCdj
2009-09-24 06:29:00

But what dentist will you go to when times get better….the corporate one or the one that helped you out? Maybe he is taking a calculated risk in getting your future business.

————————————–
That dentist office needs a new biller/cashier.

 
Comment by michael
2009-09-24 06:44:13

or…we prefer cash.

 
 
Comment by polly
2009-09-24 06:32:52

I was at the dentist yesterday too. When I walked in they were discussing another patient who needed substantial work over several weeks who was asking to pay in three chunks. Dentist was not pleased with the idea of waiting three months for full payment for work he expected to complete in less than two.

I had my regular cleaning and a found out that I did indeed have a cracked filling as I suspected. It is a recent filling so he told me that he would credit the cost of that filling against anything he had to do to fix it. I appreciate that he stands behind his work, but I guarantee, I am not going to eat unpopped popcorn kernels again. Nope. Not worth it.

My impression is that it is easier to book appointments these days than it was a few years ago. This guy is pretty expensive, but he is good and his office is a five minute walk from my office. I appreciate being entirely unable to come up with an excuse not to go. From the door of my cubicle and back it takes less than an hour and a quarter. But I suspect some of his patients are looking around for cheaper dentists, so their volume might be down. And, it seems they are neing asked to delay receipt of payment sometimes.

And my &%#@ landlord wants an increase of $60 a month on my lease renewal for next year. I think this is the year is the year I really move. The idea that there is an increase in the value of this apartment this year is as ridiculous a proposition as I have heard in a long time.

Comment by sleepless_near_seattle
2009-09-24 07:11:30

Maybe your landlord is preempting what he assumes will be a letter from you asking for reduced rent, thereby keeping rent the same?

Comment by polly
2009-09-24 10:38:09

I strongly suspect that if they ever lower the rent on these apartments it lowers what they get from the county for the county’s low income program, so if I asked for a $100 off a month, it could reduce the income on the property by a heck of a lot more than $1200 a year. Why the county can’t figure out some mechanism to avoid this is beyond me. I lived in a building in Jersey City for years that rented to subsidized low income tennants and in that building rents went up when the economy was good and went down when it was bad. They didn’t have any problem figuring out the market rate.

There is another complex nearby that is nicer, though a bit further from the Metro. I have my eye on that place. I wanted to go there last year, but I was facing the knee surgery and their only vacancy was not ground floor. Time to visit them again. The guy there told me he isn’t really allowed to lower the rent, but he gives renewals the same two months free that he gives to new leases to keep good tennants.

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Comment by DD
2009-09-24 19:29:49

he gives renewals the same two months free that he gives to new leases to keep good tennants.

That is a reduction which is up front, not averaged out!

 
 
 
 
Comment by shelby
2009-09-24 06:58:13

We are only taking checks or cold hard cash at my Employer

Too many clowns “contesting” Credit card charges & getting out of paying!!!

Sign of the times, i fear!

Comment by In Montana
2009-09-24 14:16:34

jeez…I did that recently for the first time ever, but at least I returned the (non-returnable) item.

 
 
Comment by DennisN
2009-09-24 07:11:39

My dentist gives a 5% discount if I pay by debit card rather than credit card. Cash talks.

Comment by samk
2009-09-24 07:51:13

Same here. It’s a “cash discount”.

For expensive stuff that requires payment plans they give out information for Capital One and CareCredit.

 
 
 
Comment by Stpn2me
2009-09-24 05:37:59

An intriguing(sp?) article on gold. Read some of the comments by posters. They make some of the most intelligent analysis on gold I have ever read….

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970203917304574415193376917198.html#articleTabs%3Darticle

Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2009-09-24 07:56:40

Today on Yahoo finance, Peter Shiff in the tech ticker video predicts $5000 per ounce. He also likes China stocks and India stocks (VEIEX is 18% China stocks, by the way).

I agree with Schiff’s economic issues. But I think caution is warranted. Everything is cyclic in investing and politics. There will be a day that very few people and institutions buy treasury notes and bonds. You can predict the time to sell gold by checking the events of the 1970s. Long term treasury yields were double digit.

The time to stop buying gold is when treasury yields go above 6%, IMO. The time to start selling is when they go above 8%. The higher they go, the more gold you should sell and use the proceeds to get into treasuries. Maybe a better deal would be to buy Chinese government securities, if they offer it.

 
 
Comment by mariner22
2009-09-24 05:40:32

Visiting Toronto for the first time - I am amazed to see all of the new construction going on, the tour bus driver says there are two seasons in Toronto - Winter and Construction. Luxury residences going up as well, “Shangri-la Toronto” with Estates from $2.5 million which seem really high in a market with some pretty nice looking 1200 square foot 2 bedroom condos on the waterfront of Lake Ontario going for $500K. Oh yeah, and signs stating “5% down” also are seen on some new construction.

Perhaps it is different here….but I wouldn’t make book on it.

Comment by NYCityBoy
2009-09-24 06:34:56

I visited Toronto in 1995 and 2006. The difference in the city was beyond belief.

 
Comment by polly
2009-09-24 06:43:01

Their home mortgages are a little different than ours - thirty year fixed is almost unknown - and I expect they didn’t go quite as far as we did into teaser rates and negative amortization, but they seem to believe that this means they won’t have a crash at all. If the building is still that busy, sounds like their commercial lending sector is going to be hurting soon.

A weak US dollar can make things tough for Canada. They have a lot of industry that has developed because they were a lower cost place to produce stuff (cars, TV shows, etc) than the US but without much problem with shipping costs. And US tourists are much more tight fisted when the dollars are at parity. It would be interesting to see the impact if it was US$1.20 to CA$1.00…

Comment by Al
2009-09-24 07:05:39

“…and I expect they didn’t go quite as far as we did into teaser rates..”

From TD Bank:
1 year fixed: 3.75%
3 year fixed: 4.45%
5 year fixed: 5.5%
10 year fixed: 6.7%

Most people are taking 1-3 year mortgages at these kind of rates. So officially there are no teaser rates, we just have a mortgage system that is designed to mimic the effect. Most new mortgages are 35 year amortizations, and all of Canada is recourse. Lot of pain coming.

“…but they seem to believe that this means they won’t have a crash at all.”

Oh but we’ve had our crash. When the media finally started covering the popping of the US bubble, prices here dropped slightly in some markets. That was ‘the crash’. I can’t wait to hear the ‘experts’ telling us that no one could have seen the real crash coming.

Comment by polly
2009-09-24 10:42:45

100% recourse? Oh, ouch.

What about negatice amortization? Did you guys ever get into that? Opition ARMS (pick a pay)?

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Comment by Al
2009-09-24 11:28:50

I’m not aware of any neg am or pick a pays, but we had cash back.

 
Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2009-09-24 11:42:48

Should be a similar effect, then. Cash-back is just neg-am in different clothing: you are underwater in a single transaction rather than underwater one drip at a time.

The one big difference might be that neg-am/pick-a-pays might tend to inflate prices higher due to their prevalence as “affordability products” to shoe-horn people into more house than they can afford.

 
Comment by Al
2009-09-24 12:18:09

If you google “demographia housing”, there is a survey on housing affordability which covers Canada and the US, as well as several other countries. It has median house prices and incomes for numerous cities, and provides the multiplier. Data is from Q3 2008.

Toronto: 4.8
Vancouver: 8.4
Los Angeles: 7.2
Las Vegas: 3.7

 
 
 
 
Comment by darthrealtor
2009-09-24 06:53:05

I was also there in the beginning of August. They’re gulping the cool-aid en masse up there. It’s crazy.

 
 
Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 05:41:23

To the beautiful ladies Jane and Ahansen:

Thank you for the kind words yesterday. Lot of great people on here.

Also, Jane, you hit the nail right on the head. If I would had lowered my expectations re “put up with the boss daughter bullpoopy”, I would not be unemployed today.

If I had it to do over, that is what I would have done. Mistake.

Thanks again.

ATE

 
Comment by wmbz
2009-09-24 05:56:28

A San Francisco lawyer has looked at this notion of independence and concludes: “Although America successfully seceded from the British Empire in 1776, today, more than 200 years later, it is in no way ‘independent.’ Its many dependencies include its reliance on debt to finance its operations; it looks to foreign manufacturers to provide basic goods; it is at the mercy of oil sheiks for its energy needs; and, it depends on global and regional organizations like the United Nations, NATO, and other entangling alliances to conduct diplomacy.”

Independence Requires Independents.

Jerry Salcido is a young fellow who surveyed the social landscape and decided financial debt was a destructive component, not only for individuals but for nations as well. He quotes Thomas Jefferson, who remarked that if the United States were to “preserve [its] independence” Americans could not allow the federal government to burden itself with perpetual debt.

Comment by packman
2009-09-24 06:30:53

Its many dependencies include its reliance on debt to finance its operations

Yep. Coincidentally - for some reason I haven’t heard anyone commenting how Britain has suddenly become the biggest buyer of U.S. Debt for the last few months.

Jan -> July:

China: $60.9 B
Japan: $89.3 B
UK: $96.1 B

Comment by darthrealtor
2009-09-24 06:54:41

With our incestual and corrupt financial system I wouldn’t be suprised if the largest buyer of UK debt was the US.

Comment by NYCityBoy
2009-09-24 06:56:33

With our incestual and corrupt financial system

Maybe we should name our financial system after John Phillips.

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Comment by darthrealtor
2009-09-24 07:01:02

Ewwwww…..we’ve all just been Philliped!

 
Comment by Sammy Schadenfreude
2009-09-24 07:44:05

In fairness to John Philips, his talentless, washed-up dope-fiend of a daughter is trying to flog a book on her wasted and pointless life, which is of interest to maybe five people on the planet. Nothing like a incest claim with her famous dad to spur sales and get her ravaged face on the talk-show circuit, even if it’s probably a complete fabrication.

 
 
Comment by measton
2009-09-24 07:06:47

With our incestual and corrupt financial system I wouldn’t be suprised if the largest buyer of UK debt was the US.

a little quid pro quo, everyone can point and say look the foreigners are buying our bonds.

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Comment by potential buyer
2009-09-24 16:14:17

see saw, marjorie daw

US: Your turn to buy debt

UK: Nahaaaa, you still have 1.5 weeks to go!

 
 
Comment by packman
2009-09-24 07:08:30

With our incestual and corrupt financial system I wouldn’t be suprised if the largest buyer of UK debt was the US.

I was thinking that myself, though don’t have any links to UK debt data.

Like two drowning people trying to save each other. It won’t work out well.

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Comment by packman
2009-09-24 07:10:55

(Tin foil hat time)

To follow up on that - I wonder if somehow it’s the central banks that are buying each others’ treasury debt. That way they get to do QE a little more under the radar.

 
Comment by darthrealtor
2009-09-24 07:28:46

I’ve been scouring the net and I can’t find that data either. If anyone has a link to who owns UK sovereign debt please post it.

 
Comment by NYCityBoy
2009-09-24 07:33:26

No tin foil there. That has been widely discussed on blogs. The Fed is laundering money through other central banks to increase the size of the purchases that come from foreign entities but are really from The Fed.

 
 
 
Comment by darthrealtor
2009-09-24 06:57:10

Hmmm….it’s also interesting to note that the UK has basically tripled it’s holding of US debt in the past year. Very odd.

 
Comment by edgewaterjohn
2009-09-24 07:55:30

When push comes to shove there’s no axis like the London-DC axis. Let’s see how the rest of the world reacts to it this time around. Could a true test for Anglo-American hegemony be in the works, or are our boyz still the best?

Comment by packman
2009-09-24 09:08:10

Probably better characterized as a “London-NY axis, with DC as a branch line”.

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Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 06:03:23

Geithner:
“Brother, can you spare $112 BILLION?”
This is truly alarming: If you’re like me, you can remember a time not too long ago when U.S. Treasury borrowing was less than $112 billion for an entire year. Now, we’re borrowing that much in less than one week!

That is so scary, I literally, literally, got up and threw up in the bathroom. Of course, my nerves are shot right now anyway. I asked my landlord (age 72) who is a smart man, said: “Hey Bill, you ever seen it this bad in your life”?

He said, “I have never seen anything like this, ever”.

Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 06:41:27

Time for you to stop worrying and learn to love the debt bomb, pal…

Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 07:02:57

OK Prof. B. I guess we can learn anything, huh?

 
 
Comment by Sammy Schadenfreude
2009-09-24 07:48:20

ATE-UP, I worry about you. Seriously. You seem to have a nervous and jittery disposition. Times like these call for sterner stuff. The situation is what it is: the most appropriate response is to get your own affairs in order, and to actively join and back the few individuals and organizations of integrity who are fighting to restore sanity and accountability to the system.

Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 07:59:39

Sammy, thanks, and I say it because I think you mean it. I was an only child, and yes, I am scared. I have good friends, a bunch, but need to get back to work, that’s all.

I appreciate your comments, and, in fact, I have changed my mind about you. You are a good guy.

Just need to get to work.

You know, Sammy, knowing this country is going to hell, is not easy to deal with. One might say, better off having your Ostrich (Oly, How do you spell Ostrich?) head buried in the sand.

Thank you for your comment, and I took it it constructively.

ATE

Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 08:10:06

Also, and not to sound whiny, I buried both parents. So, No Mas family.

We all have it hard, and you are right Sammy, it is time to step up to the plate.

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Comment by Sammy Schadenfreude
2009-09-24 09:45:13

Lack of family - dependable, immediate family - would make facing what’s coming that much scarier. I am fortunate in that regard, which makes a huge difference and would help explain the anxiety on your part. It helps to know that good solid kinsmen have your back. Also, I’m pretty sure every generation since 1776 feels the country is going to hell - we’ve survived worse - and hard times might force us as a nation and people to get our priorities in order and start behaving like responsible citizens, which is long overdue.

I try to do what I can, help where I can, and raise my kids to be part of the solution instead of adding to the problem. Beyond that, you have to be somewhat fatalistic - what will be will be, and you can’t afford to become maladroit with fear. Man proposes, God disposes, as General Grant said.

 
Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 09:57:10

You’re cool Sammy and I have totally changed my mind about you. I was wrong.

 
Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2009-09-24 14:01:03

Lack of family - dependable, immediate family - would make facing what’s coming that much scarier.

Not necessarily true.

I lost both my parents too.

If you are the strongest link in the family, you have no one to lean on. If you are the weakest of the group, the strongest can be encouraging and lift you up.

Of the survivers in my family, I’m the strongest and most independent and most adaptable with several years worth of living expenses in government securities and gold bullion. I have to worry about my family - they are nice and well meaning, but they are absolutely clueless on saving money and issues we’ve discussed here for years. They are reactive and not proactive. I’m not worried about me. It would be better if I had no family, but I cannot really say that. I don’t wish anything bad for my family. I cannot turn away from them.

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 19:00:47

Also, I’m pretty sure every generation since 1776 feels the country is going to hell - we’ve survived worse - …”

That’s an insight I have recently enjoyed myself.

 
Comment by Sammy Schadenfreude
2009-09-24 19:58:40

You’re cool Sammy and I have totally changed my mind about you. I was wrong.

Thanks, ATE-UP, but I’d say the jury’s still out on that, since I do seem to have a talent for pissing people off. Not intentionally, for the most part.

Anyhow, I hope you get back to work, soon, doing something you enjoy and that pays the bills. I know what it is to be unemployed and feel that knawing anxiety. Right now things are going well for me but life can turn on a dime, something I’ve learned the hard way too many times. Anyway, brother, keep your head held high and your conscience clean - at the end of the day that’s the best that we can do.

 
Comment by ahansen
2009-09-24 21:14:53

“…I have recently enjoyed myself.”

Me, too, Prof. These last couple of years have been a total hoot for all of us Cassandra types. (Or Eris’s…I’m not sure which is more appropriate these days.) For sheer roller-coaster exhilaration, how could anything possibly out-do the markets of last summer and winter? And the challenges ahead have focused our national debate like nothing since Vietnam.

Scary, terrible, and…redemptive—- in a “what’s-really-important-to-you?” sort of way.

 
 
 
Comment by CentralCoastDude
2009-09-24 10:07:28

or go fishing…

 
Comment by james
2009-09-24 13:23:52

Wow Sammy, you are just killing me today. Restoring integrity to the system. You got a Chicago President with a first lady Hillary that was neck deep in corruption last time.

The in power party was buttock deep in a super massive bailout with no accountability just last year and the new guys all voted for it.

Only places you can turn to are Green and Libertarian fringes.

Maybe the church people can help.

 
 
 
Comment by michael
Comment by sleepless_near_seattle
2009-09-24 07:03:15

Wow. I didn’t realize EMTs only made $28k-ish.

Comment by edgewaterjohn
2009-09-24 08:04:19

EMTs are the tip of the iceberg. It’s a good think so many workers choose to impale themselves on the lance of debt by voluntarily chasing “homes” and shiny cars instead of looking deeper into their situation, otherwise there could be trouble.

 
Comment by In Colorado
2009-09-24 11:26:05

And yet an ambulance ride costs over a $1000

Comment by awaiting wipeout
2009-09-24 17:07:36

When I settled my late father’s ambulance bills, the girl in confidence (w/the LAFD )told me the illegals in Los Angeles are using them as a taxi for non-emergencies to ER. The law requires them to pick up and transport, once a call comes in,and the illegals know it. That’s part of the $1,000-. I hear ya.

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Comment by oxide
2009-09-24 11:44:36

I guess EMT’s don’t make much money because they don’t “work hard” enough. Lazy bums. Get a real job. No health benefits; go work for the federal gov. Why should *I* pay for your health care? You’re taking my tax money etc…

/talking points

 
Comment by Jon
2009-09-24 12:11:59

EMT’s make a lot more than that. It just appears to be 28kish if you look at the hourly rate. Throw in mandatory overtime, and pay doubles quickly.

Comment by DD
2009-09-24 19:34:00

No they don’t make more than that. The hours and stress they are under to save lives and they really do not make more than that. Unless they own the Biz. Which most don’t.

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Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 06:52:45

“Come January 2010, seniors may do a double take after seeing their Social Security checks. The two to three percentage-point increase in benefits they usually get each year won’t be there”.

Hi! Ms. Canary! Carry the Lantern High. (Bill Wyman/Stones).

 
Comment by measton
2009-09-24 07:03:46

NPR quote today

Gen Y teens have more discretionary income than Baby Boombers.

Hard to believe.

Comment by michael
2009-09-24 07:07:12

what comes after gen z?

Comment by Sammy Schadenfreude
2009-09-24 07:50:37

The End of the World as We Know It?

Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 13:29:40

REM.

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Comment by cobaltblue
2009-09-24 09:34:15

Gen Zzz

 
 
Comment by jfp
2009-09-24 10:18:51

Although I’m not a member of generation Y, I will say that few things teach financial discipline like watching your parents struggle with retarded amounts of debt.

Comment by packman
2009-09-24 10:42:44

One would think - which is probably why the “greatest generation” is currently the last of the true savers. They were kids during the great depression, and saw the debt that their parents had to deal with; which incidentally - while high for its time - is nothing compared with today’s debt levels.

However unfortunately the lesson our kids today are learning is - get deep enough into debt and you can just bail, or be bailed, and no problem. You’re covered by the suckers who thought that prudent savings was the way to wealth.

Comment by In Montana
2009-09-24 14:55:26

Just thinking about my parents, who were from that era. Mom was a bit irresponsible but still had that basic caution. I think at bottom, they still thought they were doing well to have enough food to eat and a roof over their heads. The rest was gravy.

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Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 07:04:55

This article about the expensive housing in La Jolla showed up yesterday in CNN and resurfaced today in the San Diego Union-Tribune. The claim that a plain-vanilla middle manager’s house (2200 sq ft, 4 brs, 3 1/2 baths) in La Jolla was currently valued at $2,125,000 struck me as absurd, so I did a little checking on the MLS. The data I post below represents current list prices for the median-list-price home and a few slightly more expensive listings. Several of them appear to be much larger than 2200 square feet, and all of them are listed below $1,900,000 ($225,000 below the supposed “median value” mentioned in the article).

I have to assume that under current market conditions, most homes are selling at a considerable discount to list price. As I posted yesterday, last month’s DataQuick numbers show the following for single-family home sales in La Jolla:

La Jolla 92037 31 $1,354,500 -24.8%

I.e., a total of 31 single family homes sold with a median sale price of $1,354,500, down 24.8 percent in price from August 2008.

Don’t journalists have to bother checking their facts anymore these days?

La Jolla called most expensive housing market in U.S. again
Area one of two in top 10 that saw prices increase :-)
By Roger Showley
Union-Tribune Staff Writer

2:00 a.m. September 24, 2009

For the second straight year, La Jolla is the nation’s most expensive housing market, according to Coldwell Banker’s home price index.

The real estate brokerage bases its rankings on the price of 2,200-square-foot homes with four bedrooms and 3½ baths. The La Jolla price was listed at $2,125,000, up $282,333 or 16.6 percent from last year.

The lowest-priced similar home went for $112,675 in Grayling, Mich., a town of about 2,000 that calls itself the “canoe capital of the world.” La Jolla calls itself “the jewel.”

Rick Hoffman, president of Coldwell Banker Residential Brokerage in San Diego, said La Jolla owes its high standing to its unique location and amenities.

“It’s a very desirable place to live,” he said, and its prices have held up better than many neighborhoods locally.
—————————————————————————–
From ZipRealty dot com:

7221 EADS La Jolla, 92037
$1,855,000 - $1,925,000
Est. Monthly Payment: $12,341*

Beds: 4 | Baths: 3 | Sq. Ft.: 2,320 | $/Sq.Ft.: $800 | Lot Size: N/A
Year Built: 1998 | Listing Date: 07/26/09
Description: Prime location in the village with walking distance to all schools, beach, shopping + separate… more

1306 NAUTILUS La Jolla, 92037
$1,875,000
Est. Monthly Payment: $12,474*
Beds: 4 | Baths: 3 | Sq. Ft.: 2,983 | $/Sq.Ft.: $629 | Lot Size: 19,602 Sq. Ft.
Year Built: 1990 | Listing Date: 06/01/09
Description: Put this beautiful and spacious home on your must see list! The open plan 27′x 24′ great room… more

2521 VIA VIESTA La Jolla, 92037
$1,875,000
Est. Monthly Payment: $12,474*
Beds: 4 | Baths: 4 | Sq. Ft.: 3,284 | $/Sq.Ft.: $571 | Lot Size: 12,600 Sq. Ft.
Year Built: 1963 | Listing Date: 02/03/09
Description: What a location! What a view! On the main level, this gracious 4 br/2.5 ba home offers soaring… more

5961 LA JOLLA MESA DRIVE La Jolla, 92037
$1,879,000
Est. Monthly Payment: $12,501*
Beds: 3 | Baths: 2 | Sq. Ft.: 2,674 | $/Sq.Ft.: $703 | Lot Size: 25,265 Sq. Ft.
Year Built: 1975 | Listing Date: 04/03/09
Description: High ceilings, open floor plan, views of mission bay and the pacific ocean, fireworks every night… more

5453 CARDENO DRIVE La Jolla, 92037
$1,888,000
Est. Monthly Payment: $12,560*
Beds: 5 | Baths: 5 | Sq. Ft.: 3,883 | $/Sq.Ft.: $486 | Lot Size: 20,865 Sq. Ft.
Year Built: 1998 | Listing Date: 07/14/09
Description: La jolla alta custom series. Large home with plenty of additional amenities on the sunny side of… more

7412 HIGH La Jolla, 92037
$1,895,000
Est. Monthly Payment: $12,607*
Beds: 3 | Baths: 3 | Sq. Ft.: 1,700 | $/Sq.Ft.: $1,115 | Lot Size: N/A
Year Built: 1948 | Listing Date: 08/28/09
Description: Quality remodeled home on a quiet corner is a short walk to the village. This beautiful home has… more

7972 LA JOLLA SHORES La Jolla, 92037
$1,895,000
Est. Monthly Payment: $12,607*
Beds: 3 | Baths: 3 | Sq. Ft.: 2,112 | $/Sq.Ft.: $897 | Lot Size: 7,740 Sq. Ft.
Year Built: 1947 | Listing Date: 08/10/09
Description: Outstanding california living in this beautifully remodeled mid-century modern beach bungalow… more

921 SKYLARK La Jolla, 92037
$1,895,000
Est. Monthly Payment: $12,607*
Beds: 3 | Baths: 2 | Sq. Ft.: 2,150 | $/Sq.Ft.: $881 | Lot Size: 17,000 Sq. Ft.
Year Built: 1960 | Listing Date: 06/26/09
Description: Unobstructed panoramic ocean, bay, downtown views on 17,000 square foot lot. Remodeled and chic… more

1127 VIRGINIA La Jolla, 92037
$1,895,000 - $2,050,000
Est. Monthly Payment: $12,607*
Beds: 3 | Baths: 3 | Sq. Ft.: 2,470 | $/Sq.Ft.: $767 | Lot Size: N/A
Year Built: 1930 | Listing Date: 06/30/09
Description: From the moment you enter this sophisticated nantucket charmer in the heart of the village, you… more

1997 CALLE MADRIGAL La Jolla, 92037
$1,895,000
Est. Monthly Payment: $12,607*
Beds: 5 | Baths: 6 | Sq. Ft.: 3,932 | $/Sq.Ft.: $482 | Lot Size: 20,386 Sq. Ft.
Year Built: 1972 | Listing Date: 08/24/09
Description: Gorgeous canyon surroundings on a beautiful muirlands west cul-de-sac, vast square footage, and… more

1353 WEST MUIRLANDS DRIVE La Jolla, 92037
$1,899,000
Est. Monthly Payment: $12,634*
Beds: 3 | Baths: 3 | Sq. Ft.: 3,330 | $/Sq.Ft.: $570 | Lot Size: 17,424 Sq. Ft.
Year Built: 1952 | Listing Date: 01/21/09

Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 07:37:22

My apologies. Due to a counting error, I misquoted the median list priced La Jolla SFR currently on the MLS. I post in the corrected quote below (there are currently three listings at the median asking price of $2,495,000). But note that the listings I posted above are more comparable with the 2,200 sq ft sized home mentioned in the Coldwell-Banker study. One would expect a 3,045 square foot home to sell for quite a bit more than a 2,200 sq ft home.

8695 GLENWICK La Jolla, 92037
$2,495,000
Est. Monthly Payment: $16,599*

Beds: 4 | Baths: 3 | Sq. Ft.: 3,045 | $/Sq.Ft.: $819 | Lot Size: 8,100 Sq. Ft.
Year Built: 1990 | Listing Date: 04/13/09
Description: This single level soft contemporary home has been tastefully remodeled with a spanish flair and… more

Comment by DD
2009-09-24 11:09:16

fireworks every night… more

Every night? I guess that house with views in Del Mar -1974 @ $70k should have been my first purchase. Now worth? over 1 mill. Even then the houses in La Jolla were through the roof, but nowhere near 1.mill+ Yep, I know they all have added granite so that must make up for the difference in 74 prices and 09 ? Same views. But Fireworks every night. Add that and granite and you have that extra comma.

Comment by packman
2009-09-24 11:20:45

fireworks every night

“I do not think that means what you think it means”
- Inigo Montoya

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Comment by DD
2009-09-24 11:36:29

LOL. but it did say that in the ad.

Plus, Disneyland is nowhere around LaJolla and that is the only place I know that has real fireworks every night.

 
Comment by San Diego RE Bear
2009-09-24 12:45:00

I think Sea World has fireworks every night during the summer but don’t quote me on that.

 
Comment by CA renter
2009-09-25 01:49:37

Yes, they are probably referring to Sea World.

Hi, SD! :)

 
 
 
 
Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2009-09-24 07:38:59

Since visiting San Diego as a teenager back in 1974, La Jolla has been my number one pick of places I would love to have an ocean view house at. And also a ski chalet at Lake Tahoe.

Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 07:42:52

$1.35 million sounds downright reasonable compared to the $2.25 million market value claimed in that article, doesn’t it?

 
Comment by CentralCoastDude
2009-09-24 10:09:22

Ever been to Santa Barbara? Makes La Jolla look like Anaheim.

Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2009-09-24 11:14:08

Yeah I have, more than to San Diego. SB is nice but too small. I need more people to hide among.

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Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 09:23:29

One more thing: SD Ziprealty shows 282 La Jolla SFRs on the market, and Foreclosure dot com shows 361 homes listed. If the same proportion of Foreclosure dot com listings are assumed to be condos on the MLS, that would leave roughly 225 SFRs on Foreclosure dot com. Assuming no overlap w/ the MLS, there are over 500 SFRs in La Jolla currently on the market — more than 16 months supply at the recent pace of 31 sales per month (500/31 = 16.12 months). I am surprised the wealthy Chinese real estate investors are not snapping up La Jolla residences like hot cakes, given how much their prices have fallen (especially in currency-adjusted terms)!

Comment by DD
2009-09-24 11:12:29

Makes me think, might become affordable ’some time’ but the taxes and the monthly of any portion over say 200k much less anywhere near 1mill is way to much monthly,yearly.
Who has that kind of money anyway? What the hell did I do wrong?

Nothing, just school of hard knocks. PHD. Right thinking, wrong timing.

 
 
 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 07:12:44

Why is the US stock market suddenly so dependent on home sales? A couple of years ago, an army of trolls posted on this blog to suggest the housing market and Wall Street were fundamentally decoupled. What changed?

It is kind of hilarious when financial journalists comment on the significance of two or three point up or down movements on the DJIA at levels approaching 10K. It looks to me as though the PPT is holding the line just fine so far this morning.

market pulse

Sept. 24, 2009, 10:06 a.m. EDT
U.S. stocks dip into red after housing data

NEW YORK (MarketWatch) — U.S. stocks turned lower on Thursday after disappointing news on the housing market. The Dow Jones Industrial Average (INDU 9,750, +1.59, +0.02%) fell 3.70 points to 9,743.41. The S&P 500 declined 1.82 points to 1,059.05, while the Nasdaq Composite (COMP 2,121, -10.87, -0.51%) fell 5.62 points to 2,125.80.

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 07:16:27

Sept. 24, 2009, 8:50 a.m. EDT

Former Fed Chief Volcker backs keeping central bank power
Volcker: proposals to remove the Fed’s supervisory authority would be mistake
By Ronald D. Orol, MarketWatch

WASHINGTON (MarketWatch) — Former Federal Reserve Chairman Paul Volcker on Thursday said he opposed congressional calls to take away the central bank’s authority over everything bank related except monetary policy.

Volcker, who chair’s President Obama’s new economic advisory panel, said in testimony prepared for delivery to the House Financial Services Committee that removing the Fed’s supervisory authority over banks would be a mistake. The Fed currently completes onsite exams and sets capital and liquidity standards for financial institutions.

“The Federal Reserve Board should not become an academic seminar debating in its marble palace various approaches toward monetary policy without the leavening experience of direct contact with, and responsibility for, the world of finance and the institutions through which monetary policy is effected,” Volcker said.

Comment by measton
2009-09-24 07:36:46

If you accept that there needs to be a rate setting entity like the FED, I think you can make a logical arguement about not allowing that to become a political tool and thus having an indepent FED, but why would anyone favor giving them any regulatory power is beyond me.

Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 09:25:00

They’ve always had the power to regulate the banking system, and if you look at the history of the banking system since 1980, you can see how effectively they have wielded it (not too effectively, IMHO).

 
 
 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 07:21:22

Phasing out the $8K “first-time homebuyer’s” tax credit could be an excellent measure to help restore housing market affordability. But some NAR representatives are sounding alarm bells that doing so would result in a double-dip recession. Doesn’t economic recovery depend on affordable housing, which can help entice workers where they are most needed in a recovering job market?

The idea that there would be no buyers without the $8K credit is misguided, as it ignores the market’s ability to simultaneously adjust price levels and the flow of sales.

Economic Report

Sept. 24, 2009, 10:01 a.m. EDT

Existing home sales drop 2.7% in August to 5.10 million pace
Realtors push for extension of federal home-buyer subsidy

By Rex Nutting, MarketWatch

WASHINGTON (MarketWatch) - Resales of U.S. homes dropped 2.7% in August to a seasonally adjusted annual rate of 5.10 million, the first decline in five months, the National Association of Realtors reported Thursday.

Inventories of unsold homes on the market declined by 10.8% to 3.62 million, representing an 8.5-month supply at the August sales pace, the lowest since April 2007. The inventory figures are not seasonally adjusted. The drop in inventories was much larger than the historic norm for August, the trade group said.

The August existing-home sales figures represent “a mild retreat from a very strong gain in July,” said Lawrence Yun, chief economist for the real estate trade group. The August sales pace was the second highest in 23 months, he said.

The decline in sales was unexpected by most economists. The median forecast by economists surveyed by MarketWatch was for a small gain to a 5.40 million annual rate from 5.25 million in July.

Sales are up 13.6% from January’s bottom.

“We are very close to reaching the point of a self-sustaining recovery,” Yun said. The realtors are still “lobbying very hard” for Congress to extend and expand the $8,000 tax credit for first-time home buyers. Yun defined “self-sustaining” as stable or rising prices, which would encourage buyers who are waiting for prices to bottom out before taking the plunge.

Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 07:23:46

“We are very close to reaching the point of a self-sustaining recovery,”

I guess that means that not only can the $8K first-time buyer’s credit be eliminated, but it will also no longer be necessary to slap taxpayer-funded federal guarantees on mortgages, or for the Fed to purchase 80 percent of new mortgages. This is great news for US taxpayers with no interest in funneling money into the housing market in order to keep prices propped up on an unaffordably high plateau!

Comment by pressboardbox
2009-09-24 07:44:06

No more gov money for GM or AIG either. Fannie and Freddie can stand on their own and $hit now smells like fresh rose petals. This is great news. So glad the crisis is over.

Comment by mina
2009-09-24 11:58:04

They all talk about a double dip recession even though there is no data to indicate that we have left the first recession.

Some kind of brain washing is going on here …

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Comment by packman
2009-09-24 12:57:34

One problem is the actual terminology. “Double-dip recession” implies that there’s actually a rise after the first recession; and that in fact “recession” refers to a “low” economic period.

However a recession isn’t defined that way (at least by the NBER) - it’s not defined as a “low” period - it’s defined as the downslope into a low period. The problem is that most people psychologically consider the low period itself to be “in a recession”.

In other words - it’s a question of the definition of recession being “the act of recessing” vs. “the state of being in a recessed period.”. The government likes to use the former, to make us feel good about “coming out of the recession” even though we’re still in the depths of low economic activity and high unemployment.

That’s going to be especially true this time, when we’ve had such a hard fall, and true recovery will be extremely slow to non-existent for a long time.

 
Comment by DD
2009-09-24 19:38:54

I am seeing some building going on, and serious road repair out here. But lots and lots of for lease signs.

 
 
 
 
Comment by measton
2009-09-24 07:30:10

This should be the peak effect of the credit, ie everyone worried that they have to get in there and buy before it goes away.

Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 07:40:20

They will have to wait until the credit expires (or has nearly expired) to announce its renewal and possible expansion, in order to maximize the “buy now or lose out on the credit” effect and the “surprise — the credit is back and bigger than ever before” effect.

Cargo cultists, take note :-)

Comment by DD
2009-09-24 11:21:06

Friend is looking to buy before she retires, she and retired H so financing will be easy for her to get. Says the agents are telling her of all cash buyers who are swooping in at prices now, so that is why the prices aren’t going down further in our zip anytime soon. Other friend who is RE mentioned that his office is seeing the same things, Infestors buying up chunks of property, sfrs etc at these prices or lower for all. So, that leaves friend and others dealing with some multiple offers situations, if they can’t Cash out. Now if prices were much lower, she would go all cash, but the prices are still to high.

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Comment by edgewaterjohn
2009-09-24 08:09:54

No kidding, maybe those newly erupted bidding wars the agents have been bragging about are taking a toll?

And it’s a sad day when Yun plays John Wayne and the agents are the calvary. Nah, they’re more like “F Troop”.

Comment by ecofeco
2009-09-24 16:08:10

The end of the Civil War was near,
When quite accidentally,
A hero who sneezed, abruptly seized
Retreat and reversed it to victory.

His Medal of Honor pleased and thrilled
His proud little family group.
While pinning it on, some blood was spilled,
And so it was planned he’d command … F-Troop!

Where Indian fights are colorful sights
And nobody takes a lickin’,
Where paleface and redskin
Both turn chicken.

When drilling and fighting get them down,
They know their morale can’t droop,
As long as they all relax in town
Before they resume, with a bang and a boom … F-Troop!

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Comment by measton
2009-09-24 07:27:29

Sept. 24 (Bloomberg) — Sales of existing U.S. homes unexpectedly fell in August for the first time in four months, signaling the housing recovery will be slow to gain speed.

Purchases dropped 2.7 percent

Given the pending deadline for the 8k credit this is shocking, and it makes a 15k credit seem more likely.

Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2009-09-24 07:33:32

Yep! This is fun to watch! Got coffee?

 
Comment by shelby
2009-09-24 07:34:41

I MIGHT get off the fence if they’re handing out 15K next year..we will also be over the 3 years-since-we’ve-owned hump too :)

Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 07:38:55

We are going to hold out for the $25K credit offered at the end of next year :-)

Comment by Sammy Schadenfreude
2009-09-24 07:52:16

I’d like to hold out for the 50% haircut by 2011. They can keep their silly $8K/15K/25K tax credit.

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Comment by shelby
2009-09-24 08:00:05

Ok!
We’ll wait for the 50% haircut by 2011 & the 25K tax credit as well!

Oh wait - not happening here!

We’re in D.C. & have all the money & all the jobs (the ones left!) don’t ya know!

Capital of the free world, don’t ya know.

All the rich Contractors live here & suck off the the Government

Our RE Market is always artificially proped up :(

Damn!

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 10:03:22

How is it that we are going to get a 50% haircut when the Fed is working as hard as it can behind the scenes to prop up housing prices?

 
Comment by james
2009-09-24 16:30:40

Some WAGs. I think the growing rift between the treasury, Fed, taxpayers, China will do it. Possibly even more than that.

At some point the Fed might start looking at cutting its losses with some of the larger institutions.

The Fed bank members get together and vote on this stuff and on different officers. Would not be shocked if you get different camps. One set will probably have offloaded MBS and preserved capital and be looking secure the dollar (and create bargins for themselves).

The other group will be leveraged to the hilt for maximized returns but will be vunerable.

The banks don’t get extra votes based on size either. Just one vote per bank. Membership means you are in a bank that participates in treasury options.

Oh, and there is that little option ARM thing, the CRE thing all going on in the background. Meanwhile, Barrak is trying to figure out what his head is and what his ass is.

The unions are starting to line up on these tarrifs pretty fast.

 
 
 
Comment by CarrieAnn
2009-09-24 13:28:44

If we’re still on stand-by next spring we might as well wait until we hit the 3 year mark later in the fall. If I was planning on buying soon anyway, I’d hold off a purchase until I could get that $15k gift, seeing as we’ll soon be paying for it whether it helps us or not. So in our case, it might delay a sale, maybe even end up preventing one should things turn really south before the 3 year mark.

Unintended consequences and all that.

 
 
 
Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 07:31:38

A moment of crystal clarity… an epiphany if you will…

This whole gig is about Devo covering “Satisfaction” 28 years ago. Now my tummy feels better.

Comment by ecofeco
2009-09-24 16:17:37

Are we not men?

 
 
Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 07:50:28

Gold’s tanking today, re housing data.

That is why I don’t pay too much attention to what it does day-to-day…

Comment by Sammy Schadenfreude
2009-09-24 07:54:19

http://www.kitco.com/market/

Down $10 isn’t exactly tanking, just normal volatility. Though Ido expect a substantial drop to under $900 in the near future.

Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 08:07:58

Yeah. I saw gold go up and down 80 bucks in one day not to long ago.

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 09:51:29

Even though the gold price appears to be pegged at $1000/oz?

 
 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 10:04:40

Saying that “gold is tanking” seems rather at odds with extreme price stickiness at $1000/oz. It looks to me more as though the international central banking cartel has decided the price is currently right at that level, and is taking measures to fix it there.

Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 10:07:49

P.S. Commodities and stock prices appear considerably less sticky, though there is a fair amount of evidence to suggest their daily movement range is “contained.” Whether this is due to market forces, technical constraints on the market’s operation or intervention by 800 lb gorillas who can move prices is beyond the limits of my knowledge of what drives daily share price movements…

 
Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 12:48:42

I agree Prof. B. You know more than me, so that, in part, is why I agree.

 
 
 
Comment by wmbz
2009-09-24 08:14:08

August hotel occupancy falls to 58 percent
Orlando Business Journal September 24, 2009,

Orlando’s hotel occupancy continued to decline for the month of August with a 8.9 percent drop.

Orlando’s occupancy numbers dropped from 63.7 percent in 2008 to 58 percent in 2009, said Smith Travel Research.

In addition, revenue per available room — a key factor used to assess hotel profitability — fell from $56.75 in August 2008 to $44.26 for the same period this year, a 22 percent decline.

Average daily room rate followed the same trend with a 14.4 percent decline from $89.11 in 2008 to $76.29 this year.

State and national occupancy numbers also declined, by 7.1 percent and 9.9 percent respectively.

Revenue per available room dropped 16.7 percent in Florida from $56.18 in August 2008 to $46.79 for the month this year.

National revenue per available room fell 19 percent, from $72.37 last year to $58.65 in 2009.

Comment by edgewaterjohn
2009-09-24 09:00:58

Isn’t all of August one big vacay for the Euros? And don’t the Brits have a particular fondness for FLA.? Hmmmm.

Comment by hip in zilker
2009-09-24 12:09:33

The British papers this summer have had a lot of articles about vacationing in the UK and “staycation” activities.

 
Comment by Jon
2009-09-24 12:26:31

Nothing worse than standing in line in 100 degree heat with 99% humidity for 2 hours at DWorld behind some German dude who hasn’t bathed in a couple of days and is 5 minutes from heat stroke. I hate having to step over the stinky body as the line moves forward.

 
 
 
Comment by wmbz
2009-09-24 08:47:07

The Debtorship Society
More Americans became “homeowners” while owning less and less of their homes.
Tim Cavanaugh | October 2009 Print Edition

Real estate used to be a pretty lowbrow business. When my grandmother opened her agency in the 1950s, it was mildly groundbreaking for a lady to be involved in the grimy, pushy, mold-concealing business of hawking houses. When I accompanied my father on his own real estate agent rounds on a South Jersey barrier island during the Carter/Reagan years, the job seemed to alternate between long hours of cleaning up every form of human waste, heavy volumes of legal documentation, and brief, tense altercations with deadbeats, squatters, and shady contractors. The preferred weapon for this last exchange was a baseball bat.

http://reason.com/news/show/135716.html

 
Comment by wmbz
2009-09-24 09:08:24

Builders Design’s Model Home Annex Showroom To Close After 33 Years
Gaithersburg Maryland - September 24, 2009 — the Model Home Furniture Clearance Center Annex store developed by Builders Design will soon close its doors forever.

Since 1976, Builders Design has been recognized as the home building and construction industries preferred choice for all their interior design requirements. Builders Design has received numerous national and regional rewards from professional builders. The Model Home Clearance Center and the Annex are used to sell the display furniture from large projects all over the country. The slow-down in the housing market has resulted in a huge overstock of quality home furnishings from famous makers like Bernhardt, Flexsteel, Bassett, Hooker, Lexington, Pennsylvania House, Stanley, and many others. They also offer hundreds of one-of-a-kind fine handmade oriental rugs.

“The Annex Store Closing total liquidation is now in progress ,” said Anna Toretch showroom manager. “There are 2 showrooms and a very large warehouse on the property. All locations will be liquidated wall-to-wall. Now that the decision to close the annex has been made the general public will have a unique opportunity to see and buy the finest quality home furnishings at discounts below wholesale”. Toretch went on to say, “We have reductions of up to 75% on every item in the both showrooms. Over $2 million of home furnishings and handmade rugs will be sold as quickly as possible at the lowest prices in the area.” Toretch continues, “Every item in the multi-million dollar inventory will be sold, regardless of cost…This is a store closing total liquidation.”

The decision to close the annex showroom was made revealing plans for the closing event. In announcing the closing, Toretch stated, “The decision to close has been a difficult one. Everyone in the housing industry is struggling and we need to liquidate this inventory fast.

Comment by joeyinCalif
2009-09-24 09:20:27

..“Every item in the multi-million dollar inventory will be sold, regardless of cost…This is a store closing total liquidation.”

OMG! The furniture store around the corner from me goes out of business about 8 times a year is doing it again!

And get this: The big sign on the wall outside has those.. exact.. words.

Twilight Zone i tell ya.. spooky.

Comment by DD
2009-09-24 11:27:00

They always say this. One ad on tv shows a completely filled showroom in bk liquidation. Go to that showroom and maybe 1/4 of it is filled haphazardly and much of it is broken or ugly. Now I know where lots of the chinese junk went.

 
 
 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 09:48:22
Comment by joeyinCalif
2009-09-24 10:17:58

What difference does it make how many dollars it takes to buy an ounce of gold (unless one is speculating in currencies among people who think gold is a currency).

The important thing is how many eggs, or how much milk, or how much booze and bullets an ounce of gold can be traded for. And that depends not on the “value” of some currency, but on the law of supply and demand.

——–
People say fiat money has no value but then proceed to equate some number of valueless fiats with some amount of gold. What’s up with that?

Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 14:34:29

I agree with your point that it is the real value of money (including gold) that matters. My comment reflected the recent empirical regularity of gold sticking to $1000/oz like flies on ship with a trailing ‘t’ in place of ‘p’.

 
 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 19:13:07

Put on your tinfoil hats and tell me whether this information is whatsoever plausible. They seem to be suggesting that the Fed has surreptitious arrangements in place to hold down the price of The Precious™.

Fed admits hiding gold swap arrangements
Submitted by cpowell on Wed, 2009-09-23 02:55.
Section: Daily Dispatches

11p Tuesday, September 22, 2009

Dear Friend of GATA and Gold:

The Federal Reserve System has disclosed to GATA that it has gold swap arrangements with foreign banks that it does not want the public to know about.

The disclosure contradicts denials provided by the Fed to GATA in 2001 and suggests that the Fed is indeed very much involved in the surreptitious international central bank manipulation of the gold price particularly and the currency markets generally.

The Fed’s disclosure came this week in a letter to GATA’s Washington-area lawyer, William J. Olson of Vienna, Virginia (http://www.lawandfreedom.com/), denying GATA’s administrative appeal of a freedom-of-information request to the Fed for information about gold swaps, transactions in which monetary gold is temporarily exchanged between central banks or between central banks and bullion banks. (See the International Monetary Fund’s treatise on gold swaps here: http://www.imf.org/external/bopage/pdf/99-10.pdf.)

Comment by technovelist
2009-09-24 21:17:13

I wouldn’t call this information “plausible”, as it is certain to be true.

 
 
 
Comment by laurel, md
2009-09-24 10:09:21

There are three for sale REOs within 1,500 feet of my house. One on market for 18mn, one 12 mn, and one 2 mn. All with different not local, not big boy companies. One has a Virginia phone #, house is in MD. One is listed by MD-REO Reality.

Do banks bid out REO listings? Even if the out of area REs are on the MLS system the other children will not play with them.

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 10:11:46

Mightn’t this news be a Wii bit deflationary?

Sept. 24, 2009, 10:10 a.m. EDT · Recommend (2) · Post:
Nintendo cuts price of Wii console to $199
Reduction follows similar moves by Sony, Microsoft as game sales slow

By Dan Gallagher, MarketWatch

SAN FRANCISCO (MarketWatch) — Nintendo Ltd. cut the price of its popular Wii console by $50 to $199, the latest price reduction by video game console makers who have watched sales fall sharply over the last six months.

Late Wednesday, Nintendo (NTDO.Y 33.32, +0.54, +1.65%) issued a statement announcing the reduction, which had been widely expected across the gaming industry after rivals Sony Corp. and Microsoft Corp. scaled back the prices of their own consoles earlier this year.

It is the first time the Wii has seen a price reduction since its initial launch on the market in late 2006 — the longest a game console has ever gone at its initial price.

“We expect the price cut, coupled with the release of several key first-party titles, to spur demand for the console, helping to provide the console with some momentum going into the holiday season,” Edward Williams of BMO Capital Markets wrote in a note to clients Thursday.

Comment by michael
2009-09-24 10:16:08

“Mightn’t this news be a Wii bit deflationary?”

not necessarily…great pun though.

“…coupled with the release of several key first-party titles”

Comment by joeyinCalif
2009-09-24 10:28:51

it’s absolutely deflationary.. it’s what deflation is all about.

deflation is the hoarding of money.. doesn’t really matter how many dollars are out there. Doesn’t matter if the Fed and Treasury and banks are having a private orgy.

Money is not being spent in the markets. People are afraid to spend for whatever reasons.
—–
As a result of non-spending, you get Nintendo dropping it’s prices. That further encourages people to NOT spend since they see prices dropping, and they don’t want to spend precious dollars on falling cutlery.

If it gets so bad that the same happens to virtually all products in all markets, it’s called a deflationary spiral..

Comment by Skip
2009-09-24 14:08:51

It is not deflationary.

It is a Nintendo game console that came out 3 years ago. They have already shipped 50 million of them.

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Comment by joeyinCalif
2009-09-24 16:34:03

Hold on a sec..
In reference to deflation or inflation, what does it matter how long a product has been for sale, or how many units have been sold?

—–
Lets reverse it. Lets say Nintendo had reason to believe their company would somehow benefit by increasing the price by $50, and they do it.

Would that be inflationary?

I’d say yes.. certainly inflationary. You’d say… No?

No, because 3 years and 50 M units is some standard by which “inflation” or “deflation” can be determined?
No, because they’ve sold too many units, and for too long a time to increase price now? Therefore the price increase is not an inflationary force?

 
 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 14:32:14

I was joking, Joey. All new software products’ prices go down over time as newer, (hopefully) better stuff hits the markets.

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Comment by wmbz
2009-09-24 15:08:56

I would spend no time worrying about a deflationary spiral.

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Comment by joeyinCalif
2009-09-24 17:59:12

i think it’s worth a bit of time.. Lots of people around here propose the Fed not try to encourage spending. That, imo, would lead to serious deflation.

Having money doesn’t protect a person from deflation. Having money and nothing to buy with it, because producers have stopped producing or have gone out of business, is not fun.
Those working people with or without money can pretty much kiss their jobs goodbye..
——

Back in the G.Depression years, the Fed was legally unable to do what it’s doing today. (They had reached the near limit of money creation, since new money needed some gold backing).
Fed allowed a couple big banks to fail.. a lot of panic and runs on smaller, local banks followed. Some 10,000,000 savings accounts evaporated.

Deflation got serious in a hurry. Money supply shrunk by one third.

 
Comment by technovelist
2009-09-24 21:24:38

Having money doesn’t protect a person from deflation. Having money and nothing to buy with it, because producers have stopped producing or have gone out of business, is not fun.

This has to be one of the funniest statements I’ve read on this blog. Congratulations!

 
 
 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 11:08:56

I was frankly just trying to be punny. I would guess that new game technology products generally see declining prices over time, regardless of whether an economic crisis is playing out in the background.

Comment by oxide
2009-09-24 11:48:54

Oh don’t get all Wii-Wii’d up.

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Comment by wmbz
2009-09-24 10:17:29

Fed Cuts TAF, TSLF Loan Amounts
MarketWatch Pulse September 24, 2009

NEW YORK — The Federal Reserve Bank of New York said Thursday it would again reduce the amounts of credit offered under its Term Auction Facility and Term Securities Lending Facility, citing continued improvements in financial market conditions. The amount of some TAF loans will be reduced as low as $25 billion, down from $75 billion in the most recent operations and $150 billion offered during worse periods in the credit crisis. The 28-day operations scheduled through January will continue to be for $75 billion to account for possible year-end pressures. TSLF offerings will be reduced to $50 billion in October and $25 billion in the subsequent three months, after already reducing the frequency of operations and the type of securities accepted for exchange.

Comment by DD
2009-09-24 11:33:35

Doesnt’ anyone else get the idea that all these acronymed finance made up thingamajigs are way out of control?
Whatever happened to basic loans, basic paybacks, basic accounting where you can see where the money is and where it went?
You know the basic two books of accounting, the public one, and the hidden books. But all this other stuff is So out of control.

TTFN.

Comment by ecofeco
2009-09-24 16:26:59

Transparency and simplicity?

How… quaint and provincial.

3 card monte, er, modern financing “instruments” and “structures” require just a bit more sophistication.

 
 
 
Comment by wmbz
2009-09-24 10:27:51

Yo stimulator bucks at work… 25,000 new gubmint jobs, sweeet! That’ll get er done.

Stimulus funds boost number of federal jobs
USA TODAY
WASHINGTON — The $787 billion economic recovery package also is stimulating growth in the federal government as agencies hire thousands of workers and spend millions of dollars to oversee and implement the package, according to government records and spokesmen.

Fourteen of the top federal agencies responsible for spending under the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act say they’ve hired about 3,000 workers with stimulus money. That’s helped fuel the continued growth of the federal government, which increased by more than 25,000 employees, or 1.3%, since December 2008, according to the latest quarterly report. During that time, the ranks of the nation’s unemployed increased by nearly 4 million, Labor Department statistics show.

Overall, there are about 2 million federal workers, the data show.

Thirteen agencies that report stimulus-related administrative expenses separately on their weekly spending reports say they’ve spent $186.8 million so far on salaries and other overhead. Those agencies have reported spending $46.1 billion in stimulus funds overall.

The new workers are tackling such tasks as managing stimulus-funded contracts, processing Social Security benefit claims and investigating possible cases of fraud and waste. They’re overseeing about $288 billion in tax cuts and nearly $500 billion in federal spending, much of it in the form of transfers to state governments for education, health care and jobless benefits.

Comment by fecaltime!
2009-09-24 11:08:32

Like a fire that creates it’s own wind, the stimulus creates it own jobs!

Fecaltime!

 
Comment by joeyinCalif
2009-09-24 11:29:54

It takes money to spend money.

Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 22:02:20

Either money or a printing press technology will do.

 
 
Comment by michael
2009-09-24 11:30:34

“…and investigating possible cases of fraud and waste.”

awwww…that’s cute.

 
Comment by ecofeco
2009-09-24 16:29:09

Thousands and thousands of new jobs!

Millions and millions still jobless!

Ocean, meet bucket.

 
 
Comment by measton
2009-09-24 12:35:06

Sept. 24 (Bloomberg) — New U.S. home sales may jump 30 percent next year, buoyed by low mortgage rates and a “greater than 50 percent probability” that Congress will extend a tax credit for first-time buyers, Goldman Sachs Group Inc. said.

New home sales in California will lead as property values rise and transactions climb to more than 525,000 nationally, analysts led by Joshua Pollard wrote in a note to investors. The firm raised its recommendation for D.R. Horton Inc., Meritage Homes Corp., Toll Brothers Inc. and M.D.C. Holdings Inc.

I just ran out and bet it all on these companies. Thanks Goldman Sachs.

Comment by packman
2009-09-24 13:03:54

transactions climb to more than 525,000 nationally

LOL - wow a whopping 525k - that’s quite a recovery. Not. Normal rate is about 1.2M-1.5M annually, and it peaked well above 2.0M in 2005/2006.

525k is *well* below the previous pre-bubble record lows of about 800k.

Comment by packman
2009-09-24 13:04:59
 
 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 13:19:05

They’ve already burned the chair legs out from under near-term future demand with the $8K credit in place. Are you expecting an increase in the credit to have a significant impact on McMansion demand? Or do you expect Goldman to run some kind of stock price inflation scam, no matter how much money the builders appear to be losing?

Comment by packman
2009-09-24 13:28:59

Don’t forget that the $8k was limited to first-timers. I think there’s still other potential near-term demand (albeit artificial) from speculators. Thus the key to the proposed new credit isn’t the increase from $8k to $15k, but rather its expansion to all buyers.

Don’t be amazed if it actually works - for a while. On the frontside of this bubble many of us were amazed at how high the amount of money borrowing went before it collapsed - likewise we may now end up being amazed at how high the future-demand borrowing can go.

Comment by packman
2009-09-24 13:34:08

To add to that - it seems to me now that the plan is to use this artificial stimulus to pump up prices as high as possible, so that the banks can finally unload their backlog of foreclosed homes to a new round of knife catchers, at not-so-bad prices. Then when the current hunchback re-bubble bursts, the bulk of the losses will be directly on the taxpayers, e.g. via the FHA.

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Comment by packman
2009-09-24 13:38:28

Going a step further - I think the scope of the pump-and-dump efforts goes beyond just the $8k/$15k stimulus, and even beyond the F/F MBS purchases. I think the bulk of the green shoots declarations are for this very purpose as well - to try to get people feeling good about the economy again so they’ll be willing to buy that house they’ve been thinking about, now that there are so many great foreclosure “deals” out there.

 
Comment by Austin_Martin
2009-09-24 13:43:29

Actually, it looks like they are going to push it onto money market fund holders.

“Fed’s exit strategy may use money market funds: report”

from yahoo news….

“The Fed would borrow from the funds via reverse repurchase agreements involving some of the huge portfolio of mortgage-backed securities and U.S. Treasuries that it acquired as it fought the financial crisis, the newspaper reported, without citing any sources.”

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 14:31:02

What is the advantage to the Fed of using money market funds versus just directly targeting the money at the housing market? In fact, I think they should just print money and mail $20,000 housing purchase vouchers (redeemable in Federal Reserve Notes) to all prospective new home buyers.

 
Comment by Austin_Martin
2009-09-24 17:03:49

They are trying to lower the liquidity while at the same time they can’t afford to sell any of the mbs’s that they are holding.

This would remove money from the system, and push the mbs’ on mmfs(greater return, but riskier)

 
 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 14:29:03

“first-timers” = anyone who has either never owned or has been out of the market for at least three years.

The plan to hand $15K over to gamblers in order to prop up housing is completely outrageous, but I am entirely certain the NAR would support the suggestion, as they are clearly desperate to reflate the bubble by any means necessary. Given the campaign contributions they can raise, I also would not be surprised to see such a proposal generate lots of political support.

Rest assured that if this measure passes, there will be an abundance of cheap rental housing available for the next quarter-century, as building would ramp up in response to an increase in speculator demand, and any measure to add new homes to the extant 18m+ vacant homes in the US at higher than current prices will have the effect of increasing rental supply and suppressing rents.

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Comment by DD
2009-09-24 19:49:02

there will be an abundance of cheap rental housing available for the next quarter-century,
Then I will be a renter till forever! Got to find a great large apartment first. That isn’t easy. Unless you like living in a shoe box with No garage, just a carport.

 
 
Comment by measton
2009-09-24 15:06:55

To add to that - it seems to me now that the plan is to use this artificial stimulus to pump up prices as high as possible, so that the banks can finally unload their backlog of foreclosed homes to a new round of knife catchers, at not-so-bad prices. Then when the current hunchback re-bubble bursts, the bulk of the losses will be directly on the taxpayers, e.g. via the FHA.

One way or another they going to put that bad debt on the American taxpayer.

(Comments wont nest below this level)
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 17:10:38

You pegged it. To finish the story, the taxpayer will not be able to repay the insurance claims without the aid of the Fed’s printing press. At the end of the day, the printing press technology will be needed to relieve the taxpayer’s debt burden (or at least to transfer it to anyone unfortunate enough to be long dollar-denominated payments).

 
 
 
 
 
Comment by michael
Comment by ahansen
2009-09-24 21:52:55

You know how water seeks its own level? Like that. Only with the global economy.

 
 
Comment by ATE-UP
2009-09-24 13:35:21

This Shit is Going To Explode Paradigm of Thought.

Question…

When?

I say 3 years.

(Money pumpin’ works wonders, for a period of time).

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 14:37:52

The Financial Times
Volcker warns of ‘intractable’ problem with reforms
By Tom Braithwaite

Published: September 24 2009 13:52 | Last updated: September 24 2009 18:32

Paul Volcker, the former Federal Reserve chairman and adviser to the White House, on Thursday expressed continued doubts over the Obama administration’s plan for financial regulatory reform and lent his support to new taxes on banks.

In a sign of the on going struggle over the detail of the bill, Mr Volcker warned that the plan to deal with systemically important financial institutions contains a seemingly “intractable” problem — how to draw the dividing line between companies seen as ‘too big to fail and those that are not.

Large companies, under close supervision and held to tougher capital standards by the Federal Reserve, “will feel competitively hobbled by stricter standards. In times of potential crisis, it would be the institution left out of the ‘too big to fail’ club that will fear disadvantage”.

His testimony at the House financial services committee followed Tim Geithner, US Treasury secretary, who on Wednesday defended the plan to deal with the failure of large institutions – such as Lehman Brothers and AIG – whose collapse would threaten the entire system.

Although Mr Volcker is broadly supportive of the administration’s plan, which is facing challenges from politicians, banks and regulators, he said he was concerned that “moral hazard” was reinforced, not reduced, in the administration’s scheme for dealing with large interconnected institutions, which other observers have warned could benefit from an implicit government guarantee.

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 14:44:11

A big philosophical rift is developing between the former Fed chairman and the current Treasury Secretary. It will be interesting to see whether Volcker’s concerns affect the outcome.

In his evidence to Congress this morning, he (Paul Volcker) zeroed in on the problem that a range of big institutions, now including investment banks such as Goldman Sachs and Morgan Stanley, as well as traditional commercial banks and hybrids such as JP Morgan Chase, are being designated as “systemically important”.

The clear implication of such dsignation, whether officially acknowledged or not, will be that such institutions, in whole or in part, will be sheltered by access to a federal safely net in time of crisis; they will be broadly understood to be ‘too big to fail’ . . .

In fair financial weather, the important institutions will feel competitively hobbled by stricter standards. In times of potential crisis, it would be the institution left out of the ‘too big to fail’ club that will fear disadvantage.

Compare that with the evidence of Tim Geithner, the Treasury Secretary, yesterday:

Identification of a firm as a Tier 1 financial holding company will not convey a government subsidy - it will be no guarantee of extraordinary governmental assistance in the event of financial distress. To the contrary, it will be a guarantee of substantially stricter supervision and regulation by the government - an intensity of government oversight that will serve as a strong disincentive for forms to become too big, complex, leveraged and interconnected.

Comment by mrktMaven
2009-09-24 15:42:06

That’s why Volcker didn’t get the job.

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 17:05:50

The above passage is from a Financial Times blog.

Here is Martin Wolf, commenting on irreconcilable regulatory issues facing the G20 summit.

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 17:07:31

“To the contrary, it will be a guarantee of substantially stricter supervision and regulation by the government - an intensity of government oversight that will serve as a strong disincentive for forms to become too big, complex, leveraged and interconnected.”

What is to prevent Megabank, Inc from capturing their regulators?

 
 
Comment by SUGuy
2009-09-24 15:00:20

Is the fed planning on becoming US landlord?

U.S. Economy: Existing-Home Sales Unexpectedly Fall

Stocks fell on concern the housing market remains dependent on government tax credits and purchases of housing debt by the Federal Reserve. The central bank yesterday said it would extend its program to buy $1.25 trillion in mortgage- backed securities, as well as $200 billion in agency debt, through March while noting that “housing-market activity has increased.”
“The improvement in the housing market is not going to be a smooth rise, but a choppy, upward trend,” said Zach Pandl, an economist at Nomura Securities International Inc. in New York, who projected sales would fall. “The real test will be if the market can weather the end of government stimulus.”

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aIHod.Mpqglk

Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 17:03:43

I guess if they are buying mortgages and lots of those go into foreclosure, perhaps the Fed will have to open an REO department?

 
Comment by CA renter
2009-09-25 02:19:41

Stocks fell on concern the housing market remains dependent on government tax credits and purchases of housing debt by the Federal Reserve.
——————–

If they removed the govt supports, prices would fall to a level where people would buy them. Then, the market would no longer need to be “dependent on government tax credits…”

Lower prices are the **solution.** Why can’t anyone be honest about this for a change?

 
 
Comment by wmbz
2009-09-24 15:54:45

Aw crap, now the prisoners may die of pig flu…

Alcoholic hand gel removed from prison after inmates use it to make ‘hooch’ Daily Mail

Alcohol hand gel used to combat swine flu has been banned from a jail after inmates got drunk on the liquid soap.

The hygiene gel dispensers were introduced on wings to prevent the spread of swine flu earlier this month.

But within hours crafty inmates had started drinking the liquid soap, mixing it with fruit, sugar and water to make the alcoholic drink known as hooch.

There were reports that one prisoner was so intoxicated that he started a fist fight with another inmate at HMP The Verne, although this was denied by prison officials.

Now the governor of the Category C jail on the Isle of Portland in Dorset has banned the detergent.

A source at the Verne claimed: ‘The cleansers were put out on a wing to combat swine flu but as soon as they were put out, the prisoners started drinking the stuff straight out of them.

‘There was a fight after one of the prisoners got violent after drinking the gel.’

Andy Fear, a member of the Verne’s Prison Officer’s Association committee, said ‘We were informed of an incident within hours of the gel being available.

‘In one of the wings it is believed an inmate was using it inappropriately. When you get something called alcohol gel you can see what is going to happen.

‘We had concerns when we heard these were being given to inmates. You don’t want drunk prisoners running around the prison.’

Comment by joeyinCalif
2009-09-24 17:36:52

seems like that stuff would kill you long before the pig flu get’s ya..

[continued]

The alcoholic disinfectant was originally introduced in hospitals to combat the superbug MRSA, but it has led to several deaths among those who drank it.

In June this year, Dorset County Hospital in Dorchester removed gel dispensers from the entrance after vagrants were caught swigging from them.

They have also been withdrawn from a psychiatric complex and a hospital for the elderly in Staffordshire, amid fears that they could be risking patient’s lives.

Last year two homeless people died after using hand gel from Lewisham Hospital in South-East London to concoct an alcoholic home brew.

(It’s a Daily Telegraph UK article)

——–

Wikipedia
Category C jail:
Category C prisoners are those who cannot be trusted in open conditions but who are unlikely to try to escape..

…unlikely to try to escape .. but quite anxious to attempt any escape from the reality of being in jail..

Comment by CA renter
2009-09-25 02:21:43

That’s crazy. There seems to be no limit to what desperate addicts will do to get high. I just cannot relate.

 
 
 
Comment by jeff saturday
2009-09-24 18:03:41

It’s going to be even harder to buy a condo in South Florida thanks to new FHA rule

By DANIEL VASQUEZ
South Florida Sun Sentinel
Wednesday, September 23, 2009

It may be a buyer’s market for those looking to purchase a South Florida condominium, but a new FHA rule putting an end to “spot approvals” for home loans may burst the shopping bubble and make it much more difficult to qualify for a loan.

By extension, the same rule may also mean more bad news for condo sellers, already suffering through a bad economy which has sent property values into the Dumpster, since it impedes buyers’ ability to purchase. And the financial pain could eventually spread to all Florida homeowners by way of higher property taxes, say experts.

What is happening: Beginning Nov. 1, a new Federal Housing Administration rule goes into effect that disallows a loan process called “spot approvals,” which gave loan underwriters the authority to approve individual units rather than an entire building.

The reason such authority was so helpful to buyers is the cost and paperwork for a condo association to get an entire building approved by the FHA is onerous at best, costing tens of thousands of dollars for appraisals, structural engineering reports and other reports.

Spot approvals, in comparison, only require an association representative to spend 15 minutes filling out a single-page form. Those loans are prized by buyers because they generally have lower interest rates and require much lower down payments, about 3.5 percent of the purchase price compared with conventional bank loans, which may require up to 30 percent down.

Now, without spot approvals, condo buyers and owners will not be able to get an FHA loan for units in a non-approved building and will have to rely on conventional bank loans or pay cash, said Theresa M. Schmitz, a senior underwriter for Amerifirst in Fort Lauderdale.

“This poses a potential downward trend in condo values because many people can’t afford to put such a large down payment down on a condo,” Schmitz said. “And if there is a smaller pool of buyers, the market value of condos will decline even further and a condo unit will only be worth what a cash buyer is willing to pay for it.”

Ripple effect: It also stands to compound the current real estate market problems that have caused cities to raise tax rates, Schmitz said. “Single family homeowners may think this doesn’t affect them, but indirectly it will. When the condo assessed valuations plummet, our collective tax base will decline. Single family homeowners will pick up the slack with a hike in the millage rates and property taxes.”

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 19:05:01

When will decoupling start to show up in the form of independence in trans-Pacific share price movements? This article goes so far as to blame Japanese stock price declines on the bad US home sales news. That seems like quite a big stretch.

Asian shares skid south

Asia stock markets suffer in the wake of a downbeat day on Wall Street, with Japanese shares leading steep declines.

Comment by sleepless_near_seattle
2009-09-24 19:59:06

I remember in 1998 when every US company that had an earnings miss blamed the “Asian Flu” for their woes. Tit-for-tat?

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 22:00:52

I can’t understand why Asian countries don’t have plunge protection teams to enable their corporations to dilute shareholder wealth without sparking selloffs. Why don’t they get with the program and setup means to prop up their stock markets? Is it different over here in the US of A?

Asia Markets

Sept. 24, 2009, 11:26 p.m. EDT

Nomura shares ask-only, dragging down Tokyo financials

By V. Phani Kumar, MarketWatch

HONG KONG (MarketWatch) — A rush of sell orders for Nomura Holdings hammered down the Japanese financial sector Friday after the Japanese brokerage house announced its second large share offering in six months, reigniting concerns about equity dilution.

Analysts expect Nomura to use the $5.7 billion proceeds raised from the offering to grow its business, rather than as a protection against future losses.

“We view the capital raise as offense (for growth) rather than defense,” given the company’s “well buffered” tier 1 capital ratio of 12.7% and a “manageable balance sheet risk,” Goldman Sachs wrote in a note to clients.

 
 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 22:10:53

Developments on the fairway ain’t all that no mo’…

* The Wall Street Journal
* REAL ESTATE
* SEPTEMBER 24, 2009

Teed-Off Residents Drive Developer to Brink of Ruin

By WILLIAM M. BULKELEY

Bonita Bay owner Michael Lissack, shown above with a colleague, has accused Bonita Bay of owing back taxes on golf fees.

NAPLES, Fla. — It’s not easy living on a golf course.

Bonita Bay Group, once a premier developer of upper-crust golf communities in this upper-crust town, is on the verge of collapse. The company says it will be forced to file for bankruptcy if it has to refund $245 million in golf-club membership fees some homeowners are demanding, in a battle that’s pitting residents against each other and against the company that sold them lavish dream homes during the height of the boom.

Through the 1990s and the earlier part of this decade, Bonita Bay was regarded as one of the leading developers in the Naples area, which has the highest per capita income of any locale in the country except Stamford-Greenwich, Conn. Bonita Bay launched seven Naples-area communities where houses sold for up to $12 million and came with access to exclusive golf clubs with restaurants, tennis courts and pools. Its homeowners have included Richard Schulze, the billionaire chairman of Best Buy Corp., opera diva Kiri Te Kanawa and New Jersey Nets President Rod Thorn.

Clouds Over Bonita Bay

Today, like many other Sunbelt developers, Bonita Bay is being squeezed by debt and plunging sales. But its biggest problem is a dispute over the deposits homeowners plunked down for memberships in the golf clubs, a marina and other clubs. Many members want to quit the clubs and get their money back for reasons ranging from cheaper golf elsewhere to the desire for ready cash. Their membership agreements say the deposits — up to $185,000 per member — are refundable on demand, a relatively unusual stipulation homeowners say was a big part of the appeal of joining.

Yet Bonita Bay says the agreements also stipulate that the rules “may be amended from time to time,” thus allowing it to cancel the refund policy at its discretion — and that at any rate, it can’t pay the money.

Angry residents have filed at least 15 lawsuits against Bonita Bay seeking the return of their deposits and accusing the company of civil fraud. They say the right to amend the rules doesn’t apply to the refund policy. The Florida attorney general, responding to a citizen complaint, is investigating Bonita Bay to see whether the way it sold and refunded membership deposits was a Ponzi scheme. One Bonita Bay resident and former Wall Street executive, Michael Lissack, has filed a whistle-blower’s complaint against the company with the Internal Revenue Service, saying it owes back taxes on profits it made by holding the deposits.

Bonita Bay’s bind is one of the strongest signs yet that putting up houses around fairways — a hallmark of the real-estate boom — has lost its cachet. Several other developers of golf communities have already entered bankruptcy proceedings, including the high-end Winchester Country Club in Auburn, Calif., and Promontory in Park City, Utah.

In an interview, Bonita Bay Chairman David Lucas scoffed at the idea that the company is running a Ponzi scheme — in which investors are paid returns from money that comes from later investors — or doing anything else that is wrong. Mr. Lucas says the deposits were used to meet operating costs, and aren’t taxable. He says the developer is simply in a financial bind as a result of bad land purchases combined with the real-estate downturn, and that members of his wife’s family, which owns the closely held company, have poured in funds to keep Bonita Bay going. He says losses in the past three years have “completely wiped out” prior profits.

Bonita Bay has already closed the golf club at Twin Eagles, its latest development, where most of the lots are unsold and weeds are sprouting from the bunkers. In addition to threatening a bankruptcy filing if it has to refund deposits at the other clubs, the developer says it might have to shut down the clubs entirely unless residents come up with millions of dollars to buy them — a prospect that has homeowners doubly steamed.

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 22:12:56

* The Wall Street Journal
* LETTERS
* SEPTEMBER 25, 2009

Acorn’s Problems Are More Than a Few Bad Apples

In response to your editorial “Acorn Live!” and John Fund’s op-ed “Acorn Runs Off the Rails” (both Sept. 16): It now should be apparent that community organizers such as the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now are subject to the same malignancy that plagues Wall Street and Washington—the seductive nature of working with other people’s money (OPM). It is human nature to behave differently when someone else is footing the bill. That’s why investment managers and mutual fund companies are heavily regulated and held to a high fiduciary (or “prudent man”) standard. Lack of internal risk controls and regulatory due diligence are why Bear Stearns, Lehman, Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, Countrywide, etc., made imprudent bets that ultimately will be paid by taxpayers.

It was clear a year ago that Acorn had more than a “few bad apples” involved in voter registration fraud, yet the organization (and its affiliates) continued to receive tens of millions of dollars as well as an assignment to help conduct the 2010 U.S. Census. It also was clear that Acorn had lobbied aggressively and effectively over many years for subprime housing loans to low-income borrowers, adding to, if not causing, the mortgage market meltdown.

Now, several more Acorn employees are caught on videotape offering creative ideas for financing a brothel made up of child prostitutes from Central America. The focus, however, should not be on the reprehensible behavior of this latest barrel of Acorn bad apples. Instead, any community organizers and their affiliates (and particularly Acorn) that receive government funds ought to be as heavily regulated as banks and subject to periodic audits—perhaps conducted by an ordinary group of taxpayers who are the source of OPM. Oh, and while it’s at it, Congress might want to adopt some prudent-man fiduciary standards for its own members that will hold them accountable the next time they dole out large amounts of OPM to an organization full of rotten fruit.

R. P. Graham

Orlando, Fla.

 
Comment by Professor Bear
2009-09-24 22:20:33

The Fed has inflation fears on the boil. Is this part of their plan?

The Frightening Spike in the Price of Gold

The price of gold has been hanging near its historic highs, selling for more than $1,000 per ounce. In times of crisis — the terrorist attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, the collapse of Bear Stearns in spring 2008 — gold has spiked, as fearful investors grabbed for something they could hold onto.

But that’s not the case today. The U.S. is technically out of its Great Recession, Fed Chairman Ben Bernanke recently said. New jobless claims unexpectedly fell last week. The stock markets are riding a 50 percent rally since March. And yet, gold keeps going up.

That means a growing number of investors, traders — and, most troublingly, foreign governments — don’t believe in the strength of the U.S. dollar, analysts warn. People buy gold when there’s fear.

“It’s not the fear of an event of some sort,” such as a terrorist attack, said Peter Boockvar, equity strategist at Miller Tabak, whom I spoke to this week. “It’s the fear that the piece of paper in your pocket you call money will devalue over time.”

 
Comment by GrizzlyBear
2009-09-24 23:09:38

The madness continues. A $299k single acre parcel of RAW land in Kitsap County, WA (across the water from Seattle) is pending sale, on a golf course in a “luxury” community which is in foreclosure. This bubble’s got legs. Wake me up in 15 years.

 
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