The Housing Bubble

Why do Republicans idolize morons? Maybe they should change their name to the Republitard party?

Why do Republicans idolize morons? Maybe they should rename themselves the Republitard party?

Limbaugh works out of his house in Florida, AFTRA membership is voluntary and I imagine his maid & gardener are not union members.

Beck probably kept his membership from his DJ years in morning radio when he benefitted from union membership.

Don’t forget, the guys at the radio/tv stations that play thier shows are all Union members.

Don’t forget, the guys at the radio/tv stations that play thier shows are all Union members. Whose jobs are “important in aggregate,” even though they aren’t stars.

The head of the Wisconsin Police Association asks the govenor to keep the Capitol open, announces a police sleepover.

The cops will be sleeping with the protestors in the Capitol.

Wow, that will suprise the govenors National Guard.

Wait, the cops — are the National Guard !!

Come to Madison and Cuddle a Cop.

http://tinyurl.com/4j4hrxt

OMG ~~ We’re gonna need a lot MORE of those chocolate covered doughnuts donuts folks !!

“The head of the Wisconsin Police Association asks the govenor to keep the Capitol open, announces a police sleepover.”………

More overtime, more overtime, Kaching, Kaching!!!!!!

“just by telling the facts, you’re angering a lot of people…”

Tell me about it.

OMG Faux News…Donnn’t Do It…

The right wingers CAN’T handle the Facts !!

I want to bust the SEIU in my town. Ave City employee gets 40% more per year than private does - plus pension! What’s wrong with this ?

40% more per year for the same job title and duties? Or are you comparing people with college degrees to workers at mcdonalds?

“Why do Republicans worship morons like Rush”….

To listen to Rush you have to first put it in context and realize that what he is talking about will be taken to the extreme. It makes for good rateings and entertainment. That being said, you will often hear things that make you go Hmmmmmm!

So, if you can put it in perspective, you will get a first hand look at the opposing side. Get out of it what you can get out of it. Same goes for NPR.

“It makes for good rateings and entertainment.”

What if you don’t find the bloviated rantings of a narcotics addict to be whatsoever entertaining?

Most unions have been conceding pay and benefits for 20 years.

CEOs and BODs have been conceding… nothing.

You might want to talk to them about taking in the shorts.

I know my union has had to pay for every COL increase, through benefit concessions, for the last ten years.(ex: reduction of OT rate of pay, training on your own time, starting salaries.)

I guess some unions are more successful than others. Here in San Diego they have been very successful indeed!

You will notice that in all the places Unions are strong, the municipalities are on the verge of bankruptcy.

Also I don’t really buy the whole CEO’s are thieving thugs so we should be too argument. CEO pay is clearly way out of line, and banksters bonuses etc are worse. That said, just because one group is stealing from me does not justify another doing the same, and does not answer the basic question I raised which is OK, government employees are fantastic deserving people who should be highly compensated. By whom? Which bank account should the checks be written against?

And lastly since unions are great for everyone, where is MY representation?

There are lot more places where the unions aren’t strong where the municipalities are just as broke.

And yes, you are correct that unions are more successful in some places than others.

oops…Pubic = Public… LOL

It wasn’t an error… Merkins don’t make errors! Merkins don’t apologize!

Definition of Merkin

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Merkin

I knew it was going to be you that would exploit my mistake exeter…LOL

In newspaper headline writing, leaving the “L” out of “public” is considered on of the cardinal sins of the whole profession. That and putting the f-word in 60 point type. But the public thing is more likely to happen.

I don’t think anyone is against pubic unions.

LOL….You guys are funny…

It exists.

But the people who currently “own” it keep threatening to take their ball and go elsewhere, unless the rules are slanted even more in their favor.

The policies the Republicans have been promoting since Roosevelt (Eisenhower excepted) have been globalization, “free markets” (at least for J6P), deregulation, and this John-Wayne-esqe “if you can’t pull yourself up by your bootstraps, you are obviously a lazy ba$tard” fantasy.

Since these policies have been promoted and implemented, things have gotten visibly and measurably worse for the bottom 90% of the food chain.

The Republicans answer to all this is that things suck, because those crappy liberals/socialists have kept them from fully implementing the Master Plan.

No consideration whatsoever that maybe the Plan sucks.

You’re saying there has never been a balanced budget in any state ever which is false.

Where did the money go?

The Republicans answer to all this is that things suck, because those crappy liberals/socialists have kept them from fully implementing the Master Plan.

No consideration whatsoever that maybe the Plan sucks.

That’s poetry.

No exeter, I am saying that there is not enough money backing the future IOU’s. States have balanced their budgets, based on current cash flow, but the budget may have been balanced by failing to make its required $200 million pension contribution that year. Do that for a number of years and state pensions are little more than IOU’s. Just another form of off-balance sheet debt and the money was spent on whatever government deemed more important than funding its future promises.

So the money IS in the bank, and checks simply need to be written then even though costs such as medical go up 20% a year. Last I heard here in San Diego, the pension fund was underfunded to the tune of 2 billion, but you are saying they in fact have the 2 billion safely put away in the fund and they are lying?

I for one don’t buy it. Fund managers way overestimated investment returns which in some cases have lost money. They based tax income at maximum bubble levels, assumed a lower lifespan and that medical costs would remain even. All false assumptions it turns out, so the money is in fact NOT there.

GH …so therefore we don’t attack any of the costs that threw the budget out of whack ,such as health care ,to bring down the costs .

So Pension managers are incompetent ,but lets keep them on the job or promote them. . Wall Street Investment middlemen are criminals and Ponzi-schemers ,but they get bailed out and they are entitled to their bubble profits and they get to go out and continue to get ill-gotten gain. Health care industry monopoly is entitled to their higher profit margins
and bubble gains and they get to increase prices anytime they want ,so the public pensions will always run short . Outsourcing and out-manufacturing and improper tariffs and trade balances will continue to erode our tax-base ,thereby making it impossible to pay the pensions ,and making it impossible to increase jobs or wages on jobs .

Why don’t we just hand over all the money right now to
Wall Street and Corporate America and the Multi-National Companies and just reduce all the workers to 5 bucks a hour
with no benefits and get this over with .Lets just take away Social Security and Medicare and be done with it ,who care if the older people have any medical coverage ,they don’t have any value to Corporations anymore except being a liability they were suppose to pay for . Hell just all parties default and start from the law of the Jungle .

I agree with that as well. Will confirm whether or not this is really true and get back to cactus tomorrow.

During the bubble, fire and police departments were handing out signing bonuses because they couldn’t get enough qualified applicants.

The bubble is what this blog is all about. A gigantic imbalance which has collapsed our economy into the worst recession (depression) since the depression. Everywhere we look efforts are being made to cling onto the bubble wins in terms of housing prices, wages etc.

The simple fact is that the money is gone now, and adjustments MUST be made, just like I have had to make adjustments along with millions of others in the West.

I am not saying these good folks are not deserving I am saying we cannot afford them.

GH,

Even I had posted the other day about concessions that MANY people need to make, including union employees. But trying to make public sector unions the scapegoats for the financial sector is WRONG.

I am not so willing to just let it stand that the Culprits get to keep their bubble profits ,even get bailed out on the taxpayers dime ,and we just take it out of the hide of the taxpayers and the people . This approach is not going to get the balance of power back to proper functioning .

cactus,

You tried to throw a lot of stuff at the wall, hoping something would stick.

Here’s the relevant part of your post WRT overtime:

Special “7(k) Work Periods.” Public-sector (government) fire departments may establish special “7(k) work periods” for sworn firefighters, which can increase the FLSA overtime “thresholds” beyond the normal 40 hour week. Firefighters covered by these special work periods are entitled to FLSA overtime only for hours worked in excess of a threshold set by the Department of Labor on a chart.
—————————-

What you probably didn’t understand is that this FAVORS the employer, not the employee. It means that firefighters can be required to work over 40 hours/week, and not be paid overtime. They gave an example of a schedule with a 53-hour workweek. The departments I’m most familiar with have ~56-hour workweeks. Firefighters are NOT PAID OVERTIME for the 16 hours over the 40 hour threshold for private employers, nor are they paid overtime for the over-8 or over-12-hour/day thresholds, because they work 24-hour shifts.

Their overtime only comes AFTER the 56 hours/week is reached.

See, private fire protection employers CANNOT get out of paying their employees overtime if they work over 40 hours per week. This means that a private employer would pay MORE OVERTIME than a public employer. The “special rules” regarding the **government** employees means that they are entitled to LESS overtime than their private sector counterparts.

You’ve just made my point. This is exactly what I’m talking about.

Note the first couple of lines here…they say that the private employers are not allowed to use the special rules. IOW, the **employers** don’t get the benefit that the public employers (taxpayers!) do when they get to require more hours BEFORE overtime is paid.

Private fire protection employers are not permitted to use the special §7(k) work periods, and employees of private fire companies must be paid FLSA overtime for all hours worked over 40 per week. A private fire company means a fire protection unit of private industry.

And yes, REALLY, firefighters DO NOT GET DOUBLE OR TRIPLE TIME FOR OVERTIME.

Here it is in black and white, right there in your post:

Regular Rate. FLSA overtime must be paid at time and one-half the employee’s “regular rate.” The FLSA regular rate is always stated as an hourly rate, no matter how the employees are really paid.

Any other questions?

Just to make it clear (in case you didn’t get it, again)…

The above “special rules” –posted in your very own link — explain the EXEMPTION from regular overtime rules for firefighters, just like I said above.

Me former boss died of a heart attack in his early 50s; ironically, he was thin as a rail, and working out at Vic Tanny at the time.

The helicopters have been fired up. What do you think is causing all the asset price increases…and the social unrest around the world?

BTW, those who made those foolish decisions were NOT the workers who are constantly being discussed here.

It doesn’t matter if it was the workers or not that made the foolish choices, the foolish choices were there for anyone to see if they cared enough to take a look.

Just as they are today.

Question: Regarding Social Security and Medicare, does anyone here feel they should retire now and depend on these two government entities to make good on their promises?

“Regarding Social Security and Medicare, does anyone here feel they should retire now and depend on these two government entities to make good on their promises?”

Too bad for so many, that they HAVE to.

Mathematics - such a cruel bitch! How unfortunate the country is bankrupt; such an impediment to social engineering.

Everything would be so nice if only there were money-crapping unicorns to pay for all the Good Things everyone was promised! Tax the rich? Great idea! Let’s start with the Rothschilds, I hear they have a family fortune of about 500 Trillion. I’m sure they wouldn’t mind being asked to pony up.
Very civic minded altruists, ya know. And the Rockefellers are indubitably just waiting to be asked also. Hosni Mubarek has $70 Billion that would fund Social Security and Medicare for a couple of weeks, don’t forget him.

“The main problem with the no money story is that it is not a story: There is no money to pay for all that was promised. If there was money then we wouldn’t be having this discussion.”

There’s plenty of money- the rich have it all. Return tax rates to their post-WW2 average, and we could pay everyone their benefits, and pay down the debt.

This truth will not remain hidden for long. Just as the Kochtopus was finally pulled up into the light for all to see, so too will people finally see the truth about where the money is, despite all the well-financed operations of the rich to throw sand in our eyes.

“Hosni Mubarek has $70 Billion that would fund Social Security and Medicare for a couple of weeks,”

What if we just removed the income cap from social security and medicare taxes, thus taxing the rich at the same rate we tax everyone else? Surely if we can afford to pay it, they can.

Why should the rich have a lower tax rate?

I think in some point Social security and medicare will be “to big to fail” and Fed will bailout ( I hope 1% rich will agree with that…)

“Regarding Social Security and Medicare, does anyone here feel they should retire now and depend on these two government entities to make good on their promises?”

I have not expected to collect SS since I first started working in the 70s. I expect to work until I drop. One of the key issues for me is the prospect of inflation eating away at fixed retirement income.

And I expect Gen X and Gen Y to continue to suffer from the collective decision of Boomers to keep working.

We are really damned if we do and damned if we don’t. If we retire, then the burden of supporting us falls on our children. If we continue to work, then we reduce opportunity for advancement and compete with them for jobs.

The robber barrons need to pay for causing the crisis in the first place. There is no reason for workers to pay the price for the bankers’ misdeeds.

barons, not barrons…

You really need to have your meds reviewed.

And your point is?

Your “robber baron” ramblings are incomprehensible and have no logic whatsoever.

Why NYCityboy?

Surely you are not suggesting the FIRE sector didn’t cause this mess?

Surely you can see that picking on unions and public sector workers is nothing, NOTHING, but a distraction tactic.

Seriously.

NYCityBoy — I hope the banksters are paying you handsomely for your trollery.

“The pension funds were OVER-funded in the mid-late 90s”.

According to who? Some clowns with ASSumptions that they could earn 8% returns on invested capital forever? Too bad the ASSumptions didn’t work out. Too bad, so sad. Time to hold a meeting and complain about how unfair everything is.

Why isn’t there money enough to go around? Who’s responsible? Let’s find him and slap his wrist.

Exponential numbers never lie.

The question is why are the funds underfunded today?

What about the ASSumptions that housing always goes up and that people with a 540 FICO are actually going to make all the ARM-adjusted payments on a $350K crapshack, with interes, for THIRTY YEARS? Let’s make a CDS “bet” on that, shall we?

That casino got bailed out of those ASSumptions, and collecting “promised” bonuses as gravy.

Your $46K teacher? “too bad so sad.” Yeah, great thanks.

They are the government counterparts to hedge fund managers and investment bankers.

Appointed by the banksters, you mean?

Look, the only qualification that a political appointee has to have is that the executive wants to appoint them and (if the job is important enough) the legislature is willing to confirm them. That is different than going through the entire civil service hiring process.

A program for hiring recent college graduates was recently *eliminated* in civil service hiring because it was determined to be age discriminatory. The got rid of the whole thing because it could result in a kid getting a job that a more qualified experienced person would be willing to take. Try finding a program like that in the private sector? And, yes, it was a union that took on the fight.

So, what does that have to do with anything? The people that want the unions called to account also want Wall Street called to account. It is not either or except in the minds of the zealots around here that just keep shouting, “well Wall Street steals, too”. They are the ones using one wrong to justify another wrong.

Nobody that is questioning the tactics of the public unions is saying that income disparity is good. And I bet we can trace a lot of that back to the ballooning of our government. Cough, cough, Fannie and Freddie. Cough, cough, Tarp. Bigger government is not the solution, and the public unions are big government. A giant centralized government, with its hand in every aspect of every facet of our lives, is the problem.

“The people that want the unions called to account also want Wall Street called to account.”

link?

Most citizens outside the beltway want all financial criminals brought to justice. It will not happen because, just like the public sector unions, Wall Street showers Washington with campaign cash. Corrupt communist unions and corrupt bankers battling to control our nation’s governments.

Let’s put the Wall Street and Washington crooks in jail to set an example and send the communists back into the ash heap of history were they belong.

The people that want the unions called to account also want Wall Street called to account. It is not either or except in the minds of the zealots around here that just keep shouting, “well Wall Street steals, too”. They are the ones using one wrong to justify another wrong.

Exactly.

Nobody that is questioning the tactics of the public unions is saying that income disparity is good.NYCityBoy

Everyone on the fence please look at that statement. I read it many times. Now please think. Have you ever heard Rush L. defend the status quo of wealth disparity and attack unions? I have. Not only that but I’ve heard Rush, Glen, Hannity, and savage bash unions AND promote ideas that would make the income disparity even bigger. Tax cuts for the rich anyone?

I’m going to read it again.

Nobody that is questioning the tactics of the public unions is saying that income disparity is good.NYCityBoy

Is the above quote factual?

No. Here’s an example of which there are thousands, no matter what NyCityBoy professes to believe. It’s a clip of uber-rich Glen Beck (with an audience of millions) teaching his disciples that in fact, “income disparity is good”.

http://vidrec.com/?v=SgrikK4-Tvk

“The people that want the unions called to account also want Wall Street called to account.”

“link?”

You don’t need a link, alpha. This is very evident if you have read this blog for the past many years.

Let’s put the Wall Street and Washington crooks in jail to set an example and send the communists back nickpapageorgio

You’re funny nickpapageorgio. I read somewhere that Glen Beck’s ratings dropped like a bomb and some writer said something like “well, people got board with the “Obama is a socialist” thing. Well that’s when Glen Beck started to get even more nutball with his chalkboard and started crying more and instead of saying “socialist” he started saying “communist” (Actually right about the time you, nickpapageorgio changed from saying “socialist” to the more so scary “communist” (rio shivers)

Well Glen Beck got a little bump in the ratings but I read they were still down 38% from a year ago and 50% in a certain important age category.

So here’s the problem. People got immune to “socialist” now “communist” is making people start to yawn. So you are facing a huge problem.

You guys are running out of scary names

people got board with the “Obama is a socialist”

lol, people got bored.…..

i shouldn’t write fast while chuckling so much

“You don’t need a link, alpha. This is very evident if you have read this blog for the past many years.”

Oh, I agree there’s a few here on this blog, but I’ve yet to see a bus full of TeaKoch Party activists pull up in front of the NYSE to protest the Wall Street bailouts. Nor have I heard any of their leaders’ call for investigations of the financial industry.

But they sure do show up at the anti-union protests.

Good, alpha…and I will agree with you: you don’t see much of that perspective outside the HBB.

Sean Hannity’s Mother and Father retired on government pensions. I know because I worked with his Mother. His Mother was a lovely woman( a little strict), but I liked her. I believe his Father was a postal inspector.

“People got immune to “socialist” now “communist”"

I’ve been calling communists communists for almost 3 decades now, and it never gets old. My eyes are wide open to every fake name, every phony organization and front group you hide behind.

I’ve been calling communists communists for almost 3 decades now, and it never gets old.

No no, I don’t mean for you. I’m sure you still love calling people “communist”. It’s you. But I mean the people you call it might be getting bored with it. I think “Anti-Christs” sounds pretty scary.

My eyes are wide open to every fake name, every phony organization and front group you hide behind.

That’s good…. That’s good. …Everything’s fine…. ..BTW… I’ve heard that Chlorpromazine might be better because Haloperidol can give some people diarrhea if they take it with milk

Please.

The attitude of some on this blog is that “since we can’t/won’t fix the problems generated by the banktsers, we’ll make up for it by fooking over someone that we can”.

Public Unions are the cause of what? Maybe 5-10% of the problems we have? And for this, some think they should get the death penalty.

Like them or not, nobody has presented any evidence that turning public/civil service employees into serfs is going to do anything other than put even more people into the poorhouse.

Have a problem with their “gold-plated” benefits? Good. Then you should be backing a National Healthcare Plan for everyone, including Congress. Get rid of all those “free-market distortions caused by some public sector employees getting medical insurance, and the private sector being priced out, or being forced others into involuntary serfdom, because they can’t change jobs due to pre-existing conditions.

I think NYCBoy has been watching Fox too much. He used to be an “Equal-Opportunity Hater”…….

Thank you X- GSfixr for that post.

Thank you X- GSfixr for that post.

And another hearty “Thank you!” from Slim.

Triple that thanks, GS-fixer.

It’s really amusing - instead of exploring the causes of a declining standard of living in the private sector - loss of pensions, stagnating wages, loss of jobs - we turn on other workers, fighting for the crumbs.

It’s like two people getting their houses burglarized, and complaining the other guy got less taken.

Gotta keep our eyes on the ball - why is our standard of living declining? It’s not the fault of unions.

“NYCBoy has been watching Fox too much.”

Methinks I smell a case of pension envy, as in he ain’t got one, so everyone else’s pension naturally seems larger than his.

Hundreds protest outside of Koch lobby office

JUDITH DAVIDOFF AND JESSICA VANEGEREN|The Capital Times Posted: Friday, February 25, 2011 9:00 am

While hundreds of people protested on the sidewalk, a maintenance worker with Urban Land Interests stood Thursday outside the building housing the lobbying offices of Koch Industries, Inc. A security guard stood inside.

While hundreds of people protested on the sidewalk, a maintenance worker with Urban Land Interests stood Thursday outside the building housing the lobbying offices of Koch Industries, Inc. A security guard stood inside.

“We’re watching out for our tenants,” said the maintenance worker, who declined to be identified. “He is hired by us to keep people out of our building and to protect the privacy of our tenants - not necessarily for Koch, but our tenants in general,” he added, of the security guard. “We can’t have people walking through who don’t belong there.”

Which is apparently what started happening after it was reported that Koch Companies Public Sector Inc. had opened a lobbying office at 10 E. Doty St. (the actual entrance is at 119 Martin Luther King, Jr. Blvd.) two weeks before Scott Walker was elected governor.

When fliers went up at the Capitol Wednesday about Thursday’s rally, the building’s office manager alerted tenants in a memo that it might not be a good idea to schedule meetings at the office on Thursday afternoon.

Now the doors to the lobby at both entrances are closed and only tenants and their guests are allowed in the building.

David and Charles Koch, co-owners of Koch Industries, have extensive business interests in the state, including the Koch Pipeline Company, Flint Hill Resources, which distributes refined oil through pipelines and terminals and the C. Reiss Coal Company.

Their political action committee contributed $43,000 to Walker’s election campaign and gave more than $1 million to the Republican Governor’s Association, which in turn paid for $3.4 million in attack ads against Walker’s opponent, Milwaukee Mayor Tom Barrett.

A prank call to Walker by a blogger claiming to be David Koch provided more ammunition to the claims that the Koch brothers, and one of the groups they generously fund, Americans for Prosperity, are major players in Walker’s plan to end collective bargaining for state workers. On Wednesday, Americans for Prosperity began running pro-Walker ads across the state that defend the governor’s plan to end collective bargaining for public workers.

In an interview posted Thursday night on National Review Online, Koch executives told political reporter Robert Costa that the Koch brothers will ‘not stop’ supporting free-enterprise initiatives, even in the face of intimidation from “the Left.” They also said that David Koch and Walker have never met or spoken.

“With the Left trying to intimidate the Koch brothers to back off of their support for freedom and signaling to others that this is what happens if you oppose the administration and its allies, we have no choice but to continue to fight,” Richard Fink, the executive vice president of Koch Industries, told Costa. “We will not step back at all. We firmly believe that economic freedom has benefited the overwhelming majority of society, including workers, who earn higher wages when you have open and free markets. When government grows as it has with the Bush and Obama administrations, that is what destroys prosperity.”

On Thursday, protesters filled both sides of Doty Street, with more than 30 police officers stationed at the curbs to keep traffic flowing at rush hour.

Jane Pedersen, one of the protesters, had traveled to Madison from Menominee three days ago with a handmade sign reading, “Walker: Bought by Koch brothers ???”

Thursday she had her poster in hand. The questions marks had been crossed through with a black marker. For her, the minor change held major significance.

“Now, it’s a fact,” she said, noting the prank call between Walker and blogger Ian Murphy and the new lobbying office. “There’s a connection between Walker and the Koch brothers.”

That bothers her. The connection between politicians and lobbyists is too great in most cases, she said, but in this case it seems extreme.

Aleia Mason was wearing a sandwich board sign made of cardboard and packing tape. She said even a week ago she got questions about her sign, which reads, “Koch Party, I want my country back.” Now, she says, everyone knows who David and Charles Koch are.

“Its seems like it’s reached critical mass,” she says.

We firmly believe that economic freedom has benefited the overwhelming majority of society, including workers, who earn higher wages when you have open and free markets. When government grows as it has with the Bush and Obama administrations, that is what destroys prosperity.”
———————–

There you go, guys. That’s for you all in the private sector. These idiots think that YOUR life is better without unions.

Have you seen any evidence of this????

They are living in Fantasyland.

Placed on “Ignore”.

I’ll be watching for your check in the mail, NYCBoy

Placed on “Ignore”. NYCityBoy

I’ll be watching for your check in the mail, NYCBoy drumminj

LOL You just made a funny joke drumminj.

I believe he “placed on “Ignore”" about as much as I believe
“the checks in the mail”.

I never understood the “ignore” thing. It’s kind of like a kid screaming and plugging his ears.

Wow NYCityBoy ”

Placed on “Ignore”.

It would looks like your quaint brand of HBB popularity is dropping like a rock, along with any perceived credibility you may to have had.

Be sure Honor me by placing me on “Ignore” if you haven’t done so already.

NYCityBoy, are you Charlie Sheen?

My theory is that NY City Boy has joined tazed former HBB posters Eddie and Joey in CA among the ranks of the bankster PsyOps troll brigade that comes on the HBB to rankle the regulars. What are they paying you to do this?

As I recall there are some who would consider themselves great employees on this board who have had a hard time finding jobs in the private sector.

“consider themselves great”

might as well wait for that check in the mail.

As soon as the private sector goes back to real meritocracy and stability, I’m sure they will.

Even if we have great politicians in office who didn’t cave to the union pressure that funded their campaigns, the lie still exists. There is no guarantee in this life that sh!t won’t hit the fan and put an end to a “promise” made to take care of you. And even worse, that lie is paid for by taxing at threat of force those who refuse to put their head in the sand and go out and fight every day to be productive and secure their own future.

Dude….seriously…… you should record that to some Wagner.

So you’re saying, in general, politicians don’t over promise and under-deliver?

So you’re saying, in general, politicians don’t over promise and under-deliver?

Always. I just recognize a clear and present danger that I don’t think you do. And it isn’t the unions (12% of our workforce.)

No one is saying to eliminate public education or cut all 12% of our workforce… Let’s just agree that the politicians over promised , cut back to what is sustainable, and move on…

Exactly.

I sure hope any of these “individualists” who have money in the bank (FDIC insured, of course) or own Treasuries are prepared to not get their money back. After all, government “promises” don’t count anymore, right?

Most of the inspectors I’ve known are worthless pieces of crap that couldn’t build
their way out of their sand box.

And Rio, most civil servants don’t have the math capabilities to understand that their
way of life is unsustainable…Maybe they
just listened to the politicians to often and
to long.

build
their way out of their sand box.

The Brazilian residential building inspectors ROCK. I mean when I built my house …….wait…….as a matter of fact….there weren’t any! Crazy huh?

It seems in Rio, on a house there are no building inspectors, BUT you can’t do it yourself, (most of it) you have to hire a professional, certified architect and engineer to sign off, take responsibility for and then the engineer’s construction company will build the place or it isn’t legal. Then when it’s done (in twice the time you thought, thousands of bags of cement and sand and for more money) ONE DUDE comes with a tape measure and makes sure it’s the size you had the permit for. You be really nice and polite with him and offer him a drink of Johnny Walker (Black) and laugh at his jokes and stuff.

He then sees that the toilets flush and the sinks work and then he makes you go through 8 months of waiting because the interior stairs were in a different place than the plans. Then one magic day after a lot of hassle where you, your architect and engineer have been to the city hall about 14 times, you get your piece of paper with about 4 rubber stamps in different colors and with different initials and signatures on top off all rubber stamps and a lot of official colonial looking logos and then your house is legal.

Wheww…

Rio,
I would welcome a system like that with
open arms. Why? Because you would know
ahead of time exactly what is required.

Here you’d pay $27k for the permit, another several thou for SDC’s, the inspectors
wouldn’t know shit, and you’d be constantly
badgered for more changes and fees during
the whole process. In 55 years during which
I was a fringe of the construction industry,
I never, and I mean never, saw an inspector with a tape measure, a plumb stick, or a framing square. Civil servants with a mind
like a brick.

Even in New York City where the best private schools can cost upwards of $15,000*

The best are 30+k

Can you find one that has a cost less than 17k?

We’re in San Diego, and the schools around us are all more expensive than the public schools.

It’s not the civil servants sending their children to 20k plus private schools. Always makes me wonder how much money is being made in the private capitalist world.

“Here in Salinas I paid $800+ in 2007 and it has gone up since.”

Should have $8000 per student per year.

Neither does the so called, certification process…

It might not everyone, but I would say an additional year of college specifically teaching me how to teach would help me a lot.

I be edukated good but if you threw me in there now I wouldn’t
even know where to start. But probably in the teachers lounge.

Well, scdave, those questions can easily be answered by… researching your own local school system.

But probably in the teachers lounge ??

Funny….

Some of the worst cases I have witnessed firsthand have been engineers trying to teach secondary math. They get pissed that the kids, “don’t get it.”

That description fits my father to a tee.

In his prime, he was a mathematical genius. And Yours Truly? Let’s say that I can add, subtract, divide, and multiply, but I was not — and am not — at his level.

His attempts to explain math to me were marked by tantrums — shouting, beatings, the whole nine yards. Pardon me for saying so, but even though he’s an old man in declining health, I don’t think this behavior was acceptable. Nor was my mother’s decision to do nothing to stop it.

After I left home, became an adult, and went into business, one of my clients was an author who specialized in writing about math and science in such a way that people like me could get it. I’ve found her books to be very helpful. BTW, she’s *not* an engineer.

Maybe they are paying for smaller class sizes or to isolate their children from bad peer influences or because public schools teach things like evolution that they don’t want their children to learn or because they don’t want their children to be bused to a failing school in a big city district.

Maybe the teachers see things you don’t see because you aren’t there.

The end result may be that a marginal school will become a failing school because anyone that can leave will. So then the big city public schools are all failing because they contain all of the behavior problems and all of the children whose parents don’t care and all of the children whose parents can’t transport them to the private school.

You got it, Happy.

———————

mathguy,

I’m assuming you don’t have kids. If so, you might have a few friend who put their kids in “elite” private schools. Ask them why. Most of these parents know that it’s not the teachers, per se, who make the students look good; it’s the students/parents.

Most “elite” private schools require IQ/tests just to get in. They get to filter the students, and only pick the very best, intellectually, and behaviorally. Public schools do not have this option.

But you will get to bailout those states if they don’t make cuts on their own. That will be fun for flyover land.

Oh they’ll makes cuts alright, but we’ll still have to bail them out.

And it won’t just be “flyover” states either.

When did you join Eddie and JoeyinCA in carrying out PR assignments for Megabank, Inc?

NYCityBoy now sounds like Eddie on Chamomile tea.

So you might have a biased opinion regarding the teachers union?

Can you imagine if as a condition of employment YOU were forced to join “right to life” and “tea party” groups and state took that money right out of your paycheck.
(Comments wont nest below this level)
—————–

If I didn’t like those conditions, I wouldn’t apply for the job.

Seems simple enough to me.

so your solution to a condition that you don’t like is “don’t apply for the job”?

my solution to you…for a condtion you do like that is being taken away from you is…go apply for a different job.

Something wrong with that? Isn’t that what we do in the private sector every day?

“I think you’d be singing a different song.”

A voice of reason.

What is going on right now is the best promotional campaign the teachers unions could ever have among their members.

What is going on right now is the best promotional campaign the teachers unions could ever have among their members.

So then why make it requirement of THEIR JOB to be FORCED to join the union?

If the union is so great - most/all will join by their own choice.

But they DO have a choice. Work somewhere else.

It’s what we do in the private sector every day.

Isn’t it.

Wow. That is all I can say. Wow.

Don’t say “wow.” Name a country.

Feel free to move to Somalia, or any other country without a strong, centralized government.

????

And Cuba, the USSR, Zimbabwe, North Korea, Pol Pot’s Cambodia, Nazi German, etc. ALL had strong, centralized governments…

Feel free to move there if you think you will be taken care-off.

How about we get back to American government that worked pretty well for the first 200 years? A smaller government that did regulate every facet of our lives?

What is your point? Every post you have is an incoherent screech. Now you are trying to equate a strong, centralized government with a good place to live. That is just insane.

You try to make personal attacks and name-call in an attempt to cover up the fact that you have nothing useful to contribute to the conversation. You provide no facts, no logic, nothing.

Name a single country. Come on, you wanted to make your point about the bliss that can be experienced in a country with low/no taxes and a weak government, now do it.

Bulgaria? Romania?

“Feel free to move to Somalia”; that’s a well reasoned response!

A Union is certified after an election in which the majority of the voting workers have voted for the Union. The Union then purports to speak for all the workers, but the Union may take positions that clearly conflict with many citizens’ personal views and beliefs.

A councilperson, representative or senator is elected by a majority of the voting citizens. Those elected purport to speak for all the citizens, but those elected may take positions that clearly conflict with many citizens’ personal views and beliefs.

What’s the difference?
The difference is that government uses guns to enforce it’s positions, and Unions rarely do.

I guess you never hear of the Mob and the teamsters? Ask Jimmy Hoffa or Jack Kennedy

Libya does not have a strong central government…

Feel free to move to Somalia, or any other country without a strong, centralized government.

You realize the US didn’t used to be this way? Some of us have been and continue to stop this from happening.

Why don’t those who want a strong central move to a country that has one, and doesn’t have a constitution that’s supposed to protect against just that???

You guys act like you can just choose public service work or
choose private work at a drop of the hat . The gig is that you only get addition benefits if you stay long term ,its called being vested .
So the carrot is if you stay longer with this gig (so we don’t have the expense of retraining ) you get increased benefits . The only problem is when the employer ,public or private ,goes BK or
doesn’t have the money they don’t want to pay for the incentives they gave you to be a nice docile loyal long term worker who won’t snitch on the employer.
Besides if your vested ,your going to put up with a lot of shit ,and perhaps your going to keep your mouth shut also in a Corporation if they tell you to do something that might be wrong . It’s the loyalty pledge .It also in theory makes you
a more productive worker . Once you have served enough time ,you can’t get out . But the employers violation of their
contract ,public or private ,it you added up the benefits
gotten from those promises ,the benefits were priceless .

“What is your point? Every post you have is an incoherent screech. Now you are trying to equate a strong, centralized government with a good place to live. That is just insane”

Oh, now when a member on HBB posts an unpopular post to the mighty NYCityBoy and his gang, it’s a “incoherent screech” and they are labled “insane.”

NYCityBoy, why don’t you just call them Communists or even Socialists, call yourself Joe and rename this blog your House Un-American Activities Committee ?

“Wow. That is all I can say. Wow.”

That’s all he can say? Sounds like a guy who could have used a little more unionized McEducmacation.

After this last week, and I can’t believe I’m saying this, but I think I’m a straight-line Democratic voter.

Damn nickpapageorgio……………..We done lost another one…

Maybe it’s because Scott Walker was too soft on the Commies. Maybe Scott Walker (bows head) compromises too much.

If only he would have taken a hard line on those Democrat b#@$ards.

It isn’t over.

It isn’t over.

I wasn’t talking about the Bill being pass or not robin.

why does our public education system suck? ??

I can name two reasons;

First, and foremost, the lack of discipline on so many levels that there is really nowhere to start…You ever see the size of a Chinese elementary school classroom ??

Second, unions & tenure….

Wrong. School boards are the number one problem.

Go to a few of YOUR local school board meetings. Read their policies statements. Look at their purchasing actions. You are NOT going to like what you see.

Then remember that YOU can vote them in or out.

Wrong. School boards are the number one problem ??

Oh I would love to introduce you to the high school kids we have around here…When would you like to meet them…In the morning, noon,afternoon or night at the 7-11 ??

For every example Republicans have of government employees that suck, you can find an equivalent example of how outsourcing this function to private enterprise sucks.

Doesn’t matter if it’s public or private, if you have sleazeball running it, it’s going to be fooked up. And if anyone believes that the businessmen in this country are more virtuous than they typical civil servant, I have a couple of hundred bridges I need to sell you.

Government handled funding of education pretty well from about 1945 to 1980, or thereabouts. As socialist as they would be considered now, does anyone believe that the various GI Bills between 1944 and 1975 weren’t beneficial to the country?

I’ll tell you what……..let’s eliminate all the veteran’s programs, and at the same time, bring everyone back for overseas, discharge them, and tell them “Sorry, all the money that would have paid for the benefits that you were promised has been given to the banksters. We don’t have the money to fund everything, so someone has to sacrifice. Good thing you have those new army boots, so you can pull yourself up with them bootstraps. Thats all the help you are going to get from the government. All Hail the “Free Market System (as currently practiced)……”

Let me know how that works out for everyone in 12-36 months

“other countries are good at it…we should study them and emulate them…or would that solution somehow impact the teachers’ union negatively?”

It likely would. It would also require less testing and more hours in the classroom. The union bosses would be running mad…at least about the more hours part.

I agree that students should spend more hours in school.

But too many people neglect the fact that any country with the demographic make up that we have has problems with their educational system.

Like it or not, bringing millions of poor people in from countries where education isn’t always available, and where many don’t even graduate from fifth grade, there are going to be problems.

You’ll see the degradation of public schools in almost every country that has recently been overrun by poor immigrants with little education and who have poor language skills in their hosts country’s language.

My goodness, I agree with Rio.

My goodness, I agree with Rio.

Well, in reality, compared historically, I’m not that big of a liberal. Sure some called me a liberal in Kansas. But my dad used to call me a young Republican in High School. And many times I was branded a conservative when I lived in the Bay Area.

Now I am a “liberal” on healthcare and my strong anti-fascist/corporatist stand makes me sound liberal these nutball days, but corporatism and inequality of wealth has nothing to do with real conservatism. Barry Goldwater would be shocked to see what most neocons and Tea Partiers are up to. (I just read his book. And I didn’t mean it to sound like I have a huge library, more like a nice bedroom with the walls covered with books, but that’s pretty good for a gringo in Rio)

Anyway, even though the Democrats suck and Obama is a huge dissapointment, I have taken a hard left because that is where I feel the defense is most needed in America. There IS a takeover being attempted and supporting the traitor Republicans will hasten our demise.

I’ve never been a big union guy but I always respected their rights to exist and their role in raising middle-class standards of living. But now, I totally support them because they are in grave danger of being crushed.

So what you see in me is a former middle of the road guy who has chosen sides in a country that is gravely in danger of being taken over by intolerant, greedy fascists.

But it’s Rio on Friday night and I want a beer. Have a good weekend everybody. Thanks Ben. Boa Noite!

What he said. Same here.

Rio ,I second your emotions .

Frack. Typing too fast.

“…we’re…”

i think he was questioning physical brick and mortar libraries…not libraries in general.

i am sure if one was to research it they would find that much more information exist electronically these days that stored somewhere on paper anyway.

Sorry, but books are still superior.

For starters, they don’t crash. Or run out of battery power.

And most poor people, who need the library the most so they can, ya know, better themselves, can’t afford gizmos or bookstores.

We don’t need a library to watch IDOL or the Grammies or Oscars. Isn’t OPRA an intel show? I don’t have to think. My head hurts with FOX News.

Your mind is really a mess, Mikey. I believe it is your brethren that have pushed for the changes to Tom Sawyer.

I agree that we don’t want to kill libraries. We really need to encourage an educated populace. (However, I am not opposed to cutting hours of operation to reduce costs, if necessary.)

Libraries deprive authors income. They should be outlawed. What’s the difference if I check a book out or download it from a bittorrent site? What’s the difference if I buy a used CD or download it from a bittorrent site? None.

Libraries deprive authors income. They should be outlawed.

To the contrary. And I speak as an author who’s sold quite a few books to libraries. They’re great customers.

Exactly. Libraries as portals for inquisitive minds to access a vast offering never before afforded to them.

Or on their I-Pad at home, if they can afford one. Save trees and real estate. Get real. Touchy-Feely is warm and fuzzy, but it costs us taxpayers a lot!

Long held beliefs …

BELIEF GROUNDS FOR BELIEF

Take this low pay ……You could be starving in China .

The Rich get richer ….Therefore we should tax them less .

It’s always been this way..,Therefore don’t make change or
correct inequities .

It’s their fault ………….. Blame the victim take the heat
off the thieves or corruption .

There is no money ………We would rather spend the money
another way .

You need to conform
and be a team player……One more docile cattle worker who
will make money for the rich and
not rebel .

Life is what you make it …If your born in Beverly hills ,are
given all the advantages and
proceed to fleece the
underclass and keep them in
their place .

The rich deserve more
because they are smart ….Exploitation of people with no
choices makes them smart .

The Investment class and
the risk takers are the backbone
of all business ……………Great rich quick is easier than
working for the man .

Real estate always goes up ..Given a 100 year span of time

We didn’t see it coming ……It crashed before we got out .

If you just keep working a little harder each day, you too will join the club of wealthy corporatists.

The inflation myth is certainly do real enough damage to my bank account.

…doing…

I guess I’ll have to buy another 1000 shares of Wellpoint eh ?

Thank you for the excellent post, Wiz.

I’m guessing he is in Fishkill or Poughkeepsie.

Too bad church didn’t teach him humility. It looks like life is about to achieve that task.

Close. All 5 are in Poughquag and LaGrangeville.

Humility? This is the same character who I heard say “I’m an engineer”. His real occupation? Janitor. He precisely demonstrates my entire point when I mention the fact that people run frantically from their peonage and peasantry.

Wait, $65K a year as a janitor? Or is the $65K what he used to make?

Dang, with 7 kids I hope cable is not cut-off because he has demonstrated an ability to fill idle time around the house with the wifey.

Yeah but there is(was in his case) a solution to that…. It’s called birth control.

LOL, NYCboy.

Wow! Exeter. I guess I didn’t understand the how the hell are they making this happen statement. Does he think his unpaid vendors or mortgage holder have no recourse? Does he believe because he signed some papers that despite not paying his mortgage that the house is still “his”?

“Wait, $65K a year as a janitor? ”

It is in NY state. Out here school janitors are paid $12/hr. In the private sector thay are all minimum wage illegals.

No he works in a building owned by a REIT who lease to high finance. But a janitor nonetheless.

We can hope.

And the consequence is a new, baby faced yes-man named Scott Walker is hundreds of miles from shore treading water…. with no rescue in sight while his cowardly shipmates are high and dry. And he’s singing his last tune that goes like this;

Waterloo - I was defeated, you won the war
Waterloo - promise to love you for ever more
Waterloo - couldn’t escape if I wanted to
Waterloo - knowing my fate is to be with you
Waterloo - finally facing my waterloo

Or say we are not showing up until we get our way on a bill before it is even debated?…No – the legislative process does not work that way in America.

No, it actually does sometimes. That is exactly the way the legislative process works in America when a legislature is structured with a quourum requirement as does the WI Senate.

The WI Democratic Senators are not doing anything illegal because apparently, unlike the US Senate, the WI Senate does not have a strong binding “Call of the House” procedure that would arrest them and bring them back to the Senate to vote.

On the other hand, the US Senate has a strong “Call of the House” procedure where they can actually arrest Senators if they walk out to not meet a quourum. The last time Senators walked out on the US Senate was 1988 when the Republicans walked out because they didn’t like a bill being debated.

In the United States Senate, the procedure was (last) used in the early morning hours of February 25, 1988. Senator Robert C. Byrd of West Virginia, then the Senate Majority Leader, moved a call of the house after the minority Republicans walked out in an attempt to deny the Senate a quorum after Senate aides began bring cots into the Senate cloakrooms in preparation for an all-night session over campaign finance reform for congressional elections.

After a cleaning woman gave a tip that Senator Robert Packwood of Oregon was in his office, Giugni opened the door with a skeleton key. Packwood attempted to shove the door closed, but Giugni and two assistants pushed it open. Packwood was “carried feet-first into the Senate chamber by three plainclothes officers” and sustained bruised knuckles.[9] wiki

If only the gubmint in WI under Walker actually functioned like a democratic republic, with stuff like debate and compromise, rather than the current dictatorial my-way-or-the-highway shenanigans.

“I believe the same would be true of residential real estate.”

Are you suggesting banks have to recognize unrealized losses on residential real estate? How can they even figure out the magnitude of unrealized losses for areas where properties are generally kept off the market or put on the market at list prices where they never sell? It seems like a lack of sales would lead to a lack of comps on which to base your estimate of unrealized real estate gambling losses, but perhaps you know better than I how this is done…

FASB. Rule 157. Mark to Fantasy. Extend and Pretend. Smoke and mirrors. Insolvent, but got cash flow. Pray for a miracle.

Our beloved Volker invented this tactic.

Thanks, Blue. NYCB, you know anything about FASB Rule 157?

“Our beloved Volker invented this tactic.”

I’m skeptical he originated this. It seems like the Soviet Union was engaging in some kind of mass accounting fraud before they blew up in 1989. More recently, didn’t Enron pretty much hide their losses off balance sheet until the day they blew sky high? And the Japanese banks also failed to recognize losses after their asset prices collapsed in the early-1990s. Not sure how these examples tie in to your point about Volcker, but it seems like shell games to hide losses are very prevalent in corporations and governments.

Volker saved the banks in the 80s by letting them slide on accounting rules regarding bad loans to Latin America, IIRC. In time, they earned enough to cover the bad loans.

Thanks, Blue. NYCB, you know anything about FASB Rule 157?

Yes I do. Please give me the names of small banks that are not being forced to write down loans.

Just because you jumped the shark, don’t get uppity with me.

If a small bank gets shut down and a big bank takes over its assets, does dog poop suddenly turn back into gold or does it get flushed?

The FDIC brings a big trash can and a pooper scooper. Nice, ehhhh?

But to imply that nothing is getting written down is silly. FASB157 doesn’t stop everything in the banking system from facing any write-downs.

Volker saved the banks in the 80s ??

And crushed many friends of mine that never recovered… Almost got me…

“Please give me the names of small banks that are not being forced to write down loans.”

OK — here’s one:

Regulators Close Small Ill. Bank; Makes 23 in 2011
Regulators shut down small bank in Illinois; makes 23 US bank failures in 2011
The Associated Press
By MARCY GORDON AP Business Writer
WASHINGTON February 25, 2011 (AP)

Regulators on Friday shut down a small bank in Illinois, raising to 23 the number of U.S. bank failures this year after the limping economy and mounting soured loans felled 157 banks in 2010.

The Federal Deposit Insurance Corp. seized Valley Community Bank, based in St. Charles, Ill. The bank has five branches, $123.8 million in assets and $124.2 million in deposits.
…

OMG rms , I will never forget that vision . Holy shit, when I saw the photo you posted chills went down my spine and my being
was just disturbed to the core .

OMG, indeed.