Bits Bucket for June 5, 2011
Post off-topic ideas, links, and Craigslist finds here.
The Housing Bubble
Examining the home price boom and its effect on owners, lenders, regulators, realtors and the economy as a whole.
About Me
Name:Ben Jones
Location:Northern Arizona, United States
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If I need a mortgage, maybe I’ll go to the mob. As long as you paid them, they were pretty honest and left you alone…
———–
The new nation-wide investigation into foreclosure frauds comes as no surprise to people who follow the mortgage service business. Shoddy, deceptive paperwork has plagued homeowners for years. In the industry’s slimy underside, firms push borrowers into default and foreclosure, even when they’ve been making payments on time.
Their business model makes defaults profitable, says Marie McDonnell who has been auditing mortgages for accuracy since 1986. The ugly chain of deception starts with the way a servicer might handle your escrow account.
…However, every homeowner should check his or her mortgage escrow account — right now – for one of two wrongs. First, the servicer might be putting more into escrow than you actually owe, hoping you won’t notice. That gives the bank extra money to earn some interest on. Or second, you might owe more than you realize. That leads to underpayments, default, fat late fees owed and, eventually, foreclosure.
http://moneywatch.bnet.com/economic-news/blog/make-money/foreclosure-fraud-how-you-can-be-driven-to-default-even-if-you-pay-on-time/544/?tag=content;col1
———–
Interest on an escrow account does not go to the servicer.
Then where does it go? And if the servicer doesn’t get it, then why do they take the extra money?
By the way, could this be solved if you signed up to send paper checks, so they don’t have access to your bank account? And wouldn’t you spot this on your monthly statement? From the article, it seems like people don’t check their bank statements for months on end.
Slimy underside, and top side, and right and left sides, and inside too!
Realtors are slimers.
So many victims!
Caveat emptor. So many suckers, so many marks, so few genuine victims.
“Twentysomething Inc. reports 85 percent of new college graduates will move back home.
Just 53 percent of those graduating between 2006 and 2010 with four-year degrees have full-time jobs, according to the John J. Heldrich Center for Workforce Development at Rutgers University. Those who did find work earned a median salary that is 10 percent less than it was four years ago.”
http://www.democratandchronicle.com/article/20110605/BUSINESS0108/106050316/Starting-Out-Bachelor-s-degrees-don-t-give-grads-what-they-used-to
Not surprising as Corporate America can fill its hiring needs at a steep discount in the third world. When I worked at HP we had pretty much offshored a lot of our backoffice work to Mexico and Central America, where the degreed staff (accounting, HR, tech support, etc.) started out for less than US minimum wage.
When I graduated from college ten years ago, I started out earning 10% less than my boss had earned with same degree ten years earlier. Today, new grads entering my field are making, guess what, 10% less than I did.
Someone on this board a while back came on here with the claim that new grads expect to earn as much as a 50-year-old. I’d say you gotta be living in la-la land to hold that view. I feel totally sorry for kids right now.
“I feel totally sorry for kids right now.”
As do I, BV. What a steaming pile of shat we have left them.
“What a steaming pile of shat we have left them.”
Yes, but remember, at some point those that left the pile will need help with things like going to the bathroom; expect horrible health care, and expect to pay a lot for it.
Look around now, retirement homes are already chock full of indifferent orderlies. Things will get unexpectedly worse.
Things will get unexpectedly worse.
Especially since the next generations won’t have pensions or any money to pay for their nursing homes.
Next generation? Try this generation.
What are the “pensions” you speak of?
Yeah, Generation Greed has screwed their own children, grandchildren, and country in the name of money. Ironic that Bob Dylan, who penned songs such as “It’s Alright, Ma (I’m Only Bleeding)”, “Like a Rolling Stone”, “A Hard Rain’s A-Gonna Fall”, “The Times They Are A-Changin’”and “Only A Pawn In Their Game”, lives in a Beverly Hills mansion, and was turned in by neighbors for having a Honey-Bucket sh!tshack in his backyard which was reeking up the entire neighborhood. It seems he was too cheap to have it cleaned weekly, so it was unsanitary and became a public nuisance. When one wonders why there is a Honey-Bucket in his backyard to begin with, one finds that he has illegal aliens working on his property, and these second class non-citizens are not allowed in any of the structures to use the facilities. What ever happened to “Maggie’s Farm” Bob?
I love hearing the boomers say “We were the generation that had Woodstock!”. Ahh yes, the concert that, when the producer ran out of tickets, the boomers just smashed the gate and stormed the field. Then 25 years later telling the next generation “You can have your own Woodstock” and corporatizing the hell out of it!
Its like all of the over 65’s that I talked to last years that were just angry and up set about “Obamacare” and wanted it over turned.
It turns out that they worked hard and “deserved” their Medicare, but everyone else did not deserve medical care. Especially that free medical care.
Ah, the irony. Farmers and ranchers don’t want to enforce the law by verifying that their employees are legal (because they aren’t) and warn that food prices will go up if they have to pay the wages necessary for Americans to do this work. Yet, we are all subsidizing this broken system through the increased demand on public services that everyone complains about it. So which way is it people? Enforce our laws and pay the true cost of produce?, or continue with our broken immigration system that lets some employers get away with skirting the law so that we can buy artificially cheap food and services? If you chose the later than don’t be complaining about “anchor babies” and the impact on entitlements.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/43279449
I suspect the average American is willing to bite the bullet on produce prices, but the MSM chooses not to report that. ‘Cause we’re racist and all.
“Farmers and ranchers don’t want to enforce the law by verifying that their employees are legal (because they aren’t) and warn that food prices will go up if they have to pay the wages necessary for Americans to do this work.”
Funny, I’ve never seen a poor farmer or rancher. They’re always sporting $60k pickup trucks, and large homes on mass acreage. F**k those greedy turds.
I know what you’re saying Big V, but considering that many 50 yos are substantially earning less than they were 20 years as well, it might be a fair statement after all.
I don’t know whether to laugh or cry.
The old deal was that you would be hired as a trainee out of college, and as you progressed you would get raises.
The new deal is that you are expected to hit the ground running and there won’t be any pay increases. And the starting pay is worse than what trainees used to get.
“College Conspiracy”
Someone may have previously posted a link to this video - it’s an hour long.
The video appears to have some merit. Folks use to graduate from college with little to no loans. Those with loans were able to pay them off in a relatively short period of time and then move on to a mortgage, kids, etc. Folks today graduate from college, obtain a low paying job and enter into a lifetime of paying off the loans which short circuits the mortgage, kids, etc.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VpZtX32sKVE
I moved back home after graduating college, but I had a job waiting for me and my parents insisted I move back in, saying there was no reason to waste money on an apartment. I worked full time and still made time to paint rooms and fix things my Mom wanted done. Only lived there about ten months before moving cross country,but those few months of saving on rent really did help me out.
I bet a lot of those vapid, earnest student Obama Zombies of 2008 are starting to figure out they got sold a bill of goods. How’s that hope ‘n change working out for ya?
If given the choice between Obama and McLame, I’d vote for Obama again. But I voted against “100 more years in Iraq” and for bringing the troops home. Obama hasn’t exactly done that, so I won’t be voting for him again. I’ll laugh heartily if some hypocritical narcissistic right wing cult member hack like Romney is elected.
me too, lesser of two evils
Delinquent Homeowners to Get Mortgage Aid from Government
By: Reuters
The Obama administration wants to help more struggling Americans stay in their homes by reducing the amount they owe on their troubled mortgages, a top Treasury official said Saturday.
“We are very definitely trying to facilitate more principal reductions,” said Timothy Massad, Treasury’s acting assistant secretary for financial stability. “It is a very important piece of the overall solution,” he said.
The administration is trying through taxpayer-funded programs to prevent homeowners from losing their homes. Nearly $50 billion has been set aside from the $700 billion bank bailout known as the Troubled Asset Relief Program, or TARP, to help distressed homeowners.
Persistently high unemployment and a weak housing market pose a threat to President Obama’s re-election prospects next year.
So far, one of the programs has helped some 670,000 distressed homeowners win lower mortgage payments. But that has done very little to help the overall housing market, which remains depressed even as other parts of the economy have started to recover.
“So far, one of the programs has helped some 670,000 distressed homeowners win lower mortgage payments.”
So far, all of the programs have helped 0 renters win lower rent payments.
“Nearly $50 billion has been set aside to help distressed homeowners.”
$0 billion has been set aside to help renters.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/43281199 - -
Renters do not owe the banks trillions of dollars. They do not need to be propped up to support the banks.
There it is.
“There it is.”
Whoomp!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-FPimCmbX8
(BTW, this is the one with Obama supposedly at 1:00)
If I were a judge, and I had an eviction case before me, where the homeowner was not paying the mortgage and the tenant had stopped paying rent, I’d put that case on the back burner. It would suddenly become lunch time exactly at the moment that case got to my bench. Then, when I got back from lunch, I’d be like, “Where were we again, oh yeah, we were moving on the next case, the one that hasn’t gotten to my bench yet.”
And what about the greatest generation share holders? Are their investments to be thrown under the bus, or can we evict these non-payers, and get the home resold at a lower price to a bill-payer? The only workable solution is to let the normal foreclosure process proceed as in the past.
Oh yeah, get the home resold for sure. Let the bank evict the tenant if they’re still in there. I just hate to see greedy mofo landlords collecting rent checks and pocketing them. Durn, that burrrrrrns me up.
Oh, just to be clear, I was talking about if the nonpaying homemoaner was trying evict the nonpaying tenant.
“The only workable solution is to let the normal foreclosure process proceed as in the past.”
The only problem is that in the past, it was legally clear who the owner the mortgage note was- an important part of the foreclosure process.
Now, thanks to de facto deregulation by the use of MERS, no one is really sure who owns what. That’s a problem in the legal world. A big one.
How would the judge know the particulars of the case before it hit the bench?
More people would be in their homes if the ASKING PRICE was reduced.
Delinquent Homeowners to Get Mortgage Aid from Government
Published: Saturday, 4 Jun 2011 | 6:20 PM ET
Another program, now ramping up, gives states that have been the hardest hit by falling home prices funding to help reduce the principal of a borrower’s loan, among other things.
“I think those will make a big difference in terms of the problems of unemployed homeowners and falling house prices,” said Massad. But he added the process was tricky.
“There are issues of how you do it, making sure it’s fair, making sure you don’t create the wrong incentives,” Massad said.
At the event, dozens of homeowners seeking relief waited to talk to housing counselors and their mortgage servicers, who collect housing payments and negotiate new terms for troubled loans.
One housing counselor expressed frustration with the servicers, saying more people would still be in their homes if their principal was reduced.
‘Nearly $50 billion has been set aside to help distressed homeowners…$0 billion has been set aside to help renters’
Talk about the haves and have nots. Billions for landowners, nothing for renters. Billions for bankers, etc.
Some of you know I think the left/right conservative/liberal dualism are shams that keep the people divided. But I’ve seen some “liberals” attacking “conservative” posters here. Generally, the scene is predictable and proves my point about the whole political theater.
But how about it Obama supporters? Are you all for handing out billions to “rich” landowners, while us lowly renting serfs get nothing?
And for you bomb dropping “conservatives”, what happened to your constitutional roots? Up is down, in the world anymore:
“Dwindling congressional and public support for the decade-old conflict in Afghanistan will influence the Obama administration’s war policy, Defense Secretary Robert Gates said Saturday. “You can’t be oblivious to the growing war weariness at home, and diminishing support in the Congress,” Gates said.’
http://thehill.com/news-by-subject/defense-homeland-security/164757-gates-administration-cant-ignore-dwindling-hill-public-support-for-afghan-war
“One Democrat called it the “sign of the apocalypse.” An anti-war resolution authored by Rep. Dennis Kucinich (D-Ohio), who spent years trying to impeach the last Republican president for prosecuting an illegal war, won more support from Republicans than Democrats on the House floor.”
http://thehill.com/news-by-subject/defense-homeland-security/164741-sign-of-the-apocalypse-kucinichs-strong-gop-support-on-libya
So the “opposition” struggles against a warmongering commander in chief to stop an unpopular war. Why does this seem familiar? How come things never change in DC? Could it be that people are so caught up in defending “their” side that they forget what is right and wrong?
forget what is right and wrong?
Very few people formulate their own opinions on big issues, is what I am beginning to believe. They need and authority figure to tell them what the bottom line is. I think this is why politics (slogans) drives crowds more than a common idea of what is right.
On the constitution, isn’t it ironic that a law is proposed requiring adherance to the constitution?
Thats how advertising works. Get a popular figure to endorse a product and sales will sky rocket.
“Some of you know I think the left/right conservative/liberal dualism are shams that keep the people divided.”
That’s what it’s all about. There really isn’t any “conservative/liberal” dualism, just the appearance of it. People who fall into this trap are dorks, anyway. I took a “lib” position on one thread and was immediately attacked by one of our “lib” posters. It was just knee-jerk opposition, nothing more or less.
“the left/right conservative/liberal dualism are shams that keep the people divided.”
If this is true:
1. Who wants to keep the people divided? Are they mostly “right” or “left”? Are they the rich or poor? Are they the liberals or the conservatives? Are they out for themselves only or do they care about their country and common good as well?
2. In the past 40 years, have those wanting to divide us got their way economically and politically?
3. If those wanting to divide us have got their way, has this been to the benefit of the average American?
4. If those wanting to divide us have got their way and it has not been to the benefit of the average American, should not the average American stick up for the side who has been losing the battle?
“There really isn’t any “conservative/liberal” dualism, just the appearance of it.”
Well, except that their brains are built differently:
Brain structure differs in liberals, conservatives: study
(AFP) – Apr 7, 2011
Google News
WASHINGTON — Everyone knows that liberals and conservatives butt heads when it comes to world views, but scientists have now shown that their brains are actually built differently.
Liberals have more gray matter in a part of the brain associated with understanding complexity, while the conservative brain is bigger in the section related to processing fear, said the study on Thursday in Current Biology.
“We found that greater liberalism was associated with increased gray matter volume in the anterior cingulate cortex, whereas greater conservatism was associated with increased volume of the right amygdala,” the study said.
Other research has shown greater brain activity in those areas, according to which political views a person holds, but this is the first study to show a physical difference in size in the same regions.
“Previously, some psychological traits were known to be predictive of an individual’s political orientation,” said Ryota Kanai of the University College London, where the research took place.
“Our study now links such personality traits with specific brain structure.”
The study was based on 90 “healthy young adults” who reported their political views on a scale of one to five from very liberal to very conservative, then agreed to have their brains scanned.
People with a large amygdala are “more sensitive to disgust” and tend to “respond to threatening situations with more aggression than do liberals and are more sensitive to threatening facial expressions,” the study said.
Liberals are linked to larger anterior cingulate cortexes, a region that “monitor(s) uncertainty and conflicts,” it said.
“Thus, it is conceivable that individuals with a larger ACC have a higher capacity to tolerate uncertainty and conflicts, allowing them to accept more liberal views.”
It remains unclear whether the structural differences cause the divergence in political views, or are the effect of them.
But the central issue in determining political views appears to revolve around fear and how it affects a person.
“Our findings are consistent with the proposal that political orientation is associated with psychological processes for managing fear and uncertainty,” the study said.
“People with a large amygdala are “more sensitive to disgust” and tend to “respond to threatening situations with more aggression than do liberals and are more sensitive to threatening facial expressions,” the study said.”
How much did that study cost?
I don`t think they studied the liberal group Organize Now, because they obviously have tiny anterior cingulate cortexes.
Democratic activists urged to be aggressive at Rep. Allen West town hall meetings
By George Bennett Palm Beach Post Staff Writer
Posted: 1:53 p.m. Sunday, June 5, 2011
Palm Beach County Democratic activists got some coaching last week on getting loud and getting ejected when U.S. Rep. Allen West, R-Plantation, holds another town hall meeting Thursday in Boca Raton.
“Make your voice heard. Get angry. Get upset - because you are .. .Attend every single town hall and get loud. That’s the only way the media’s going to pick us up,” Craig Borkon of the liberal group Organize Now told the county Democratic Executive Committee.
When one of the roughly 100 partisans mentioned getting tossed out, Borkon said: “Let them throw you out. Finally maybe the media will put something in the paper saying he’s throwing everybody out that disagrees with him.”
http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/state/democratic-activists-urged-to-be-aggressive-at-rep-1520192.html - -
“Attend every single town hall and get loud. That’s the only way the media’s going to pick us up,”
Sounds…frightening, doesn’t it?
LOL
“Make your voice heard. Get angry. Get upset - because you are ..”
Tiny anterior cingulate cortexes.
I, the semi-liberal, have made my views pretty clear.
I have not “attacked” conservative posters who write comments with ideas, suggestions, and reasoning behind them. It’s those short, vague, meaningless talking points that raise my ire. You know the ones.
I’ve repeated my suggestion for cramdowns several times. Change BK law to allow partial discharge of mortgage debt in a BK. If the FB declares a BK, then the worth of the house is determined by some formula. If the FB can afford the market mortgage,* then cram it down. If not, bye bye FB. This gives the FB pain, it gives the bank a LOT of pain, and doesn’t violate contract law.
And no, of course I don’t like Obama’s monetary policies. I’m pretty sure Obama doesn’t like Obama’s policies. So why did he hand money to the banks? Because they were too big to fail. That’s what too big to fail means! They were so big that they could take ordinary employees hostage and blackmail the government, not that Hanky Panky fought the deals all that hard. Why were banks too big to fail? Because previous administrations relaxed the regulations which allowed them to grow to monopoly. I’ve predicted before that at some point, Obama going’s to shut off the fire hose. I don’t know when. It depends on whether we’ll have QE3.
I admit I don’t like Obama’s choice of advisors.
Renters have always gotten the shaft and always will. There just aren’t enough of them to have a voice, and they certainly can’t afford to buy off Congress like the rich can.
————-
* e.g. that strawberry-picker shouldn’t have his $700K house crammed down to $90K just becuase $90K is all he can afford. Whereas, an engineer in a $400K housenprobably could afford the house if it was crammed down to $250K.
Renters have always gotten the shaft and always will.
Maybe renters never have gotten the shaft. From 1975-2009 you could have rented and investing the difference from buying in T-Bills and come out ahead according to some studies. *
Maybe the government knew it was the buyers getting the shaft so they evened out the playing field.
* The Rent Isn’t Too Damn High
Why it’s good news that more Americans are renting rather than buying homes. slate dot com
Ben, it looks like noone here wants to answer your question. Maybe the shine is off. IMO, there will be a hero, but it is still too early.
Oxy, yes, but you weren’t getting the question.
Maybe you don’t understand the answers.
I voted for Obama, but I’m not an “Obama supporter.” I hate what he’s done, and would never even consider voting for him again. It’s people like me- non-partisan swing voters, who made it possible for him to be elected. Unfortunately, he picked up right where George Bush left off, getting on his knees in front of the likes of Lloyd Blankfein, etc. He’s done.
It’s all about issues.
You have to compare who is likely to vote which way on what, then calculate the chances of that issue coming up for a vote during their tenure. Then figure out what other issues that person may support that you DON’T like, and base your support for them on some impossible calculus based on the likelihood of THOSE issues coming up for a vote in opposition to your best interests. All while realizing that depending upon circumstances or payola, that pledge of support for the issue you DO support them for is quite likely to change as do their political winds.
Get it? I sure as eff don’t.
Which is why I support politicians as diverse as Bernie Sanders and Dana Rohrabacher. At least I know what they’re going to do on issues I care about– whether I like their vote or not. Thus eliminating one of the variables.
Now, scolding and excoriating before and after the fact? THAT is a constant in my personal political equation.
this angers me to no end…
“this angers me to no end…”
I would tend to believe that some of this is true, yet the NAR, Wall Street, victim “homeowners” whose kids made fun of mine in 2005-2007 parroting their parents who
said what an idiot my kids father was because
“house prices only go up and they would never own a home” the Banks and the government have kept me and many other right thinking responsible people from raising their kids with the….
“Social Benefits of Homeownership and Stable Housing,”
NAR survey: Homeownership and community stability linked
Fri, 2010-08-13 16:48 —
Homeowners are more active in their communities, benefit from improved education opportunities, and report higher levels of self-esteem and happiness when compared to renters, according to leading research. A new report from the National Association of Realtors (NAR), “Social Benefits of Homeownership and Stable Housing,” explores the impact of stable housing and the positive social outcomes resulting from homeownership.
Several research studies cited in the NAR report have found that homeownership has a significant impact on educational achievement. For instance, the decision by teenage students to stay in school is higher for those raised by parents who are homeowners compared to those whose parents are renters. Access to economic and educational opportunities are also more prevalent in neighborhoods with high rates of homeownership. Furthermore, studies have shown that changing schools frequently due to moving impacts negatively a child’s educational outcome.
http://nationalmortgageprofessional.com/news19610/nar-survey-homeownership-and-community-stability-linked - 52k -
” right thinking” correct thinking or prudent not meant to be political. Sorry if that offended anyone.
Same old BS. Correlation does not prove causation. Usually, correlation proves that there is a common cause. In this case, a stable decent paying jobs allows people to BOTH buy the house and have all that education and happy happy joy joy community.
I’d explain this to people but they generally aren’t smart enough to get it. And the people who are smart enough to get it are probably underwater and would just kill the messenger (me).
I think one factor skewing the stats is single-parent households always moving from place to place. We moved around a lot when I was a kid. Divorced women seem to be a dissatisfied lot.
“So far, one of the programs has helped some 670,000 distressed homeowners win lower mortgage payments.”
Win?
Yeah, I wondered about that, too. But I’ve learned to just shrug off with a laugh a lot of these misplaced/misused words and phrases. Journalism has descended to the level of the ignorant and illiterate.
This is only available for houses with mortgages of less than $729k. So at least it`s not helping rich people.
Again, so many victims!(voters too)
Lower home prices would certainly get the real estate market moving again, and that would boost the economy, so obviously the PTB are interested only in supporting large banks and the rest of us are under the bus.
So now it’s a “civil rights” issue…
U.S. Mortgage Proposal May Result in ‘Rental Entrapment’
By Lorraine Woellert - Bloomberg
Minorities and the working class may find it harder to buy homes under a U.S. plan that would require larger down payments to qualify for lower-cost mortgages, according to lenders, consumer groups and lawmakers.
Bankers and consumer advocates, often at odds on policy issues, united today to make the case for revising the government proposal and released data that they said shows the rule would deny loans to millions of borrowers while doing little to reduce defaults.
“This is a civil rights issue,” John Taylor, chief executive officer of the National Community Reinvestment Coalition in Washington, said in an interview. “It falls around people of color. It’s a class issue.”
The rule could lead to “long-term rental entrapment” for “large numbers” of Americans who would need at least a decade to save for a 20 percent down payment, said David Stevens, president of the Mortgage Bankers Association. It would take at least a decade for a family to save that much in Los Angeles, Philadelphia, Seattle, and Birmingham, Alabama, he said, citing U.S. and industry data on household incomes and home prices.
Deadline Extension
Regulators plan to extend the deadline for public comment on the proposal from June 10 to Aug. 1, according to a person familiar with the matter, who declined to be identified because the decision hasn’t been made public. That may delay the law from taking effect.
Oh sure…
If it takes a decade to save a downpayment, then the average life span is not long enough to pay off the mortgage. There is the real enslavement.
Obviously for many, being a homeowener is true enslavement…
“…then the average life span is not long enough to pay off the mortgage…”
But you always have the option to sell in five years or so; just ask all the folks who financed with payment-option ARMs circa 2005…
If one chooses to purchase a modest home he or she can easily afford with a roommate or spouse, it’s a piece of cake. I paid off my humble abode in 17 years on a 30-year program and have, over time, invested more in upgrades than the cost of the house. Probably 50% of the labor was done by me.
I truly believe it is the sad mentality of instant gratification. I want what I want, screw what I need. Somehow my roommates and I got along with only one bathroom. My wife and I still do.
It’s still humble, only deluxe humble with skylight, central air and heat, attic fan, double-insulated windows, refinished hardwood floors, totally rewired and insulated, major surgery and walls torn out and parts move around. Completely liveable.
House next door sold for $603k 2 years ago. Now they would be lucky to get $350k. Do I care? A little, but it is all relative. A good time to buy, great times to buy are likely up the road; but watch where interest rates go. Make sure you can do it on one low income. I predict no valid guarantees from any view over the next decade.
We all wanted the correction and price drops we have seen. Now we have it. Yet we are not celebrating because it did not occur in a vacuum. It was not a ceterus paribus phenomena.
“U.S. Mortgage Proposal May Result in ‘Rental Entrapment’”
Isn’t that exactly the point of the ‘Save Our Homes’ bailout programs? Help out banks by keeping the value of the collateral high, while pricing low income and minority renter familes out of the market forever as a consequence?
What am I missing here?
How long do you have to be a renter before it is considered “long-term rental entrapment”. I have been renting since Sep. 05 because of artificially high house prices. Does that count as “long-term rental entrapment”?
I believe “rental entrapment” would pertain more to a situation where the rental destroyed his credit score by purchasing a home he couldn’t afford, then defaulting on the mortgage:
- He rents because he has to.
- He does not have any savings to fund a downpayment to buy a home.
- His credit score makes it impossible for him to qualify for a mortgage.
Does that sound about right?
By contrast, if your credit score and income qualify you to buy a home, but you choose not to buy, that would not seem to meet the definition of ‘entrapment,’ since you could presumably buy if you chose to do so.
National Community Reinvestment Coalition
We provide resources for community development corporations; local and state government agencies; faith-based institutions; community organizing and civil rights groups; minority and women-owned business associations as well as housing counselors and social service providers.
Train with the Best in the Country! Opportunities Available in 15 Cities!
Recognized for its leadership and expertise in fair lending, NCRC’s Housing Counseling Network team will train at least 1,000 housing professionals in 15 cities. Participants will learn how to identify fair lending abuses and mortgage fraud in predatory loans which, in turn, wil assist them in systemically negotiating loan modifications and hold discriminatory and unscrupulous lenders and servicers accountable.
Identifying Mortgage Abuses and Fair Lending Violations (Two-Day Introductory Course)
The goal of this course two-day training is to teach participants to look at the foreclosure process through a fair lending lens to better assist their communities. Housing professionals will receive an overview of the historical mortgage marketplace and discuss issues relevant to the current housing market as well as fair lending concerns. Specifically, students will:
•Learn how to identify discrimination or fraud in underwriting and how to work with loan servicers on behalf of clients
•Identify new best practices that will facilitate loan modifications, refinances, and forbearance agreements
•Conduct full file review and forensic analysis of underwriting with a fair lending and consumer protection issues
•Explain the various fair lending laws and protections for consumers
•Receive training on civil rights and consumer protection laws, regulations and techniques that will help sustain homeownership and hold lenders and servicers accountable for systemic violations of the law
•Obtain information about participating in the NCRC National Housing Counseling Network as a qualified HUD counseling agency in your community
http://www.ncrc.org/ - 59k -
The 5% nonsecuritization law would help poor people by allowing house prices to become affordable again more quickly.
It would take less than half that time to save for a 20% down. The economy would start moving, prices would fall by 50% making the down affordable and people would actually be able to afford the home they bought.
U.S. plan that would require larger down payments to qualify for lower-cost mortgages,
There’s that “require” again. At least they talk about lower-cost mortgages.
By the way, I guess “rental entrapment” would apply to someone like me. I graduated in 2000 with very little money, but I had a decent job. However, house prices zoomed up so fast that the 20% downpayment went up quicker than I could save it. Now prices are still a little high, but I could reasonably afford something if I really wanted to, even with a down payment. But guess what — it took me ten years.
You need to change your job and get a better one
Well actually yes I did get a better job — in fact there is probably no better job in the country. Stable, well-paying, good benefits. Just not enough to afford the wishing prices with 20% down.
‘Rental Entrapment’ ??
Even more-so that we should let the market seek its market clearing price…Landlords take no prisoners when they have the opportunity…
“The rule could lead to “long-term rental entrapment” for “large numbers” of Americans who would need at least a decade to save for a 20 percent down payment, said David Stevens, president of the Mortgage Bankers Association. It would take at least a decade for a family to save that much in Los Angeles, Philadelphia, Seattle, and Birmingham, Alabama, he said, citing U.S. and industry data on household incomes and home prices.”
With high rents, higher housing prices, and falling wages, a decade seems overly optimistic. Unless at least two of those three change, many won’t or shouldn’t ever buy.
They are being “forced” to become renters…
Renters, not owners, now driving housing market
Many are opting to rent even if they have the means to buy, experts said.
Drew and Kim Cooper have owned seven homes in the past three decades.
But 19 years after buying their last home in Atlanta, the couple – now in their 50s – are renters again, living in the upscale Ascot neighborhood near Irmo.
It is a decision the dismal home sales market has forced on a growing number of would-be homeowners.
After years of declining home sales, falling home prices and tighter credit standards for getting a loan, some experts fear the flickering threats of a double-dip recession will be enough to put the dreams of homeownership to sleep for a growing number of consumers – from potential first-time buyers to those who have lost money on home deals.
Homeownership rates in the Columbia Metropolitan Area have dropped 11.2 percentage points since 2005, according to U.S. Census data, to stand at 69.8 percent in the first quarter of 2011.
Six years ago, when contractors were in an all-out fury to keep up with the long arc of a national housing boom, homeownership rates in the Columbia area stood at 81 percent, their historical peak.
“It’s tough for first-time home buyers right now,” said Matt Mungo, vice president of The Mungo Cos. “Home building is down to where it was a few years ago. Move-up buyers (homeowners looking to upgrade) are driving the market now.”
Read more: http://www.thestate.com/2011/06/05/1846685/renters-not-owners-now-driving.html#ixzz1OOyVpTbY
“It is a decision the dismal home sales market has forced on a growing number of would-be homeowners.”
Huh? No one else is buying so they have to rent? Shouldn’t this be described as a choice influenced by price, expected loss in value, and possibly the ability to sell in case they need to move?
When you lose a bunch of money on a house, it leaves a lasting scar on those “dreams”. My dad lost bigtime in Buffalo 50 years ago. He wanted to rent after that, period. Makes me think the feared double dip is just the reality that these shills should get used to for a generation.
Hey, houses are just like any other form of investment in that the price you pay determines your rate of return.
Buy your house cheap and pay it off and your rate of return comes back to you in the form of imputed rent.
If houses aren’t cheap for you to buy then they probably aren’t cheap for your neighbor to buy either, which means a lot of yesterday and today’s buyers are going to be tomorrow’s sellers.
Patience.
My dad was also an expert at losing money; the friendly stock mutual fund salesman convinced him that it was a good time to buy, just before the onset of the 1966-1982 bear market, that ultimately pounded broad market P/E ratios down to seven or so.
So, what did your dad do when the P/Es hit seven or so?
Again, the price you pay determines your rate of return.
I don’t really think he was doing much investing back in the early 1980s, though later he bought quite a bit of stock through his 401(K) plan as the 401(K) revolution gained force. He was fortunate to be the executive director of the organization where he worked; his board grandfathered him into the defined benefit plan when they transitioned to 401(K), so he enjoyed the best of both pension worlds. His organization was a non-profit, and he did not earn anything like present-day CEO pay in the private sector, but he also always had a gift for contentment with what he has. Many could learn much from dad’s example — myself included! — but of course, kids are notorious for ignoring their parents’ conferred wisdom.
Ouch! Should have taken advantage of the fact that one should never buy stocks like buying a house, all or nothing. Diversify and dollar cost average. Cannot do that with a house. It is no surprise I don’t do ETFs. Those are all or nothing assets. You don’t dollar cost average into ETFs.
ETFs. Those are all or nothing assets. You don’t dollar cost average into ETFs.
I don’t understand. I’ve dollar cost averaged into ETFs. $500 a month into an ETF over years is dollar cost averaging - same as buying stocks or mutual funds that way.
And one can diversify with ETFs if one buys ETFs that are diversified.
I don’t understand, either. Why can’t you dollar cost average into ETFs?
Well I now consider myself wrong! I thought ETFs were higher cost than mutual funds…
Inflation is a form of dollar cost averaging when you buy a house on a 30 year note.
Except when you bought the house in Phoenix in 2006. The $500,000 house you theoretically bought in 2006 will probably be worth $500,000 in 2036 - in 2036 dollars (if the dollar survives that long). I think one might recoup 1997 prices before 2036 though…
“Move-up buyers (homeowners looking to upgrade) are driving the market now.”
Yeah, sure. I suppose they are putting those massive home equity gains to work as downpayments on the newer, bigger homes they are moving up to?
When did this whole “move up” thing get started. I mean, I expect that it always existed for people who started out with less and became hugely wealthy during their careers, but how long has it been around for the actual middle class.
I grew up in a middle middle class neighborhood in an upper middle class town. But I do not remember any of my classmates from the rich side of town moving to nicer houses. Never happened. Their mothers occassionally hired a decorator and “redid” the living room with new furniture and a new color scheme, but they didn’t move to a new house. And in my nabe? One family on the street in back of ours moved to a nicer house closer to the lake the year their daughter was a junior in high school It was practically the biggest gossip item anyone had ever heard. Moving to a nicer place when you were about to have an “empty” nest and everyone knew that the child was going to end up at a very expensive college and wanted to go to med school after that? It was just about as close to a scandal as you could get without the police being involved.
So, only anecdotal, but this was the norm for an entire town in the 70’s and 80’s. No one moved up. Your house was your house. Was it just because of interest rates? It isn’t like there weren’t new developments in town. Developers were still building and people were still buying, they just didn’t trade up once they settled in.
“When did this whole ‘move up’ thing get started.”
IMO it started when Joe6pack learned that instead of working to earn status he could just buy it.
In L.A. the saying is “You are what you drive”. Then all over the country this saying morphed into “You are where you live”, or “You are what you live in”.
I think it was George Jefferson…..
Pretty much, although not “learned”, but rather, “sold” on the idea.
In a 75% consumer driven economy, churn is the name of the game.
In L.A. the saying is “You are what you drive”.
Does anyone there ever pay-off their $50k loans on these huge vehicles with spinner wheels and boom box stereo systems? Talk about a love affair with cars.
School integration was the start/initial cause. Whites fled old neighborhoods to the suburbs.
And some of us whites would love to go semi-urban (So Pasadena/So Ca) if housing wasn’t so darn expensive. I like the idea of the subway system close to cultural venues, and to go shopping. I have traffic burnout.
No one moved up. Your house was your house.
That’s how it was in my neighborhood too (in the 80s). Very few people moved out of our neighborhood in a middle-class suburb of chicago.
They built nicer houses around us as they plowed under corn fields, but everyone seemed to stay (and most appear to still be there, though my parents moved away - downsized).
“When did this whole “move up” thing get started.”
I recall it as far back as the 60’s. I remember my parents would talk about friends who “moved up”. I do believe that it was a lot less common though, and that maybe you’d do it once or twice in your life. The whole idea of swapping houses every 2-3 years was unheard of back then.
” It was just about as close to a scandal as you could get without the police being involved.” Polly this made me laugh out loud very hard.
And the “just about” was quite on purpose. A junior high history and math teacher divorced their respective spouses and married each other. That was the biggest scandal in town for a few years. But the adults didn’t talk about it in front of us. The idea that two teachers had had an affair was too much for our sensitive little ears to hear. In case you couldn’t guess, it was a very boring town.
I had both of them in 8th grade. They were both awsome. And she wasn’t the first woman I’d ever met who used Ms. as a title, but she was the first married woman I’d ever met who did.
To whom are the move-up buyers selling?
She’s hired: 97-year-old Mary is back on the job
Mary Poncin, 97, has what most people want: not only does she have longevity, she has a job. You can now find Poncin greeting visitors and patients at the main entrance of Kent Hospital every weekday
Her work ethic carried her from job to job, up until her most recent position as a demonstrator at Sam’s Club in Warwick. Poncin worked at Sam’s Club for 17 years, but was laid off in January of 2010. Since then she has been on the hunt for a job, refusing, even at 97 years young, to retire.
http://www.warwickonline.com/view/full_story_news/13459495/article-She-s-hired–97-year-old-Mary-is-back-on-the-job?instance=home_news_2nd_left
Hard Rain
Great story, thank you. My granny lived to be 104. She didn’t like her DIL much (my Mother), and said it was to spite her. LOL
“Buy land, they’re not making it anymore”.
~ Mark Twain
Home Truths
To keep itself politically bullet-proof, Fannie Mae paid competing lobbyists to sit on the sidelines.
By JAMES FREEMAN
‘The American people realize they’ve been robbed. They’re just not sure by whom,” write Gretchen Morgenson and Joshua Rosner in “Reckless Endangerment.” But Americans who read this outstanding history of the financial crisis will know, by the end, exactly who created the meltdown of 2008 and how they did it. This is a story, the authors say, “of what happens when Washington decides, in its infinite wisdom, that every living, breathing citizen should own a home.”
At the center of the drama is Fannie Mae, a private company that used its special government backing to dominate the mortgage market and become the nation’s second-largest debt issuer, after the U.S. Treasury itself. Encouraged by politicians to expand home lending—not least to minorities and to households with few assets—the company ignored reasonable standards of underwriting and piled up fugitive profits almost as fast as it increased risk to taxpayers.
The disaster is now measured in the hundreds of billions of dollars. As for the borrowers who were supposedly to benefit from Fannie’s mortgage-industrial complex, Ms. Morgenson and Mr. Rosner write that home ownership “put them squarely on the road to personal and financial ruin.”
The disaster would not have been possible, the authors make clear, without the early efforts of James Johnson, Fannie Mae’s chief executive in the 1990s and one of the Beltway’s most connected figures—at one time or other the chairman of the Brookings Institution and the Kennedy Center for the Performing Arts as well as a member of Goldman Sachs’s board of directors.
As an assistant to Vice President Walter Mondale, Mr. Johnson had little background in financial markets. When he was chosen to head up Fannie Mae, in 1991, he quickly grasped that the key to Fannie’s success, and to his own astronomical bonuses, was persuading Congress to maintain Fannie’s implicit government backing while preventing any bank-style regulation to interfere with the company’s operation.
That Fannie and its cousin, Freddie Mac, had been created by the government to provide a secondary market for mortgages allowed them to borrow more cheaply than potential competitors. Investors around the world assumed—correctly, as it turned out—that the U.S. government would bail them out in a crisis and therefore viewed investing in Fannie and Freddie’s debt as almost as safe as buying Treasurys.
Mr. Johnson’s state-of-the-art lobbying machine spread the fiction that Fannie’s savings—the result of its lower borrowing costs—were routinely passed on to home borrowers whose loans it was buying. But a 1995 Congressional Budget Office analysis showed that Fannie and Freddie were keeping more than $2 billion of this combined annual subsidy for themselves.
Mr. Johnson never knocked down that analysis, but it didn’t matter. Congress never came close to yanking the toxic twins’ special privileges. Not even a scandal in the mid-2000s over years-long accounting irregularities could persuade lawmakers to put limits on the amount of taxpayer risk that the companies were allowed to create. Even today, Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner provides Fannie and Freddie with unlimited taxpayer support.
…
The proposed requirement that all homeowners be living, breathing citizens is a violation of the civil rights of the dead and of noncitizens.
Even today, Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner provides Fannie and Freddie with unlimited taxpayer support.
Turbo Tax Timmy has no such power.
U.S. Move to Cover Fannie, Freddie Losses Stirs Controversy
WSJ
Dec 28, 2009
By JAMES R. HAGERTY and JESSICA HOLZER
The Obama administration’s decision to cover an unlimited amount of losses at the mortgage-finance giants Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac over the next three years stirred controversy over the holiday.
The Treasury announced Thursday it was removing the caps that limited the amount of available capital to the companies to $200 billion each.
Summer job bummer: Teen unemployment 24 percent
Nationwide unemployment is around 9 percent right now, but one in four 16- to 19-year-olds can’t find work (CBS News)
The latest numbers show the unemployment rate stands at 9.1 percent, with the pace of job growth slowing. When it comes to new jobs, 70 percent of those are coming from small businesses, but many of them are struggling just to hang on.
Small businesses are often responsible for filling the summer job needs of America’s teenagers. CBS News correspondent Bill Whitaker reports that many 16- to 19-year-olds are finding the going rough when it comes to finding work once school is out.
Nearly 14 million Americans are looking for work
The Labor Department says the unemployment rate for those aged 16 to 19 last month was more than 24 percent. Compare that to May of 2000, when the rate was less than 13 percent.
Looking for summer employment has become a full-time job for 19-year-old Ana Galindo.
“I’m worried all the time. I’m worried because I have bills to pay,” Galindo says.
She has filled out countless applications, but so far, the answer’s been the same.
“At the moment we’re not hiring, but we’re just taking applications. We’ll give you a call,” prospective employers say.
Yet the phone never rings. College sophomore John Reed-Torres has been job hunting since last November. He says he’s often competing with older workers and college grads for entry-level positions.
“People with Masters (degrees) trying to work at McDonald’s. They’re going to get hired before I do,” Reed-Torres says.
“one in four 16- to 19-year-olds can’t find work -Teen UE 24% ”
Criminal Invaders don’t go back to school.
I shop at Sprouts & Henry’s Market (same firm-hdqtrs AZ)
They E-Verify and lots of college kids work there.
As a teen I took care of several neighbors gardening chores, which gave be a decent allowance outside of trying to talk Mom out of the money (no point even asking dad…).
These jobs are no longer available to teens due… You know jobs Americans wont do…
These jobs are no longer available to teens due… You know jobs Americans wont do… ??
From my perspective its due to potential liability…
Hasn’t it been this way for years now?
There were engineers driving taxi cabs in the 1970s.
I have a friend who worked in the space program until the post Apollo layoffs kicked in. He told me the same thing, engineers working at McDonalds, etc. Plus he told me that they weren’t that well paid back then. He tried to buy a house near Cocoa Beach in the 60’s and was turned down for the mortgage. The loan officer at the bank told him to get at job at a grocery store, then they could talk (He was an EE).
Thank god teenagers will just sit at home and remain calm since they have nothing better to do.
Oh wait…
Get ready for it, folks:
THERE HAS NEVER BEEN A BETTER TIME TO BUY (or so the Wall Street Journal writers tell me).
But wait a minute; if the number of distressed home sales are not expected to fall until 2013, and unemployment rates are likely to remain high while home sales remain dismal in the interim, then shouldn’t we expect lower prices to come by 2013? That is, wouldn’t it be wiser to sit on your hands and save up a down payment to buy at a lower price in two years from now, rather than catching yourself a falling knife?
That would make 2013 the time to buy, not 2011.
Just sayin’…
WEEKEND INVESTOR
JUNE 4, 2011
Why It’s Time To Buy
The Clouds Haven’t Quite Parted, But the Long-Term Case for Home Ownership Is Looking Stronger
By RUTH SIMON and JESSICA SILVER-GREENBERG
Back in June 2006, when the housing market peaked, the prospect of a five-year national housing bust seemed unimaginable to most people. And yet here we are, with the latest Standard & Poor’s Case-Shiller index showing that prices hit new bear-market lows, falling back to 2002 levels nationally and to 1990s levels in some battered regions.
Despite all the gloom, however, there are growing indications that it is a good time to buy. Mortgage rates, which fell to 4.55% for the week ending June 2, according to Freddie Mac, are near 50-year lows. Homes have become more affordable than they have been in years: According to Moody’s Analytics, the ratio of home prices to income is now 20.9% lower than the 15-year average through 2010, and 12.5% lower than the 1989-2004 average. A historic glut of homes, meanwhile, has created a buyer’s market: There were about 15 million vacant homes in the U.S. last year, according to John Burns Real Estate ConsultingInc.—some 3.1 million more than normal.
Such conditions might not last long. Moody’s Analytics predicts that the number of distressed sales will begin to fall in 2013, and that prices will begin to edge upward then. Home building is at a virtual standstill, so the supply overhang isn’t likely to get much worse. Meanwhile, demographic indicators such as “household formation”—the number of new households each year—are on the rise, and promise to take a bite out of the glut in coming years.
The upshot: “While we might not see rapid growth in the next couple of years, there are a tremendous number of positive signs that could lead to a rebound,” says Anthony Sanders, a real-estate finance professor at George Mason University.
…
Mortgage rates, which fell to 4.55% for the week ending June 2 ??
Thats Highway robbery….Why can’t I borrow at 1% like Bank of America ??
“Home building is at a virtual standtill, so the supply overhang isn’t likely to get much worse.”
Except there’s that pesky (and growing) shadow inventory thingy.
“Meanwhile demographic indicators such as ‘household formation’ - the number of new households each year - are on the rise, and promise to take a bite out of the glut in coming years.”
Isn’t there a couple of trends, now active, that are countering this?
Young people can’t find jobs so:
1. They are putting off getting married and having kids.
2. They are moving back in with mom and dad.
1 + 2 = reduced household formations, not increased household formations.
Note that this article (which appeared in this morning’s SD Union-Tribune) actually came out one day before the Labor Department’s unemployment rate figure showed an increase for last month.
More job seekers give up, reducing unemployment
By PAUL WISEMAN, AP Economics Writer – Thu Jun 2, 12:56 pm ET
WASHINGTON – Where did all the workers go?
The labor force — those who have a job or are looking for one — is getting smaller, even though the economy is growing and steadily adding jobs. That trend defies the rules of a normal economic recovery.
Nobody is sure why it’s happening. Economists think some of the missing workers have retired, have entered college or are getting by on government disability checks. Others have probably just given up looking for work.
“A small work force means millions of discouraged workers, lower output in the future and a weak recovery,” says Rep. Kevin Brady of Texas, the ranking Republican on the Congress’ Joint Economic Committee. “Those are unhealthy signs.”
By the government’s definition, if you quit looking, you’re no longer counted as unemployed. And you’re no longer part of the labor force.
Since November, the number of Americans counted as employed has grown by 765,000, to just shy of 139 million. The nation has been creating jobs every month as the economy recovers. The economy added 244,000 jobs in April.
But the number of Americans counted as unemployed has shrunk by much more — almost 1.3 million — during this time. That means the labor force has dropped by 529,000 workers.
…
“The labor force — those who have a job or are looking for one — is getting smaller, even though the economy is growing and steadily adding jobs.”
What kind of jobs is the economy adding? Let me guess: crappy, P/T under $10/hr jobs. Which means that you need more than one to survive. So maybe current workers are picking up those jobs and thus the labor force isn’t growing.
And its possible these jobs only exist in some computer’s “birth/death” simulation model. After all, didn’t we just hear that teens can’t find jobs?
McDonalds just hired a bunch of people. In fact I was reading that hire accounted for most of last months private sector hiring “spree”
Who’s eating this crap, anyway?
That is it as well, Colorado. when you need 2 part time jobs just to survive, that’s one more person who can’t get a job.
You are correct GH. 50,000 out of (I think they revised and said…) 96,000 “created.”
Too bad this isn’t Europe where the starting pay at Mickey D’s is $15 hr.
So, I should soon be able drop into any McDonalds restaurant and find the place over run with employees?
Are these thousands of extra employees going to somehow lift the bottom line?
I always thought it was the number of customers that lifted the bottom line, not the number of employees. Are the increased number of employees supposed to somehow magically increase the number of customers?
A better measure - a more accurate measure, if accuracy is what one wants (and I am not convinced it is) - would be the number of employee-hours worked, not the number of employees.
Given a full-time work force I could magically double the number of employees I have working for me by converting all my full-time employees into part-time employees. The hours worked would remain the same but my expenses would drop because part-time workers are not entitled to all the bennies that a full-time workers are entitled to (at least this is how I understand it).
So by converting my full-time workers to part-time workers:
1. I get to become a hero because I am offering jobs to the unemployed, and
2. I get to save a bunch of money in employment expenses.
It is all good.
Story time:
I was once, a long time ago, driving across the desert on a two-lane road and had to stop for gas in the middle of nowhere. There were two gas stations, one on each side of the highway. The kid that filled by tank told me that he worked, part-time, back-and-forth, at both gas stations.
So I asked him: “How does your boss feel about you working for the competition?”
“Oh, my boss owns both of the gas stations.”
So there it was. The kid worked two part-time jobs, for franchises of two seperate companies, both of which are owned by the same guy. Payroll-wise the boss made out like a bandit, and the kid didn’t have a clue.
I have no idea what you’re trying to say, combo.
Mickey D’s would NOT be hiring them if they didn’t need them.
As for the conversion of full -time to part-time, this has already been done by many large corporations. When I worked for HP, I was contract at 38 hr. No bennies. EEOC regs of a part-timer. Same with the rest of the labor laws.
We’re WAY past that point.
“I have no idea what you are trying to say, combo.”
“Mickey D’s would not be hiring them if they didn’t need them.”
Which is my point. I don’t think they are hiring them. Not net hiring, at least. I think they are playing games with numbers.
These Mcdonalds restaurants are structured in such a way to have a certain number of employees to service a certain number of customers. To increase the number of employees they would have to either increase the number of restaurants or increase the hours of which they are open. I very much doubt they are doing either.
Plus, as I understand it, these restaurants are independently owned. Each owner decides how many employees he needs, not the main office. But it is the main office - the headquarters - that made the announcements of the numbers of new hires and not the restaurants.
Lol. I just did a search in google and on April 4 there was a headline that said McDonald’s was going to hire 50,000 people in one day.
Hire fifty-thousand people. In one day.
Does anyone here really believe that in one day the business of McDonalds will explode to the point where they will need fifty-thousand additional employees?
Truly, a media event.
Ah, I see what you’re saying and you have a good point. Could very well be the case. I wouldn’t put it past them.
I still believe that A good chunk of those workers were older, who COULD have retired a few years ago but stayed on for benefits or because they had nothing else to do. Get laid off, suck off unemployment while pretending to look for a job, then when it ended they just walk away. Happy retirement!
Laying off anyone over 65 is a very tricky proposition.
Companies prefer to lay off in the 40-60 range.
why is that, skroodle? I hope you’re right.
No. A good chunk stayed because they HAD too.
This sort of fraudulent activity would be more difficult were it not for the NAR monopoly’s lock on the real estate market.
Nation’s Housing
Quick profits, a ’short’ way to fraud
By Kenneth R. Harney
WASHINGTON — Are banks and distressed home sellers getting rooked on a massive scale in the booming short-sale arena — leaving hundreds of millions of dollars on the table for white-collar criminals?
A comprehensive new study estimates they will lose more than $375 million this year alone when they sell undervalued houses to tag teams consisting of real-estate agents and investors. Worse yet, the trend appears to be growing at the rate of 25 percent a year.
CoreLogic, a large real-estate and mortgage-data research firm headquartered in Santa Ana, Calif., studied 450,000 short-sale transactions across the country during the past two years, and offered these real-life examples of how lenders are losing big bucks:
• A house in Kings Beach, Calif., was purchased near the height of the boom in 2005 for $530,000. On Oct. 28, 2009, it was sold in a short sale — an arrangement in which the lender allows the delinquent owner to avoid foreclosure by selling to a third party — for $247,500 to an investment group. Later that same day, the investors resold the house to a non-investor purchaser for $375,000. This produced a quick $127,500 profit — a 52 percent gain for the investment group in a matter of hours.
…
“• A house in Kings Beach, Calif., was purchased near the height of the boom in 2005 for $530,000. On Oct. 28, 2009, it was sold in a short sale — an arrangement in which the lender allows the delinquent owner to avoid foreclosure by selling to a third party — for $247,500 to an investment group. Later that same day, the investors resold the house to a non-investor purchaser for $375,000. This produced a quick $127,500 profit — a 52 percent gain for the investment group in a matter of hours.”
Interesting. Fraud, not uprising. Where oh where did the rest of this thread go???
not surprising
SaladSD:
I looked up the article about E.coli getting into lettuce and spinach through the roots. It looks like they’re saying it can get in through tears and stuff in the roots. I don’t know if the same thing would happen in a field or not, since this was done in a lab where very high concentrations of E.coli were being introduced. Kinda weird, since you’d think we’d all be getting E.coli all the time if this were the case.
Anyway, time to start eating lettuce soup?
Actually, while I was reading through the various references, I got the feeling these people were trying to sell me on the idea of only buying nonorganic, hydroponic veggies. They kept implicating that “soil is dirty”, and “organic fertilizer is poop”. It kinda made it seem like the science was being used as an advertisement in this case. Then I read this quote from a person not involved with the original research:
In other words, this has never been observed in nature. Makes you wonder who paid for that research, eh?
Lol. Since E.coli comes from natural fertilizers and not from chemical fertilizers a good case could be made that vegetables grown using chemical fertilizers are safer - and thus better for you - than organic vegetables.
That’s what they’re trying to say. I would argue that dirt is less than harmful than whateverthehell else they might decide to use.
Does a plant really care where it gets its nutrients? Does the human body really care?
Aren’t vitamin suppliments really just chemicals? Does the human body care whether it gets its doses of calcium from a tablet or from some other, more natural source?
Personally, I don’t think so.
Your body knows when it ingests something that it was never meant to ingest. Remember when the Chinese were selling us plants that had been fertilized with a type of plastic? Caused kidney failure. I’m just saying that I know what dirt is. It probably won’t kill me. On the other hand, I do NOT know what else is being fed to/sprayed on a crop that might kill me after all.
Yesterday, I went to my local Mediterranean deli and bought some flat bread. This bread was made in Canada, which is neither Meditarranean nor Richmond. The same Canada that acted as the middleman for China’s plastic-fed vegetable protein. You have to admit it’s a little scary these days.
Remember the exploding melons in China last month? The farmers were applying too much growth hormone. Our food supplies are very contaminated with these chemicals and there is nothing natural about them. I reckon growth hormones which are fed to animals and make their way into our food supplies are probably in good part responsible for more and more overweight people…
Yeah, and they think it might have something to do with the fact that the average American girl is now developing breasts and getting her period at an earlier age. That does not sound healthy to me. Let people AND food grow at their own rate, already.
E. Coli is also present in contaminated water.
If the poo is properly composted, then it will not contain e coli. If, however, raw poo is used as fertilizer, then there will be e coli, and other contaminants.
This is why in classical Chinese cooking, there are no raw vegetable dishes at all- the Chinese long used (perhaps still do?) uncomposted human and animal sewage as fertilizer.
Combo- Many studies have shown multivitamins to have little or no effectiveness. Here’s a report on one:
NYTimes
“In a study of 161,808 women who were part of the government-funded Women’s Health Initiative research effort, doctors from 40 centers around the country collected data on multivitamin use. While research shows that people who eat nutrient-rich diets filled with fruits and vegetables have lower rates of heart disease and cancer, it hasn’t been clear whether taking a daily supplement results in a similar benefit.
“After following the women for about eight years, they looked at rates of various cancers and heart problems among the 42 percent of women who were regular multivitamin users, and compared them to those who didn’t take vitamins. The researchers found no evidence of any benefit from multivitamin use in any of 10 categories studied, including no differences in the rate of breast or colon cancer, heart attack, stroke, blood clots or mortality. The findings were published in the current issue of the Archives of Internal Medicine.”
“Kinda weird, since you’d think we’d all be getting E.coli all the time if this were the case.”
And since we aren’t getting E. coli all the time then I’d say such conclusions are questionable.
Questions:
1. How many people in this country eat fresh vegetables on a regular basis?
2. How many of these people get sick from eating these fresh vegetables?
If the numbers are high for number 2 as compared to number 1 then this suggests there is something wrong with the fresh vegetables. If the numbers are low for number 2 as compared to number 1 then this suggests there is some other factor involved.
I’m thinking it should be fine to just wash your veggies before you eat them. As a matter of fact, if I buy organic, I usually leave them unwashed unless they’re downright gritty. I think it helps develop my immune system. We used to say in preschool “God made dirt, so dirt won’t hurt” (right before eating one of those deLICious preschool mud pies).
I do wash nonorganic veggies, though. You never know what chemicals or unnatural stuff is on there.
You actually ate the mud pies? That explains a few things…
No matter what the source, ALWAYS wash your produce. (I used to work in produce)
Never buy the pre-cut produce. (I also used to work in produce).
My former neighbor is a Pharmacist and use to wash his produce in baking soda and vinegar. He said many of the commercial produce washes are based on it. I think there was a third ingredient. It’s been a while.
An old friend who was in the military said to just put a capful or so of bleach in a gallon of water to sanitize produce.
I lived in the Middle East and chlorine bleach was what we used to soak vegetables and fruit in.
“chlorine bleach was what we used to soak vegetables and fruit in.”
I assume not straight chlorine bleach, although that would certainly get rid of any germs.
I know, this does seem somewhat nebulous. What I recalled from the Salinas outbreak was there was some issue with adjacent pig or cow lots with hugh earthen cess pools of urine and poop leaching into the groundwater. Perhaps the spinach fields were getting sprayed with e.coli from irrigation water.
New Al Qaeda Video: American Muslims Should Buy Guns, Start Shooting People (ABC News)
In a new video message released on the internet Friday, American-born al Qaeda spokesman Adam Gadahn calls on Muslims living in America to carry out deadly one-man terrorist acts using fully automatic weapons purchased at gun shows, and to target major institutions and public figures.
“What are you waiting for?” asks Gadahn in English, and then adds that jihadis shouldn’t worry about getting caught, since so many have been released. “Over these past few years, I’ve seen the release of many, many Mujahideen whom I had never even dreamed would regain their freedom.”
The two-part, two hour video appeared on jihadi websites Friday with images of jihadi leaders as well as snapshots of alleged underwear bomber Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab and accused Fort Hood shooter Major Nidal Hasan. Both Hasan and Abdulmutallab are charged with carrying out attacks inside the U.S.
Called “Do Not Rely on Others, Take the Task Upon Yourself” and produced by al Qaeda’s media arm, as Sahab, the tape mixes Gadahn’s new message with clips from old videos of Osama bin Laden, Ayman al-Zawahiri and other al Qaeda leaders praising one-man attacks. They call on jihadis in the West to carry out lone wolf operations.
“What are you waiting for?” asks Gadahn in English
Maybe they just want to hang on to their jobs, pay the mortgage and get their kids through college, like other people?
Exaclty. Muslims who moved to America probably don’t actually hate America, although they may very well hate the nonstop violence and hatred experienced back home.
“American Muslims Should Buy Guns, Start Shooting People.”
Anyone remember the threat of Sleeper Cells from a few years ago?
Fear.
If the MSM was presented these stories that riles up the masses then they would have to invent them.
was = wasn’t
The financial avarice of the global banking system – U.S. banks insolvent to the tune of $3 trillion. FDIC pretends to have funds to support over $7 trillion in banking deposits.
Posted by mybudget360 in bailout, banks, corporate power, crooks, economy, gambling, government, income, wall street, world markets
Part of the big delusion in our banking system is the reality that debt has become a large source of money flowing through the economy. This is why housing made the perfect vessel for Wall Street and banking speculation. Banks create money by issuing loans and there is nothing larger to loan on than a home. Think about the fact that banks were giving out $500,000 for trashy run down homes overrun with rats and this was something that they were booking on their balance sheet as an asset. The FDIC and other regulators simply sat back and watched as the wolves ate the financial chickens at the roost. Many Americans think that banks actually have the money in a vault when they make a loan.
They do not. Just like Houdini the illusion is what is powerful. In fact, the FDIC has an insurance fund that is close to negative and this institution is supposed to back up over $7 trillion in saving deposits. How is that even possible? Only when a world is blindly accepting to a banking system and believe the media jargon that banking is too complicated for them to understand. This is what the central and investment banks want because it makes the theft easier.
http://www.mybudget360.com/financial-avarice-of-the-global-banking-system-banks-insolvent-to-the-tune-of-3-trillion-fdic/
ITEM: Federal authorities have seized bottles and drums of elderberry juice concentrate from a Kansas winery, contending that the company’s claims of its benefits for treating various diseases make the product a drug.
…”Products with unapproved disease claims are dangerous because they may cause consumers to delay or avoid legitimate treatments, Dara Corrigan, the FDA’s associate commissioner for regulatory affairs, said in a news release. “The FDA is committed to protecting consumers from unapproved products on the market.” Reported by Karen DeCoster
← Is red wine soon to be classified as a drug?
Probably. After all, media for years have reported the health benefits of small daily doses of red wine. It is said to be beneficial to one’s arteries and heart and many articles aimed at old people advise a daily glass of red wine.
If the elderberry wine makers were making outrageous claims for their product…cures dropsy, stops cancer, enhances sex life and so on…a scolding from food and drink regulators is surely in order. But the drugstore shelves are loaded with pills, balms, and potions approved by the FDA, despite their claims to curative powers.
Visit a health food store and read the labels on their products. Everything from tea that will make you “regular” to capsules that will put your liver and bladder in order.
Elderberry wine seems to fit right in!
The FDA is as crooked, corrupt and inept as the rest of them.
But then, years of budget cuts will do that.
Then it is simple!
We must have more money, more money, more money ,more money,…Wait! We are $14.4 TRILLION in debt and climbing at a precipitous rate. I know, Tax the Rich! Tax the Rich! Tax the Rich! It is their fault we can’t safely drink elderberry wine. Oh, the inhumanity!
INTERVIEW-W.Bank to suggest CO2 levy on jet, shipping fuel
Sun Jun 5, 2011
BONN, Germany, June 5 (Reuters) - The World Bank will suggest a global levy on jet and shipping fuel in recommendations to G20 governments later this year on raising climate finance, a senior official said on Sunday.
Developed countries have already written off chances of agreement on a new binding deal at a U.N. conference in Durban this year, placing a new focus on piecemeal efforts including fund-raising.
Binding targets under the Kyoto Protocol cap the greenhouse gas emissions of nearly 40 industrialised countries but expire in 2012 and now look unlikely to be extended in time.
The World Bank is focusing on a levy on shipping and jet fuels in a report to G20 finance minister in October, among other efforts to keep climate action on track.
“We are looking at carbon emissions-based sources … including bunker (shipping) fuels and aviation fuels, that would be internationally coordinated albeit nationally collected,” said Andrew Steer, World Bank special envoy for climate change.
The Bank estimates the extra cost to help the developing world prepare for more droughts, floods and rising seas at $100 billion annually. Various sources put the extra cost of cutting carbon emissions at $200 billion or more annually.
Steer said he was disappointed by the pace of a U.N. climate process which launched talks in 2007 to find a Kyoto successor.
“I’ve got to say the situation is very urgent and sometimes that sense of urgency is not evident in the negotiations.”
This report is from Fox News so it’s probably not in any way correct.
E. Coli Outbreak Likely Caused by Bean Sprouts. ~ Fox News
HAMBURG, Germany — Health authorities say locally grown bean sprouts in northern Germany have been identified as the likely cause of an outbreak of E. coli that has killed at least 22 people and sickened hundreds in Europe.
Lower Saxony agriculture ministry spokesman Gert Hahne told The Associated Press his state is sending an alert warning people to stop eating the sprouts, which are often used in mixed salads.
Hahne said official test results have not yet conclusively shown that the Lower Saxony-grown sprouts are to blame but “all indications speak to them being” the cause.
He says many restaurants where people ate before becoming ill had recently taken delivery of the sprouts. However, he said there will not likely be any immediate lifting of the warning against eating tomatoes, cucumbers or lettuce.
Hospitals in northern Germany are being overwhelmed as they struggle to provide enough beds and medical care for patients stricken by an outbreak of E. coli, the German health minister admitted Sunday.
“The situation in the hospitals is intense,” minister Daniel Bahr told the Bild am Sonntag newspaper, adding that clinics outside of Hamburg and northern Germany — the epicenter of the E.coli outbreak — should start taking in ill persons from the north.
“He says many restaurants where people ate before becoming ill had recently taken delivery of the sprouts.”
And most likely the restaurant employees did not wash the sprouts before delivering them to their customers for consumption.
Are there many reports of people getting sick from preparing and eating these sprouts at home? It’s a good bet that there are not. That’s because the same people who are going to EAT the food are going to be a bit more careful in preparing the food that the people who are NOT GOING TO EAT the food. Funny how that is.
If that is the case then the problem is not with the sprouts, the problem is with the preparation of the sprouts.
That is one problem. Another problem is that the E.coli is resistant to antibiotics, which means the sick people will have to go through the illness, rather than taking a convenient little pill or getting a convenient little shot.
“This report is from Fox News so it’s probably not in any way correct.”
If you feel that way, why the heck do you post it? Does this mean you trust the others?
If you feel that way, why the heck do you post it?
I assume he/she’s being sarcastic, as folks here want to discount anything from Fox News, regardless of the actual content.
Good point. I missed that.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20110605/ts_afp/greecespaineconomypoliticsprotestinternet_20110605183938
50,000 Greeks are protesting in Athens, shouting “thieves, thieves” against their country’s political class. And who, pray tell, voted such thieves into office and turned a blind eye to their corruption and venality for so many decades?
50,000 Greeks are protesting in Athens, shouting “thieves, thieves” against their country’s political class. And who, pray tell, voted such thieves into office and turned a blind eye to their corruption and venality for so many decades?
But just because they weren’t not wrong before doesn’t make them not right now.
Why do people always blame the victims of psychopaths… and then wonder why the world is so screwed up?
The people of Greece, like their US counterparts, kept this corrupt political establishment in power for decades. Now that the bill comes due they act like they are innocent victims. Not so much. They went along with the swindle every step of the way, just as US voters have perpetuated our own kleptocracy with their votes for the Wall Street-Republicrat status quo.
How do you know those protesters didn’t vote for ‘third party’ candidates through the years?
Democratic activists urged to be aggressive at Rep. Allen West town hall meetings
By George Bennett Palm Beach Post Staff Writer
Posted: 1:53 p.m. Sunday, June 5, 2011
Palm Beach County Democratic activists got some coaching last week on getting loud and getting ejected when U.S. Rep. Allen West, R-Plantation, holds another town hall meeting Thursday in Boca Raton.
“Make your voice heard. Get angry. Get upset - because you are .. .Attend every single town hall and get loud. That’s the only way the media’s going to pick us up,” Craig Borkon of the liberal group Organize Now told the county Democratic Executive Committee.
When one of the roughly 100 partisans mentioned getting tossed out, Borkon said: “Let them throw you out. Finally maybe the media will put something in the paper saying he’s throwing everybody out that disagrees with him.”
http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/state/democratic-activists-urged-to-be-aggressive-at-rep-1520192.html - -
The loss of civility in our political process is the hallmark of a rabble that may no longer be fit for democracy.
Like in the British or Japanese parliaments?
Popular police cars Crown Victorias prone to explode, tied to deaths
By Pat Beall Palm Beach Post Staff Writer
Posted: 11:06 a.m. Sunday, June 5, 2011
The last minutes of trooper Patrick Ambroise’s short life were spent in a Crown Victoria Police Interceptor - a car praised for its strength, hailed for its durability and known to explode in high-speed rear-end crashes .
By one estimate, fiery Ford Crown Victoria crashes have claimed more lives than the notorious Ford Pinto, subject of a nationwide recall in 1978. “Basically, the Crown Vic is a big Pinto,” said Clarence Ditlow, executive director of the Center for Auto Safety, a Washington-based advocacy group.
Ambroise, who died last year, is the latest of at least 30 law enforcement officers since 1983 who fell victim to fiery Crown Victoria crashes. Five were in Florida. Another 20 escaped patrol cars that crashed and caught fire.
http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/popular-police-cars-crown-victorias-prone-to-explode-1520076.html?cxtype=rss_news - -
“They blowed up reel guud!”
Lawyer BS.
Ring ding dingaling
Slate
Last week the the former Alaska governor and GOP vice-presidential nominee drowned out Mitt Romney’s announcement of a presidential run with coverage of her creative take on Paul Revere’s midnight ride. She told a crowd in Boston that the revolutionary “warned the British that they weren’t going to be taking away our arms, uh, by ringin’ those bells.”
she did say that and its true
well, you’re half right. she did say that.
On the eighteenth of April, in Seventy-five;
Hardly a man is now alive
Who remembers that famous day and year.
He said to his friend, “If the British march
By land or sea from the town to-night,
Hang a lantern aloft in the belfry arch
Of the North Church tower as a signal light,–
One if by land, and two if by sea;
And I on the opposite shore will be,
Ready to ride and spread the alarm
Through every Middlesex village and farm,
For the country folk to be up and to arm, you betcha!
To stop those redcoats from taking our rights and freedoms
And other great American stuff, under god!”
Defending herself Sunday on Fox, which pays her as a contributor, Palin said her version was correct and alluded to a lesser known part of the story, when Revere was captured by three British soldiers late that night and told them 500 militiamen were ready for battle.
“Part of his ride was to warn the British that ‘We’re already there.’ That, ‘Hey, you’re not going to succeed. You’re not going to take American arms. You are not going to beat our own well-armed persons, individual, private militia that we have,’ ” Palin said. “He did warn the British.”
Realtors Are Liars
Good show, old chap. Thought you might miss a day.
Never Brother Alpha. My venom for the Housing Crime Syndicate will spare no quarter.
How many gobzillion dollars did John Paulson make again off Gollumn’s toxic mortgage stew?
BUSINESS
JUNE 6, 2011
Goldman Plans to Fight Report on Mortgage Bets
Goldman Sachs Group Inc. plans to accuse the U.S. Senate Permanent Subcommittee on Investigations of drastically overstating Goldman’s bets against the housing market in 2007, according to people familiar with the situation, in an attempt to counter a report from that subcommittee that is fueling investigations and suspicion of the securities firm.
The subcommittee’s 639-page report, released in April, denounced Goldman as an unusually strong example of wrongdoing by financial firms during the crisis. According to the report, Goldman systematically sought to profit from a “big short” against the housing market and betrayed clients by putting the firm’s own interests ahead of theirs. Goldman initially said it disagreed “with many of the conclusions of the report.”
Goldman is now considering releasing documents about its mortgage bets that are aimed at showing what the securities firm’s officials claim is sloppy math and incomplete analysis by the subcommittee as the panel sifted through tens of millions of documents turned over by Goldman.
The information might be released soon on Goldman’s website, though a decision hasn’t been made yet. Even if the documents aren’t made public, they could be used by Goldman to defend itself in ongoing investigations that appear to be linked to the Senate subcommittee’s report.
A subcommittee spokeswoman declined to comment.
…