Bits Bucket for November 2, 2011
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The Housing Bubble
Examining the home price boom and its effect on owners, lenders, regulators, realtors and the economy as a whole.
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Comment by aNYCdj
2011-11-01 19:09:36
That’s the difference muggy it used to NOT happen all the time….it was rare and everyone knew about it…the parents had to come to school and apologize …or else.
———–
No, it did happen all the time. My best friend set another kid’s backpack on fire on a bus and it melted part of the bus seat. Everyone played dumb and there was no consequence. Another guy I knew took a dear, dismembered it, and scattered all the parts all over the school parking lot. I was once interrogated during a multiple smoke bomb incident that I may or may not have been involved with… everyone gets to make mistakes as a child.
Elementary kids are driven by safety, hunger/thirst, and the need to use the restroom. Yes, the girl from yesterday’s story was way out of line, but if she gets yelled at every time she has to use the restroom, and slapped when she asks for food, of course she is going to protect her right to eat. Wouldn’t you?
That’s what’s so scary about the current discipline scene. Did everyone forgot about smoking pot in the woods, fooling around in a car, throwing a few eggs at whatever, skipping class to go to the park on a nice spring day?
Kids will be kids, and they should be. There’s nothing worse than an adult whose never tried a damn thing, much less tested the boundaries of authority.
How can you have any pudding if you don’t at your meat?
“That’s what’s so scary about the current discipline scene. Did everyone forgot about smoking pot in the woods, fooling around in a car, throwing a few eggs at whatever, skipping class to go to the park on a nice spring day?”
I have to remind my wife of this from time to time.
No I didn’t forget. I led in all those subjects. And I have to remind my self righteous friends and coworkers that they did the very same thing.
“I have to remind my wife of this from time to time.”
Standard response: It was Different when we were young!
Yeah….but here’s what they’re writing now:
Teenagers scare the living sh*t out of me.
They could care less as someone will bleed.
So darken your clothes
Or strike a violent pose
Maybe they’ll leave you alone
But not me.
Teenagers
Gerard Way, My Chemical Romance
The band members often claim the best thing that ever happened to them was getting out of their violent town where they grew up in NJ. They’re in their young 30s.
How about this: given what has happened to the country, it is clear you can’t do what we did. Otherwise, who is going to pay for us?
Older generations have high standards for younger generation’s behaviour,and low standards for their future.
college…yes…high school…no.
my father was insistent that school was my job.
Once the Hippies became older, the swung back to be even more conservative than thier parents.
School uniforms would never have happened in the 60’s.
School uniforms would never have happened in the 60’s.
Gee, I wonder what that plaid thing one that I was wearing back then. You know the one where I matched what every other girl in my school was wearing. And don’t forget the bow tie!
one = was
Man, I’ve got to stop doing 3 things at once.
Catholic?
Yes Muggy but those were non violent activities….
Where did you grow up? I was in Fairfield county CT, and the violence aspect was rare…all my years in jr and HS we almost never saw a poilice car on our street of at least 50 houses…that was relegated to the Ghetto Roodner court section 8 homes…yes police were there most every night.
Just a little while longer for a strong arm leader…Rahm Emanuel in 2016?
Or maybe we should bring back the draft…force them to either stay in school or join the military. That should work too.
When unemployment is this high, you get a de facto draft. At least for the poor.
True. But until you draft Middle Class kids the sheeple don’t give a damn about overseas wars. They get a lot more involved and vocal once it’s their kid that might be sent into harm’s way.
That’s right. It’s not even on the radar when it’s someone elses kid getting sent off to be slaughtered. It’s why the draft is necessary. Call it National Defense Service or whatever but for as long as we’re going to bomb 3rd world countries, the playing field needs to be leveled.
And when wars are put on the national credit card for future generations to pay, the sheeple just shrug and consider it to be someone else’s problem.
Former President Theodore Roosevelt begged to fight in World War I but Wilson wouldn’t let him because of his failing health.
Theodore Roosevelt Jr. served in World War I (wounded) and World War II (Medal of Honor)
Kermit Roosevelt served in World War I and World War 2.
Archibald Roosevelt served in World War I (wounded) and World War II (wounded).
Quentin Roosevelt served in World War I (killed in his aircraft over France).
We should reinstate the draft.
And make your draft number the same as where your family stands on the income scale.
After all, the 1%ers have bought and paid for this government. They should be willing to go to Afghanistan to defend what is “theirs”. And none of this “socialist” stuff of providing them with government cheese like Predators, Apaches and M-1 tanks. Make them go down to Cabela’s and buy their own uniforms and machine guns.
If they aren’t, then maybe we don’t need to send anybody else’s kids there, either.
Teddy was always sad that he missed that glorious Civil War.
“But until you draft Middle Class kids the sheeple don’t give a damn about overseas wars.”
That’s kind of my point. We already have a “shadow draft” for the poor through the siphoning of cash from local economies to Greenwich, CT, Big Oil, China, etc., the siphoning of jobs to Chinidia and the siphoning of brain power to the cities. Welcome to the suck.
Mil doesn’t want a lot of them. They’d have to pass tests and stuff.
Well that’s why teaching those people to read, write and speak English is so important, work, study or military…..
Frame it as a worthy goal: we want all minorities to commit crimes at the same rate as white people.
When unemployment is this high, you get a de facto draft. At least for the poor.
There’s a waiting list to get into the Marines. At this point, you can enlist (if they’ll take you) and then wait almost a year before you go to boot camp.
The other services are also getting much pickier about who they’ll sign up.
“other services are also getting much pickier about who they’ll sign up”
I remember reading about how, during the boom time, the Army was being to take the bottom quartile (!) of test takers and I may have been working off that older data set. I’ll bet that it’s getting tougher now. Makes sense.
Just imagine what would happen if we pulled out of any of these places around the globe we currently occupy and “sent the boys home”.
“When unemployment is this high, you get a de facto draft. At least for the poor.”
It’s called ‘Economic Conscription’
I am starting to think the foreclosure defense attorneys don`t want to lose their revenue stream any more than the banks want to lose their`s from servicing the bad loans or the Deadbeats that don`t want to lose their free place to live while the PTB don`t want the massive inventory put on the market to crush prices which kinda leaves me feeling like the Red headed step child. (are you allowed to say that anymore?) Probably not huh. I had better just go ahead and send my apologies out to the League of Red Headed Step Children for making such an insensitive statement.
Foreclosure review begins today by homeowner request
by Kim Miller
Palm Beach Post
Wednesday, November 2, 2011
A massive review of as many as 4 million foreclosures nationwide began Tuesday as mortgage servicers seek out borrowers whose cases contain flaws.
The review could impact thousands of Floridians, who as part of the federally-mandated program may be compensated if a review finds they suffered financial harm because of defects in their case.
Letters began being mailed Tuesday to eligible homeowners who were in some stage of foreclosure in 2009 and 2010 alerting them that they can request the free evaluation. A homeowner hotline has also been established at 888-952-9105.
If a homeowner in an active foreclosure chooses to participate, the foreclosure will be put on hold until the review is complete.
Auditors are looking for problems such as robo-signing, inaccurate fee charges and foreclosures that occurred while a homeowner was working on a loan modification.
“Robo-signing may or may not result in financial injury but certainly is one of the things they will be looking for,” said Bryan Hubbard, a spokesman for the U.S. Office of the Comptroller of the Currency, which announced the launch of the program Tuesday.
While homeowners can obtain the review with no strings attached, it has yet to be determined whether they will have to waive rights, such as the ability to sue the servicer, before they can receive compensation, Hubbard said.
Homeowners must request the review no later than April 30, 2012.
The program is part of a consent agreement reached in April by bank regulators and 14 of the nation’s largest mortgage servicers that included an overhaul of foreclosure practices. It stemmed from last fall’s revelations that deficient foreclosure documents were used to repossess homes. Most of the nation’s major lenders suspended foreclosures as paperwork was reviewed and re-filed as necessary.
Boca Raton-based foreclosure defense attorney Ron Kaniuk said he recommends homeowners request the audit, although he questions whether a review conducted by bank-chosen auditors will favor homeowners.
“I’m skeptical of any program implemented by the banks and servicers to examine their prior errors, omissions and intentional or unintentional criminal acts,” Kaniuk said. “But it does present an opportunity to try and get some relief to homeowners.”
The names of the companies hired to conduct the reviews will be released in the next few weeks, Hubbard said. When asked why not now, he said the comptroller’s office just wasn’t prepared to do so yet.
That sounds fishy to Fort Lauderdale attorney Shari Olefson, who represents banks in foreclosure cases.
“If I really wanted to increase public confidence and create transparency, I would start off by saying who the auditors are,” Olefson said. “I think it’s a good gesture, but everything is just too little, too late.”
The letter going to homeowners is also being kept secret in an attempt to thwart scammers from mimicking the document, Hubbard said.
“We are concerned about fraud and people putting up fake websites,” he said. “Borrowers should understand this is free to them and should avoid anyone trying to charge them.”
Banks, Lawyers and ReaItors WANT Home-Debtors to stay in the house so they can;
-Extend the length of their mortage term putting them much DEEPER in debt
-Keep housing prices grossly inflated.
Banks, Lawyers and reaItors are colluding to bleed them all dry.
-To keep the house in good condition for when the bank does have to sell it.
Why go to the expense to foreclosure and take a 50% hit when you can increase your total profit by refinancing debtors to 50 years?
Won’t work if the squatters are refusing to pay. Lowering the amount won’t make the pay.
Would Fannie/Freddie still buy 50-year toxic waste?
Indentured Slavitude. Grant the false notion of ownership to the debtor while he makes smaller payments(all interest) into perpetuity. Guess who still owns the house?
“Indentured Slavitude”. That’s a new one for me. I like it.
“Debt Serfdom” gets overused some times. Need a little variety!
“-Extend the length of their mortage term putting them much DEEPER in debt
-Keep housing prices grossly inflated.
Banks, Lawyers and reaItors are colluding to bleed them all dry.”
None of these themes seem to be part of what the OCC is doing. They have set up a screwing reviewing that the banks will pay for. It won’t keep anyone in their house. It won’t extend anyone’s mortgage terms. We’ve read many accounts of people working through a loan mod and getting foreclosed at the same time. They may get a check from the bank. If they want their house back, they are on their own to sue.
What’s not to like about that?
I love it if that is actually happening. Do you read Jethro Saturday’s posts about debtors remaining in house years after default?
I don’t see it in today’s bucket. I wouldn’t classify that in itself as a screwing by the bank probably.
One of the many I know who still lives in “his” house yet hasn`t made a payment in years. Just a LP from 11/14/2008 no JUD on the house. Bought in Feb-2006 for $313,000 with $1k down and took out $78,800.00 on 10/10/2006 (I don`t know how much of it he got) while telling people what an idiot I was for selling my place in 2005 and renting. As most of these victims told me or people I worked with or my kids…… He is making a big mistake realestate only goes, oh forget it.
PS
I have not posted the 5 JUD that have shown up in the last couple of years for car/truck loans and credit cards
Sale/Date
Feb-2006 20008/1076 $313,000 WARRANTY DEED PTAK SCOTT T
Type: MTG
Date/Time: 3/6/2006 08:16:53
CFN: 20060129830
Book Type: O
Book/Page: 20008/1077
Pages: 17
Consideration: $250,400.00
Party 1: PTAK SCOTT T
PTAK LISE M
Party 2: MORTGAGE ELECTRONIC REGISTRATION SYSTEMS INC
WACHOVIA MORTGAGE CORPORATION
Legal: LA MANCHA BN L11 BL
Type: MTG
Date/Time: 3/6/2006 08:16:53
CFN: 20060129831
Book Type: O
Book/Page: 20008/1094
Pages: 6
Consideration: $62,000.00
Party 1: PTAK SCOTT T
PTAK LISE
Party 2: CITIBANK FEDERAL SAVINGS BANK
MORTGAGE ELECTRONIC REGISTRATION SYSTEMS INC
Legal: LA MANCHA BN L11 BL
Type: MTG
Date/Time: 10/10/2006 08:57:05
CFN: 20060571782
Book Type: O
Book/Page: 20939/542
Pages: 7
Consideration: $78,800.00
Party 1: PTAK SCOTT T
PTAK LISE
Party 2: CITIBANK FEDERAL SAVINGS BANK
Legal: LA MANCHA BN L11 BL
Type: LP
Date/Time: 11/14/2008 13:46:50
CFN: 20080413832
Book Type: O
Book/Page: 22953/1738
Pages: 1
Consideration: $0.00
Party 1: DLJ MORTGAGE CAPITAL INCORPORATED
Party 2: PTAK SCOTT T
PTAK SPOUSE
PTAK LISA M
CITIBANK NATIONAL ASSOCIATION
CITIBANK FEDERAL SAVINGS BANK
Legal: LA MANCHA BN L11 BL
Another enlistee in the Free $hit Army. Recruited(deceived) by Lying ReaItor.
Is the Free $hit Army AIG or Citi?
Let’s say the Free Shit Army wins the war and the pandering bitches that crowded us out of the trade 2000-2011 somehow actually get their mortgage debt zero’ed.
Hows that going to work out for us? Or you?
“A massive review of as many as 4 million foreclosures nationwide began Tuesday as mortgage servicers seek out borrowers whose cases contain flaws.”
How are they going to work this out? Will wrongfully-foreclosed former owners be given their houses back? Or will Megabank, Inc be ‘asked’ to pay compensation for wrongful eviction?
“A massive review of as many as 4 million foreclosures nationwide began Tuesday as mortgage servicers seek out borrowers whose cases contain flaws.”
“Currently, about 11 million borrowers are underwater on their mortgages,”
Troubled homeowners get a lifeline
By Les Christie October 24, 2011: 6:05 PM ET
NEW YORK (CNNMoney) — In the latest attempt to address the ailing housing market, the government on Monday announced changes to a federal program that will make it easier for struggling homeowners to refinance to today’s near-record low rates.
Currently, about 11 million borrowers are underwater on their mortgages, with about 4.7 million of those loans meeting or exceeding the 125% loan-to-value limit, according to CoreLogic, a financial analytics company.
http://money.cnn.com/2011/10/24/real_estate/housing_refinance/index.htm - 67k
“A massive review of as many as 4 million foreclosures nationwide began Tuesday…”
The robo-signers will all have a new gig as robo-reviewers. You heard it here first.
It’s very simple how this is going to be worked out. Non-performing mortgages are going to be transferred from the accounts of the TBTF banks onto the taxpayers. This is what Obama and McCain voters gave the kleptocracy a green light to do, and naturally they’re taking full advantage.
Better buy now, prices will never be this high again!
Honey, jeff researched it.
Wouldn’t the correct advice be, “Better sell now…”?
“Wouldn’t the correct advice be, “Better sell now…”?”
Of course not. It`s always a great time to buy because Realtors are….. See comment below.
Realtors Are Liars®
Hey RAL, have you ever considered hiring the Goodyear blimp over the superbowl to convey your oh-so-true message? Most of us would probably chip in.
Yes I’ve been thinking along those lines. Not the blimp but T shirts, bumper stickers, etc.
Frankly I’m more interested is posing the same question to ReaItor every where possible and it’s very simple.
“ReaItor. Why are you encouraging people to buy houses when prices are falling?”
This question has gone unanswered for years now.
Methinks you should put that on a placard and stand outside open houses in your community.
Someone needs to counteract their propaganda. Just had HGTV on in the background and heard the racketeers favorite line: You don’t want to offend the seller. Their second favorite I hear on almost every show dealing with home buying: You need to lower your expectations. It’s sickening.
PRECISELY FedUp. You’re exactly right. Their lying voice permeates every level of media, cultural and society. Call me whatever you want but REFUTE what I and FED Up are saying. refute it. Dare you.
And it is sickening as FedUp says. We’ve been trained like good little robots to lay down and accept. Make an oath *to yourself* to stand up to it in whatever way you can. Not to me. Not to BJ. To yourself.
We have singleness of purpose here. It’s housing and the Crime Syndicate that sets up the toll booth in front of the house. If you don’t do *something* who will? Obama? Ron Paul? Ben Jones?
Get pissed my brothers and sisters. Get pissed or go away.
Get pissed my brothers and sisters. Get pissed or go away.
I agree but pick a fight that matters more too. I’d say many’s main fight is a fight about a symptom. Fight the cause.
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/rich-class-beating-99-to-a-pulp-2011-11-01?pagenumber=2
We know the GOP is the Party of the Rich Class. But the Dems are co-conspirators fighting the class war as pawns of the wealthy. No wonder the Occupy Wall Street crowd focuses on the inequality gap between America’s top 1% and the 99% who’ve seen no income growth since the Reaganomics ideology took over American politics. Many are like House Budget Committee chairman Paul Ryan, clones of Ayn Rand’s narcissistic cult of selfish capitalism.
Listen, both parties are singing in harmony: “Yes, there’s class warfare. And yes, it’s our duty to fight for the richest class of capitalists who are making this war. We must help them win, get richer, squeeze more and more out of all Americans.”
You do that. I’m cool with it. In the meantime I’ve diverted my efforts to demonizing those on the front line who continue to lie to the public, encourage the public to commit financial suicide and then deny they’re doing it. And if this one man show has any degree of success at *shutting down reaItor talking points*, even once, I’ve done something measurable.
I encourage you to ask Realtor The Question. Every opportunity you can. Pose the question. Do something. Shutdown conversations. Create doubt in the minds of those who are blind to the Crime Syndicate. Tell a reaItor he’s a crook. Anything. Do it.
OMG, what’s gonna happen with Greece today?
And, will Jon Corzine get to do a perp walk, or are they only gonna go after the brown Masters of the Universe?
Some people lent Grease a pile of money and now they want it back. And they’re not going away until they get it.
Live by the sword, die by the sword.
It does seem like there is a Wall Street bias towards convicting brown people as opposed to, say, white Skull & Bones Society members.
New Corzine MF symbol…..
MFGLQ.PK 0.28 -0.92 -76.70%
LMAO! I’m feeling a sure of pure unadultrated schadenfreude as I gleefully ponder the massive losses absorbed by fools who entrusted their money to a former Goldman Sachs CEO, lib-Dem NJ governor and senator, and leading pick for a cabinet position in the Obama Administration. Gee, who’d have thunk he’d be a crook?!!!
http://finance.yahoo.com/q?s=MFGLQ.PK
Corzine will probably escape a prison sentence - he is, after all, Too Connected to Jail (TCTJ) - but his chances of being Obama’s next Treasury Secretary just got a lot slimmer.
Brilliant
I wonder if this was done as a way of getting conservative investors to help bailout gamblers. Take over a large fund and then divert the money to things investors had no idea they were investing in. I’d love to see who he bailed out with this, were all of his purchases from GS????
What exactly does “MF” stand for?
‘What exactly does “MF” stand for?’
Man Financial
Making stupid bets wasn’t illegal. Really high leverage wasn’t illegal. Having a golden parachute clause that gave him $12 if the thing was sold even if it was a fire sale caused by a collapse of his own making wasn’t illegal.
Using client funds in brokerage accounts to back the firm’s own trades is illegal, though I don’t know if what is alleged is a civil violation or a criminal one.
If it is criminal, and they can prove he knew about it and especially if he suggested or approved it directly, I’m guessing he’ll do a little time. Not a lot, but some.
I met Corzine briefly when he was governor. Didn’t strike me as a very personable guy for a politician.
$12 = $12 million
Anyone else note the irony that Greece’s legislature DOESN’T want a national referendum on whether to accept the terms of the bailout?
Hint: Greece is/was known as the “cradle of democracy.”
Nobody really cares what the servants think. Anywhere.
Democracy is great until it costs the banksters money.
Those all USED to be illegal.
I wonder why?
I don’t think it was ever illegal to have high leverage in a hedge fund. He wasn’t running a bank or an insurance company. They are, by definition, unregulated and only sell shares to sophisticated investors.
And those golden parachute payments? Never were illegal. Way back when, they didn’t exist because, serioulsy, what board of directors would be so stupid as to approve one. A big payout on the sale of the company even if the sale was because the CEO had bankrupted the company by his own bad decisions? Boards wouldn’t have signed off on that stuff back in the old days (70’s, I’m guessing). But everything changed in the 80’s.
As for stupid bets? I DARE you to show me a time when being stupid has been illegal. He lost on a bet that the EU central bank would get its act together to do a “lender of last resort” style bailout before the rates on the sovereign debt he bought caused him to go under because of the leverage. He lost. And betting on something like that was pretty dumb - just too many operators to count on it all going quickly and smoothly. But being wrong isn’t illegal.
Greece? Corzine? Let’s not lose sight of what’s important here, folks. DWTS is down to the final couples, and poor Kim Kardashian has bolted from her marriage.
Tomorrow is my 112th anniversary in Kardashians.
Congratulations!
I guess you should call it a Kardashian Unit to be consistent with the Friedman Unit (six months).
And nancy grace is still in the running…who hoo
http://www.thenation.com/blog/treasury-secretary-jon-corzine
Remember when lefties were touting Corzine’s possible appointment as Treasury Secretary in the incoming Obama Administration as an indicator of “change we can believe in”?
Um, yeah….
Perth property in freefall as price slump shows no sign of ending
Courtney Trenwith
April 28, 2011.
Perth property prices are expected to continue to fall for the rest of the year in what could be the city’s worst property recession since before the Global Financial Crisis.
And while WA’s strong economic prospects could prompt a recovery, analysts now fear the property market will need to show a significant turnaround before the negative sentiment can be reversed.
Data released by Australian Property Monitors - owned by Fairfax Digital, publisher of this website - shows Perth median house and unit prices fell for the third consecutive quarter during the three months to March and show no sign of stabilising.
The continued decline surprised analysts who had expected to see the city’s property market start to stabilise by the March quarter.
“We’d be lucky to see price growth at the end of the year. There are no clear signs yet that we have either stabilised or that we have potential to move off the bottom.”
The resources boom saw Perth property prices skyrocket in 2005-06 before pulling back with four consecutive quarters of negative growth from March 2008.
“We knew that Perth had a massive boom in [the 2005-06] period and there was always going to be a massive adjustment coming back from that [but it has gone on] longer than we anticipated,” Dr Wilson said.
http://www.watoday.com.au/business/property/perth-property-in-freefall-as-price-slump-shows-no-sign-of-ending-20110427-1dwi3.html
I thought it was different there? Ya know, the unlimited resources for China’s unlimited demand?
“Perth property in freefall as price slump shows no sign of ending”
Tom Petty free fallin’
It`s a big house, was just gonna flip it
Gotta nice pool and granite tops too
She’s a Realtor, crazy ’bout research
Loves horses and her commissions too
It’s a long day livin’ in Reseda
There’s a freeway runnin’ through the yard
I’m a Deadbeat, ’cause I don’t make my payments
I’m a bad boy for rentin` it out
And I’ts free, free fallin’
Yeah I’ts free, free fallin’
All the Realtors walkin’ through the valley
Move west down Ventura Blvd.
And all the houses are standing in the shadows
All the victims are home with broken hearts
And I’ts free, I’ts free fallin’
Yeah I’ts free, free fallin’
I wanna write down half of this mortgage
I wanna take my name off this loan
I wanna short sale so I don`t owe nothin’
Gonna leave this house for awhile
Cause I’ts free, free fallin’
Yeah I’ts free, free fallin’
Oh that one is AWSOME, Jeff!
Is Canada the only one left with a bubble aloft?
I mean besides D.C.
The DC bubble is very complex. You have interest rates which are likely to stay low. You have an inflating rent bubble which will eventually meet the deflating housing bubble; in some cases, the twain have already met. You have very local real estate shifts, depending on the job source: defense contractor; county seat; Military base; government service offices; poor ‘hood. You have commuting considerations. You have established neighborhoods where the household has been in fed gov for years and is rif-proof. You have neighborhoods where the couple bought the house 20 years ago and won’t go FB with a layoff. You have old close-in housing (bubble price) and new far-out housing (bubble pop).
The DC bubble is deflatING, but not quite done yet.
We can tell the tide is turning in DC from up here in WNY. The hordes of equity withdrawal investors from DC have vanished. We still have the cargo cult mentality hanging on though.
Equity locusts in WNY from DC? I hadn’t realized that.
Wishing prices on the “highest end” condo building in Chevy Chase MD seem to be holding strong. Someone wants $8000 a month for the penthouse that is also offered for sale for $2,950,000 - 4 bed, 4.5 bath, 3650 square feet. I notice they have not listed actual sale prices in the ad that goes in the area’s monthly news letter. 2 bed, 2.5 bath with dens (almost 3000 square feet) are asking $1.5M to $1.7M.
I wish I could see these places in person, but who would even give me a tour? I saw a one bed advertised in those buildings once for $500K, but I don’t know if I even qualify for a looksee in that one.
They’re not looking to fill these places with bureaucrats and those high flying feds. I’m not sure that there are enough lobbyists and trade group presidents to fill ‘em either.
I think their they have two target markets. Wealthy former lawyer/lobbists/trade association presidents/etc. who want to downsize from the giant Potomac or Bethesda house to a place where they don’t have to supervise so much maintenance. Probably because of a recent retirement and will want to spend multiple weeks at a time in sun belt/ski condo/Europe so stand-alone house is not great idea.
Other possibility is for a country to purchase for living quarters for mid to high level embassy staff who don’t live in the actual embassy.
The D.C. bubble is DEflating?
Here are the Case-Schiller numbers for the D.C. area for the last six months.
March 177.62
April 178.74
May 180.19
June 181.30
July 184.63
August 187.57
“I mean besides D.C.”
+1
Evidently, they’re going to try to school Papa.
EU Leaders Will Tell Papandreou No Alternative to Cuts
(bloomibergi):
“European leaders racing to prevent their week-old debt crisis strategy from unravelling convene emergency talks today to tell Greece there is no alternative to the budget cuts imposed in the bailout plan.
Greek Prime Minister George Papandreou, his hold on power weakening, was summoned to Cannes on the eve of a Group of 20 summit where he will hear from French President Nicolas Sarkozy that the ‘only way to resolve Greek debt problems’ is through a deal hammered out last week in a six-day crisis-management marathon.
…’The referendum will be a clear mandate and strong message within and without Greece on our European course and our participation in the euro,’ Papandreou told his ministers in Athens late yesterday, according to an e-mailed transcript. It will ‘ensure this course in the most decisive way’.”
“Greek Prime Minister George Papandreou, his hold on power weakening, was summoned to Cannes …”
Interesting phrase: “was summoned”, as if he, the leader of a country, had to report to an authority on a higher plane than his own - which is probably the case.
You rang Your Majesty?
Hey, Greeky-Boy! This is the Banksters talking! We don’t have time for no stinking democracy.
The Banksters must be worried about Iceland Part 2.
This is going to become very interesting.
Indeed it is. Iceland was a nuthin’. Greece is a precedent.
I can’t wait to see what happens on the streets of Athens if they try to reverse the referendum.
Seriously I think it will get VERY ugly. IT would be an overt sign that the Greek gov has been taken over by foreign banks.
Banksters lost nothing on Iceland. The UK paid out.
Steve, does that mean that it’s France’s turn this time?
Why doesn’t the French guy travel to Greece, if he absolutely must speak with the Greek man in person?
Indeed, how this whole referendum epsiode has been handled is quite unsettling. The narrative in many stories strongly hints that the Greeks are somehow not equal to the other animals in the Euro barn - beyond financially.
Then again, were this to be happening 80 years ago we’d be well on the road to a world war. It’s a good thing we humans have so dramatically evolved in the past eight decades.
http://translate.google.com/translate?sl=de&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.spiegel.de%2Fwirtschaft%2Fsoziales%2F0%2C1518%2C795189%2C00.html
G-Pap, unlike Obama, is giving his people a chance to be heard before kow-towing to the banksters.
It seems to me that Papandreou wants to have the people vote on the austerity package AFTER THE DETAILS become clear.
He’s unwilling to indenture the Greeks to the tender mercies of the bankers, sight unseen, relying on the creditors’ sense of fairness and justice.
His cabinet just had a unanimous vote in support of this. It makes perfect sense. Who would sight-unseen, accept a punitive package of austerity? It’s what happened to Germany after WWI, and that was involuntary.
Of course the creditor countries are going to try and strongarm him into accepting the payback package, sight unseen.
He’s a lead politician. He’s not going to fall on his sword, which at the core, this is all about. He wants political backing to continue with the austerity, and wants the Greek people onboard - AFTER they see the deal. Right now, there’s just a vague “agreement in principle.”
The devil’s in the details.
LOL, four old white geezers. I guess that’s the best the FBI can do. It must get really boring doing the catch and release thing on violent drug cartel members and Somalian jihadist immigrants.
http://www.fbi.gov/atlanta/press-releases/2011/north-georgia-men-arrested-charged-in-plots-to-purchase-explosives-silencer-and-to-manufacture-a-biological-toxin
Dang, I’m SO proud the Feds are watching out for us. Gives me a nice, warm, fuzzy feeling.
I guessing they watch a bunch of hours of Fox News and have that AM radio pegged to Rush & Sean. They let that manufactured outrage go to their heads. I am only surprised that one of these nuts hasn’t tried to knock off the president.
You mean like the guy who tried to knock off Gabby Giffords and the guy who shot all those people in Fort Hood?
or the guy trying to set the van-bomb in NYC or the shooter in Little Rock
No, I was thinking of the freedom lover who blew up the little kids in Oklahoma City. Or, maybe the pscyho bitch who put targets on Gabby Gifford. Or maybe the white-haired coke adddict radio personality that sees every action by anybody as a conspiracy against Jesus. Somebody like that.
The guy that shot Giffords listed The Communist Manifesto as one of his favorite books on his MySpace page.
If I didn’t know any better I’d swear it was Rush Limbaugh’s page.
The guy that shot Giffords listed The Communist Manifesto as one of his favorite books on his MySpace page.
If I didn’t know any better I’d swear it was Rush Limbaugh’s page.
And that guy is also bat-sheet crazy. To the point where the people at med center for federal prisoners have had a very tough time dealing with him. To put it nicely, when he’s way out there, he doesn’t understand the proper use of toilet paper.
Now that he’s medicated, he’s a lot more lucid and can even carry on conversations.
I am relinquishing my handle (used five years here) to avoid confusion between the new CrackerBob and me. He and I appear to have opposing views.
Guess this explains why TSA keeps looking for al-Ki-yay-dah in granny’s drawers.
Anyone want to guess which state is adding jobs now?
Any guesses which state’s housing market will recover first?
Any guesses which state is controled by socialists and public unions?
—————————————-
Texas bests California on another business list
Orange County Register | 11-2-11 | Jan Norman
California ranks 47th among the states in the number of new company relocations per million population, according to the Site Selection magazine’s 2011 Top Business Climates rankings.
The relative scarcity of relocations plus California’s tax climate – ranked 49th – puts the Golden State at 20th out of 25 states in business climate, the publication reports. California’s competitiveness ranks 37th.
Texas ranks first.
“Well now, there you go again $lipperyBanana,…” Ronnie Raygun
Texas ranks first.
At what Fi$cal Deception? Naw, but they sure is mighty close to the very top of such a list. Which given their “TrueFi$calCon$ervative’$™” aren’t-we -just-flat-out-brilliant-with-leadership! control sure seem to be in a rough oil patch.
Options to fill the hole [Perhaps the hole they refer to is the one Preacher Perry uses to shout on 'bout his "Texas Miracle!"]
Budget cuts: In 2003, lawmakers used massive cuts and increases in fees to fill a $10 billion budget hole. Gov. Rick Perry has said those measures can be used again in the 2011 session.
Leadership in the Texas Legislature, which is dominated by fiscal conservatives, is not expected to support attempts to raise taxes to fill the multibillion-dollar hole. But social service advocates say the state’s safety net system can’t afford any further budget cuts.
A budget shortfall as high as $27 billion is projected as lawmakers work through the 2011 legislative session, according to estimates from economists and the comptroller’s office.
Tribpedia: Texas 2011 Budget Shortfall
Texas Tribune
How the state fell into a hole
Declining sales tax receipts and the recession: State lawmakers write a budget based on an educated guess of how much money will be available to spend during the period for which they’re writing a budget. For example, in 2009, lawmakers wrote a budget for 2010-11. State government gets about 60 percent of its revenue from sales taxes, so when there’s a dramatic drop in state revenues, or collections, there’s less money to spend. During the economic recession of 2008-09, Texas saw a drop in state revenues for 14 straight months.
Structural deficit: Some budget watchers say lawmakers created a “structural” deficit in 2005, when lawmakers cut school property taxes by one-third and expanded the business tax to make up the difference. But the business tax brings in billions less each year than the property tax did, meaning that with every new budget, lawmakers must find more and more extra money to make up the difference. The structure of the revenue system creates deficits each year.
Increasing revenue: There are various ways this can occur, but lawmakers must approve them, which makes some of them much more likely than others.
Draining the Rainy Day Fund: The Rainy Day Fund allows states to set aside excess revenue for use in times of unexpected revenue shortfall. It can plug holes in the budget, defend against an economic perfect storm and keep the deficit clouds at bay. Using the fund itself isn’t particularly easy. If the comptroller says that revenue will decrease between legislative sessions or if a budget deficit unexpectedly develops, it requires a three-fifths vote to transfer money away from the fund. Of course, if members want to use the money for any other situation — like say, a budget shortfall — then they’ll need to reach two-thirds of their colleagues, an even higher threshold.
Cost-shifting: Cost-shifting refers to transferring the burden of paying for a service from the state government to its beneficiaries. The best-known example from 2003 was the deregulation of tuition at public universities. Those with state-subsidized health insurance also had to shoulder higher costs — including $790 million in new co-pays, premiums and other costs.
Fees: Since it’s politically unpalatable to raise taxes, lawmakers in the past have raised fees in places that many Texans would not notice or be affected by. In 2003, lawmakers established a quality-assurance fee for facilities for the developmentally disabled ($54 million) and added a $1,000-a-year charge for three years for motorists’ first driving-while-intoxicated conviction.
Gambling: In light of the budget situation, lawmakers are considering casino gambling as a possible new revenue stream. But there’s infighting among industry groups over which industry — track owners or destination resort casino backers — get preferential treatment in the lawmaking process. If a casino gambling bill actually passed, Texans would then vote to approve them. It would take another few years for the industry to grow in Texas and provide billions promised in increased revenue. But some tax revenue, like money from casino licenses, could flow into state coffers more quickly.
Personal income tax: Texas has no personal income tax, and most Republican leadership in Texas say it will never happen. But progressive economists argue that a personal income tax is the only way to grow revenue over time because a property tax and sales tax system will not be enough to continue funding programs and services.
How the state fell into a hole
Declining sales tax receipts and the recession
But, but Texas is creating jobs … why are sales tax receipts falling?
I do recall reading that most of the new private sector jobs were being gobbled up by illegals (so they were probably menial jobs) and that about half of the jobs (and most of the non menial jobs) created under Perry’s watch were gov’t jobs, which are now going to get cut to balance the budget.
My favorite tax is the $5 battery disposal tax.
Goes straight into the state general fund.
what?!?!?!?!
you got a problem with education, teachers, firemen, policemen, roads and children?
i see…you want poisoned water, starving kids and old people eating dog food…not to mention falling down bridges.
i bet you watch fox news.
Yep. LOTS of sub-$10hr jobs. You should apply for one!
A decent 2 bedroom apartment rents for $500-600 in Dallas, less in smaller towns. $10/hr sounds low, but adjusting for cost of living, it’s the equivalent of a $20/hr job on the coasts. Even more in some cases.
And not just housing. Everything’ cheaper. Food, gas, car insurance, car registration, you name it, it’s cheaper in TX vs. coastal areas. Two people each making $10/hr = $40K a year combined. That goes far in Texas.
Those wages don’t get taxed very hard at the federal level and of course Texas still has no state income tax.
That’s not true. My last one bedroom in Dallas in the sort of ghetto (dangerous looking section 8 was across the street but mine was fine) was more than $650 for a 600 sq ft one bedroom, and that was a few years ago. A two bedroom in a decent area in the city would be more like $1200, and in a good area $1500 and up. In smaller cities, a 2 bedroom would be $600.
Also home insurance is kind of a wash with other places because Texas has hail storms, which cause considerable damage to cars and houses and makes it relatively higher compared to other places, but less of course than places than get crushed by hurricanes. My insurance is about 1% of my purchase price currently I think.
In Texas, you don’t get points on your license, which makes car insurance a little cheaper if you like to skirt the edges of the law.
Gas is cheaper.
Food may be cheaper, but all the shopping I’ve done in southern California has shown that it’s pretty much the same price. I’ve never done any shopping on the East Coast, but restaurants are about the same price (minus New York) as in every other major US city.
Stuff is more expensive in other places, but I’ve seen close-out sales on the coasts that beats close out sales in Texas by far, but I’m not much of a shopper so the wrong person to ask about that.
Car registration might be cheaper as well, but you have to do it every year and get the smog checks every year. My wife (Southern California native) was pissed and said it was slightly more expensive and more of a pain in the butt.
You haven’t been to Texas in a while. I was there just last week.
$600 2bdrs apt are only available in the ghettos and there is nothing “decent” about them.
Adjusted for living, $10hr in Texas is equivalent to $10hr anywhere but NYC or SF.
FYI, Texas has the HIGHEST auto insurance in the nation.
According to the money.com cost of living adjustment calculator
$10 in Dallas =
$23.50 in NYC
$17.85 in SF
$15.23 in DC
This takes into account all costs of living, car insurance, food, utilities, in addition to housing. But not state income tax.
The same people who look down at $10/hr in Texas would be cheering $23.50 jobs in NYC or $18 jobs in SF or $15 in DC.
I can’t speak for Dallas, but I lived in Austin in the late 90s, and my pretty mediocre (although well-located) 1 bedroom apt was $700 a month. Can’t imagine it’s gone down since then.
Actually, we can do a back of the envelope cost of living calculations. Somebody mentioned renting a tuxedo in Long Island last week. I had to rent one too as a usher (what a bummer for a wedding). Mine was a Men’s Warehouse basic I think: Obviously there are lots of factors included in a tux rental beyond physical location, but rents and salaries and whatnot make up the majority I’m sure, so it acts as a decent-enough proxy for a laugh:
Mine was $125 before taxes. The person mentioned their’s was about $170 I think. So the TX/NY tuxedo index is $125/$170 or about 26% higher.
“it’s the equivalent of a $20/hr job on the coasts”
I’ve lived in Texas, that isn’t even close to true.
Maybe rent is substantially less, but food, gas, cars, insurance, etc. do NOT cost substantially less, not by a long shot. Many things (like those pickups they love so much) cost the same as everywhere else.
The last time I was in Dallas I stepped into a WalMart to buy a few things. Much to my surprise they asked to see my receipt on the way out, which to me screams: shoplifting problem. If everything costs HALF as much (what a frakking joke) and it’s so affordable to live there and there are plenty of good paying jobs then why is there a shoplifting problem?
No message
Not one law will be changed
Not one new person will be elected
It will end with violence and riots
—————————————–
Occupy Wall Street is 99% dead: The media, once curious, has moved on
MarketWatch | November 2, 2011 | Jon Friedman
Here’s how the media are viewing the once-hottest news story:
Occupy Wall Street is 99% dead.
In the first phase of Occupy Wall Street, journalists were dazzled by the spirit and the anger of the participants. For a brief, flickering moment, the idea of rallying as an economically aggrieved 99% of the population had terrific potential.
Reporters trekked to Zuccotti Park to observe the latest link in the chain, advancing from the anti-Vietnam protests of the ‘60s and ‘70s to the anti-nuclear power demonstrations that followed it.
Now we’re seeing the lamentable second wave of the Occupy Wall Street story. The spirit has been muffled by people who want to cash in on the popularity of Occupy Wall Street and exploit the participants’ idealism.
Sure, the crowds of supporters and sympathizers will continue to gather at Zuccotti Park in lower Manhattan, the starting point for what became a global movement. And yes, similar groups will congregate elsewhere around the world. You can be sure that this news story will rank prominently in those year-end retrospective pieces highlighting 2011.
I wrote in this space a few weeks ago that Occupy Wall Street would become corrupted by big business, which would exploit the popularity of the movement to sell blue jeans, t-shirts and beer. I wasn’t far off.
We’ve heard rumblings that MTV’s Real World is said to be scouting people between the ages of 20 and 24 for a series with an Occupy Wall Street theme.
In another sign that Occupy Wall Street is ripe for exploitation, there is actually a website called Hot Chicks of Occupy Wall Street…
“there is actually a website called Hot Chicks of Occupy Wall Street…”
And that proves it’s dead? Whatever. Keep hoping it’s a tempest in a teapot, 1%ers.
The Tea Party vs. OWS conflict is 100% created and framed by the corporate media.
You know what I’ve been seeing this week?
Friends of mine that refused to comment on stories a little earlier in the game have decided yeah, ya know what, I am mad and maybe I should be doing more than sitting in my house.
I’m not too worried about the “knee jerk” media. They weren’t there in the beginning either. Cursed w/ADD…I don’t have any doubts they’ll be back.
What a surprise.
If the PTB is threatened by a movement then it will simply hijack it and marginalize it and the sheeple will never catch on.
Meanwhile thousands of OWS supporters signed a petition protesting B of A raising fees on accounts THAT THEY THEMSELVES HAVE WITH THE BANK and are immensly proud of themselves now that B of A has changed its mind.
IMO if these protesters really were serious about the whole matter then they would close out their accounts, but for some reason this never seems to occur to them.
Lemmings all: These folks have power over the banks - each and every one of them - but for some reason they will not use it.
“if these protesters really were serious about the whole matter then they would close out their accounts,”
How do you know the vast majority of them hadn’t done so already? Perhaps they were attempting to clue the rest of the nation in. That’s pretty much what a protest movement is all about.
“and are immensly proud of themselves now that B of A has changed its mind.”
I’ve seen no victory parties in their ranks. Are you sure you aren’t just parroting the right wing/MSM caricature of them as clueless anti-capitalist hippies?
“If the PTB is threatened by a movement then it will simply hijack it and marginalize it and the sheeple will never catch on.
Thus far, they seem to be doing a good job of confounding attempts to marginalize or hijack the movement. Those out-of-work kids are actually pretty smart.
No, that sounds like talking points? “Each and every one has an account at BoA” smacks of the usual talk-radio logical fallacy.
And it wasn’t the OWS petition which made BoA backpeddle. It was the thousands of regular people who saw the story on Brian Williams or online and made the switch themselves. The paid shills on comment boards tried to keep customers by extolling the BoA services, but people didn’t fall for it.
I’m sure that by now no one on this blog has an account or credit card from BofA, WF, or Chase/Citi.
Right?
uh-oh
i like my citicard.
i pay it off every month. i get 1% cash back.
i LUV the virtual account number you can generate for a one time use.
all that said, i am 100% with the 99%’ers.
Do my fellow bloggers reproach my decision?
I use whatever card has the best promo at the time.
Right now it’s Discover. 1% cash back on all purchases. Current promo: spend $3K per month Oct-Feb and on top of the 1% cashback, get a bonus $500 cash back.
I pay off the balance every month, therefore no interest. So doing this promo I will earn a minimum $650 tax free from Discover for 5 months.
Prior to this, Capital One had a 100% miles bonus (2 miles per $1 spent) if you spend $2500/month. So I used my Capital One card exclusively for the duration of the promo.
I realize that for most people, they will pay more interest on these promos than they will get back. But if you’re like me and pay the balances off every month, you can really benefit from the cards with a little digging around for the offers. I bought 2 airline tickets last year last minute with my Capital One points that would otherwise have cost $2K.
I don’t spend $3000 a month including my rent which can’t go on a card.
Seriously? $3000 a month that is eligible to be put on a credit card for 5 months in a row to get the bonus? I had to plan it out to spend $400 on a card two months in a row to get $50 back. One was a car repair and one was buying my Thanksgiving plane ticket really early.
I just got a Citi AA card, 75k miles if you spend $1500 in 6 mos.
Just finished with my Brit Air. card, ended up with 150k miles. It is a great game, if you know how to play.
“How do you know the vast majority of them hadn’t done so already? Perhaps they were attempting to clue the rest of the nation in. That’s pretty much what a protest movement is all about.”
Well if the majority has done so, it proves their numbers are so small as to be a rounding error. If OWS were truly the mass movement the MSM claims it is, even if 20% closed their BoA accounts, it would be a huge hit to BoA.
So either their numbers are paltry. Or their numbers are big but they talk the talk without walking the walk.
I have 3 BoA accounts. I haven’t seen that $5 fee that everyone’s so upset about on either account. And even so, $5 a month for the convenience of having an ATM on every corner is worth it for me. I could take my business to a small local bank where I’d save $5. But I’d pay $3 each time I used a non-bank ATM when I’m not at the bank itself.
Where have you seen the MSM claim OWS is a mass movement? I’ve never seen that. Quite the opposite, they were dismissive of the protesters at first and now seem to acknowledge that they are persistent, though small. The one thing the media does acknowledge is that polls show a lot of the public is generally sympathetic to the movement. Very different.
The $5 fee wasn’t ever going to happen until January 1st, so it is no wonder that you didn’t see it. And it has nothing to do with ATMs. It was going to be charged every month in which the holder used their debit card at least once. So, a charge for accessing your money using the single method that costs the bank the least to process.
As for lots of ATMs, you may like not having to pay to not use any BofA ATM. So do I. I don’t ever pay to use an ATM. My bank reimburses the charges up to $15 a month for charges by other banks and doesn’t charge a fee of its own. Oddly enough there are other banks that also do this. I wonder why you don’t know about any of them?
BofA and its ilk can get away with anything as long as there’s this attitude:
“And even so, $5 a month for the convenience of having an ATM on every corner is worth it for me.”
Best bank is USAA if you qualify.
That is my bank. Love ‘em. And, their call centers are in the US. You can tell from the accents and word usage.
IMO if these protesters really were serious about the whole matter then they would close out their accounts, but for some reason this never seems to occur to them.
Lemmings all: ?????????????????????????????????????/
Care to site a link that supports your premise that all OWS participants have their money at big banks. Seriously, how can you post this? Even if some are just realizing the link at least many are doing something about it. There are people in the movement who were arrested while trying to withdraw their money from said banks.
When the NYC United Federation of Teachers, who recently got their retirement age cut from 62 to 55 in a political deal and are now protesting against classroom cuts to pay for it, infiltrated the movement, it was pretty much game over.
When it comes for being paid when they are not working, THEY are the top one percent.
From Bloomberg 2009
Dec. 2 (Bloomberg) — New York state’s pension program will raise the retirement age and financial contributions for new workers to save the state and local governments about $48 billion over 30 years.
The change, affecting workers hired Jan. 1 or after, was approved by legislators today and is supported by Governor David Paterson. The two biggest public employee unions backed the change after Paterson agreed to drop proposals to eliminate a 3 percent pay increase this year and cut 8,700 state jobs.
“Savings will be achieved not only in state spending, but at the local level, which will help to reduce property taxes,” Paterson, 55, said in a statement. The state constitution bars reductions in pension benefits for existing workers.
New York’s pension fund, the third-largest in the U.S., covers 1 million current and retired workers, and had $126 billion in assets on Sept. 30, according to Comptroller Thomas DiNapoli, the sole trustee.
For new workers, the bill raises the age for retirement without penalty to 62 from 55, imposes a 38 percent penalty on non-uniformed workers who retire before 62 and increases the minimum years of service to draw a pension to 10 from 5, according to Paterson’s office.
From 2010
New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg said he will eliminate scheduled raises for teachers and principals for the next two years to cope with the loss of state funding for education.
The removal of planned 2 percent raises in 2011 and 2012 will help the city avoid getting rid of more than 4,400 teaching positions, Bloomberg said in an e-mailed statement.
I think you got that exactly wrong. The teachers have seen the retirement age increased not decreased. Post a link if you have one that supports you statement that they had their retirement age cut.
Seriously it amazes me that so many on this board are willing to write off this movement so soon. Some even working toward it’s demise.
This was your best gem
“When it comes for being paid when they are not working, THEY are the top one percent.”
Then from yahoo
Many “Occupy Wall Street” protesters arrested in New York City “occupy” more luxurious homes than their “99 percent” rhetoric might suggest, a Daily Caller investigation has found.
For each of the 984 Occupy Wall Street protesters arrested in New York City between September 18 and October 15, police collected and filed an information sheet recording the arrestee’s name, age, sex, criminal charge, home address and — in most cases — race. The Daily Caller has obtained all of this information from a source in the New York City government.
Among addresses for which information is available, single-family homes listed on those police intake forms have a median value of $305,000 — a far higher number than the $185,400 median value of owner-occupied housing units in the United States.
yahoo.com/nyc-arrest-records-many-occupy-wall-street
So which is it are they dirty unemployed poor hippies or are they rich and can’t relate to the average American? the anti OWS crowd moved by BS propaganda from the elite can’t seem to make up their mind.
Also note the story of the fully employed decorated marine shot in the head in Oakland by police, and then ask yourself who are you supporting when you make posts like this.
“I think you got that exactly wrong. The teachers have seen the retirement age increased not decreased. Post a link if you have one that supports you statement that they had their retirement age cut.”
http://gothamschools.org/2011/07/18/pension-changes-could-be-enduring-effect-of-merit-pay-pilot/
The Mayor claimed that cutting the retirement age from 62 to 55 would save money. Then he proposed increasing the retirement age for new hires. To save money.
That article is rather vague as to whether they are talking about proposals or if it’s already in effect.
http://www.crainsnewyork.com/article/20110519/INS/110519858
Thanks.
“No message
Not one law will be changed
Not one new person will be elected
It will end with violence and riots”
I’m quite certain King George made similar comments about the American colonies before he went mad.
I’m quite certain King George made similar comments about the American colonies before he went mad.
Equating socialists with $500 iphones who want to expand government out the wazoo to patriots that gave up everything with the threat of hanging for treason for small and limited government?
And camping out in a NYC park during one snow storm equals Valley Forge.
Can you hear yourself?
I’m sure the guys at Valley Forge were mocked by the British and the loyalists in much the same way you now mock the OWS protesters.
Origin of the song “Yankee Doodle”
“The first verse and refrain, as often sung today, runs:
Yankee Doodle went to town,
Riding on a pony;
He stuck a feather in his hat,
And called it macaroni[2]
Traditions place its origin in a pre-Revolutionary War song originally by British military officers to mock the disheveled, disorganized colonial “Yankees” with whom they served in the French and Indian War. It is believed that the tune comes from the nursery rhyme Lucy Locket. One version of the Yankee Doodle lyrics is “generally attributed” to Doctor Richard Shuckburgh,[3] a British Army surgeon. According to one story, Shuckburgh wrote the song after seeing the appearance of Colonial troops under Colonel Thomas Fitch, Jr., the son of Connecticut Governor Thomas Fitch.[2]
As a term Doodle first appeared in the early seventeenth century,[4] and is thought to derive from the Low German dudel or dödel, meaning “fool” or “simpleton”. The Macaroni wig was an extreme fashion in the 1770s and became contemporary slang for foppishness.[5] The implication of the verse was therefore probably that the Yankees were so unsophisticated that they thought simply sticking a feather in a cap would make them the height of fashion.[6]”
wikipedia
…and with the girls be handy (!)
I’m sure 2 banana would have been out mocking the revolution and acting as Benedict Arnold.
You, sir, spend way too much time watching The Angry Channel.
There is no marketing/advertising in OWS for the corporate media to exploit and profit from, therefore they attempt to criticize and marginalize.
If you’re not pissed by now, you’re part of the problem.
“One dog barks at something, the rest bark at him.”
Chinese Proverb
(modified to fit $lipperybanana’$ modus operandi):
“One [Mad/Angry] dog barks at something, the rest bark at him.”
Equating socialists with $500 iphones who want to expand government out the wazoo to patriots that gave up everything with the threat of hanging for treason for small and limited government?
Correction
Equating patriots who want the banking monopoly and corporate aristocrats who have taken over our gov and have used it to enrich themselves at the expense of everyone else, who have privatized the gains and socialized the losses, promoted market manipulation, outsourced our manufacturing, is EXACTLY right. There is no difference between these aristocrats and the ones that demanded a pound of flesh from the American colonies.
+1 -
So many people pretend they don’t know what OWS is all about, or at least I hope they are just pretending.
I like OWS.
“patriots that gave up everything with the threat of hanging for treason for small and limited government”
Is there a Fox version of Schoolhouse Rock that your TV picks up?
The Colonial Army had restriction on the amount of credit that could be extended to soldiers by camp followers. Seems like they understood the necessity of regulation of credit and the danger of predatory lenders.
November 2, 2011 5:52 AM
“Occupy Oakland” strike gains big labor support
A man walks past the Occupy Oakland encampment, Nov. 1, 2011, in Oakland, Calif. (AP Photo/Ben Margot)
OAKLAND, Calif. - A widely anticipated strike Wednesday by anti-Wall Street demonstrators in Oakland is expected to get a big boost from organized labor and established advocacy groups whose grievances range from school closures and waning union benefits to home foreclosures and cuts to libraries and services for the disabled.
The unions representing Oakland’s public school teachers, community college instructors, city government workers and University of California, Berkeley teaching assistants have endorsed the broad-based call to action that is expected to include marches, pickets outside banks and an attempt to shut down the Port of Oakland in the evening.
…
No message….It will end with violence and riots
That’s weak 2bananna. Is that all you’ve got? Here. Here’s a guide to your right-wing-in-a-panic, inane talking points. Study up.
http://mediamatters.org/research/201110180014
A Guide To The Smear Campaign Against Occupy Wall Street
October 18, 2011 2:12 pm ET — 514 Comments
The right-wing media have engaged in a relentless smear campaign against the Occupy Wall Street movement, including calling the protesters socialists and Marxists, saying they represent the “fringe of the fringe of the fringe,” and claiming they “sound like the Unabomber,” among other attacks.
RioAmericanInBrasil
I would love to know if the Unknown Comic was on the Gong Show with “The Popsicle Twins”. I didn`t get to see the original show when it aired.
Gong Show: The Popsicle Twins (aka “Have You Got A Nickle …
14 Oct 2010 … From September 1977; aired in the East Coast, never made it to the West Coast…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDxDYIQL6Nc - 86k -
Jeff,
No the unknown comic was not on that one and he didn’t even know about it because he was long gone by then he says. According to him, he was the first unknown comic and got like $250 a show but the bad thing about having a bag over one’s head is that he could be replaced easily by someone else cheaper or funnier maybe. He was replaced. Some of the things he told me was that Chuck Barris had a drum set as his office desk and that Chuck had a lot of women admirers but wouldn’t cheat on his wife. He said both Chuck Barris and Jamie Farr were cool.
Well if he was the original tell him that he and Gene Gene the dancing machine were the ones who got us hooked on the show. I don`t think whoever replaced him could have been any funnier, I think walking out on the stage in a jacket and tie with a paper bag on his head took care of that. Thanks for the info.
In the movie “dangerous mind” he claimed Barris was crazy as a loon and pulled a gun on him backstage.
The actual title of the film was “Confessions of A Dangerous Mind.” Wild stuff.
What about Sarah Palin, the Hot Chick of the Tea Party?
I have to see anybody cash in on Occupy Wall Street. Anyone who showed up (Moore, unions, Rangel, Sharpton) but were eventually shown the door. They certainly didn’t take center stage the way Glenn Beck did.
MTV’s reality show will tap into the same frustration the #OWS exposed, not #OWS itself (there’s a difference).
As for TV cashing in on the Tea Party mentality? Hollywood did that decades ago with The Dukes of Hazzard, complete with hot chick in hot pants.
Occupy Wall Street is 99% dead
And since the Corporate Owned MSM says so it must be true!
Yeah, right. That’s why they’re sending their jack booted thugs to clear out the protesters.
The corporate media is 99% dead. The REIC ad-driven revenue model of newsprint was the first casualty. For people who think, teevee is dead. OWS and the blogosphere and social networks that support it (yes on our $$$ smartphones) is alive and thriving.
In Oakland it is growing.
If setting around with a bunch of vapid drum-pounders and Free Sh*t Army members isn’t your thing, and you are genuinely concerned with crony capitalism and corruption in high places, here’s a much better alternative to doing something about it. Even former Obama and McCain voters who have unscrambled their lobotomies are welcome, despite the culpability they bear for perpetuating the plutocracy.
http://www.ronpaul.com/
“No message
Not one law will be changed
Not one new person will be elected
It will end with violence and riots”
There is a message for the 1 percenters. It’s stop hoarding and start sharing. If the message is ignored (which seems likely), then it will end with violence and riots. If the system doesn’t take care of people, then the people will take care of the system.
Oh please. The sheeple voted for this system. The 1 percent know that maybe five percent of the population actually are capable of independent thought. If there’s violence and riots it will be by opportunistic thugs. The system wasn’t put in place to “take care of the people.” It’s place is not to hinder them as they take care of themselves and their families. Failure, as Santelli said, is the ultimate regulator of companies and people who make bad decisions.
If there’s violence and riots it will be by the police. SWAT gear clad police attacking unarmed, unemployed veterans in OWS will make for some great teevee, watch the corporate media try to spin that one.
Like the police riot that recently took place in Oakland, CA? The one where the Iraq war veteran was shot in the head with a rubber bullet? And he’s still in the hospital?
“The sheeple voted for this system.” I have yet to see any ballot that gives the opportunity to vote for or against a kleptocracy? It’s just worked into the system, and voting won’t prevent it. Showing up in numbers at the root of the problem, that being Wallstreet, it the closest people came come to voting against the system.
“The system wasn’t put in place to “take care of the people.”” Sure it was. Property rights, the right to vote, the criminal system, etc were all designed to create an environment where people can flourish or fail. That system is being eroded and if it continues to do so it will be put aside, along with the people managing it.
“Failure, as Santelli said, is the ultimate regulator of companies and people who make bad decisions.” Agreed. But currently the system is protecting the 1% from their bad decisions, while giving the rest less and less opportunity to make good ones. What it boils down too, when the economic/political system leaves you with too little to survive, you have an incentive to work outside it. When a critical mass of people is reached, then the system will be torn down. Consider OWS as an early warning, even if few OWSers understand it themselves.
See the Colbert interview with 2 OWSers, you can watch it on Comedy Central’s web site. Funny stuff.
Sad too thinking the media (and DNC) is taking these people seriously. We live in interesting times indeed.
Also interesting, The Daily Caller did an analysis on the arrests made at OWS. Something like 95% of them were white, college educated kids in their 20s. And the vast majority of them lived in zip codes where the median income, median rent and median house price were way above the NY average.
It’s a fad by bored rich white kids. As soon as it starts getting cold and the cameras go away, the circus will end.
It’s a fad by bored rich white kids. As soon as it starts getting cold and the cameras go away, the circus will end.
If they had the option of jobs and a nice middle class life you’d be right.
You’re right they’re not middle class. They are UPPER middle class.
If I were 22 I’d probably be down there as well. It’s a party. Lots of girls. Lots of weed. Tents!! And you might even get on TV. I’m not knocking the upper middle class white college kids for doing this. I’m knocking anyone for taking them seriously.
Speaking of which, I remember somebody publishing an opinion long ago that if you want to see where the world is headed, watch the pretty girls. During Vietnam they were protesting, and in the 80s they were working…etc.. So I’d say just on that measure OWS has a chance to mean something.
But regardless of that, I’m still saying that regardless of what class you say they are in, they can’t get a job sufficient to pay their student loans. Why should they be anywhere else?
Why should they be anywhere else?
The general consensus of the reader comments on any corporate media news article is that they should be in mom’s basement.
Even being in mom’s basement doesn’t stop the clock on the student loan interest.
Like I said, I’m not faulting them for being there. I’d be there too (well after work anyway) if I were 15-20 years younger. What I do find hilarious is people take these kids seriously. I mean come on, it’s a fraternity party with tents.
As for student loans, I don’t see how it’s Wall St’s fault. Did Wall St force them to pay $50K a year for a degree when a state school degree for $10K a year would have been just as good? Did Wall st force them to borrow money to buy a new iphone every year, along with a new ibook, ipod, ipad and every other product with an apple logo on it? From what I’ve seen of the footage these kids aren’t exactly wearing rags either. Lots of designed clothes on the “victims” of Wall St.
Reminds me a lot of people who took out $200K in equity from their homes to buy Hummers and Fiji vacations who then blame the bank for giving them the money after the house loses $300K in value.
Then again maybe I wouldn’t go down there.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gGFeJ6gmJAE&feature=player_embedded
What I do find hilarious is people take these (OWS) kids seriously.
Then you are not to be taken seriously. Period. Go ahead and “laugh” while the entire political discussion has shifted.
MSM stories discussing “wealth-inequality,” “wealth distribution” and “crony-capitalism” are up over 1,000% since the OWC.
There ain’t a snowball’s chance in hell now for a 9-9-9 tax plan. So laugh at that.
I think it takes some dissatisfaction to take to the streets and face the cops. This isn’t only happening in one place, it’s happening across the US and around the world.
Those who have secure jobs and circumstances simply do not get why anyone would do this.
If you take away opportunity from middle class youth, that is how revolutions are born. We have a big pressure release valve here in the vote, so there’s no excuse for violence. This could well be an echo of the Arab Spring with the release valve of the vote. This could be how young people just getting started in the world react to a dropping standard of living.
You have no idea you just supported their argument, do you GEG?
You seem to think that being better off is not a reason to demand social responsibilty.
“Irony, how does it work?”
Oh, you’re right. People who are educated, energetic, and members of the most successful race on the planet must be …WRONG? Not really.
OK, I was being sarcastic about the race thing. But I’m just saying. It’s easier to discredit people who appear to belong to a loserish crowd. Being members of the in crowd is does not make you weaker.
Here in Tucson, the Occupy movement is kicking right along. It has quite a bit of local support too.
The downside of accepting hush money is that you give up your right to defend yourself against bald-face lies.
When gauging the significance of this story for election prospects, it is worth recalling that although both Clinton and the Gropinator managed to get elected under clouds of similar allegations, neither of them were involved in a “holier-than-thou” competition for the evangelistic fringe vote. Ironically, although Romney doesn’t qualify as Christian according to the evangelicals’ political calculus, he of all the serious contenders for the Republican ticket probably best meets their standards of personal morality.
Nov 02, 2011
Report: Herman Cain’s accuser got year’s salary
By Catalina Camia, USA TODAY
Updated 28m ago
GOP presidential hopeful Herman Cain will be on the hot seat for the third straight day as he deals with the controversy surrounding allegations of sexual harassment when he led the National Restaurant Association.
The New York Times reports one of Cain’s accusers received $35,000, a year’s salary, in severance pay after an incident with Cain that made her uncomfortable. The story said the incident came “in the context of a work outing during which there had been heavy drinking.”
Joel Bennett, the attorney for another Cain accuser, said last night that he plans to ask the National Restaurant Association to release his client from a confidentiality agreement so she can tell her story.
“She’s been very upset about this since the story broke…because Mr. Cain has been giving the impression she came out and made false allegations,” Bennett said on CNN. “That’s certainly not true.”
Cain, who has maintained he was “falsely accused” of sexual harassment, told Fox News on Tuesday night that he’s not sure if he’ll ask the association to comply with Bennett’s request. He suggested there could be “legal implications,” and said he would consult with his lawyers.
…
The downside of accepting hush money is that you give up your right to defend yourself against bald-face lies.
Or if TV shows now offer alot more than what you got in your voluntary and legally binding settlement…
I guess when Cain was running for Senate the dollars were just not there to “come out”
Do you have any proof that she was offered money by TV shows? Might it be that seeing that this man who harrased her might become the next president be enough to make her want to speak up?
Let me explain it in terms you may understand.
Let’s say the -fixr and another person catches someone (lets call him 2pomegranite) fornicating with a duck down by the lake. Fixr calls the cops, but the pom offers him $35K to forget he saw anything. Fixr reluctantly signs, because 2pom doesn’t have the time to hassle with the smear campaign that 2pom’s lawyers have assured him will begin, if he doesn’t.
2pom goes out, and repeated asserts that the -fixr is a liar. Does $35K give 2pom the right to call -fixr a liar?
As a supervisor/manager, there’s no reason whatsoever for you to put yourself in a position to be accused of sexual harassment (back in the 90’s the company I worked for had mandatory 2-3 day sessions every year on just this subject…..but I guess that kind of thing is considered “unnecessary regulation” today. But I digress…..)
Guys are stupid, though. There are some guys that think that they are God’s gift to women, and can’t imagine that their BS isn’t universally appealing to the opposite sex.
Some women need their jobs, and try to tolerate it, knowing how much of a stink it raises for everyone if they file a complaint. Some managers who hit on their subordinates catch the signs that the woman isn’t interested, and stop. Others think that “tolerating” it means that the woman likes the attention, and the BS continues and gets worse. Then, they usually step way over the line, and a complaint is filed.
In my experience, women are very reluctant to file harassment claims against bosses and co-workers. For every case that was filed, I’ve seen ten that could/should have been. I have three daughters, ages 18-29. All three of them have related stories of the crap they have to deal with from some of their male managers.
Thanks to the -fixr’s guidance and leadership as they were growing up (for better or worse), they have never been hesitant about telling men to go eff themselves. Others (typically the Bible-thumper crowd) have brain-washed their daughters into thinking that the “authority figure”, be it church elder, employer, political leader should be deferred to, and are always right.
It’s great being a 1%’er. You can violate laws and buy desperate Lucky Duckies’ silence for what is mere chicken feed.
This is what really makes Oligarchs tick: being above the law, being able to do things that would serious harm to a “little person” should the commit those acts.
This is what makes lynchmobs tick.
“She’s been very upset about this since the story broke…because Mr. Cain has been giving the impression she came out and made false allegations,”
“Bad Pizza” Cain = New Coke
SCOTUS “Clarice” Thomas = Coke “Classic”
Seems like just yesterday…
According to Hill, during her two years of employment as Thomas’s assistant, Thomas had asked her out socially many times, and after she refused, he used work situations to discuss sexual subjects. “He spoke about … such matters as women having sex with animals and films showing group sex or rape scenes” she said, adding that on several occasions Thomas described “graphically “his own sexual prowess” and the details of his anatomy. Hill also recounted an instance in which Thomas examined a can of Coke on his desk and asked, “Who has put pubic hair on my Coke?”
Four female witnesses waited in the wings to reportedly support Hill’s credibility, but they were not called, due to what the Los Angeles Times described as private, compromise deal between “aggressive, gloves-off” Republicans and the Senate Judiciary Committee Chair, Democrat Joe Biden.According to Time magazine, one of the witnesses, Angela Wright, may not have been considered credible on the issue of sexual harassment because she had been fired from the EEOC by Thomas.
Hill agreed to take a polygraph test which found that her statements were true; Thomas declined the test. He made a vehement and complete denial, adding that he was being subjected to a “high-tech lynching for uppity blacks” by white liberals who were seeking to block a black conservative from taking a seat on the Supreme Court.
Did anyone ever ask to see “Clarice’s” birth certificate?
What a suave and sophisticaed charmer! How could any women resist?
Perhaps “Bad Pizza” Cain’s wife will contact those hussies in another 10 years and demand that they send him a personal apology.
Ironically, although Romney doesn’t qualify as Christian according to the evangelicals’ political calculus, he of all the serious contenders for the Republican ticket probably best meets their standards of personal morality.
About that personal morality: Remember the story of how the Romney family put their dog in a crate on top of their car and drove through several states? Dog was so frightened that it lost control of its bodily functions.
Nice family, those Romneys.
I rode in the back of a pickup through multiple states on vacation once. I managed to hold it between stops, though…at least that’s my story.
Here’s a good read.
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/e71ab1d6-049d-11e1-ac2a-00144feabdc0.html#ixzz1cYMDrsu9
“This story lies behind what is happening to the world. It is behind the agenda of the European summit of last week and that of the Group of 20 leading economies this weekend. As Mervyn King, governor of the Bank of England, stated in a recent speech, it is the story behind all the crises since 2007: “Persistent trade surpluses in some countries and deficits in others did not reflect a flow of capital to countries with profitable investment opportunities, but to countries that borrowed to finance consumption or had lost competitiveness. The result was unsustainably high levels of consumption (whether public or private) in the US, UK and a range of other advanced economies and unsustainably low levels of consumption in China and other economies in Asia, and some advanced economies with persistent trade surpluses, such as Germany and Japan.”
Globalisation and trade are not the problem. Debt for consumption is. That’s what screwed up trade and everything else.
Globalisation and trade are the cause of debt for consumption.
Exactly.
Only if you buy stuff you cannot pay for.
When you throw up the trade barriers, it will constrain consumption. Stuff will cost more and you will do with less, which is what you should have done in the first place. Now that you have all that debt, you will do with a lot less for a while.
And racked up all that debt? The Walmart shopper on food stamps of the large corps buying merchandise by the warehouse/ship fleet load?
“…who racked up…”
“…OR the large corps…”
Sheesh, busy day.
Stuff will cost more and you will do with less
Will it? Are the brand name people really passing on the savings or is it just going to the bottom line?
They charge what the market will bear.
You might be right. I expect we’ll find out. At least we won’t have to pay UE benefits for displaced Chinese workers.
That’s what globalization is. Debt for consumption. Have you ever wondered how it’s possible for a capitalist country to have free trade with a communist country, even though commies do not participate in the free market? The answer - IT CAN’T.
You have to hand it to Papandreou for at least trying to give his people a say in their destiny, rather than cramming bailouts down their throats the way America’s Congress did to us.
Greek debt referendum: Bad for economy, but good for democracy
The shocking news of a Greek debt referendum this week has prompted European leaders to hold an emergency meeting today ahead of the G20 summit in Cannes, France.
By Michael Steininger, Correspondent / November 2, 2011
Pedestrians pass a plaque of a Greek one-drachma coin, which was replaced by the euro in 2002, outside Athens City Hall, on Wednesday. Greek Prime Minister George Papandreou will try to win over irate European leaders hours after persuading his cabinet to back a hugely-controversial referendum on the debt-crippled country’s latest rescue package.
EU leaders are reportedly “irritated” and “annoyed” with Greek Prime Minister George Papandreou, who shocked his European colleagues and global markets by announcing a referendum on the latest EU bailout plan for his country.
But those not directly involved in bailout negotiations seem to agree on two things: The Greek call for a referendum is good for democracy although it is, at least in the short term, potentially bad for the economy.
“I welcome the referendum,” says Hans-Peter Burghof, chair of the banking and finance department at the University of Hohenheim. “It’s a reminder of the democratic basics that organize European societies. But since we have no date for the referendum and no clear idea what exactly it will ask, it throws overboard the whole schedule for the Greek bailout. We simply have no idea what’s going to happen next.”
…
Perhaps it’s true that Papandreou’s motives include a desire to save his hide politically - but even so the referendum is a good thing. Plus, it’s amusing to watch Merkel and Sarkozy scramble.
The fact that so many are taking the time to weigh the pros an cons of the referendum vis a vis the economy - well, that’s a little more disturbing. Sacrifice freedom for growth? Really?
Growth? Whose growth? There certainly won’t be any growth in Greece for years (if not decades) while the Banksters stripmine their pound of flesh from it while the Greeks live under the austerity programs.
To save his hide physically as well. Power to the people, yo.
Consider home swap in tough market
By Polyana da Costa • Bankrate.com
After spending two years trying to sell her Florida home, Pam Farley decided it was time for a new strategy. She quit looking for a buyer and went after sellers who were interested in trading homes with her. A few months later, she signed the closing documents and swapped her house in Sarasota for a house in New Mexico.
“Nobody has to feel stuck if they can’t sell their homes,” she says. “There are a lot of options if you are willing to trade.”
How it works
A home swap is not as complicated as it first sounds, says Naumov.
“It’s just that instead of one transaction you have two transactions happening at the same time — one selling your house and a second buying the other party’s house,” he says.
Simply put, swapping properties is like selling your home to a person and buying another home from that same person, ideally on the same day.
http://www.bankrate.com/finance/real-estate/home-swap-tough-market-1.aspx - -
With a realtor’s help, of course!
How about a home swap + a wife swap (a two-fer)?
You should have rented Bob.
Ew, Bob is gross and nasty.
To the HBB
Yea though I walk through the valley of Deadbeats, I will fear no evil: for Thou art with me; Thy rod and Thy staff they comfort me.
“A new broom sweeps clean, but the old brush knows all the corner$.”
Irish Proverb
(x1 of me mothers favorites)
In stitches with the Socialistas
So let’s say you’re an American living in Brazil and you have private, low deductable medical/dental/mental/acupuncture/homeopathic health insurance costing $148 dollars a month but you cut yourself on a rusty piece of metal on a Sunday which is your doctor’s day off. You could go to your private hospital, which is a 30 min subway, ride or as your Brazilian friend tells you, you can walk 5 blocks to the 24-hour free health care center.
Being a staunch capitalist and so proud of the American health-care system that provides excellent care to over half of Americans, you don’t want anything to do with Commie medicine but your Brazilian Bolshevist friend tells you to chill and follow him to the “Karl Marx” free clinic. So you go.
You know it’s going take hours and hours of dealing with Socialist red tape but you hand your Brazilian green card to the receptionist and you notice a pretty nurse sitting by her just like she’s taking a left-wing break. 30 seconds later you get your card back and she tells you go into a nurses office where an insanely hot nurse looks at your cut and says it’s not an emergency so you’ll have to take a seat where you see a screen saying the wait time is about 24 min. The waiting room is about 1/3 full and looks like any American hospital/clinic waiting room except the language is funny. Looking around you notice a Federal Ministry of Health logo on the wall. Great. You know anything that the government’s involved in is going to a clusterf#$$ but then you also notice a sign with the State Secretary of Heath logo and you feel a little better because you know there is some kind of States Rights thing involved. Then you see a “health is strength” and “healthcare for the people” sign and you almost throw up.
As you are waiting you see all types of left-wing propaganda signs like. “Wash your hands often when you are sick” and “Sneeze into your elbow”. Great, you think, the mind control is already started as you look around expecting to see a picture Che Guevara. All of a sudden a messed up dude get’s led in and he gets to cut in front of everyone and you notice the screen changes from a 24 minute wait to a 32 min wait. So this is the dreaded “medical rationing” that you’ve been told of. Now you have to wait 8 more minutes. This is the cruel face of Socialism staring you in the face.
The 32-minute wait seems like decades but they finally call your name after about 20 minutes and you’re directed to an examination room. You get a tetanus shot, your cut cleaned and some stitches and bandages by a government paid doctor who you know would rather be patching up Cuban soldiers in Angola. He gives you some free pain pills and as you are leaving you ask him if they will send the bill to you house but he laughs at you and says everything is paid for by taxes because in Brazil, basic healthcare is a right that was given in the 1988 constitution. By now, you are totally confused so you thank him but you still have to call him a commie, government union goon as you’re walking out the door.
Yup.
Sound just like a clueless Fox news watching ingrate.
My god, man! What a horrible experience! You’re lucky to have survived your brush with socialist medicine. You sure they didn’t implant a chip?
And it was 5 blocks away? WTH? I don’t even have a 7-11 5 blocks from my house. The closest place open on a Sunday is a pricey for profit “Urgent Care” center that’s a 10 minute car ride from the house. The ER is 15 minutes away. And even with “good insurance” you are looking at a $50-100 copay at the Urgent Care center.
I went to the ER 2 years ago, when I had a pain in my chest (turned out to be gall stones).
As I lay on the bed in the room in the ER they carted in a portable cash register into my room and offered me a 10% discount on my copay if I paid right there and then.
And the ambulance ride was $1400 and I had to pay the deductible ($500).
Our system is utterly unsustainable. Access to healthcare as it works today will be but a memory by the end of the decade for all but the wealthy.
Yup. The medico-insurance establishment should/could come up with a solution, but being part of the problem pays better, at least currently.
We’re either going to have a single payer/Socialist system, or a crap/no system for the 99%, and “spare no expense” treatment of the 1%ers. With government medical research paid for by the 99%ers, researching cures that only the 1%ers can pay for.
“Medical Tourism” is a term you are going to be hearing more, if things progress as they currently are. Build a state of the art clinic in Mexico next to a major airport, hire Blackwater to provide security from the narcos, make a deal for discounted airfare with one of the low cost airlines to run shuttles to the clinic, and present a plan to major employers to set up free/low cost clinics for the run of the mill stuff near their employees, and fly major cases to Mexico. Maybe even buy a half dozen “Air Ambulances” to transport emergency cases.
Yeah, the participants will have to forego some of their legal “rights”. Big deal, if you can get decent treatment at a lot lower cost to everyone.
A solution can be designed, but won’t be, because the medical and insurance establishments like things the way they are.
One word, Lawyers.
I was checking the lawyers per-capita in OECD countries. Of course, we are #1 by miles. We suck not only at health care, also at education, and so on and so forth. What’s the #1 reason behind all these? I am thoroughly convinced that it’s the lawyers. We spend way too much money on lawyers, processing and administration. The latter two are many times the direct result of the new laws and the lawyers gaming the system.
If tort reform is such a savior of the health care industry, then where is the bill that the R’s wrote and passed to reform tort? After all, they control the House now, right?
Tort reform in Texas and California have not lead to lower medical costs to the average voter.
…yet have denied many victims of malpractice just reward.
Has it led to less A-hole lawyer commercials? If is has, then I am for tort reform. Florida is lousy with them.
Nope. At least not the last time I recently watched.
In the US even getting rid of the large medical malpractice settlements doesn’t get rid of the overtesting because doctors are allowed to own equity stakes in the testing facilities. Every time they recommend a test, they get part of the profit. Same for procedures at the for-profit ambulatory surgical center.
My friends who are retired docs in Canada thought that was the most unethical thing they had ever heard.
“American ethics” is now an oxymoron.
You didn’t need the shot or the pills. A simple alcohol rub and bandage would have been fine.
You didn’t need the shot or the pills. A simple alcohol rub and bandage would have been fine.
No, I needed the shot, pills and stitches. I needed the shot because it’s been 20 years since my last tetanus shot and someday I really might NEED it but then it would be too late. I’ve used some of them and I’m sure I will “need” pain pills again someday too.
As far as the alcohol part….. I’m all for it.
And the (24 hour Brazilian urgent care center) was 5 blocks away?
I just got lucky on that. They are not all 5 blocks away but the fact that the waiting room was only 1/3 full might indicate that there are enough of these 24 hour urgent care centers at least in Rio.
There were ambulances parked outside so this was something like a 24 hour emergency room/urgent care center but also serving people with cuts and colds too. I was impressed with the service and that type of place even existing. Other than my address and green-card number there was no paperwork or red-tape at all and I’m not even Brazilian but I am a permanent resident. A tourist or an illegal alien would not receive this “free” treatment in Brazil I have read.
Just having this type of facility in the USA would take care of what percentage of our health-care needs? 30%? 50%?
There is a facility of that type in my town, attached to the hospital. It’s closed.
Those types of operations exist in the US usually as part of some sort of charity/non profit org. They usually have huge waiting lists to see anyone and they usually charge a “sliding rate” depending on your financial situation. I had a coworker who took her family to one of those (she was on an HD plan).
my son needed stitches twice last year.
Urgent Care - $30 co pay - 4 stitches on his head
E Room - $2200 - glue on the back of his head
I guess it depend son you rinsurance. On our current plan the E Room and Urgent care have the same copay (I just switched jobs and have a non HD plan again)
Hilariously well written :-). Mind if I post this (with credit) elsewhere?
Hilariously well written :-). Mind if I post this (with credit) elsewhere?
Thank you. Thanks for the comments and compliments people. Sure you can re-post and I fixed a lot of the errors below (I was in a hurry) and I changed the ending a bit. And the pain pills were generic. (Sorry about the corrected, slightly changed re-post)
In stitches with the Socialistas
So let’s say you’re an American living in Brazil and you have private, low deductible medical/dental/mental/acupuncture/homeopathic health insurance costing $148 dollars a month but you cut yourself on a rusty piece of metal on a Sunday which is your doctor’s day off. You could go to your private hospital which is a 30 min subway ride, or as your Brazilian friend tells you, you can walk 5 blocks to the 24-hour free health-care center.
Being a staunch capitalist and so proud of the American health-care system that provides excellent care to over half of Americans, you don’t want anything to do with commie medicine but your Brazilian Bolshevist friend tells you to chill-out and follow him to the “Karl Marx” free clinic. So you go.
You just know it’s going take hours and hours dealing with socialist RED tape but you hand your Brazilian green card to the receptionist and you notice a pretty nurse sitting behind the desk looking like she’s taking a union break. 30 seconds later you get your card back and you’re told to go into a nurse’s office where an insanely hot nurse looks at your cut and says it’s not an emergency so you’ll have to take a seat where you see a screen saying the wait time is about 24 min.
The waiting room is about 1/3 full and looks like any American hospital/clinic waiting room except the language is funny. Looking around, you notice a Federal Ministry of Health placard on the wall. Great. You know anything that the government’s involved in is going to be a clusterf#@% but then you also notice a sign with the State Secretary of Heath logo and you feel a little better because you know there’s some kind of States’ Rights thing involved. Then you see a “health is strength” and “healthcare for the people” sign and you almost throw up.
As you are waiting you see all types of left-wing propaganda signs like “Wash your hands often when you’re sick” and “Sneeze into your elbow”. Just great….the mind control has already started as you look around expecting to see a picture of Che Guevara. All of a sudden a messed up dude is led in and he gets to cut in front of everyone and you notice the screen changes from a 24 minute wait to a 32 min wait. So this is the dreaded “medical rationing” that you’ve been told of. Now you have to wait 8 more minutes. This is the cruel reality of godless socialism staring you in the face.
The 32-minute wait seems like decades but they finally call your name after about 20 minutes and you’re directed to an examination room. You get a tetanus shot, your cut cleaned and some stitches and bandages applied by a government paid doctor who you just know would rather be patching up Cuban soldiers in Angola.
The doctor then gives you some free pain pills and as you are leaving you ask him if they will send the bill to your house but he laughs at you and says everything is paid for by taxes because in Brazil, basic health care is a Brazilian right that was confirmed in the 1988 constitution. “Isn’t that the way it is in America?” he asks you. By now you are totally confused so you mumble something about Blue Cross/Blue Shield and you thank him but you’re still tempted to call him a commie, government union-goon as you’re walking out the door. But for some reason……you don’t.
He gives you some free pain pills
Do they MegaMedical-Pharmaceutical-Indu$trial-Complex-Inc. name-brand logo’$ on ‘em?
Great snap-shot story of “Evil” foreign-$ocialist healthcare service-for-citizen/peons, Tankxs Rio.
RioAmBr, that post is the funniest thing I read here in a while.
It is so so funny how everyone talks about the horror of universal health care and how you have to wait for days to see a doctor. Of course this is what you hear on the MSM shows, interspersed by big-pharma advertisements.
I am proud to live in the only industrialised nation on the planet (other than South Africa) with no universal health care.
And to think that we could put a horrible system in place like thosed damned Canadians where you need to wat three years to see a doctor. Well, I’ll tell you what. I’ve never heard this to be the case. My housemate is from Edmonton, I have a friend over on Vancouver Island that I visit on occasion - both requring surgery and ongoing medication - and I know many other Canadians (I live in a border town). None of them have ever experienced any of the horrors told on the MSM. Granted, there are some clinics in BFE Alberta that are understaffed, but the US has the same issue in filling positions in rural hospitals. In the US, they just close the hospital down.
Yes, the US healthcare system is on an unsustainable path. The main goal of my doctor friends is to get out of the profession.
If the government offered a public option or single payer or similar system (for example, as a gov employee/contractor), would your doctor friends stay in the profession?
I don’t have an answer to that question. But hopefully this would entail less administration than the 01current system. You look in a doctors’ office at all the staff required to keep up with the paperwork, filing, etc. I’ve read that roughly 40% of the cost of healthcare is related to administration and complying with the needs of the insurance companies. Compare this to the Canadian side, where the doctor’s small staff, or even the actual doctor, fills in a code, and sends the form off to Ottawa. Minimal paperwork.
Another item is the litigation in healthcare. A small percentage of the cost of healthcare is actually the award handed out in lawsuits. But there are a ton of tests that doctors need to perform strictly as a CYA measure, even though it is widely known that most of these tests are unnecessary.
People come to the hospital with the expectation of miracles being performed after they’ve lived horribly unhealthy and sedentary lives. It’s not the case, and the doctors, given the increasingly reduced constraints that they are given to work with are even up against great struggles.
One old time GP lamented how he is expected to continuously increase his productivity and can spend less and less time with patients that he’s known for years. Fortunately he’s close to retirement (or already has – I haven’t spoken to him for five years or so). Actually, they’re not even called patients anymore – they use some less personal term .
There are some things in society that should not be profit driven, and health care is one of them.
But to answer your questions, I think that anything is better than the current system. And a anesthesiologist friend is staying with me this weekend, so it will be interesting to hear his answer to this question, although he is already offshoring his assets, so he is a bit jaded.
I’ve been a health care provider in military and now private clinical practice.
It is and was shocking to discover how much administrative burden private practices carry. Primarily this involves private insurances including the absurd medicare advantage plans, not government regulations or medicare per se. Every company has their own rules, requirements, coverages, co-pays and the list goes on an on. This is just on the practice side. The burden on the patient to know their coverages, etc is also quite large. Dealing with these private insurance issues requires a large staff and takes many minutes/hours a day from the clinician to deal with the absurd red tape.
Military practice was not perfect but it certainly was easier for the clinicians in many respects and better for the patients; more patient-focused rather than getting them out the door. We always had the admin guys hounding us to see more patients and they attempted various ways to count every minute of our day through coding etc. Ridiculous, impossible and counterproductive. By nature admins see only dollar signs and not quality care. They must be fought tooth and nail but this is not a private/govt thing - it’s universal as they must find ways to justify their own positions. The push for computerized health records and the new coding paradigm ICD-10 next year are simply attempts to track performance of the clinician as well as the patient.
would your doctor friends stay in the profession?
And do what? Work at Old Navy?
That’s a good question.
One (ED Phys) is looking to launch a medical device company (that’s how I met him). Another (the anesthesiologist) is looking to launch something too, but overseas. A third is retiring (I believe), Another (OB/GYN) is generally happy but don’t get him started on the hospital management making more than he does while they spend days on the golf course and he’s working sixteen hour days up to his elbows in placenta. At least his malpractice is paid for by the (teaching) hospital.
It was funny one time we were rounding Cape Flattery in the anesthesiologist’s HR46 on a passage to Portland and I suggested that we blow town and set a course for the South Pacific. Fortunately I forgot my passport or he may have acted on my suggestion. He said “I have enough water and food on board.”
Just a question.
How many people in Brazil have free Medicare scooters?
How many years will Brazil pay to keep you semi-alive while hooked up to machines?
How many new body parts will Brazil install?
The kind of care you received is cheap. We’d have it too if we didn’t pay for all the other stuff.
I think that’s Rio’s point. The Brazilians (and everyone else for that matter) has a system that prioritizes in a way to be more efficient.
Well my initial thought was how did these super-expensive scooters get covered under Medicare? I wonder if intense lobbying by the medical device industry had anything to do with this? Most of the people I see on these are horribly overweight, not necessarily elderly or sick.
And I do hope that our system is broken enough that I do not need to be kept-semi-alive for years to die without dignity. Again, don’t get my friend going about how selfish family members insist on spending a couple hundred thousand dollars to keep someone at death’s door alive so they can fly family members in from around the US to say their last goodbyes.
And about installing body parts, probably about the same amount they install on my friend with a prosthesis living in Boulder. Zero. He’s got full coverage, well except for the leg he lost back in 1990. Those damned pre-existing conditions.
Face it, our system is broken.
Well my initial thought was how did these super-expensive scooters get covered under Medicare? I wonder if intense lobbying by the medical device industry had anything to do with this? Most of the people I see on these are horribly overweight, not necessarily elderly or sick.
It seems that the Tucson Scooter User Group has a weight requirement. As in, you have to be at least 100 pounds overweight before you can get your Medicare-financed wheels.
Most of the elderly/infirm people I see in my neighborhood (there are a lot of older people here) who are thin or average weight use walkers rather than scooters. It takes them a while to get where they are going, but they get there eventually.
Well…to be realistic it’s the weight that really pushes you over the edge into needing one in most circumstances. I saw elderly people over in Poland with some pretty big disabilities getting by with just the crutches with the arm-hold type braces. But they were strong and they weren’t very fat. Over here they’d have been in the scooter or bedridden a long time ago. And I say that as a person who is scooter-bound someday if I don’t get better control of my eating habits :-).
UGH! This is one of my pet peeves. If we treated our dog or cat like some people treat grandma and grandpa we would be charged with animal cruelty. And the whole religious stance on the issue makes me seethe.
If someone will die without being connected to a machine, then obviously god isn’t interested in keeping them alive. That whole Terry Schiavo(sp?) issue made me sick.
Can someone explain to me what happened in the stock market on Monday, particularly with regard to SPY? It looks like it gapped down on Monday, but charts show some trading activity about 1:20 EDT that filled the gap for a moment. What the hell was that?
It was two ban’s mom.
The Free $hit Army’s fundamental demand is to retire at 45 years old. If that means me or my kids entering into debt slavery for 30 years to pay them a grossly inflated price for their rapidly depreciating house, then so be it.
Some of the other demands by the Free $hit Army?
Some of the other demands by the Free $hit Army?
It is tough to get a comprehensive picture
What I have seen first hand and in the news:
Free college and a forgiveness of all college loans
Free health care
Forgiveness of most mortgages
Even more insane salaries/benefits/pensions for public unions
Higher Taxes
Bigger Government
Leave the current administration alone – he is trying his best
I recall seeing pictures of some wackos with some pretty unrealistic demands at tea party rallies, too. Doesn’t mean they represented the majority there, even though that’s what the media seemed to want me to think.
2Bananana - has it all wrong.
I believe it exhibits how effective the MSM has been at distorting this movement.
He’s got housing right. The rest is questionable.
OWS is all about bailouts for Wall St, while ignoring main st. $3 T war, then rebuilding Iraq, while USA crumbles. Priorities and a new world order.
“Forgiveness of most mortgages”
“He’s got housing right.”
These deadbeats, they won`t pay
If it ain`t free then they won`t stay
With a knick, knack, paddy whack,
They don`t want a loan
These deadbeats all want free homes
lmao. BRAVO!
I disagree with 5 of the 23 spin-off points that have come from the NY OWS. I do not disagree with their basic message. They are correct that it was Wall Street that caused the problem (through government corruption), but they are not correct that the foreclosures are the problem. The foreclosures are the solution IMO.
However, I realize that the average person can not be expected to understand something that complicated. Foreclosures are just the topic du jour. That is not the crux of the movement.
Let us know when it equals the TRILLION DOLLAR bailout Wall St. got.
Imagine, right in Cheney-$hrub’s $EC’s crissy “The Enforcer!” cox’s very Newport Beach bayside backyard, …he was this [.] to catchin’ ‘em. crissy musta lost a lot of sleep over it.
MedCap had lured more than a thousand investors with promises of safe investments in medical receivables, billings for hospitals and doctor visits.
In fact, a court-appoint receiver determined, most of the receivables on MedCap’s books did not exist. The company plowed investors’ money into several far more adventurous projects, including a yacht named the “Home Stretch”, several debt-ridden hospitals, a medical-nuclear reactor and a movie about a Mexican Little League team.
MedCap boss charged with tax evasion:
October 20th, 2011, by Ronald Campbell
Joseph J. Lampariello, one of the two principals at Medical Capital Holdings when it allegedly perpetrated a billion-dollar fraud, has been charged with failing to file federal tax returns for five years.
The criminal information was filed in U.S. District Court in Santa Ana last week, at least 19 months after federal prosecutors began investigating MedCap.
The other principal at Tustin-based MedCap, Sidney M. Field of Villa Park, has not been criminally charged.
The criminal information alleges that Lampariello, of Newport Beach and Huntington, New York, did not file income tax returns from 2004 through 2008. During those years, while he was employed as MedCap’s president and chief operating officer, Lampariello earned $6,177,114, the government claimed.
The Securities and Exchange Commission sued Lampariello and Field in July 2009, alleging that they ran a massive “Ponzi-like” scheme.
Stewart is a genius!
http://www.hulu.com/watch/295469/the-daily-show-with-jon-stewart-indecision-2012-ruh-roh-edition
Despite 50-year low interest rates, the Fed’s apparent plan is to push rates even lower and hold them there until the bubble returns. Good luck!
Bernanke Housing Rebound May Hinge on Access to Refinancing
November 02, 2011, 12:36 PM EDT
By Scott Lanman and Caroline Salas Gage
(Updates markets in 11th paragraph.)
Nov. 1 (Bloomberg) — Federal Reserve Chairman Ben S. Bernanke can’t go it alone when it comes to reviving the U.S. housing market.
Fed policy makers, who started a two-day meeting today, are considering buying mortgage-backed securities to push down borrowing costs and help homeowners refinance their debt. That would reduce monthly payments, freeing up cash for other purchases that could spur the economy and reduce unemployment, Fed Governor Daniel Tarullo said Oct. 20.
Such an effort would save homeowners $60 billion to $80 billion a year, or about 0.5 percent of gross domestic product, so long as the Obama administration succeeds in helping homeowners through a stepped-up refinancing aid plan, said Joseph Gagnon, a former Fed economist. Should the program fail, Fed asset-buying would probably provide homeowners less than half its potential savings, said Gagnon, a senior fellow at the Peterson Institute for International Economics in Washington.
“The Achilles’ heel of the Fed’s efforts so far has been that the monetary-policy transmission has not worked as they would like because of, in large part, the inability of consumers to get loans” for homes and other purchases, said Ward McCarthy, chief financial economist at Jefferies & Co. in New York.
…
“The Achilles’ heel of the Fed’s efforts so far has been that the monetary-policy transmission has not worked as they would like because of, in large part, the inability of consumers to get loans” for homes and other purchases, said Ward McCarthy, chief financial economist at Jefferies & Co. in New York.
And what if people just aren’t interested in taking out loans? Maybe they’re paying down debt. Or maybe they’ve finally extricated themselves and don’t want to get into new debt.
That’s just it
What’s the best investment you can make now.
You can park your money in a bank and earn nothing, or a treasury and earn next to nothing.
How much can you make paying of credit card debt, the school loan, the house.
Answer a lot more.
Retired people with any money who still own a home and want to stay there should definitely pay it off.
“And what if people just aren’t interested in taking out loans?”
According to the Fed, that would mean interest rates aren’t low enough yet — even though they are currently as close to zero as ever in my lifetime.
They are going to hoist themselves on their own petard.
One of the things I love about this blog is the intriguing offers found in the top and side bars, as well as the middle and bottom of the page. Don’t you guys agree? So enticing.
I think the juxtaposition of those intriguing offers and the content of this blog is hilarious. Just goes to show you that “context-based” Internet advertising is still in its infancy.
@b-hamster.
South Africa DOES have universal healthcare.
oops. thanks for clarifying…
November 1, 2011, 1:02 PM ET
Hotline Now Open for Foreclosure Complaints
By Alan Zibel and Nick Timiraos
Bank regulators and the mortgage industry have launched a complaint process to reach out to more than 4 million homeowners to find and compensate any who were harmed by deficiencies in banks’ foreclosure operations.
Bank regulators in April ordered 14 large mortgage servicing firms to fix problems in their foreclosure-handling processes. The Office of the Comptroller of the Currency and Federal Reserve required these companies to hire independent consultants to fix those problems. The industry has now started sending letters to around 4.5 million borrowers who were in some stage of foreclosure in 2009 or 2010.
Consumers who want to have their foreclosure cases reviewed must submit their information by April 30, though it remained unclear how much they will be compensated, or whether they would be required to waive their right to sue their mortgage company to receive compensation.
The regulators and mortgage servicers have also launched a toll free number 1-888-952-9105 and a website.
The affected mortgage servicers include the nation’s largest banks, such as Bank of America Corp., Wells Fargo & Co., J.P. Morgan Chase & Co. and Citigroup Inc.
The review process announced Tuesday is one of several efforts to address revelations that surfaced a year ago over banks’ use of so-called robo-signers, bank employees who signed off on huge numbers of legal foreclosure filings daily and falsely claimed to have personally reviewed each case.
Banking industry officials insist that the review is likely to find few borrowers who were harmed financially. But regulators outlined several kinds of errors that could have impacted borrowers and require compensation.
Those include: homeowners who lost their homes to foreclosure even though they were protected by bankruptcy court, borrowers who were charged improper fees or those who lost their homes even though they were in the process of getting a loan modification to lower their monthly payments.
Regulators are also seeking to find cases in which active-duty members of the military were thrust into foreclosure in violation of a federal law that bans such actions.
Democrats on Capitol Hill and consumer advocates have questioned the regulators’ decision to allow banks to hire their own consultants to conduct foreclosure reviews. Rep. Maxine Waters (D. Calif.) said regulators are “putting the banks in the driver’s seat” in finding and compensating consumers harmed by shoddy foreclosure practices.
“They’re allowing servicers to hire entry-level employees to make complex legal determinations on whether foreclosures were in accordance with state and federal law,” she said in a statement Tuesday.
…
Will they subtract all those free months with no payment from the “harm”?
Foreclosures: Was yours illegal? Get it reviewed.
Foreclosures affecting some 4 million homeowners are eligible for review. But the new federal order means that the lenders will be reviewing their own foreclosures for mistakes.
By Derek Kravitz, AP Economics Writer / November 2, 2011
WASHINGTON
About 4 million homeowners who may have been improperly foreclosed upon in 2009 and 2010 are getting an opportunity to have their cases reviewed. Whether they will be reimbursed is up to the same lenders who are accused of moving too swiftly to seize their homes.
The Office of the Comptroller of the Currency said Monday that mortgage services will begin sending out letters this month that ask borrowers if they want their case reviewed.
The nation’s 14 largest mortgage servicers — including Citibank, Bank of America, JPMorgan Chase and Wells Fargo — were ordered to offer to review cases after the government found that some rushed the foreclosureprocess without carefully reviewing documents.
…
“without carefully reviewing documents.”
More like ‘without having any idea where the documents might be’.
MARKETS
NOVEMBER 2, 2011, 5:02 P.M. ET
Greece Faces Grilling at G-20
Fears of Political Chaos Tank Global Markets as Europe’s Bailout Plan
By MARCUS WALKER And ALKMAN GRANITSAS
Greek Prime Minister George Papandreou, fighting for political survival at home, faced a grilling from euro-zone leaders over his plan to put Greece’s international bailout to a referendum.
At a meeting in Cannes, France, late Wednesday ahead of the summit of the Group of 20 leading economies, the euro zone’s two most powerful politicians, German Chancellor Angela Merkel and French President Nicolas Sarkozy, were expected to warn Mr. Papandreou to keep the bailout plan on track.
The message for the Greek leader, say German and French officials: Any referendum must take place as soon as possible so that the bailout plan agreed to in October can go ahead. And Greece won’t get more-generous bailout terms than those already on offer.
Euro-zone authorities are worried that banks won’t take part in a planned restructuring of Greece’s bond debt while the outcome of a possible referendum remains uncertain. Under pressure to move fast, Greek officials now suggest the vote could be held in early December.
Mr. Papandreou stunned Europe and financial markets this week by calling for a plebiscite on the latest, €130 billion (around $178 billion) rescue package for Greece, which is tied to even-deeper austerity policies in the economically suffering country as well as the restructuring of Greek bonds.
Analysts say the referendum idea was a Hail Mary pass by an increasingly friendless premier, aimed at gaining a popular mandate for his painful overhauls of the Greek state and economy, and putting his opponents on the spot.
But if voters spurn the bailout deal, Greece could face national bankruptcy and exit from the euro, while leaving Europe confronting an almighty financial panic and an economic slump.
The enormous stakes, and the high risk of a “no” vote amid Greeks’ anger about steep government cuts and tax hikes, have triggered a revolt by some lawmakers in Mr. Papandreou’s ruling Socialist party.
…
wat?
I can not believe the audacity of an elected representative who DARES to ask the citizens of his country what they want him to do. The nerve! Why, I think the international community ought to really grill that guy. Really grill im.
But if voters spurn the bailout deal, Greece could face national bankruptcy and exit from the euro
They say that like it’s a bad thing.
Meanwhile, the Brits are crowing like roosters over not joining the Eurozone. But then again, the Brits enjoy being one-up on the rest of Europe.
OCC’s Foreclosure Reviews Largely a Sham
By: David Dayen Wednesday November 2, 2011 11:44 am
What are we to make of this nice-sounding article by Brady Dennis about a “foreclosure review” for borrowers?