February 22, 2012

The Way Things Were Meant To Be

The Longmont Times Call reports from Colorado. “What can you buy for $8.5 million? How about a 12,000-square-foot home on Arrowleaf Court in Boulder? It’s listed at $8.5 million. You’d have to come up with $12 million to get into a home for sale on Rozena Court in Hygiene. Get $9 million together and you’ve got yourself a farmhouse that’s currently for sale on Pike Road just west of Longmont. Sounds like a lot of money — until you consider that NewMark Merrill Mountain States came up with $8.5 million and got itself a whole shopping mall.”

“Scott Franklund of Legendary Properties ticked off several homes for sale in the area whose cost approaches what NewMark paid for Twin Peaks Mall. What makes the deal especially surprising is that former owner Panattoni Development Co. paid $33.6 million for the 75-acre, 650,000-square-foot mall in 2007, he said. That’s roughly a 75 percent drop in price. ‘You just don’t see that,’ Franklund said.”

From KJCT in Colorado. “Colorado Springs was recently listed as one of the housing markets where renting is actually cheaper than buying. But here in Grand Junction, some realtors argue just the opposite; saying buying a home is much more affordable in the long run. ‘I don’t know how someone can say it’s less expensive to actually rent. We’re at sixty year lows right now, so that unto itself allows a person to actually buy more or have more purchasing power then they would even last year,’ Brian Donaldson, with Bray Real Estate, said.”

The East Valley Tribune in Arizona. “Agents’ optimism has grown for five months in a row as a result of seeing more buyers and a shrinking number of available homes, said Bob Bemis, CEO of the Arizona Regional Multiple Listing Service. The news is great for sellers who’ve had trouble unloading their homes - but there’s a downside for buyers. ‘They’ll be surprised if they go looking for anything other than a foreclosure,’ Bemis said. ‘If they’re looking for traditional houses, there will be bidding wars. Not two or three, but eight or 10 contracts on the property because we have so few houses in that price range or quality range.’”

“For the first time since the home-buying frenzy that peaked in 2005, agent Christine Loschiavo has been advising clients to bid above the asking price. It’s becoming harder for traditional buyers to compete with investors and also Canadians looking for second homes, she said. ‘Chandler is the worst place to try to buy a house right now for a good price,’ she said. ‘I have to tell my buyers to overbid.’”

The Casa Grande Dispatch in Arizona. “Like a roller coaster ride, Arizona’s housing market reached a peak and then descended over the last decade. And the areas that grew the fastest, like Pinal County, have been hit the hardest. ‘During the housing boom in the mid-2000s, the value of homes in the Casa Grande area increased by almost 50 percent,’ said Debbie Yost, broker of REMAX/Casa Grande Yost Group. But as the housing bubble burst, values plummeted and many homeowners who purchased during that period were stuck with pricey mortgages and high interest rates. During 2011 alone, more than 2,200 homeowners in Pinal County and 325 in Casa Grande went through foreclosure. For many, it has seemed like the only option.”

“‘People have been giving up and walking away,’ said Yost, who has been selling real estate in Casa Grande since 1980, ‘but now there are reasons not to. Each situation is different, but now there is a road map and a number of options.’ The other options for those behind on their payments, as the panel will discuss, are refinancing, modifying their loans, short-selling or deeding-in-lieu of foreclosure. ‘There’s this idea that it’s almost impossible to short-sell,’ Debbie said. ‘That’s not true.’”

The Arizona Republic. “Verrado opened amid a housing rush in 2004 but soon plunged into a downturn of historic proportions. In the years that followed, executives and planners at DMB, the developer that built this community, came to realize that the old approach to master-planned communities would have to change. For them, Verrado was the turning point. Nearly everything there today tells a story about the way things were meant to be before the crash.”

“The changes all come back to the 2,000 homes that encircle Verrado’s Main Street: When the community opened, DMB estimated it would sell at least three times that many homes by 2012. Instead, today, it is a town, but a far smaller town. At least 6,000 vacant acres sit unobtrusively outside the developed area,”

“In 2004 amid a marketing blitz. people flocked to Verrado during the last two weekends of January to try to be one of the community’s first homebuyers. They filled out information cards that were placed in giant fish bowls in hopes their names would be drawn. But by 2006, it was clear something was off-track in the metro Phoenix housing market. By 2007, metro Phoenix builders had begun walking away from deals and giving their lots back to lenders.”

“DMB principal Mark Sklar said people ask him often if this real-estate crash is as bad as the last one. ‘I have to laugh and say it’s about 30 times worse. During the last crash, GM and all the major lenders weren’t failing at the same time,’ he said.”

The Daily Courier in Arizona. “Kathi Dollarhide simply wants her Yavapai Hills property to be somebody’s home. That goal appears within reach for Dollarhide, who expects to sell her former retirement home through the short-sale process. ‘I want to see someone living in the house. That’s what it was built for,’ she said. ‘It was never an investment. It wasn’t meant to sit there until the market turns around and some bank decides, ‘OK, now we can sell it.’”

“The short-sale option makes Dollarhide one of the lucky ones. This past week, state and federal officials announced a $25 billion deal to settle possible state charges over allegations of improper foreclosures. Marshall Vest, director of the Economic and Business Research Center at the Eller College of Management at the University of Arizona, believes the settlement will help some homeowners. Vest said the settlement will help keep people in their homes rather than have to walk away from their properties.”

“But Vest agrees with the ProPublica argument that the settlement won’t help millions of homeowners. ‘There’s still a lot of people who won’t get help,’ he said. ‘The amount of dollars just aren’t big enough to help and, of course, not everybody would qualify.’”

From KTNV in Nevada. “Home values in Southern Nevada have fallen 65 percent in six years. Two out of three homeowners are now underwater. Shauntele Harless is one of them. She’s moving out of her home while she tries to get Bank of America to agree to a short sale of $80,000. Harless says she tried to work with the bank. ‘I even tried to pay $260,000 for it just as long as they would lock my rates and they wouldn’t do it,’ Harless said.”

The Las Vegas Business Press in Nevada. “Economic analyst Jeremy Aguero calls it the ‘three-finger salute,’ hitting the control-alt-delete keys to reset real estate values in Las Vegas to current market conditions. Forget about the peak. ‘Nobody sober would ever suggest we’re going to get back to the peak,’ Aguero said at Preview Las Vegas, an economic forum presented by the Las Vegas Chamber of Commerce.”

“Las Vegas homeowners have lost $91 billion in equity, roughly $112,000 a home, since the market took a dive from 2006, the principal of research firm Applied Analysis estimated. Aguero said legislators need to rethink some of the laws such as Assembly Bill 284, an attempt to stop foreclosures by requiring banks to prove they have proper documentation.”

“‘Why would they do that? At the end of the day, if you’re not paying your mortgage, you do not get to live in the house for free,’ Aguero said. ‘With the robo-signing, the banks probably didn’t handle it well, I’m the first to admit. But how do you take it so far that the bank can’t foreclose if you’re not paying?’”




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41 Comments »

Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-02-22 08:18:29

“For the first time since the home-buying frenzy that peaked in 2005, agent Christine Loschiavo has been advising clients to bid above the asking price. It’s becoming harder for traditional buyers to compete with investors and also Canadians looking for second homes, she said. ‘Chandler is the worst place to try to buy a house right now for a good price,’ she said. ‘I have to tell my buyers to overbid.’”

Americans shouldn’t even think about buying until the Australian and Chinese investor crazes end, which should happen around the time their respective domestic housing bubbles pop.

Comment by Patrick
2012-02-22 09:40:40

Comment

Agreed. Our Canadian market is frankly defying gravity.

Toronto, despite being down by 5% this year, is still full of hot air!

I made a cash offer on a piece of industrial property last week and got a “respectfully declined” written across the front of it.

Oh well, he was polite ! Or was he ?

With the world’s industry slowing down dramatically now, soon we will wake up to find our Canadian bed has disappeared and we are floating to the ground in a free fall. Or crashing.

Oh wait, it’s an American election year. Times will be good until the election is over.

Comment by polly
2012-02-22 11:11:32

But when should I buy mt Stratford tickets? That is the real question. Meaning, is the CA$ going to take a hit with respect to the US$ in the next few months? Probably not as long as commodities are still going crazy, but I miss my ultra-cheap Canadian vacations…

Comment by Ol'Bubba
2012-02-22 16:31:55

If I recall correctly back in 2001 one greenback exchanged for one and a half loonie.

To put it in perspective, a C$150 per night hotel room would cost you US$100.

A C$30 restaurant tab would cost you US$20.

Last time I looked, the exchange rate was very close to par.

C’est la vie.

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Comment by polly
2012-02-22 17:11:48

Like I said, ultra cheap Canadian vacations. And the weather in early September was usually so amazing.

 
Comment by Blue Skye
2012-02-22 17:43:39

2001 was when I bought one of my dream toys, an ultralight Kevlar canoe, in North Bay. I think the exchange rate was 1.35.

 
Comment by Muggy
2012-02-22 20:40:53

“Like I said, ultra cheap Canadian vacations.”

Ah yes, my UB days in Niagara Falls. Had to cross the border to get the exchange rate and Molson 3.0.

Didn’t always make it across the border.

 
 
Comment by Patrick
2012-02-22 19:24:47

Polly

The Stratford Festival. Nice. Agree that the Canadian dollar at par is a bit of an inconvenience - to our manufacturers who were soooo used to a free ride. Was good for tourism too.

I think the C$ will be at a premium for a long time to come. Your buddy Ben B is responsible with all his free dollars.

Blue Skye - nice to see you were in North Bay boating I presume. On Lake Nipissing ? If so, what did you think of the sudden waves ?

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Comment by Blue Skye
2012-02-22 20:30:58

Tamagami!

 
 
 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-02-23 02:32:37

“…soon we will wake up to find our Canadian bed has disappeared and we are floating to the ground in a free fall. Or crashing.”

Comforting caught for Canadians and Chinese bubble watchers: The recent Japanese and U.S. housing bubble collapse experiences have demonstrated the post-bubble free fall can last much longer than expected — even decades in Japan’s case — and particularly so if government intervention is used in a futile attempt to stop the fall — as in the U.S. case.

So just relax, enjoy life, cook yourself some popcorn, and watch. It is certain to be at least as exciting as watching continents drift or paint dry.

 
 
 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-02-22 08:21:14

“‘Nobody sober would ever suggest we’re going to get back to the peak,’ Aguero said at Preview Las Vegas, an economic forum presented by the Las Vegas Chamber of Commerce.”

Can you believe he said that in the sobriety capital of the U.S.?

 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-02-22 08:23:39

“Las Vegas homeowners have lost $91 billion in equity, roughly $112,000 a home, since the market took a dive from 2006, the principal of research firm Applied Analysis estimated.”

Pretty craptacular!

“Aguero said legislators need to rethink some of the laws such as Assembly Bill 284, an attempt to stop foreclosures by requiring banks to prove they have proper documentation. ‘Why would they do that? At the end of the day, if you’re not paying your mortgage, you do not get to live in the house for free,’ Aguero said. ‘With the robo-signing, the banks probably didn’t handle it well, I’m the first to admit. But how do you take it so far that the bank can’t foreclose if you’re not paying?’”

Change the rules of the game to allow this?

Comment by X-GSfixr
2012-02-22 11:41:30

There is a certain percentage of the population that will never “get it”

All they see is the guy living in the “free house”. They just can’t/won’t get their heads around the fact that these dumbazz bankers have screwed the system up so much, they can’t prove they are the ones legally entitled to foreclose.

Relaxing foreclosure law = Trusting bankers

Hasn’t anyone been paying attention in the past 5 years? If the banksters get a free pass to do what they want, it will be easier for the banks to “legally” steal your house, than it will be for them to steal your $500 beater parked in the driveway.

Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-02-23 02:34:12

Take my beater, please…

 
 
 
Comment by GrizzlyBear
2012-02-22 08:29:11

“Get $9 million together and you’ve got yourself a farmhouse that’s currently for sale on Pike Road just west of Longmont. Sounds like a lot of money — until you consider that NewMark Merrill Mountain States came up with $8.5 million and got itself a whole shopping mall.””

Exactly. $9M for a farmhouse is an absolutely stupid price.

 
Comment by In Colorado
2012-02-22 08:34:34

Scott Franklund of Legendary Properties ticked off several homes for sale in the area whose cost approaches what NewMark paid for Twin Peaks Mall. What makes the deal especially surprising is that former owner Panattoni Development Co. paid $33.6 million for the 75-acre, 650,000-square-foot mall in 2007

The Twin Peaks Mall in Longmont is one of those “dead” malls (like the one in Fort Collins). It’s hopelessly obsolete and short on tenants, it will probably be bulldozed and its land used for something else. Amazing that someone paid 33 million for it in 2007. Even back then it was obviouis the place was destined for the wrecking ball.

Comment by scdave
2012-02-22 08:42:46

The Twin Peaks Mall in Longmont is one of those “dead” malls ??

Build it and they will come…Probably cost another 8-mil to demo the damm thing…

Comment by In Colorado
2012-02-22 10:26:25

Malls get demolished all the time in the Centennial State. To mention a few:

Cinderella City
Westminster Mall
Villa Italia
Boulder Mall

For some reason, indoor shopping malls aren’t very popular out here (Park Meadows and Flatirons seem to be the exception). The one in Ft. Collins (Foothills Mall) is in its death throes.

What is big out here (don’t ask me why) is what are known as “lifestyle centers”, which are basically oversized stripmalls that have an anchor store or two. It makes no sense to me as these are outdoor malls and it can get cold and snowy out here. Perhaps the appeal is that you can park your land yacht right in front of whatever store you wish to visit (hey, we’re Americans … we don’t have to walk anywhere!)

Comment by Carl Morris
2012-02-22 10:34:16

I work within walking distance of Twin Peaks Mall. It’s in a good location…I’m surprised they’ve let it languish this long. I figured they would bulldoze it or remodel it years ago. It was obvious they were doomed when Penneys moved out…and now Sears is on the way out, too. I just don’t understand why that valuable of a location would just sit and lose money…

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Comment by In Colorado
2012-02-22 11:00:50

I set foot in Twin Peaks once, in 1999. The place already was a ghost town back then. It looked dated and dirty. I think the old Greeley Mall is gone too.

 
Comment by Carl Morris
2012-02-22 12:52:19

I lived in Longmont in 1995/1996 and thought it was doing OK at that time.

 
 
Comment by polly
2012-02-22 11:25:14

White Flint Mall (just north of Bethesda, within two miles of the Beltway) is going to be torn down to create a “town center” like area along 355/Wisconsin Avenue/Rockville Pike in the DC area. Some of the knowledgable sounding comments on the article said that these set ups make rent a lot cheaper because the tennants don’t have to split cooling/heating vast quantities of common area. I believe the county also prefers that sort of development because it is easier to add large condo towers near public transportation when there are also walkable areas near by.

I have to say that I think this is short sighted. People don’t hang out “downtown” when it is 95 degrees F and 98% humidity. Washington has precious few months when it is a pleasure to be outside for a few hours.

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Comment by oxide
2012-02-23 06:31:49

The whole point behind having common areas in the mall is that people have a place to go when the weather is bad, to eat overpriced bad food, and to sit and rest in between impulse buys at Forever 21. Isn’t that why developers began to enclose malls in the first place? Now they’re going in the opposite direction, chasing some dream of a “simpler time”, like Main Street USA or The Music Man, right down to the plastic picket fences. What will really happen is that during bad weather people will stay away entirely and therefore not buy anything, which negates the cheaper rent.

 
 
Comment by Montana
2012-02-22 13:33:34

I’ve gotten bored with the usual store mix in malls. I can go all through a busy mall like Fashion Mall in Arcadia, CA, and not find a damn thing to buy.

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Comment by Arizona Slim
2012-02-22 13:37:04

And I thought I was the only one!

 
 
 
 
 
Comment by goon squad
2012-02-22 08:44:58

Apartment vacancy rates decline in Colorado metro areas; rents rise

http://www.denverpost.com/search/ci_20018133

Metro Denver median prices still at 4-5x median incomes and beaucoup de foreclosures, not buying the REIC lies…

Comment by In Colorado
2012-02-22 11:26:22

Yesterday at lunch with the coworkers the topic of prices in metro Denver, Highlands Ranch in particular, came up. One coworker wants to buy in HR, but apprarently prices in Highlands Ranch continue to defy gravity. It was mentioned that he saw a 1500 sq ft house with a 400K asking price.

I don’t get it. I’ve been to HR on ocassion. The place isn’t all that. It isn’t any nicer than Ft. Collins. Perhaps it’s the proximity to the Denver Tech Center and Cherry Creek, but still …

Comment by Carl Morris
2012-02-22 12:54:18

I totally don’t “get” south Denver. But maybe that’s because I grew up in Wyoming and all the jobs in my field are north of Denver.

 
 
 
Comment by Arizona Slim
2012-02-22 08:50:46

I see that there’s quite a bit of Phoenix area REIC crowing about inventory being down. Well, same thing’s afoot here in Tucson, and Slim is here to tell you why:

A few years ago, this town was bristling with “for sale” signs. Things would stay up for months, and in some cases, years. Many of these properties went unsold?

Why? Well, I’ll spell out the reason slowly and carefully so that no one misunderstands:

P-R-I-C-E-S

As in, they were too high.

What’s happened to those wishing priced houses? Well, in some cases, they’re being rented out “until the market improves.” Whatever that means. Some have been walked away from. Others are still occupied by the price wishers who pulled them off the market.

And that’s the elephant in the room: There are a lot of sales attempts that just plumb failed. Because the prices were too high.

Moral of the story: It’s all about the price. Set it too high, and you can sit and sigh. Price it well, and then you can sell.

Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-02-22 09:40:02

“Price it high, sit and sigh.
Price it right, sell overnight.”

There’s some great homespun philosophy for Realtors® and wannabe sellers to fathom!

 
 
Comment by salinasron
2012-02-22 09:54:21

““For the first time since the home-buying frenzy that peaked in 2005, agent Christine Loschiavo has been advising clients to bid above the asking price.”

Interesting because here in Salinas, CA most loans are FHA and the appraisal is setting the price. You can bid more but FHA will only go the appraised price and that means that the buyer needs to bring cash to closing and the buyers can’t. Property is coming on the market and going pending only to fall out of contract rather quickly, meanwhile property values continue to slide.
There is a property for sale that a friend bid on (held by two novice speculators). Asking price, $259K and he bid $250K with a three day acceptance. The next morning on receiving the bid the speculators called his RE and told him to submit a best offer. He cancelled on the spot. I would have resubmitted at $240K.

Comment by redrum
2012-02-22 11:51:17

> that means that the buyer needs to bring cash to closing and the buyers can’t.

Somebody remind me again: what’s the definition of “buyer”?

Comment by BetterRenter
2012-02-22 20:48:57

Sure, redrum. A “buyer” is a guy with big lender backing (not his own money) who bids up the price of housing, in hopes that his upward bidding lifts the entire market so that he can then sell out of the house without paying much of anything (ref. interest-only loans), for a fat profit.

This is not a real market, since both buyers and sellers are trying to get a higher price. It’s still happening, except that the buyers today are getting houses upon which the prices have dropped from what few market forces that are allowed to operate (auction, foreclosure, short sale, etc.), largely without the input of the home‘own’er (i.e. money-renter or homeDEBTor). They then either bid those prices up, or they bid at price; either way, they spin around soon and put the property right back on the market with a fat markup… where it sits and sits, much to their bewilderment. And after all those episodes of “Flip That House”! {fume, grrr, rassa-frassin’}

 
 
 
Comment by salinasron
2012-02-22 10:02:15

““Las Vegas homeowners have lost $91 billion in equity, roughly $112,000 a home, since the market took a dive from 2006, the principal of research firm Applied Analysis estimated.”

I have a problem with this “equity” thing. My way of thinking is that “equity” is only a percent of the mortgage that I own. When the mortgage is paid off I have 100% equity in the property. There can be “pseudo or blue sky equity” that is based on what some seer thinks that the property is worth at any given period of time, but that value can only be truly derived by selling the property at market value and paying off any existing mortgage or liens.
Therefore, the lost $91 billion in equity is absolutely crap.

Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-02-22 10:07:29

“…the lost $91 billion in equity is absolutely crap.”

Your point is taken, as regards the pie-in-the-sky bubble-era equity valuations. But you can still think of equity at the individual household level as the difference between what you could realize by selling your home at the current market price less what it would cost you to sell it and pay off your loan.

 
Comment by octal77
2012-02-22 10:10:44

Indeed. How can you lose something that you never had to begin with?

 
Comment by The_Overdog
2012-02-22 10:20:50

How do you have a percentage of a mortgage? To get your equity percent, you are still comparing a value (your purchase price) to the amount you owe. That purchase price may still apply, it may not. So really, the only thing you have is a mortage amount - which is how much you owe the bank for that property. Any percentage of equity you determine from that mortgage amount is up for debate.

 
Comment by redrum
2012-02-22 11:52:58

Equity is an opinion.

Debt is real.

Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-02-23 02:36:40

Equity is fleeting.

Debt is forever.

 
 
 
Comment by Alex Horowitz
2012-02-23 02:40:54

There are too many renters these days. It makes me feel sad for real estate companies. I myself prefer to buy a house that I can call my own instead of spending thousands of dollars paying rent for a house or apartment that will never be mine. If you think like I do but are still wary of home prices, you should definitely check out Brea homes. I moved to Brea from Irvine last year because of the market. They have cheap offers and their financing plans are easy on the pocket. There are great schools for my children to go to and the area is safe and continually developing. I am so fortunate to have found such a wonderful home for my family and really count my blessings everyday because of the deal we got.

Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2012-02-23 11:33:30

Go away, lying Realtor. Take your advertisements elsewhere.

 
 
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