The Housing Bubble

“Turn left Floyd!!” “TURN LEFT!!!”

Yes, Aunt Peggy would have laughed at the irony. It had been her car.

GOVCO! Eureka, we’ve got it! Thanks, slothie!

Now all that’s necessary are slogans for GovCo.

“You’ll have all your needs met at GovCo. We insist on it.”

GOVCO: “Between love and madness lies Obsession.”

GOVCO: “They took ourr jerbs!!”

GOVCO: “We’re not happy until you’re not happy.”

“Here at GOVCO, we don’t make corrupt leaders, we make the leaders more corrupt.”

“Always low ethics. Always.”

“Got graft?”

OMG this is way too much fun!

GovCo: “Sometimes you feel like a nut, sometimes you don’t.”

“You’re in good hands with THE state.”

“You got your Money in my Government! You got your Government in my Money! (Voiceover) Two great tastes that taste great together.”

And last but not least:

“Reach out and touch someone”

GOVCO: “We’re not happy until you’re not happy.”

LOL… Loved this one.

Not unlike the left discriminating against the productive and the Christians.

The “productive” bwa ha ha ha ha. Crybaby John Galt wannabes can go live in invisible hand of the free market paradise Somalia.

“Not unlike the left discriminating against the productive and the Christians.”

Really? I’m a Christian and so are many of my friends and we’ve never experienced this discrimination.

Would you care to expound on it?

“Not unlike the left discriminating against the productive and the Christians.”

That would be hilarious if only he/she didn’t believe it.

@goonsquad : so you prefer the non-free market soviet russia of the 50s-80s? Glad we got that straight.

“Under communism man exploits man. Under capitalism, it’s the other way around.”

“prefer the non-free market soviet russia of the 50s-80s?”

No, prefer pre-1953 under Stalin.

And is Obama a Nazi or is he a Marxist? The fear brigade can’t seem to decide which one…

Well….. according to the McCain Campaign CrazyLady, he’s an Egyptian.

Shouldn’t you just go to a store you don’t use that much (or at all), pay cash and not give them the “loyalty” card if you have one?

Seems a lot more private than adding stuff to the purchase.

You can pretend the item in question is for “someone else” if you buy it with a bunch of other crap.

Not that you are fooling anyone except yourself. It’s that “reasonable doubt” thing. Especially if the clerk asks the question “Why would he buy all this other crap, if all he wants is condoms?

It makes no sense……but it is what it is.

You can pretend the item in question is for “someone else” if you buy it with a bunch of other crap.

“I’d like a crowbar, 2 pair of thigh-high stockings and some #4 wood screws please.”

Would you like the crowbar gift wrapped?

lol

There’s a strategy. Play on the Nobel Prize.

“attacks Iran right before the election.”

Do we have the resource personnel for that type of adventure? Or are would we just drop bunker busters on Mossad intel?

Romney Crowds vs Ron Paul Crowds (Michigan Election 2012)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fIP-ibpRYIY

If that doesn’t get RP his turn as Anybody But Romney, he’ll never get one.

jealous of?

The description sounded like something I see on the market for no less than $280k. Of course, I didn’t see any photos.

Sounds like a euphemism. The women would say, “take away our birth control and ‘gitmo’ is closed for business”.

‘gitmo’ is closed for business”.

gitmo is now gitnomo

“Gitmo” has become “git less”.

Gitenany?

People forget that it was state laws that initiated the sea change.

initiated the sea change.

So states’ rights (namely states’ insistence they had the right to hold slaves) led to the devastation and slaughter of the Civil War. Later states’ rights were used to defend Jim Crow laws. And now they are used to defend making gays second-class citizens.

Sounds like a great system results when you ‘get the federal government out of the way’! Plenty of rights- for white, male, straight, well-connected, Christians. Everyone else- you’re on your own.

Yes mathguy, there are progressive states, the problem is, they are not the majority of states and never were.

I truly have no love for the federal gov, but they are FAR more fair than states and corporate governance.

there are progressive states, the problem is, they are not the majority of states and never were.

There would be some states where you’d probably have the same or more civil liberties than before, more states where you’d have less, some where you’d have a lot less. People would begin to move to the states that were most conducive to their personal beliefs, ethnicity, religions, and lifestyles, and the states would become ever more differentiated. Eventually the legal systems of the states would be so different that the breakup of the union would occur, maybe peacefully, maybe not.

I think that is essentially the unspoken goal of many who support states’ rights, in various guises. They have come to accept that there will be no return to their idealized America of yesteryear as the country is currently constituted (too many tan people, weird religions, gays, etc). So they envision a system of states rights’ that would lead to a semi-voluntary movement of groups of people to states that most protected their rights, which would lead to states that were lily-white, Christian, and conservative, states that were more multicultural and liberal, states that were lily-white and libertarian, and who knows what else. Eventually the legal systems and cultures would diverge, the split would be complete, and they will live in the state of their dreams, without all those you-know-whos messing everything up.

Eventually the legal systems and cultures would diverge, the split would be complete,

I don’t see anything wrong with states that cater to a particular sub-culture—see Utah for an example of that that already exists today.

I don’t buy that it necessarily implies that the United States would cease being united, by any means.

“People forget that it was state laws that initiated the sea change.”

We also forget that it was small groups of dissent that initiated change on the local level. Big Central Government is the least fertile ground for dissent.

“live in the state of their dreams”

Migrations occur when a group hopes to find more tolerably liberal conditions elsewhere, not so much when they are persecuting weaker persons at home.

Mormon State
Quaker State
Cajun State
Miami, the new Cuba
Celtic State (Ontario)
California, the fruits and nuts state

Homogenizers would rather keep these folks at home and beat the crap out of them.

Big Central Government is the least fertile ground for dissent.

Tell that to the civil rights marchers, and the little black kids trying to get to school, through an angry mob of white bigots. If it wasn’t for the Feds, they would have rounded up the civil rights marchers and lynched them in many of those locales, and states.

Prime- I’m all for states having degree of autonomy, but I think of the Constitution as the baseline, which protects all Americans equally, regardless of the state they live in. States can add rights to these Constitutional rights, but they cannot violate or take away these Constitutional rights.

Under states rights, state law trumps federal law in most instances, hence the government is powerless in most situations to defend a local citizen’s Constitutional rights against the whims of the state or locality. Hence there is an overall loss of rights under states rights, at least in our history. I don’t see why it would be any different now.

Homogenizers would rather keep these folks at home and beat the crap out of them.

Every example you gave was of a group that fled persecution in their home areas . States rights encourages such persecution, because it removes the protection of Constitutional rights by the federal government. If the groups’ Constitutional rights are protected, they won’t have to flee their homes. Your example is illogical.

Under states rights, state law trumps federal law in most instances, hence the government is powerless in most situations to defend a local citizen’s Constitutional rights against the whims of the state or locality.

Umm…really?

The Constitution is the supreme law of the land, and would in fact trump any state law. That was kind of the whole point - individual states united by the belief of the individual freedoms guaranteed by the Constitution.

Umm…really?

Yes, really. You clearly don’t know the history of states rights in the US, and the long, hard slog to get Constitutional rights guaranteed for ALL people, in ALL places and situations- ie to really be ‘the supreme law of the land’.

If it were otherwise, why couldn’t black people eat at white restaurants, well into the 50s and 60s? Why couldn’t blacks and whites intermarry? Why couldn’t black kids go to white schools? Their (and our) Constitutional rights were not being protected by the federal government against their violation by local authorities. States rights was the political philosophy that was used to defend such violations of rights- the belief that local law was superior to federal law, either officially, or de facto.

Read up on the history and effect of the 13th, 14th, and 15th Amendments. Then read up on the history of the Civil Rights movement, and you’ll come to understand what the history and meaning of states rights is. It’s not a political philosophy that calls for an expansion of rights, it’s the opposite.

As to whether those who champion states rights today are also champions of Constitutional rights, ask what their position is on the 13th,14th, and 15th Amendments. That will tell you which side of the divide they are on. If they wish to repeal any of those amendments, they are not champions of Constitutional rights, because those amendments are what finally, eventually, allowed federal (Constitutional) law to trump state law- ie states rights. They are what made the Constitution the supreme law of the land.

You will find many who champion states rights also champion the repeal of some or all of those amendments. They are the ones who seek to restrict our Constitutional rights, though they will claim otherwise.

Preaching to the choir on civil rights. No argument at all.

Balance and restraints for abuse are a concern. Too much power in the center has its risks. The current state of affairs is dragging everyman into rights vulnerabilities. Too much unchecked power at the center.

The minority can only abuse the majority by obtaining seats of power. Central power unchecked is just too attractive to them and dangerous to us.

In our current situation, it’s the extremity of it, not its mere existence.

Yes, I should have made that point to prevent easy sniping/issue skirting. The issue is that the disparity is increasing AND the rate of increase is increasing. Perhaps the rate has lessened over the past few years, I don’t have the data in front of me. But that the disparity has increased enormously and is out of line globally cannot be denied.

Perhaps the rate (of wealth/income inequality) has lessened over the past few years,

It has increased. The charts will blow one’s mind.

http://motherjones.com/politics/2011/02/income-inequality-in-america-chart-graph

My suspicion is that along with the wealth disparity increase, there is a wealth fragility increase. I expect a lot of these magic beanstalks will break down as the credit ponzi does.

“a lot of these magic beanstalks will break down as the credit ponzi does.”

Now imagine what happens when the folks who never had a beanstalk and never took more than their fair share of the beans no longer have any at all.

Yes, dangerous times. Quite likely for most of us who think we have things under some sort of control.

Yeah, like the briefcase twirling team in the Pasadena DooDah Parade. Loved that shtick.

One home on the market was just purchased at the end of last summer. D’uh! The story on that home is a job transfer but I’m not always buying the realtor lines.

I’ve seen this more than a few times recently and it does make me wonder. Sold last summer and now on the market again.

Flippers?

The mortgage I signed in 2007 on my current abode was a little over 6%. In 2012, I’m at 3.5%. I don’t think we can blame rising interest rates.

More likely, the owner occupants — would could afford the I/O or neg-am payment circa 2007 — can not afford market rates circa 2012 for the same house.

I heard on multiple occasions homeowners who had bought prior to the bubble, state that they could not buy their house during the bubble.

The starkest example I ever saw was the example of a friend who bought a large new house in a desirable suburban area shortly pre-bubble. In the midst of the bubble, another aquaintance paid the same price (no down BTW) for a rowhome in sketchy area of Baltimore City. As Baltimore City continuously lost population.

And government at all levels, in the thrall of the FIRE sector, is trying to maintain that bubble pricing. Which will no doubt end well.

In the midst of the bubble, another aquaintance paid the same price (no down BTW) for a rowhome in sketchy area of Baltimore City. As Baltimore City continuously lost population.

I thought row-houses in sketchy parts of Balti-morgue could had almost for _free_ prior to the bubble! Yikes, that’s scary.

But there was a standard legal solution already in place that would have solved the problem relatively quickly and without so many empty houses. And we changed/ignored the law (mark to market) to avoid it.

How does mark to market establish clear title?

That’s why there are empty houses.

Also depends on the tenant’s rights laws in your area. Here in SF tenants have more rights than in many other places.

If you buy a place to live that already has tenants then you have to owner-occupy, the tenants have 60 days (at least), and you have to pay them to leave to the tune of 4K per person (max @ $15,000 per household).

You can’t buy, kick the rent-controlled tenants out, and then rent it back out again at market rates.

How does mark to market establish clear title?

By itself it doesn’t, but solving everything else would have allowed them to focus on that and I’m confident it would have been solved before now.

I’m not saying it would. I’m just saying that in order to rent the foreclosed house back to the FB, three or four separate things would have to happen… and there are separate problems with all of them.

Exactly. But they also do not worry about their Ficos either. So maybe they are walking away but the “homes” they are walking away from are not waht you and I would call “homes”. We would call them investments.

It wasn’t .50 cal…. They were lasers that would make you evaporate

No, no, no… it was sharks with “frickn’ laser beams” on their heads.

But……they COULD afford those houses.

The banksters told them they could…..and if they couldn’t, “housing always appreciates”.

And who were supposed to be the financial masterminds in this transaction? Who had the fiduciary duty to review the loan docs, and make the decision on whether to hand out $800K to an illegal strawberry picker?

The buyers got a soon-to be depreciating “asset”. The banksters walked away with cash.

The borrowers were (for the most part) dumbazzes. The banksters/REIC crowd were criminals.

“I am for the rule of law, you are not. Is that simple enough for you?”

Right again alpha! I am not for “Looney Laws” like allowing a Deadbeat who lied on a loan application to claim that they are now a victim and live for freeeee for years and then get paid $2k to move out. And bi#ch about that on top of it. It should be on the list below, and you must agree with EVERY single one because you are “for the rule of law”.

Looney Laws, Ordinances, and Rules

Colorado

In Logan County, it is illegal for a man to kiss a woman while she is asleep.

In Pueblo, it is illegal to let a dandelion grow within city limits.

Illinois

In Chicago, it is illegal to fish in one’s pajamas.

In Chicago, it is illegal to take a French poodle to the opera.

According to state law, it is illegal to speak English. The officially recognized language is “American.”

In Gurnee, it is illegal for women weighing more than 200 pounds to ride horses in shorts.

In Joliet, it is illegal to mispronounce the name Joliet

Massachusetts

It is illegal to wear a goatee without a license.

North Andover prohibits its citizens from carrying “space guns.”

State legislation forbids dueling with water pistols.

In Boston, it is illegal to take a bath unless one has been ordered by a physician to do so.

In 1659, the state outlawed Christmas.

Florida

Unmarried women who parachute on Sundays may be jailed.

In Sarasota, it is illegal to sing while wearing a bathing suit.

Iowa

State law forbids any establishment from charging admission to see a one-armed piano player.

In Fort Madison, firemen are required to practice for 15 minutes before attending a fire.

Maryland

In Baltimore, it is illegal to wash or scrub sinks, no matter how dirty they get.

Every person who has bowled since 1833 may be fined $2 for each offense.

In Halethorpe, it is illegal to kiss for more than one second.

It’s illegal to mistreat oysters.

It’s illegal to play Randy Newman’s “Short People” on the radio.

Michigan

A state law stipulates that a woman’s hair legally belongs to her husband.

In Detroit, it is illegal to make love in a car unless it is parked on your property.

In Port Huron, the speed limit for ambulances in 20 m.p.h.

Under state law, dentists are officially classified as “mechanics.”

Minnesota

Women may face up to 30 days in jail if they impersonate Santa Claus.

In Minneapolis, double-parkers can be put on a chain gang.

Every man in Brainerd is required by law to grow a beard.

It’s illegal to tease skunks.

New Jersey

It is against the law to “frown” at a police officer.

In Newark, it is illegal to sell ice cream after 6pm, unless the customer has a note from his doctor.

It is illegal to slurp soup.

In Trenton, it is illegal to throw a bad pickle in the street.

Pennsylvania

“Any motorist who sights a team of horses coming toward him must pull well off the road, cover his car with a blanket or canvas that blends with the countryside, and let the horses pass. If the horses appear skittish, the motorist must take his car apart, piece by piece, and hide it under the nearest bushes.”

In Morrisville, women need a permit to wear cosmetics.

Utah

Birds have the right of way on all highways.

A husband is responsible for every criminal act committed by his wife while she is in his presence.

In Monroe, daylight must be visible between partners on a dance floor.

Virginia

In Richmond, it is illegal to flip a coin in any eating establishment to determine who buys a cup of coffee.

There is a state law prohibiting “corrupt practices of bribery by any person other than candidates.”

In Lebanon, it is illegal to kick your wife out of bed.

Washington

Seattle residents may not carry concealed weapons longer than six feet.

It is illegal to pretend that one’s parents are rich.

Wisconsin

In St. Croix, women are not allowed to wear anything red in public.

It is illegal to cut a woman’s hair.

It is illegal to kiss on a train.

Cheese making requires a cheese maker’s license; Limburger cheese making requires a master cheese maker’s license.

http://www.totallyuselessknowledge.com/laws.php - 33k -

In Chicago, it is illegal to take a French poodle to the opera.

Santorum wants to make that a federal offense I think.

“I am for the rule of law, you are not.”

Alaska

In Fairbanks, it is illegal to feed alcoholic beverages to a moose.

While it is legal to shoot bears, waking a sleeping bear for the purpose of taking a photograph is prohibited.

Arizona

In Tucson, it is illegal for women to wear pants.

In Globe, it is illegal to play cards in the street with a Native American.

In Glendale, it is illegal to drive a car in reverse.

In Nogales, it is illegal to wear suspenders.

Arkansas

In Fayetteville, it is illegal to kill “any living creature.”

School teachers who bob their hair may forfeit their pay raises.

California

It is a misdemeanor to shoot at any kind of game from a moving vehicle, unless the target is a whale.

In Pacific Grove, “molesting” butterflies can result in a $500 fine.

It is illegal to set a mousetrap without a hunting license.

In Long Beach, it is illegal to curse on a mini-golf course.

It is illegal to cry on the witness stand in Los Angeles courts.

“I am for the rule of law, you are not.”

Idaho

Also in Pocatello, “It is prohibited for pedestrians and motorists to display frowns, grimaces, scowls, threatening and glowering looks, gloomy and depressed facial appearances, generally all of which reflect unfavorably upon the city’s reputation.”

Boxes of candy given as romantic gifts must weigh more than 50 pounds.

First you say you are for the rule of law, but only if it does what you want it to (throw the deadbeats out, no matter who owns title). Then you give a long list of absurd, outdated laws, as if to heap scorn of the concept of law.

You, sir, are not for the rule of law. Although you seem incapable understanding the idea of rule of law, which may excuse you through ignorance, you are nonetheless not a champion of the rule of law.

No I think I get it. Some laws are absurd as long as you say they are and any law that you say is not absurd is not. Anyone who disagrees with you is ignorant. The rule of alpha.

In Gurnee, it is illegal for women weighing more than 200 pounds to ride horses in shorts.

Oooooo, could we please get that extend to cover the wearing of spandex as well??

The law has always said that a party must show the official rights of ownership in order to evict someone from a property, for good and obvious reasons. You seek to ignore this law, because it slows down the tossing out of deadbeats, which you desire.

You don’t understand that sometimes the rule of law means not everything occurs as you would like to see fit. Law trumps individual’s desires. If it doesn’t, then we have no law.

I can’t make it any simpler, and yet I know you still won’t get it.

Unlike the loonie laws cited above, having standing to sue is a fundamental principle of law. I want banks to be held to the same standard that I will be held to.

It is one thing to repeal or not enforce a looney law. Allowing banks to commit fraud upon the court undermines the entire judicial system.

There is a shorlist of REO dumps and I’m interested in owning one of them…. at the realistic price….. I’ve written about it here before.

OK this may be a naive question, but can somebody please tell me why I even need a buyer’s agent?

Our agent has not shown us a single property that we didn’t find ourselves (between MLS, Redfin, email updates, and friends sending us stuff they see out there).

He drove us around one weekend, but after that I really just preferred to go to open houses in my own car and on my own schedule.

Why not just cozy up to all the seller’s agents in the areas I am interested in (we have narrowed it down pretty well) and work a deal with them? Hire my own RE lawyer and inspector when we find something we want.

I’ve never bought or sold RE before, so maybe this is a way to get ripped off, as most of the “experts” say, but I am having some difficulty wrapping my mind around how a buyer’s agent can possibly have my best interest in mind. The more we spend on a house, the more money he gets.

Please clarify.

OK this may be a naive question, but can somebody please tell me why I even need a buyer’s agent?

To avoid giving the whole 6% to the seller’s agent?

“OK this may be a naive question, but can somebody please tell me why I even need a buyer’s agent?”

To subvert the NAR bible with cash.

If you don’t have a buyer’s agent, it’s a lot harder to schedule something like looking at 3 houses in one afternoon. And most seller’s agent you come in contact with will hound you once they find out you don’t have an agent, trying to become your agent.

Conversely, if you don’t have an agent, the seller’s agent is a lot more excited about your offer being accepted.

Our agent has not shown us a single property that we didn’t find ourselves (between MLS, Redfin, email updates, and friends sending us stuff they see out there).
————–
We had an agent (for a short period of time) who would not do this; rather he just showed properties listed by his company.

You need an agent to unlock the doors.

“The Group?” Creepy…

Sounds like the People’s Temple or Bohemian Grove.

FocusOnTheFamily

The sequence was algebra 9, geometry 10 , trig 11, pre-calc 12. The below average kids couldn’t pass geometry and took “business math” to get the two years of math they needed for the HS diploma. The average kids didn’t get calc until freshman year college. The talented and gifted kids would have started the sequence a year early with algebra in 8 and taken AP calc in grade 12.

In my high school the regular college prep sequence was Algebra I, Geometry, Algebra II, Trig/pre-calc.

Trig and pre-calc were one year. Trig is really just a bunch of definitions applied to the Pythagorean Theorem. The basic ideas are easy enough for elementary school kids (measure the shadow of a tree and the length of a ruler and its shadow at the same time and you can figure out how tall the tree is). It shouldn’t take a whole year.

Algebra II was matrix multiplication (basic linear algebra) and a lot more work with complex equations (cubic and higher ordered) and a lot more graphing and working with equations that didn’t have integer solutions. Not everything is as easy as x squared plus 7x plus 12.

No idea what they are doing with the curriculum now. I expect that graphing calculators were a big part of it for a while, though perhaps they have moved on from that.

People who couldn’t get through Algebra I after one or two tries got a class called consumer math. Our math team coach taught it (as well as the trig/pre-calc class for those of us taking calculus in 12th grade). She used to let us make up the quizzes on adding and subtracting negative numbers. Then she always told us they were too hard.

“What class did you learn calculus in?”
11th — AB
12th — BC
Undergrad — Multivariable
Grad — Differential

But don’t talk to me about set theory!

“But don’t talk to me about set theory!”

Some of us Space Race babies saw that in grade school, then not again until grad school (at least in my case). Looking back, I suspect lots of my fellow grade school kiddies were completely out of their depth in the set theory material (known at the time as the “new math,” even though it wasn’t)…

I loved sets, numbers bases, etc. in years third-sixth grade, then switched to a new district in 7th and got lost in their first year algebra program–which was taught in the classic “Old math” manner and totally blew apart my nascent pathways of internal computation.

Never could reconcile the two methods and emphases, looking for Boolean aleph naught in advanced algebra, patterning in trig and math analysis. Gave up about the time I hit calculus, and didn’t come back until I studied fortran as a hs junior. Maybe that’s why my brain finally rebelled and came to rest in experimental music….

Someday maybe I’ll meet someone who can help me integrate theoretical with pure linear math–but not holding my breath.

“There are a lot of unemployed techies.”

Yes, and a large majority of them are (in the order I see most commonly):

Not 100% proficient in the English language
Not able to speak to high level executives/give presentations
Don’t have the skills we require (virtualization and storage expertise)
Don’t have a CS/EE degree
Don’t have the certs that we need (this one we can overlook for the right candidate, it doesn’t take too long to get someone with the right skills certified).

I’m not trying to start a war over this, I’m just telling you what I’m seeing in my very small corner of the world. If you know any CCIEs or VCPs with a storage background at least a few years of experience that are looking for work, have a degree, and are good public speakers, please send them my way. I have 3 open positions right now, all paying around 100K and not sales jobs (that’s a base salary, not “you might make this if you sell a lot”).

We’re paying recruiters a lot of money to find these folks for us, and, frankly, not having much luck. We’ve hired 2 people in the past year, and both have been great hires; but we could have hired 1 more last year and just couldn’t fill the position.

Not 100% proficient in the English language
Not able to speak to high level executives/give presentations
Don’t have the skills we require (virtualization and storage expertise)
Don’t have a CS/EE degree
Don’t have the certs that we need (this one we can overlook for the right candidate, it doesn’t take too long to get someone with the right skills certified).

A security clearance is important too. The SCADA world often requires the homegrown TCP/IP(4/6) CISSP peeps; off-shoring isn’t a threat…yet.

Back in the day IBM would train music majors to be programmers.

There is a high correlation between math and music…

See here

Anyone who isn’t deathly afraid of public speaking can be trained in sales process and methodology, sales psychology, overcoming objectives, and closing the deal.

You can train someone to “close the deal” but not many are great at it. I’d say it might be easier to teach someone CS than to teach someone to be great at sales.

I’d say in both areas anybody can be trained enough to be OK. But in both areas to be great you have to be born with it.

But in both areas to be great you have to be born with it.

Yep.

I’m not sure you can train someone in either area from “awful” to “good”. You have to be an outgoing and somewhat pushy person for a sales job. If you’re not, you’re always going to suffer, you might be able to do it, but you’re not going to be as good at as most of the other people around you are.

Programming you can teach someone. But the rigorous logical thinking required is, IMHO, one of those “born with it” things. There are people who can make music, and there are people who have the ability to take complex problems and chunk them down into small enough portions to tackle. I’ve worked with people who aren’t good at it, they can’t stand this kind of work, it’s far too methodical and requires a kind of thought that just does not come naturally to them. Just like emotional intelligence is a foreign concept to me, I don’t understand it, and, although I probably could learn to “emulate” it, I’d never be as good at it as someone who actually thinks on that level.

Although I don’t code much anymore, I look at a lot of code written by others on a day to day basis. It’s pretty obvious who “has it” and who doesn’t. For example (terribly simplistic):

Programmer who gets it (print “Get’s it” 10X):
10 DO(PRINT “Get’s it”)
20 I=I+1
30 WHILE I<10

Programmer who doesn’t get it:
10 PRINT “Get’s it”
20 PRINT “Get’s it”
30 PRINT “Get’s it”
40 PRINT “Get’s it”
..etc…

Unfortunately, computers have become so fast, storage so cheap, and offshore labor so cheap that it might be cheaper to hire the guy who doesn’t get it and just let him type the same line 10X than someone who does get it and have him write elegant code. But, back to my point, it usually only takes a few pages of reading someone else’s code to figure out if they will be a good programmer or not.

Having the ability to be trained in both skill sets to a “good” level of performance is something that is uncommon. Even rarer is someone who enjoys both skill sets.

I get along with people well, speak and write English well, and, with practice, could do presentations well. I am not certain that I would ever enjoy it.

Sitting at my desk and coding is something I have enjoyed doing for many years.

So, given the choice of earning a good living coding versus earning a good living making presentations, I choose coding. Consequently, I will probably never be very good at presentations.

“Comment by Northeastener
2012-02-28 11:37:54

There is a high correlation between math and music…”

As a musical math geek who is part of a nuclear family all of whom have above-average mathematical and musical aptitudes, I agree, though I don’t claim to really understand the connection. Perhaps it has something to do with an unusually accute perception of the abstract?

I saved a copy of the paper for later scrutiny, but at a quick glance was surprised to see no reference to either the connection between fractions, meter and rhythm, nor the connection between Fourier series and musical timbre. Perhaps I should write a paper on music-math connections of interest to me?

Part of the problem is that 100K, while a good salary for a coder, is chump change for a corporate sales rep who can meet his/her quotas.

Curiously, for my current job, as part of the interview I had to give a 15 minute presentation on a technical topic of my choice (I spoke about using Virtual Machines in a QA environment).

After I was hired we inteviewed an east Asian candidate. Even though she’s been living in the USA for 20 years her communication skills were appalling and she failed the interview for that reason.

I don’t understand why there is a split between dental and medical coverage, especially in light of the evidence for gum disease promoting heart disease.

My biggest peeve….why wont dental coverage be given to poor people let alone those who have insurance..

Those silver crowns let everyone know you’re a homie.

we have lots of positions in my department for people with advanced technical skills, many paying 100K+ that we’re having a really hard time filling. We need people with CS degrees that have verbal and presentation skills. Good luck putting that combo together;

Yet here we are, reading “we have lots of positions in my department for people with advanced technical skills, many paying 100K+ that we’re having a really hard time filling. We need people with CS degrees that have verbal and presentation skills. Good luck putting that combo together;“.

It’s a mystery to me…

Doh, didn’t mean for that to end up in there twice.

Just out of curiosity (please don’t take this the wrong way), have you gotten many IT certifications? For me the key was my VCP (VMware certification); that really opened up the doors for me to the “100K” club.

I’m not an IT guy, I’m an engineer who writes firmware at junction between HW and SW. I’m through that door, too, but have gotten no traction trying to get to the next level where the MBA might actually be useful. Sounds like you’re talking specifically about IT stuff, not engineering work.

I just find it interesting that for all the talk of what’s out there and can’t be filled, I never see anybody actually nosing around trying to find out if any of their current people would be good for that sort of thing. And because I’m not in the club I never hear of what other companies might be looking for that isn’t advertised.

“I’m through that door, too, but have gotten no traction trying to get to the next level where the MBA might actually be useful. Sounds like you’re talking specifically about IT stuff, not engineering work.”

I am, I should have clarified, I work on the “softer” side of the house, not in firmware. I have no idea what that market looks like. Although, I would say, IMHO the universal rule is “try to get more customer facing” and figure out some way to equate sales to your performance. Either that, work your way up to run a team of programmers. Or, probably the most lucrative of all (sadly), be the person who offshores the programming and oversees a team of programmers in India. I have a buddy who works at a major software house who basically canned his whole division and took the operation to some offshore shop. Set himself up at the liaison between his company and the offshore shop (basically translating the customer requests into requests of enhancement to the product) and somehow got himself a salary that’s got to be close to 500K (he’s got some kind of leveraged plan based on how much he saves the company).

I have so far been unsuccessful in attempts to get a position managing Americans I have been asked about managing a team in India. Not interested due to the travel required to do it right. If that was my only chance to make the big bucks, oh well.

The workforce has no choice. Extend and pretend is only an option for a few.

And out on the farm they and their kids were pretty much physically safe.

In a cheap neighborhood in Baltimore…or LA?

I wasn’t going to mention that…….

Glocks aren’t cheap.

And a Glock and window bars are poor insurance compared to a farm neighborhood full of dogs and shotguns and and everybody knows everybody that’s supposed to be there.

Glocks aren’t cheap.

After watching The Wire (great show!) I won’t go anywhere near Baltimore

compared to a farm neighborhood full of dogs and shotguns

besides, you can get a mossy 500 for really cheap.

Gaah! That’s an ugly house. Looks like it sold for $850,00 (holy cow!) at the height of the bubble, so say it would be more in the neighborhood of a $17,000 loss, versus around $38,000 for a year’s rent on it. Getting close to a wash, but I wouldn’t buy that house for $150,000, unless it’s walking distance to the beach, which I doubt.

http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/Northern-Moon-Way-San-Diego-CA-92154/2135807454_zpid/

This one is the same size and currently rents for less ($1100) than any of my two bedroom apartments I lived in. Very close to Mexico and not too far from the beach. It rented for $3000 in 2010. The EKG looks like the patient is dieing.

A quick zillow check says ~$3200/month.

And that’s paid out of take-home.

Pickup trucks are CHEAP around here, when compared to the typical econobox.

Looked at a semi-stripper Ford Focus for the youngest a week or so ago. $21K MSRP (but it had $1500 cash-back/ 0%).

F-150 Club Cabs had higher stickers, but $5-6K rebates/dealers incentives/sale prices. Thus putting the “out-the door” price within a couple thousand of each other.

If you think you will ever need to haul anything, or need room for more than two people, it’s a no-brainer. There isn’t a lot of stop-and-go type city traffic around here, so the gas mileage penalty isn’t as big as you would think.

Add to that, the truck will be a LOT easier/cheaper to fix.

Assuming:
7 years of ownership
$4.50/gal average for the next 7 years (my guess, too low)
15000mi/yr driving
Combined mileage as per EPA: F150=17, Focus=31
Then your fuel cost for the two vehicles is:
F150: $22500
Focus: $12434

Over $10,000 difference.
Don’t forget to price insurance too… not sure how young the “youngest” is, or if male/female; but pickups can be very expensive to insure for young males. Something to do with that feeling of invincibility I suppose.

The biggest expense with a new vehicle is depreciation. Your guess is as good as mine as to the end-point value of the two. My guess is, it will have a lot to do with fuel cost in ~2019.

Why can’t more than two people drive in a Ford Focus?

Around here, cars are a lot more expensive to insure than trucks.

Out in flyover, we measure distance by hours, not miles. A typical truck can get around 20 mpg on a 200 mile trip on the Interstate, depending on wind. The Focus can’t haul crap, so you need to add this formula:

(Number of times truck borrowed from family or neighbor) x (gallons bought filling truck gas tank) x (gasoline price/gallon) = Additional transportation cost.

$4.50/gallon = IMO, too high. The economy will tank when it hits $4 for an extended period of time.

Especially when the $12/hour duckies do the math, and realize their take-home will be higher if they take that $8/hour MickeyDee’s job that is walking distance from the house).

You would think that high gas prices, and higher production numbers, would lower the resale value of trucks……yeah, that’s what I thought too, in 1974……and 1979…….and 1987…….and 1990-91……and 2007……. It doesn’t happen, at least not around here.

Who knows? We might be back in horse drawn wagons by 2019.
(Five years ago, I’d have said the probability of that happening was about zero. Now? 5-10%)

No argument X-GSfixr-

Just trying to point out that total cost of ownership is much more than purchase price

There was a pretty convincing article I read once advocating that in many cases, it made sense to just go buy your (used) dream car (Corvette, Ferarri, etc.). Sure, fuel and insurance will be higher; but if you buy right, depreciation - typically the biggest expense - can be almost zero. Buy a vette at the bottom of it’s price curve (now, probably mid-to-late-80’s) and you might even make a few bucks.

I keep looking at early Vipers, which can be bought in the mid 20’s now. Take care of it, and in 5 years, I think I could sell one for close to today’s purchase price. About the same entry point as the Focus… certainly higher operating costs; so maybe it’s a wash. But, I know which one I’d have more fun driving

If you want to play the collector car appreciation game I think you also have to know or gamble on whether the next generation of cars will get better. Usually they do, and the old cars don’t gain much value. But in a situation like the late 70s where new cars are getting worse and used cars like 10 year old 427 Cobras are selling for depreciated prices you can make a killing if you time it right.

There was a pretty convincing article I read once advocating that in many cases, it made sense to just go buy your (used) dream car (Corvette, Ferarri, etc.). Sure, fuel and insurance will be higher; but if you buy right, depreciation - typically the biggest expense - can be almost zero.

—————————-
Depreciation is a car’s biggest expense but doesn’t impact the ability to drive the car daily, at least not compared to the $1500 brake job or $2000 tires that a Ferrari or Corvette is going to require. The maintenance and insurance on a super car daily driver will wipe you out. I have friends who have tried it. They are happier with a used Lexus or Infiniti.

The maintenance and insurance on a super car daily driver will wipe you out.

Another reason to buy a more generic car with the potential to be faster than exotics, and make it so. I always find it quite fun. But I don’t need to be seen in an exotic, so that helps.

Another reason to buy a more generic car with the potential to be faster than exotics, and make it so.

Got a top-5 list for that? Just curious…

Hmmm, my recent choice was a BMW 335xi. The prototype big turbo kits are starting to hit the streets and make well over 500hp. If you prefer a different model the same thing should work on any of their inline 6 turbo models.

Pretty much anything with a turbo, and AWD if you want to be able to use the power at lower speeds. The rally car based stuff like the Mitsubishi EVO and turbo Subarus are good choices. The high end turbo Volvo cars are good, too, but there isn’t as much aftermarket support for making them really fast. The last V8 Pontiacs had a lot of potential if you’re willing to have a supercharger installed. No AWD option, though :-(.

I’d have to agree with the “maintenance will eat you alive” argument, especially on exotics. I had a buddy with a Maserati (which he bought for like 30K about 5 years old). Awesome car (the sound was incredible).

Until the clutch let go (and mind you, at the time, this car was only about 4-5 years old with low mileage). 7K for the clutch job. I almost died when I heard that. Then he got me with the thing that pushed me totally over the edge.. “The dealer told me I’m lucky if I get 10K miles out of a clutch”.

ROFL.

A much more “down to earth” example. I owned a 2007 CLS 550 (Mercedes). Needed a brake job (pads for all 4, rotors for 2). 2,100 dollars. Oil change (required service), 500-600 dollars.

Total lunacy. If someone dropped a free Ferrari in my front yard I’m pretty sure I couldn’t afford to actually use the darn thing.

But I don’t need to be seen in an exotic, so that helps.

No, not in an exotic..but not exactly low-profile vehicles either

The Mitsu was definitely low profile. I’m just stuck in a baller-mobile right now because it has the drivetrain I want to play with. Still…it doesn’t stick out that much being white and 4dr.

A quick looksie on cars dot com in my neck of the woods confirms your statement.

Strange weather to be driving a 2-seat sports car.

Strange weather

I drive my sports car all winter- it’s the only car I have. (Of course, it’s technically a 4-seater, but the 2 people in the back have to be children, midgets, or yoga experts.)

Aspen is a strange place Oxide.

what does temperature have to do with it? i did have the top up and BTW it is AWD so it works well in the winter as long as the snow on the roads isn’t deep.

AWD?

A Jeep is not a “sports car”.

I’ve driven my Miata in the snow before. You can even put the top down if you are bundled up well and use the heater. (I really hated driving it with the top up.) I used to drive it top down all winter in California and even the first couple of winters here in AZ.

Although eventually I got tired of that and driving it on the dirt roads here and bought a Jeep. The Miata now sits in the garage waiting for me to sell.

AWD?

A Jeep is not a “sports car”.

I think he’s talking Porsche :).

Xsfixer

A Jeep is not a “sports car”

its not a jeep

Here’s my flying sports car

I think he’s talking Porsche :).

Hmm, AWD and two-seats… could be an Audi R8 too

Like alpha-sloth, I drive a 270hp 2-dr coupe 6MT year round. Has back seats, but they’re only used when I transport the kids. Front drive, w/ snow tires, it’s tolerable in the winter.

Wife has the 4X4 and I drive 100+ miles a day with my commute, so something sporty but economical (regular gas, 27mpg highway, <$30k) was what sold me.

Less than $30K is economical?

I’ve really been out of the car market for a long time. Maybe I can convince Dad to treat himself for his 74th birthday, so I can buy the civic.

“Less than $30K is economical?

That’s what I thought. I’ve never paid more than 10K for a car. It’s been a long time since I’ve bought new.

It’s just an excuse, to reject/lowball people.

I’ve had factory training and extensive experience on several aircraft types (Cessna 500 series, Cessna 525/CJ series, 650, 750/Citation X; Falcon 20 and 900, Gulfstream 200), also trained on several avionics systems (Collins, Honeywell) and engines (Garrett/Honeywell TFE731, Pratt and Whitney JT15 and PW300 series, Williams FJ44, Rolls-Royce/Allison AE3007C, extensive supervisory and sales/direct customer support experience, and running the maintenance department of 4 different Corporate/Air Charter operators.

So I really don’t need much training. Doesn’t keep people from lowballing me (”Lowballing me ” = $25-30/hour)

I expect them to lowball the first time unless they already know your current salary or are offering some particularly outstanding working condition. The question is what happens when you say no to the lowball.

They go look for someone else. Too bad all of the “young guys” (under 40) around here are bailing out for greener pastures Or fix it themselves (which won’t be a problem unless their is a crash investigation, or the local Feds catch wind of it) Or pay the $150 hour (plus expenses) the major shops charge for road trips.

Pilots have a problem with “Well, if I’m making “X”, then that doofus mechanic should be making 1/2 “X”. They still like their jobs; after all, flying is fun, especially when you can get someone to pay you for it. So they think we should be in it for “fun”

The business stopped being “fun” for mechs about 25 years ago, and it gets to be even less fun the farther you move up the food chain.

The “contract” rate for airplane work around here has been frozen at the $50/hour range since at least 1999. A little more, if you have training in the type you are working on.

OTOH, these same guys don’t have a problem with shelling out $500/$1000 a trip for airplane catering.

SUMMARY: This business has been as screwed up as a football bat for a long time. Chickens are coming home to roost. Everybody in the business (except for the pilots) are looking at career alternatives. Insurance claims on damaged airplanes are going up, because the guys running the show won’t pay enough to retain good help.

It will be like everything else. There won’t be a problem, until it blows up in someone’s face, and/or someone gets sued. Then twice as much money will be spend on crisis management, and panic “fixes”, as it would have cost to do the right thing in the first place.

But in the meantime the bonuses will continue to flow, so the current course is obviously best.

“It will be like everything else. There won’t be a problem, until it blows up in someone’s face, and/or someone gets sued. Then twice as much money will be spend on crisis management, and panic “fixes”, as it would have cost to do the right thing in the first place.”

My company does what you do, solve problems, and gets paid to solve them before they happen. Problem is, people think the $10-20-30k solutions we provide are “too expensive.” Like the company who just made over $4M worth of product incorrectly and now has to rework all of it, even though we’ve been talking to them for years about how we could prevent exactly that from happening. Meh…our price just doubled suckers!

Q: Why did the 1%er cross the road?

A: Because he paid for that damn road, you deadbeat, by stripping companies of their assets, and sending jobs to China! And if you don’t like it, he’ll offshore your job too! And his taxes are too damn high!

A Muslim, a Christian, and a 1%er walk into a bar.
Suddenly on average, everyone is a millionaire.

A politician and 1%er walk into a bar. The union guy ducks.

*ba dum pum *ching*

A small plane carrying a German guy, a Polish guy, a French guy, and a 1%er crashes in the middle of a desert, miles from civilization. The group makes plans to leave the junked plane and walk to safety.

The German guy says, “I’ll bring this canteen filled with water. If we get thirsty, we can drink the water.”

The French guy says, “And I have bread. We can eat it when we are hungry!”

Encouraged, they all nod in approval.

The 1%er says, “I’m going to create canteen-backed futures market to ensure our water needs are met by the free market, even way out here in the middle of nowhere!”

I almost forgot…

The Polish guys looks at all of them in disdain. He follows, “You are all idiots. I will be bringing the airplane door! If we get hot walking across the desert, I will roll down the window so we can all cool off!”