June 12, 2012

Bits Bucket for June 12, 2012

Post off-topic ideas, links, and Craigslist finds here.




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343 Comments »

Comment by frankie
2012-06-12 02:34:58

In the UK over the last decade buy-to-let has become more popular as pensions have failed to deliver on there promises. Several of my workmates have bought flats and are renting them out to tenants, and the reasons they all give for this is it isn’t worth investing in a pension, or the flat is my pension. Which begs the question how much of the property boom has been driven by people desperate to secure a long term source of income rather than a fast buck?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/pensions/9325041/UK-pension-performance-among-worst-in-developed-world.html

The international think tank warned that the poor performance of British pension companies could leave people retiring without enough to live comfortably.

The OECD said that returns on money invested by pension companies on behalf of savers fell every year between 2001 and 2010.

The bad performance of UK workplace pension funds was only outdone by the US and Spain, where the value of money in pension funds has fallen by between 1 and 2 per cent a year over the last decade.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/pensions/9044861/Is-property-better-than-a-pension-for-your-retirement-nest-egg.html

Britons are turning their backs on pensions in record numbers even though the main alternatives – Isas and buy-to-let – lack the generous tax relief that pension contributions attract.

Comment by vinceinwaukesha
2012-06-12 05:53:14

This is an interesting strategy WRT to “return of capital vs return on capital” where you assume you’ll lose large fractions of your investment, in exchange for always (well, hopefully) having a rental income.

If you analyze it like an annuity I wonder how it pencils out or what it implies about the fake govt manipulated interest rate vs the psychological real interest rate.

So the fake manipulated rate is (who cares). However the psychological rate is I’ll throw away 300K pounds of capital loss in exchange for 1K pounds per year net rental profit after all expenses and taxes meaning the real world interest rate is sorta 0.33% plus or minus a lot of annuity type calculations that I can’t make at this time of morning.

Interesting way to look at real vs fake interest rates and investment returns.

 
Comment by turkey lurkey
2012-06-12 06:11:05

Despite the huge numbers of FBs and flippers, the lack of income keeping pace with inflation for most people, was indeed a motivator to invest in property.

Comment by In Colorado
2012-06-12 07:11:59

Absolutely. I recall someone who was trying to coax me into becoming a flipper, telling me that “working for a living doesn’t pay”

Comment by oxide
2012-06-12 07:22:27

This also agrees with yesterday’s comment of a small time dealer who wanted to do “just one big deal without getting caught,” and would then go straight.

Cheat once to get ahead, then being honest becomes much easier.

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Comment by Carl Morris
2012-06-12 08:28:03

Sometimes it takes a pull from a jet-ski to catch a big wave. Otherwise you’re just bobbing in the giant swells going nowhere.

 
 
 
 
Comment by Darrell in Phoenix
2012-06-12 06:30:01

2 of my 4 sisters have purchased properties for this very reason. A third is thinking about doing so.

One bought a piece of property with 3 small houses on it back in 2002. Her costs are $2000 a month and she rents the units out at $1500, $700 and $500.

The other bought a piece of land with 2 duplexes, Her costs are about $800 a month and she has 3 of the 4 rented out at $400 a month, with the 4th needing a remodel before she can rent it out.

The wild card is, what happens to rent? If rents stay where they are, the sisters should do well. If rents tank, then the math doesn’t pencil out quite so well.

Comment by combotechie
2012-06-12 06:45:46

“The wild card is, what happens to rent?”

The answer to this wild card lies in just how many rentals are popping up throughout the land.

Comment by In Colorado
2012-06-12 07:13:33

In my neck of the woods rentals are pricey and vacancies are low.

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Comment by Mr. Smithers
2012-06-12 07:27:06

“In my neck of the woods rentals are pricey and vacancies are low.”

Me too.

 
Comment by happyfriday
2012-06-12 08:04:35

Same here.

I see more families with kids in my apartment. The landlord just converted a open space to kids’ playground and expanded pool and made it kids friendly.

 
Comment by cactus
2012-06-12 08:39:46

In my neck of the woods rentals are pricey and vacancies are low.”

same here

 
Comment by Avocado
2012-06-12 11:17:35

Me too, rents are high, hard to find good places in Central Coast of CA.

 
Comment by sleepless_near_seattle
2012-06-12 13:24:03

Rent is too damn high, and rising, here in Portland as well.

 
 
 
Comment by scdave
2012-06-12 07:03:46

The wild card is, what happens to rent ??

Well, there is a wild card in everything isn’t there ?? Gold is subject to fluctuations…So is cash in a mattress….

Investment real estate is just one of the many alternatives…IMO, to be a successful small real estate investor you must have or develop a number of skill sets including knowledge & basic handyman repairs…

 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-12 07:06:03

We had dinner guests over last night — wife’s cousin, husband and family. I ended up engaged in conversation with the husband, my wife with her cousin, and when my wife and I later compared notes, we realized we had both been favored with a FB story of a close relative (relation suppressed to protect identities) who bought four houses in an expensive PNW city during the boom, only to ride out the crash through a series of foreclosures which ended in a bankruptcy declaration. During the “loosing my shirt” phase of the investing adventure, said family member would get foreclosed from the home she was occupying, only to evict a tenant from another home to which she would relocate. Apparently she was paying none of her mortgages, all the while collecting rent from her hapless tenants. For three years, she lived rent-free, until she was handed $30K to sell her last home, at which point she declared BK.

Needless to say, this investor was a Realtor®. I suppose all of the above was perfectly legal.

 
Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2012-06-12 07:32:08

The wild card is, what happens to rent? If

The other wild card is what happens to costs. Property taxes could escalate, or a couple of furnaces, and she would be deep in the red.

Though on the face of it, without more detailed information, $8400/yr in the black on cash flow doesn’t look too bad…

 
Comment by vinceinwaukesha
2012-06-12 08:07:47

“Her costs are $2000 a month”

I’d worry about that factor more than historical property cost vs current market price.

For example my $10K roof (partial flat, very expensive) and $5K complete HVAC replacement represent something like two full years of your sisters profit… and a house is a lot more than a roof and hvac system.

Or as a more general question you can discuss variation in property prices and variations in rent going forward, but variations in maint and prop tax expenses cannot be ignored.

Comment by scdave
2012-06-12 08:25:09

variations in maint and prop tax expenses cannot be ignored ??

Two biggest mistakes I see made with first time real estate rental investors;

#1. Lack of knowledge of the HUD & local housing laws…

#2. The cost of maintenance and replacements “particularly” if
they have no skill set to preform some of those tasks
themselves…

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Comment by cactus
2012-06-12 08:50:48

#2. The cost of maintenance and replacements “particularly” if
they have no skill set to preform some of those tasks
themselves…”

so it probably won’t get done house slowly turns to a junker. Pottersville.

I have a friend who has made millions repairing tubs and sinks in apartments , he patches and paints them.
He has a big crew that does the work now for him.

how many coats of paint can you put on a tub or sink to cover the rust before it falls apart?

 
Comment by scdave
2012-06-12 09:06:59

how many coats of paint can you put on a tub or sink to cover the rust before it falls apart ??

Zero…You don’t put paint on Tubs or Sinks and if you do, refer back to my #2 above…

 
Comment by Avocado
2012-06-12 11:21:17

I have seen everything from ceramic tile painted, to tubs and sinks. Nasty, but they do it to fool the fools.

 
 
 
Comment by Avocado
2012-06-12 11:16:05

Have rents ever “tanked?” Flat maybe, but never tanked that I know unless it is Detroit or some unique situation that goes ghost town.

Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2012-06-12 11:37:57

Anyone know what rents did during GD-I?

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Comment by Avocado
2012-06-12 11:51:53

oh, you think it will get that bad….

then back to ammo, water and seeds.

 
Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2012-06-12 13:43:49

oh, you think it will get that bad….

My suspicion is that it will _not_ get that bad, actually—for several reasons:

1) We have a much deeper social safety net. In GD-I, people were literally desperate enough to stand in soup and bread lines, and now they have SNAP and Unemployment.

2) Many of the actions taken to extend and pretend have cushioned the blow to some extend, but at the cost of extending the duration.

So I expect things not to be nearly as bad, but for the malinvestment to take quite some time to be wrung from the system.

 
 
 
 
Comment by Arizona Slim
2012-06-12 11:27:49

In the UK over the last decade buy-to-let has become more popular as pensions have failed to deliver on there promises. Several of my workmates have bought flats and are renting them out to tenants, and the reasons they all give for this is it isn’t worth investing in a pension, or the flat is my pension.

I think the above is behind the current coverage of all-cash investors in this country. Instead of leaving that pile of money in the ole 401k or in the bank, they’re buying rental houses.

I doubt that this scenario will end well.

 
 
Comment by frankie
2012-06-12 04:22:42

There is an orderly queue of countries waiting in line for a bailout after Spain. We now have Cyprus saying that there was an “exceptionally urgent” need for an international bailout while Austrian FinMin can’t rule out the possibility that Italy may need external help.

http://www.ifre.com/ifr-comment-spain-fourth-cyprus-fifth-and-italy-sixth/21023317.article

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/2c6b125c-b3f4-11e1-8fea-00144feabdc0.html#ixzz1xZphyOnp

Cyprus has said it could request an international bailout within days, reflecting growing expectations it will become the fifth eurozone country to seek rescue funds.

Vassos Shiarly, finance minister, said the cash-strapped country’s predicament was exceptionally urgent because of bank capitalisation rules due to come into effect on June 30. But he also suggested Nicosia could seek aid for more than just the banking sector. Cyprus has been shut out of international capital markets for about a year.

I’m putting in my request for a bail out today; don’t want Italy taking all the money before I get mine. A couple of billion should do nicely.

Comment by Mr. Smithers
2012-06-12 06:09:36

Don’t think we’re any better. California and Illinois will be getting a nice fat bailout sooner than later.

Comment by scdave
2012-06-12 07:06:00

California and Illinois will be getting a nice fat bailout sooner than later ??

Yeah right….I am sure that legislation would just slide right through the US Congress…

 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-12 07:07:43

Huh?

Comment by In Colorado
2012-06-12 07:18:57

Agreed, I’m not holding my breath, If the Feds bailout Calif and Illinois, they’ll have to bail out every state, county, municipality and school district in the country. It would take the mother of all QE’s to pull that off.

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Comment by Mr. Smithers
2012-06-12 07:28:15

CA is Spain
IL is Greece

Bailouts for both states will be coming soon enough.

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Comment by polly
2012-06-12 07:38:06

Why don’t you give us a date? Give yourself a big safety margin over when you think it really will happen. Describe how you think it will pay out - exchange of state bonds for federal ones? something else? And I will put a note in my calendar and we can revisit the issue at that time. You know, instead of you making entirely unspecified predictions of entirely unspecified actions at entirely unspecified times.

 
Comment by In Colorado
2012-06-12 08:04:31

“You know, instead of you making entirely unspecified predictions of entirely unspecified actions at entirely unspecified times.”

Oh, let him have his fun. It’s amusing to watch neo-cons froth at the mouth.

 
Comment by aNYCdj
2012-06-12 08:23:44

Then the feds will imposes drastic reductions of pensions and health benefits to balance out the costs

So why cant unions step up to the plate and do this themselves?? Eliminate the abuses, and the public will be on your side.

Bailouts for both states will be coming soon enough.

 
Comment by Rental Watch
2012-06-12 08:31:03

California is the uncle that always cries “poor”, yet has 30 gold bricks buried in his backyard that he chooses to leave there.

I seem to recall reading that if CA taxed oil production the same way Alaska did, it would generate many billions per year in revenue.

Also, CA has the Monterey Shale Oil field (estimated 15 billion barrels of “technically” recoverable oil…whatever that means–sounds like a lot). The problem is beaurocracy. Jerry Brown needed to replace the head of California’s Department of Conservation due to unreasonable delays in their permitting process…must have been REALLY bad if Jerry Brown getting involved improves things.

Unlike Greece (Spain I think is a bit better off than Greece), California actually has the capacity to solve their problems, if they simply had the political will to do so.

 
Comment by cactus
2012-06-12 08:59:06

California is the uncle that always cries “poor”, yet has 30 gold bricks buried in his backyard that he chooses to leave there.

yea I think you’re right lots of oil plus. It leaks out of the ground in many areas around here. Hwy 156 between Santa Paula and Ojai is one place I know of.

New pumps are going in I have seen 2 in the last 2 years and I’m not really looking.

 
Comment by Mr. Smithers
2012-06-12 09:17:14

“So why cant unions step up to the plate and do this themselves?? Eliminate the abuses, and the public will be on your side.”

Unions went ape s**t in WI when Walker told them to contribute 8% of their health care costs. Don’t hold your breath waiting for this to happen.

 
Comment by The_Overdog
2012-06-12 09:23:56

I’d add Alabama to the list of states going bankrupt. A county there has actually gone bankrupt.

 
Comment by MrBubble
2012-06-12 09:50:09

“CA has the Monterey Shale Oil field (estimated 15 billion barrels of “technically” recoverable oil…whatever that means–sounds like a lot).”

Technically recoverable oil does not take into account the price of extraction in dollar and, more importantly for shale oil extraction in dry areas, water costs.

Although 15 bbl might sound like a lot of oil, it’s about two years supply for the US (at 20 million bbl/day). We use quite a bit of the stuff, much of it needlessly.

 
Comment by Happy2bHeard
2012-06-12 10:14:38

“Unions went ape s**t in WI when Walker told them to contribute 8% of their health care costs. “

Rewriting history? Unions protested when Walker eliminated collective bargaining rights.

 
Comment by oxide
2012-06-12 10:52:25

I thought the unions had already offered concessions to Walker and that wasn’t enough for him. He wanted to break the unions entirely.

As for HBB’s favorite union whipping buyz: police and firefighters. Well, Walked exempted them from the unio-busting.

 
Comment by 2banana
2012-06-12 11:43:20

What a laugh.

PUBLIC unions STILL have collective bargaining rights in WI.

It is just NOW people can CHOOSE not to join the public union goon mafia as a CONDITION of employment. And the state DOES NOT take out union dues anymore. The PUBLIC union goons have to collect those dues all by themselves.

And the public union goons have to pay a little more for thier healthcare and pensions.

THE HUMANITY OF IT ALL!

Go ahead and spin the PUBLIC union goon talking points.

It is kinda of funny - really.

The PUBLIC union goons can’t defend insane benefits/ pensions. The PUBLIC union goons can’t defend their corrupt lock on political power. The PUBLIC union goons can’t defend bankrupting cities and the state. So what do they do?

They cry that they are losing their “collective bargaining rights” when it is a lie.

Cause that sounds like something the public may support…

Unions protested when Walker eliminated collective bargaining rights.

 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-12 12:32:13

Are Smithers and 2banana a Repugnican troll tag team?

 
Comment by Carl Morris
2012-06-12 12:45:05

I figured Smithers was hard core “Log Cabin” like the cartoon character.

 
Comment by Arizona Slim
2012-06-12 12:49:45

Are Smithers and 2banana a Repugnican troll tag team?

I think so. And all I can say is that if this is the best that Team Elephant can do, they’ve got a problem.

 
Comment by polly
2012-06-12 12:57:51

And he still hasn’t said when his predicted bailout will take place and what form it will take. We are just supposed to “take his word” on it.

 
Comment by In Colorado
2012-06-12 13:03:52

“I figured Smithers was hard core “Log Cabin” like the cartoon character.”

That thought crossed my mind, an odd choice of handle name for a neo-con, unless like his namesake he too finds Mr.Burns to be irresistible.

 
Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2012-06-12 13:46:10

It is just NOW people can CHOOSE not to join the public union goon mafia as a CONDITION of employment.

The one time in my working-life that I was unable to choose not to join a union (in WI, incidentally, when I was a grad student—yes, even the grad students are unionized in WI), I was rather unhappy about it. I didn’t see any point in paying union staff for essentially providing no service; the grad-student wages certainly didn’t suggest that they were winning big for us!

 
Comment by polly
2012-06-12 15:12:00

My brother helped with the grad school organizing when he was getting his Phd. They weren’t mostly concerned about pay. The biggest problem was the health insurance. One of his friends was denied coverage for an ambulance ride when she had a compound fracture of the femur. Yes, you read that right. Her thigh bone was snapped in half and at least one end was poking though the skin to the outside and they didn’t think that was sufficient injury to call 911. Expected her to get herself to the hospital somehow. Perhaps by hopping.

It was a real problem because a lot of the foreign grad students had wives and kids and their wives didn’t have visas that allowed them to work, so no family coverage that way. They just wanted to be allowed to elect the employee coverage, rather than the coverage aimed at 18 to 22 year olds who were still really covered by their parents’ policies but got the university coverage too so they didn’t have to deal with forms at the student health clinic.

 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-12 17:17:55

“Log Cabin”

Speaking thereof, what, if anything, is Romney doing to court the Log Cabin Republican vote?

Smithers & 2banana, please weigh in generously, as I eagerly await the news on this subject from your Republican party masters.

 
Comment by Ben Jones
2012-06-12 17:41:11

I understand the LCR have been excluded from major ‘conservative’ conferences this year, after having been included for many years. The Republicans are on a path that shuns one group after another to the point where they have a long litmus test list, IMO, that if you don’t agree, you’re out.

You gotta be a neo-con. No exceptions. No gays, no small government types, no cutting the military. Killing A-rabs and other Muslims is a duty. Israel can do no wrong. No questioning of the police state.

Here’s a weird one; we’re on the brink of going Greece, but Merika is THE exceptional nation. Somehow they have reconciled this gawd-given greatness with our imminent downfall should the Democrats not be swept from DC.

A big tent indeed. No wonder they are the incredible shrinking party. Here’s a political observation; the Citizen United thing, with the super-PACs, screwed the GOP more than anyone else.

 
Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2012-06-12 20:09:07

Meanwhile the percentage of non-religious Americans increases every year. An estimated 25% of people between 18 and 34 do not give a hoot about religion. In another generation there will be no more pandering to the religion-nuts. Thank Buddha!

 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-12 21:02:30

“…instead of you making entirely unspecified predictions of entirely unspecified actions at entirely unspecified times.”

Why not take the unfalsifiable approach to prediction? Nobody can ever laugh at you if you make a prediction which can’t possibly not come true.

 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-12 21:09:31

“The Republicans are on a path that shuns one group after another to the point where they have a long litmus test list, IMO, that if you don’t agree, you’re out.”

Sounds like they are going Mormon.

 
Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2012-06-12 22:03:49

My brother helped with the grad school organizing when he was getting his Phd. They weren’t mostly concerned about pay. The biggest problem was the health insurance.

That makes good sense, polly. My bad.

I was really glad about the medical insurance that the UW system provided, and didn’t realize that that had been hard-fought for by the union.

I guess I did benefit from their efforts, including your brother’s.

 
 
 
 
 
Comment by The UNKNOWN TENANT
2012-06-12 04:33:31

Posted: 6:24 p.m. Monday, June 11, 2012

Florida among states hardest hit by drop in net worth

By Kimberly Miller

Palm Beach Post Staff Writer

The wealth of the median American family shrunk to 1992 levels as of 2010, according to a Federal Reserve report that singles out Florida as one of the states hit hardest by the Great Recession.

The Survey of Consumer Finance, released Monday, blamed a “broad collapse in housing prices” for the 38.8 percent drop in median net worth between 2007 and 2010.

“The amount of wealth destroyed by the housing crisis was trillions of dollars, and suddenly where there was a mound of wealth, consumers saw a crater,” said University of Central Florida economist Sean Snaith. “It’s one of the reasons I’ve been projecting the recovery to be as subdued as it has been.”

The survey showed the median net worth of $126,400 in 2007 plummeted to $77,300 in 2010. Net worth is the value of assets like homes, bank accounts and stocks, minus debts like mortgages and credit cards.

Among families that owned homes, the Fed survey found that their median home equity declined from $95,300 in 2007 to $55,000 in 2010, a 42.3 percent drop.

“So much of your net worth is in the form of home equity and if you are in a county that had the steepest declines it would follow you would have greater declines in wealth than the average person,” said Stan Geberer, a senior associate with the Orlando-based consulting firm Fishkind & Associates. “It’s highly likely that many people in Florida were hit harder than average.”

While home prices have inched upward in recent months in Palm Beach, Broward and Miami-Dade counties, they are still down 50 percent from their December 2006 peak, according to the most recent Standard & Poor’s/Case-Shiller index.

Geberer said one positive economic sign in Monday’s report is that costly credit card balances are down, meaning people are paying off bad debt. The proportion of families carrying a credit card balance fell to 39.4 percent in 2010, a drop of 6.7 percentage points from 2007.

The median credit card balance also fell, dropping from $3,100 in 2007 to $2,600 in 2010.

Because the survey only contains information through 2010, it doesn’t reflect more recent gains in the stock market, Snaith said. A separate survey the Fed released last week showed that total family net worth climbed 4.7 percent in the first quarter of the year to $62.9 trillion, about 28 percent above its recession low. The increase was fueled by stock market gains.

Those gains put net worth about 5 percent below its pre-recession peak of $66 trillion.

Those gains can be especially important to South Florida’s economy where retirees may have more of their wealth in the market over home equity, Snaith said.

While the report doesn’t break down net worth by state, it pointed to Florida, California, Nevada and Arizona as states that saw home price declines of 40 to 50 percent. Iowa, the report notes, saw only about a 1 percent drop in prices.

“The prices are still languishing here,” Snaith said about Florida.

The Associated Press contributed to this report.

Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-12 07:10:05

“While the report doesn’t break down net worth by state, it pointed to Florida, California, Nevada and Arizona as states that saw home price declines of 40 to 50 percent”

The median CA home price before the bust was over $500K, so a 40 percent drop in home prices would set the owner of one of these homes back at least $200K, before considering job loss, pension loss, or stock market loss.

Certainly CA is in the running for one of the states with the largest loss in household net worths?

Comment by sleepless_near_seattle
2012-06-12 13:23:02

Friend of mine who owns a successful small biz lost $180k on a personal property he finally sold after a year on the market. Now he wants to try his hand in the wine making arena and is looking to throw $1M down on 50 acres to get his dream started. I’ll give him credit, he’s quite the optimist. Or, maybe he’s that way because he’s using OPM.

Then again, knowing him, he probably found a way to write that $180k off as a business expense, as in, calling it a different division of the his company.

Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2012-06-12 13:47:30

Out of curiosity, property where, sleepless?

I’m an amateur winemaker going pro (small scale) this year myself… LMK if he needs a good winemaker! :-)

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Comment by sleepless_near_seattle
2012-06-12 13:58:18

Somewhere in the Columbia River Gorge or Yakima Valley. Not sure of exact location. He thinks what with the area being deemed a viticultural area that his presence is needed in the game, even though that was years ago and it’s already pretty mature in that area.

Just last month, my wife and I were tasting in the Willamette Valley and several of the winemakers we chatted with were complaining about all the nouveau vineyards and wineries popping up.

 
Comment by sleepless_near_seattle
2012-06-12 14:12:17

I think he just wants to be able to tell everyone he has a vineyard. I’ve NEVER even seen him drink wine. He’s a beer guy.

 
Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2012-06-12 14:12:18

and several of the winemakers we chatted with were complaining about all the nouveau vineyards and wineries popping up.

Yeah, there are an amazing number of them that have sprouted up in recent years…

From what I understand, sales are starting to pick up a smidge on the higher-end, after taking a bit of a shellacing in the downturn.

Personally, I expected more of a shake-out in the space, with the more heavily leveraged small wineries going bust. Haven’t really seen it yet, though. Oh well, can’t guess ‘em all right.

 
Comment by sleepless_near_seattle
2012-06-12 14:20:33

I think, other than rental houses, as discussed earlier in this bucket, people are looking for that annuity to retire on. It’s causing a glut in those areas.

If there’s a good business case, I say go for it. But as I noted, (that you might not have seen since we posted at the same time), this guy has zero experience in the area and isn’t even a consumer of wine. I think he’s succumbed to a trendy image more than anything.

 
Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2012-06-12 14:56:29

I think he just wants to be able to tell everyone he has a vineyard.

Priceless.

The wine business will likely eat this guy for lunch… You know the old saying about the best way to make a small fortune in the wine business… :-)

 
Comment by Florida Is Going To Kill Me ®
2012-06-12 16:27:58

“I’m an amateur winemaker”

Box it up and I’ll buy it!

 
Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2012-06-12 22:06:04

You’ll get no snobbery from me, Muggy; the box is not a bad packaging, even if it doesn’t get the nod of approval from the establishment yet.

It is kind of mind-blowing that we still seal our bottles up with a chunk of _tree_!

 
Comment by DB_in_AZ
2012-06-13 08:39:11

Just for the record, the cork comes from the outer layer of bark and is renewable. When we lived in Portugal we saw the trees, they strip the bark, then paint the tree and put a number on it (I think the year) and then repeat when the bark has grown back to the right thickness. So it doesn’t kill the tree at least.

 
Comment by MiddleCoaster
2012-06-13 11:58:18

The Portuguese are concerned about the trend toward screw caps on wine bottles, worried that it will mean the decline and fall of their cork business. Someone is always unhappy about something in this world.

 
 
 
 
Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2012-06-12 07:58:50

“The prices are still languishing here,” Snaith said about Florida.

Perhaps you’re operating under a “whole new economic model” there now, huh, Snaith?

 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-12 12:18:04

Tuesday, Jun 12, 2012 07:33 AM PDT
Middle-class catastrophe
The Fed releases brutal details on how the crash sucker-punched America. So why won’t it do anything?
By Andrew Leonard

For economy watchers, the title of the report released Monday by the Federal Reserve, “Changes in U.S. Family Finances From 2007 to 2010: Evidence From the Survey of Consumer Finances,” must inspire a feeling akin to what drivers on the highway experience when they see the twirling lights of police cars on the side of the road near the scene of a major accident. You know you shouldn’t stare, and you know what you see might make you sick, but you nevertheless end up rubbernecking anyway. It’s human nature — we can’t stop ourselves from goggling at disaster.

And so it is with the Survey, which the New York Times’ Binyamin Appelbaum calls ”one of the broadest and deepest sources of information about the financial health of American families” that we have. One look at the title tells you all you need to know: Here, in all their gory detail, will be found the brutal details on what happened to Americans in the immediate aftermath of the worst economic disaster since the Great Depression.

Bottom line — Americans got hammered by the crash. The median net worth of the American family fell by 38 percent between 2007 and 2010, from an average of $126,400 to $77,300. Median income fell by 7.7 percent. It was the worst decline in both categories since the survey started in 1989.

Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-12 12:23:46

“The distribution of the losses tells us that the middle class took the brunt of the damage, in terms of both net worth and income. But there are some interesting statistical oddities. For the lowest-income quintile of the American public, income actually rose by about 4 percent. Meanwhile, the top 10 percent of Americans saw their net worth tick up slightly.

The housing bust explains the divergence. Middle-class Americans tend to have most of their wealth invested in their homes. The nationwide collapse in housing prices clobbered home equity, but the poor and the rich were mostly insulated from the damage. The fact that income rose, slightly, for the poorest Americans is still a bit of a mystery.

Here is a conjecture: A substantial share of the poorest 10% simply fell off the radar screen into homelessness or due to outmigration. Thus what the survey picks up is a comparison of the deeply poor of yesterday to the present-day status of yesterday’s less-poor, rather than a valid longitudinal comparison.

I rescind my conjecture if the study used longitudinal data.

 
 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-12 21:44:45

Can anyone who gets all the hand wringing over the post-Spanish-bailout eurozone situation kindly explain? Judging from today’s Wall Street rally, it looks as though all is well again.

ft dot com
Fears rise over EU handling of debt crisis
June 13, 2012

 
 
Comment by The UNKNOWN TENANT
2012-06-12 04:38:21

Flood of Shadow Real Estate Inventory about to hit the market will drive prices

By Lynnettemarcene Follow Mon, 11 Jun 2012, 4:49pm

Flood of Shadow Real Estate Inventory about to hit the market will drive prices further down. My friend who works for B of A Foreclosure Dept informed me the National HUD moratorium was lifted last month in which they expect the next big wave of foreclosures to hit throughout the end of 2012 and 2013. The media cannot broadcast this because this information will cause potential buyers to hold off on buying properties which will further drive the prices down which will cause the banks to loose more money. Awe, poor executives at the banks…after they fraudulently used the gov’t bail out money to give themselves gigantic bonus, do we really feel sorry for them?

Below is what the media has posted so far as they do not want to publicize how grim the outlook really is.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/04/04/us-foreclosure-idUSBRE83319E20120404

Comment by CharlieTango
2012-06-12 05:54:20

The media cannot broadcast this because this information will cause potential buyers to hold off on buying properties which will further drive the prices down which will cause the banks to loose more money.

The media should report the news and comment on it.
How is it that the media cannot broadcast information in order to benefit banks at the cost of would be cheap home buyers?

Comment by The UNKNOWN TENANT
2012-06-12 06:15:12

“How is it that the media cannot broadcast information in order to benefit banks at the cost of would be cheap home buyers?”

So you are saying you would like to beat the press, or maybe just flog the press. Throw eggs at the press? What exactly would you like to do to the press?

What do you call someone who did not make it in Journalism?

A Realtor.

 
 
Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 06:03:35

“Until banks engage in meaningful principal reduction as a matter of course,” ESOP’s Seifert said after a recent protest at a Chase branch in Cleveland, “this crisis will not end.”

And there’s the money quote.

Comment by Hi-Z
2012-06-12 07:47:02

Meaningful principal reduction should occur in the old fashioned way; foreclosure and resale at market. Both perpetrators of the mess (buyer and lender) pay the piper for their ill-fated and often fraudulent decision then. But banks and homeloaners want the solution to make them whole no matter the cost to people who had nothing to do with it.

Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2012-06-12 08:02:48

old fashioned way;

The “old fashioned way” would be for the banks to do it voluntarily when they believe that it is in their best interest—e.g. when their losses due to a principal reduction would be lower than their losses on a foreclosure.

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Comment by Hi-Z
2012-06-12 09:41:27

Federal and State governments are doing everything in their power to make the old fashioned way difficult, expensive, and time consuming because after all they are all victims.

 
Comment by Florida Is Going To Kill Me ®
2012-06-12 16:39:27

“Federal and State governments are doing everything in their power to make the old fashioned way difficult”

See, this is where the circle jerk is completed. The State/Fed entities are kicking the can down the road, too, because they are most likely still getting paid their taxes dollars.

The two abandoned homes around me do not have delinquent taxes. Nobody wins by looking behind the curtain, all at once, all at the same time.

Lucky for me and my children this approach will effectively price us out for… for… for… for… for… for…forever.

Worse? NAR data shows that my children will grow up to be poor, color-blind, partially deaf, and possibly lose a kidney through renting.

 
 
 
 
Comment by ragerunner
2012-06-12 08:28:47

I know a real estate group that only does foreclosures and they stated the same thing. Starting in July the banks are going to start unloading their shadow inventory.

Comment by Rental Watch
2012-06-12 08:55:47

In what state(s) is the group active?

We have some visibility into what is happening in Southern California. What appears to be happening is there are more buyers with $ at auctions (driving up prices), but the volume of homes coming through the foreclosure process has been fairly steady.

There are rumors that some banks are going to hold private auctions to sell some of the housing in bulk, with the invitees on the participant list being groups with the capabilities to buy a lot of homes at once, but I’ve yet to hear of any of those auctions take place (while they certainly may have).

I’ve been hearing that there will be an uptick generally as well in the Southern California market, but the influx of capital there has been significant, so I’m not sure how much of an impact the uptick will have (it the uptick occurs).

 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-12 21:13:36

“Starting in July the banks are going to start unloading their shadow inventory.”

Kindly post a reference so we can be assured you are not blowing smoke in our eyes.

 
 
Comment by aNYCdj
2012-06-12 08:29:25

I still say wait for jan 2013 when the bush tax cuts on forgiven debt expires…

Banks will be glad to make short sales and sue you for the balance….those that scammed the system ( hidden assets) will not be able to file for BK.

 
Comment by Rental Watch
2012-06-12 08:47:22

“Online foreclosure marketplace RealtyTrac estimated that while foreclosures dropped slightly nationwide in February from January and from February 2011, they rose in 21 states and jumped sharply in cities like Tampa (64 percent), Chicago (43 percent) and Miami (53 percent).”

Cue the broken record:

Florida: Judicial State
Illinois: Judicial State

Total Judicial States in the US: 24 (+1? Nevada is officially non-judicial, but with their recent law making it harder to foreclose, they might as well be judicial).

I’m willing to bet that 2/3 or more of the 21 states where there was a significant uptick are in these 24 judicial states.

They say that the increase in foreclosure activity is “likely to be replicated across much of the United States.” Yet so far, they note spikes in 21 states, and call out specifically two of the worst offenders when it came to slow-playing the foreclosure mess.

This train wreck has not been playing out uniformly across the US, and it won’t start now.

 
Comment by zee_in_phx
2012-06-12 10:15:43

reading this just gave me goose bumps… thanks Mr. U T

 
 
Comment by oxide
2012-06-12 04:52:25

Next-door house history. I don’t want to give exact numbers because this house is next door to me. It’s a short sale. No one lives there, but someone comes 1-2 times a week to mow the lawn and walk around inside. There is no sign out front and no lockbox that I could see.

May 2001: Sold for X
May 2002: Sold for 1.3X
Jun 2005: Sold for 2.0X
Dec 2006: Zestimate 2.24X (peak)
Dec 2011: Listed for 1.7x
Dec 2011: Tax assessed for 1.4X
Apr 2012: Price change to 1.5X
May 2012: Price change to 1.30X
Jun 2012: Not for sale

Oxide’s assessment: Based on size and location, the house is probably worth its tax assessment price. But it’s got some bad paint on the outside and the roof looks marginal. 1.3X may be a fair price for a short sale.

For reference: 1.3X in 2012 has the same buying power as 1.0X in 2001. In other words, adjusting for inflation, this house is priced at the same price now as it sold for in 2001.

So the house was either taken off market, or an offer was accepted in a week. At the 1.3x price and low inventory I expected a steady stream of buyer traffic, but I only saw two parties visit the house.

Yesterday Highway59 posted about “flopping,” where a Realtor plays games to keep out buyers, keep the price low, and convince the bank to accept a very low price in the short sale. The bank sells at a low price to the Realtor’s compatriot. Once the bank takes the loss, the Realtor then flips the house up at a higher price. I wonder if that is what is happening here.

Comment by scdave
2012-06-12 06:47:41

Oxide…From yesterday…

So people feel the need to cheat — just once — to get slightly ahead, but after that you can maintain your lead on honesty alone ??

The only error in this quote is “to get slightly ahead”….In the three examples I gave, none would be considered slight…

But to the point of your question;
“so now cheating is the new normal”…

No…It has been going on since the birth of our nation…Look at your history books…Their are many legacy beneficiaries of very questionable if not out-right corrupt forefathers…Those same beneficiaries are now pillars (Kennedy’s) of our communities, and yes they are maintaining their lead on honesty alone…No need to cheat anymore, unless like I said you are Greedy & Stupid…

Comment by oxide
2012-06-12 10:47:14

But that’s not the new normal. Those who cheated in the past got ahead, way ahead. Now, we’re coming to a point where you have to cheat just to keep up.

Sourcing jobs to non-Americans could be considered a form of cheating.

Comment by scdave
2012-06-12 10:58:18

Now, we’re coming to a point where you have to cheat just to keep up ??

Good point…

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Comment by Housing Is Cratering®
2012-06-12 06:58:19

where a Realtor plays games to keep out buyers, keep the price low, and convince the bank to accept a very low price in the short sale. The bank sells at a low price to the Realtor’s compatriot. Once the bank takes the loss, the Realtor then flips the house up at a higher price. I wonder if that is what is happening here.

You wonder? After decades of corruption and unethical moves by these charlatans, you shouldn’t need any more proof.

These people are the problem, not the solution.

 
 
Comment by polly
2012-06-12 05:09:06

From Dean Baker’s Beat the Press Blog:

Romney’s Education Agenda; Beliefs Do Not Replace Policies
Tuesday, 12 June 2012 04:56

The NYT reports that Governor Romney will strongly push school vouchers if he gets into the White House. It told readers:

“Now Mr. Romney is taking his party back to its ideological roots by emphasizing a lesser role for Washington, replacing top-down mandates with a belief in market mechanisms.”

Top down mandates are a policy. The policy is not replaced with beliefs, it is replaced with other policies. In this case, the piece tells us the policy is a voucher that can be used for private schools. While the article repeatedly assures readers that the motive is an ideological belief in markets, there is another possibility that goes completely unmentioned in this article.

There are companies that profit from running private schools. Such companies could make large amounts of money if the Federal government were to pressure state and local governments to give students a voucher that could be used in their schools.

It is possible that Romney and his advisers are motivated by the desire to appease people running for profit schools rather than an ideological belief in the idea that market forces will somehow fix education for low income student. This possibility seems especially plausible since there is now considerable evidence that increased use of market mechanisms will not improve the quality of education.

Comment by Hwy50ina49Dodge
2012-06-12 06:08:30

Thee Church youth Disciple$ Cult member$ [but not Islam or Muslim or ...] + The Gov’t peon-citizen Tax Revenue$ = TrueBeliever’s “Tolerant” based Education $ystem for the Future! :-)

Vouchers Breathe New Life Into Shrinking Catholic Schools

“But families, including those who aren’t Catholic, must be willing to accept weekly Mass and religion classes in many schools.” ;-)

By STEPHANIE BANCHERO and JENNIFER LEVITZ / Wall $t. Jaundice

The most impressive gains for Catholic education have happened in Indiana, where the nation’s largest voucher system rolled out last year. More than 2,400 children used state-issued vouchers to transfer from public to Catholic schools. Another 1,500 used vouchers to move to other religious or private schools.

EAST CHICAGO, Ind.—It had been years since Principal Kathleen Lowry pulled extra desks from the dusty attic of St. Stanislaus, the only Catholic school left in this port city. But after Indiana began offering parents vouchers in the spring of 2011 to pay for private tuition, she had to bring down 30 spare desks and hire three teachers’ aides.

Thanks to vouchers, St. Stanislaus, which was $140,000 in debt to the Catholic Diocese of Gary at the end of 2010, picked up 72 new students, boosting enrollment by 38%.

“God has been good to us,” says Ms. Lowry. “Growth is a good problem to have.”

For the first time in decades, Catholic education is showing signs of life. Driven by expanding voucher programs, outreach to Hispanic Catholics and donations by business leaders, Catholic schools in several major cities are swinging back from closures and declining enrollment.

Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 06:24:23

“Growth is a good problem to have.”

Sure, just ask anyone with cancer.

Comment by Hwy50ina49Dodge
2012-06-12 06:59:36

Are you inferring that Integration of Church & $tate is a form of certain type of dangerous cancer? :-)

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Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 07:10:17

You said it, I didn’t!

The position of the Catholic Church in these matters is almost laughable. They have no problem taking federal money for schools, medical services, etc., but then cry foul when the goobermin tells them what to do, bloviating about “separation of Church and state”. Really? Don’t take the money, then.

 
Comment by 2banana
2012-06-12 07:55:35

At one time there was no income tax in America (for almost 140 years).

Now the average joe pays almost HALF his wages in some kind of tax.

How about we give some money back to them so the PARENTS can make the choice of where to send their kids to schools?

Oh - that’s right. Liberals are all for CHOICE - but only when it comes to aborting a baby. ALL other decision are better left to the government.

It is almost comical. The government takes more and more of a person’s money and force those people to become dependent on government. Never does it dawn on them to take LESS money.

Really? Don’t take the money, then.

 
Comment by Blue Skye
2012-06-12 08:13:07

The Catholics have to obey the laws of the land just like everybody else. The rest of us should support their rights to otherwise act according to their beliefs. The Feds like to play the bully, going beyond what is law often, using the flow of money as a big stick. Personally, I think it’s ridiculous to insist that the nuns hand out condoms with every free school lunch. JMO.

 
Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 08:48:17

I don’t disagree with you, but they shouldn’t take the money if they don’t want to hand out condoms with free school lunches.

 
Comment by polly
2012-06-12 08:54:25

“Personally, I think it’s ridiculous to insist that the nuns hand out condoms with every free school lunch. JMO.”

Since no one has insisted on that, I guess it is a good that you got your opinion out there. What about addressing something that actually happened?

 
Comment by In Colorado
2012-06-12 13:17:13

“Personally, I think it’s ridiculous to insist that the nuns hand out condoms with every free school lunch.”

Since they don’t hand out condoms with the free school lunches at the PUBLIC high school where my kids went, I don’t see why they would have to hand them out in Parochial schools.

That said, K-12 Parochial programs don’t get any government funding, unlike Universities. The thing about most Catholic Universities, unlike K-12 schools, they are not Church property. Technically, Parochial Schools are owned by the local Diocese. Universities are not. Most have ties to religious orders, which in many cases are tenuous. For instance, none of the board members at my alma mater are Priests or Nuns.

 
 
 
 
Comment by oxide
2012-06-12 06:59:37

It’s another private sector money grab. Private sector loves nothing more than to run a program using government subsidies and taking their little skim.

Some people may think that corporate schools would simply jettison the problem students to the street because they would be too costly and cut into company profits. I disagree. If the government forces the private schools to keep problem students, the corporation would simply demand higher subsidies to where a problem student would be even more profitable.

Comment by Northeastener
2012-06-12 08:18:23

It’s another private sector money grab.

I completely disagree. The public education system is broken, except in the wealthiest of school systems. No Child Left Behind is an abomination and mandated standardized tests at the state level to determine student and teacher performance is a disaster. The blame is on Federal, State, and Local governments, Teacher’s Unions, bloated and overpaid administrators and bureaucracies, and lastly, un-involved and dis-interested parents.

I welcome vouchers as I’m sick of paying real-estate taxes to fund and support an education system that we don’t use, is overpriced, and performs poorly. I know many parents like me who are fed up with the public system, have pulled our children, and would support vouchers… it has nothing to do with a “money grab” for private industry, but wanted the best possible education for our children.

Full disclosure: Our children go to a private Catholic school, and will continue to do so as long as we can afford it. My wife and I went through public schools (I attended a private Catholic high school) and met at a State University.

Comment by aNYCdj
2012-06-12 08:34:10

And they force your kids to speak ENGLISH when they walk in the door.

Now if we could get that same commitment in public schools.

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Comment by Northeastener
2012-06-12 10:21:10

And they force your kids to speak ENGLISH when they walk in the door.

Not just English… French as well. French lessons start at Kindergarten in my children’s school.

 
Comment by aNYCdj
2012-06-12 13:01:31

Sad you kids wont learn Ebonics…its the new normal language

—-French lessons start at Kindergarten in my children’s school.

 
Comment by Arizona Slim
2012-06-12 14:58:39

Sad you kids wont learn Ebonics…its the new normal language

Ummm, deejay, I think it’s time to cut the race-baiting out. Seriously.

You’ve told us that you work in radio, which is a very diverse field. Which means that you’d be well served by learning to get along with all sorts of different people, from the guy who does the hip-hop show to the lady who’s been hosting the gospel show for decades. Not to mention the Latino/bilingual public affairs show producers.

 
 
Comment by scdave
2012-06-12 08:35:47

un-involved and dis-interested parents ??

There it is right there…Solve that problem and everything else falls into place…In many instances, K-12 has become a giant day care program…I say give local districts full independence from the Fed’s & to a large degree the State…Let districts set the standards for conduct & curriculum…Don’t like the policies, go to another district…

Fareed Zakaria had a excellent program recently on other countries who seem to get it right…In watching it, I did not see one student with a nose ring or purple hair…

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Comment by ahansen
2012-06-12 09:32:18

Just for the record, sc, my stepson had both nose ring AND purple hair, was elected student body president, and graduated from an Ivy then went on to get his MD.

Lost the mohawk and nose ring, but has now has full body tats to go with his specialty board certifications. Just sayin’.

 
Comment by scdave
2012-06-12 11:06:59

Just for the record, sc, my stepson had both nose ring AND purple hair, was elected student body president, and graduated from an Ivy then went on to get his MD ??

The exception or the rule here my lady ??

Besides, the metaphor was used to make the point that in the program I watched there was obviously no open policy to how you dressed or looked vs. the anything goes in our public schools…There were rules…Simular to most if not all private schools…Hell, if you can get the kids to follow the damm rules you are likely 99% of the way to a productive citizen…

 
Comment by Arizona Slim
2012-06-12 11:35:56

Just for the record, sc, my stepson had both nose ring AND purple hair, was elected student body president, and graduated from an Ivy then went on to get his MD.

Lost the mohawk and nose ring, but has now has full body tats to go with his specialty board certifications. Just sayin’.

A couple of weekends ago, I was part of the volunteer crew that organized the grand re-opening of the city pool in the park at the end of the street.

The Tucson Fire Department came with a ladder truck, and oh, was that a big hit with the kids. One of the firefighters was, shall we say, quite well acquainted with tattoo parlors.

There was a time when such a guy probably wouldn’t have been considered fit for duty as a firefighter. But not now.

Listening to him talk to the kids about his job was all that was needed to dispel any doubts. This guy’s a professional firefighter through and through, and I’m glad to have him serving us in Tucson.

 
Comment by The_Overdog
2012-06-12 12:48:23

It’s gonna be a wierd world when you see people in corporate offices with face tattoos.

 
Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2012-06-12 13:50:00

It’s gonna be a wierd world when you see people in corporate offices with face tattoos.

Bet we’ll get there eventually…

 
Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2012-06-12 20:20:32

We won’t get there. The “Dress For Success” lessons about classic attire commanding respect is going to always win. No way would anyone respect a tattooed face popped out of the neck of a classic suit.

Overly tattooed people are worse than the punks of the early 80s with spiked rooster tail Mohawks and piercings. Because tattoos may just as well be permanent.

Permanent low man on the totem pole status. Like a felony, but worse!

 
 
Comment by drumminj
2012-06-12 10:14:51

I welcome vouchers as I’m sick of paying real-estate taxes to fund and support an education system that we don’t use

Now you know how us non-parents feel.

How about we simply have parents pay the cost of education of their children? You can pay a private school, or you can pay the state school. Subsidies from low-income students can come from the fees of other parents/children.

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Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2012-06-12 11:42:26

Subsidies from low-income students can come from the fees of other parents/children.

Why should non-low-income parents subsidize the education of low-income students any more than you should? They didn’t choose to have _those_ kids, only their own. That position seems disingenuous, drumminj.

Personally, I think there is societal value in an educated populace; in other words, we all benefit, so we all pay.

 
Comment by Carl Morris
2012-06-12 12:08:49

There is a certain logic to that, but I think we’re better off as a society to pay to give the poor an opportunity for a decent education. I think we should be much quicker to kick out the troublemakers, though. It’s not fair to the ones that are trying to have to do it in a jailhouse environment. Also not fair to make teachers do the work of wardens.

 
Comment by drumminj
2012-06-12 14:25:57

Why should non-low-income parents subsidize the education of low-income students any more than you should? They didn’t choose to have _those_ kids, only their own. That position seems disingenuous, drumminj.

There’s already a precedent for this type of approach - if I have a phone line, I subsidize phone service for low-income folks. Same with other utilities - other customers pay a fee to subsidize the lower-income customers. Why is it disingenuous to suggest such an approach for government schools?

I don’t disagree there’s value in an educated populace. However at what cost to folks like me, without children? I really don’t believe it’s proper/right/moral for one group of people to be able to vote for the government to take money from another group and put it in their own pockets.

 
Comment by polly
2012-06-12 15:29:38

Are you willing to pledge to never use services provided by people with public educations? Go to a special line in the supermarket that can’t be staffed with people who went to public school? Never use a doctor who went to a public school? Or pay some kind of other extra tax so that your share of the public education of members of the military can be covered? No? Well, you benefit from public education every single day of your life. We happen to allocate that cost (direct benefit is too burdensome to trace) by having you pay property taxes to educate the people who are children while you own property (and a bit of state and federal income tax). The benefit of educating childen goes to the child and the people who have to share a society with that child, not just to the parents of that child.

 
Comment by drumminj
2012-06-12 15:48:32

Are you willing to pledge to never use services provided by people with public educations? Go to a special line in the supermarket that can’t be staffed with people who went to public school?

That’s a ridiculous argument, Polly. They are being paid for their service — I’m paying for the products. There’s no distinction to be made here regarding public schooling vs private. Should folks have to pay MORE if it’s staffed by someone who was schooled privately?!

 
Comment by polly
2012-06-12 17:40:41

Yes they are being paid for their services. But they can only provide those services because of the public education they received. If you decline to help educate the current crop of kids (the way society currently decides to maintain an educated populace) then you should have to pay something for taking advantage of the education that society has provided for the publicly educated people you interact with on a daily basis. Otherwise you are a free rider on the system.

Stop thinking about public education as a benefit to the parents by realizing that we are all dependent on living in a society filled with educated people of all ages, and it becomes obvious.

 
Comment by mathguy
2012-06-12 18:53:58

Polly,

Seems like a great issue to leave to the states to decide. No reason the feds have to get involved.

 
Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2012-06-12 20:24:10

Where is that Lew Rockwell link again? Polly conveniently ignored it the first time…

Ah!

http://lewrockwell.com/vance/vance279.html

Drumminj, you are correct!

 
Comment by drumminj
2012-06-12 22:05:06

If you decline to help educate the current crop of kids (the way society currently decides to maintain an educated populace) then you should have to pay something for taking advantage of the education that society has provided for the publicly educated people you interact with on a daily basis.

I disagree with your line of argument, but let’s accept it for a moment.

It naturally follows, then, that one should pay more when provided a service by or purchasing a product designed/manufactured/delivered by someone who’s parents paid for a private education, yes? And if one went to private university rather than public, same thing?

And new immigrants - legal and illegal - should pay more as well, as they’ve not contributed, right?

And the folks living in Sun City and other 55+ communities who don’t pay property taxes to the school district?

Are you beginning to see why your argument is ridiculous?

 
 
 
Comment by Carl Morris
2012-06-12 08:51:50

If the government forces the private schools to keep problem students, the corporation would simply demand higher subsidies to where a problem student would be even more profitable.

Or perhaps the Education Industrial Complex and the Prison Industrial Complex could get some synergy going…

Comment by aNYCdj
2012-06-12 13:08:51

THEY DO Carl…

Why do you think i rant so much about speaking ENGLISH? I see it as a training ground for prison, and we are too scared to tell black people to speak English, all that PC stuff gets in our way….but 90+% speak Ebonics in jail….

Add in the flooding of rap hip hop music its done on purpose

I believe JayZ and the KKK are on the same side wanting to keep them niccazs in their place.

———
Or perhaps the Education Industrial Complex and the Prison Industrial Complex could get some synergy going…

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Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 14:41:04

Could get?

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Comment by Hard Rain
2012-06-12 05:28:25

A bit for the bucket. Anyone else ever notice the seemingly significant tight age grouping of the frequent/longtime posters here ( I am 52)?

I have often wondered at the fortuitousness of our generation in avoiding the calamities most others have faced. I don’t think I am alone in the feeling we are due.

Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-12 07:14:21

Beware the curse of longevity.

June 11, 2012

Counting on an Inheritance? Count Again.
The bad news: Many baby boomers are likely to get less money from Mom and Dad than they thought. The worse news: They may have to help their parents financially instead.
By ANNE TERGESEN

Counting on an inheritance? Count again. Baby boomers may not only be getting less money than they thought, they also may have to help out their parents financially, as Anne Tergesen explains on Lunch Break. Photo: Getty Images.

Baby boomers: Get ready for a double whammy.

For years now, there’s been a lot of talk about boomers getting tremendous windfalls as their parents pass on. Many boomers, in fact, have been lagging behind in their savings, betting on—hoping for—big bequests, especially since many of them suffered big losses in 2008.

But for a growing number of boomers, things aren’t going according to plan. The postwar generation is living longer—and many are spending their savings along the way. And, of course, many of them also took a hit in 2008.

The result is that, as a group, boomers likely won’t be getting as much of an inheritance as they hoped. Even worse, far from receiving a bequest, a growing number are tapping some of their own savings to help their cash-strapped parents make ends meet.

For families, the result is often a lot of scrambling, dashed dreams, and conflict and angst as parents and children try to come to grips with the lean new reality—and divide up a smaller pie.

“There are way too many adult children I see who are looking at Mom and Dad’s estate as their ticket to a secure retirement,” says M. Holly Isdale, an estate planner in Bryn Mawr, Pa. “But with people living longer, much of the money is likely to be spent.”

How much longer? Thanks to medical gains, a 65-year-old man has a 60% chance of living to age 80 and a 40% chance of reaching 85. For women, the odds are 71% and 53%, respectively. All of this has made the 85-and-over age bracket the fastest-growing segment of the population. In an era of low interest rates, volatile financial markets, and rising costs for health and long-term care, finding money to cover those years isn’t always easy.

 
Comment by goon squad
2012-06-12 07:17:01

HA! 2 decades behind there and will not be doing any “household formation” in the next decade, if ever. The squad household is already formed, in a rental for less than 20% of net income. And which could be afforded on unemployment or Lucky Ducky wages.

The REIC wants us to buy the LIE of loanownership, but after enduring a decade working as both a contractor and permanent employee in Corporate America© marked by minimal job security, layoffs, no health insurance, why bother?

When the squad lived with ex-squadette and gave her money for the mortgage was as close to loanownership as we’ll ever be. Every weekend was wasted doing yard work and going to Home Depot. And there were always those “surprise” maintenance issues to deal with (and pay for).

Also at the age now where some of the squad’s married friends are heading for divorce, usually resulting from arguments about money, and said money issues resulting from guess what? Loanownership and their unsustainable lifestyles. Just as we’ll skip the starter house, will skip the “starter marriage” as well. Loosers!

Comment by In Colorado
2012-06-12 07:53:26

“and permanent employee in Corporate America©”

I think you meant “full-time” employee. There’s nothing “permanent” about working in “Corporate America©”. If anything, layoffs should be added to the list of “inevitable” things one will experience, along with taxes and death.

Comment by goon squad
2012-06-12 08:12:28

“Permanent” as in when the squad worked for TARP bank we had health insurance and 401k. As opposed to contractor gigs with Fortune 500 defense contractor and Educational-Industrial-Complex Corp©. Employment with TARP bank was of course “at will” employment.

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Comment by scdave
2012-06-12 08:40:33

layoffs should be added to the list of “inevitable” things one will experience ??

I have only been layed-off once in my life…Broke my heart.. :(

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Comment by In Colorado
2012-06-12 08:02:24

Every weekend was wasted doing yard work and going to Home Depot.

I don’t know about that. I spend maybe 2 hours a week tops doing yard work, and that’s only from May through September. As for the Home Despot, I never understood the endless urge to do “projects” around the house. I like the yard just fine the way it is. I can easily resist the urge to remodel it every year, adding/removing fountains, flagstones, flower beds, etc. The walls are painted and will stay that way. On the rare occasions when I go, I always wonder why so many people need to purchase drywall, 2×4’s, plywood, etc.

Comment by goon squad
2012-06-12 08:19:01

The extent of each squadette’s “nesting instinct” is different. Current squadette is fully nested in Capitol Hill 1BR/1BA resulting in us getting to leave Denver every weekend for more interesting environs…

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Comment by Northeastener
2012-06-12 08:48:36

I always wonder why so many people need to purchase drywall, 2×4’s, plywood, etc.

If they’re like me, it’s because their house was built in 1900, renovated in the 1970’s, and is a complete “living space” disaster: from the horsehair plaster, and lead-paint infested molding to 1970’s style kitchen cabinets.

Sometimes you just need to knock it all down to the studs and start over… or buy new construction, which has it’s own issues in a high-cost state like MA.

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Comment by scdave
2012-06-12 09:12:22

built in 1900, renovated in the 1970’s, and is a complete “living space” disaster ??

Funny but its the truth…Houses that age have the most dysfunctional living area’s you can imagine…How big is your cl;oset ?? :)

 
Comment by In Colorado
2012-06-12 09:15:23

Understood. I have always avoided the “handyman’s specials” (or as Realtors describe them: “needs TLC”) like the plague. Yet another reason why we fled California. Those were the only places we could afford there.

 
Comment by Northeastener
2012-06-12 10:03:39

Those were the only places we could afford there.

Yep. Sounds exactly like us. Only difference is we’re stuck here if we want to raise kids with family around.

How big is your cl;oset ?

You have closets?!?

 
Comment by scdave
2012-06-12 11:08:59

LOL….

 
Comment by Robin
2012-06-12 16:21:50

Built in 1918 - master (originally 1BR) has 3′x3′ closet.

 
 
 
Comment by Northeastener
2012-06-12 08:28:50

Also at the age now where some of the squad’s married friends are heading for divorce, usually resulting from arguments about money

If it flies, floats, or f***s, rent it.

I used to think that saying applied to things like horses. Now I know better.

 
Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2012-06-12 20:36:07

Your realization reads a lot like mine that caused me to hoist anchor at the old age of 41 and live the techie cheapo nomadic life. Before those days I was telling myself there is no way I could be very fit, have a rewarding career, and wonderful family. Only two of those, yes. So one had to be told bye. Ironically she married right away, had two kids, and divorced within four years that we parted. A wonderful woman though. I was stabbed repeatedly by the big corporation because I was not in the in crowd. If not for that, I would be a family man today married to that wonderful woman. I could not stay with that company without being shamed further. But what’s done is done.

Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2012-06-12 22:12:05

I was stabbed repeatedly by the big corporation because I was not in the in crowd. If not for that, I would be a family man today married to that wonderful woman.

Bill, how did your being stabbed by the big corporation result in you not being married? I didn’t get the connection…

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Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2012-06-13 07:23:47

It was the only company in town that I could work in. Had to relocate as a temporary in the next city and brought my girlfriend with me - she was finished with her classes for her Phd and just had to follow up on her thesis and could do it in the next city. But I lost the stability. I could not go back to that corporation and it turned out that Phoenix was (in 2002) about to have a glut of engineers looking for work.

 
 
Comment by ahansen
2012-06-12 23:12:09

Hugs, Bila. That’s a hard row, and I’m sorry you had to go through that.

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Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2012-06-13 07:25:22

Still want to go back to that original company - not for the love of the management, but with a big pile of cash and be driving an Audi R8 with investment income higher than the annual income of managers two levels above me - that’s the only revenge I wanted.

 
 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-13 00:08:31

Bill,

That is a genuinely sad tale, but I doubt it is uncommon in these trying times. I frankly am surprised that I did not follow my late-twenties plan to remain a bachelor.

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Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2012-06-13 07:31:19

I think I reacted to the lost decade at the very beginning of that decade without guessing it would be lost. I mean I really prospered because of living very cheap and dollar cost averaging in all asset classes outside of real estate. Gold and Series I savings bonds were my best places and if I could go back to 2001 I would have put every last penny in those areas.

 
 
 
 
Comment by Housing Is Cratering®
2012-06-12 07:33:18

“Anyone else ever notice the seemingly significant tight age grouping of the frequent/longtime posters here ( I am 52)?”

It seems that way doesn’t it…….. Mid 40’s to early 50’s seems to be the demographic here.

Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2012-06-12 08:17:35

Mid 40’s to early 50’s seems to be the demographic here.

+1.

Which raises the question: why were people of this age-range more likely to spot the bubble?

Was the era in which we were raised more likely to encourage individual thinking rather than group-think?

Or is it something about stage-of-life that made us spot the bubble?

Other possibilities?

Comment by Carl Morris
2012-06-12 09:00:58

Or is it something about stage-of-life that made us spot the bubble?

I think it’s the stage of life. When you’re older you’ve made it or you haven’t but either way all you can do is live with the consequences. When you’re younger your eyes are firmly fixed on whatever prize you’re obsessed with and you’re not really looking around much. It seems like 40s is when you first look up and try to evaluate whether the prize you’re after is really what you want. That’s how it feels to me anyway. The concrete isn’t quite set yet and I have time for one more major adjustment and then I’m going to need to live with it…

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Comment by Realtors Are Swindlers®
2012-06-12 09:29:25

“It seems like 40s is when you first look up and try to evaluate whether the prize you’re after is really what you want.”

BINGO. Took the words right out of my skull.

 
 
Comment by WT Economist
2012-06-12 09:03:31

The first generation to be worst off than the one before (though hardly the last).

Some of us were in the coastal housing market during the late 1980s bubbles or in the Southwest in the mid-1980s.

Those older got the benefits from the 1970s and early 1980s housng price run up. Those younger were too young to experience the previous bust.

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Comment by Avocado
2012-06-12 14:00:48

I am 46, sold in 2005 and 2009, over 50% gains on each. No pizzing it away, nearly unemployed.

I saw the bubble, cashed out, might buy in 2013 when inventory goes up.

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Comment by happyfriday
2012-06-12 09:45:07

No, there are lots of 30’s out here as well.

Comment by goon squad
2012-06-12 09:58:03

Yup. Ask anyone whose adult working life has been framed by the dotcom bubble, 9/11, the housing bubble, and the Greater Depression of 2008-2020 how well it has worked out for them…

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Comment by Northeastener
2012-06-12 10:05:52

ask anyone whose adult working life has been framed by the dotcom bubble, 9/11, the housing bubble, and the Greater Depression of 2008-2020 how well it has worked out for them…

Stop. You’re depressing me…

 
Comment by Happy2bHeard
2012-06-12 13:04:53

The Arab Oil embargo, the rampant inflation of the 70s, outsourcing of the 80s and 90s, S&L debacle.

 
Comment by howiewowie
2012-06-12 14:13:14

The Arab Oil embargo, the rampant inflation of the 70s, outsourcing of the 80s and 90s, S&L debacle.

All of that seemed to work out pretty well for my parents, who worked through all of that. 70’s inflation worked out pretty well when they bought a house in the early part of the decade and sold it for much more in the latter part. And then sold that home in the late 80s for almost triple what they paid for it.

Now my mom was stay-at-home until the mid 80s. She then got a job she just retired from last year after almost 30 years there. My dad has had a number of jobs and was laid of twice, both in the 90s, but wasn’t out of work long either time.

I remember asking him how much he made when I was in middle school back in 1988. It was in the $50K range. Solidly middle class. Fastforward to now and I’m about the same age he was and I’m still not at what he made 25 years ago. Part of that is my choice of profession, but it still sucks to think about that.

 
Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2012-06-12 14:26:30

70’s inflation worked out pretty well when they bought a house in the early part of the decade and sold it for much more in the latter part. And then sold that home in the late 80s for almost triple what they paid for it.

That only works out well if you are cashing out or down-sizing. If they bought a roughly equivalent or better home elsewhere, then those gains were all phantom, as the houses they were buying had inflated as well.

 
Comment by Happy2bHeard
2012-06-12 21:34:29

“All of that seemed to work out pretty well for my parents, who worked through all of that. 70’s inflation worked out pretty well when they bought a house in the early part of the decade”

Buying in the early 70s was key. By 1973, inflation took off and the ability to save at a rate that beat inflation declined. I suspect your folks were born before 1950. If they graduated in 1968, they had 5 years to save, unless they went to college.

 
 
 
Comment by Arizona Slim
2012-06-12 11:39:22

Mid-50s for this HBB-er. Still waiting for the hair to go gray, however.

I guess I inherited Dad’s hair coloring. Guy didn’t get gray until he was in his seventies.

And thanks, Mom, for the voice. It worked well for you in the classroom when you started teaching in your forties. It’s helping me in my emergent running-the-mouth career. Current career outpost: radio deejay. Next show is this Sunday.

Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2012-06-12 20:40:21

My sisters are older than my 53 years. We four inherited our mom’s hair. I am the worse off (unless they color the fringes). Got white at the nape of my neck and my sideburns. Otherwise same brown color.

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Comment by Ol'Bubba
2012-06-12 17:03:09

Put me down for early to mid 50’s.

My oldest siblings are the first of the baby boomers, and it seems like they had first dibs on everything.

 
Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2012-06-12 20:37:11

53 as of a couple weeks ago ;)

 
 
Comment by Carl Morris
2012-06-12 08:54:52

A bit for the bucket. Anyone else ever notice the seemingly significant tight age grouping of the frequent/longtime posters here ( I am 52)?

I think I’ve noticed a cluster of early-mid 40s, too.

Comment by Linda
2012-06-12 18:38:10

65 for me. Sold my Dow stock at 10,500 before the stock mkt crashed. Dived back in at 8,500. Just sold it all when in reached 12,900. Living on savings until I hit 70.

 
 
Comment by cactus
2012-06-12 09:29:18

Cusp boomers

had to wait but not completely shut-out

Comment by sleepless_near_seattle
2012-06-13 00:13:47

I think it’s partly that and partly what Carl said above about reaching 40. Later Boomers and most of GenX. 42, here. For this span of ages, methinks most of us had a pretty good example set for us as to fairly frugal living, no? Those just before, and just after, perhaps not so much.

Comment by DB_in_AZ
2012-06-13 08:59:52

My fiancee is 49 and I am 46. It seems like we are just a bit too late to the party and are going to end up with the cleanup and none of the fun. I am worried that we will never be able to retire comfortably. I am already vested in 2 pensions, which I am guessing will probably be bankrupt or greatly reduced by the time I am eligible to collect.

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Comment by The UNKNOWN TENANT
2012-06-12 05:46:26

A dingo did eat her baby

(maybe it was on bath salts)

1 hour 9 minutes ago, Reuters Videos

A court in Australia rules a wild dog was responsible for the death of an infant 32 years ago. Julie Noce reports.

http://my.news.yahoo.com/video/dingo-did-eat-her-baby-053816882.html

Comment by Robin
2012-06-12 16:28:07

Yes, but it didn’t disrobe.

 
 
Comment by The UNKNOWN TENANT
2012-06-12 05:50:08

Sorry if this was already posted but better safe than sorry.

Flashlight Bombs Puzzle Phoenix Authorities

By AMANDA LEE MYERS Associated Press
PHOENIX June 9, 2012 (AP)

Flick the switch on these flashlights and they don’t light up. They blow up.

Three of these bombs have exploded within the last month in the Phoenix area, causing minor injuries to five people and raising fears of more serious ones.

Police still have no idea who is behind them and have taken the unusual step of putting up 22 billboards across the sprawling metro area to warn residents about discarded flashlights.

“The nature of the bombings are so random,” said Tom Mangan, a special agent at the U.S. Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives in Phoenix.

Mangan said the agency has ruled out any connection to terrorism because the targets have been random and there have been no messages or demands.

The ATF said the bombs appear to have been made by the same person or people because their design was identical.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/flashlight-bombs-puzzle-phoenix-authorities-16531427 - -

Comment by Hwy50ina49Dodge
2012-06-12 06:13:55

“the agency has ruled out any connection to terrorism because the targets have been random and there have been no messages or demands.”

Did any ask if they all had the same brand name like : Tylenol, or made in China?

 
Comment by Northeastener
2012-06-12 08:31:41

Mangan said the agency has ruled out any connection to terrorism because the targets have been random

Did this statement not come across as a bit strange to anyone else? I mean, the whole point of “terrorism” is to instill fear in an asymmetric fashion…

Comment by oxide
2012-06-12 09:52:13

Agree. The Washington area probably suffered more terror at the hands of the Washington Sniper than we ever did from AQ.

Comment by Carl Morris
2012-06-12 12:39:32

I’ve been surprised that AQ didn’t jump on that proven effective bandwagon. Makes me think they have a lot less ready-to-go sleeper cell people than we were originally worried about.

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Comment by Arizona Slim
2012-06-12 12:51:15

I seem to recall reading that, once in the United States, more than a few sleeper cell members come to the realization that this country isn’t so bad after all. So, their terrorist aspirations, nod off and fall asleep.

 
 
 
 
 
Comment by The UNKNOWN TENANT
2012-06-12 05:53:57

Bath Salts May Be Behind Naked Man Confronting Girl In Park

June 11, 2012 5:32 PM

MIAMI (CBS4) – The drug that made headlines after the causeway cannibal case is back in the news again.

This time, North Miami Beach Police said a man believed to be on bath salts stripped nearly naked at a childrens playground and threatened a three-year-old girl with sexual advances.

Police said surviellance video shows Shane Shuyler stripping in the tot lot and then going very close to a three-year-old girl.

http://miami.cbslocal.com/2012/06/11/bath-salts-may-be-behind-naked-man-confronting-girl-in-park/ - -

 
Comment by vinceinwaukesha
2012-06-12 05:54:40

I seem to be posting with a 24 hour tape delay…

WRT the “Everyone’s moving out of Chicago because of macroeconomic effects” there is an intermediate step between (insert political distractor issue) and people moving out that is being skipped, people are moving out or not moving in solely because of microeconomic effects. On a personal level, everything is too expensive, too small, high crime, and travel is way too fast and cheap. I’m two hours away by train, maybe three by car, and I visit at least once a year for business and pleasure. Cool museums, used to be cool tours in the financial district before they 911′d those away. The food isn’t any better than I can get locallly. The shopping used to be legendary when I was a kid, but now its all made in the same Chinese factory and shipped locally just as well as Chicago, and everyone shops online anyway. Its fun to visit once a year, but I would never want to live there. If they want me to move there, they need to 1) Improve the cost/income ratio 2) make travel much more expensive and slower so I can’t live somewhere cheap but have fun in CHC anyway 3) Make CHC much more attractive to visit, more than annually, if I was visiting almost every weekend maybe I’d move there, but there’s not enough “good stuff” 4) Improve the american lifestyle ratio of (time spent working and home drudgery) vs (time spent doing fun stuff) such that there would be any point in moving there. Sitting in a cubical for 11 hours a day, or folding laundry and changing diapers at home isn’t any more exciting simply because I’m in Chicago, may as well stay here. I’m not sure that(political distractor issue) or (political 3rd rail issue) will help in any way with these problems. Destroying the last middle class union jobs might make the R party very happy, but its not going to make CHC a better cultural destination, or make the cost of living there any cheaper (any savings from union busting will of course go into CEO salaries, or into the world famous massive corruption the city is famous for, etc), likewise letting the D side win by installing socialized medicine like the rest of the civilized world is also not going to encourage me to move there. So the logic in the article was pretty lame to non-existing.

WRT 40% of the workforce “retiring” I believe we have a definition problem. Look at the labor force participation graphs as posted on zerohedge pretty much weekly. Only around 60% of working age people are currently working as of “now”. During the boom it approached 65% and now its more like 55% whatever just round it to about 3 in 5 folks “my age” have a job. Of course some without jobs are in .mil, some are students in .edu, about 1% are guests of the mostly for profit prison industrial complex, some are permanently totally disabled… I think the insurance exec’s estimate is based on some fraction of the 40% currently not working admitting they’ll never work again, ever, plus some continued downsizing especially of those too old to ever be rehired (like my mom), equals a total of 40% of the U.S. Workforce will never hold a paying job again, aka “they are retired”. Does not mean 40% reached the magic age or they’re going to get any benefits at all, it just means 2 in 5 will realize they will never hold a job again for the rest of their lives, whereas at least some fraction now think good times are right around the corner. I think a lot of discussion yesterday was good, but missed that rather important point that retirement is a state of mind more than a collection of magic dates and entitlement programs.

WRT inheritance disappearing, my elderly grandmother passed away about 18 months ago, and carrying costs of real estate during probate are an interesting issue that has not been discussed here on the HBB as far as I know (and I’ve been lurking since 2005 or so). So lets say a 85 year old widow owns a house with a mortgage… OK well toward the end, the medical industrial complex took away almost everything she had, exactly as they’ve been carefully designed to do … except for the house … great, at least there’s still a house to divide up. Now carrying costs including the mortgage are in excess of $1K/month and lets say her net worth was maybe $50K at death. Of course SS and retirement pensions and annuities and whatever else she had stops at the date of death, but the house-vampire lives on forever, draining the estate until its eventually sold. Lets say it takes two years from death to final sale and dividing up the loot, which is probably realistic. Its been 18 months so far. Its not unlikely that by the time the house is sold, the lawyers and fees are paid, there will be pretty much nothing left. Every month that this drags on, my inheritance drops by (roughly) $300. Now my mother in law is in the same situation, old and owns a house, so they’ll be no inheritance there. My mother rents, which is great news, bad news is she’s a lucky ducky downsize downsize downsize, so we’ll get everything she has, which is approximately nothing before the medical industrial complex scrapes out the last pennies. Every other ancestor is already dead and any financial resources went to the widows or kids literally decades ago, etc. I don’t think my anecdotal situation of basically not expecting to inherit any money at all, is all that unusual, so I totally believe the articles claim that there will be no inheritance for boomers and younger (I have been classified as Gen X, although I have no feeling of belonging). What happens when poltical 3rd rail issue of inheritance taxes smashes into the realization that the concept of inheritance was obsoleted and eliminated by the housing bubble and the medical industrial complex? This will be fun to watch.

Comment by Montana
2012-06-12 06:13:30

I don’t get it. my dad had a lot of medical, cancer and parkinson’s, but between medicare and medigap ins, everything but meds was paid.

Comment by In Colorado
2012-06-12 08:18:56

Ditto. My mom spent a few months in the hospital during the last year of her life, had cancer surgery, etc. Medicare pretty much covered everything for her.

Comment by Northeastener
2012-06-12 08:34:50

My understanding is that only works once you have no assets left… at least that is how it is working with my great aunt and grandmother. One had a paid-off house and pension/SS while the other had nothing but SS. The one with just SS has medicare pay for everything. The one with assets get’s to pay out of pocket for quite a bit.

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Comment by In Colorado
2012-06-12 08:42:47

I don’t know … my in-laws seem well heeled and medicare seems to pay for all their medical costs. They did opt for Kaiser or some other HMO as part of their medicare, I believe.

 
Comment by Montana
2012-06-12 09:01:31

You’re confusing Medicare with Medicaid. Medicaid is welfare, and no you don’t get it if you still have significant assets. Did she end up at a nursing home? that will eat up the rest of someone’s assets for sure.

 
Comment by polly
2012-06-12 09:04:27

The only thing I can think of is you are confusing Medicare with Medicaid and health care with maintenance care.

If you are sick and have Medicare and a pretty good Medigap policy, pretty much all your health care expenses are taken care of.

But Medicare does not pay for long term nursing home care (it might pay for a short term stay while you are actually recovering from something). You have to pay for that yourself. Unless you have essentially no assets. Then you become “dual eligible” and Medicaid will pay long term nursing home care (assuming you can find a place that will accept the Medicaid reimbursement rate). If assets are only in a house, Medicaid might kick in earlier, but they put a lien on the house so that they get paid back when the second member of the couple dies or the house is sold.

 
Comment by Bill in Carolina
2012-06-12 09:46:25

Polly is correct. Wife’s gall bladder surgery and my arthritic joint clean-up (remove bone spur, dress edges of remaining cartilage) resulted in NO out of pocket as the medigap policy covered it.

When I hear of medicare-eligible people being saddled with big hospital and/or doctor bills I presume they have no medigap policy.

LTC is indeed a different situation.

 
Comment by Northeastener
2012-06-12 10:08:37

I think Polly’s description nailed it in my family’s circumstance of LTC.

 
Comment by Montana
2012-06-12 12:49:56

So many people do not get the Medicare/Medicaid distinction. They didn’t 20 years ago and they still don’t. Good luck reforming either.

They should have called Medicaid Free Sh#t or something.

 
 
 
Comment by MiddleCoaster
2012-06-12 10:08:44

Did he spend time in assisted living or a nursing home? Those are the places that will quickly deplete a person’s assets.

Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 10:23:51

That is true, saw it happen in my family. Home care can also be a pretty heavy nut.

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Comment by scdave
2012-06-12 07:38:02

This will be fun to watch ??

Why ??

Comment by vinceinwaukesha
2012-06-12 08:24:40

Sorry everybody for the immense wall of text. I just stream of consciousness typed it out, and look, war and peace suddenly appeared in the bits bucket. I need a job where I’m paid by the word. I’m not even paid by source line of code SLOC.

“This will be fun to watch ??
Why ??”

I mean WRT to narrow little part of a major political strategy being upset by long term demographic shift. Or Bubba might end up bamboozled that he’s the only guy not to get an inheritance so he’s just doing his duty to get rid of inheritance taxes for “everyone” else not realizing the tax is only relevant to the 1%, if that many.

Not fun WRT the entire wall of text post, or how funny it is that I like to visit Chicago but would never want to live there, etc.

 
 
Comment by aNYCdj
2012-06-12 09:18:23

This is exactly why you sign the house to the kids at least 5 years before they need medicaid.

Sad, but most families cannot talk about end of life wants and needs until it is too late….

Also the downside risk is the kids must really be financially responsible you cant file for BK because you would still own a part of a house.

Every month that this drags on, my inheritance drops by (roughly) $300. Now my mother in law is in the same situation, old and owns a house, so they’ll be no inheritance there

Comment by polly
2012-06-12 13:30:08

This is evil. It is legal, but it shouldn’t be. Medicaid is not a program to allow middle class home owners to leave houses to their children. You want dad’s house? Move in and take care of him.

Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2012-06-12 13:54:20

Evil?

I think this is the first time that I’ve heard a lawyer suggest that knowing the law, and then adapting your situation such that the law benefits you, would be an evil thing.

People do this every day, polly: BK planning, estate planning, tax planning, etc, etc, etc.

Why should Medicare/Medicare/LTC planning be any different?

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Comment by polly
2012-06-12 15:41:33

I didn’t say it was illegal. I said it was evil. Lots of evil things are legal.

The other problem with it is that until people are wealthy and educated enough to have regular contact with a lawyer for planning purposes (not just OMG, something happened puroses) they don’t do it. It increases the wealth gap. Look, my grandfather did this level of planning. He then died without ever going into a nursing home, but he did it. I have had a lot of time to think about it. I don’t think my parents have done it just because I expect I would know about it if they had, but they have at least some long term care insurance.

One a scale from evil to angelic, where would you put purposefully bankrupting yourself so you can make the taxpayers pay for your long term care while your children get all your cash and assets? I don’t have a problem with taxpayers subsidizing real need and poverty. This is fake need and poverty and setting it up is evil.

 
 
Comment by aNYCdj
2012-06-12 15:02:11

Ummm Polly I DID ….glad I did, but boy Employers HATE that if you take time off to care for a sick one…you know GAP in the resume.

Maybe you should put some effort into ending this type of discrimination.

Imagine if you had a baby and took 3 years off to be a mom, and a Law firm said we don’t hire anyone with a gap in their resume….would you be pisssed?

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Comment by Arizona Slim
2012-06-12 15:37:14

Imagine if you had a baby and took 3 years off to be a mom

One of my mother’s friends did that. While her kids were still young and she wasn’t practicing law in a firm, she set up an office in her home. Call it mom’s home-based legal practice.

She also made a deal with her husband that Wednesday night would be her night down at the Penn law library. She wanted to keep up with developments in her areas of expertise. He arranged his schedule (he was a hospital physician) to accommodate her.

When she went back to work part-time, the law firm considered her work to be so good that they made her a partner. While she was part-time.

Her excellence was noticed by a certain Jimmy Carter. He nominated her to federal bench in 1978. She’s still there.

 
Comment by polly
2012-06-12 15:44:08

My sister-in-law took off one year for each of her kids. Her legal employer had no problem with that. It was, in fact, office policy to allow it.

I’m sorry you had that problem. Doesn’t change the fact that the 5 limit on Medicaid claw backs is terrible, fiscally and pretty much every other way I can think of.

 
Comment by aNYCdj
2012-06-12 18:53:35

Polly it may be terrible to you but its the only way some people will ever get an inheritance. Get the house live there for a lot less then renting

If you take that away then the next generation of 20-30 something will be hopeless…student debt no chance of SS being around and now no parents home to save $$ and try to regroup.

 
Comment by polly
2012-06-12 20:03:16

If you want to use public money to guarantee an inheritance to everyone in society, then go ahead and propose one. But doing it by letting older upper middle class adults with good estate attorneys to get around the rules and get the taxpayers to pay for their nursing home care is the WRONG way to do it.

 
Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2012-06-12 22:21:58

to get around the rules

I don’t see why you call this “getting around the rules.”

They are optimizing their situation to the rules.

If you don’t like the outcome, how about we change the rules?

That seems preferable to me to calling people who engage in planning “evil”?

 
Comment by aNYCdj
2012-06-13 00:30:01

OK then the parents should die broke…Heloc the house at 85, will that make you feel better… spend it on trips to alaska, then when the big c comes I aint gotz no mooonnnnneeeyyy…

Polly i propose a win win solution, you no transfers and the get hospitals to put a lien on the house and I get a Dr Kevorkian type to end my life when I want, and no one gets sued or arrested.

Therefore…I can save on my death costs and pass on what i own to the rest of my living family…..OK?

If you want to use public money to guarantee an inheritance to everyone in society, then go ahead and propose one

 
 
 
 
Comment by MiddleCoaster
2012-06-12 10:14:17

In a way, I feel fortunate that I have always known there would be no inheritance. When you start your adult life with the realization that you and you alone will be responsible for your financial well-being, you tend to make good choices.

 
 
Comment by WT Economist
2012-06-12 06:07:06

You hear a lot of whining about “uncertainty” as an excuse for business not hiring. The federal government is usually blamed.

You know what the “uncertainty” is? Everyone knows that the rich and the institutions they control are sitting on huge, hidden losses. You see that decline in net worth for the middle class? Some of that decline backs paper assets held by the financial sector and wealthy.

They are hiding, delaying and deferring in the hopes that the losses can be gradually offloaded onto the less well off. As a result stock prices aren’t real. Bond prices aren’t real. Real estate prices aren’t real. So nothing moves, because no one really knows what the real price is.

That is uncertainty.

Comment by Darrell in Phoenix
2012-06-12 06:43:24

Even that uncertainty is not the source of labor market slack.

The problem is, lack of demand.

If businesses had customers with money beating down the doors to buy stuff, they would be hiring employees to met the demand, regardless of whether their tax on the profit was going to be 30% or 40% and regardless of whether or not the bank next door was eventually going to have to admit the loss on $1T in non-performing loans.

Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 07:06:06

“If businesses had customers with money beating down the doors to buy stuff, they would be hiring employees to met the demand”

I disagree. It depends on the business and the acumen of the owners or managers. Some businesses, even (gasp!) large corporations are penny-wise and pound foolish. A large big-box chain with stores in this part of Florida, where the heat is ferocious right now, seems to have a problem getting the idea that if the temperatures in the store are comfortable, shoppers might spend more time in the store, instead of dashing in, getting what they need and dashing out to get home to air-conditioned comfort. Shoppers who have to spend more time getting more items out of necessity become hot, bothered and short-tempered. And although I’ve never seen any of the employees act out because of the heat, the potential exists.

And I’ve seen any number of these types of stores woefully undermanned on the floor, which makes me wonder how much business they’re losing when customers give up trying to find what they’re looking for, because they can’t find someone to help them. I know I’ve walked out more than once in such a situation. Sometimes buying on line is the solution to this, for a shopper.

The business model of cutting costs on employees, operations and physical plant to generate more profit only works up to a point.

Comment by In Colorado
2012-06-12 07:28:09

“The business model of cutting costs on employees, operations and physical plant to generate more profit only works up to a point.”

But it’s what analysts demand. When I worked at HP some idiot analyst proclaimed that we had way too many IT people. So in knee jerk fashion HP proceeded to lay off half of the IT folks. The results were of course predictable: Networks would crash and take forever to come back up, bringing work to a screeching halt. I wish I had a dollar for every time the ClearCase server went down.

But hey! Profits rose and the stock price followed suit. Until it didn’t. Now Meg Whitman has to clean up the mess, but she’s under the same Wall St. BS pressure to “cut costs”.

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Comment by polly
2012-06-12 08:02:31

It is the inevitable result of the reoganization of responsibilities and executive bonuses. Put the energy costs of all the stores in one department under one executive instead of doing it regionally. Lets say he is located in Minnesota and used to be a very successful store manager. When he was a store manager, he had all the functions under his control, and when the two weeks of beastly heat hit, he would up the AC just as you suggest. It made sense and he could see moms bringing in their kids to cool off after time in the playground (and to buy school supplies). The older folks without AC just hung out and it built their loyalty for Christmas even if they didn’t buy much.

Now he isn’t responsible for profitability of the store. He never sees those numbers and he doesn’t care about them. He has a few geek energy consultants and no matter what the stores sell, his bonus is dependent on getting those energy costs down. And he has NO experience in dealing with how AC impacts traffic in the stores when the beastly heat lasts for 5 months, not two weeks. AC get set to a much higher temperature nationwide. Costs go down. He gets his maximum bonus. He is happy. The store managers are in despair, but they are just store managers, not executives, so who the heck cares about them. Or the employees. Or the customers.

For what it is worth, I used to walk past a lovely little crafts store on my walk home. The cooled the heck out of that place and a lot of the time in the summer, they would leave the door open. The waft of cold air would draw me into the store for a few minutes 1 time out of 5. I didn’t buy anything, but a more impulsive shopper might have.

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Comment by aNYCdj
2012-06-12 09:26:29

Palmy I see this a lot in NYC….I’ll bet yet they are Pakistanis Indians cubans, etc. who run or own the store where that kind of heat reminds them of the old country and are used to it.

Side note I rail against bar owners who wont AC the bathrooms, and have only air dyers for exactly the same reason…a little water on the face, neck and chest and some wiping off the sweat in a cold environment will keep you there long enough to buy another drink times that by 100 200 500 a might……cheapest way to increase business i’ve ever seen…yet they wont do it.

A large big-box chain with stores in this part of Florida, where the heat is ferocious right now, seems to have a problem getting the idea that if the temperatures in the store are comfortable, shoppers might spend more time in the store,

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Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 10:29:10

“Palmy I see this a lot in NYC….I’ll bet yet they are Pakistanis Indians cubans, etc. who run or own the store where that kind of heat reminds them of the old country and are used to it.”

Well, mostly the big box stores are corporate, shareholder owned, and although I’m sure some of the shareholders may belong to the above ethnic groups, probably not in any number that would affect the temperature. I doubt they go to shareholder meetings and complain about the A/C costs and demand that the stores be climate controlled like back in the old country.

 
 
Comment by Darrell in Phoenix
2012-06-12 11:10:32

Businesses need to constantly increase profits. Since profits are revenue - costs, there are two ways to increase profits: increase revenue or lower costs (or both).

Again, IF customers were beating down the door with money, businesses would be hiring to get their share of the increased demand.

Since potential customers don’t have money to go beating down the doors, businesses can’t increase revenues, so they cut costs.

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Comment by Housing Is Cratering®
2012-06-12 07:34:47

Excellent post WT Economist….. But are you correct?

Comment by WT Economist
2012-06-12 09:06:06

I can’t be sure I’m correct. But I can be sure that I don’t trust any investment vehicle right now. I see hidden losses possibly on the books in all of them.

Not just business. How about the hidden liabilties of state and local governments.

Comment by scdave
2012-06-12 11:13:14

How about the hidden liabilties of state and local governments ??

Even with healthy ones….

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Comment by Robin
2012-06-12 17:06:54

And what part of “defined benefit” do you yet-to-be-retired not understand?

You have been, or soon will have been, sold out.

 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-12 21:19:50

And what part of “printing press technology” do you not understand?

 
Comment by Happy2bHeard
2012-06-12 21:57:41

There are 2 ways to renege on pension obligations. The straightforward bankruptcy or the inflation solution. I suspect both will happen before all is said and done.

I am also expecting that SS will be inflated away by the time I really need it in 25 years. And that most providers will not accept Medicare patients. Most of my generation will be dead by then, but I have a good chance of still being healthy at 85 - barring accidents, natural disasters, and acts of war.

If Medicare is replaced by vouchers for those now younger than 55, then Medicare will more quickly become worthless.

We will all be sold out.

 
 
 
 
Comment by vinceinwaukesha
2012-06-12 08:36:53

“The federal government is usually blamed.

That is uncertainty.”

Hmm in November if candidate 1 is elected, then the guys in charge of the feds will be bankrolled and controlled by big biz. Or, if candidate 2 is elected, then the guys in charge of the feds will be bankrolled and controlled by big biz. I’m not thinking there is very much uncertainty. Unless the next prez wants to end up like JFK he’s going to do exactly what he’s told by the people who bought him, and they’ve bought both sides, so…

In the fluffy stuff there might be some narrow business related difference. We might have a flag burning amendment which might have a minimal impact on importers of Chinese made American flags. Or we might legalize gay marriage which is great if you’re in the marriage-industrial complex, like a DJ or a wedding cake decorator, or on the other end of the pipeline, a divorce lawyer (hey, its over 50% odds after a couple years for the straights, I assume similar odds for the LGBT folks too). However, I’m not predicting anything happening with bank regulation that the big banks do not order to happen.

 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-12 21:18:48

Uncertainty is deception and cover-up.

 
 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-12 07:18:00

It’s kinda funny, but I always seem to look at the MarketWatch home page about the time when the market has completely reversed directions from what their headline announces.

Bulletin
Get news bulletins by email » Yield on Spanish 10-year bond reaches record high: Tradeweb

Stocks back on the rise

Tough Monday gives way to slightly stronger Tuesday, with Apple up as price target raised. Spanish bond yields continue to rise, as fresh bailout accomplishes little.

Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-12 10:16:20

The Fed stimulus cargo cult is keeping the U.S. stock market in the black.

What if the Fed makes the perfectly reasonable announcement that since long-term rates are at generational lows, no further quantitative easing or operation twisting is warranted?

June 12, 2012, 11:38 a.m. EDT
U.S. stocks rise on hopes for stimulus
By Kate Gibson, MarketWatch

NEW YORK (MarketWatch) — U.S. stocks rallied Tuesday on speculation that central bankers could make further moves to stimulate the global economy and as Wall Street continued to closely monitor events in Europe.

The major stock indexes had erased much of an early advance as Spain’s 10-year bond yield hit a record high after Fitch Ratings downgraded some of the country’s banks. But both Spanish and Italian bond prices bounced off their lows heading toward the European markets’ close.

 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-12 12:10:28

If investors are so pessimistic, then who is driving up the market?

Market Pulse Archives

June 12, 2012, 10:29 a.m. EDT
Investors becoming more pessimistic: survey
By Val Brickates Kennedy

Stories You Might Like
Recession crushed middle-class wealth: Fed survey
U.S. stock futures choppy as investors eye Europe
Centane falls 28% on lower 2012 outlook

BOSTON (MarketWatch) — Investors have become increasingly pessimistic about the state of the global economy, with many adopting “aggressively risk off” positions ahead of expected government policy moves, according to a monthly survey of fund managers released Tuesday by BofA Merrill Lynch Global Research. The survey found that 11% of the respondents believe the global economy will further deteriorate over the next 12 months, the survey’s most negative response since December 2011. “Investors have taken extreme ‘risk off’ positions and equities are oversold, but we have yet to see full capitulation. Low allocations in Europe are in line with perceptions of growing risk levels in the eurozone,” said Gary Baker, head of European Equities strategy at BofA Merrill Lynch Global Research, in a statement. “Hopes expressed last month of a policy response have now become expectations. Markets are keenly anticipating decisive action from key policy meetings in June,” said Michael Hartnett, chief Global Equity strategist at BofA Merrill Lynch Global Research, added.

 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-12 17:21:25

This is the kind of rally that only a bear could love. Try not to catch yourself a falling knife!

Market rally is ‘major bull trap,’ analyst says
June 12, 2012, 6:14 PM

Stock investors are whistling past the euro-zone graveyard, pushing U.S. markets higher even as the economic headlines from Europe become more ghoulish.

The U.S. markets’ rally Tuesday was impressive, with all major indices adding more than 1%. But the gains didn’t impress Christopher Vecchio, currency analyst at DailyFX, who said a “major bull trap” is forming.

“The rally is a wolf in sheep’s clothing,” Vecchio said in a research note late Tuesday.

 
 
Comment by 2banana
2012-06-12 07:48:43

Wow - public unions now crushing students as they control all power in Mass.

Who would have thunk it?

But it is for the children!

———————————————

Gov. Patrick to blame for tuition hike
Lowell Sun | 6/12/2012 | Peter Lucas

If you are looking to assess blame for the increase in tuition at the University of Massachusetts, look no further than the office of Gov. Deval Patrick.

But, given his governing style, Patrick is the last person to accept responsibility for the 4.9 percent hike, even though it comes under his watch and was implemented by the members of the UMass board of trustees, the majority of whom he appointed.

The increase represents a $580 tuition hike, raising the average tuition bill for students from $11,901 to $12,481. It means an additional $25 million in revenue for the school, and it comes as the Legislature has increasingly cut back on the UMass budget.

To win the support of the Massachusetts Building Trades Council of the union, Patrick promised to implement a mandate that required the hiring only of union workers for a multimillion-dollar mega-construction project at UMass Boston, as well as construction projects elsewhere in the state.

These mandates are called Project Labor Agreements, or PLAs. They are essentially discriminatory rules that prohibit the hiring of non-union workers for public construction jobs, jobs that routinely can be done cheaper by non-union workers. In return for the PLA, labor promised no strikes or interruptions in completion of the projects.

Non-union workers may pay taxes in Massachusetts that go toward paying for these building projects, but they are prohibited from working on them. How’s that for fairness?

It is estimated by responsible critics that the PLA for the UMass Boston job alone will cost taxpayers at least $100 million more than it would had non-union construction workers been hired to do the same work. It simply goes without saying that union labor, with all the benefits and work rules attached, costs more than nonunion labor.

That $100 million estimate in savings is four times the $25 million the Patrick administration is now asking students to pay in increased tuition costs. In other words, had Patrick not initiated the PLA, there would be an additional $100 million that could have gone to lower tuition rates, or at least keep them level, rather than increase them.

Comment by Northeastener
2012-06-12 08:25:39

If it wasn’t for the fact that both my and my wife’s family are “dug in like ticks” here, we would have left MA for NH, NC, or TX long ago…

Don’t even get me started on the MBTA budget woes due to it’s Public Union employee retirement costs and lack of pricing power (can’t raise fares or cut inefficient services, that would hurt the poor!). Better to increase the state gas tax on everyone in the state to fund the mobility of the poor around Boston and Public Unions.

 
Comment by In Colorado
2012-06-12 08:30:01

FWIW, private school tuition is rising just as quickly.

Something I pointed out a few days ago: Here in the Centennial State, every single State U has a significantly lower total cost (tuition + state subsidy) than ANY of the private U’s in the state. For instance, at Colorado State, the total cost is about $13,000 (the school has threatened to privatize, and that was reported as the proposed tuition). Private Colleges, like Regis or the University of Denver charge $30,000. Even for profit schools like U Phoenix charge more.

Comment by Northeastener
2012-06-12 08:44:09

private school tuition is rising just as quickly

I don’t mind paying for good performance, in fact, I expect it. How do we determine “good performance” ? By being involved with our children’s education. By studying with them, helping with homework and projects, and gauging their learning. By meeting with teachers regularly.

Want to know what parents get when they go to a public school (warning, rash generalization coming): “This is what we are teaching because this is what’s on the MCAS.” “I’m sorry, my class is too big to spend the kind of time your son/daughter needs on this subject. You should pay for a tutor.” “I understand your son/daughter is bored because they understand this material already. I can’t get too far ahead because of the special needs/poor performing children in the class.”.

Comment by In Colorado
2012-06-12 09:22:32

K-12 is another matter. We had our kids in Parochial school through 8th grade and then moved them to a public high school. The tuition at the school was heavily subsidized by the parish, so it was affordable for us. Of course, it was too expensive for lucky ducky parishioners, who had to send their kids to the local public schools. Eventually the subsidy was phased out and the school became rather pricey (it went from $2k to about $6k over a 15 year period). They still pack them in though.

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Comment by polly
2012-06-12 15:47:40

And if people get the option of taking a $4K voucher to a private school, what do you want to bet the tuition would be close to $10K very, very quickly.

 
 
 
 
 
Comment by 2banana
2012-06-12 07:58:05

The Who’s song ‘Won’t get fooled again” comes to mind.

———————–

Zogby: Disillusioned young voters dropping out
Washington Examiner | 6-11-2012 | Paul Bedard

Nearly four years after enthusiastic younger voters poured into polling booths to help push Barack Obama over the finish line and into the Oval Office, their hope has turned to fear and pollster John Zogby says that they are ready to give up on politics.

“I truly am worried about today’s twenty-somethings,” he frets. “They are our global generation and I have seen them move from hope and grand expectations for themselves and their world to anxiety and disillusionment. We can’t afford to lose them,” he adds.

Zogby previewed his remarks to the League of Women Voters 50th anniversary convention Monday night with Secrets. His worry: that younger voters will stop voting.

Comment by happyfriday
2012-06-12 08:17:07

His worry: that younger voters will stop voting.

Join the club and I think it’s a good sign. Instead of outsourcing their hopes and dreams to politicians, maybe the generation will start improving their own lives one step at a time.

Comment by In Colorado
2012-06-12 08:39:38

How, by leaving the country?

But yeah, why vote if it’s either gonna be Tweedle-Dee or Tweedle-Dum who “wins”? In either case the young in this country seem to have few choices:

Get into hock for a worthless college degree
Join the military
Become a Lucky Ducky
Seek their fortune elsewhere (get that foreign passport of you can, no one else is anywhere nearly as welcoming to immigrants as we are, plus you’ll be American which will make you persona non grata)

Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 08:45:30

Hey, Colorado, how’re you doing? I’ve been reading about these wildfires, are you in a relatively safe zone where you can stick it out?

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Comment by goon squad
2012-06-12 09:10:41

West metro Denver is covered in smoky haze. Squad colleague who lives in Fort Collins informs us it is much worse up there, but fires unlikely (as of yet) to move down from foothills into densely populated nabes…

 
Comment by In Colorado
2012-06-12 09:24:44

I’m working at home today in Loveland. Lots of smoky haze today and from what I hear the fire is still out of control.

 
Comment by Carl Morris
2012-06-12 12:43:33

It was mild in Boulder but bad in Longmont this morning. Now the wind has shifted and everything is further north.

 
Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 13:16:14

Well, stay safe, folks, please. If you have any respiratory issues, stay inside.

Having been through it here on a number of occasions, I’m praying for some rain (and lots of it) to come your way.

 
 
Comment by scdave
2012-06-12 08:49:28

plus you’ll be American which will make you persona non grata ??

Which promps the question; Why ?

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Comment by In Colorado
2012-06-12 09:30:44

Uh … cuz everyone hates Americans? As a former ex-pat, I speak from experience. I NEVER advertised that I was a Gringo, which I got away with since I speak Spanish without an accent. To do so was to ask for trouble.

I remember an old AMEX commercial, where a couple in a foreign country has lot all their stuff.

Cabbie: Are you Americans?
Them: Yes
Cabbie: You have American Express?
Them: Yes
Cabbie: No problem, I take you there (to the AMEX office)

I always envisioned the cabbie taking them somewhere desolate and killing them.

 
Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2012-06-12 10:17:57

Which promps the question; Why ?

A rhetorical question, I presume?

 
Comment by scdave
2012-06-12 11:17:48

A rhetorical question, I presume ??

No…A serious one…America has came to the rescue in many ways over our recent history and still it seems we are so generally disliked…On the other hand, everyone wants to come here so whats up ?? Our interventionist ways ?? The worlds Bully ??

 
Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 11:26:50

“On the other hand, everyone wants to come here so whats up ??”

It’s sort of a survival thing. The best way to preserve your arse, if you’re living in a place the US is crappin’ on, is to move to the place that’s doing the crappin’, rather than being one of the crappees.

It’s got nothing to do with adopting some American way of life, or God Bless the USA.

Most of the folks who want to come here at this time, are looking for the goodies. And maybe to get out from under drones and bombs. Period.

 
Comment by Arizona Slim
2012-06-12 11:46:55

Most of the folks who want to come here at this time, are looking for the goodies. And maybe to get out from under drones and bombs. Period.

My mother’s grandfather came to this country because he could get paid better than he was in Canada, and before that, in Scotland.

My father’s grandfather came here because he was the youngest of nine children. And there was no work in County Cornwall after the British Empire started bringing cheaper tin in from Malaysia. Poof went the Cornish tin mining industry.

Today, Cornwall is one of the poorest counties in England.

 
Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 13:12:48

Well, I don’t know what your forebears felt toward the US, but mine were very grateful for the opportunity and happy to adopt the US as their new home, assimilate and contribute.

I’m seeing some newer arrivals to this area that make the illegals from south of the border look like a bunch of cub scouts and charm school graduates. The surliness, resentment, nastiness and sense of entitlement is worse than I’ve ever seen it. Their treatment of some of the volunteers in this area is beyond disgusting.

 
Comment by Prime_Is_Contained
2012-06-12 13:41:24

On the other hand, everyone wants to come here so whats up ?? Our interventionist ways ?? The worlds Bully ??

I think you nailed it right there, but I’ll expand a bit on what you said:

We’re hated because we intervene all around the globe; this is perceived as bullying. Often the effects are not good: supporting horribly-repressive dictators because they do what we want; toppling actual democracies if we don’t like the elected leaders’ policies while saying we support democracy around the world; complicit in arm-twisting using IMF money to privatize needed things (like water!) in order to allow the financial rape by big business of countries with few resources; do I really need to continue? The list is long.

Yes, at times we have been the virtual saviors of the world (WW I & II). Much of the rest of the time we have treated the rest of the world rather badly.

I think people still want to come here because they distinguish between the policies of our government, and the fact that there is still much more opportunity available here for someone who is willing to work hard than there is for them in their home countries. Even if our class-mobility is much lower than in the past, I think they are still correct.

 
Comment by polly
2012-06-12 13:41:37

The people who ran the bed and breakfast I used at the theater festival in Canada would give me little Canadian Flag lapel pins. They recommended them for travelling in Europe to avoid the assumption that you are American.

 
Comment by Carl Morris
2012-06-12 13:51:25

Well, I don’t know what your forebears felt toward the US, but mine were very grateful for the opportunity and happy to adopt the US as their new home, assimilate and contribute.

Yup, mine learned English as quickly as possible and only spoke the mother tongue among their own generation. In one generation they were fully Americanized in the eyes of everyone but the KKK…who were so bored in Wyoming they had to settle for harassing Polish Catholics.

 
Comment by sleepless_near_seattle
2012-06-13 00:57:43

“They recommended them for travelling in Europe to avoid the assumption that you are American.”

Really? Europe? Admittedly I’ve only been to Germany, Poland, and Italy but I found all to be helpful and friendly and they could easily pick me out of a crowd.

Well, okay, maybe not the ferry boat operators on Lake Como but I partially won them over by at least trying to speak in my ancestors tongue, unlike the English-only speaking English tourists on one of my trips over the lake who they wouldn’t give the time of day to.

 
 
 
Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 08:44:11

Good post, happyfriday. I’m no fan of Obama’s, but I also feel that there was probably never any way that he could have lived up to all the hype about “hope and change”. However, when he’s gone so far in the opposite direction that he’s considered Bush on steroids, then true disillusionment sets in.

Indeed, the system is broken and needs fixed. The Stuxnet thing, Bradley Manning, the “kill list”, Obamacare, ceaseless suing of states (although to be fair, the states have done their own fair share of suing), recent legislation granting the unitardy expletive the power of life and death over citizens without due process, the eternal wars in the Middle East, the drumbeat starts to shatter the eardrums.

Comment by happyfriday
2012-06-12 09:19:24

Yeah Obama was set up for a failure from the beginning. It’s kind of sad that he didn’t know this. May be it’s his ideology, or his naivety, or his arrogance he perpetuated and continues to perpetuate the beliefs that Government can fix things for the little people. I still hear him say stupid sh!t like, we created this many jobs or saved that many jobs. I am sure the true believers will buy into this and vote for him again but most people are dejected and will stay away from politics all together just like retail investors in WallStreet. They are not coming back anytime soon and that’s a good thing.

We will see if the Hollyweird crowds and free concerts will bring the yutes to vote for him again.

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Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 10:14:08

Good business saying: Underpromise and over-deliver. Would have served him better, I think. Really, he didn’t need to go much over the top to bury McCain. I would never have voted for him and still wouldn’t, I have a nasty habit now of doing the third party thing in pres elections. But I could almost be persuaded to vote Romney (barf) just to bring to an end the current gobbermint reign of terror. Jeebus, it’s scarier than Bush’s.

 
Comment by Mr. Smithers
2012-06-12 10:23:45

All Obama had was over the top hype. Without it he was a 1 term senator with the most liberal voting record in the senate. And this was at a time when Ted Kennedy was still in the senate mind you.

People voted for the hope and the change and the history. Had everything been said and done by Obama but he was a white dude named Ron Johnson, he would have been laughed off the stage. But he was the first (half) black president so everything he did was magic. And he couldn’t just turn it off midway through. He went all in. Remember he said himself that after the election the oceans would recede. How was McCain supposed to counter that?

 
Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 11:18:17

“How was McCain supposed to counter that?”

Jeebus. He wasn’t, don’t you get it? By running McCain, the Pubes couldn’t have come up with a better way to elect Obama if they tried. McCain was a complete train wreck.

 
Comment by rms
2012-06-12 11:46:05

“May be it’s his ideology, or his naivety, or his arrogance he perpetuated and continues to perpetuate the beliefs that Government can fix things for the little people.”

+1 Obama’s administration is indeed arrogant while our congress has become venal serving the needs of the warmongering neo-cons who could care less about individual liberty.

 
Comment by Northeastener
2012-06-12 11:47:42

McCain was a complete train wreck.

Let me fix that for you…

“Palin McCain was a complete train wreck.”

All set.

 
Comment by Arizona Slim
2012-06-12 11:48:42

By running McCain, the Pubes couldn’t have come up with a better way to elect Obama if they tried. McCain was a complete train wreck.

Roger on the train wreck sentiment. We in Arizona have known this for a long time.

 
Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 12:22:13

Yeah, and Palin was part of the train wreck.

I about had a heart attack when I read this am that McCain and Graham were teaming up to demand a special prosecutor look into that Stuxnet thing. I actually agreed with them. I scared myself.

 
Comment by Northeastener
2012-06-12 13:18:20

read this am that McCain and Graham were teaming up to demand a special prosecutor look into that Stuxnet thing

Not sure what this is in regards to as I haven’t been following it closely. Is it the leak of the existence of Stuxnet as a sanctioned US cyber attack against Iran or that Stuxnet went awry and went global or that we attempted to covertly attack another sovereign nation’s sensitive computer systems that needs to be investigated?

 
Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 13:30:51

It’s the leaks, LOL! That’s what they’re concerned about, LMAO!

 
 
 
Comment by aNYCdj
2012-06-12 13:25:04

I wish Ohboozoo would pull an LBJ….refuse to run and ask Hillary to take over…..

Join the club and I think it’s a good sign

Comment by Mr. Smithers
2012-06-12 15:09:26

“I wish Ohboozoo would pull an LBJ….refuse to run and ask Hillary to take over…..

Join the club and I think it’s a good sign”

I’ve heard this said a lot of times but it’s crazy. If Obama is pushed aside, the black vote will evaporate for Hillary. That voting block won’t vote for Romney, but they’ll stay home. And that will lead to a landslide for Romney. If it was anyone else but Obama, he’d most likely be pushed aside by the Democrats. With Obama? Not a chance in hell.

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Comment by vinceinwaukesha
2012-06-12 08:52:26

Reading between the lines is hilarious. Let me provide an edited summarized version of the article (yes, ironic that Mr Wall Of Text is writing a summary):

“global generation…” (now that the kids aren’t so naive means) “…anxiety and disillusionment.” (which impacts everything, including voting).

Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 10:03:18

“global generation…” (now that the kids aren’t so naive means) “…anxiety and disillusionment.” (which impacts everything, including voting).”

Sometimes old Palmy’s heart breaks. I don’t have kids, but I’ve got nieces and nephews who are all delightful, thank God. Smart, hardworking, with a conscience. The oldest works, goes to community college and is an advocate for the homeless in his area. He is not complaining because he has no shoes. He is trying to help those who have no feet, so to speak.

Unlike the some of the “I’ll be gone” dumfark retirees in these parts, I want these kids to have a good life and not be beaten down by globalists. I want them to live in a relatively safe and prosperous society. It should not be lost on people that the “solution” to the middle class in the US has been to destroy it and import third world crime, poverty, despair and parisitism, rather than exporting a model that was desirable at one time.

As to the elitists who have fostered this, I will never forgive, I will never forget.

Comment by MiddleCoaster
2012-06-12 10:29:40

Wow, Palmy. This is one powerful comment. It resonates with me, having a couple of twenty-something nieces for whom I want that same good life. And I worry, oh do I worry about the future, for them and for everyone of their generation.

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Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 10:58:22

You are rare. Do what you can in your own sphere of influence to help relieve the situation for them. You can influence others.

These kids have to have a chance at the same or better than the life I had.

 
Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 11:43:56

BTW, last week here on the blog we spoke of Ray Bradbury and his visionary work. One of my fave stories by the master was the last one in The Martian Chronicles, entitled “October, 2006: The Million Year Picnic”. It still sends chills up my spine.

God bless the tough visionaries like Elon Musk. It will be because of men (and women) like him that future generations will escape this nasty little mudball and its foul (would-be) totalitarian stew, spread through the stars and flower in gardens of their own, unmolested by global elitists and their gulags.

 
Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 12:07:04

And how I wish I could be there to see it, ridin’ that rocket in the sky like Randy Quaid in Independence Day, hurtling toward some derelict invading spacecraft full of elitists looking for another planet to screw.

What a way to go!

 
 
Comment by Arizona Slim
2012-06-12 11:50:38

‘Scuse me while I brag on one of my young cousins. He’s the sous chef who’s showing some love to the dishwashers in this story.

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Comment by Mr. Smithers
2012-06-12 09:53:35

Hope and Change doesn’t pay the bills for the yuuts after all, eh?

Comment by Avocado
2012-06-12 15:15:14

Yes, we all wish Obama could have fixed the Bush mess even faster.

But, O did keep up out of a Depression for now.

Romney or O, lesser of two evils again… O wins.

 
 
Comment by WT Economist
2012-06-12 10:48:35

If the young don’t vote Generation Greed will just screw them more.

Don’t trust anybody old enough to have been paying attention when Jack Weinberger coined the phrase “Don’t Trust Anyone Over 30.”

 
Comment by Darrell in Phoenix
2012-06-12 11:31:55

Young voters didn’t realize that Obama was a Republican when they voted for him in 2008.

Comment by MiddleCoaster
2012-06-12 12:54:32

Neither did some of us older voters. ;)

Comment by Robin
2012-06-13 17:23:26

+1

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Comment by Northeastener
2012-06-12 08:58:59

Someone asked in yesterday’s bits bucket about links to articles showing increasing wages for tech workers. Here’s what I’ve seen:

tech-employees-beating-the-recession-slump

One study by Yoh Services, a technology staffing firm that tracks the wages of its workers, said Thursday that wages for highly skilled workers increased by 6.85% in September 2011 compared to the same month a year ago

DICE salary survey results 2011-2012

After two straight years of wages remaining nearly flat, tech professionals on average garnered salary increases of more than two percent

I’m in the Boston tech market, and demand is high for the right skills: senior software developer/architect, mobile developer, DBA, network security, etc. The startup market is also pretty strong here, with big data (Cassandra, MongoDB, etc) being particularly strong. My understanding is that San Fran/Silicon Valley is even crazier.

Additionally, co-workers who have changed jobs this year are seeing 10-15% increases in salary. Those who are staying put are seeing 3-4% increases (myself included).

Comment by In Colorado
2012-06-12 11:11:10

Maybe it’s a Colorado thing, but everyone I keep in touch with isn’t getting raises. At small, medium and large companies. As for job hopping, many employers here expect you to hop for a little as 0% more. I guess I should move to Boston.

Comment by Northeastener
2012-06-12 12:01:47

It could be. I didn’t reply to RIC/RAL yesterday about cherry picking locales/industries because I can only comment on tech demand in Boston and to some extent San Fran/Silly Valley (lot’s of former co-workers and friends out there). I’ve been getting emails every week from head hunters, so I know demand is there…

As I said before, I can put you in touch with a couple of top-notch head hunters in the area if you’re interested in relocating. Just be aware that prices for housing convenient to Boston and 128 are still ridiculous. Not as bad as San Fran, but still…

Check out Scott’s site here. He is in tune with the local startup community and has some great job postings. Some to $150k + equity, which is a good package for senior level non-management talent. He helped me with my last gig and has worked with some friends of mine.

Comment by Northeastener
2012-06-12 12:08:20

Sorry, that link was for Scott’s blog, though he has positions posted there as well as his recruiting site.

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Comment by goon squad
2012-06-12 12:20:39

We’re not as rich as all you IT nerds in the private sector or slurping up the really rich, thick, taxpayer gravy from Uncle Sugar like Bill-in-wherever does, but the squad was offered a 6% bump to move from our current government contractor to … guess what … another government contractor!

Shrink this, Grover Norquist! And keep paying your federal income taxes, suckers :)

Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 12:41:16

Yeah, ya know, I’ve been meaning to ask you goobermint contractors on this blog:

How does this work, exactly? I mean, with all due respect, some of the folks who claim to be government contractors seem to spend an awful lot of time here on the blog. At least, they’re usually on here when I am, so I’m assuming they’re also probably on here when I’m not.

Do you guys (or the firms you work for) get to bill Uncle Sam for the time you spend here? Doya laugh about it and slap each other on the back? Do some of your associates take a peek at what you’re writing and wonder when one of us will catch on? After reading that Rolling Stone article, I kinda got to wondering about it. I can understand some commenting here and there while at work, these blogs are sort of the modern day version of the water cooler, but I mean, Jeebus, there’s a couple of commenters in particular who have claimed to work for firms contracted to Uncle Sam and their output here is prodigious. (OTOH, they could be full of beans, I dunno).

Meh, after reading that article, I don’t really need to ask.

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Comment by goon squad
2012-06-12 15:16:34

No comment to the above. You’ll just have to get your own Uncle Sugar gravy trough contracting gig and find out for yourself. And rest assured, dear taxpayer, no government computers or networks are used posting to the HBB, Ben’s IP logs will attest to that :)

 
Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 16:08:24

“no government computers or networks are used posting to the HBB, Ben’s IP logs will attest to that”

Of course not. “Contracting” gets around that sort of thing. I’m sure the contractor’s computers or networks are used quite liberally. Or you can just log on from the old “home office” and have at it.

 
Comment by jane
2012-06-12 17:45:42

You may note that I don’t post - if I post - till late at night.

I work for a non-profit that exercises (statutory) oversight over government contracts, in large (ACAT I and II) hw and sw systems development programs. I am conversant in the Acquisitions Life Cycle (what proofs need to be proffered to justify continued funding) and in Systems Engineering (how well does your actual performance stack up, vis-a-vis your claims on paper).

I run the milestone reviews; I know approximately where the skeletons can be buried; I know what questions to ask; I now know enough to understand exactly where I am subject to being bull-sh*t; I have enough literacy to understand when a question is being ducked (albeit nicely, and with propriety); and, having grown up as a research scientist, I love hard data.

We like to think of ourselves as development partners. I will schedule a preview a month before the fact to advise my partners whether or not they are ready for prime time. I note that the previews are now standing room only. I’m not doing anything different than I was the day I started.

Checking the box (documentation-wise) does not always equate to a working system, on time and on budget.

I have a ton of respect for the technical and cost pressures the contractors are working under. Generally speaking, thinking things through before committing to build saves a ton of heartache down the line. Therefore, the solution to perceived jerking around is making sure the thing d*am well works before you build it on my dime.

Naturally, I have a bulls’ eye on my forehead. In the immortal words of Cody Lundin, Party On!

I actually like what I do. Being as I am working for the man, this is hard to admit.

 
 
Comment by Northeastener
2012-06-12 13:26:18

offered a 6% bump

Take it and run… gotta get while the getting is good.

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Comment by goon squad
2012-06-12 20:05:53

In the immortal lyrics of Poison: “Pour that sugar on me!

Thanks taxpayers (LOOSERS). Pay for my vacation already…

 
Comment by Carl Morris
2012-06-13 08:19:54

In the immortal lyrics of Poison: “Pour that sugar on me!

No. Poison != Def Leppard and that != some :-).

 
 
Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2012-06-12 20:51:59

I gurus the part in the U.S. Constitution, under which you owe your very existence means the “providing for the common defense” must be done for free. So you favor enslaving engineers right?

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Comment by Carl Morris
2012-06-12 12:50:53

Maybe it’s a Colorado thing, but everyone I keep in touch with isn’t getting raises.

I got a small one plus the healthy bonus I was promised a couple of months ago. I was expecting the worst, so I was pleasantly surprised.

Comment by Northeastener
2012-06-12 13:22:33

It’s not all sunshine and roses… my company gave decent raises, but the bonus was much smaller than expected (due to poor company performance in the last two quarters of 2012). I guess that’s why they call it a “bonus”…

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Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 14:54:43

Well, at least you didn’t get a bone-us, like companies such as Bain give.

 
 
 
 
Comment by nickpapageorgio
2012-06-12 18:19:51

I will just cut to the chase…We need huge gains in salaries to keep pace with what we are currently seeing with the price of just food and housing under ZIRP. It’s not happening, so the recovery is not real…yet.

Come out here and see good ol bidding war Arizona, drive around and take a really close look at the economic activity or lack there of…That will tell you everything you need to know about what is really happening even to skilled tech workers, we are going backwards.

I hope to see that change in the near future, because frankly I am getting a little bit nervous.

 
Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2012-06-12 20:49:46

I not only took a cut to come to L.A. From much cheaaper Tampa this year, but I have been encouraged to work extra hours for free. I am a contractor and am violating my company’s agreement by not charging OT. I hope you are right. I will skeddadle when I find something much better. I love L.A. of all the places I have worked, but I am devoted to my career.

 
 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-12 09:04:33

Spanish bank bailout failout not working…

June 12, 2012, 10:31 a.m. EDT
Euro falls further as Spain’s yields hit record

NEW YORK (MarketWatch) — The euro fell further on Tuesday as Spain’s bond yields shot to record highs, spooking equity markets and pushing the S&P 500 index (SPX +0.66%) into negative territory. The euro (EURUSD -0.0112%) fell to $1.2452, from $1.2495 Monday. The dollar index (DXY -0.15%), which measures the greenback against six currencies, rose to 82.699 from 82.529 in late North American trading on Monday.

 
Comment by happyfriday
2012-06-12 09:32:29

Median net worth $77000.

That seems rather low to me for a family. More pain ahead indeed. If the stock bubble bursts to a reasonable price, the median net worth could down another 30% at least.

Comment by Bill in Carolina
2012-06-12 09:55:12

Let’s assume someone bought a house in 2007 for $300K and now it’s worth maybe $200K net. Their mortgage balance is $270K. That’s $70K on the negative side right there so they’d need $147K in savings and investments just to hit the $77K median.

Since it’s a median (half above, half below), I’m surprised the net worth number is even $77K.

 
 
Comment by Neuromance
2012-06-12 09:34:33

When considering any new housing/finance initiatives, politicians should consider one guiding principle:

Taxes should only go to public goods, not FIRE sector profits.

Comment by WT Economist
2012-06-12 14:40:05

How about avoiding FIRE sector losses?

By the way, the FIRE sector was under the old Standard Industrial Classification system. It is the Financial Activities supersector under its replacement.

Good thing they got the reclassification done before they had to layoff all the statisticians. Then again, once they can’t afford data they’ll be no need to classify it.

Comment by Neuromance
2012-06-12 16:08:10

I think OpenSecrets.org still refers to them as the FIRE sector.

 
 
 
Comment by Bill in Carolina
2012-06-12 09:57:53

Uh-oh.

“This has been one of the worst stretches of the Obama presidency. In Washington, there is a creeping sense that the bottom has fallen out and that there may be no second term. Privately, senior Obama advisers say they are no longer expecting much economic improvement before the election.”

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/car-wreck-at-the-white-house/2012/06/11/gJQAl8MpVV_print.html

However, don’t discount Romney’s ability to blow it one way or another.

Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 10:07:28

Got my barf bag prepared for the Rubio veep announcement. Can’t wait to see the old biddies around here wetting their panties for a photo-op with Marco-Marc.

Wouldn’t surprise me if Romney does blow it.

Comment by happyfriday
2012-06-12 11:36:21

Rubio made his Israel trip already. He is “qualified” and ready.

Had Romney made the trip yet?

Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 12:01:19

Wow, I had something really weird happen to me the other night. Phone rang and it was one of those political survey calls, sometimes I’ll participate, just to see what it’s all about. First they ask am I a registered voter. I say yes. Then they ask how often I vote (I was a little confused on this, but they meant did I vote in all elections, sometimes, rarely, never). I say pretty much all. OK, now comes the capper: Are you a strong supporter of Israel? Me: Click. I figured it was a phony phone call.

WTF is that all about? I thought people were joshing about this stuff, or being paranoid.

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Comment by polly
2012-06-12 13:54:24

It is called a push poll. They ask a series of leading questions and then announce the next day that X% of likely voters support [person/policy/whatever]. When I get those calls, I just answer the opposite of what they want to hear. It isn’t too hard to figure out. If you had just answered “no” to the pollster, you might have found out a little more about the what they were fishing for.

 
 
 
Comment by Arizona Slim
2012-06-12 11:52:34

Wouldn’t surprise me if Romney does blow it.

I’m expecting the 2012 version of Gerald Ford’s 1976 “no Communist domination of Eastern Europe” gaffe.

Comment by Mr. Smithers
2012-06-12 14:54:30

“I’m expecting the 2012 version of Gerald Ford’s 1976 “no Communist domination of Eastern Europe” gaffe.”

I’m expecting you’ll be very disappointed. Romney’s run about as bulletproof campaign as you can get so far. Yeah one of his lackey mis-spelled America on twitter. The fact that insignificant typo was THE GAFFE HEARD ‘ROUND THE WORLD tells you how tight the campaign is.

I think he may well win 45 of the 57 states Obama’s visited.

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Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-12 21:23:07

Wait — you mean Trump isn’t going to get the VP nod?

 
 
Comment by WT Economist
2012-06-12 10:52:39

“Privately, senior Obama advisers say they are no longer expecting much economic improvement before the election.”

If Obama’s advisors had told him that in 2009 (or if he just read this blog) perhaps he would have understood what is going on.

Kind of like LBJ’s advisors suddenly all being against the Vietnam War — in 1968.

At least Bush lasted long enough to fire most of the neo-cons.

Comment by rms
2012-06-12 11:36:13

“At least Bush lasted long enough to fire most of the neo-cons.”

That reborn Dubya was little more than the neo-cons Charlie McCarthy, a ventriloquist’s dummy. They rode him hard wringing every dollar possible from the U.S. Treasury before they sent him back to Texas where he remains in hiding having sold his country short. Dubya, a real chit!

Comment by Mr. Smithers
2012-06-12 11:42:37

When it doubt blame the Jooos.

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Comment by rms
2012-06-12 12:42:13

Cognitive dissonance?

 
 
 
 
Comment by In Colorado
2012-06-12 13:41:11

However, don’t discount Romney’s ability to blow it one way or another.

Two inept candidates. What a country.

 
 
Comment by 2banana
2012-06-12 11:00:34

The system will crash in California - soon. But not before they sell every assets and tax everything that moves (and doesn’t) in order not to touch the public unions and illegals.

They will plead poverty and will cry for a federal bailout - while retired firefighters/police/teachers make $100,000+/year in pensions and have free health care for life.

————————————-

Is Perestroika Coming In California?
Forbes | 6.11.12 | Joel Kotkin

When Jerry Brown was elected governor for a third time in 2010, there was widespread hope that he would repair the state’s crumbling and dysfunctional political edifice. But instead of becoming a Californian Mikhail Gorbachev, he has turned out to be something more resembling Konstantin Chernenko or Yuri Andropov, an aged hegemon desperately trying to save a dying system.

California’s “progressive” approach has been enshrined in what is essentially a one-party state that is almost Soviet in its rigidity and inability to adapt to changing conditions. With conservatives, most businesses and taxpayer advocates marginalized, California politics has become the plaything of three powerful interest groups: public-sector unions, the Bay Area/Silicon Valley elite and the greens. Their agendas, largely unrestrained by serious opposition, have brought this great state to its knees.

Clearly, the conditions for a California perestroika are coming into place. Still missing is a coherent vision — from either Independents, centrist Democrats or Republicans — that can unite business, private-sector workers and taxpayers around a fiscally prudent, pro-economic growth agenda. Yet it’s clearly good news that , for the first time in a decade, there’s hope that the whole corrupt, failing California political edifice could come crashing down, providing a renewed hope for recovering the state’s former greatness.

Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 11:20:43

It’s just awful to watch. Another thing that makes me sad, watching Cali go down the tubes.

Comment by Grim Reaper
2012-06-12 11:24:07

Sad? Give it the royal flush. Flush the turds.

Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 14:49:22

Flush the turds, yes, but not Cali, Cali doesn’t deserve it.

When I wuz a pup, California Dreamin’ was one of my fave songs. Living in the Northeast, which could be incredibly dreary during the winter, I totally understood the longing for golden sunshine and mild weather.

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Comment by Florida Is Going To Kill Me ®
2012-06-12 16:14:05

“I totally understood the longing for golden sunshine and mild weather.”

Well, there it is. They get paid in sunshine!

 
 
 
 
Comment by Mr. Smithers
2012-06-12 11:46:43

Every time a $100K a year pension check is cashed at the local bank, a Democrat angel gets his wings.

Comment by happyfriday
2012-06-12 11:55:32

What’s equivalent to Repubs?

Comment by In Colorado
2012-06-12 12:53:00

Every time the 1% share of the overall wealth increases?

Every time a job is offshored?

Every time a billionaire gets another tax break?

Every time we invade another country?

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Comment by Northeastener
2012-06-12 13:32:06

a Democrat angel gets his wings.

Saw an interesting show on the History channel that turned the stereotypical view of angels on it’s ear. The premise was that angel’s were actually demons, at least in so far as the old testament was concerned.

Seems pop culture has picked up on that given movies like Legion. The Wrath of God wasn’t something beautiful to behold…

 
 
Comment by In Colorado
2012-06-12 13:00:12

while retired firefighters/police/teachers make $100,000+/year in pensions

Unlikely, at least for teachers, as sfrenter will attest.

According to teacher portal. the average teacher salary in California is $59,825. A 100K pension is out of the question.

http://www.teacherportal.com/teacher-salaries-by-state

And before you say the numbers are baloney, I checked the state where my sister teaches, and the number matched her salary (she has 15 years experience)

 
 
Comment by Grim Reaper
2012-06-12 11:09:41

Realtors are the Jerry Sanduskys of Housing.

Comment by Arizona Slim
2012-06-12 11:53:40

Hey, watch it! You just insulted Jerry Sandusky.

Comment by polly
2012-06-12 15:04:30

Have you read any accounts of the testimony thus far, Slim? It seems that insulting Mr. Sandusky by comparing him to anyone or anything would be very, very difficult.

Comment by Arizona Slim
2012-06-12 15:39:25

Yes, I’ve read the accounts. And I was cracking a joke upstairs in this thread.

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Comment by palmetto
2012-06-12 16:10:20

Well, I got the yuk.

 
 
Comment by exeter
2012-06-12 16:21:23

“Have you read any accounts of the testimony thus far, Slim? It seems that insulting Mr. Sandusky by comparing him to anyone or anything would be very, very difficult.”

It’s hideous and that word doesn’t come close to conveying what kind of monster Sandusky is. Did you hear the testimony from the 18 year old today? He was eleven years old. Eleven. My God…..It’s a good thing there is a God and a court system because not even a saint could find the restraint to refrain from butchering the monster. He’s far far beyond sick. Eleven years old.

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Comment by exeter
2012-06-12 13:08:56

Can you techies direct me to where I can find the the best price on Ipods?

Comment by nickpapageorgio
2012-06-12 17:52:01

I buy most of my stuff from amazon, unless someone else is having a blowout sale, they are usually pretty close to the best price.

Comment by exeter
2012-06-12 20:51:53

Yeah Amazon is usually lowest… even for auto parts but not in this case. Surprisingly, Apples website had the best price on a refurb Ipod touch with the best warranty.

Comment by nickpapageorgio
2012-06-13 05:21:41

Sweet.

(Comments wont nest below this level)
 
 
 
 
Comment by cactus
2012-06-12 14:15:35

Is this how we correct the trade imbalance ?

“Lured by bargain home prices, foreign buyers stepped up their purchases of U.S. homes by 24% over the past year, according to an industry trade group.

The National Association of Realtors reported Monday that $82.4 billion worth of homes were sold to international buyers in the 12 months that ended in March, up from $66.4 billion the year before.

“Today’s advantageous market conditions have drawn more and more foreign buyers to the U.S.,” said NAR President Moe Veissi, who owns a real estate firm in Miami. (Related: Where homes prices are rising fastest)

U.S. prices have fallen by about a third from their 2006 peak and are at their lowest level since 2002, and foreign sales were especially strong in states where prices dropped even more sharply. Of the four states cited in the report as tops for foreign buyers — Florida, California, Texas and Arizona — only Texas has not recorded a severe home price correction.

Meanwhile, currency exchange rates grew more favorable for many foreign nationals. The currencies of both Mexico and Brazil have gained 20% or more against the dollar over the past year, giving buyers additional discounts on U.S. purchases. Canada’s currency is up about 5%.

Comment by Arizona Slim
2012-06-12 14:27:12

I think that a lot of these foreign buyers are following a bug-out strategy.

As in, that newly purchased house in the US of A is where they plan to go when the you-know-what hits the fan in their current country. (China, I’m looking right at ya.)

 
 
Comment by wittbelle
2012-06-12 21:28:50

Just stumbled upon this.
http://www.dsnews.com/
Welcome to DSNews.com—delivering stories, ideas, links, companies, people, events, and videos impacting the mortgage default servicing industry.

 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-12 23:59:54

Niall Ferguson on How Europe Could Cost Obama the Election
Jun 11, 2012 1:00 AM EDT
Spain has accepted a big bank bailout, but the Eurostorm isn’t ending anytime soon—and it may come to American shores just in time for the election.

Could Europe cost Barack Obama the presidency? At first sight, that seems like a crazy question. Isn’t November’s election supposed to be decided in key swing states like Florida and Ohio, not foreign countries like Greece and Spain? And don’t left-leaning Europeans love Obama and loathe Republicans?

Sure. But the possibility is now very real that a double-dip recession in Europe could kill off hopes of a sustained recovery in the United States. As the president showed in his anxious press conference last Friday, he well understands the danger emanating from across the pond. Slower growth and higher unemployment can only hurt his chances in an already very tight race with Mitt Romney.

Most Americans are bored or baffled by Europe. Try explaining the latest news about Greek politics or Spanish banks, and their eyelids begin to droop. So, at the end of a four-week road trip round Europe, let me try putting this in familiar American terms.

Imagine that the United States had never ratified the Constitution and was still working with the 1781 Articles of Confederation. Imagine a tiny federal government with almost no revenue. Only the states get to tax and borrow. Now imagine that Nevada has a debt in excess of 150 percent of the state’s gross domestic product. Imagine, too, the beginning of a massive bank run in California. And imagine that unemployment in these states is above 20 percent, with youth unemployment twice as high. Picture riots in Las Vegas and a general strike in Los Angeles.

Now imagine that the only way to deal with these problems is for Nevada and California to go cap in hand to Virginia or Texas—where unemployment today really is half what it is in Nevada. Imagine negotiations between the governors of all 50 states about the terms and conditions of the bailout. Imagine the International Monetary Fund arriving in Sacramento to negotiate an austerity program.

This is pretty much where Europe finds itself today. Whereas the United States, with its federal system, has—almost without discussion—shared the burden of the financial crisis between the states of the Union, Europe has almost none of the institutions that would make that possible.

Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-13 00:11:46

“Most Americans are bored or baffled by Europe. Try explaining the latest news about Greek politics or Spanish banks, and their eyelids begin to droop.”

That should make Romney’s job of blaming the bad economy on Obama much easier. Most Americans can’t see far enough past the end of their noses to notice the unabated financial playing out on the other side of the Atlantic.

 
 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-13 00:04:57

videocafe dot crooksandliars dot com
June 12, 2012 10:00 PM
Colbert Mocks Romney for Calling President Obama Out of Touch
By Heather

Stephen Colbert had a bit of fun with GOP presidential candidate ‘Rmoney’ after his comments that President Obama didn’t get the message from Wisconsin about cutting teachers and firefighters.

COLBERT: Well said. Obama is totally out of touch. Romney then flew off in his private jet to watch Rafalca compete in the national dressage championship.

And Romney was just getting luke-warmed up. […]

Yes! Only Romney has the courage to say what we’re all thinking. America is being sucked dry by fireman, policeman and teachers. These big-government teet moochers are so lazy they can’t even take the stairs. Some of them slide down poles.

Must be nice. And the worst part folks is our kids look up to these parasites. Ask any brainwashed six year old what he wants to be when he grows up and it’s always members of public service unions; firemen, policemen, teachers.

Kids need to start admiring society’s real heroes; job creators.

Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-06-13 00:12:47

Stephen Colbert must be reading 2banana’s posts!

 
 
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