July 25, 2012

Bits Bucket for July 25, 2012

Post off-topic ideas, links, and Craigslist finds here.




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Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-07-25 01:43:02

July 25, 2012, 12:01 a.m. EDT
Global economy’s cure is worse than the disease
Commentary: Take two aspirin and call Bernanke in the morning
By Satyajit Das

SYDNEY (MarketWatch) — Dear Doctor: Thank you for referring Mr. Global Economy to me.

The patient’s history includes a seizure in 2007/ 2008 — financial losses, banking problems, a major recession. Liberal injections of taxpayer cash avoided catastrophic multiple organ failure, assisting a modest recovery.

Governments ran large budget deficits in the period after the crisis. Interest rates around the world were reduced to historic lows, zero or negative in many developed countries. Balance sheets of major central banks have increased to $18 trillion from around $6 trillion, reflecting an unprecedented 30% of global gross domestic product.

Mr. Economy is now addicted to monetary heroin. Increasing doses are necessary for the patient to function at all.

Mr. Economy has not made the changes necessary for a return to full health. He seems to have taken rock star Steven Tyler’s advice: “Fake it until you make it.”

Borrowing levels remain unsustainable. Debt levels for 11 major nations have increased to 417% of GDP in 2012 from 381% of GDP in 2007. Debt has increased in Canada, Germany, Greece, France, Ireland, Italy, Japan, Spain, Portugal, the U.K. and the U.S.

Global imbalances — major current account surpluses and deficits — remain. Little progress has been made in bringing the banking system under control.

Comment by turkey lurkey
2012-07-25 06:22:15

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-18944097

“Tax havens: Super-rich ‘hiding’ at least $21tn”

Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-07-25 07:06:35

Maybe the problem is the “jobs creators” are hiding away $21 tn+ instead of using it to create jobs?

Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2012-07-25 07:44:42

I think you are right. But you and I also know that a businessman’s purpose is and should be to create wealth, not to create jobs. Preserving your wealth from an unchecked growth in government is a virtue.

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Comment by In Colorado
2012-07-25 08:35:52

But won’t the proverbial businessman make more money in a healthy economy, where people have jobs? And all that dough that is stashed away is most likely being loaned out to someone. If the economy gets sick enough won’t most of that money go “poof” as combo likes to say?

 
Comment by Steve J
2012-07-25 08:44:40

Business men used to have an obligation to society.

 
Comment by In Colorado
2012-07-25 08:47:40

I am reminded of an old Looney Tunes Cartoon where Sylvester inherits a wad from Granny. He want to blow it on a good time with his cat friends. The executor(Elmer Fudd) of Granny’s estate shows him a movie about how when money is invested, jobs are created which grow the economy (and in the process, makes him richer). He isn’t paying attention and just wants to take the money (which is in a soft sided briefcase) and eventually grabs it and runs.

His cat friends are outside, peering in through a window, and also saw the movies. When he reaches them he tells them: “I got it!”

They get indignant and tell him to “put it back”

Funny, how this used to be the common wisdom, that a gainfully employed and well paid middle class was actually good for the economy and even for the rich.

I also found the cartoon on youtube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Wq5LtPcS5M

 
Comment by In Colorado
2012-07-25 08:51:00

Preserving your wealth from an unchecked growth in government is a virtue.

Oh please, they’re lending that money to the gov’t. Heck, even you do it, and even brag about it.

 
Comment by Diogenes (Tampa, Fl)
2012-07-25 08:55:56

No. It won’t go poof……… His study deals only with financial wealth deposited in bank and investment accounts, and not other assets such as property and yachts.
If it’s Bankster money, they can just print up a bunch more money to cover any loses. that’s how this works. And if they have financial loses for making “investments”, the FED and the World Bank and the IMF and the EBC and all the other world thieves will simply add digits to the accounts of their buddies.
I am always suspicious of these “studies”.
What do they mean by “investment accounts”??????? If it’s not a “cash” deposit, then it must be invested in something.
That usually means business or ASSETS, which would include hotel properties and stuff like that, perhaps even a private villa? There are so many ways to bring “property” into investment vehicles that I am suspicious of what the “investment accounts” might actually be.
NO worries. We’ve got Tim Geithner on the Job, along with Ben Bernanke, saving the rich everyday from any bad things they may do.

 
Comment by RioAmericanInBrasil
2012-07-25 09:09:40

Business men used to have an obligation to society.

As they should, because businesses function in societies not vacuums, and government is a huge factor in creating and maintaining societies.

Taxes are paying the toll to function in the societies businesses create their wealth in.

The government laws and regulations should slant towards the greater good of the entire society (jobs, good pay, benefits) and not slant just to favor the wealth “creators”. Because as we’ve seen, slanting laws in favor of simply creating wealth has NOT been a boon to the greater society but rather has concentrated wealth at the expense of the average American.

This is not an academic question anymore. We’ve lived it and done it for almost 40 years and the results are staring us in the face. To want to double down on failed “worshiping the rich”, supply-side, cut taxes for the rich failed policies of the past 30 years would be insanity.

 
Comment by In Colorado
2012-07-25 10:35:42

No. It won’t go poof……… His study deals only with financial wealth deposited in bank and investment accounts, and not other assets such as property and yachts.

But if its hidden offshore in places like the Caymans, then it probably is cash or cash equivalent, which is being loaned out.

Maybe that’s why Larry Ellison went and bought himself a 500m island? Now that’s a hard asset. Of course, if everything tanks it could depreciate big time, so there would be some poofage too.

But I do agree that if the poop hits the fan that money will be printed and the elite will be made whole.

 
Comment by scdave
2012-07-25 12:58:46

+1 Rio…Spot on Summary….

 
Comment by GrizzlyBear
2012-07-25 18:51:42

“Preserving your wealth from an unchecked growth in government is a virtue.”

How about from a angry, unemployed man’s pistol?

 
 
Comment by Northeastener
2012-07-25 08:35:46

Plenty of Venture Capital funds are throwing money at entrepreneurs, creating jobs along the way…

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Comment by RioAmericanInBrasil
2012-07-25 08:54:52

We need wealth and opportunity redistribution on a massive scale. There is nothing “socialistic” about it. Why? Because it would be just be returning the wealth and opportunity redistributed from Average Americans to to the rich the past 30 years.

One example? In 1983 the WalMart family wealth was equal to the wealth of 62,000 median American family’s wealth. By 2012 the WalMart family wealth had grown to equal the value of 1,158,000 median American family’s wealth - massive wealth redistribution and concentration in exchange for crap jobs and crap Chinese products.

6 Walmart Heirs Hold More Wealth Than 42% of Americans Combined

the six Walmart heirs now have more wealth than the bottom 42 percent of Americans combined, up from 30 percent in 2007. Between 2007 and 2010, the collective wealth of the six richest Waltons rose from $73 billion to $90 billion, while the wealth of the average American declined from $126,000 to $77,000…

…The recession has devastated the finances of many Americans, but it has been very good to the Walton family. Since 2007, Walmart stores have been flooded with millions of folks who’ve lost their shirts in the housing bust, stock market crash, and stalled job market—people who can no longer afford to buy anything that isn’t made in China and sold by someone making close to minimum wage.

 
Comment by RioAmericanInBrasil
2012-07-25 08:56:06

The WalMart wealth link:

6 Walmart Heirs Hold More Wealth Than 42% of Americans Combined

http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2012/07/walmart-heirs-waltons-wealth-income-inequality

 
Comment by Diogenes (Tampa, Fl)
2012-07-25 09:31:06

There’s something seriously wrong with this story. It takes all the people on welfare, who show zero “wealth” on their balance sheets and then compares that group with the income of some of the richest.
Again, very slanted. There are LOTS of people who piss away all their money. I see them at the beach every week, living it up. Cafe’s are full. Eating and drinking expensive fare. You can’t CONSUME your wealth and have any.

But let’s look at the numbers for a minute.
According to the story, the “AVERAGE” American family has 77,000 in assets (who know where they get the numbers)
So 77,000 x 1000 is 77 million. So 1000 people have 77 Million dollars of “wealth”. Multiply that by another 1000, and you get 77 BILLION> around the combined “wealth” of 6 Waltons (give or take).
So it takes 1 Million, on average, Americans, to pool their “wealth” to get to the Walton Family megabucks status.
We have over 300 Million people here.
The PROBLEM is that 1/2 the population isn’t in the workforce. They are collecting “entitlements” and living off the “system”…… So, no, they don’t report any “wealth”.
However, many are living better than you and I who must either spend our savings or work to keep food on the table and gas in our car…..and pay insurance, and water, electric, sewer, rent, mortgage, taxes, dues, ……………
In America, being “poor” is an asset, so long as the government can keep the FED printing fake money to pay for the “consumption” habits of the “poor”.
Being on public support is like having a “trust fund”, having never put in a dime, or worked a day, for the privilege.

 
Comment by turkey lurkey
2012-07-25 09:47:01

Does that mean they also pay 42% of all federal income taxes?

Rhetorical question.

 
Comment by Northeastener
2012-07-25 10:21:19

“Some rich guy should give me a job because I deserve it”…

How many Americans does Walmart employ? Answer: 1.2 Million domestically.

Are they all great paying jobs? No. But they are jobs. To hate on the Walmart family because they are wealthy is useless. They are wealthy because they have a business that is successful… and that success means more people working.

As I said, there is plenty of Venture Fund money out there looking for fresh ideas and motivated people to create the next success. Instead of bemoaning income disparity of the wealthy, how about we focus on creating something and attracting some of that Venture money? To demonize the wealthy for not “creating jobs” is just flat wrong. At some point, Americans need to take responsibility for their own fate…

Now, you want to discuss the undo influence the wealthy and corporations have on our government and legislative process, I’m game…

 
Comment by Housing Wizard
2012-07-25 10:22:21

I really agree with everything you are saying above me Rio . How can anybody not see that wealth in to few hands
creates mass poverty , lack of government funds for social service ,a eventual rise in crime rate ,more welfare needed ( which isn’t productive ),and children on street corners with little tin cans begging for coins ,Cities going BK ,and housing turning into ghettos,and high unemployment rates that will create social instability

I guess the rich think they will be isolated in their Ivory tower gate guarded Communities while the rest of the World can fight over scraps . Currently places like Wal Mart don’t even give a living wage if you consider the cost of living .

Should the goal of a society be to make so few rich at the expense of the majority ,because that is what is happening .The natural byproduct of unregulated Capitalism ,combined with tax breaks for the 10%, creates
monopolies and to much power in to few hands .

I don’t even care anymore about having a Military that protects me ,because if everybody is poor than who in the hell is the Military protecting when you have nothing to lose and your poor .

 
Comment by In Colorado
2012-07-25 10:37:23

“Plenty of Venture Capital funds are throwing money at entrepreneurs, creating jobs along the way…”

But not many jobs. Sure, a few engineers will get hired, but the bulk of the jobs will be offshored to sweat shop nations.

 
Comment by RioAmericanInBrasil
2012-07-25 10:39:04

To hate on the Walmart family because they are wealthy is useless.

“hate”? Do cities charge me sales tax because they “hate” me? Geez, you sound like one of the AM radio clowns. Next thing you’ll tell me is I think they’re “evil”. Get a new script.

How many Americans does Walmart employ? Answer: 1.2 Million domestically.

“for every two jobs Walmart “creates,” three local jobs are destroyed.”

Study proves it: Walmart super-stores kill off local small businesses

http://articles.nydailynews.com/2011-05-04/local/29523684_1_small-businesses-david-neumark-city-stores

Walmart’s stores destroy more retail jobs than they create.

n 2006, the big-box retailer promised to bring jobs to the cash-strapped community. But according to a landmark study by Loyola University, the company’s rhetoric didn’t match reality: Within two years of Walmart’s opening its doors, 82 local stores went out of business.

Instead of growing Chicago’s retail economy, Walmart simply overtook it - absorbing sales from other city stores and shuttering dozens of them in the process.

Researchers at Loyola dubbed Walmart’s store a wash - generating no new sales revenue for Chicago and no new jobs for hard-off residents.

Chicago’s cautionary tale isn’t isolated. Countless communities and peer-reviewed surveys across the country, all reach the same conclusion: When Walmart moves in, small businesses and jobs, move out; Main St. dies.

According to a provisional study by David Neumark, Junfu Zhang and Stephen Ciccarella called “The Effects of Walmart on Local Labor Markets,” for every two jobs Walmart “creates,” three local jobs are destroyed.

 
Comment by RioAmericanInBrasil
2012-07-25 10:47:59

Instead of bemoaning income disparity of the wealthy, how about we focus on creating something and attracting some of that Venture money?

Venture money? Sure that’s important but how about also thinking venture money on a national scale. Like Brazil did to become energy independent and how Sweden provides free college education and projects like we used to do in USA.

If the super-rich and corporations were taxed at past historic levels, there would be “venture money” to create public projects, energy projects, basic research, grants for small business development, universal health-care, education, infrastructure etc etc etc

You know. The things that help make countries great.

 
Comment by Housing Wizard
2012-07-25 11:38:13

Small retail business cannot compete with big Monopolies ,especially when people are forced to shop at the cheapest places because of lower incomes . Wal Mart just destroyed the Mom and Pop business in many a town
in America ,and the manufacturing base was replaced by
other Countries .

I don’t care how much you might want to start a small business ,the Monopolies will beat you in price ,even when the products are crap China shit . People are even going to be relying more on the cheaper stores .
Monopolies are cheaper at first ,and than they own the market .

 
Comment by ahansen
2012-07-25 11:43:21

Not only are local Mom and Pop jobs destroyed when big boxes come in, but so are the benefits that go with them. The Waltons offer their million (that’s one percent of the American workforce, btw) minimum wage-earners jobs with no bennies or health insurance, so the tax-payers have to pick it up for them.

That’s why Obamacare is so vehemently opposed by the well-orchestrated WalCos of the country– it shifts the cost of employee’s health care back to the large employer. Mom and Pops with under 50 employees are unaffected.

 
Comment by Carl Morris
2012-07-25 11:58:55

Not defending monopolies, but how many Mom and Pop places had any sort of benefits? Back in the late 70s when KMart rolled into my little hometown people were impressed that they offered some benefits because the Mom & Pop places didn’t. I think at one of the well established restaurants I worked at in high school the small core of full timers did get a bit of paid vacation but I think that was it.

 
Comment by Northeastener
2012-07-25 12:00:51

“hate”? Do cities charge me sales tax because they “hate” me?

Not sure where this came from, but if you want me to use a different term for singling out the wealth of the Walmart family, that’s fine:

Study proves it: Walmart super-stores kill off local small businesses

I’m all for small businesses, but Capitalism is about creative destruction. Businesses consolidate, small players get wiped out, etc. That’s just how it works…

Sure that’s important but how about also thinking venture money on a national scale.

I can get behind that, even if we have to raise taxes to do it…

 
Comment by Mr. Smithers
2012-07-25 12:10:54

“Small retail business cannot compete with big Monopolies ,especially when people are forced to shop at the cheapest places because of lower incomes”

LOL. All I read here on the HBB is how people need to spend less and stop living beyond their means. Then the same people turn around and whine that people are “forced” to shop at the cheapest places.

 
Comment by Mr. Smithers
2012-07-25 12:14:30

“Study proves it: Walmart super-stores kill off local small businesses”

Study proves it: Walmart has better business model than mom and pop stores. Soon to come out another study that proves the automobile is a better technology than the horse and buggy and will soon put every horse and buggy related business into bankruptcy. Boo hoo.

I never understand this hatred for Walmart by the left. It provides cheap goods and services to millions of people, mainly lower income people. And yet liberals insist on driving Walmart out of business forcing those millions of low income customers to pay more money for the same goods and services provided by other vendors. Insanity.

 
Comment by RioAmericanInBrasil
2012-07-25 12:16:32

but Capitalism is about creative destruction.

Part of capitalism is about creative destruction. It is not the entirety of capitalism. Also, the destruction part is not always creative or creative in a positive way.

For example: WalMart. Both its creative and destructive aspects were a net negative regarding USA jobs and small businesses.

This is why capitalism’s regulation should slant towards the creation that creates the most good for the entire society.

An example of that would be tax policies and tariffs that would benefit creation and support of small business and American manufacturing.

 
Comment by In Colorado
2012-07-25 12:20:15

I don’t care how much you might want to start a small business ,the Monopolies will beat you in price

In our little burg there’s a mom-n-pop burger joint across the street from Mickey D’s. Mom-n-pop can’t compete on price, so they aim “higher”. The problem is that there are also chains that target the more demanding burger eater, starting with Wendy’s and going up to chains like Five Guys, Freddy’s, Culver’s and Smash Burger.

The mom-n-pop joint (AKA Fatso’s) always looks deserted, I suspect it’s only a matter of time before they fold. The place used to be an A&W, with the retro car hop service.

There was also an appliance and furniture store called Penner’s that had been around for decades. As Big Box after Big Box opened in our town Penner’s withered away until they filed a BK and closed.

 
Comment by Mr. Smithers
2012-07-25 12:27:08

“The Waltons offer their million (that’s one percent of the American workforce, btw) minimum wage-earners jobs with no bennies or health insurance, so the tax-payers have to pick it up for them.”

You know why the offer minimum wage? Because someone stocking shelves or a cashier provides minimum wage worth of work. There’s a reason why a heart surgeon makes $500K and a WalMart cashier makes $7.25/hr. I know you can figure it out if you try.

And 1 million is not 1% of the workforce. There are about 140 million working adults in this country.

And not every one of the 1 million WM employees earns minimum wage. That’s a starting point. The vast majority of people who stay on over time get raises and/or promotions and earn significantly more than minimum wage. But even if 100% of WM employees earned $7.25/hr with 0 benefits, so what? It’s a private company that employs people. Those people voluntarily work there for an agreed upon wage. Unless you are a shareholder, it’s really none of your business what WM pays or doesn’t pay. As a shareholder of WM (I own about 450 shares), I do have a say, and I say keep the wages low and profit margins high.

 
Comment by Mr. Smithers
2012-07-25 12:29:24

“An example of that would be tax policies and tariffs that would benefit creation and support of small business and American manufacturing.”

You really have no knowledge of history, do you?
Read up on Smoot-Hawley, you might learn a thing or two about how destructive tariffs are. Only thing tariffs create is misery.

 
Comment by RioAmericanInBrasil
2012-07-25 12:29:54

Study proves it: Walmart has better business model than mom and pop stores.

Study proves it: Right wing shills care more about money than they care about their country, their own people and the vanishing American way of life.

I never understand this hatred for Walmart by the left. It provides cheap goods and services to millions of people,
destroys businesses, destroys three jobs for every one job it creates, sends our factory jobs to China and pawns off healthcare coverage to the state. What’s not to love??

forcing those millions of low income customers to pay more money for the same goods and services provided by other vendors. Insanity.

I’m sure the former mom and pop business owners and the $40-70K former factory workers who lost their jobs to WalMart’s China would rather still have their jobs, pay 15% more for their products than have their new $25K per year job and the “low prices” of WalMart. (The company that destroyed their jobs)

 
Comment by RioAmericanInBrasil
2012-07-25 12:38:48

Read up on Smoot-Hawley, you might learn a thing or two about how destructive tariffs are.

Tariffs were much higher during the 50’s, 60’s, 70’s and 80’s. You know. When Americans had good jobs with benefits. High tariffs have protected Brazil’s and other country’s factory jobs. But you don’t know all that because you only deal in small word,right-wing, soundbyte pseudo-Philosophy.

Only thing tariffs create is misery for the rich corporatist who does not give a damn about his country, his people or the American way of life.

 
Comment by Mr. Smithers
2012-07-25 12:42:16

Colorado,

Could it be maybe that your local joint just makes crappy burgers?

Two sort of local mom and pop burger joints I frequent…

In Seattle there is a min-chain (4 or 5 locations) called Dick’s Drive-In. On any given weekend day, the line is at least 20 minutes long at any of the 5 locations. It’s very good food and cheap too.

In Coeur D’Alene, ID there is a shack burger joint called Rogers. I mean literally a shack on Sherman Ave, doesn’t even have a public bathroom and just a couple of tables outside. During the summer, same thing 20+ minute wait no matter what time of day. The food is great, but by no means cheap. And yet people are lined up around the block waiting to buy lunch/dinner.

Small businesses can and do succeed when they provide good products.

 
Comment by Montana
2012-07-25 13:01:04

“I never understand this hatred for Walmart by the left.”

If they can keep Walmart far away from their neighborhoods, they can keep away all the undesirables who shop and work there as well.

Pretty clever, actually.

 
Comment by ahansen
2012-07-25 13:09:03

I’m not knocking Walmart’s minimum wage or the company’s right to employ low-skill labor at a commensurate rate of pay, (reading comprehension is our friend). I am saying (and I’ll reiterate s-l-o-w-l-y so you can understand) that the approximately one million (out of 1.2+ million total) employees who are at that pay level do not get health insurance benefits from their employer — who takes the de facto taxpayer subsidy and pockets the profit.

Whereas old free-market Mom and Pop typically offer at least some level of health insurance to their low-wage employees so they don’t have to rely on the emergency room at taxpayer expense.

If you’re going to shill and parrot, at least shill and parrot with some ideological consistency, Smithers.

 
Comment by scdave
2012-07-25 13:14:16

I don’t care how much you might want to start a small business ,the Monopolies will beat you in price ,even when the products are crap China shit…

Well, I tried to make that point the other day and FPSS told me to quit whining and deal with it….

Small business fail at an outstanding rate because they do not have the resources to withstand the down cycle or they just flat can’t compete with bigger, deeper pocket competitors…

 
Comment by Steve J
2012-07-25 13:37:03

Dollar Store is beating Walmart.

 
Comment by polly
2012-07-25 14:09:47

The areas where mom and pop can really compete are there, but they are outrageously limited. In retail I think you have to hit an area where people spend relatively small amounts of their money so they feel like their whole budget isn’t going to be blown if they don’t get the best deal possible. I know a kids toy store (small, extremely well edited, and with outstanding customer service) that can pull it off. Doesn’t hurt that the nearest Walmart is pretty far away. That being said, if you just want the hottest new toy that the child saw advertised on TV, this isn’t the place to get it.

 
Comment by In Colorado
2012-07-25 14:19:29

Could it be maybe that your local joint just makes crappy burgers?

Nope, they’re good, but no better than the high end chains.

But they do lack the brand name recognition, the TV advertising and the economies of scale. Plus being in the old, dated A&W location doesn’t help them as the chain places are all in gleaming, brand new (and expensive) facilities. Heck, last year they bulldozed the old Mickey D’s on Eisenhower Blvd and build a brand new one in its place.

What’s interesting is that we have 3 Sonic Burger franchises in town. I used to believe that it was impossible to make a worse burger than Mickey D’s, however Sonic proved me wrong, very wrong. Yet, their car hop restaurants have brisk business while Fatso’s languishes.

 
Comment by In Colorado
2012-07-25 14:24:16

Small business fail at an outstanding rate because they do not have the resources to withstand the down cycle or they just flat can’t compete with bigger, deeper pocket competitors

I also have a friend who tried to start a mom n pop espresso joint. They made pannini sandwiches, sold their own gelatto and served Lavazza coffee.

They did develop a faithful core set of customers, but they never reached the critical mass needed. Meanwhile, just a few blocks away, Starbucks had long lines selling their mediocre coffee.

My friend’s cafe’s product was superior in every way and competitively priced, and they still went out of business.

 
Comment by In Colorado
2012-07-25 14:34:34

Small businesses can and do succeed when they provide good products.

Very few do. A drive down Main Street in any town will show that most high volume businesses are chains. Sure, there will be shoe cobblers, comic book stores, martial arts studios, and other low margin, low profit outlets that big biz has left alone because … there’s no money in it.

 
Comment by Carl Morris
2012-07-25 14:56:35

Sometimes what seems superior in every way is still missing something critical for the masses. I had a friend put huge effort into building a gym. He had the business end of it right, and catered to the hardcore weightlifters and body builders. They loved it. But there just weren’t enough of them. And what they thought was perfect was a turnoff for everybody else. He finally gave up after about 2 years. He thought that if he created what he’d always wanted that it would suit others too. It did, but there just weren’t enough people like him.

 
Comment by sfrenter
2012-07-25 16:36:40

People of walmart dot com.

I really can’t say anything more about the issue, a picture being worth a thousand words and all that.

 
Comment by Housing Wizard
2012-07-25 16:50:30

The more I think of it ,the big Monopolies even crush
medium size business ,such as a business with 100 employees or 50 employees .

But I think the issue is that it’s the combo of the manufacturing being done outside of the Country as well as the power of the Monopoly to crush all competition .

How would you all feel if someday the only choice you have is five Monopolies that offer the same crap products ,
produced in the same crap locations outside the Country ,and they have the power to price fix any price they want because they are the only game in town .

Also ,nobody gives very much thought to the fact that it
is a National security issue to rely to heavy on outside Countries for manufacturing of needed products . What are we going to do, tell them we will bomb them if they don’t send us products we need and have come to rely on if they ever get mad at us ?

 
Comment by rms
2012-07-25 18:23:08

“The WalMart wealth link:”

Here’s the John T. Walton link regarding his U.S. Army Special Forces combat medic service and Silver Star for bravery:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_T._Walton

 
 
 
Comment by Hi-Z
2012-07-25 09:43:52

There is no basis for this conclusive number; only one man’s opinion that can not be disproven as there is no better data to disprove as to prove it.

Comment by turkey lurkey
2012-07-25 09:49:26

Ever heard of “algebra”?

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Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-07-25 10:33:08

Wednesday, September 12, 2007
Weapons of Math Instruction and Al-Gebra Movement

A public school teacher was arrested today at John F.Kennedy International Airport as he attempted to board a flight while in possession of a ruler, a protractor, a set square, a slide rule and a calculator.

At a morning press conference, Attorney General Alberto Gonzales said he believes the man is a member of the notorious Al-gebra movement.

He did not identify the man , who has been charged by the FBI with carrying weapons of math instruction.

“Al-gebra is a problem for us,” Gonzales said. “They desire solutions by means and extremes, and sometimes go off on tangents in a search of absolute value. They use secret code names like ‘x’ and ‘y’ and refer to themselves as ‘unknowns’, but we have determined they belong to a common denominator of the axis of medieval with coordinates in every country. As the Greek philanderer Isos Celes used to say, ‘There are 3 sides to every triangle’.”

When asked to comment on the arrest, President Bush said, “If God had wanted us to have better weapons of math instruction, He would have given us more fingers and toes.”

White House aides told reporters they could not recall a more intelligent or profound statement by the President.

 
Comment by turkey lurkey
2012-07-25 10:51:52

:lol:

I had forgotten all about that one.

 
Comment by Housing Wizard
2012-07-25 11:50:13

You guys all underestimate the power of Monopolies to crush their competition .

And what if people did come up with something new ,it would just be a matter of time in which the Monopolies would want to take it over ,or duplicate the new innovation ,or suppress the new innovation . The point is that Monopolies just have to much power .

 
Comment by sfrenter
2012-07-25 12:06:30

attempted to board a flight while in possession of a ruler, a protractor, a set square, a slide rule and a calculator.

Apparently there is a rule that you are not allowed to take any “tool” on a place that is longer than 7 inches.

I’m still mad about the fact that a very nice 15mm SnapOn wrench was confiscated by the TSA last weekend on our flight home. Grrrr.

I fly to NY every summer to do the NYC Triathlon, so I always take my bike pedals and a wrench (I borrow a bike for the race). The wrench has never come to anyone’s attention before.

$30 wrench (no sharp edges!) that I could have kept if I had wanted to check a bag for $25.00.

 
Comment by In Colorado
2012-07-25 12:25:25

The point is that Monopolies just have too much power.

Aw c’mon! We all know that if we can get “government out of the way” that business, especially “big biz” will do the right thing.

 
Comment by sleepless_near_seattle
2012-07-25 13:06:45

And what if people did come up with something new ,it would just be a matter of time in which the Monopolies would want to take it over ,or duplicate the new innovation ,or suppress the new innovation .

Didn’t that happen several times in the auto industry? Demand should certainly drive its appearance on the market (new engines like hybrids for example) and it’s a good thing it has, but I often wonder how much demand would have materialized had those innovations been allowed to have been exposed to the general public earlier.

That’s why I don’t get the right’s hate for things like the Prius. So what if the majority of its end users are lefty pinko commies. It’s great innovation from an engineering standpoint, it’s popular, and reduces demand on oil which to some degree lowers the price of gas, another one of the right’s recent hot button issues.

 
Comment by In Colorado
2012-07-25 13:50:53

That’s why I don’t get the right’s hate for things like the Prius.

They’re afraid that their beloved gas guzzlers will be legislated out of existence and they’ll be forced to drive a limp wristed hybrid. Think about it … those “truck nutz” would look even sillier on a Prius.

 
Comment by turkey lurkey
2012-07-25 13:55:23

Google “Who Killed the Electric Car”

 
Comment by Housing Wizard
2012-07-25 17:50:10

The point is what are these jack ass talking heads talking about regarding new small business opening when they know that they can’t compete against WalMart /China Manufacturing Nation . Ford Moter Company just built a new car manufacturing plant in Mexico . I think Hershey just built a
plant in Mexico after they closed down their long term manufacturing location in America .

Everybody talks about how its much more efficient to let
the lowest wage labor Nations produce whatever they can ,but that doesn’t take into consideration who ends up with the greater profits or benefits by that efficiency .If the benefits or greater profits just go into fewer hands ,than who is it really benefiting ? Does Ford Moter Company lower the price of the car when they sell in America because they saved labor costs by opening a new Plant in Mexico ? No ,if anything they raised the price ,as if they were still manufacturing the product in America at the higher labor costs .

And those crap products from Wal Mart arent really worth the cheaper price anyway and they end up in the land fills quicker and they fall apart quicker . Half the time you have to put the products together yourself . That plastic from China is weird stuff . Suffice to say that it smells and is toxic and most that plastic certainly doesn’t hold up even in the Sun ,and most likely not in the microwave .

 
Comment by RioAmericanInBrasil
2012-07-25 18:06:06

who ends up with the greater profits or benefits by that efficiency .If the benefits or greater profits just go into fewer hands ,than who is it really benefiting ?

Exactly. It was a lobby/rich driven policy that did not promote the general welfare and is a long term threat to domestic tranquility because it does not establish justice and moves away from government’s responsibility of promoting a more perfect union.

We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

 
Comment by Housing Wizard
2012-07-25 18:57:19

Yes ,exactly Rio ? And for a long time in this Country we seemed to promote those basic values of the “General Welfare ” of the majority population .

 
Comment by alpha-sloth
2012-07-25 19:49:13

And for a long time in this Country we seemed to promote those basic values of the “General Welfare ” of the majority population .

Then we found out that was commie, and the majority of the population were deadbeats.

 
Comment by Housing Wizard
2012-07-25 20:59:08

The General Welfare of the Nation doesn’t translate into Deadbeat Nation or Welfare Nation or Commie Nation . I think it means creating circumstances that promote full employment with livable wages and reducing the need for government handouts . For the longest time they had the “War on Poverty ” as a National goal .

 
 
 
 
Comment by Diogenes (Tampa, Fl)
2012-07-25 08:44:00

Well, it would have been worse if we didn’t “Do something”……….
Yea. right. Banksters living in luxury by fiat money robbery.
The NEW DEAL in progress.

 
Comment by wphr_editor
2012-07-25 10:08:33

“Mr. Global Economy, I’m afraid I have some bad news.”

 
 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-07-25 01:44:40

BULLETIN British GDP falls 0.7% in second quarter as recession digs in

July 24, 2012, 9:05 a.m. EDT
U.S. flash PMI at lowest since December 2010
By Steve Goldstein

WASHINGTON (MarketWatch) — U.S. manufacturing growth slowed to the lowest level in July since December 2010, according to the flash Markit manufacturing purchasing managers index released Tuesday. The gauge fell to 51.8 from 52.5 in July, marking the second-lowest rate since the recovery. PMI readings above 50 signal an increase in activity, while readings below 50 signal a decrease. The flash PMI is based on approximately 85%-90% of total PMI survey responses each month, and the index is similar to the Institute for Supply Management’s manufacturing index, which last month fell into contraction territory.

Comment by Liz Pendens
2012-07-25 05:31:30

Who needs manufacturing when we have China? All our workers have more time to spend more if they don’t work anyway. Welfare programs just need contiunal expansion to keep the ponzi system running smoothly. The best part is its free: Just print the money and hand it out accordingly so the bills can still get paid to the 1%. So you see, there really is no problem. There can be no problems in this invincible era. We got this.

Comment by RioAmericanInBrasil
2012-07-25 12:54:40

Welfare programs just need contiunal expansion to keep the ponzi system running smoothly.

Which brings up a big problem. If our government has willingly altered our economy to benefit the rich while putting millions out of work, then it is the American government’s responsibility to expand welfare.

To those on the right, there is no disputing it as it is one of the goals of the Constitution. It is in our mission statement that government’s responsibility is to: “PROMOTE THE GENERAL WELFARE”

Of course the best way to live up to that is to have policies to create and nurture good jobs and the “promoting general welfare” will take care of itself. But our government has not and is not doing that. But they still need to live up to their responsibility of promoting the general welfare one way of another.

One way is to tax the rich more and spend more on the safety-net stuff that wealth inequality has made necessary. USA needing more welfare sucks. Americans want jobs but here we are.

Justice Story concluded that the General Welfare Clause is not a grant of general legislative power,[6][4] but a qualification on the taxing power[7][8][4] which includes within it a federal power to spend federal revenues on matters of general interest to the federal government wiki

Comment by sleepless_near_seattle
2012-07-25 13:43:17

If our government has willingly altered our economy to benefit the rich while putting millions out of work, then it is the American government’s responsibility to expand welfare.
.
.
But our government has not and is not doing that. But they still need to live up to their responsibility of promoting the general welfare one way of another.

Thought-provoking angle, there, Rio. Thanks.

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Comment by RioAmericanInBrasil
2012-07-25 18:11:48

You’re welcome. Thank you.

 
 
 
 
Comment by combotechie
2012-07-25 05:40:16

PB: Do you ever sleep?

Comment by frankie
2012-07-25 05:44:36

I believe he hibernates during periods of economic strength.

Comment by combotechie
2012-07-25 05:46:33

Which means he NEVER sleeps.

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Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-07-25 07:12:25

Calling out MSM lies is almost another full time job in itself on top of the day job…

 
Comment by GrizzlyBear
2012-07-25 20:34:25

He’s Housing Bubble Blog Hall of Fame material.

 
 
Comment by measton
2012-07-25 08:20:12

How can England crash? I thought austerity was the solution. Note if you take out the Olympics things would be even worse.

Comment by 2banana
2012-07-25 08:42:18

What austerity?

UK Government spending continues to increase.

2008-09 629.8
2009-10 670.1
2010-11 687.9
2011-12 687.6
2012-13 683.4
2013-14 720
2014-15 733.5
2015-16 744
2016-17 756

http://www.ukpublicspending.co.uk/
http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2010/apr/25/uk-public-spending-1963

Comment by In Colorado
2012-07-25 11:22:39

The 2013-14 budgets and beyond look like wishful thinking. The 2012-2113 budget (the current one) is less than those in 2010-11, and 2011-12, so there was some “austerity” even if it was minimal.

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Comment by frankie
2012-07-25 12:19:38

You’ve forgotten to take into account inflation. If they hit theeir target for 2011-12 given that inflation was 3.6% in March that’s a 3.6% cut in real terms. Inflation may reach their target of 2% this year but again that would be over a 2% cut in real terms.

 
Comment by In Colorado
2012-07-25 13:47:09

I did take inflation into account when I said that the “austerity” was “minimal”, as opposed to 30%+ cuts which some believe will fix everything.

 
Comment by frankie
2012-07-25 15:04:19

Kill or cure, think I’d prefer an aspirin.

 
 
Comment by Al
2012-07-25 16:22:59

.3 drop from 2010/2011 to 2011/2012
4.2 drop from 2011/2012 to 2012/2013

Now that’s what I call belt tightening!

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Comment by aNYCdj
Comment by measton
2012-07-25 08:21:12

Who are kristen stewart and robert pattinson?

Comment by Northeastener
2012-07-25 08:36:50

You obviously don’t have a pre-teen or teenage girl in the house…

Comment by Steve J
2012-07-25 08:47:17

Kinky man, very kinky.

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Comment by Specu-debtor
2012-07-25 09:40:19

But Rolling Stone has both Matt Taibbi for the A-dults and the Biebs for the tweens.

My daughter is 13 and we are going to spend two weeks next door to my ole surfing buddy in Cambria. His son is 14. Awkwardness guaranteed! Knowing someone in Cambria= $50/night lodging=beachhouse priceless.

We don’t have much $$ to spend; but we have family and friends we have not seen since 2006. Wanna gotta do it. Not exactly studying abroad but still costly.

 
Comment by scdave
2012-07-25 14:10:45

Love Cambria…Little Tavern in up-town that is the original from the logging days….Big hump in the floor right down the middle of the bar…If you start on one side its up-hill then down-hill…Makes you feel like you have had a little bit too much fun…. :)

 
 
Comment by AmazingRuss
2012-07-25 10:58:19

“You obviously don’t have a pre-teen or teenage girl in the house…”

But I DO have one in the trunk of my car. For emergencies.

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Comment by Northeastener
2012-07-25 12:03:14

Lol…

Jake: [fakes accent] How much for the little girl? How much for the women?
Father: What?
Jake: Your women. I want to buy your women. The little girl, your daughters… sell them to me. Sell me your children!

 
 
 
 
 
Comment by SUGuy
2012-07-25 03:42:33

For stupid money you can buy one of these. There too many nice second homes or retirement digs up for sale in upstate NY.

Here is one

http://www.cnyhomes.com/Listing/Search/info.cgi?mlnum=S245655

Comment by 2banana
2012-07-25 08:20:47

$6000 in taxes for a house in the middle of nowhere upstate NY with NO roads to it, trash pick up, etc…

Comment by Diogenes (Tampa, Fl)
2012-07-25 09:03:44

But it’s Real estate, man. And we’re running out of land. There’s only so much of it. The price can only go up. It ALWAYS goes up.
There’s no better time to buy. There’s never been a better time to buy…….IF you don’t buy now……”YOU’LL BE PRICED OUT FOREVER.”

And …..It’s in NY. You know those Canadians across the border are going to be coming down to take advantage of the Low prices.

 
 
Comment by ahansen
2012-07-25 11:51:08

That is a beautifully-presented property. Very evocative, yet somehow… not seductive. Still, what a cool place to rent for a weekend! Thanks for posting.

 
Comment by MiddleCoaster
2012-07-25 13:33:17

Wow, the buyer will own an island! Just like Larry Ellison!

 
 
Comment by SUGuy
Comment by palmetto
2012-07-25 06:15:37

But, but, it’s HISTORIC! And it has beach access!

 
Comment by rms
2012-07-25 07:54:04

And mold at no extra cost to you.

 
Comment by sleepless_near_seattle
2012-07-25 08:19:51

Looks great in the summer. Where’s the winter pic?

 
Comment by SUGuy
2012-07-25 16:27:36

Sorry meant to post this one for those on a budget. How about having a paid off rock before retirement.

http://www.cnyhomes.com/Listing/Search/info.cgi?mlnum=S275693

 
 
Comment by Muggy
2012-07-25 04:18:19

Buy now or be ___________________ !

Comment by combotechie
2012-07-25 06:51:15

To be ______ or not to be ______, that is the question.

Comment by Ol'Bubba
2012-07-25 16:27:01

effed?

 
Comment by Muggy
2012-07-25 17:34:03

“To be ______ or not to be ______, that is the question.”

To be poof or not to be poof, that is the question.

 
Comment by ahansen
2012-07-25 22:23:46

Nice, combo.

 
 
 
Comment by Martin
Comment by aNYCdj
2012-07-25 07:50:44

in line with my prediction 1/3 of colleges will close by the end of the decade and probably a lot sooner

Which is good, because we need cheaper alternatives, more intensive schooling, 4 years into 3 or less.

Mandatory short term job training for new careers, when your business closes and you collect unemployment….no more wasting 99 weeks with nothing to put on your resume.

Comment by Steve J
2012-07-25 08:49:59

99 weeks is long gone. It’s been back to 26 weeks for a while now.

Comment by Diogenes (Tampa, Fl)
2012-07-25 09:11:49

I collected a little over a year. I fell through the “long term” collection times due to waiting to file my claim. I did not file the week I was laid off. I waited a month and that put me into a different ‘tier” grouping. I think my claim lasted 57 or 62 weeks. I don’t recall, but it ended abruptly. Only a select group of EARLY layoffs in 2009 collected the 99 weeks. At least that is how it worked in Florida. That ended around for me around March of 2011, but only lasted till then due to delays at each “refiling” period.
The max benefit is typically 26 weeks.

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Comment by turkey lurkey
2012-07-25 09:53:14

“Mandatory short term job training for new careers, when your business closes and you collect unemployment…”

This is actually law in many states, but… the business has to be of certain size or larger and it’s not always enforced and enough money will get the company exempted.

Comment by polly
2012-07-25 10:29:19

He isn’t talking about the company providing training. He wants the government to provide it for anyone who becomes unemployed instead of, you know, expecting them to look for work.

As a general rule (there are exceptions for special programs) you can’t collect unemployment while in school. If you are in school, you are not “available” for work and therefore ineligible.

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Comment by turkey lurkey
2012-07-25 10:57:32

Ah. Looks like I read that wrong.

But wasn’t there a program already like that?

Wait, here it is: http://www.doleta.gov/programs/factsht/warn.htm

Doesn’t give specifics about retraining thought, even though it’s in the name. Hmmm.

 
Comment by Happy2bHeard
2012-07-25 10:59:42

The last time I was unemployed (2002), there were actually job training programs available while collecting unemployment. I thought I would get right back to work, so I missed the window of opportunity to get into one.

 
Comment by aNYCdj
2012-07-25 12:05:21

Polly always seems to forget there are no real jobs anymore. That pay more than unemployment. Plus all the Illegal non paying internships everywhere

Plus you know you are guaranteed a set amount of weeks why screw it up by taking a part time job with a potential schizo employer.Who will fire you and claim you destroyed the business and then you have to appeal and wait 12 weeks before you win and get all the back checks…

So if you dont want the guv to pay for some quick job re-training then pay people to sit around and do nothing again for 99 weeks…..or let them collect unemployment while in those Illegal internships..

Most dont have good credit anymore to get a private student loan…..So Polly what about another Guaranteed student loan while collecting unemployment the rent still has to be paid.

 
Comment by polly
2012-07-25 12:05:42

Yes, as I mentioned there are exceptions for some training programs that are co-ordinated through the unemployment offices. But I was once denied by unemployment for a week because I responded truthfully that I had taken a class that week. Called the office, and explained that I really was available and actively looking for work as the class met once a week for 2 hours for only 8 weeks and I would be delighted to drop it if a job offer came around. The woman on the phone paused and told me to say I wasn’t in school the next week because that wasn’t what they meant to happen.

dj said he wanted EVERYONE to have to take a training class the instant they were on unemployment because, evidently, no one who is unemployed ever gets another job in the field they already know (and everyone who is on unemployment takes a vacation for the entire time they are covered). I presume he thinks this because he can’t get a job in TV anymore and has no ability to consider that other people - like ex-gsfixer - have other experiences.

 
Comment by polly
2012-07-25 13:10:17

If there are “no real jobs anymore” than what the heck do you expect to get trained in, especially in 26 weeks? So you expect to be guaranteed a job at the end of this free, government provided training?

 
Comment by aNYCdj
2012-07-25 19:24:41

26 weeks x 35 hours is over 900 hours of class room and lab time….certainly you can learn new computer skills, or car repair….intensive full time training no wussie 2 classes a week… and you get docked for each day you miss.

You have nothing else to do …you’re UNEMPLOYED!

Plus We have to stop thinking in college terms of semesters summers off…and start thinking of rolling admissions, full time school…

Comprehensive Employment and Training Act

The Comprehensive Employment and Training Act (or CETA, Pub.L. 93-203) was a United States federal law enacted in 1973 to train workers and provide them with jobs in the public service.

The program offered work to those with low incomes and the long term unemployed as well as summer jobs to low income high school students. Full time jobs were provided for a period of 12 to 24 months in public agencies or private not for profit organizations.

The intent was to impart a marketable skill that would allow participants to move to an unsubsidized job. It was an extension of the Works Progress Administration program from the 1930s. The Act was intended to decentralize control of federally controlled job training programs, giving more power to the individual state governments. Nine years later, it was replaced by the Job Training Partnership Act.

 
 
 
Comment by BetterRenter
2012-07-25 21:13:51

I don’t think you got the memo, aNYCdj, but information technology isn’t supposed to reduce employment in the information professions like teacher, doctor and lawyer, because… well, just because!

 
 
 
Comment by UNKNOWN TENANT
2012-07-25 05:26:57

Older Homeowners Still Underwater

July 19, 2012, 11:00 AM.

By Kelly Greene

Foreclosure rates are still lower among older Americans than their younger counterparts, but they rose dramatically in the past five years, according to research released this morning by AARP.

More than 1.5 million U.S. homeowners age 50 or older lost their homes to foreclosure from 2007 through 2011, according to the group’s analysis of CoreLogic data.

The percentage of loans in foreclosure or at least 90 days delinquent increased to 6% from 1% in the same time period, it says.

The situation appears even worse for those age 75 and older, who had a 3.2% foreclosure rate, compared with 2.6% for those age 65 to 74 and 3% for those age 50 to 64.

Meanwhile, 16% of mortgages made to those 50-plus, a total of 3.5 million loans, were worth more than the real estate they were used to buy.

Since older homeowners often count on home equity to help finance retirement expenses, the lack thereof “is troubling,” says Debra Whitman, AARP’s executive vice president for policy.

http://blogs.wsj.com/totalreturn/2012/07/19/older-homeowners-still-underwater/ - 56k -

Comment by salinasron
2012-07-25 07:09:21

“Meanwhile, 16% of mortgages made to those 50-plus, a total of 3.5 million loans, were worth more than the real estate they were used to buy.”

So that means only 16% of the loans are performing loans? Weird way of putting things in print.

Comment by Rental Watch
2012-07-25 09:30:57

No. 16% of the mortgages exceed the value of the real estate (ie. 16% underwater).

94% are either performing (payments being made on schedule) or have delinquencies less than 90 days.

 
Comment by Ol'Bubba
2012-07-25 16:31:25

It’s also possible for an underwater loan to be a performing loan. As long as the borrower is making the payments as spelled out in the note, the loan is performing.

 
 
Comment by Montana
2012-07-25 09:01:38

I was driving home from a meeting last night, heard part of Dave Ramsey show…a young couple with 4 kids bought a house with money from the parents, who mortgaged their own place for $110k. So the couple had it free and clear, more or less, but then HELOCed it for another $110k…the parents didn’t even get a lien on their house. The wife had quit her good job for a teaching asst job to be near the kids, still had student loan debt and the usual.

Ramsey really went off on her and she kept saying “I know, I know…” Yeah right. I wanted to reach through and strangle her.

Comment by Specu-debtor
2012-07-25 09:56:39

Spending time near your children is also valuable

I bought my daughter a wetsuit for $150. So she can get out in the water and not be on the computer posting inanities with friends. She may go on to save a species or the polluted ocean some day. She may learn to love surfing. Not all $$ sacrifices are as cut and dry as they seem.

As lunchlady, wife drives kids to school each day(saving some $$). She uses her extra time to volunteer or to exercise. Being visible at the school opens doors for positions with benefits, even though it costs her in opportunity right now.

The wetsuit is money well “invested”. Like the mom asst teaching in their school. Valuable but not in $$. Maybe the kid’s will appreciate her sacrifices some day and help their folks age gracefully…..Maybe. Have to learn how to pass the baton to next generation and teach them to be successfull with it.

However, there are no guarantees. The couple should not have leveraged against their “free” house, though, I agree.

 
Comment by Diogenes (Tampa, Fl)
2012-07-25 10:03:19

I feel bad for the foolish generosity of the parents, however, i am reminded that : No good deed goes unpunished.

 
 
Comment by rms
2012-07-25 18:36:27

“Meanwhile, 16% of mortgages made to those 50-plus, a total of 3.5 million loans, were worth more than the real estate they were used to buy.”

So it sounds like 16% were stupidly greedy likely opting for the 125% HELOC; a Stanley Johnson Sr. commercial is needed. IMO the AARP is too liberal, e.g., lobbying for no consequences, just bailouts for older FBs. I wonder if they warned their membership of the hazards during the run-up, or suggested that it was a great time to be silver and liberate that equity?

 
 
Comment by frankie
2012-07-25 05:43:25

Dive Dive Dive

UK GDP slump: Osborne’s blundering incompetence made the economy sicker

Despite rain, jubilee and Olympic Games hopes, the 0.7% drop leaves the chancellor’s deficit reduction strategy in tatters

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2012/jul/25/britain-double-dip-recession-figures-catastrophic

The euro zone faces economic disaster unless its financially stronger states and its central bank commit to bearing a larger share of the region’s debt burden, leading global economists including two advisers to the German government said.

“We believe that …Europe is sleepwalking toward a disaster of incalculable proportions… The sense of a never-ending crisis, with one domino falling after another, must be reversed,” the Institute for New Economic Thinking (INET), backed by veteran investor George Soros, wrote in its report.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2012/0725/breaking18.html

Greece may need a second debt restructuring to stay in the euro, a leading political ally of Chancellor Angela Merkel said.

The comments by Norbert Barthle, the Christian Democratic Union’s parliamentary budget spokesman, are the first indication by a senior German official that additional help for Greece may be forthcoming to avert the market turmoil that would be triggered by its exit from the 17-nation currency region.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-07-25/merkel-ally-says-greece-may-need-second-debt-cut-to-stay-in-euro.html

(Reuters) - Spain paid the second highest yield on short-term debt since the birth of the euro at an auction on Tuesday, and EU officials said Greece had little hope of meeting the terms of its bailout, casting fresh doubt on its future in the euro zone.

Spain’s increasingly desperate struggle to put its finances right has seen its borrowing costs soar to levels that are not manageable indefinitely, reflecting a growing belief that it will need a sovereign bailout the euro zone can barely afford.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2012/07/25/us-eurozone-idUSBRE86N1F020120725

Still looking on the bright side, at least it’s stopped raining.

 
Comment by Arizona Slim
2012-07-25 05:59:41

I had a short night’s sleep too. And darn if my beloved KXCI wasn’t playing one of my favorite-est genres of music ever. That would be head-banging heavy metal.

So, I got up, and here I am. Doing some time at my home studio computer before heading out to work at another location for the day.

Will start this day of work with a meeting with a potential freelance copywriting client. Yes, you read that right. All of my tickling of the keyboard here — and other places — has gained recognition from people with money and budgets.

Expect to hear a lot more about Slim the freelance copywriter in the months to come.

Comment by palmetto
2012-07-25 06:23:54

“All of my tickling of the keyboard here — and other places — has gained recognition from people with money and budgets.”

So, wait, posting to a blog qualifies as copywriting? How? I’m not doubting you, just curious. Actually, looking at the sorry-ass state of most internet copywriting, advertisers could use someone literate like yourself, instead of searching for all those “social media” experts who can’t even spell.

Comment by palmetto
2012-07-25 06:35:49

And I hope you read a client or two a diplomatically worded riot act about how “social media” doesn’t translate into $$.

A well-written, well placed ad, however, just might.

Comment by aNYCdj
2012-07-25 07:58:16

Palmy i knew quite a few dj’s who use myspace ( still do) and make money because they would limit their friends to being very local…what good if 5000 friends if they are all over the world and your gig is in tampa?

Anyone know how to find people on FB say within 5 miles of a zip code?

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Comment by Steve J
2012-07-25 08:52:12

Google knows.

 
 
 
 
Comment by turkey lurkey
2012-07-25 06:26:20

You’re a head-banger?

Seriously, I woulda never guessed.

well… huh.

Comment by Specu-debtor
2012-07-25 08:15:16

Hell bent for leather? (judas priest)

Back in Black? Highway to Hell? Dirty Deeds (AC/DC)
Ironman? Sabbath Crazy Train (Ozzy)
Enter the Sandman (metallica)
Which of these your favored title? What else you like?

 
 
Comment by Diogenes (Tampa, Fl)
2012-07-25 09:37:22

……………recognition from people with money and budgets.
Yes, it’s nice.
But I have found from experience that the people who have money don’t really like spending it, unless it is on frivolous luxuries.
They will typically will pay as little as possible and sometimes, even after you did the work, they will try to find ways to NOT pay.
Be careful of people selling you on what they can do for you.

Comment by turkey lurkey
2012-07-25 10:01:09

That’s been pretty much my experience as well. Jobs creators? HA! More like theft of services as often as possible.

I ALWAYS get half up front when working for businesses or the wealthy and NOBODY gets credit and “net” nothing.

You see, I’ve EARNED my disrespect for the rich.

 
 
Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2012-07-25 20:09:44

3.8 earthquake shook me awake this morning. But after web surfing for 45 minutes I went back to sleep.

 
 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-07-25 07:09:34

It looks like the bounce is currently in the “gravitationally-influenced redirection” phase…

Bulls muster Street bounce

Faced with a choice of Caterpillar and Boeing (bullish) vs. Apple and Netflix (bearish), investors choose the former as U.S. stocks manage early Wednesday gains.

Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-07-25 07:17:20

New-home sales down 8.4% in June
Data dent bulls’ momentum

U.S. equity benchmarks diverge in the wake as data on june sales of new homes fail to confirm the prior month’s upturn. Caterpillar and Boeing underpin the Dow following results, while Apple and Netflix leave the Nasdaq again mired in the red.

Comment by In Colorado
2012-07-25 13:43:02

I have to say, after setting up the Roku streaming box and hooking it up to our TV that I really like Netflix. The satellite is going bye bye after the Olympics are over (otherwise I would cancel it right now).

 
 
 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-07-25 07:11:25

July 25, 2012, 10:07 a.m. EDT
Treasurys, dollar pare loss after home-sales data
By Deborah Levine

NEW YORK (MarketWatch) — Treasury prices and the dollar pared losses on Wednesday after a report showed U.S. sales of new homes unexpectedly fell in June. The euro EURUSD +0.58% traded at $1.2129, from $1.2135 before the data and $1.2066 in North American trade late Tuesday. The dollar index DXY -0.37% , which tracks the U.S. unit against six major currencies, fell to 83.739, from 84.009. Yields on 10-year notes 10_YEAR +1.51% , which move inversely to prices, pared a rise to 1 basis point to 1.40%.

 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-07-25 07:15:42

If you buy now, your competition is federally-insured subprime buyers.

Subprime Rally Building as Dealers Sop Up Supply: Credit Markets
By Jody Shenn - Jul 24, 2012 8:18 AM PT

The rally in U.S. home-loan securities without government backing is accelerating as investors wager the housing bust is over and supply is sopped up by bond dealers emboldened by new capital rules.

Gains on subprime-mortgage bonds from 2005 through 2007, the years that produced the most defaults leading to the worst financial crisis since the Great Depression, have soared to 5.4 percent in July, bringing returns for the year through last week to 21.6 percent, according to Barclays Plc data. Securities backed by option adjustable-rate mortgages jumped over the past month by 7 percent to the highest level since May 2011.

Investors faced with benchmark interest rates at record lows are seeking mortgage securities after a 35 percent decline in home prices from the peak in 2006. Wall Street banks are also adding to inventories after regulatory changes in June. As Citigroup Inc. warns prices may drop if dealers can’t place the holdings, daily trading volumes surged almost 40 percent last week, reaching the highest this year by one measure.

“There’s been a lot of investors waiting on the sidelines until home prices stabilize and now that they have, they’re moving in,” said Adam Yarnold, managing director of securitized products trading in New York at Barclays’s investment-banking arm. In addition, “the absolute low level of rates out there is driving institutional investors like pension funds to put money into anything with” returns that can top 7.5 percent and so- called non-agency securities offer that potential, he said.

Less Capital

The Federal Reserve and other regulators last month ended the use of credit ratings in calculations of how much capital Wall Street traders must hold against securitized debt. That’s allowing them to hold less for speculative-grade debt, helping the $1 trillion market manage greater sales.

Dealers added $3.5 billion of non-agency securities to their inventories last week, based on regulatory data. That compares with $4.5 billion for the rest of 2012 and sales of $18.1 billion in the final seven months of last year.

“While the market has shown resilience in the face of large supply, we would be cautious,” Citigroup analysts including Tanuj Garg wrote in a July 20 report. “Yields are at the tightest levels in the past two years, and the prices could pull back if dealers are unable to place their increased inventory.”

Comment by Neuromance
2012-07-25 14:21:30

House prices are directly linked to the amount of debt the buyer can take on. I think we’re past Peak Consumer Debt. Low loan to value numbers and high debt to income numbers are going to keep defaulting as they have in the past.

If loan originators generate junk, the only buyer/insurer will be the government. However, the bond markets and traders are the ones who ultimately dictate most house prices, so it’s an arena well worth watching.

In addition, “the absolute low level of rates out there is driving institutional investors like pension funds to put money into anything with” returns that can top 7.5 percent and so- called non-agency securities offer that potential, he said.

And that’s how bubbles start.

 
 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-07-25 07:18:37

I really can’t stand Romney’s tone. I can’t imagine women or blacks voting for him (other than Mormons or Utahns, of course). Obama manages to strike a contemporary fatherly tone, while Romney is Ward Cleaver.

Comment by AmazingRuss
2012-07-25 07:31:26

Ward wouldn’t send his neighbor’s job to China.

Comment by In Colorado
2012-07-25 10:41:37

Mitt isn’t Ward, he’s Gordon Gekko. I wonder what embarrassing horrors (tax evasion/amnesty?) are chronicled in all those tax returns he’s refusing to release?

 
 
Comment by michael
2012-07-25 07:38:08

” a contemporary fatherly tone”

i have never in my life seen a better reason to vote for someone…how do you reconcile this with the fact that a romney/rubio team would be much better looking team than obama/biden though?

a true conundrum.

Comment by polly
2012-07-25 08:38:43

People who are voting based on how close the candiates are to the voter’s ideology and/or policy preferences have already made their decisions.

The only ones left to influence are the emotional/I’d like to have a beer with him/he seems like a creep voters.

This is one of the reasons why GOTV has become so important in modern politics.

 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-07-25 09:14:50

I’m not suggesting this is a reason to vote for one or the other candidate; rather, I suggest this as a likely basis for many other voters’ choices.

I personally am considering the idea of flipping a penny when I fill in my absentee ballot.

Comment by michael
2012-07-25 09:59:14

i have voted third party in the past few elections. the more obama opens his mouth…the more i am beginning to realize that i would much rather criticize romney than obama…so who knows.

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Comment by michael
2012-07-25 10:02:16

I have voted third party in the past couple of elections. The more Obama opens his mouth the more I am realizing that I would rather criticize Romney than Obama…so who knows.

Obama seems to be focused more on securing his base and alienating independents.

When Obama was elected I was hopeful. I told people he had the opportunity to be one of the greatest presidents that has ever lived…epic fail.

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Comment by Doghouse Riley
2012-07-25 13:30:36

Michael:

“I told people he had the opportunity to be one of the greatest presidents that has ever lived”

What was it in Obama’s background that led to that conclusion?

I’m asking seriously. No snark intended.

 
Comment by In Colorado
2012-07-25 13:39:56

He said opportunity. That doesn’t mean that he had the potential to rise to the occasion, just that the occasion was there.

 
 
 
Comment by Happy2bHeard
2012-07-25 15:58:48

“how do you reconcile this with the fact that a romney/rubio team would be much better looking team than obama/biden though?”

IDK, it seems like a tossup. Biden is still pretty good looking. I think you can’t be hideous and succeed in politics.

On looks alone, Romney would do better with Ryan than Rubio.

 
 
Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2012-07-25 07:47:23

True, I like Obama more than Romney. But I like Gary Johnson and Ron Paul far more than Obama.

Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-07-25 10:27:16

Do you still plan to vote for RP?

Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2012-07-25 20:18:08

Since his son Rand announced his endorsement of Romney, I am tilting toward Gary Johnson.

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Comment by 2banana
2012-07-25 08:25:05

I voted for Hillary in the primaries because she was so hot…

Comment by Northeastener
2012-07-25 08:39:42

This is me throwing up in my mouth…

Comment by Specu-debtor
2012-07-25 09:46:42

Is Obama running with Biden again? I vote for Clooney as Veep! Who is Mitt running with?

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Comment by Specu-debtor
2012-07-25 09:44:00

Pantsuits for the lady.
Have you seen Jenna, GWB’s daughter, on NBC? Matt Lauer supposedly impregnated her! Another Olympics, another scandal in the making! (Totally made up but the MSM seems to make stuff up anyway)

Comment by palmetto
2012-07-25 10:08:44

“Matt Lauer supposedly impregnated her!”

Most Repulsive. Anchor. Ever.

I dunno how he keeps his gig. Must have pictures of TPTB with the barnyard animals.

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Comment by rms
2012-07-25 18:15:40

“Matt Lauer supposedly impregnated her!”

Youtube link??

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Comment by Stellaralliances
2012-07-25 07:48:05

A new report wants to burst the idea of a Toronto housing bubble.
Yes, condo sales and construction are booming, but the Royal Bank of Canada report says there is no housing bubble because the city’s number of new housing units is in line with demographic needs.
The Greater Toronto Area sees an influx of close to 100,000 people each year.
That translated to approximately 38,000 new households per year from 2006 to 2011, according to RBC and Statistics Canada data in the report.

 
Comment by aNYCdj
2012-07-25 08:06:39

“No reason for him to be shot like a dog. If he’s running away from them, ain’t no reason,” James White said.

http://www.myfoxdfw.com/story/19103767/police-kill-suspect-in-pleasant-grove

 
Comment by 2banana
2012-07-25 08:23:36

New Home Sales Miss By Most In 20 Months
Tyler Durden - 07/25/2012 - Zerohedge

But, but, but… the housing recovery. Was demand pulled forward? Could it be that warm weather encouraged people to venture out of their igloos? It appears so as new home sales plunge 8.4% MoM on expectations of a rise of 0.7%, days after the already fudged NAR data showed a huge miss in existing home sales as well. This is the first miss since October of last year and the biggest miss of expectations since October 2010. This is the biggest absolute drop since January with the actual number of new homes sold, not annualized, in June was 33,000 - of which a mere 1,000 was in the NorthEast. Median home prices also fell appreciably. Hope.is.fading as we note that of the 33,000 total new houses sold in June, 11,000 have not even been started, and 11,000 are still under construction and the number of homes sold at a price over $750,000 was less than 1,000.

 
Comment by Diogenes (Tampa, Fl)
2012-07-25 09:54:59

Some quick anecdotal evidence of American decline in both housing and economy:
2 things happened this past week.
one friend called me and we discussed our lives and future. he has been an “independent” business operator since he was a teenager.
that means he took in very little income most of the time, bartered and traded, did repair work and restorations and paid NO Social Security Taxes and NO Federal taxes.
The Past 5 years he found work doing unlicensed A/C installations and repairs by paying a licensed contractor an occasional fee and sometimes not when his ‘partner’ wasn’t a part of the job. He often made $1000 a day on some jobs. I estimate he has in excess of $350,000 in untaxed savings. 2 years ago, his partner ratted him out on non-payment of federal/state and SS taxes. IRS ran him down, harassed him, collected some cash (he does CASH business and hides it in various place) and he has since paid some tax the past 2 years (though i am sure he understated his ‘earnings’).
Well, guess what…………he’s 65 now.
And YES, he gets to collect around $1000 a month from Social Security because he is an American that is 65 years old.
I thought you had to PUT IN at least 20 to 30 years of money to collect.
Well, no, I guess it’s really best to cheat all you can because you get to collect…………..illegal aliens and their families, too.
NO problem….Print more money.

In another event, another friend is being foreclosed. that’s right. Just the past few months this came up. Non-payment. Bank wants it’s money. Hired a lawyer. Lawyer is sure they can’t come up with the original “deed” because of MERS and the Mortgage was re-assigned multiple times since he bought the place.
He figures he can stay indefinitely, because it’s tied up in legal action, and the lawyer is pretty sure the “original” claim is lost.
Too bad the STATE governments didn’t sue the MERS system for tax evasion and tax fraud for not FILING the documents at the local court house and PAYING REQuired fees.
But, this is just ONE MORE property that is not getting the mortgage paid and that is “owner occupied”.
So, again, NOT paying is the way to go in America. If you go to work and pay taxes, and take your earnings and pay debts, then you are a sucker. America is a land of opportunity for DEADBEATS and swindlers, but a TAX sucking leach for the working class who pay the burdens of supporting the rest.
Sad but true.

Comment by palmetto
2012-07-25 10:10:59

“America is a land of opportunity for DEADBEATS and swindlers, but a TAX sucking leach for the working class who pay the burdens of supporting the rest.
Sad but true.”

Testify, brothah!

 
Comment by polly
2012-07-25 10:56:00

“I thought you had to PUT IN at least 20 to 30 years of money to collect.”

You have to put in 40 quarters which is 10 years.

And the states can’t sue MERS for the fees because MERS didn’t transfer anything. The mortgages all remained with the trust that issued the bonds. The only thing that MERS did was keep track of who had the right to get the payments from the bonds. County didn’t care. The same way they wouldn’t care if you sold your house and self-financed (took payments instead of cash) and then paid a portion of the monthly payment to a land lord. The only time the mortgage had to be asssigned to a new person was when the payments stopped coming in. Then the people who owned the bonds who were in line to take the hit (the riskiest bonds got hit first, the next riskiest second, etc.) had to get the mortgage transferred to them so they (really their servicer) could take what ever actions were needed to foreclose. That is the first time the documents were actually needed - when it was time to foreclose. Now someone lost the documents and the people trying to get some of their money out with their foreclosure rights can sue that person (I’m not even sure that MERS was the one that stored the docs), but the counties don’t have a leg to stand on. Never did.

Comment by Happy2bHeard
2012-07-25 12:20:26

“You have to put in 40 quarters which is 10 years. “

And if he is getting $1000 per month, then he had substantial income for those 40 quarters, on the order of $50K per year *(some of the early years could have been significantly less).

Perhaps you don’t know his financial situation as well as you think you do.

*This rough estimate is based on the max benefit of about $2400 per month and the income limit of about $106K.

Comment by polly
2012-07-25 13:14:31

But it isn’t straight line from the max benefit to the lowest. I don’t know what the formula is, but it definitely isn’t straight line. However, you could be right about the $50K. I’m really not up for that sort of research right now.

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Comment by Steve J
2012-07-25 13:45:24

Minimum is around $400/month.

 
 
 
 
Comment by turkey lurkey
2012-07-25 11:02:29

Many states are aware of the “lost deed” problem and its effects on their tax revenue and are trying to do something about it.

What, I don’t know. But I do I’ve seen several news reports about it.

Comment by turkey lurkey
2012-07-25 11:04:54

“I do know I’ve”

I hate my office chair.

Comment by rms
2012-07-25 18:13:13

“I hate my office chair.”

Probably not a Herman Miller Aeron?

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Comment by aNYCdj
2012-07-25 19:42:40

This is what i am siting on now of course it need reupholstering….

http://www.regalchairs.com/JIMMY-CARTER-OVAL-OFFICE-CHAIR-PSC-JC.htm

 
Comment by TheNYCdb
2012-07-25 20:00:52
 
Comment by aNYCdj
2012-07-25 21:43:53

I dunno mines old from a lawyers office its before OSHA’s 5 wheel mandate…..mine only has 4

 
 
 
 
Comment by cactus
2012-07-25 11:18:15

So, again, NOT paying is the way to go in America. If you go to work and pay taxes, and take your earnings and pay debts, then you are a sucker.’

worked for Greece

Comment by turkey lurkey
2012-07-25 13:57:43

Worked even better for Wall St.

 
 
Comment by BetterRenter
2012-07-25 21:28:51

“If you go to work and pay taxes, and take your earnings and pay debts, then you are a sucker.”

Yes, Diogenes. This is the core truth to America today. Every failure to investigate, every bailout, every tax break, every subsidy and every stimulus showed you that was true. If you play by the rules you’re being a fool.

The tax burden on the common American worker will continue to rise until he rebels. And he might not even do that until his tax burden rises until it absorbs all his discretionary money. That means until he ends up working and paying tax and bills and doing nothing else. Americans really are the dumbest people in the world. They can’t see anything that’s happening to them until it’s well underway or it’s already over.

 
 
Comment by measton
2012-07-25 10:26:50

This morning Sandy Weill casually forsook all that which he once held dear by calling for the break up of big banks. Speaking on CNBC’s Squawk Box, Weill said the monsters he created should be split up and “do something that doesn’t risk taxpayer dollars.” The thud you heard around 8:30am this morning was the sound of jaws simultaneously dropping across the financial world.

I guess this means Sandy has moved to cash and is ready to buy up the pieces when the FED breaks up some of banks. Why should we listen to this pig now. I love the manufactured drama at the end.

Comment by turkey lurkey
2012-07-25 11:06:16

I would bet that’s exactly what it means. He’s secured his money.

 
Comment by AmazingRuss
2012-07-25 11:06:57

His piggishness doesn’t mean what he says is incorrect.

Comment by turkey lurkey
2012-07-25 13:58:49

That is true.

 
 
 
Comment by Neuromance
2012-07-25 10:30:50

I was considering Darrell’s proposition that if all debt were paid off, we would have global collapse. I disagree. Here’s why:

Lenders have given money they have to debtors. Debtors agree to pay interest while they have the loaned money. What then the lender is currently getting, and operating his daily business/life with, is the income stream from the interest.

If you have a debt jubilee (make all debt disappear), what you get is the lenders losing the income stream, which would result in some economic contraction. And what else you’d get is a massive transfer of wealth from lenders to those currently holding the money, the debtors.

So, the result from all debt being declared null and void would be a massive wealth transfer from lender to debtor. Paying all the debt off would simply transfer the wealth back to the lenders.

Comment by Diogenes (Tampa, Fl)
2012-07-25 10:49:04

So, the result from all debt being declared null and void would be a massive wealth transfer from lender to debtor. Paying all the debt off would simply transfer the wealth back to the lenders……………..

You and others here are living in a fantasy. The current use of currency or “money” is a CLAIM on FUTURE work. If you are holding “money”, the purpose is that you have a claim on someone else’s work.
You can take your ‘money’ and go to the store and all the people linked into that enterprise are your servants or slaves to get some of the money.
They typically are in DEBT, because they didn’t have the Money to pay for the things they thought they needed or wanted currently.
Debt is taking money NOW and contracting to PAY in the future.
the FUTURE earnings have not been made.

Debt is your promise to pay what you don’t have today.
If all the debts are relinquished, the income stream disappears for the holder of the debt paper.
What reason do you have to WORK? for any current income if you have no debt? you are technically free of the slavery of debt.

Getting a “paid off” house by a debt jubilee will give someone $1000 a month less debt to pay. (this assumes “secured” credit). Do you think they will be extended future credit? will they continue working as in the past? What would be the impact? As i’ve often said, you can’t can x without effecting y and z.
Most businesses rely on credit to operate. If debt contracts become “invalid”, do you think credit would be expended to continue operating? we are seeing the ruminations of debt default in the world economy. What the banking crisis was about is failure to TRUST the other guy. Was his business “viable”?
When trust is broken, the entire edifice begins to crumble.

Comment by In Colorado
2012-07-25 12:11:15

The current use of currency or “money” is a CLAIM on FUTURE work. If you are holding “money”, the purpose is that you have a claim on someone else’s work.

Which becomes problematic as people increasingly can’t find work.

Comment by Blue Skye
2012-07-25 12:59:03

There is work if one will accept the wage. Not a good thing to have long term debt during an era of falling wages. Better to have secure entitlements!

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Comment by In Colorado
2012-07-25 13:37:48

There is work if one will accept the wage

Kind of hard to pay back that 100K student loan or 300K mortgage if you’re making $1 an hour.

 
 
 
Comment by Neuromance
2012-07-25 14:08:29

You and others here are living in a fantasy. The current use of currency or “money” is a CLAIM on FUTURE work. If you are holding “money”, the purpose is that you have a claim on someone else’s work.

Disagree, it’s not a claim on anyone else. It is a store of value. Instead of barter, we can use currency to exchange goods and services. It’s not a claim on anyone. I have money. I walk into a barber shop. I don’t have a claim on the barber. I’m not his Rumplestiltskin. He can choose to take my store of value - money - or not.

You can take your ‘money’ and go to the store and all the people linked into that enterprise are your servants or slaves to get some of the money.
They typically are in DEBT, because they didn’t have the Money to pay for the things they thought they needed or wanted currently.

Some of them are in debt. Some are not. It’s not relevant.

Debt is taking money NOW and contracting to PAY in the future.
the FUTURE earnings have not been made.

Disagree. Debt is one person borrowing money from another person or group of people. Nothing more.

Debt is your promise to pay what you don’t have today.

Disagree. Debt is money I’ve borrowed from another entity. We must speak precisely and clearly, not in poetic terms, in order to have an exchange of ideas.

If all the debts are relinquished, the income stream disappears for the holder of the debt paper.

That’s right. It would severely damage the business model of lenders.

What reason do you have to WORK? for any current income if you have no debt? you are technically free of the slavery of debt.

I think this is the core of your position, that we must have an indebted populace in order to keep people toiling.

Look, neither I, nor several folks I know have any debt. And in fact, have non-trivial (in middle class terms) net worths. Yet we all work. Why? Because we don’t have enough to never work again. We need food, clothing, shelter, medical care, energy, and will continue to need it while we are living. So instead of bartering on a day-to-day, or week-to-week basis, we work so we can gain enough stored value - money - so that eventually perhaps, we can stop working when we amass enough stored value.

Getting a “paid off” house by a debt jubilee will give someone $1000 a month less debt to pay. (this assumes “secured” credit). Do you think they will be extended future credit? will they continue working as in the past? What would be the impact? As i’ve often said, you can’t can x without effecting y and z.

It will negatively impact the lender’s business model, no question.

Most businesses rely on credit to operate.

Lenders make money off the credit/debt. Businesses use of debt has become quite significant, but it doesn’t have to be that way.

And FYI, the German Mittlestand typically doesn’t constantly need debt to fund its daily operations. I recently posted an article from The Economist on the Mittlestand.

If debt contracts become “invalid”, do you think credit would be expended to continue operating? we are seeing the ruminations of debt default in the world economy. What the banking crisis was about is failure to TRUST the other guy. Was his business “viable”?
When trust is broken, the entire edifice begins to crumble.

I’m not advocating a repudiation of all debts. Just pointing out that reducing debt will not collapse the global economy. A repudiation/jubilee is an extreme case of eliminating debt. And even that would not collapse the economy. However, lenders would lend and debtors would borrow if both thought it in their interest.

Comment by In Colorado
2012-07-25 14:41:00

Disagree, it’s not a claim on anyone else. It is a store of value.

Perhaps if they are greenbacks in your wallet. Otherwise, that 100K CD in the bank has been loaned out to one or more borrowers.

And being a “store of value” implies that it has an inherent value. Fiats are really just fancy IOU’s. I can barter a bag of rice for say a bag of nails, as both have an inherent value. But if faith in a Fiat is lost, then its worthless.

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Comment by Neuromance
2012-07-25 17:04:12

The circumference of any circle, divided by its diameter will always give you PI - 3.14159..etc. It’s a curiosity of the natural world.

Similarly, another curiosity of the natural world is the willingness of humans to use the logical construct known as currency. They are willing to ascribe value to it, under certain circumstances (limited availability, willingness of others in the society to trade goods and services for it). It’s a shared illusion, a mass hallucination. For both gold, and paper. But it is a relatively durable hallucination as long as prices remain stable.

You make a good point about the 100K in the bank. People with money in banks would stand to lose significant sums if all debt were suddenly repudiated. It would be a sudden wealth transfer from savers, via banks, to debtors. 90% losses or thereabouts, depending on the reserve requirement the bank is required to hold. But that’s what it would be - a transfer of wealth, a transfer of value.

 
Comment by Carl Morris
2012-07-26 08:18:11

But that’s what it would be - a transfer of wealth, a transfer of value.

But hasn’t the transfer already occurred in the form of loans that can’t be paid back? And it would simply be a recognition of that?

 
 
Comment by Al
2012-07-25 16:44:24

A good read Neuromance. I particularly like tackling the ‘debt slave’ notion. I work because I like being a productive member of society and because I have both current and future needs to address. Debt is not required.

Debt and savings are almost the same in that they allow us to detach the timing of our spending from our income. Debt allows us to spend future income, while savings allows us to retain income for future use. I’m working and saving now so I’ll be able to spend in retirement.

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Comment by polly
2012-07-25 12:10:19

The other result would be people who still had a lot of assets refusing to lend to anyone ever again.

Comment by Housing Wizard
2012-07-25 22:01:59

I remember when they first started giving credit cards to people . Prior to that only a purchase like a house or a car was put on credit . People started buying bigger appliances on credit ,but you really had to qualify . The notion at the time by people was that the price of the appliance would go up in price by inflation more than the price of the interest paid for the term of the loan to get the item today ( rather than spending
time saving to pay cash ). At least that was how business was selling the concept of going into debt to get something now at now prices .

But in general people 40 or 50 years ago were not that thrilled about debt .Banks just wouldn’t let you get over extended either in those days . I think during those times the default rate on debt was pretty low also . But of course during those times
the Glass- Stegal Act was operative .

it’s just almost unbelievable what ended up happening regarding debt .

 
 
 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-07-25 10:31:23

Sandy Weill, the man who built Citigroup into a giant, now says break up big banks
By Associated Press, Updated: Wednesday, July 25, 9:34 AM
NEW YORK — Sandy Weill is having a change of heart.

Weill, the aggressive dealmaker who built Citigroup on the idea that in banking, bigger is better, said Wednesday that he believes big banks should be broken up.

Speaking on CNBC’s “Squawk Box,” the 79-year-old Weill appeared to shock the show’s anchors when he said that consumer banking units should be split from riskier investment banking units. That would mean dismembering Citigroup as well as other big U.S. banks, like JPMorgan Chase and Bank of America.

Comment by WT Economist
2012-07-25 12:52:12

The problem isn’t that the same firm that can make a loan to a corporation can also underwrite a bond for it.

The problem is size, pure and simple.

Break up the top five or six into 20 or 30.

 
Comment by Housing Wizard
2012-07-25 22:20:20

The return of Glass-Stegal it sounds like ,along with Monopoly busting ,or finally realization that to big to fall puts that entity in
a blackmailing position to be rescued .

But what about all the pending bets in the unregulated markets ?
Somehow this feels like some new bailout .

 
Comment by BetterRenter
2012-07-26 04:05:20

Oh god, this is so f*cking transparent. This is just a scheme to create more companies to plop onto the stock market for suckers to buy into. The elite know they’ve gone as far as they can with the current crop of stalled performers. So, break ‘em up and play the “small but focused and nimble” propaganda line, and roll the public’s money through another round of crap stocks. Then they can start re-merging them.

This is probably a good move since Americans are only getting more numb and dumb.

 
 
Comment by WT Economist
2012-07-25 12:51:00

IMHO neither Romney nor Obama are as bad as the political ads will suggest.

Whereas most of those in Congress are worse that you imagine.

If I were a campaign consultant, I’d have my candidate for President run against the other side’s Congress people, warning what THEY will do if the other candidate wins since he won’t stand up to them.

Comment by RioAmericanInBrasil
2012-07-25 12:58:47

I’d have my candidate for President run against the other side’s Congress people, warning what THEY will do if the other candidate wins

+1

 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-07-25 20:50:19

“Still, coming in the wake of several weeks of intense TV campaign advertising, much of it negative, the poll of 1,000 registered voters found Mr. Obama leading his Republican rival, Mitt Romney, 49% to 43%, a gap mirrored precisely in four other Journal/NBC polls over the last year.”

Can’t Buy Me Love

POLITICS
Updated July 25, 2012, 8:41 a.m. ET

Obama Keeps Lead as Voter Anxiety Rises

By NEIL KING JR. And DANIEL LIPPMAN
Associated Press

President Barack Obama, shown at a campaign stop in Florida last week, holds a six-point advantage in the latest poll.

American voters are growing more polarized and locked in their views as they witness a presidential campaign that is boosting negative feelings about both candidates, a Wall Street Journal/NBC News poll released Tuesday shows.

The poll also finds a resurgence of anxiety about the economy as job growth has slowed, though President Barack Obama maintains his edge on several fronts despite that. Half of registered voters feel less optimistic about the direction of the economy, with just 27% predicting the economy would improve over the next year—a sharp drop in optimism from recent months.

Still, coming in the wake of several weeks of intense TV campaign advertising, much of it negative, the poll of 1,000 registered voters found Mr. Obama leading his Republican rival, Mitt Romney, 49% to 43%, a gap mirrored precisely in four other Journal/NBC polls over the last year. The poll, conducted July 18-22, has a margin of error of plus or minus 3.1 percentage points.

Republican Mitt Romney, who has focused almost his entire campaign on his ability to turn around the economy, continues to enjoy an advantage with voters on that key subject, even as he trails in other categories, according to the latest Wall Street Journal/NBC News poll. Neil King has details on The News Hub.

Nearly 100 days before the election, all the tumult of the early summer—the Supreme Court health ruling, a gloomy June jobs report, questions about Mr. Romney’s business career, a steady bombardment of campaign ads—has done little to jar the dynamics of the race.

One result stands out, though: Both candidates clocked their highest count to date among Americans who now view them “very negatively.” Nearly a third of voters saw Mr. Obama that way, compared with nearly a quarter for Mr. Romney.

At the same time, more than four in 10 voters said they felt less favorably toward the candidates after all that they had seen, read and heard about the campaign in recent weeks. The surge in negative sentiment toward the candidates is likely a byproduct of a summer campaign that has bombarded voters with an unprecedented volume of attack ads.

We have two candidates who are in deep, double-digit negatives,” said Bill McInturff, a Republican pollster who conducts the survey with Democrat Peter Hart. “There is no precedent for that in the modern era.

 
 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-07-25 15:09:14

June Home Sales Signal Stumbling Housing Recovery
By REUTERS
Published: July 25, 2012

WASHINGTON (Reuters) — Sales of new homes recorded the biggest drop in more than a year in June, and prices resumed their downward trend, dealing a setback for the budding housing market recovery.

Single-family home sales tumbled 8.4 percent to a seasonally adjusted 350,000-unit annual rate, the lowest rate in five months, the Commerce Department said on Wednesday.

The percent decline was the largest since February 2011. Much of the drop in sales last month reflected a 60 percent plunge in the Northeast, a region that had enjoyed hefty gains since December.

“Housing will continue to recover gradually throughout the year, but fundamentals are not supportive of a fully fledged housing market recovery,” said Yelena Shulyatyeva, an economist at BNP Paribas in New York.

 
Comment by TheNYCdb
2012-07-25 16:21:36

I would argue that short of hitting the birth lottery, most people with money are incredibly ch…trifty. We can talk all day long about taking a risk on a big idea, but the reality is if you haven’t been scrimping and saving for years in anticipation of someday having the great idea you are pretty much SOL. Anecdote when I was in college, I had an opportunity to invest in a startup that I believed, the catch was it took my life savings (at that time $30K). I ultimately cashed out 8 months later for $300K, but the point is if I hadn’t saved every dime I made working in HS and college I never would have had the opportunity that I did. I’ll admit that I’m still as tight as the bark on a tree even though we can afford to spend money, we (wife & I) filter every decision through the prism of value before pulling the trigger.

Now the inherent cheapskat-ery is also the reason why tax breaks for us aren’t really productive. If I have more money coming in it just means I’m going to be able to save more. People with little money are more likely to spend it to “stimulate” the economy.

Comment by TheNYCdb
2012-07-25 16:22:36

Weird this was supposed to be in response to the thread above about cheap rich people.

 
Comment by Bill in Los Angeles
2012-07-25 20:24:04

But the wealth redistribution fans such as Alpha, Oxide, Measton, Rio, and fellow thugs should have been told so they could stream it to their beloved big government.

 
 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-07-25 20:35:43

EUROPE BUSINESS NEWS
July 25, 2012

Risks at J.P. Morgan Spotted
Bank of England Worried About 2010 Positions But Didn’t Alert Other Regulators
By DAVID ENRICH

LONDON—More than a year before J.P. Morgan Chase Co. JPM +1.27% racked up billions of dollars in losses from bad trades in its London investment office, Bank of England officials raised concerns internally about potential risks arising from some of the office’s activities, but didn’t formally alert other regulators, according to people involved in the central bank’s talks.

In late 2010, employees at the central bank worried that the London arm of J.P. Morgan’s Chief Investment Office had come to dominate some important corners of the city’s financial markets—including residential mortgage-backed securities—and they were concerned about the potential impact that could have on the stability of U.K. markets, these people said.

The concerns were relayed to a top central-bank oficial. But the Bank of England doesn’t appear to have acted on the concerns or flagged them to regulators responsible for supervising J.P. Morgan.

The central bank’s concerns weren’t focused on the specific trading area that has caused J.P. Morgan to suffer $5.8 billion in losses this year.

And it isn’t clear that the Bank of England could have prevented the subsequent trading blowup in the J.P. Morgan investment office. The disastrous trades hadn’t been made back in late 2010. Also, the Bank of England isn’t in charge of supervising J.P. Morgan. That job falls to other British and U.S. regulators.

Still, the episode indicates that the Bank of England was paying attention to the then-little-known arm of J.P. Morgan that later got into trouble partly because it amassed an excessive position in an obscure type of corporate derivatives.

The Bank of England this month has drawn fire for failing to confront a brewing crisis involving banks’ attempted manipulation of the London interbank offered rate, or Libor. Bank of England documents show that senior officials, including Governor Mervyn King and Deputy Governor Paul Tucker, were warned years ago about problems with Libor. Messrs. King and Tucker have said they didn’t at the time appreciate the magnitude of the scandal.

The Libor debacle and the J.P. Morgan losses—which involved a trader nicknamed “the London whale”—are the latest financial scandals to have a major U.K. component.

 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-07-25 20:57:28

Which of the two candidates has snuggled up more to Megabank, Inc?

Wednesday, Jul 25, 2012 05:38 AM PDT

Romney fundraises with Libor fixers
Romney collects despite Libor scandal; Obamacare repeal would cost billions; and other top Wednesday stories
By Alex Seitz-Wald

Romney fundraises with Libor fixersRepublican presidential candidate, former Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney addresses the 113th National Convention of the Veterans of Foreign Wars, Tuesday, July 24,2012, in Reno, Nev. (AP Photo/Rich Pedroncelli)(Credit: AP)

Romney’s Libor of love: Mitt Romney arrived in London this morning where he will watch the Olympic Games and hold fundraisers, including two with bankers and lobbyists involved in the expanding Libor rate-fixing scandal. London-based bank Barclays paid a $450 million fine earlier this month for manipulating the Libor, a rate that determines trillions of dollars of loans around the globe. The company’s ex-CEO resigned both his post at the company and his hosting duties of a Romney fundraiser, but Barclays lobbyist Patrick Durkin remains a co-chair of the Romney fundraisers, and there are others with ties to the scandal as well. Some involved in the scandal could face jail time in the future.

No one trusts Wall Street: Despite the demise of the Occupy movement, Americans’ confidence in big banks has continued to erode, even as the economy has begun to recover, with a new survey showing just 21 percent saying they trust the financial system. It’s the lowest level the Chicago Booth/Kellogg School survey has found since March of 2009. A majority of respondents trust community banks, but fewer than one in four trust big national banks.

 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-07-25 21:01:25

Is more extraordinary rendition for Uncle Buck in the bag?

Yen Rises Against Major Peers Amid Global Slowing Signs
By Monami Yui and Masaki Kondo - Jul 25, 2012 7:46 PM PT

The yen gained against most of its 16 major counterparts amid signs of weakening global growth, boosting demand for the currency as a refuge.

The yen traded 0.2 percent from an eight-week high versus the dollar before U.S. reports today forecast to show slowing durable-goods orders and pending home sales, boosting prospects the Federal Reserve will expand stimulus that debases the greenback. The euro weakened before data that economists said will signal retail sales in Italy declined and Spain’s unemployment rate climbed, adding to evidence of how Europe’s debt crisis is weighing on the real economy.

“The economic fundamentals of the euro zone are weak,” said Imre Speizer, a strategist in Auckland at Westpac Banking Corp. (WBC), Australia’s second-largest lender. “The yen will be the ultimate safe-haven currency.”

 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-07-25 21:29:42

CalPERS returns are paltry
CalPERS headquarters

Atrium in CalPERS’ Sacramento headquarters. (Rich Pedroncelli / Associated Press)
By Marc Lifsher

July 16, 2012, 2:11 p.m.

SACRAMENTO — The California Public Employees’ Retirement System, the largest public pension fund in the country, posted a mere 1% return on its investment for the fiscal year that ended June 30.

The performance came in well below the fund’s target of 1.7% growth in its $234.3-billion portfolio, said Joseph Dear, CalPERS’ chief investment officer. The return for fiscal 2012 also was way below CalPERS’ long-term growth strategy, which calls for a 7.5% average annual rate of return to pay for retirement benefits for more than 1.3 million members.

“The last 12 months were a challenging period for all investors and the ongoing European debt crisis and slowing global economic growth increased market volatility and reduced equity returns,” said Dear.

CalPERS biggest losses were in public equity, down 7.2%, and private equity, down 5.4%. Fixed-income investments, mainly bonds, gained 12.7%, while real estate rose by 15.9% and infrastructure investments by 8.4%.

No substantial turnaround in the markets is likely this year, Dear predicted.

CalPERS’ sister pension agency, the California State Teachers’ Retirement System, also posted weak returns for its fiscal 2012, which ended June 30. But at 1.8%, they were better than CalPERS’ performance.

The performance was well below the targeted 7.5% average annual return that the $150.6-billion CalSTRS fund uses to meet its obligations to provide pensions to 856,000 public school educators and their families.

CalSTRS’ worst performance was in global stocks, with a loss of 3.1%. Real estate, however, showed a 9.2% gain, while private-equity investments gained 5.9% and fixed-income bonds rose 7.3%.

“This fiscal year has presented a very difficult market for long-term investors like CalSTRS, with wild fluctuations amid ongoing instability in Europe, slowing growth in China and India, a U.S. credit rating downgrade and a sluggish economy,” said Chief Investment Officer Christopher J. Ailman.

 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-07-25 23:27:08

All stock market gains ride on bailout hopes.

Asian stocks rise on hopes for bigger Europe bailout fund but SKorea slowdown tempers gains
Asia stocks rise but weak SKorea data limits gains
Associated Press | 26 minutes ago in

Asian stock markets rose Thursday amid hopes Europe will give its bailout fund more financial firepower but gains were tempered as South Korea reported its economic growth slowed to a two-year low.

Markets have been rattled over the past few days by fears that Spain, the fourth-largest economy among the 17 states that use the euro, could need a bailout along the lines of Greece, Ireland and Portugal.

Sentiment was given a boost by a suggestion from European Central Bank policymaker Ewald Nowotny that the European Stability Mechanism, the euro area’s planned permanent bailout fund, could be given a banking license. That would give it the ability to borrow money from the ECB. Such a move would be of particular significant for Spain and Italy as the current bailout fund does not have enough money to rescue them both.

“We find it quite positive that the ECB seems to be at least thinking about these steps, although it is no way reflecting the wider central banks’ opinion, as it is only his (Nowotny’s) personal view. Mr Nowotny should be listened to though, as he is seen as a bit of a visionary within the bank,” said IG Markets strategist Stan Shamu.

 
Comment by Cantankerous Intellectual Bomb Thrower©
2012-07-25 23:32:20

Hong Kong to Oslo Flirt With Bubbles on Cheap Cash: MortgagesAndrew Blackman, Kelvin Wong and Klaus Wille

Published 11:06 p.m., Wednesday, July 25, 2012

July 26 (Bloomberg) — Jean Liu’s plan to buy a Hong Kong apartment was derailed by the 2008 global financial crisis. It was an opportunity lost as prices surged instead of dropping as they did in many of the world’s property markets, leaving the 32-year-old corporate banker still searching for an affordable home four years later.

“I originally set my budget at HK$3 million,” or $390,000, Liu said by telephone. “Now that’s barely enough for a down payment.”

Liu’s plight is shared by homebuyers as far away as Canada, Switzerland and Norway as a flood of money supplied by central banks globally to prop up the financial system finds its way into markets regarded as havens from economic turmoil and Europe’s sovereign-debt crisis, pushing down borrowing costs and driving up home values. The U.S. Federal Reserve has held interest rates near zero since 2008 to stimulate the world’s largest economy, forcing faster growing economies such as Hong Kong to adopt a loose monetary policy that fuels inflation.

“The Fed’s trying to save the day, yet it’s creating a lot of distortions both at home and internationally,” Mickey Levy, chief economist at Bank of America Corp. in New York, said by phone. “The Fed is understating the magnitude of these distortions,” such as rising real estate prices and low bond yields, he said.

Investors in search of higher returns are moving into appreciating real estate markets benefiting from strong economies and stable governments not burdened by high levels of debt.

Booming Markets

In Canada, where government bond yields this week fell to the lowest level since 1950, home prices have climbed 34 percent since January 2009 to an average of C$369,339 ($362,204), according to the Canadian Real Estate Association.

Switzerland is as close to a housing bubble as it’s been in two decades, according to data compiled by UBS AG. Norwegian homeowners, who’ve seen property prices surge almost 30 percent since 2008, may face higher mortgage payments before the end of the year as the country’s central bank seeks to deflate a property bubble amid expectations that household debt will surpass 200 percent of disposable incomes next year.

Hong Kong’s combination of record-low borrowing costs and a shrinking supply of new buildings caused home values to jump more than 80 percent since the start of 2009, according to the Centa-City Leading Index. In the 12 months through March, prices gained 5.4 percent, more than any other Asian market apart from India, broker Knight Frank LLP estimates.

 
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