Everyone Thinks We’re Back In 2007 Again
Miami Today reports from Florida. “Real estate professionals are keeping their eyes firmly on China as more buyers from afar trickle into South Florida. A group from China recently looked at units in Midblock, said L. J. Rodriguez, Midtown sales director for Fortune International. Mr. Rodriguez said the group was interested in buying multiple units. The appeal of Midblock to the Chinese, he said, is that it is existing construction. Also, he said, the price point. Miami Today previously reported the majority of Midtown prices are in the $300 per square foot range – from $375 per square foot for a one-bedroom, one-bathroom in Midblock. Most units have a tenant in place and buyers can begin earning on their investment immediately.”
“‘Why they are starting to look into the Miami area is very simple. California prices, Hawaii prices and New York prices… are way more expensive than the Miami market,’ said Fernando de Nuñez, vice president of the International Division for Fortune International.”
The Palm Beach Post. “Palm Beach County homes spent a median of just 59 days on the market in 2013 before going under contract, down from 90 days in 2012. But people’s expectations on what they can get are sometimes unrealistic, Realtors say. While data shows the average seller got 93 percent of their original list price, that doesn’t mean you can ask for the moon. ‘We’re seeing sellers tending to come out pricing higher than they should be because everyone thinks we’re back in 2007 again,’ said West Palm Beach Realtor Shannon Brink. ‘We are telling them, yes, prices have improved, but you’re not going to get $100,000 more than the last sale.’”
From Highlands Today. “It’s not like the mid-2000s, but Steve Fruit is again encountering customers who want to buy a house, remodel and flip it. ‘I have one current seller who bought a short sale in Sun N’ Lakes Sebring for less than $150,000, and is now listing it for $195,000. It didn’t need much work, mostly cosmetic issues,’ said Fruit, a broker associate with RE/MAX Realty Plus II in Lake Placid.”
“So far, flipping here seems minimal. Instead, said Clerk of Courts Bob Germaine, ‘Mortgage foreclosure sales are all going back to the banks. Very few individuals are buying the property. I would say less than 5 percent.’”
“‘Buyers have to be careful and really know what they are doing in order to make any money,’ cautioned Fruit. TV shows like ‘Flip This House,’ ‘Flipping Out’ and ‘Flip Men’ make turning around a house in 180 days look easy. Don’t be fooled, warned Fruit. ‘I think the ‘reality’ shows are a joke, and I suspect many of the so-called ‘flippers’ that try to emulate them are not successful. You have to be very careful in rehabbing, or you’ll get burnt.’”
The Tampa Bay Times. “With its leaky cushion of investor cash still deflating, Tampa Bay’s housing market entered 2014 with home sales sliding to their slowest level in almost two years, listing data show. Realtors blamed tepid sales on seasonal doldrums, but the deep drop in investor buying, often due to rising prices, also played a role. January saw both the fewest home sales, and the fewest all-cash sales, since February 2012. The median home sold for $143,000, down from the $170,000 summertime peak but still 10 percent higher than January 2013.”
“The thinning sales from local investors could trim Tampa Bay’s market even further, as 47 percent of last month’s sales were bought through all-cash deals. A quarter of the homes sold by Realtors last month were foreclosures, the biggest share since 2011. Most were bought by investors seeking to fix them up for rentals or flip them for quick resale.”
“Calling the housing recovery ‘a long, difficult slog,’ Wells Fargo economists said that the investor exodus had illustrated how modestly the fundamentals guiding traditional housing markets, like job and income growth, had improved.”
From WFTV 9. “Major delays in a program that was supposed to help Orange County neighborhoods hit hard by the foreclosure crisis is costing taxpayers thousands of dollars. Orange County received $40 million in federal money to have foreclosed homes fixed up, bought and moved into. One of the goals was to make sure the homes weren’t bought by investors.”
“An audit by the comptroller’s office however, found big delays left 43 of the homes sitting empty for months, and in some cases years, costing $121,000 in federal money to maintain. ‘When it’s just sitting there for months and nothing’s been done, it seems like a waste of money,’ resident Myrna Figueroa said.”
“WFTV’s Lori Brown found one of the county’s foreclosed homes that was fixed up through the Neighborhood Stabilization Program. That home has been sitting empty for two years and three months. Neighbors said the nicely renovated, three-bedroom, two-bathroom house has looked move-in ready for months, yet there’s no ‘for sale’ sign and it’s not on any real estate website. Mitchel Glasser, who heads the program, blames the delays on an overload of inventory. ‘Quite frankly, we have a lot of listings and a lot of homes under contract,’ Glasser said.”
“With its leaky cushion of investor cash still deflating, Tampa Bay’s housing market entered 2014 with home sales sliding to their slowest level in almost two years, listing data show.”
This is unraveling too quickly for the MSM to keep up.
Here in Tucson, the NPR affiliate has news of a real estate slowdown in the Phoenix area. With the implication that our local market may be experiencing the same thing.
“Real estate professionals are keeping their eyes firmly on China as more buyers from afar trickle into South Florida.”
Luckily for these hopeful professionals, the Chinese economy always goes up.
Strong China January trade data sparks cheers, doubts
BEIJING Wed Feb 12, 2014 6:59am EST
Containers are seen at a port of Shanghai Free Trade Zone, February 11, 2014. REUTERS/Aly Song
(Reuters) - China surprised markets with a thumping trade performance in January as import growth hit a six-month high, drawing some skepticism about the data but still allaying fears of a deepening economic malaise.
Analysts who had expected the long Lunar New Year holiday to drag on January’s trade warned that the figures may be inflated by fake trade transactions, where traders forge deals to sneak cash into the country past capital controls.
The value of China’s total exports climbed 10.6 percent in January from a year earlier, the Customs Administration said on Wednesday, more than five times market forecasts for a 2 percent rise.
The value of imports also jumped 10 percent from a year ago as China bought record volumes of iron ore, crude oil and copper. That lifted import growth to its highest level since July, handily beating predictions for a 3 percent gain.
The country’s trade surplus rose to $31.9 billion, well above forecasts of $23.7 billion and December’s $25.6 billion.
“We find this strong level of export growth puzzling,” said Zhang Zhiwei, an economist at Nomura. “It is unclear to what extent the strong export data reflects the true strength in the economy.”
…
China Record Credit Growth Boosts Outlook for Economy
By Bloomberg News
Feb 16, 2014 11:34 PM PT
Record new credit in China in January will help the economy maintain momentum while highlighting challenges for officials trying to limit the risk of financial turbulence from defaults and bad loans.
Aggregate financing, the broadest measure of credit, was 2.58 trillion yuan ($425 billion), the People’s Bank of China said in a Feb. 15 statement. New local-currency lending was 1.32 trillion yuan, the highest level since 2010. Trust loans, under scrutiny because of default risks, were about half the level of a year earlier.
The data add to better-than-forecast trade numbers, suggesting that China can limit the scale of any slowdown from last year’s 7.7 percent expansion in gross domestic product. At the same time, the figures contrast with a central bank call in mid-January for lenders to control surging loans and highlight diminishing economic returns from credit growth.
“These numbers show that the firming up of the central bank’s monetary stance is going to be a gradual, balanced exercise, not an aggressive one,” said Louis Kuijs, chief China economist at Royal Bank of Scotland Plc in Hong Kong. “The authorities want to slow down the pace of credit growth and contain financial risks but they also want to ensure that sufficient credit continues to come online to support economic growth.”
…
Power, steel, cement suggest China’s economy not so buoyant
By Koh Gui Qing
BEIJING Sun Feb 16, 2014 4:00pm EST
Feb 17 (Reuters) - The big debate about how fast China’s economy will grow this year can find some answers in the real world, where signs suggest the growth giant is slowly but surely losing its fizz.
From falling power consumption to record-low steel prices, a clutch of indicators show sluggish investment and domestic demand are weighing on China’s $9.4 trillion economy, a worrying sign for some economists who are cutting their GDP forecasts for 2014 - which is unusual so early in the year.
Rising interest rates and restrictions that stop wasteful spending by Chinese governments have depressed investment to at least a decade-low, making it perhaps the single biggest drag on the world’s No. 2 economy.
The implication is big, especially since investment accounted for over half of China’s 7.7 percent economic growth last year. Experts believe growth may sag in coming months towards 7 percent, a rate bound to disconcert investors and even some policymakers in Beijing worried that the economy is braking too hard.
“It will be a few more months before we hit the bottom,” said Frederic Neumann, an HSBC economist in Hong Kong. “It may take more aggressive measures from the government to turn things around.”
…
I can think of only one reason Chinese would buy real estate in the USA: to become landlords. First generation Asians are very xenophobic (racis) and don’t want to mix. I suppose they could team up and buy whole pieces of Florida land and build houses only for Chinese-descent.
They might also be planning to gain territory inside U.S. borders. If you have ever visited China Town SF, you realize the potential for native speakers of Chinese to live their entire lives within the U.S. without ever speaking any other language besides Mandarin. I could imagine other areas of the U.S. heading this direction, due in part to the open encouragement of our government to foreign investors in U.S. residential RE.
As I recall, the romans and nazi’s did the same thing.
It’s a good strategy for occupying and taking over a foreign power. I suppose one might point to the Trojan Horse as another, albeit smaller scale, variant.
A lot of people thought the Japanese were going to buy everything in the US years ago.
They spent a fortune on Roc center back in the 1980’s. And lost a fortune on Roc center back in the 1990’s.
And the golf courses:
‘In 1990 Davis sold the Pebble Beach Company to the Japanese businessman Minoru Isutani, who made it a subsidiary of the Japanese resort company Taiheiyo Club Inc. under a holding company called the Lone Cypress Company. Isutani was investigated by the FBI in the early 1990s for money laundering. Isutani’s $341M loss taken on the sale of Pebble Beach was cited as an example.’
“… occupying and taking over a foreign power.”
I don’t know about the taking over but as for the occupying we, the collective we, sent to China the claims on property (and everything else that is for sale) in the form of dollars (worthless, unbacked fiats, as many posters here used to term them - but we don’t hear much from these posters anymore, do we?) and now some of the Chineese are in the process of exercising these claims.
We have met the enemy and it is us.
Plus, we not only willingly sent over to China earned wealth (in this case claims on assets) in the form of dollars we also sent to China unearned wealth in the form of jobs.
People are smart.
“A lot of people thought the Japanese were going to buy everything in the US years ago.”
It’s funny how a couple of decades of never-ending real estate investing losses can completely overturn perceptions.
“…(worthless, unbacked fiats, as many posters here used to term them - but we don’t hear much from these posters anymore, do we?)…”
I’m curious whether Ben put a moratorium on financial idiocy, or if these people simply vanished on their own?
The USA has 5x the population of Japan. China has 5x the population of the USA.
They think they are going to make money on it, pure and simple. Same as most donkeys here. Moronically believing the propaganda because they want to believe.
This is why education doesn’t work. Emotion trumps knowledge for most people.
This is quite the scheme — China lends money into existence at a furious rate, which funds are funneled to corrupt officials and cronies and used to buy up global real estate, which has the collateral consequence of jacking up housing prices to the benefit of certain preferred business and electoral constituencies in the developed world.
Of course, if you aren’t a member of one of those constituencies, or a recipient of the created funds, you’re pretty much hosed. Too bad, so sad!
The funneling of central bank monies to favored constituencies in the form of low-interest loans is a key part of the post-2008 economic landscape, and I am not merely talking about China here.
For instance, why were Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, Bear Stearns, AIG and Lehman Brothers allowed to collapse while any number of other so-called too-big-to-fail (aka systemically risky) financial entities were propped up to the tune of something like $4 trillion in low-interest Fed-funded loans? What was the principle involved in deciding which large financial institution survived and which didn’t? I’m missing it.
“Realtors blamed tepid sales on seasonal doldrums, but the deep drop in investor buying, often due to rising prices, also played a role.”
RealtLiars attributing what is clearly a price driven collapse in sales to “seasonality” seems fraudulent. Think about the typical person interacting with one of these liars. How is he to protect himself from what will be a very costly mistake?
Tampa FL Housing Prices Slide 6%; Inventory Explodes 58%
http://www.movoto.com/tampa-fl/market-trends/
Palm Beach, FL Housing Prices Crater 25%; Price Reductions Up 75%
ooop-C
http://www.movoto.com/palm-beach-fl/market-trends/
Daytona Beach, FL Housing Prices Sink 10% Y-o-Y
http://www.movoto.com/daytona-beach-fl/market-trends/
Vero Beach, FL Housing Prices Cave 15%; Inventory Skyrockets 119%
http://www.movoto.com/vero-beach-fl/market-trends/
HA — you da man.
We do what we can.
I wonder how much of the drop in Tampa has to do with the enactment of legislation that’s jacking up flood insurance rates?
“Asheville Real Estate Agent Arrested On Drug Charges”
http://www.foxcarolina.com/story/21550065/police-asheville-real-estate-agent-arrested-on-drug-charges
These people need to be rounded up and dealt with before they commit their crimes.
“‘We’re seeing sellers tending to come out pricing higher than they should be because everyone thinks we’re back in 2007 again,’ said West Palm Beach Realtor Shannon Brink.”
In Jupiter Fl. it’s more like 2003. First DBLL I rented from starting back in 2005 paid $260k in 2003 or 2004, refied up to $300k+ in 2005. Moved back to NY and rented to me in Nov. 2005 DBLL stopped paying the mortgage but continued to collect rent in 2007 until short sale at $150k in 2010 (at least 3 years tax free income total of $60k+)
Short sale buyer just sold that POS for $260k
your number = 2005?
260-260k
They paid $260k in 2003
They refied it up over $300k before they moved back to NY in 2005
Isn’t that nice….. The slimer goes down there, reeks havoc and then bails out. That’s friggin’ aggravating.
sorry missed that
2005 june was doubleplus peak in 22151 s of central soviet
Aside from operating like the USSR, DC actually looks like a soviet city.
Across the street in a nicer hood on Realtor.com today.
7660 Misty Lake Pl
Jupiter, FL 33458
Foreclosure Bank Owned Listing
Refreshed:
3 Minutes Ago
$325,000
Property History
Date Event Price Price/Sq.Ft. Change Source
02/07/2014 Price Changed $325,000 $140 -3.1% MLS #RX-10003126
12/25/2013 Listed $335,000 $144 — MLS #RX-10003126
08/16/2006 Sold $505,000 $268 — MLS #RX-2617075
08/16/2006 Sold $505,000 $268 — Public Record
02/09/2006 Listed $505,000 $268 — MLS #RX-2617075
05/27/2005 Sold $450,000 $239 — Public Record
01/27/2003 Sold $285,000 $151 — Public Record
08/16/2006 Sold $505,000 $268 — MLS #RX-2617075
08/16/2006 Sold $505,000 $268 — Public Record
Suzanne researched this - YouTube
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=20n-cD8ERgs - 112k - Cached - Similar pages
Apr 11, 2006 …
‘prices are in the $300 per square foot range – from $375 per square foot for a one-bedroom, one-bathroom in Midblock. Most units have a tenant in place’
I’m sure the bartenders are paying plenty of rent to cover this price per square foot.
This is all so bizarre. Build condos, rent them out, and sell them to Chinese. Why not just build apartments?
The advantage of condos would appear to be the ability to parcel them out into individual units for sale to all-cash Chinese investors. Do Chinese investors buy apartment buildings?
07? my market collapsed 7/2005
inventory mushroomed
msn is always 6 months behind on re stats
Our market started tanking in November of 2005. We saw it coming because we put an offer on a piece of land and were the last one’s to do so in that development.(see: greater fool) Backed out a week before closing. Lost our 1K deposit but didn’t have to turn over 130K for a piece of worthless dirt. The tell tale sign we did the right thing was when the selling agent asked us to offer what we felt it was worth. We did so by walking away.
Interesting story… Thanks. Clearly you did the right thing.
How the hell do you manage to tolerate the over the top realtor BS on pnet?
We saw what most realtors peddle: LIES.
‘Nalika Abeysinghe, a chartered accountant from Toronto, decided to go the “endvestor” route. Last September, she and her family bought a townhome in a new development called Serenity in Clermont, only a 20-minute drive to Walt Disney in Orlando, which they found through Florida Home Finders. The 39-year-old and her husband decided to purchase the property as both an income property and vacation home, with the ultimate goal of retiring there in 15 years or so.’
“We chose Orlando because we wanted to get an investment property in Florida, and the weather is good and the prices are still low, and we thought in two years they would go up.”
Clermont used to be a sleepy town, but I wouldn’t use the word “serenity” to describe it now. Let’s get one thing straight, Globe and Mail reporter: to have a 20-minute drive to Disney World, you better be on Disney property to begin with. I’ve been stuck in theme park traffic and it puts you in a most unmagical mood before the first dollar comes out of your wallet.
I’ve heard Orlando is an absolute armpit. I’ve not been there so I can’t say.
Each city in Florida is a matter of individual taste. I like some, can tolerate others, and there are a few that I don’t like at all.
Here’s my list
Miami NO
Key West YES
Naples YES
Sarasota MAYBE
Tampa MAYBE
St. Pete Maybe
Orlando AWW HELL NO
Daytona MAYBE (only if you hit it like a tourist)
Gainesville YES
Still haven’t been to J-Ville or Tally.
As far as nature areas, I love the Glades and Weeki Wachee. At some point I’ll check out Ocala National Forest.
Knowing nothing about FL except for the crime being out of control, what is so bad about Orlando?
The built environment. It’s a medium density, police-state hell.
“Arterial” roadways everywhere
Red light cams everywhere
Nothing is walkable
All new, cheap, construction
No airflow like the coasts
Check out street view on Kirkman Road in Metrowest. I used to go to meetings there. Total zombie bath salts GTA clown fest.
http://goo.gl/maps/gL27p
The ongoing evolution of paying back what you’ve borrowed in the US:
‘The city of Detroit’s effort to declare some of its general obligation bonds as unsecured debt will be challenged in bankruptcy court Wednesday in what could be a precedent-setting turn in the largest-ever municipal bankruptcy in U.S. history.’
‘The issue in front of federal bankruptcy Judge Steven Rhodes is whether a pledge of Detroit tax revenue to pay off the voter-approved bond issues is a binding obligation under Michigan law, as argued by bond insurers in two lawsuits, or merely a promise.’
‘The outcome could revolve around the meaning of the word “pledge” under Michigan law. In the proceeding on Wednesday, Rhodes will hear Detroit’s argument that the city’s pledge to repay some $410 million of general obligation bonds outstanding as of the end of the city’s fiscal 2012 is far less than binding.’
The question before the judge is whether general obligation bonds are obligations.
Could it potentially get down to the question of what “is” is?
You still can’t squeeze blood out of a turnip.
Good Morning everyone,
I’m fascinated in the fact 875,000
Americans left this country for
Medical Tourism in 2010, plus all
the Mexican Dental Clinics (no Passport
walk across the border turnstile). Actually
comparable care.
Many of my network acquaintances see
a major boom in the medical bldg. sector, and
I see a moderate boom. I see Medical Tourism
picking up with the ACA. Thailand, India, etc…,
have it together.
Many complain it will make other countries even
more of a two-tier healthcare accessibly system. If you take out insurance companies it becomes more affordable for us boomers. All patients I’ve met are really happy.Even Blue Cross own a MT firm. Employers are catching on as well, even offering a financial reward to their employees. I read a home improvement big box cut a deal w/ the Cleveland Clinic for heart procedures.
Back to our regularly scheduled topics…
oops, this should be in bits. Sorry.
I did lots of work on this
Sing,Maly for heart - bypass 12-14k
Czech republic for radiation (prostate complete w Cyberknife $12k
Lithuania- Kardiolita for heart and joint
india is cheaper but otherwise nasty- trip surrounding etc
Wow…. you’re a wreck… Are you ok now?
I researched it- no procedures for me yet, tx
SIL and hubby went to Czech republic for a fertility treatments. No complaints so far as I know, but no baby, either.
taxpayers
You Tube has fascinating TV segments and Mini-Documentaries on it. I want the world to be flat when it comes my choices ad wallet in health care. Our system is a big mess and standard of care (”scare”) is the FDA, AMA and Big Pharma’s wet dream.
Here’s a cool article or two:
these-glasses-help-surgeons-spot-cancer
http://www.smartplanet.com/blog/bulletin/these-glasses-help-surgeons-spot-cancer/
Exploring new technology platforms in the Operating Room
http://www.cimit.org/programs-operatingroom.html
choices ad wallet s/b choices AND wallet. typed fast and didn’t edit
Nephew wants to go into medical technology. (He’s 18) He’s an expensive kid to educate, thank goodness!
How those cancer glasses work:
http://www.philly.com/philly/health/cancer/HealthDay684772_20140211_Experimental_Eyewear_Helps_Surgeons__See__Cancer__Study_Says.html
Realturd Pleads Guilty (of course!) to Mortgage Fraud Charges
http://www.mortgagedaily.com/Fraud/MctNobles012714.asp
http://www.realtor.com/realestateagents/Richard-Nobles_Powell_OH__596789143
How much crime can one industry generate without being declared a threat to public order?
Thanks for the FL thread! Just wanted to say, “Present, and accounted for!”
Two of my neighbs are having leases non-renewed this month. Both young families… go get some boxes.
Biggert-Waters is going to mess my ‘hood up fierce.