The Expected Truth Isn’t Always Right
The Winston-Salem Journal reports from North Carolina. “For the first time in several months, the Winston-Salem MSA did not have the lowest year over year price increase of the state’s five major metro areas. By comparison, the average sales price of existing homes rose 17.6 percent year over year to $187,385 in May, according to the report from the Winston-Salem Regional Association of Realtors. The association reported 560 homes were sold in May, up 11.6 percent from 502 in April, but down 18.4 percent from 686 in May 2013. The statistics are based on numbers from the Triad MLS and include selected housing markets outside Forsyth. ‘We saw a large number of investors enter the market in the spring of 2013, driving our total units sold artificially high,’ said Glenn Cobb, the association’s chief staff executive.”
The Fayetteville Observer in North Carolina. “In early January, the executive VP of the Fayetteville Regional Association of Realtors predicted the local housing market would perform ‘a little better’ this year than in 2013. Based on those high hopes, Zan Monroe estimated that 6,000 properties would close - 4,200 resales and 1,800 new construction. Over halfway to year’s end, the numbers are falling short of that projection. ‘New construction sales have slowed down, and for the resale market, that’s wonderful news,’ said Realtor Doug Nunnally, a former president of the Realtors association. ‘It may be that the builders are slowing down. We have over 4,600 houses on the market right now. That’s a lot of houses.’”
“Wendy Harris, broker and owner of Team Harris Real Estate, said the new construction market remains healthy and, despite an oversupply of resales, the sales numbers on existing homes are improving. Judy Capps, an associate broker with Townsend Real Estate who works only in the existing homes market, put it this way: ‘It’s still a buyer’s market, of course. The statistics say that we’re up compared to new houses.’”
The Herald Mail in Maryland. “The diagnosis is rather clear: Washington County’s housing market in the first six months of 2014 has been on a path back toward healthy conditions. ‘Hopefully, the housing market is going to continue to forge on. We are by no means fully recovered. It’s still a fragile market. There’s still quite a few foreclosures trickling out,’ said Nancy Allen, president-elect of the Pen-Mar Regional Association of Realtors. ‘The key word here is, ‘jobs’, ‘jobs’, ‘jobs’. We need to have them. We need to do whatever we can to attract business and increase jobs.’”
“Dan Plombon, a Realtor for Mackintosh Realtors in Hagerstown, noted that more homes have been coming on the market. MRIS data shows there were 917 active listings here in June, compared to 742 a year ago. Whether that’s good for the market ‘depends who you talk to,’ Plombon said. ‘To me, from the different people you talk to — appraisers and such — they’re saying if there’s 700 or so in the market at any given time, it’s good,’ he said. But if the inventory rises to, say, 1,000 or more, the average price can drop because buyers have more properties from which to choose, he said.”
“Bob Ernst, regional president of Susquehanna Bank’s Hagerstown and central Maryland territories, said he wonders whether those who lived through the Great Recession of 2007 to 2009, will be as affected by it over the decades as have been those who lived through the Great Depression of 1929 to 1939. ‘In 2008, when the housing market took its shot in the head, a lot of people who had invested a lot of money and sweat equity into homes in the belief that the value of homes would always go up, got a sudden shock and realization that that sort of expected truth wasn’t always right,’ Ernst said.”
“‘My question is, was that shock great enough to turn enough people away from the desire to own a home long term, that they will really have a hard time coming back into the real estate market? Or, will their memory be short enough that when everything returns to normal — whatever that is — will they forget about that and come back into the market and say, ‘Yeah, I do want to be a homeowner?’”
“‘Or,’ Ernst continued, ‘will there be substantial numbers of folks who will say, ‘No, I’m just going to rent?’”
The Baltimore Sun in Maryland. “The market for luxury homes has struggled since the recession. In the Baltimore region, more than 560 homes listed above $1 million sat on the market in June, but just 36 homes in that range sold, according to RealEstate Business Intelligence. On the Eastern Shore, there were nearly 300 listings above $1 million in June. Number of sales? Seven.”
“Auctioneers said they are starting to get more calls from owners who have held off, growing impatient as they wait for a buyer. These sellers may also be more willing to accept that prices won’t return to the pre-crash heights: 1234 Cherry Tree Lane in Annapolis, listed in 2011 at $15 million, went to auction in May and brought $4.2 million after settlement in July.”
“‘It’s all about price,’ said Joe Cooper, president of Alex Cooper Auctioneers, which sold a five-bedroom Colonial brick home in Owings Mills at auction for more than $1 million in June, just slightly above what the original owner paid in 2006. ‘We try to explain to people what they might get. By doing that, we eliminate some people’s dreams, but we sell their properties.’”
“A Harris Creek estate offered for online auction with a reserve last fall failed to sell. A 3.27-acre waterfront property in Worton advertised with a suggested $950,000 opening bid drew no serious buyers to its May auction. ‘We were disappointed,’ said Joan Lessans, who said she and her husband had wanted to downsize and turned to auction when the 4,450-square-foot home didn’t sell via the traditional route. ‘It was puzzling. … It seems like it has to do with the market and what people are looking for today.’ Lessans said her family is enjoying the estate this summer, but the home, which has an indoor pool and tennis court, remains listed for $1.3 million. ‘It’s on the market … but we’re not going to auction again,’ she said.”
The Washington Post. “Depending on where you live in the Washington area, you’re either seeing homes sell within days or languish on the market for weeks or months. ‘There’s lots of activity in the market right now but buyers are also more confident that more homes will come on the market,’ says Ron Sitrin, a real estate agent with Long & Foster Real Estate in Washington. ‘Now the spring rush is behind us and the lack of inventory is less pronounced.’”
“Ida Kelley, a homeowner in Alexandria, listed her home for sale in mid-April and has waited in frustration for buyers to make an offer. Kelley, who has already relocated to Orange County, Calif., says that despite excellent marketing, few prospective buyers have even visited the home. The property was initially listed for sale at $885,000. Similar homes in the community have not sold in spite of the excellent location in a good school district, near commuter routes and shops, Kelley says. She recently dropped the price to $850,000 after an interim price reduction to $875,000 didn’t bring in a buyer.”
“‘It’s as if the buyers just disappeared,’ says Kelley. ‘We don’t know what to do.’”
Good to see coverage of the bubble that is Annapolis….Just wait for another hurricane or a republican win to clear out the area.
As the fleet shrinks, I suggest that Annapolis declare itself independent and become a money laundering center. The Crab Republic! Bitcoin currency, HF trading and no rules.
The New Trend will be like italy. Cities will break away from knuckledragger welfare areas and create libertarian places by allowjng things that neighbors do not. Be a revolutionary to make real money. Democracy fails when people find that they can vote themselves other peoples money.
Hbb was an education in RE….I now teach it in NYC! Healthy pessimism is impkrtant.
md has a gop?
living in MD I love watching MD
whoops meant watching from VA
Late day update-
Sorry for the typos. Thumbs.
I am up in Manhattan these days looking at a deal-o-rama. Teaching brokers 2-3 days a week, they are absolutely shocked when I tell them of the human consequences of Brokers Gone Wild. Having followed Ben and his honorable service since 2004? on Blogspot, it is really funny to hear the repeats. I tell the brokers about their responsibility to protect their customers (I have another state license) and they look at me like I am crazy. One Israeli student told me outright- she is here because it is so easy to take advantage of Americans.
Met a NYC broker with TEN figure (no decimals) sales, and she told me a key point: The Chinese are not closing. A lot of money was deposited, but NYC will look very different after a visit from ISIS or (worse) a visit from the Bond Ghouls. (Props to Lou Rukeyser).
If you can’t beat ‘em…….I am closing on a $30+ deal…
I appreciate the inside scoop.
‘I am closing on a $30+ deal’
Fixer-upper?
Gut rehab… Not kidding.
Thanks, Ben
Gut rehab… Not kidding.
That was NOT a typo???
“bond ghouls”
I had to look that one up.
Monday, January 9, 2012
Bond Ghouls coming to a bond auction near you soon?
The late great Louis Rukeyser used to call bond traders, bond ghouls. The reason is that bond traders always see things from the worst point of view, assuming that the economy is going to hell in a hand basket. Thus the only way to keep your money safe is in bonds, not stocks or any other asset. A more pessimistic bunch you can not find.
Bond Ghouls are currently assessing bonds in country after country in Europe as unable to make debt payments and default as being the obvious next step. The last one was Italy and if you have been following our postings you know Italy can not pay interest rates above 7% and survive long. They currently are nearing 8%. The only country left in Europe currently considered stable financially is Germany and the bond ghouls have taken a different approach there today.
We have talked about EFFECTIVE negative interest rates on US Treasury bonds when you take the impact of inflation and the low low interest rates paid. But for the first time in my life government bonds actually traded at NEGATIVE interest rates. The rate was .01% negative and it was even oversubscribed by almost four to one. This traders and investors is what is called real fear that Europe is going to collapse. You give Germany $10000 and in six months they give you back $9995. Go figure.
“The Chinese are not closing.”
Is this in reference to residential real estate?
What is stopping them? Don’t they realize that NYC real estate always goes up (just like California real estate)?
“The Chinese are not closing.”
I’d like to understand a little more about this statement, too.
Ben,
You have saved my financial life over the last 10 years from far away, and will always be appreciated. Having gone from the political insanity of DC to the financial insanity of NYC, I can tell you that your blog gave a perspective from outside the bubble that was invaluable. Having designed skyscrapers, rode thru 9/11 and advised WAY inside of the Borg, I can tell you that the wisdom of you and your amazing readers is great. When 31+ closes, I hope to return a little of the favor your way.
Chinese aren’t closing: They put 20% deposits down on 30mm 3BR’s, but cannot or will not close. Sounds like 2008 to me.
I have David Rockefeller living across the street, Bentley-lock at the 50k/yr boy’s middle school on my street and homeless people on the corner. Not sure if this is America or Mars sometimes, but your blog is quoted daily- to some that cause the problems that you have been such a clarion call against.
Just waiting for St. Louis to happen here- hopefully after 31.
I designed a tower years ago- less than 10% of the lights are on at night.
Knifecatcher — enjoyed your fascinating insights!
That Isreali chick is gonna freak out when she gets arrested.
“Ida Kelley, a homeowner in Alexandria, listed her home for sale in mid-April and has waited in frustration for buyers to make an offer. Kelley, who has already relocated to Orange County, Calif., says that despite excellent marketing, few prospective buyers have even visited the home. The property was initially listed for sale at $885,000. Similar homes in the community have not sold in spite of the excellent location in a good school district, near commuter routes and shops, Kelley says. She recently dropped the price to $850,000 after an interim price reduction to $875,000 didn’t bring in a buyer.”
“‘It’s as if the buyers just disappeared,’ says Kelley. ‘We don’t know what to do.’”
She first listed the house at $885,000 then, because it wouldn’t sell, she reduced her asking price to $875,000 - a whooping 1.1% price reduction.
Bahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
Then she reduced the price from $875,000 to $850,000 for about another 3% price reduction.
So the total price reductions, from start to finish, has been about 4.1%. And people have not flooded in to buy and she apparently cannot understand just why this is.
“‘We don’t know what to do.’”
I have an idea: Go see Amy!
Bahahahahahahahahahahahaha
Amy, are you out there? Go fetch this woman, lube her up nice and good with a bit of cold, hard, real-world reality, and then bring her to me and maybe you and I can make a few bucks off of her and her stupidity.
‘We don’t know what to do.’
R e d u c e — t h e — p r i c e!!!
A good school district isn’t worth $850,000.
It’s not even worth half that.
Perhaps - and, at most - one third.
why not private school? Catholic school is cheap compared to 200K extra mort
Depends on how many kids you are going to send to it…
Dig in your heels and stick to your price. The end result will be even greater losses.
Start slashing.
So what did she pay for the house and at what price point did she enter orange,ca
Who cares.
Her understanding of value and worth are clearly warped.
‘With a portfolio of residential properties slipping away to foreclosure, a local homebuilder receded into bankruptcy Friday. Hallmark Home Builders Inc. filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection on Aug. 1.’
‘The day before, the company lost 13 residential lots and two finished homes at auction but filed for bankruptcy just in time to save another seven lots and 10 homes from additional foreclosure auctions that had been scheduled for Friday afternoon.’
‘The foreclosures were spurred by the builder defaulting on a loan from Union First Market Bank. The loan was backed by 32 residential properties in Henrico, Hanover, King William, New Kent and Louisa counties.’
‘A slate of five courthouse auctions was scheduled for Hallmark’s properties Thursday and Friday of last week. The July 31 sales happened as planned, and Hallmark Home Builders lost its properties in King William and New Kent County.’
‘But Hallmark’s Chapter 11 filing, entered at 10:41 a.m. Friday morning, beat out foreclosure auctions scheduled for 11:30 in Hanover County and 1 p.m. in Henrico County. The move has, at least temporarily, kept Hallmark from losing the remaining 17 lots.’
‘Seven of the lots have homes on them. The homes are in the Staples Mill Trace, Hunton Station, Mountain Laurel Townhouses and Lee’s Crossing subdivisions in Henrico. The Hanover County properties slated for foreclosure included three lots, each with finished homes, at Elwin Place, The Hollows and Glen Harbor subdivisions.’
‘Hallmark’s initial foreclosure filing values its assets between $0 and $50,000 with liabilities in the $1 million to $10 million range.’
http://www.richmondbizsense.com/2014/08/04/local-homebuilder-files-for-chapter-11/
that county tells me they are flush and just spent big $$
“Auctioneers said they are starting to get more calls from owners who have held off, growing impatient as they wait for a buyer. These sellers may also be more willing to accept that prices won’t return to the pre-crash heights: 1234 Cherry Tree Lane in Annapolis, listed in 2011 at $15 million, went to auction in May and brought $4.2 million after settlement in July.”
In this context, the example suggests a seller got so impatient they took a $10.8 million dollar reduction in wishing price — 67% off initial list price.
Nice haircut!
Roughly a 65% reduction.
…..As we’ve maintained all along.
Seems like you have lots of time for copying and pasting, no time to punch a single address into Zillow:
1234 Cherry Tree Lane, Annapolis, MD:
Zestimate July 2005: $4.2 million
Zestimate: July 2006: $4.8 million (peak)
Zestimate: July 2014: $3.8 million
SOLD: July 2014: $4.2 million
The owners listed at $15 million solely to gin up interest and make people think they were getting a huge deal … and they ensnared both of you good.
I bet you guys would buy a 10-year-old Honda if the seller drops the price from $50K to $18K.
In reality, this house just “craaaatered” to its July 2005 price. That is, NEAR PEAK, and 10% above the supposedly inflated Zestimate.
‘NEAR PEAK’
Yeah, and like I said yesterday, loans made near the peak are still the majority of foreclosures.
Your motive here on the HBB is evident by now Donk don’t you think? I sense something coming your way.
And yes…. The minor price reduction of your shanty still results in a price 200% higher than long term trend. And you paid that 200% premium and doubled down by financing it. Underwater already and going deeper by the day.
Enjoy your losses.
I don’t know that oxide has a motive. Like a few other posters, there is a resistance to objectivity. Look around right now. San Diego, ‘where are the buyers?’ Boston, inventory is piling up. Every market in Texas has slowed down. Foreclosures are at least twice the historic rate, and that’s with prices having gone up for around 2 years. You can lead a horse to water.
It seems almost every day now the Washington Post has an article bemoaning the lack of sales in the DC area but assuring us that all is well. We’re never crashing, we’re just returning to a normal market. NASA is gonna deploy those airbags around us at any minute.
My only motive was to point out that the $15 million list price was a HEAD FAKE, and it fooled the reporter (and both Whac and HA) into thinking it was a real haircut.
Now that I think it of, it’s much more likely that it was a Zillow TYPO — I’ve seen several of those* — and the list price should have read $5 million, not $15 million. That would explain everything.
And Ben, peak prices does not automatically indicate strawberry picker buyers. Loans have higher standards today. The buyer was stupid, but he was able to meet the standards. [and look at the house, it's an estate property that was probably bought by a multimillionaire who could spare the cash regardless.]
————–
*ya know, I haven’t seen ever A-dan and zillow in the same place at the same time. Hmm….
Nice dunk and weave Donk.
Here…. seeing as we have the owner involved in the discussion, why not tell us what you paid for your shanty rounded to the nearest $10k. Don’t give us another duck and weave lame excuse.
Put up or be the donkey you’ve suited yourself up as.
‘probably bought by a multimillionaire who could spare the cash regardless’
Do you remember the time I related what happened with Mr Biggs? He had a house in Flagstaff, I contacted his listing agent. (Almost all foreclosures in the early days had agents - the seller was trying to get out). She told me, ‘you must be mistaken, Mr Biggs is very wealthy and could pay cash for this house many times over.’ I asked her to call and when she got back with me, she sheepishly said, ‘go ahead and change the locks. He’s walking away from it.’ In 2008-09, easily half the foreclosures in Flagstaff were in the most expensive subdivisions.
When buyers, even cash buyers, think they’ve hit the top, if their motivation was to make money, they try to sell. Isn’t it interesting that inventory is rising all over the US just as prices slow down or reverse? Similarly, when some go underwater, a lot of them are going to walk. Even if they view themselves as non-speculators, they see it as good money after bad.
Yes, we all remember the strawberry pickers. Not many remember Mr Biggs.
Oxy, you are making stuff up. It was listed earlier this year for $9,000,000.
Interestingly, Zillow thinks the place would rent for $3,000/mo. That’s over 1000/1 own vs rent ratio!
I’m not making stuff up. I’m speculating as to how a house that was never worth more than $5 million came to be listed at $15 million in 2011. My theories were either typo or head fake. If they reduced the price down through the $9 million mark, it’s probably not a typo. Perhaps they thought to head fake some wealthy Chinese who don’t know the market.
Similarly, when some go underwater, a lot of them are going to walk.
In Maryland? Maryland is a recourse state. If a millionaire with assets sstrategically walks from a million-dollar mortgage, you can bet that the bank will sue his ass-ets.
‘you can bet that the bank will sue’
It almost never happens. Look at all the refi foreclosures in California. How many lawsuits have you heard about? I don’t know why they do this.
MD has a foreclosure moratorium holding back a tidal wave inventory just like the other 49 states.
Recourse or non recourse is a distinction without a difference.
Still going to hide what you paid? Good. You should be embarrassed.
my dc area hood is 8% off peak 6/2005
Was it a bubble then, or did it only become a bubble in 2005-6? And it would be past the peak if the lending was allowing it.
Was it a bubble then, or did it only become a bubble in 2005-6?
I thought it was a bubble in 2003—when I realized that two DINKs who had bought conservatively would not have been able to buy a year later, as the price appreciation was so rapid that even with heavy savings, they would not be able to save enough to make a 20% downpayment.
And it would be past the peak if the lending was allowing it.
Yep, a fool and someone else’s money will soon be parted, as they spend whatever they are allowed to borrow.
When even well-paid DINKs are priced out, it’s better to step aside and let the greater fools step up to catch themselves falling knives until mania pricing subsides.
are there any positive counties? maybe some sweaty part of miami is hot or some area forefingers flock too
otherwise name a complete county that’s booming.
Yes, Weston fl outside ft laud and Miami. Prices in my area are stable at about 200 per sq ft and houses are trading well. The macro numbers for the town show increased inventory but it isn’t driving pricing yet.
Oh dear…
‘The typical summer slowdown in the Washington region’s housing market has been even more pronounced this year. With some exceptions in neighborhoods where homes continue to be snapped up quickly – such as Cabin John, Falls Church and Capitol Hill – buyers are staying away in droves.’
‘Since the government shutdown in October, the number of homes sold has declined year-over-year in all but one month.’
‘The continued decline in pending sales – homes that are under contract but the deals have not closed – indicate that activity won’t be picking up anytime soon. The number of new contracts has declined year-over-year for the past eight months.’
‘The slowdown in sales is putting downward pressure on home prices. Alexandria showed the biggest gain in median price last month, rising to $530,000 last month from $484,905 in July 2013. Fairfax City had the biggest drop in median price last month, falling to $442,500 from $487,500 in July 2013.’
‘After months of low inventory, homes are steadily coming on the market. The number of homes for sale last month increased to 11,199, up from 8,391 in July 2013 and the highest level for any month in nearly three years.’
I wondered whether the shutdown would spook the DC area market. Maybe so?
government shutdown in October,
the 17 day paid vacation?
inventory has doubled in my hood 22151
Different picture in Newport Beach area ( Corona Del Mar, Newport Beach, Newport Coast, Balboa Island ), which is in Orange County, Ca. Here difficult to get anything decent for much less than 2M, and prices are at a new peak high ( higher than 2007 ). I am seeing new interest in the 3M to 8M market. In fact, the market appears to be heating up in this usually slow time of year. Sure looks like a big price increase is just around the corner. Appears that the wealthy are scooping up homes as rentals … as opposed to keeping cash in the bank or in the stock/bond market. Sure smells like inflation is in the cards.
^lol.
In the meantime, housing demand is collapsing across the entire state of California.
And if you think wages are going magically triple(inflation) to meet grossly inflated housing prices, you’re in for the surprise of your life.
Let the deflationary spiral rage…. and escape from CA if you can.